Why is there Evil in the presence of an almighty good God???

[Smoley]

If God is good, and God is omnipotent, then why doesn't He stop evil?

Because, for a short time, God has allowed the Word to be broken.

Have you heard of the Word?

John 1:1  ¶In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God.

2  The same was in the beginning with God.

3  All things were made by him; and without him was not any thing made that was made.

4  In him was life; and the life was the light of men.....

14  And the Word was made flesh, and dwelt among us, (and we beheld his glory, the glory as of the only begotten of the Father,) full of grace and truth.

God turned His back on the Word and allowed Him to be broken.

Matthew 27:45  Now from the sixth hour there was darkness over all the land unto the ninth hour.

46  And about the ninth hour Jesus cried with a loud voice, saying, Eli, Eli, lama sabachthani? that is to say, My God, my God, why hast thou forsaken me?

Evil exists because God made His Word to be weakness.

Evil exists because God has forsaken His Word for a short while.

God says, "Thou shalt not kill", but His Word was given in weakness.

When the Word was given to instruct the Body, it was given in weakness. DNA was not given in the strength of God, but rather the weakness. DNA can be corrupted.

Just as God's Word can be corrupted.

To Adam and Eve in the garden it was given in weakness. The serpent was able to overcome the Word easily in the garden.

But the serpent didn't understand 1Corinthians 1 either...

1 Corinthians 1:25  Because the foolishness of God is wiser than men; and the weakness of God is stronger than men.

26  For ye see your calling, brethren, how that not many wise men after the flesh, not many mighty, not many noble, are called:

27  But God hath chosen the foolish things of the world to confound the wise; and God hath chosen the weak things of the world to confound the things which are mighty;

28  And base things of the world, and things which are despised, hath God chosen, yea, and things which are not, to bring to nought things that are:

29  That no flesh should glory in his presence.

God had chosen weakness, rather than strength. He had given His Word in weakness for one reason.

1 Corinthians 1:17  ¶For Christ sent me not to baptize, but to preach the gospel: not with wisdom of words, lest the cross of Christ should be made of none effect.

NOT with wisdom of WORDS. Not in the 'strength' of the Word, but in the weakness of the Word, so that the CROSS should be lifted up.

Because it is at the Cross where we learn everything we need to know about Good and Evil.

It is at the Cross that we learn that the Word is good and right. It is at the Cross where we learn that the breaking of that WORD is evil.  It is at the Cross where we learn the cure for Evil.

It is by the death of this body of corruption, death to our own cancerous ways, and faith in God to magnify His Word in our hearts that we might live a "cancer" free life in Heaven.

God has allowed His Word to be broken. God has allowed His Word to be weak. But He is a just God, and a holy God, and He can not allow this to go on indefinitely.

Acts 17:30  And the times of this ignorance God winked at; but now commandeth all men every where to repent:

31  Because he hath appointed a day, in the which he will judge the world in righteousness by that man whom he hath ordained; whereof he hath given assurance unto all men, in that he hath raised him from the dead.

Yes, His WORD was dead on the Cross. Yes, God winked (closed His eyes for a moment) so that it could happen, but He has given us assurance that He WILL raise that Word from the dead.

Will you be ready for the day when the WORD rules in all the strength of God?  Will you be ready to bow your knee to that Word?  

The day is coming.

Romans 14:11  For it is written, As I live, saith (The Word), every knee shall bow to me, and every tongue shall confess to God.

12  So then every one of us shall give account of himself to God.

The Word will no more be mocked and abused, but the Word will establish righteousness with all power and authority, and NO evil will stand in His presence.

[e_space]

On Wednesday, April 2, 2014 9:28:16 AM UTC-4, Smoley wrote:

If God is good, and God is omnipotent, then why doesn't He stop evil?

why should HE stop something HE started? if GOD didn't want evil to exist, why did HE create it? 

 

Because, for a short time, God has allowed the Word to be broken.

Have you heard of the Word?

when reading your posts, we have heard very little else ... tired old rhetoric written by men .... 

