We Bankers

[Dilip Deshpande]

A wonderful Job done by 'We Bankers '.

[Prasad C N]

Dear Sir,

In terms of Section 18(3) of Industrial Disputes Act, any Settlement entered into during the course of Conciliation with a majority union meeting is binding on all employees' of the organisation, even if they do not belong to the Union.  Banks' Advocate has said that negotiations are going on in another conciliation meeting.  Workmen Unions which are going to sign settlement has membership of over 98%.  Is it not also binding on members of We Bankers, an organisation with 1,300 members ?  

What is that they are achieving ?  They are only harming our cause.  We are not understanding the impact.  Unfortunately, we have developed a feeling that whomsoever who questions the authority of UFBU/IBA, we support them, without understanding adverse effect of such actions.

Thanks, a Million. 

With regards,

Prasad C N

On Sunday, 18 October, 2020, 02:03:05 pm IST, Dilip Deshpande <dilip...@gmail.com> wrote:

A wonderful Job done by 'We Bankers '.

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[P V Natarajan]

The worst adversaries are UFBU. We hve understood it & experienced it.

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[Srirama Murti]

Dear Prasadji!

you have now proved with your frequent useful comments that you are the intellectual amongst the poor bank retirees/pensioners.

with best regards,

S.S.R.Murthy,ex-canbank,member of this blog,

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[Subramani S]

Well said Nararajan sir,  The worst ememy , Particularly, is AIBEA.

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[pady nabs]

Not understood Mr. Prasadji.   Once you raised voice towards pensioners.    For the recent times, your tone is entirely different.    Ever;y action/writings of yours is against Retirees.     Sorry.   what happened.

padmanabhan s

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[Subramani S]

Dear pady nabs  .  For somebody Union/Association affection may outweigh the Retirees problems.

Virus-free. www.avast.com

To view this discussion on the web visit https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/bankpensioner/1486277465.839164.1603161805391%40mail.yahoo.com.

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[Pjkmathewbreeze]

Retirees are noticing his change. Many time found supporting the anti pensioners leader

Sent from my Xperia by Sony smartphone

---- 'pady nabs' via bankpensioner wrote ----

[Prasad C N]

Dear Sir,

Merely telling the truth is no against anybody.  Finding fault with everyone else and demanding help or criticizing for not helping, when those from whom we seek are not in a position to help, do not assist or help in achieving any benefit, let alone Pension Updation.  It is amusing to see some posts, whenever anybody who criticizes UFBU, is treated as a hero or a saviour or fighter.   

Take the instance of action by 'We Bankers'.  Is it going to be helpful to Bank retirees ?  Why are they including Pensioners' issues, when they are not clear about their own issues.  I would give an instance.  In 2010, a group of employees brought stay when Second Pension option agreement was signed.  We would have hailed such action as bravery.  They would have been treated as heros.  What is the reality ?   Implementation of the Scheme was delayed by a few months.  Many retirees passed away in between and Commutation amount is lost.  Many were older by one year and thereby Commutation factor got reduced.  What did we gain ? 

Even if 'We Bankers' succeed and 'Pay Commission' or 'Tribunal' is appointed, there is no compulsion for IBA/Government to refer Pensioners' issue to 'Pay Commission' or 'Tribunal'.  If IBA/Government is willing to improve, there is no necessity for taking Pay Commission route.  It would have happened through Bipartite Settlement.  If I tell truth, one may feel I am speaking against Bank retiree and If I provide wrong information and claim some action, I may be hailed as a hero.  

Now, Family Pension improvement is happening in Bipartite System.  Without 'Pay Commission' family pension is being improved.  In RBI, Pension Updation is not through 'Pay Commission'.  For the sake of clarity in abundance, I would like to submit that there is no link between Pension Updation and Pay Commission.  In 'Pay Commission',  Govt. gives the areas it has to look into.  'Pay Commission' do not go beyond that.  If Government does not include Pension issues, while referring the matter to Pay Commission,  Pay Commission will not even touch the subject of 'Pension updation'.   Before jumping into conclusion, please go through notification of appointment of 'Pay Commission'.

I feel that the bane of Bank retirees is that they value wrong and false information which promises benefit, but not the truth.     

Thanks, a Million. 

With regards,

Prasad C N

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[Prasad C N]

Dear Shri Subamaniji,

I would say hatred towards sombody, but not pragmatism, reality and truth is making people to jump into wrong conclusion.  What can we say when we expect an organisation of 1,300 employees, to help us in updation ?  Just wait for a few weeks time.  You will understand the reality.

Thanks, a Million. 

With regards,

Prasad C N

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[Prasad C N]

Dear Mr.Padmanabhan,

I am amused.  Even explaining correct position law is treated as action/writing is against retirees.  My dear friend, we are prepared to believe 'We Bankers' merely because they added 'pension updation' and 'pay commission'.  

Most of you are Senior Executives.  Are you not aware of  the status of an agreement signed under Industrial Disputes Act.  If we say providing right information as 'anti-retiree', then what is the status of an agreement signed by Unions, if they are not implemented.  

I am talking about protection of what we have.  But, you want us to pursue imagination.   Slowly intolerance is creeping in.

Thanks, a Million. 

With regards,

Prasad C N

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[Suryakumaran Nair]

Shri. Prasad C N is speaking only the truth and  the reality.  I earnestly believe, that it is his experience, his commitment , his prudent perspective and the long vision  would have  guided him to speak the utter truth.  Definitely it is for the betterment of the retirees and the working employees.  I fully support his views. But some of our nil-informed or ill-informed retirees seem to live in fool's paradise.

With regards,

Suryakumar.

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[bhaskara sarma]

Desperate people do anything even if it is unreasonable.UFBU is squarely responsible for driving the pensioners and retirees to a corner for the past 25 years. Nobody else should be blamed.UFBU only is to be blamed.

With regards,

P Bhaskara Sarma.

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[Chandrasekaran V]

Why the apprehensions/doubts about the IBA for the employees/pensioners of banks ?  The genesis lies in 'not implementing' / 'not notifying' the 'signed agreement ' on Pension while notifying the Pension Regulations.  The IBA has cheated the Unions, and the top leadership of the majority unions who signed that Agreement did not bother to verify/cross check what was incorporated in the Pension  Regulations NOtification and what had been agreed to in the Agreement.  May be that the majority unions were reluctant in implementing the Pension Regulations, as there were so many circulars from the Associations/Unions highlighting how Contributory PF will score over Pension.  It is another matter that they had to swallow their wrong calculations and went in for Second Option.

On Wed, Oct 21, 2020 at 4:22 PM Chandrasekaran V <vchandras...@gmail.com> wrote:

Doubts/apprehensions of pensioners are understandable, since they have been 'cheated' after giving false assurances earlier.   May be that the pensioners, ,most of whom are well past their prime years after retirement,  are eager to see the the light before they depart from this world.

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[arjunbhai oza]

Dear sir, Prasad C.N, we old aged above 80 years are verey very thanksfull to your kind duing for us, god blesh you and help by all nature.

A.I. Oza

Ex- DenaBnak.

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[Chandrasekaran V]

Doubts/apprehensions of pensioners are understandable, since they have been 'cheated' after giving false assurances earlier.   May be that the pensioners, ,most of whom are well past their prime years after retirement,  are eager to see the the light before they depart from this world.

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[Prasad C N]

Dear Sir,

If I provide some information, which many of you are refusing to accept, I know I may be branded as 'anti-retiree' or 'anti-pensioner'.  Please stop that attitude.  We cannot find solutions by refusing to accept the truth.  One who has courage and conviction to place facts to enable us to think and find out ways and means to solve the problem is called as 'anti-pensioner'.  But, one who gives untenable suggestions, one who goes to Courts to lose or one who says it is the duty of UFBU to update our pension or one who finds fault with everything what UFBU constituents do is an intellectual.  We call him as our savior.  Every one agrees with him.  We question IBA and does not want IBA to negotiate.  Then who will negotiate ?  This is exactly Bankers and Govt. wants.  They want Bankwise settlement.  Without even understanding the consequence of what we want, we demand  not involving IBA.     If Settlement with IBA is illegal, we have to refund lakhs and lakhs of rupees, as our pension itself becomes illegal.  Can any benefit agreed by an illegal body through illegal agreement give us any benefit ?

I am attaching the notification of the constitution of 7th Pay Commission.  What our friends have not understood is that what happens, if the Govt. does not include Pensioners' issues.  Then we have nobody to blame.  Even neither UFBU, nor We Bankers or intellectuals amongst us who invent reasons, not discover reasons, can help us.  Even, Central Government employees were also in the same position as we are now, for 60 years, despite 'Pay Commissions'.   If Govt. or Bank managements are willing to update pension through Pay Commission, what prevents them from extending same benefit through Bipartite Settlement. If they are not willing to update our pension through our Bipartite Settlement, they will not include our issues also in reference made to pay commission.  If so, whom do we blame ?

We have developed such kind of an attitude that we do not consider any amount of information provided, any amount of examples.  What we are forgetting is that we are writing volumes criticizing UFBU, IBA, Govt. etc.  But, it is Bipartite Settlements signed by Unions that has given us an opportunity to be a part of this group.  We made mistake and did not join Pension Scheme.  UFBU got us pension option again in 2010.  But, for this option, majority of us who are writing and abusing UFBU would not joined this group.

I have seen many of us are saying that nothing has happened in 25 years.  But, why do we forget about second pension option, where majority of Bank employees/retirees got pension ?  We are waiting for last five years for our pension updation.  Those who are waiting for last 25 years, amongst us are failed by our friends only who did not have trust we had when we opted for the pension in the first instance.  

Over 60% of Officers, who were supposed to be knowledgeable did not join Pension Scheme.  Consequently, pension updation could not happen in 7th, 8th and 9th Bipartite Settlement.  If pension updation were to happen, pension option would not have come.  In RBI, open has come now, because over 90% opted for pension in the first instance, unlike intelligent Bank employees.   

It is so funny that we have also decided that employees are unhappy with Bipartite Settlement and they also need Pay Commission.  It is not their demand, but it is Bank pensioners demand. 

If we are serious about improvement in pension, what we are writing here, 'Whatsapp' organisations, 'Facebook' organisations', etc will not help us.  Abusing, scandalizing, calling names, curses,  etc. of people who has to help us, will not bring in benefits.  If they do get our pension improved, they are helping us and they are favouring us.  

I am extremely sorry to say that I have completely failed to bring some sense in our thinking.  I have failed.  No one can convince against anybody else's will.

Thanks, a Million. 

