Assistance with reading an old wedding record

[Dennis Munise]

Good afternoon!  Can someone with better eyes than me take a look at this record and please let me know the relevant information (people, places, ages)?  I cannot make out hardly anything on this.

I believe the groom is Manuel Machado and the bride Maria Rosa Cordeiro, married 20 JUL 1772, Relva.

Thank you!

http://culturacores.azores.gov.pt/biblioteca_digital/SMG-PD-RELVA-C-1762-1780/SMG-PD-RELVA-C-1762-1780_item1/index.html?page=76

[Cheri Mello]

Near the top, it says in the Ermida of Nossa Senhora da Saude. So the church in Arrifes wasn't considered a church yet, but a small ermida or chapel. That's where they married. It says that Saude belongs to the church in Relva. Then the priest blabs about himself and church stuff. Where the line is on the right margin, is where it starts with the groom and bride. Manuel Machado, son of Manuel Machado and Maria Cordeiro, she has died, he was baptized in the parish church of Sao Jose in the city of Ponta Delgada where he did his Lenten obligations; married with Maria Rosa Cordeiro daughter of Jose Almeida (or is that Oliveira?) and of Barbara Cordeiro and the bride was baptized in the same parish of Nossa Senhora das Neves where she did her Lenten obligations.

I can't tell if they were related or not. But you got the rest correct. In this time period, it doesn't give the ages.

Is this the mystery record you've been looking for?

Cheri Mello
Listowner, Azores-Gen
Researching: São Miguel island: Vila Franca, Ponta Garca, Ribeira Quente, Ribeira das Tainhas, Achada

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[JR]

They are being married in NS das Neves, Relva, not in Arrifes. They are announcing the bans which includes all three churches of Ponta Delgada and NS da Saude das Arrifes.

Relva casamentos, 1762-1780, page 73, 20-July-1772

Serem parentes em quatro grao de consanguindade
Manoel Machado filho de Manoel Machado and Maria Cordeira, ja defunta, baptizado Sao Joze de Ponta Delgada, com, Maria Cordeira, filha de Joze Moreira and Barbara Cordeira, baptizada NS das Neves, Relva.

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I often wonder why the church did not specify where the events actually took place when dealing with subsidiary churches. In Maia, for example, somewhere in the 1770's or so, the priest's started to make side margin notes indicating the couple were actually from and being married in the sufragen church of Santa Anna das Furnas, but the records were recorded and kept in Maia until about 1825.  I suspect, though not stated in the records, this is what actually happened in most sufragen churches unless they very close by. Same with Agua Retorta and Faial da Terra; Agua de Alto and Sao Pedro de Vila Franca, etc. Perhaps someone on the list knows what the actual custom was.

JR

[Cheri Mello]

John said (in Portuguese) that he saw the consanguinity stated. It said 4th degree. Therefore, the bride and groom are 3rd cousins. They share a common 2-great-grandparents. You'll have to figure out which line the 2-greats appear.

Cheri Mello
Listowner, Azores-Gen
Researching: São Miguel island: Vila Franca, Ponta Garca, Ribeira Quente, Ribeira das Tainhas, Achada

To view this discussion on the web visit https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/azores/8fe9fa22-992e-42ef-b60c-938438280accn%40googlegroups.com.

[Dennis Munise]

Cheri and JR, thank you!

Cheri this isn't the mystery record, it's someone who I already had in my tree.  I'm still searching on that front!

Thanks again!