[Smoley]

On Wednesday, April 2, 2014 10:32:59 AM UTC-4, e_space wrote:

On Wednesday, April 2, 2014 9:28:16 AM UTC-4, Smoley wrote:

If God is good, and God is omnipotent, then why doesn't He stop evil?

why should HE stop something HE started? if GOD didn't want evil to exist, why did HE create it? 

Evil is not a creation of God.  How can one create evil?

Evil is an action of choice.

God could have kept evil from happening by giving His Word in strength. 

God could have given the power of His might to the Word of DNA, but He chose to give the Word of DNA weakness.

Because DNA was given in "weakness" it can be corrupted.  And we all know that the corruption of the Word brings "evil".

Do you know what it means to be "double minded"?

The double minded man is unstable in all of his ways, because the double minded man blames God for not enforcing the righteousness of His Word while blaming God for trying to enforce the righteousness of His Word.

If God was to enforce the Word of righteousness in strength, then all cancer would be destroyed.  We live in period of grace when the Word is still shown in weakness. Soon the Word will be magnified in all its strength, and you need to be ready. 

You need to embrace it while you can, because those who reject it will not stand in His presence. 

[e_space]

On Wednesday, April 2, 2014 11:13:20 AM UTC-4, Smoley wrote:

On Wednesday, April 2, 2014 10:32:59 AM UTC-4, e_space wrote:

On Wednesday, April 2, 2014 9:28:16 AM UTC-4, Smoley wrote:

If God is good, and God is omnipotent, then why doesn't He stop evil?

why should HE stop something HE started? if GOD didn't want evil to exist, why did HE create it? 

Evil is not a creation of God.  How can one create evil?

GOD created everything ... remember?

 

Evil is an action of choice.

GOD gave us choice ... remember?

 

God could have kept evil from happening by giving His Word in strength. 

yawnzzzzzzzzz ... SO much BS

[bobo42813]

Hi,Ya.  God created the evil one. The evil one ushered in evil. It's called free willy. How da you likes dat answerererer.
Booby

[e_space]

On Wednesday, April 2, 2014 1:39:23 PM UTC-4, bobo42813 wrote:

Hi,Ya.  God created the evil one. The evil one ushered in evil. It's called free willy. How da you likes dat answerererer.

about as much as any other of your illiterate posts ... ;-^)

[Loopflanger]

On Wednesday, April 2, 2014 6:28:16 AM UTC-7, Smoley wrote:

If God is good, and God is omnipotent, then why doesn't He stop evil?

Because he doesn't exist.

 

[Loopflanger]

On Wednesday, April 2, 2014 8:13:20 AM UTC-7, Smoley wrote:

Evil is not a creation of God.

If you say god created all things, then god also created evil. If that's a problem, then don't believe in god. That should eliminate your stressing about it. 

[Dingbat]

On Wednesday, April 2, 2014 9:28:16 AM UTC-4, Smoley wrote:

If God is good, and God is omnipotent, then why doesn't He stop evil?

Does God merely ALLOW evil deeds or does God also ORDER/ CAUSE evil deeds? In Exodus 34, does God ALLOW baby donkeys' necks to be broken or does God ASK FOR baby donkey's necks to be broken?

[Smoley]

On Thursday, April 3, 2014 2:52:27 AM UTC-4, Dingbat wrote:

On Wednesday, April 2, 2014 9:28:16 AM UTC-4, Smoley wrote:

If God is good, and God is omnipotent, then why doesn't He stop evil?

Does God merely ALLOW evil deeds or does God also ORDER/ CAUSE evil deeds? In Exodus 34, does God ALLOW baby donkeys' necks to be broken or does God ASK FOR baby donkey's necks to be broken?

He asked for the lamb to be slain so the donkey could go free.  If the lamb was not slain then the donkey must be slain.

The lamb being a type of the Word.  We know this because Jesus Christ is compared to both. He was the Word, and He was the Lamb.

The only way that the "Ass" could be set free is by slaying the Word that was "contrary" to the "Ass".