With regards,

Prasad C N

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[Subramani S]

Shri. C.N.Prasadji ,

Thanks very much for ur kind reply.  We can not forget people have helpled us . Likewise 

We can not forget the betrayal done also. AIBEA  totally betrayed. Could not they incorportate the Updation and 

Family pension clause in the 1993-94 agreement ??  Just for including the 1986 retirees  they did not ensure this. 

In the subsequent Bipartite Settlements they conveniently forget this very very vital aspect affecting lacs of future retiring 

employees.  In each subsequent Bipartitments Mr.Venkatachalam led UFBU was just interested in getting about 15% wage

hike settlements, get the levy and enjoyment.

I am not pinning any hope on these short sighted, selfish betrayers to do any thing positive for updation of pension. As being 

roumored, that the Fin Minsistry is seems to be favourably looking at the Family Pension aspect. That may materialize.

regards,

Yours sincerely

Subramani S

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[R Balaji]

Dear Mr Prasad C N

Your mail is detailed and elaborate and ever after this if people do  not understand what you wanted to convey then no body can even God cannot held the retirees.

regards

R BALAJI

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[JSOMA SHEKARA]

In spite of many drawbacks and loopholes in the present BPS system and inspite of humiliations of Unions number of times why Unions are not ready to divorce IBA. If IBA is removed from the negotiating team the wage revision stops permanently in the Banking Industry? Whether collective bargaining will come to an end?

Is signing agreements and taking credit enough? Whose responsibility it is to ensure that such agreements are implemented in letter and spirit and benefit reaches beneficiaries? Are Unions not aware that there is no tribunal in the banking Industry and in case of denial of agreed benefits retirees have to suffer and secure justice only through courts process of which takes several years? Unions take credit for pension schemes which provide 50% of salary as basic  pension but again agree and sign that pre 2002 retirees are not eligible for this benefit from DOR. Providing 100% DA is an improvement in existing benefit and this benefit should have been given to all pensioners  but unions sign agreement denying this benefit to pre 2002 retirees. Unions should nor argue that it is not discriminatory based on the SC verdict. SC has passed verdict in favour of pensioners in similar cases.

Unions should answer can banks give authority to IBA to appoint actuaries without intention of introducing pension option?

Whether banks have given 3 years time to IBA to submit an actuary report? When banks can open crores of Jan Dhan accounts in just 3 months, Banks also can obtain actuary reports in 3 months. Delaying cost details is just wholesale cheating by all parties to BPS.

Pension regulations do not provide that a percentage of wage revision should be transferred to Pension fund.

Being an independent body it is not the duty of IBA to study the cost of updation and arrange funds. IBA duty is just to appoint actuary and obtain report and submit the same to banks. banks will take decisions to provide funds basing on formula provided in Pension regulations. Unions  just  were reporting what IBA said instead of demanding IBA to provide an actuary report in the next meeting to start discussions on updation. Most joking statement comes from AIBOC which claims it obtained actuary report for family pension and IBA accepted it and based on that implemented enhancement of family pension. How IBA which cannot take any decisions approved actuary report obtained by some third party.

We do not want Pay commission. At least Unions and IBA should adopt the same professional method of pay commission.

Why are Banks not stipulating a time limit for completing BPS like the Central govt. If wage and Pension  revision for 50 lakh employees and Pensioners can be completed after consulting all stakeholders like unions and retirees within 2 years

Wage revision in banks in which retirees are not heard and depend on wisdom of two GC can be completed in just 6 months.

It was IBA decision to deny gratuity to 6th BPS retirees, 50% Basic pension from DOR, 5 years benefit, denying Pension option to CRS, denying 100% DA to pre 2002 retirees. Still IBA claims it will not take decisions on its own and according to specific mandates of banks. Will any bank management dare to say this agreement is not correct and they will not adopt it as it is?All  Banks in reply to queries by pensioners say the decision is taken in industry settlement that is by IBA but IBA says it will not not take any decisions.

Are individual banks not competent to form a suitable medical scheme for its employees and retirees? SBI has its own medical insurance scheme! How is IBA, which is an independent body and has no rights to take decisions, got authority to enter into an agreement with NIC on behalf of PSU Banks? How PSU Banks agree to bear premium of its employees for a scheme of independent body like IBA?

This all proves that the whole BPS is a total lie and IBA is doing all violations by wearing a mask of innocence and 15 lakhs employees and 5 lakhs pensioners are enduring all these just to protect negotiating rights and positions  of 2 GC in the name of collective bargaining.

There is a misconception that the moment we ask for change in BPS system we are asking to appoint a pay commission.

Banks can appoint a committee to conduct negotiations and such committee cannot tell lies, take illegal decisions and still claim it is not taking any decisions like IBA and accountable as it will be covered under RTI.

For just calculating percentage, idex level of DA merger and misc allowances a squad is not required. a  3 member committee is enough.

On Wed, Oct 21, 2020 at 3:49 PM bhaskara sarma <pbsa...@gmail.com> wrote:

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[Satyanarayana Rao]

Shri C.N.Prasad. I completely endorse your views on the attitude of few retirees against the negotiating unions and their outbursts forgetting that  what we are getting as pension on account of the vision and forethought of the leadership of Aibea in 1993 and the acheivement of 2nd option of pension in2010 .

You have not failed in changeing the thinking of few by your realistic and pragmatic presentation of facts to enlightened members of the blog .Some thinkers are determined to appose every organisation and every effort made by the negotiating unions as the pension updation and 100% da issues are not resolved. It needs a balanced  evaluation of the things which are accepted and achieved and the expectations of  the aggrieved members who are expecting some wonderful  achievement by way of 

Pension updation etc.It is not the question of anger ,frustration and outbursts by senior veterans it is their right to demand for justice. The crux of the issue is both Aibea and Aiboc General secretaries have openly committed to the retirees that they will not sign 10 th bps and 11th bps unless pension updation is achieved respectively. Apart from this the joint note signed by UFBU with out any thinking had deeply hurt the veterans of the movement. But all said and done some members have lost patience and  are using  indecent comments and language in their  communication. Let us not  worry about such communication whether they achieve pension updation by such messages. Ultimately the  11th  bipartite settlement will be signed and the ifs and buts of pension updation and improvement in family pension will be known. Let us hope some good news on retirees issues. Let the anger and outbursts continue as they feel that they are on right path and they feel that it is the only formula to achieve success. With regards. 

Sent from Yahoo Mail on Android

On Thu, 22 Oct 2020 at 9:49, 'Prasad C N' via bankpensioner

<bankpe...@googlegroups.com> wrote:

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[Prasad C N]

Dear Shri Subamani Sirji,

The basic problem is that we have prejudiced and predetermined attitude towards AIBEA.  We are carrying forward the same opinion we had during working years.  Before, we question or target one organisation, please ask yourself what is the role of other organisations. In case, Award Staff unions were to agree for 16.4% Special Allowances, Officers Associations would have signed Joint Note on last Sunday, without Updation issue.  They had invited all concerned to reach Mumbai for signing of Joint Note.  Pension Updation issue is not yet taken up with all seriousness. Can we continue to blame AIBEA and Com.CHV for Officers' signing Joint Note without retirees' issue.  Award Staff Unions would not have signed Bipartite Settlement on that day.  This example amply demonstrate that we are blaming only AIBEA for all our problems.  I have not seen anyone including you, blaming Officers' organisations, more particularly AIBOC for any of our problems.  This is despite providing evidence and proof.  Is it fair and Why ?

We have decided that AIBEA should and must get our pension updated.  It is also decided that it the duty of ONLY AIBEA.  No one else is responsible.  This is the expectation of Retired Officers, including Probationary Officers. Retired Officers have also decided that it is only CHV who is deciding the issues of Officers who are in service.  Before going into merit, I have a question.  If so, why there is need for existence of Officers' Organsiations including AIBOC ?  Implication of such accusations have serious consequences, as we are questioning the role and functioning of these organisations, its leaders and the leadership of these organisation.  What we are forgetting is that when we use the word 'betrayal', we should be very careful.  Whole problem in this regard is that rendering help cannot be demanded.  If any one or organisation is not obligated to take up issues of a non-member, can not taking of such issues be called as 'betrayal'.  Was there any promise by the organisation that they would ensure updation of pension, with every settlement ?  This statement is applicable to any organisation without restricting to AIBOC or AIBEA.

Please recall your memories and take back your memories to years, 1993 to 1995.  JAC was formed by non-AIBEA organisations.  They campaigned against Pension option.  Was it a sin of AIBEA to entered into Pension Settlement ?  There were agitations and stay orders.  With great difficulty and hurriedly Pension Scheme was introduced, on account of these impediments.  That is the reason why I always say negative actions do not bring in positive results.  

On 14.12.1999 Joint Note was signed with 1616 Clause.  AIBEA did not agree for inclusion of this clause.  On account of this dispute and other issues, 7th Bipartite was signed three months' later, that too with a unwritten promise that this issue would be resolved in the next Bipartite.  Officers' Associations created this problem and AIBEA need to intervene to solve this problem.  Still who do we blame ? AIBEA.  Why these Officers Association did not update pension, as they were signing the first Bipartite Settlement after Pension Regulations came into force ?  We still blame AIBEA.  Is it correct ?  Why are we so biased ?

Whether in 2015 or now, which Union/Association, which is willing to share a portion for improvement of our Pension ?  What did Mr.Havinder Singh, General Secretary of AIBOC say when Special Allowance was introduced.  When asked about denial of pension benefit on this amount, he said 'We are more bothered about giving more money in the hands of his members, not about updation'.  Is it  correct ? Can we blame CHV for this also ?

I can keep on narrating one instance or the other in each Bipartite, how other organisations have harmed our interest.  But, since we have decided that it is only AIBEA and Com. C H Venkatachalam are responsible, whatever may be other opinion or truth, they are not acceptable to us.  I sorry, we are not fair.  I do not mind, if any one accuses me of any thing.  I am presenting true picture. I am not supporting without any reason.

Thanks, a Million. 

With regards,

Prasad C N

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[Subramani S]

Sri , Prasad ji,

They have committed worst  ' Papa (paavam in tamil) ' . That is unforgettable and unforgivable.  For the Himalayan Sin they 

have committed  they have to seek atonement  (Prayachitha).  They are incapable of doing Prayachitha. The affected lots' curse

is  " Let them go to hell . Let them suffer Janma after Janma."  

Let us stop this conversation. For somebody just Union affinity overweighs the innumerable sufferings of  lacs of

retirees and future retirees.

Regards.