If the Word had not been forsaken, as Jesus Christ was, then no "Ass" would live.

Because, the Word/Law/Righteousness can not allow for cancer to kill and destroy. Only by forsaking the Law of righteousness(for a short time) could God allow sin to "live".

The Word does not make exceptions for allowing Sin/cancer/rebellion. It can't. Cancer is bad and must be destroyed.  But for a short while, the Word was "forsaken" by God so that you and I might obtain mercy and live long enough to see the error of our ways and repent.

From this picture we can see several things:

1) Killing the Lamb was wrong, but it had to be done. The lamb was the Word of God. The Word of God does not allow cancer(this is good), but we are cancerous(this is bad). Instead of destroying Us, God destroyed His own Word. God became "sin" for us when God broke His own Word by destroying the Lamb on the Cross.

2) If the Word that was "contrary" to the "Ass" was not removed, then the "Ass" would have been destroyed by the Word.  The Word says "Thou shalt love thy neighbor as thyself". If you can not love your neighbor as yourself, then you are to be destroyed. 

3) When God forsook His own Word, evil dominated the world.  The Word was no longer in charge of right and wrong. There was no more, "Thou Shalt not kill, Thou shalt not steal, Thou shalt love thy neighbor."

The result of God forsaking the Word inevitably led to the shedding of innocent blood.  

Why did He forsake His own Word?  Because He knew that we were going to forsake His Word. This is what the story of Adam and Eve is all about. Eve forsook the Word. Eve was going to be kicked out of the garden because the corruption of cancer could not be allowed in a perfect garden, So Adam, instead of staying in the garden alone, forsook the Word also and joined Eve.

But God can not stay with Eve in the cancer of rebellion indefinitely. Eventually, Eve needs to see the error of her ways and magnify the Word instead of forsaking it.

Colossians 2:13  ¶And you, being dead in your sins and the uncircumcision of your flesh, hath he quickened together with him, having forgiven you all trespasses;

14  Blotting out the handwriting of ordinances that was against us, which was contrary to us, and took it out of the way, nailing it to his cross;

1 Corinthians 1:18  For the preaching of the cross is to them that perish foolishness; but unto us which are saved it is the power of God.

1 Corinthians 2:14  But the natural man receiveth not the things of the Spirit of God: for they are foolishness unto him: neither can he know them, because they are spiritually discerned.

[Dingbat]

On Thursday, April 3, 2014 8:35:27 AM UTC-4, Smoley wrote:

On Thursday, April 3, 2014 2:52:27 AM UTC-4, Dingbat wrote:

On Wednesday, April 2, 2014 9:28:16 AM UTC-4, Smoley wrote:

If God is good, and God is omnipotent, then why doesn't He stop evil?

Does God merely ALLOW evil deeds or does God also ORDER/ CAUSE evil deeds? In Exodus 34, does God ALLOW baby donkeys' necks to be broken or does God ASK FOR baby donkey's necks to be broken?

He asked for the lamb to be slain so the donkey could go free.  If the lamb was not slain then the donkey must be slain.

Whether a lamb or donkey, some animal gets killed, for no good reason.
 

The lamb being a type of the Word.  We know this because Jesus Christ is compared to both. He was the Word, and He was the Lamb.

The only way that the "Ass" could be set free is by slaying the Word that was "contrary" to the "Ass".

Unless God is limited in his ability, there is another way for the donkey to be free - by God not demanding its life.
 

If the Word had not been forsaken, as Jesus Christ was, then no "Ass" would live.

Because, the Word/Law/Righteousness can not allow for cancer to kill and destroy. Only by forsaking the Law of righteousness(for a short time) could God allow sin to "live".

Breaking a baby donkey's neck or killing a lamb in its place has nothing to do with rigteousness or sin. The donkey's neck is broken so God can claim that he owns it. Alternatively, a lamb is killed in the place in order to buy the donkey from God. Why does God need to own donkeys or sell donkeys and why does he demand payment in blood?