Yours

Subramani S

Pammal, Chennai

22/10/2020

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[bhaskara sarma]

Dear Prasad,

You have justified AIBEA.Why AIBEA never opened its mouth when it is criticised for all the ills of retirees,when Resignees and Pensioners are suffering for so many years and blamed CHV and AIBEA in various Fora.

If there is no fault on behalf of AIBEA,it should come out clearly.

With Regards,

P Bhaskara Sarma.

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[bhaskara sarma]

Dear Chandra Sekhar an,

UFBU did  Great Injustice to pre Nov 2002 retirees and it never made any efforts to remove the discrimination.There is provision for Updation in Pension regulations but UFBU never pursued the matter seriously.UFBU neither fought for removing the Injustices nor allowed retiree unions to deal with the matter directly with IBA.Thus many fingers are shown at UFBU.Why employees go to court against BPS ? There must be grave Injustice.Otherwise the Mighty UFBU and IBA should have scuttled the case in the beginning itself .UFBU and IBA have to justify before the Court,Public and Employees if they are Right.

With regards,

P Bhaskara Sarma

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[JSOMA SHEKARA]

We are happy that if not at the negotiating table, retirees issues are discussed seriously in this forum.

Updation issues are common for both workmen and Officers. So all constituents should discuss the issue and arrive at consensus  on demanding updation on the RBI formula. At least one time updation merging DA@ index level 6352 can be done. If all 9 unions or atleast AIBOC and AIBEA present demand strongly IBA may be compelled to refer the issue to DFS. In RBI also once updation seemed to be a hard nut to crack. But continuous joined struggle of Pensioners and employees made even majority govt to bend and accept pension updation.

Whatever  arguments pensioners can make on behalf of AIBOC or AIBEA we have to admit that all excuses given by unions fall flat without arriving at updation cost. Excuses can come late. First pensioners request both AIBEA and AIBOC release updation costs. Why is it taking years to arrive at cost? Once actual cost is revealed it will be known how it can be funded? For example If the cost is Rs.25000 crores each bank has to bear the average cost Rs.1500-2000. Is it difficult for Canara Bank or Bank of Baroda to fund this amount from operating profit/pension funds. Even with permission of RBI, cost may be spread over years.

We know that the moment Unions demand IBA will not accept. It depends on sincerity, consistent and forceful demand and not 'we raised udation issue and IBA said cost to be studied'. Let unions unite and  launch a strong and continuous struggle  for updation. Let IBA say funds not sufficient with proof of actuary report and other documents.

Once strong demand reaches DFS automatically the bank will find funds.

IBA did not have funds for 5 years benefit, 50% basic Pension from DOR, Pension to CRS etc, Once court verdict came they not only provided funds that too with 9% interest.

So far in the banking Industry strong demand from Unions has not reached DFS. Unions also have not met FM and submitted memorandum demanding updation.

If there is no provision in pension updation it can be amended. There was no provision for 100% DA.

Canara Bank repeatedly rejected demand for pension disbursement on the last working day of the month saying as per pension regulations pension is to be disbursed on the first working day of the month. But when demand from retirees unions became stronger they accepted demand.

The need of the hour is that unions should stop finding funds for updation or excuses and unite and present strong demand for updation. insist IBA to release cost data and discuss. If IBA is adamant, discuss with bank management and take the issue to DFS.

Updation issue should be discussed in BPS meetings and not in circulars. Let unions make a beginning from November.

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[GUNA]

Even Pension Settlement dt.29-10-1993 was signed under sec (18) of Industrial Disputes Act 1947 by AIBEA and IBA the RESULT of which all of us are getting PENSION NOW.

WE SALUTE the THEN Leadership of AIBEA.

On Thu, Oct 22, 2020 at 4:06 PM 'Prasad C N' via bankpensioner <bankpe...@googlegroups.com> wrote:

To view this discussion on the web visit https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/bankpensioner/11183999.1710921.1603358328165%40mail.yahoo.com.

[Subramani S]

Sri Guna ji,

Before the 1993 pension agreement, AIBEA which was demanding pension as third benefit, somesalted and went 

for Pension inl ieu of Contributory PF.  Even that demand was not properly met  (pension updation & family pension left out). What a shame ?  What is there to chest thump ?  Even the New Pension Scheme which came into being wef  April 2010 , has better components like Basic, DA on basic etc.,  Whereas what AIBEA got is inferior and injurious to lacs of retirees and future retirees.

AiBEA  has been in the forefront for damaging the interest of retirees. We curse the the then and the following leaderships of AIBEA

Which is the root cause  of the malady.

Yours

Subramani S

Virus-free. www.avast.com

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[Prasad C N]

Dear Sir,

Are they obligated to answer criticism of unconnected.  More so, when motivated campaign is taking place and ignorant comments are being made, why should they spend time and energy by indulging. Pensioners are not its members.  Are they answerable and owe explanation.  

Perhaps, with continued unfounded and uncharitable criticism and comments, day may not be far away, when none of the constituents of UFBU may even refer retirees' issues.  Unfortunately, we have forgotten the role of Unions/Associations.

We are dependent on them.  but, they are not.  In fact, we are unconnected.  If they take up, they are doing a favour, not the duty. 

Thanks, a Million. 

With regards,

Prasad C N

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[Prasad C N]

Dear Mr.Subramani,

I have been patiently answering and trying to answer ?  I can answer, react and reply.  But, I do not want to, because nobody can convince against one's will.   Please go through whatever I have stated, earlier.  Introspect.

But, it is unfortunate that we do not even have gratitude towards an organisation which has got us something called as 'pension'.  Those who do not have minimum courtesy and without any principles, do not deserve any information.  

But for pension, no Updation, no 100% DA and no Family Pension.  Enjoy the company of betrayers.

Thanks, a Million. 

With regards,

Prasad C N

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[LakshmanRao Kantamsetti]

Prasad ji 

Think over 

You get excellent idea of resolving retirees issues otherwise 

Let us not follow the same old method 

Which does not work , as we gave been watching for decades 

All the best  

KLRao

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[Prasad C N]

Dear Shri Subramani,

I am attaching copies extracted from the Booklets published by :

a. All India State Bank of Indore Officers' Co-ordination Committee (AIBOA affiliate) ;

b. National Confederation of Bank Employees

c. All India Bank Officers' Confederation.

Please go through the extracts.  You can see, how in the name of Joint Action committee, agitated against introduction of Pension Scheme and how there was a motivated campaign with a view to defeat pension scheme in Banks.  These documents are published during 1993 - 1994.  

Whatever, we write or present, they are not motivated, imaginary and false information.  I request not only you, all your friends, who have decided that AIBEA is the root cause for all our problems and AIBOC as the Champions of pensioners.  I am not targeting AIBOC, but only providing documentary evidence, about its role. 

Thanks, a Million. 

With regards,

Prasad C N

[Sebastian Sakaria]

Sir,

If you go through past history, you will find that unions have been the biggest enemy of the bank employees.

PNB was the first bank to announce VRS in the year 2000.  At that time I was working at PNB HO in New Delhi.  The then Chairman of PNB wanted to give promotion to clerical staff who completed 15 years of service because he found them very unproductive although drawing salary equal to JMG Scale I.  The unions opposed the idea.  When VRS was announced the management wanted to give section option for pension so that maximum employees can avail the scheme.  Again the union opposed it saying that they have not made any such demand.

https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/bankpensioner/1162140322.2112488.1603468596317%40mail.yahoo.com

.

[kushal mukhoti]

Subramani S.

 " அவர்கள் பெரிய பாவம் செய்தார்கள். அவர்கள் நரகத்திற்கு செல்லப்படும். அவர்கள் பிறந்த பிறகு பிறந்த நரகத்தில் கஷ்டபடுக்கும்." Is this what you wanted to say? I think we should not curse anybody in this language. We are nobody to judge whether they have committed any sin or not.  

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[JSOMA SHEKARA]

LET US MOVE IN RIGHT DIRECTION

Sri.C.N.Prasad ji has vast knowledge about pension regulations right from the day agreement is signed. He was also an office bearer. He has maintained every single record of past events pertaining to pension regulations. He presents his arguments with proof attaching documents. Without his genuine efforts and struggle pensioners of associate banks would not have received 5 years and 1616-1684 arrears. He is also monitoring and fighting for issues of other banks' pensioners.

we have to respect his advice. It is fact that updation, 100% DA issue, pension to resignees, pension on special allowance etc are pending. But there is no use debating whether it is the fault of AIBOC, AIBEA etc. We have to move on and debate how in the present scenario we can achieve our demands. We need the expertise of Sri.Prasad sir to chalk out our plans.

The Present BPS system is full of flaws. There is nobody to address our grievances. If we approach banks they reply that the issue pertains to industry level settlement. If we approach IBA we get a reply that IBA will not take decisions on its own and act according to specific mandates and we have to contact our banks. Union leaders are not interacting with pensioners except indirectly through circulars. IBA and UFBU argue in courts that we have relation whatsoever with management and cannot demand any benefits other than what is agreed in settlements.

In spite of this since IBA said it has agreed for enhancement of Family pension which means IBA has a mandate to negotiate retirees issues including updation.No court has issued any stay on discussing updation issue. DFS also in reply to members' questions states that these issues are settled in BPS. So why Unions are delaying discussing the issue.

Since BPS is postponed for another 15 days AIBOC and AIBEA can discuss updation and present strong demand for updation to IBAand find out actual cost of updation. Then everything falls in place.

It is not that both AIBOC and AIBEA are not aware of the long pending pdation issue. May be fear that IBA may reduce wage revision percentage preventing them to take up updation issue. UFBU should kick start discussions and find out the cost and say whether updation is possible or not. If talks fail retirees may approach DFS. Simply putting updation issue in cold storage is of no use.

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[zdkayyalu ramasamy]

When Majority is OK THEN PM is enough..

Why Judiciary

 Supreme Court High Court? 

U mean all Waste...

Banking Terrorist..

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[Subramani S]

Mr. Prasad Ji

I had been the part (closely following) of  then ongoing birpartite settlements from the year 1978 to  2013 .  Though you may be 

explaining some nuances of what happened in the various settlements, you OBLIVIOUS of the great injustice 

and injury  caused by AIBEA. All retires are affected. They make veiled appeals in social media. 

Your patient explaining  by word of mouth will not cure our sufferings.  Please avoid brainwashing  the affected lot. 

Instead , if you know them personally or if the top man in AIBEA  will give you audience, better explain the plight 

of  suffering  retirees and going to suffer future reitirees  who are still in the old pension scheme. We are patiently 

under going  sufferings. Out of frustation some retiress make some noise. 

Again I reqwuest you not to address me in this regard. Betrayal  is  Betreyal. 