[Smoley]

On Thursday, April 3, 2014 8:47:03 AM UTC-4, Dingbat wrote:

On Thursday, April 3, 2014 8:35:27 AM UTC-4, Smoley wrote:

On Thursday, April 3, 2014 2:52:27 AM UTC-4, Dingbat wrote:

On Wednesday, April 2, 2014 9:28:16 AM UTC-4, Smoley wrote:

If God is good, and God is omnipotent, then why doesn't He stop evil?

Does God merely ALLOW evil deeds or does God also ORDER/ CAUSE evil deeds? In Exodus 34, does God ALLOW baby donkeys' necks to be broken or does God ASK FOR baby donkey's necks to be broken?

He asked for the lamb to be slain so the donkey could go free.  If the lamb was not slain then the donkey must be slain.

Whether a lamb or donkey, some animal gets killed, for no good reason.

That's what happens when there is no law, when there is no right or wrong.  Are you saying that the Word, "Thou Shalt not Kill" should have been upheld?

That's good, because when the Word reigns supreme, you will be the first to bow your knee to it.  You have learned the difference between "Good and Evil" and you now understand that the Word is Good.

 

The lamb being a type of the Word.  We know this because Jesus Christ is compared to both. He was the Word, and He was the Lamb.

The only way that the "Ass" could be set free is by slaying the Word that was "contrary" to the "Ass".

Unless God is limited in his ability, there is another way for the donkey to be free - by God not demanding its life.

God humbled Himself. When this happened, it limited His ability.  He had the ability to prevent murders, but He took the backseat for little bit.  Waiting on you to bow the knee to His Word, so you can be put back into the perfect garden. 

 

If the Word had not been forsaken, as Jesus Christ was, then no "Ass" would live.

Because, the Word/Law/Righteousness can not allow for cancer to kill and destroy. Only by forsaking the Law of righteousness(for a short time) could God allow sin to "live".

Breaking a baby donkey's neck or killing a lamb in its place has nothing to do with rigteousness or sin. The donkey's neck is broken so God can claim that he owns it. Alternatively, a lamb is killed in the place in order to buy the donkey from God. Why does God need to own donkeys or sell donkeys and why does he demand payment in blood?

You say breaking the baby donkey's neck and killing a lamb has nothing to do with sin?  Then what is the problem?

God already owns the donkey. He already owns the lamb. His word created them. Without His word, they would not live.  DNA is necessary for life.  He gave them life when He gave them the Word.

He killed the Word, and they lost their life.  This isn't rocket science.

[Steve in Virginia]

You're right it's not rocket science - it's an ugly, inhumane, misogynist, violent, superstition that sees humankind as some kind of indelible stain on the universe.  Frankly, anyone who believes this vile, lunacy needs serious psychiatric counseling and probably long-term medication.   One of the things that eventually allowed me to break with Christianity, aside from its obsessive-compulsive fixation with death and suffering, is the endless recurring theme of blood-sacrifice and the need to constantly propitiate this vengeful, jealous, vindictive, murdering psychotic entity or face eternal damnation.

Frankly, I've never understood how the religious can in one breath go on and on about how they "love" their fellow man and in another breath pronounce that every non-believers has a one-way, first-class ticket on the hell-bound train.  The they do it with the same infantile glee usually reserved for a 4-year old who has managed to successfully snatch a handful of M&M's from the candy jar and secretly wolfed them down without mommy knowing it, just before dinner. 

Truthfully, I'd have more respect for the religious if they just said, "You non-believers can all go fuck yourselves.  We're right and you're all gonna die horrible and burn in hell forever.  God loves only the people who believe the way we do and if you're not with us you're against us.  Period.  It's just too damn bad we can't drag your, atheist, agnostic, humanist, logical, rational, bible-criticizing, scientific method, materialist, questioning asses out into the public square and burn you alive like we could in the good old days."  At least the religious would be honest about who they are and they wouldn't have to constantly pretend sufferance towards people they either openly revile or secretly despise but are forced by dogma, social convention or law to cloak their passive-aggression behind a mask of piety and false tolerance.