Regards,

Yours

Subramani S

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[Suryakumaran Nair]

Dear Prasad sir,

You are struggling hard to make our friends understand the facts.  But they are already misled by unscrupulous elements  who do not seem to have any  commitment to the cause of workers or retirees.   As a result without knowing the basic consequences,  many of our friends are following the wrong path,  upholding harmful slogans.  I sincerely salute you for having taking strenuous efforts to enlighten our friends on various aspects of our issue.  Thanks a lot

Suryakumar.

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[Prasad C N]

Dear Shri Nairji,

I fully agree with you.  When Pension Scheme was introduced, despite repeated request to opt for Pension, vast majority of Officers did not had faith in AIBEA's call and went by opinion of AIBOC.  They opted PF.  Only later most of these Officers understood, Pension is better than PF and opted for Pension in 2010.  

Whatever, we say many of them have decided that AIBEA under the leadership of Com.Venkatachalam is so powerful that he can get our Pension updated and all other organisations and their views do not matter.  They have also decided that he alone matters and all other organisations are of no consequence.  They have also decided that for our problems, only CHV is responsible and leaders of all other organisations want to update our pension and only Com.CHV and AIBEA are coming in the way.  Com. CHV promised that he will not sign the settlement without improving Pension.  There is no dispute, so is Com Soumya Datta.  We only remember Com.CHV's promise and Com. CHV is/was not aware that load of 12.5% was not acceptable to other organisations and he alone cannot improve pension. 

Whatever proof you provide, whatever evidence you provide and whatever documents you provide to the contrary, Com.CHV and AIBEA alone are responsible for all the problems of Bank retirees.  To come to such conclusion, no evidence, no proof, no document, no evidence, etc. are required.  Only belief and hearsay are enough.  Preparedness of Officers' Associations for signing the Joint Note on 18.10.20 without updation of pension should have been eye opener for Bank retirees, which demonstrated who is what.  

Therefore, I also agree with you that there is no meaning in making attempts to convince by providing information.  You can take horse to the water you cannot make it drink.  You can provide information but no one can be convinced based on valid information alone.

Thanks, a Million. 

With regards,

Prasad C N

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[JSOMA SHEKARA]

What is wrong with Unions?

No Updation since 20 Years.

No 100% DA

No 5 years and 1616-1684 benefits even after court verdict

No Pension on Special allowance

No pension for Resignees

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[narinder singh]

Agree


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On Saturday, October 24, 2020, 21:28, 'Sebastian Sakaria' via bankpensioner <bankpe...@googlegroups.com> wrote:

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Sir,

If you go through past history, you will find that unions have been the biggest enemy of the bank employees.

PNB was the first bank to announce VRS in the year 2000.  At that time I was working at PNB HO in New Delhi.  The then Chairman of PNB wanted to give promotion to clerical staff who completed 15 years of service because he found them very unproductive although drawing salary equal to JMG Scale I.  The unions opposed the idea.  When VRS was announced the management wanted to give section option for pension so that maximum employees can avail the scheme.  Again the union opposed it saying that they have not made any such demand.

https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/bankpensioner/1162140322.2112488.1603468596317%40mail.yahoo.com

.

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[JSOMA SHEKARA]

OK past is past. We retirees can only debate here.We are powerless. Since DFS has given unions to decide retirees issues to be decided in BPS FM also will not interfere unless a specific recommendation is submitted from IBA. For IBA to take a decision, Unions have to present a strong demand for updation. The ball is in UFBU court. They have to discuss the issue with IBA. Retiree associations are clueless and just to retain their posts they enact drama like sending letter to IBA. FM etc but we have not seen any acknowledgement from IBA or FM.

We Bankers case will fail. Both IBA and UFBU have hundreds of crores of Rupees at their disposal.They will appoint the costliest advocate and fight cases though they are against retirees approaching courts. AIBOC gave a huge amount to its retired office bearer. For them, the advocate fee is peanuts. Retirees cannot spend such amounts and fail.

Unless Unions introspect and understand problems of retirees pensioners will never get justice.

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[Dilip Deshpande]

Yes Mr. Suryakumarji, I also agree that respected Shri Prasad Sir is struggling hard to make our friends understand the facts. However, I feel that respected Shri Prasad Sir may chalk out a proper plan for getting updation of pension and inform this plan as well as the developments in implementing this plan to the Members of this Blog. I am confident that respected Shri Prasad Sir may show right path so that Retirees may not go to wrong path. A capable person like respected Prasad Sir may not waste his energy in struggling hard to make our friends understand the facts, because even if we assume that with such struggle our friends understand the facts, we are not going to get updation.
We are interested in getting updation of pension and whoever achieves or at least try to achieve the same, we are prepared to support and salute him.

Incidentally, you also appear to be intelligent because few days back, you had enlightened us with a totally new aspect of our issue that Corporates are playing important role to hurdle our pension updation.

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[JSOMA SHEKARA]

We expect AIBOC and AIBEA to pursue updation issue but they have their own agenda. We blame WE BANKERS that a small group of employees are out to harm collective bargaining.

Officers upto Scale 4 are majority members of AIBOC. Number of officers from scale V toVII are insignificant.

But when some banks withdrew the mandate for officers scale V and above, AIBOC for these small groups of officers was ready to stall BPS and even boycotted BPS meetings. And then went to DFS to discuss this issue. Later AIBOC got the issue resolved at whose cost? AIBOC not ready to take delegation to DFS for updation issue.

All pre 2002 pensioners are suffering because of tapered DA and without pension revision. Now an ex office bearer of AIBOC is claiming General Mangaers are more affected ecause of tapered DA. Unions give scant respect for rules and regulations. If some groups protest against present faulty system they cry collective bargaining is in danger. But what actually they are practising is selective bargaining.

[P V Natarajan]

"if some groups protest against present faulty system they cry collective bargaining is in danger. But what actually they are practising is selective bargaining."

👏👏👏

Soma Sekhara Ji,

Excellently,you hve out it Sir. 

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[Metlapalli Sharma]

Dear Somsekharji,

what you said of the present state of unions-" what actually they are practising is selective bargaining" is 100% true. 

If not why don't they( the unions) call for a day's strike for the common cause of retirees! Why don't they take up court battles on behalf of its membership? Why don't they  involve  in implementation of decided court orders?

 Collective  bargaining is an all inclusive process and  not the gross neglect of a section of  retirees for various flimsy reasons. 

The deplorable lot of pre- 2002 retirees unless addressed on a sympathetic basis, with total support from all sections of existing employees and the post 2002 retirees, the bargaining process would neither be reasonable nor ethical. 

The disbelief in trade unions has its genesis from the inhuman treatment meted out to the pre2002 retirees. Restoration of faith can happen only when the rotten issue is properly addressed. 

The trade unions can not assume a tight lipped bossism. 

They cannot  afford to keep the entire bargaining process to themselves as a closely guarded secret, that leads to gossip and misapprehensions. 

Any criticism from the members is treated anti organisational and  a  sort of grudge or revenge is meted out to such outspoken groups or collective of individuals.

Trade unions of the past most selflessly  served their members through their all -sacrificing leaders. At present the leadership is so totally changed that it fights  only for its own survival and domain of authority.  

Under such conditions seeking a direct intervention eliminating the middlemen unions and IBA , where the affected can be directly heard, remains the only alternative and is not sin.

 The Process of change is on. Let the change ensure adequate care of the already affected . Lamenting for support from members or crying for  lack of faith  is for the time being is a gone concept.

Let us pray let wisdom dawn upon all concerned in proper addressing of the grievances of the elderly lot.

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[Subramani S]

Shri PV Natarajan ji

Well said  "if some groups protest against present faulty system they cry collective bargaining is in danger. But what actually they are practising is selective bargaining."

UFBU lead by AIBEA was useless and is useless. Heart of Heart  ' Retirees' Problems' is anathema to AIBEA.

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[Debasish Mukherjee]

Mr.JSoma Shekara has rightly stated that Union leaders have selectively taken up issues for the higher level Executives ignoring affected lower level officers. These UFBU/AIBEA leaders deliberately ignored demanding removal of discrimination in payment of equal 100% D.A. to the pre Nov.2002 retirees which segment consists of not only the Genl.Managers rank officers retired before 1997 but are also affected several thousand other lower level officers & employees. Why some section is showing their concern only for G.M.level executives? UFBU & AIBEA leaders have lost confidence of major section of retirees whom the leaders have duped in all the issues and when some retirees individually or jointly as We Bankers retiree group have moved legally against repeated discrimination thrust upon the helpless retirees by the crooked alliance of IBA & UFBU those caucus of union leaders are criticizing the legal fights against discriminations initiated by those retiree groups. Days are not far that Betrayals will face stringent rebuffs from every front of discriminated segment of retirees.

Debasish Mukherjee,

mumb...@rediffmail.com

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[Dilip Deshpande]

Retirees are blaming/ criticising UFBU not just because UFBU is not settling issues of Retirees, but Retirees are cursing UFBU for the reason that out of package approved by the Government for both working & retired class, entire cake is taken by UFBU for working class, taking advantage of absence of representatives of Retirees in BPS Negotiations. The solution for this is Retirees Association has to lodge complaint with FM/ DFS and demand separate package exclusively for Retirees. Another solution is going to the Court on this ground of misappropriation. 

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[LakshmanRao Kantamsetti]

Retirees should interact with DFS not with IBA 

Courts take time and money 

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[saradindu basu]

I have also observed write-ups of Shri Prasad since long. As per my understanding his each reply reflects unbiased view on every topic of discussion and thought of long-term common good .  I wish him and others happy life.

Best regards to Shri Prasad.

---Saradindu Basu.

---

From: bankpe...@googlegroups.com <bankpe...@googlegroups.com> on behalf of Suryakumaran Nair <suryaku...@gmail.com>
Sent: Saturday, October 24, 2020 1:29 PM
To: bankpe...@googlegroups.com <bankpe...@googlegroups.com>

Subject: Re: bankpensioner We Bankers

To view this discussion on the web visit https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/bankpensioner/CAORfHTH%3DQxJCAJxBq0Z1TEOAc-s8Fr5wU2Kj2k-G3bbm7T5SjQ%40mail.gmail.com.

[Parvatam Veera Bhadra Swamy]

Yes, our retirees associations should bring it to their attention and direct DFS to settle their issues atleast in this settlement by involving retirees representatives in BPS talks and this process should continue in future settlements also.

PVB Swamy

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[Venkata S.Akella CFE]

I tot categorically concur with the view that sri.Prasad is truly professional in  his approach and attitude.

No one can doubt his passion, dedication and commitment for the cause and only the cause of the 

pensioner community.

My humble appeal to him to stay fully focussed  on his fight for the cause of improving the lot of the 

pensioners and avoid, to the extent possible, to react to all comments made .

It is trusted that HE KNOWS THAT PAST IS HISTORY AND 

                         THE PRESENT IS THE GIFT TO ALL OF US.

Wherever there is a need,only,  he may choose to respond.

 

May he be continued to be blessed with the Divine Strength, Spirit and guidance in his efforts !!!!

With best regards.

 

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[saradindu basu]

Sri Subramani, 

                                Are you sure that before the 1993 pension agreement, AIBEA  was demanding pension as third benefit and in that agreement family was ignored? I remember that after 1993 pension agreement systematic campaign unleashed against joining the pension by rivals included that " Don't worry. Don't join. We will procure Pension as third benifit". Consequently, majority including many AIBEA/AIBOA fell into the trap. But. I don't blame anyone for that. I confess that I did not have foresight. As far as remember family pension was there in 1993 pension agreement.

-Saradindu Basu

---

From: bankpe...@googlegroups.com <bankpe...@googlegroups.com> on behalf of Subramani S <subram...@gmail.com>
Sent: Friday, October 23, 2020 10:34 AM

To: bankpe...@googlegroups.com <bankpe...@googlegroups.com>
Subject: Re: bankpensioner We Bankers

Sri Guna ji,

Before the 1993 pension agreement, AIBEA which was demanding pension as third benefit, somesalted and went 

for Pension inl ieu of Contributory PF.  Even that demand was not properly met  (pension updation & family pension left out). What a shame ?  What is there to chest thump ?  Even the New Pension Scheme which came into being wef  April 2010 , has better components like Basic, DA on basic etc.,  Whereas what AIBEA got is inferior and injurious to lacs of retirees and future retirees.

AiBEA  has been in the forefront for damaging the interest of retirees. We curse the the then and the following leaderships of AIBEA

Which is the root cause  of the malady.

Yours

Subramani S

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On Fri, 23 Oct 2020 at 09:50, GUNA <ind...@gmail.com> wrote:

Even Pension Settlement dt.29-10-1993 was signed under sec (18) of Industrial Disputes Act 1947 by AIBEA and IBA the RESULT of which all of us are getting PENSION NOW.

WE SALUTE the THEN Leadership of AIBEA.

On Thu, Oct 22, 2020 at 4:06 PM 'Prasad C N' via bankpensioner <bankpe...@googlegroups.com> wrote:

Dear Shri Subamani Sirji,

The basic problem is that we have prejudiced and predetermined attitude towards AIBEA.  We are carrying forward the same opinion we had during working years.  Before, we question or target one organisation, please ask yourself what is the role of other organisations. In case, Award Staff unions were to agree for 16.4% Special Allowances, Officers Associations would have signed Joint Note on last Sunday, without Updation issue.  They had invited all concerned to reach Mumbai for signing of Joint Note.  Pension Updation issue is not yet taken up with all seriousness. Can we continue to blame AIBEA and Com.CHV for Officers' signing Joint Note without retirees' issue.  Award Staff Unions would not have signed Bipartite Settlement on that day.  This example amply demonstrate that we are blaming only AIBEA for all our problems.  I have not seen anyone including you, blaming Officers' organisations, more particularly AIBOC for any of our problems.  This is despite providing evidence and proof.  Is it fair and Why ?

We have decided that AIBEA should and must get our pension updated.  It is also decided that it the duty of ONLY AIBEA.  No one else is responsible.  This is the expectation of Retired Officers, including Probationary Officers. Retired Officers have also decided that it is only CHV who is deciding the issues of Officers who are in service.  Before going into merit, I have a question.  If so, why there is need for existence of Officers' Organsiations including AIBOC ?  Implication of such accusations have serious consequences, as we are questioning the role and functioning of these organisations, its leaders and the leadership of these organisation.  What we are forgetting is that when we use the word 'betrayal', we should be very careful.  Whole problem in this regard is that rendering help cannot be demanded.  If any one or organisation is not obligated to take up issues of a non-member, can not taking of such issues be called as 'betrayal'.  Was there any promise by the organisation that they would ensure updation of pension, with every settlement ?  This statement is applicable to any organisation without restricting to AIBOC or AIBEA.

Please recall your memories and take back your memories to years, 1993 to 1995.  JAC was formed by non-AIBEA organisations.  They campaigned against Pension option.  Was it a sin of AIBEA to entered into Pension Settlement ?  There were agitations and stay orders.  With great difficulty and hurriedly Pension Scheme was introduced, on account of these impediments.  That is the reason why I always say negative actions do not bring in positive results.  

On 14.12.1999 Joint Note was signed with 1616 Clause.  AIBEA did not agree for inclusion of this clause.  On account of this dispute and other issues, 7th Bipartite was signed three months' later, that too with a unwritten promise that this issue would be resolved in the next Bipartite.  Officers' Associations created this problem and AIBEA need to intervene to solve this problem.  Still who do we blame ? AIBEA.  Why these Officers Association did not update pension, as they were signing the first Bipartite Settlement after Pension Regulations came into force ?  We still blame AIBEA.  Is it correct ?  Why are we so biased ?

Whether in 2015 or now, which Union/Association, which is willing to share a portion for improvement of our Pension ?  What did Mr.Havinder Singh, General Secretary of AIBOC say when Special Allowance was introduced.  When asked about denial of pension benefit on this amount, he said 'We are more bothered about giving more money in the hands of his members, not about updation'.  Is it  correct ? Can we blame CHV for this also ?

I can keep on narrating one instance or the other in each Bipartite, how other organisations have harmed our interest.  But, since we have decided that it is only AIBEA and Com. C H Venkatachalam are responsible, whatever may be other opinion or truth, they are not acceptable to us.  I sorry, we are not fair.  I do not mind, if any one accuses me of any thing.  I am presenting true picture. I am not supporting without any reason.

Thanks, a Million. 

With regards,

Prasad C N

On Thursday, 22 October, 2020, 09:58:34 am IST, Subramani S <subram...@gmail.com> wrote:

Shri. C.N.Prasadji ,

Thanks very much for ur kind reply.  We can not forget people have helpled us . Likewise 

We can not forget the betrayal done also. AIBEA  totally betrayed. Could not they incorportate the Updation and 

Family pension clause in the 1993-94 agreement ??  Just for including the 1986 retirees  they did not ensure this. 

In the subsequent Bipartite Settlements they conveniently forget this very very vital aspect affecting lacs of future retiring 

employees.  In each subsequent Bipartitments Mr.Venkatachalam led UFBU was just interested in getting about 15% wage

hike settlements, get the levy and enjoyment.

I am not pinning any hope on these short sighted, selfish betrayers to do any thing positive for updation of pension. As being 

roumored, that the Fin Minsistry is seems to be favourably looking at the Family Pension aspect. That may materialize.

regards,

Yours sincerely

Subramani S

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On Wed, 21 Oct 2020 at 15:49, bhaskara sarma <pbsa...@gmail.com> wrote:

Desperate people do anything even if it is unreasonable.UFBU is squarely responsible for driving the pensioners and retirees to a corner for the past 25 years. Nobody else should be blamed.UFBU only is to be blamed.

With regards,

P Bhaskara Sarma.

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[Dilip Deshpande]

From the Videos on U Tube of 'We Bankers', it appears that this group is aggressively fighting for rights of Bank Employees and Pensioners also. In Sanskrit there is a proverb that in YADNYA only Goat is victim but not tiger, which means that only weak becomes victim. Therefore we have to be aggressive  like tiger. So far present Retirees Associations are like Goat & surrendering to UFBU and therefore Retirees have become victims. Now Retirees are required to be strong for that we have to form some group & roar against the injustice caused to us. The injustice is that in every BPS, certain amount is approved for the benefits of both working as well as retired staff, allocation of which is left to be decided by UFBU & IBA. Taking disadvantage of absence of Retirees representatives in BPS Negotiations, UFBU grabs entire package for their existing members and IBA keeps cunning silence knowing very well that Retirees are not more than Goat. We may not be Voters of any Constituents of UFBU, but we are Voters of Government of India. Moreover we are Senior Citizens having special status. We have to unite & raise our voice against the cheating as above, so that our voice reaches the PM/ FM & others. Not failure but low aim is crime.

[P V Natarajan]

Yes.

Only " We Bankers" is taking up Updation in right earnest. Now, We have no forum. We are not members of UFBU. Retirees federations are not recognised by IBA even to acknowledge their letters!

What is the way out ? 

Only Lord Yama ?

On Wed, Oct 28, 2020, 09:55 Dilip Deshpande <dilip...@gmail.com> wrote:

From the Videos on U Tube of 'We Bankers', it appears that this group is aggressively fighting for rights of Bank Employees and Pensioners also. In Sanskrit there is a proverb that in YADNYA only Goat is victim but not tiger, which means that only weak becomes victim. Therefore we have to be aggressive  like tiger. So far present Retirees Associations are like Goat & surrendering to UFBU and therefore Retirees have become victims. Now Retirees are required to be strong for that we have to form some group & roar against the injustice caused to us. The injustice is that in every BPS, certain amount is approved for the benefits of both working as well as retired staff, allocation of which is left to be decided by UFBU & IBA. Taking disadvantage of absence of Retirees representatives in BPS Negotiations, UFBU grabs entire package for their existing members and IBA keeps cunning silence knowing very well that Retirees are not more than Goat. We may not be Voters of any Constituents of UFBU, but we are Voters of Government of India. Moreover we are Senior Citizens having special status. We have to unite & raise our voice against the cheating as above, so that our voice reaches the PM/ FM & others. Not failure but low aim is crime.

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[Prasad C N]

Dear Shri Basuji,

Some pages of Documents which were circulated in 1994 - 1995 have been attached to my earlier mail.  They amply demonstrate who stood for what.  

Some have decided that they will not accept anything other than bashing of AIBEA. Is there any meaning in explaining.  After some time  we would demonstrate, why AIBEA pursued pension as second benefit, not as third benefit.  

Thanks, a Million. 

With regards,

Prasad C N

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[Nagaraju Kakani]

Sairam, You have quoted in your mail as below:

" The injustice is that in every BPS, certain amount is approved for the benefits of both working as well as retired staff, allocation of which is left to be decided by UFBU & IBA. "

Can you please through light from where you got this information. If we have proof for it, we all can join hands to fight for this injustice. Hope the experienced senior retirees can through light on this to explain this. 

With regards, 

Nagaraju Kakani, 

Hyderabad. 

On Wed, Oct 28, 2020, 09:55 Dilip Deshpande <dilip...@gmail.com> wrote:

From the Videos on U Tube of 'We Bankers', it appears that this group is aggressively fighting for rights of Bank Employees and Pensioners also. In Sanskrit there is a proverb that in YADNYA only Goat is victim but not tiger, which means that only weak becomes victim. Therefore we have to be aggressive  like tiger. So far present Retirees Associations are like Goat & surrendering to UFBU and therefore Retirees have become victims. Now Retirees are required to be strong for that we have to form some group & roar against the injustice caused to us. The injustice is that in every BPS, certain amount is approved for the benefits of both working as well as retired staff, allocation of which is left to be decided by UFBU & IBA. Taking disadvantage of absence of Retirees representatives in BPS Negotiations, UFBU grabs entire package for their existing members and IBA keeps cunning silence knowing very well that Retirees are not more than Goat. We may not be Voters of any Constituents of UFBU, but we are Voters of Government of India. Moreover we are Senior Citizens having special status. We have to unite & raise our voice against the cheating as above, so that our voice reaches the PM/ FM & others. Not failure but low aim is crime.

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[Mattar Kamalaksha Kini]

From the discussion above it is observed that the UFBU can demand for inclusion of pension updation in talks. But the the unions are silent or not bothered.Why sri Prasadji ? Can you through some light on this sir.

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MKKINI

[LakshmanRao Kantamsetti]

All the retiree associations should join hands to be one 

Joint action committee 

JAC of Retireesc

On Wed, Oct 28, 2020, 09:55 Dilip Deshpande <dilip...@gmail.com> wrote:

From the Videos on U Tube of 'We Bankers', it appears that this group is aggressively fighting for rights of Bank Employees and Pensioners also. In Sanskrit there is a proverb that in YADNYA only Goat is victim but not tiger, which means that only weak becomes victim. Therefore we have to be aggressive  like tiger. So far present Retirees Associations are like Goat & surrendering to UFBU and therefore Retirees have become victims. Now Retirees are required to be strong for that we have to form some group & roar against the injustice caused to us. The injustice is that in every BPS, certain amount is approved for the benefits of both working as well as retired staff, allocation of which is left to be decided by UFBU & IBA. Taking disadvantage of absence of Retirees representatives in BPS Negotiations, UFBU grabs entire package for their existing members and IBA keeps cunning silence knowing very well that Retirees are not more than Goat. We may not be Voters of any Constituents of UFBU, but we are Voters of Government of India. Moreover we are Senior Citizens having special status. We have to unite & raise our voice against the cheating as above, so that our voice reaches the PM/ FM & others. Not failure but low aim is crime.

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[LakshmanRao Kantamsetti]

Please do not lose heart 

All the key  office bearers 

President 

Secretary 

Of all the associations of retirees will  be  a team 

Secretaries and undersrcretariez of 

Ministry if pensions 

Ministry of social justice 

Ministry of labour 

National human rights - key officials

 Retired judges 

Is a team helping the retirees 

Impressing upon the ministry of finance team 

Mr nanda Kumar    undersecretary 

Mr Pande secretary 

Mrs Anuradha thakur   joint secretary 

Mr Krishna mutty subramanian 

Chief economic advisor 

If you people agree 

Tell me 

I propose to 

Mrs amrapali 

Deputy secretary 

Pmo 

And get it okayed 

Let us not lose time 

By 25th dec 

Payment of revised pension and all other issues to be resolved. 

KLRao 

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[Subramani S]

SrI  Saradindu Basu,

i VIVIDLY REMEMBER. Initially, AIBEA began demanding Pension as a third benefit as it was prevalent in

State Bank Inida. When they, all of a sudden, U-Turned and began demanding  Pension in lieu of Contributory

PF scheme that was in vogue. The mute point is, Even this demand they did not  accomplish properly. Crooked

people.  These traitors  have done Irreparable  ( almost - 99.90% ) injury to Retirees. Let  God punish them.

Yours

Subramani S

Pammal, Chennai

28/102020

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[bhaskara sarma]

Yes,I agree.

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[saradindu basu]

Sri Subramani S Pammal.

                                             I had written what I had observed closely. AIBEA never demanded Pension as third benifit and that was not evident from any charter of demand placed by them. As far as I know, at that time only SBI people were enjoying nominal pension as third benifit. Real Crooked and traitors unleashed systematic campaign against joining pension citing many reasons. That pension agreement was not fool-proof,  but achieving it was never easy. That agreement covered employees of private sector Banks too. Can it be explained as to why there were huge pressing demand for second option for joining the said scheme. Did those who opted for pension later were fools?

                                             

                                             When I joined my Bank, there was no pension. I am thankful to GOD that I am now getting pension which is helping me to maintain my sedate life style. EPFO are very less. Govt. pension is higher. I never compare myself with others. My firm belief is that GOD acts thru others.

---Saradindu Basu

---

From: bankpe...@googlegroups.com <bankpe...@googlegroups.com> on behalf of Subramani S <subram...@gmail.com>

Sent: Wednesday, October 28, 2020 9:47 PM

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[Subramani S]

Sri saradindu basu,

I have not maintained proof of records/cirulars etc.,  AIBEA was initially demanding pension as third benefit.

The other unions like BEFI were also strongly supporting " Pension as third Benefit". At one stage AIBEA backtracked on 

this  original demand and went for Pension in Lieu Of CPF. If you have not followed as to what happened in those periods

I will not blame you for that  nor will I term that as selective amnesia. The point is , even this Pension in Lieu of CPF was not implemented as it was prevalent for Cenral Govt Staff.  See, No updation of pension, Very poor Family pension.

Because of this all the retirees and future retirees have been FOOLED BY AIBEA . 

At that time the Central Govt was not having Liquid Funds. (IN 1990 or so they pledged the Gold with IMF ).The

Central Govt was eying the funds accumulated in PF accounts. So the IBA  was willing to offer Pension in lieu of 

CPF contribution. Problem was with AIBEA only. They completely failed to include Updation and Family pension as was in

vogue for Central Govt Staff.

AIBEA, which is TREACHEROUS VILLAIN for  those poor ruined retirees and future retirees may look like GOD for its BLIND FOLLOWERS.

Regards

Yours,

Subramani S

Pammal,Chennai

30/10/2020

  

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[Dilip Deshpande]

In the recent interview Hon'ble Finance Minister Respected Madam Nirmala Sitaraman has clearly stated that she has asked SBI to talk to IBA for issues of those who retired some time ago and whose Pension is not commensurate with Pensioners of equal rank. This is clear indication that Pension Updation is expected to happen soon in PSU Banks. 

[Satyanarayana Rao]

Now all the retirees have  developed  confidence that some improvement will take place in pension benefits. Now the ball is in the court of UFBU and IBA. Let us have patience and hope for some good news. With festival greetings. 

Sent from Yahoo Mail on Android

On Fri, 30 Oct 2020 at 15:50, Dilip Deshpande

<dilip...@gmail.com> wrote:

In the recent interview Hon'ble Finance Minister Respected Madam Nirmala Sitaraman has clearly stated that she has asked SBI to talk to IBA for issues of those who retired some time ago and whose Pension is not commensurate with Pensioners of equal rank. This is clear indication that Pension Updation is expected to happen soon in PSU Banks. 

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[Dilip Deshpande]

Hon'ble Finance Minister Respected Madam Nirmala Sitaramanji has soecifically mentioned 'whose pension is not commensurate with pension of EQUAL RANK'. This clearly refers to OROP means 'One Rank One Pension '. This interview has opened door for our Retirees Association, who now need not depend upon useless UFBU and interact directly with Banking Secretary. I hope, now at least, our Retirees Association will wake up and take active steps with necessary follow up. We have to demand OROP not only for this settlement but provision of automatic OROP in future BPS, of course if the system of BPS is not desolved.

[Dilip Deshpande]

Yes Mr. Subramani. During that period,  the Banks also were so short of Funds that the Banks were offering 14% or so rate of interest on domestic deposit. On NRNR Deposits Banks were offering rate of interest of 24%. So Pension in lieu of PF was appearing lucrative for the Bank Management, IBA & the Government, at that time.

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[Dilip Deshpande]

Lot of injustice has been made to Bank Retirees during last 25 years. To redress the same Pension of the  Bank Retirees is required to be updated on OROP basis, i.e. 'One Rank One Pension' and not only on RBI Formula. OROP means, for example an employees has retired in 2000 in the rank of Scale II Top, then his Pension to be refixed at every Settlement at the present basic of the employee retired in the rank of Scale II Top. OROP is successfully implemented in army. Since Hon'ble Finance Minister Respected Madam Nirmala Sitaraman has admired Bank employees as COVID Warrior, it is justified that OROP, just like army may be implemented for the Bank Staff. Bank employees were ahead of RBI employees in this war against Corona and therefore Bank employees deserve more benefits than RBI Employees. Otherwise also Bank employees take more risk in their job than their counterpart in RBI, but are getting much less salary compared to RBI Employees.

[P V Natarajan]

The Masters of Retiree associations are AIBEA & AIBOC.

They will never overstep their Masters. 

On Sat, Oct 31, 2020, 20:24 Dilip Deshpande <dilip...@gmail.com> wrote:

Hon'ble Finance Minister Respected Madam Nirmala Sitaramanji has soecifically mentioned 'whose pension is not commensurate with pension of EQUAL RANK'. This clearly refers to OROP means 'One Rank One Pension '. This interview has opened door for our Retirees Association, who now need not depend upon useless UFBU and interact directly with Banking Secretary. I hope, now at least, our Retirees Association will wake up and take active steps with necessary follow up. We have to demand OROP not only for this settlement but provision of automatic OROP in future BPS, of course if the system of BPS is not desolved.

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[Prasad C N]

Dear Sir,

With the exception of Defense Pensioners, no other pensioner including Central Government, Reserve Bank of India, etc. have got 'One Rank One Pension'.  This for your kind information.

Thanks, a Million. 

With regards,

Prasad C N

On Saturday, 31 October, 2020, 08:38:37 pm IST, Dilip Deshpande <dilip...@gmail.com> wrote:

Lot of injustice has been made to Bank Retirees during last 25 years. To redress the same Pension of the  Bank Retirees is required to be updated on OROP basis, i.e. 'One Rank One Pension' and not only on RBI Formula. OROP means, for example an employees has retired in 2000 in the rank of Scale II Top, then his Pension to be refixed at every Settlement at the present basic of the employee retired in the rank of Scale II Top. OROP is successfully implemented in army. Since Hon'ble Finance Minister Respected Madam Nirmala Sitaraman has admired Bank employees as COVID Warrior, it is justified that OROP, just like army may be implemented for the Bank Staff. Bank employees were ahead of RBI employees in this war against Corona and therefore Bank employees deserve more benefits than RBI Employees. Otherwise also Bank employees take more risk in their job than their counterpart in RBI, but are getting much less salary compared to RBI Employees.

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[Nagaraju Kakani]

Sairam, we pray not to puncture the ball before they make the goal.May Bhagawan give them wisdom to solve the issues at par with RBI retirees.

With greetings,

Nagaraju Kakani, 

BOI SVRS 2000/PENSION 2009,

HYDERABAD.

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[Dilip Deshpande]

Mr. Satyanarayan Rao, you are wrong. Now the Ball is not in court of IBA & UFBU, but it is in the Court of Hon'ble Finance Minister Respected Nirmala  Sitaraman Madam. She is capable of hitting the ball hard and IBA has to run to collect the ball wherever she hits the ball & UFBU has to be hand clapping spectator. Do not try to mislead us, which is your usual habit. 

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[Sanjay J]

Dilip Deshpande:

👏👏👏

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[Dilip Deshpande]

Our Demands may be:-

1. 100% DA to pre 2002 Retirees, who have suffered heavily for last 18 years or more. Hon'ble Finance Minister has referred Pensioners retired long back, in her interview. 

2. Refixation of basic Pension to the level of equal rank as per XIth BPS. This point is also referred by Hon'ble Finance Minister by saying 'Pensioners retired long ago, whose Pension is not commensurate with Pension of equal Rank'.

3. Provision of automatic refixation of Pension commensurate with equal rank in all subsequent BPS, if at all BPS System continues. 

4. Increase of Family Pension to 30%, as indicated by IBA Chairman.

5. Medical Insurance Premium for Retirees from Welfare Funds as directed by DFS long back ( but not implemented by IBA, mischievously) or from some special fund created for this purpose. 

We all Retirees remain grateful to Hon'ble Finance Minister Respected Madam Nirmala Sitaramanji in our entire life and pray to GOD to shower his best blessings on Respected Madam Nirmala Sitaramanji and also on our supporter Hon'ble Prime Minister Respected Shri Narendra Modiji. 

[Satyanarayana Rao]

Unless  a  propasal goes from UFBU and IBA  for improvement on pension updation the government  will not clear the updation. U are not aware about the orgin and sanctity of existing pension regulations for which UFBU and  IBA are having unassailable rights to negotiate and settle .Pl meet  some legal experts and know  the  importance of id act and the settlement signed. U are horping on press reort of the F M and dreaming that things have been settled. The government will not unilaterally do any improvement on its own ignoring the existing regulations and the settlement signed by  Aibea and IBA. Donot jump to the conclusion of right and wrong. U have

been advacating pay commission and writing like legal expert like Palkivala

Try to acquire some basic knowledge how agreements and settlements are

Protected under  I.D act. This forum  is not for self aggrandizement. Be cool till the final real picture emerges .Deshponde  don't be over smart in your communications.Several learned members and experts are debating the issue. With festival greetings .

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[Dilip Deshpande]

As per my knowledge, RBI Management prepared the Updation Scheme for their staff, without involvement of Unions/ Association. This Scheme, with recommendation forwarded to the Government. At that time, the Government wanted support or at least silence of RBI Staff over taking of huge Reserves lying with RBI. therefore, the Government immediately approved the updation of  RBI Pension. In our case also, for the reasons not known to me, the Government is in total favour of Bank Retirees, at present and Hon'ble Finance Minister is taking very proactive steps for up gradation & other issues of the staff retired long back. We can therefore may get something more than our expectations, for which we retirees have to be grateful to respected Madam Nirmala Sitaramanji & pray for her welfare as well as welfare of Hon'ble Prime Minister respected Shri Modiji, without whose blessings such thing would not have happened. We have to wait only for very short time to know how, when and what.

[Dilip Deshpande]

I do not belong to any political party. But , if present Government gets Pension Updation for Bank Retirees, not only me and my family of 4 persons will become permanent voters of BJP, but I will try to get at least 100 friends & relatives as permanent voters of BJP.

[mohan p]

Sir,

        Updation of Pension for RBI Pensioners was result of  years long consistent joint actions of both employees and Pensioners. Not merely on a notification from MOF it was granted. 

01.RBI Employees Union were demanding for updation of pension for past several years.

02. RBI Pensioners too were consistent on demanding and making silent protest with play cards  at the venues of each RBI board meet, whenever the meet held in past years.

03.Employees Unions went ahead for direct action with two days  mass casual leave demanding Updation on Pension in year 2018.

04.RBI Management too had submitted earlier proposal on recommending Updation of pension to its pensioners.

05.Further erstwhile RBI Governor himself met Finance Minister, to press the above demand.

06.Legal process too were initiated by pensioners.

So it can be seen that, only with full support and actions of employees ,Pensioners, and management they could secure pension updation in 2019 

In our case there were no such joint efforts 

from employees with pensioners.IBA too  has not so far sent any proposal  with their recommendation to MOF, as in the case of RBI.

Also we should be clear in our mind , on the point that, FM's statement in an interview with media, cannot be treated as resolution of pensioners all issues.

While welcoming FM's concern on our long pending issues, we should also anticipate, the normal practical procedure to make it a reality early.

A long drawn process need to be initiated from the side of IBA with consenses of workmen/officers unions, on formula to be adopted, (if it is on same line of RBI - it was up to X th BPS-or otherwise) on updation pension in banks, relevant  cost factor,  and ways and  means to build up such additional fund  and finally a proposal to MOF 

recommending updation of pension ( now up to XIth BPS level).Unless this process is completed nothing will move forward.

Retirees Apex organisation has instantly took up the matter with IBA and FM on this subject.

Now it is the turn of employees/officers unions.So far we have not seen any communication to IBA in this regard from them.Let us hope that they will also do it without delay.

Whether we like it or not only through a settlement through between employees/officers unions with IBA pension updation and related issues  can be finalised.

Let us look forward to that good day!

 

On Tue, 3 Nov, 2020, 9:46 AM Dilip Deshpande, <dilip...@gmail.com> wrote:

As per my knowledge, RBI Management prepared the Updation Scheme for their staff, without involvement of Unions/ Association. This Scheme, with recommendation forwarded to the Government. At that time, the Government wanted support or at least silence of RBI Staff over taking of huge Reserves lying with RBI. therefore, the Government immediately approved the updation of  RBI Pension. In our case also, for the reasons not known to me, the Government is in total favour of Bank Retirees, at present and Hon'ble Finance Minister is taking very proactive steps for up gradation & other issues of the staff retired long back. We can therefore may get something more than our expectations, for which we retirees have to be grateful to respected Madam Nirmala Sitaramanji & pray for her welfare as well as welfare of Hon'ble Prime Minister respected Shri Modiji, without whose blessings such thing would not have happened. We have to wait only for very short time to know how, when and what.

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[Satyanarayana Rao]

In case of RBI the sole proprietor is government of India and strong persuasion by the governor and retirees association and working employees union and backed by Bombay high court order after prolonged negotiations the updation of pension is achieved. Congratulations to RBI pensioners. 

In case of  pensioners at UFBU and IBA level there are  different banks like private sector banks.,Foreign banks,and government public sector retirees pension updation is involved. Here comes how to find  funds to meet the payments of pension updation etc ?

It is not the government to augment resources for private sector banks petitioners pension updation. The respective non government banks have to meet the requirements of funding  of 

Pension funds. 

Can it happen?

People are building castles in air based on F.M press briefing. She intelligently  passed on the buck to SBI chairman and

IBA chairman. There it will stop.

Now  comes the role of UFBU and IBA to take advantage and invole all the members of IBA like private sector banks and foreign banks and all banks  whose retirees are enjoying pension as per 1993 pension regulations and 1995 pension agreement and as per 2 nd pension option agreement of 2005etc.

 

Let us think pragmatically and wait and watch the developments with out jumping and getting excited and elated as if pension updation arrears are credited to all eligible beneficiaries/pensioners account. Time will decide the shape of things in shores 

Be calm and wait and watch. Let the learned members continue the discussion with legal background and the fate of pension updation in the light of F.M press briefing. With regards and festival greetings. 

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[Dilip Deshpande]

Since all of us have worked with Banks, we are aware of 2 systems of sanction of any loan proposal. First system is that Desk Officer prepares the Loan Proposal & with recommendation, put before Sanctioning Authority for sanction. Second System is that Sanctioning Authority himself orally or through somebody asks Desk Officer to put up a particular Loan Proposal for sanction. In first system there is no guarantee that the loan Proposal is sanctioned, but in second system, it is almost certain that the Loan Proposal will be sanctioned. In our case the interview of Hon'ble Finance Minister Respected Madam Nirmala Sitaramanji was not just interview, but it was affirmation of the fact that Hon'ble Finance Minister has (1) Already instructed SBI Chairman to take up the matter of already retired staff as a Big Brother (2) Talked to IBA Chairman to settle issues of already retired staff (3) Banking Secretary was already working on the matter. (4) She has determined to see that dues of Bank Staff and Retirees are paid. From our experience in Bank, we can easily understand that under such circumstances, it is definite that some good news will be heard by us, very soon. I appeal to all Members of this Blog, who are expert in follow up action, to kindly do your best to follow up the matter. We have to be very careful because there may be some 'Shukracharyas', who may try to prevent this generous donation from Hon'ble Finance Minister and also from some betrayed among us, who may discourage or misguided us.

[Sundar Veluthedan]

Calm down Sir, calm down. Don't count the chicken before they are hatched. If updation comes on the way good.  Otherwise as in a Thamizh film song we can console ourselves 'ponal pokattum poda' meaning 'unreachable grapes are sour'

On Tue, 3 Nov 2020, 09:49 Dilip Deshpande, <dilip...@gmail.com> wrote:

I do not belong to any political party. But , if present Government gets Pension Updation for Bank Retirees, not only me and my family of 4 persons will become permanent voters of BJP, but I will try to get at least 100 friends & relatives as permanent voters of BJP.

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[Parvatam Veera Bhadra Swamy]

Yes, I agree with the views expressed by Shri Satyanarayana Ji and unless UFBU and IBA start negotiations and agree for common formula which is in lines of RBI and forward it to DFS, it will never happen.

Now it's up to retirees associations should bring pressure on UFBU leadership to solve this issue which we are expecting since long time.

PVB Swamy

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[P V Natarajan]

In RBI, was it out of a settlement ?

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[Parvatam Veera Bhadra Swamy]

Now it's up to UFBU leadership to get pension updation of retirees of the entire banking industry as there are positive signals from mof/ DFS/ finance minister which is a blessing to all of us.

Now I feel that all retirees associations should approach UFBU to solve our issues and we should grab this opportunity to settle our demand of pension updation.

PVB Swamy

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[Atul Mangla]

देश की वित्त मंत्री के साक्षात्कार, जिसमें उन्होंने बैंक कर्मचारियों व सेवा निवृत्त बैंक कर्मचारियों की समस्यायों के समाधान की आवश्यकता के बारे में अपनी कार्यवाही के बारे में बताया है, के बाद शायद हम लोगों को ज्यादा दिमाग न लगा कर कुछ समय इंतजार कर लेना चाहिए और भगवान से प्रार्थना करनी चाहिए की हमारे महान नेता लोगों को सद्बुद्धि प्रदान करें।

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[Dilip Deshpande]

You are giving false information Mr. Satyanarayan Rao that unless Proposal is sent by UFBU & IBA, the Government will not approve Updation. You are wrong. Hon'ble Finance Minister has already instructed IBA to put up the formal Proposal. SBI Chairman is also involved and Banking Secretary is working on the matter. IBA will put up this Proposal to the Government and after approval of the Government (which is almost certain fact), Pension Regulations may be amended suitably. No role to be played by UFBU, just like how it happened in RBI. 

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[Subramani S]

I fully agree with Sri. Dilip Deshpande. No role may be played by UFBU  or its role may be very limited. Govt decides. the FM

has talked to IBA Chairman. He has to carry out her orders. The IBA  may play major role in preparing a scheme for 

Pension Updation, Family pension increase  etc.,. As this is not coming within the ambit of wage settlement, the IBA 

should call the retirees' representatives for discussion and finalisation.

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[JSOMA SHEKARA]

BREAKING NEWS

Central Government has referred the We bankers dispute in Allahabad High court to the National Tribunal.

The terms of reference are as follows

Whether the refusal of the Indian Bank's Association in not entertaining the demands of United Forum of WeBankers Kanpur is justified and whether this can beentertained as Industrial Dispute.

If not, what relief and what directions if any, are necessary in the matter ?

However no mention of any stay on BPS.

Order copy attached

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[Satyanarayana Rao]

Mr. Deshponde. How IBA will forwatd the proposal  and what will be  the type proposal and what exactly be the contemts of the proposal and what basis  forthe supposed proposal and what type of formula to be implemented to resolve the pension updation? Unless IBA deliberate with UFBU IBA will not and cannot send the proposal unilaterally. 

I think you are too much relying  media reports ignoring statutory formality to be addressed. 

Anyway i appreciate and congratulate you for  the confidence u are expressing. I will be the first person to admire and congratulate of pension updation is done as per inference.what retirees and pensioners want is justice and pension updation. O k. Be cool. With festival greetings. 

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[Dilip Deshpande]

Mr. Satyanarayan Rao, we have to find some way that IBA deliberates not with UFBU but with Retirees Association, for issues of Retirees. Alternatively, some Committee/ Commission may be appointed to submit Report to the Government and after approval of the Government, Pension Regulations may be amended suitably. We already Retired Staff are not Members of any of the Constituents of UFBU and therefore do not want deliberation by UFBU for issues exclusively for already retired staff. If at all UFBU wants, representatives of Retirees must be allowed in deliberation to play major role. I am happy to Note that you will be Happy if Updation is achieved. 

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[Prasad C N]

Dear friends,

I am attaching a copy of the Judgment of Hon'ble Supreme Court with regard to Settlement entered into through Conciliation process.

Thanks, a Million. 

With regards,

Prasad C N

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[JSOMA SHEKARA]

Mr.Satyanarayana Rao

UFBU leaders had 10 years to discuss themselves type of formula for updation, period,date of effect and strategy to discuss the issue with IBA. During X BPS negotiations both IBA and UFBU agreed that pension benefits are social security benefits and cost factor should not be considered for resolving these issues. well they forgot their understanding.

Now for IBA and UFBU this is financial issue.  But without obtaining cost data and verify whether it is viable or not leaders are making statmnts that no funds for updation. IBA dodging disclosing cost data since last 10 years and UFBU did nothing to obtain data directly through Banks.

Though it is true how long we can go on saying proposal should go from IBA when UFBU is making no efforts to demand IBA to discuss updation issue. Without action rights are useless and meaningless.

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[Dilip Deshpande]

After the interview of Hon’ble Finance Minister respected Madam Nirmala Sitaramanji, some Retirees feel that UFBU Leaders now have to put efforts for Upgradation of Pension of already retired Staff. I feel that when we already Retired Staff are not paying any fees to any of the constituent of UFBU, why we should bother UFBU Leaders for doing this honorary job. When we were working and were paying fees to Unions/ Associations, they put efforts for getting Pension Scheme as well as Second  Pension option for us. Now we are retired and have stopped paying fees to Unions/ Association, so why we should bother them to take our issues after our retirement, without paying anything to them? UFBU Leaders have already tired due to the huge efforts put by them for last 3 years to get salary revision of working staff. Now, let UFBU take rest and they may ask the Retirees Leaders to do this job of upgradation of Pension of already retired staff. During last 3 years and previously also, Leaders of Retirees Association have taken plenty of rest and are therefore fresh and therefore Retirees’ Association Leaders may  not mind in taking this new responsibility.  If necessary, Pension updation may be delinked from BPS and either retirees’ representatives deliberate with IBA or separate Committee/ Commission exclusively for Pension Updation may be appointed by the Government with time limit of 3 months. I appeal to those retirees, who have put huge efforts of follow up as a result of which present action of Finance Minister can be seen, to follow up at appropriate level, for this purpose.

[Dilip Deshpande]

 

Payment of Pension to their retired employs is commitment of the Bank. Public Sector Banks will never run from their commitment. If Public Sector Banks deny Pension to their retirees, image of India may be spoiled all over world, which the Government will not allow under any circumstances.

Otherwise also if the Banks want to skip Pension Payment to their retired staff, they may do so without bothering whether right of the Pensioner to receive Pension is legal or not. Banks, if they desire so, may refuse this legal obligation and may ask Retirees to fight upto Supreme Court for 20 years or more, when almost all Retirees would have said good bye to this world.

Respected Mr. Prasad Sir, kindly stop thinking in this direction and apply your mind to find out something which may help retirees to get updation of Pension. This is my humble request.

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[pady nabs]

Don,t understnd why you are stil relying on ufbu.    There are sdveral retiree unions are there.     They have to show their magnamity at this juncture.     Ufbu has so far not in favour of Retirees updation.     Under the cicrumstances how you can expect they will help the retirees.

Padmanabhan s.

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[Dilip Deshpande]

Mr. Satyanarayan Rao, it is true that UFBU represented for Introduction of Pension Scheme in lieu of PF for Bank Staff. The Government approved Pension Scheme in lieu of PF for Bank Staff and you and me are getting Pension after our Retirement. At that time, we were working and we were paying fees to our respective Union/Association. Thus, for the efforts put by UFBU to get Pension in lieu of PF after our retirement, we paid good amount to UFBU. But, now we are retired and have stopped paying any fees to any of the constituents of UFBU. Then, why do you think that UFBU will act like KARNA and will put huge efforts for getting Updation for their non-members, non-feepayers, non-voters? For issues exclusively pertaining to already retired staff, like addition of 5 years service, 100% DA to pre-2002 Retirees, 1616-1684 DA, UFBU did nothing. Then why do you think that for updation issue, which is mostly pertaining to already retired staff, UFBU will put efforts? I am not blaming UFBU for not doing this gratuitous act, but UFBU may not play with feelings of their ex-members i.e. poor Retirees and should be honest enough to tell the concerned that UFBU is not interested in matters pertaining exclusively for already retired staff. UFBU may not pretend to settle the issues of already retired  staff, include the same in their COD and then throw these issues in dustbin. Incidentally, Second Pension Option was followed up by UFBU under huge pressure of their fee-paying voter members and benefit to already retired staff was by-product. I request you to kindly convey our honest feelings to your Boss in UFBU.

[LakshmanRao Kantamsetti]

In case the present system of unions vs IBA continues , 

Though we do not like as favourable outcome is not found

Let people like Satyanarayana Raoji 

And persons like dilipji

Pursue with IBA and unions 

Our approach certainly helps 

All the best . 

Have a good day 

KLRao 

Well wisher 

On Sat, Nov 7, 2020, 09:37 Dilip Deshpande <dilip...@gmail.com> wrote:

Mr. Satyanarayan Rao, it is true that UFBU represented for Introduction of Pension Scheme in lieu of PF for Bank Staff. The Government approved Pension Scheme in lieu of PF for Bank Staff and you and me are getting Pension after our Retirement. At that time, we were working and we were paying fees to our respective Union/Association. Thus, for the efforts put by UFBU to get Pension in lieu of PF after our retirement, we paid good amount to UFBU. But, now we are retired and have stopped paying any fees to any of the constituents of UFBU. Then, why do you think that UFBU will act like KARNA and will put huge efforts for getting Updation for their non-members, non-feepayers, non-voters? For issues exclusively pertaining to already retired staff, like addition of 5 years service, 100% DA to pre-2002 Retirees, 1616-1684 DA, UFBU did nothing. Then why do you think that for updation issue, which is mostly pertaining to already retired staff, UFBU will put efforts? I am not blaming UFBU for not doing this gratuitous act, but UFBU may not play with feelings of their ex-members i.e. poor Retirees and should be honest enough to tell the concerned that UFBU is not interested in matters pertaining exclusively for already retired staff. UFBU may not pretend to settle the issues of already retired  staff, include the same in their COD and then throw these issues in dustbin. Incidentally, Second Pension Option was followed up by UFBU under huge pressure of their fee-paying voter members and benefit to already retired staff was by-product. I request you to kindly convey our honest feelings to your Boss in UFBU.

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[Ramarao Velagapudi]

Sir,

The truth known to thousands of suffering bank pensioners due to collusion of IBA & UFBU is out.  None can support the decision of UFBU & IBA  to unilaterally and arbitrarily violate the 

pension rules and credo of justice given by Hon'ble Supreme Court NOT to create classification among pensioners and cause misery to bank officers by reducing the % for determination of their basic pension pay and to top it, impose a ceiling on basic pay determination drastically limiting their pension eligibility and blocking revision of pension for 30 years. what is the basis or even justification for it ?

Are these draconian, anti-pensioners measures occurring anywhere else among central, state govt. pensioners or army? are UFBU and IBA blind or autocratic or are  pensioners' demands for justice wrong?

UFBU must introspect, if they have conscience.

Rama Rao

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