Steve

[thea]

On Wednesday, April 2, 2014 8:28:16 AM UTC-5, Smoley wrote:

If God is good, and God is omnipotent, then why doesn't He stop evil?

Haven't you heard how Adam sold his inheritance to Satan in the Garden of Eden when he ate what
God had specifically told him personally not to eat.

Therefore, since he sold his inheritance, the only way God can work in this world of ours,
is when we are saying *Thank You*, because "God lives in the praises of His People."

Interesting how everything is so mixed up that we cannot discern the Truth, because Satan
is determined that we worship him instead of obeying what God said -- *Thou shalt have
no other god before me.* 

thea

 

[Smoley]

On Thursday, April 3, 2014 11:15:03 AM UTC-4, Steve in Virginia wrote:

You're right it's not rocket science - it's an ugly, inhumane, misogynist, violent, superstition that sees humankind as some kind of indelible stain on the universe.  Frankly, anyone who believes this vile, lunacy needs serious psychiatric counseling and probably long-term medication.   One of the things that eventually allowed me to break with Christianity, aside from its obsessive-compulsive fixation with death and suffering, is the endless recurring theme of blood-sacrifice and the need to constantly propitiate this vengeful, jealous, vindictive, murdering psychotic entity or face eternal damnation.

First of all, when the Word is ignored this is what happens. Ugly things happen.

The Word is good, but the Word was broken. ALL violence comes by the breaking of the Word. Jesus Christ paints a very clear picture of what happens when the Word is broken. This is why the Bible clearly relates the Word with Jesus Christ. This is why the Bible clearly shows us that God "forsook the Word" on the cross.  

This ugly picture had to be painted. Otherwise you and I would not be so "appalled" at the breaking of the Word.  

Even your comments above show that you support "no blood shed, no murder, love thy neighbor".  Well that Word was broken by man when they broke the Word of God on the cross. Bloodshed, murder, and hatred.

You want the Word magnified, but you "hate" God and want Him dead. Well, it's not a one way street. God wants to reconcile the World unto Himself. But this can only happen if the world agrees that the Word should be exalted, and our ways should be given up.

 

Frankly, I've never understood how the religious can in one breath go on and on about how they "love" their fellow man and in another breath pronounce that every non-believers has a one-way, first-class ticket on the hell-bound train.  The they do it with the same infantile glee usually reserved for a 4-year old who has managed to successfully snatch a handful of M&M's from the candy jar and secretly wolfed them down without mommy knowing it, just before dinner. 

They aren't getting that "glee" from the Word. God isn't willing that any should perish, but you shouldn't tempt God. If God says that evil and bloodshed, murder, cancer, and every other "breaker of the Word" is not allowed in Heaven, then don't test that. He will not allow it, no more than a doctor will allow cancer into a healthy body.  This type of thing will end on this earth.

Next we will all go to one of two places. Either we will go to a place that has no Word. There there will be no right and wrong. There will be no instructions to follow. You can be as cancerous as you want to be, OR you will go to a place where "love your neighbor as yourself" is the requirement and the Word rules supreme.

If you don't think you can abide the Word. If you aren't able, don't worry about it. God is making us "new creatures" that are able to.

 

Truthfully, I'd have more respect for the religious if they just said, "You non-believers can all go fuck yourselves.  We're right and you're all gonna die horrible and burn in hell forever.  God loves only the people who believe the way we do and if you're not with us you're against us.  Period.  It's just too damn bad we can't drag your, atheist, agnostic, humanist, logical, rational, bible-criticizing, scientific method, materialist, questioning asses out into the public square and burn you alive like we could in the good old days."  At least the religious would be honest about who they are and they wouldn't have to constantly pretend sufferance towards people they either openly revile or secretly despise but are forced by dogma, social convention or law to cloak their passive-aggression behind a mask of piety and false tolerance.

The religious have never been very close to the Word. You do know that it was the religious that killed Christ, right? So in one respect you are right on target.

But it is the Word that is truth, not religious people.  Let me share an analogy with you and let me know if you can see why God is so "picky" about "forcing" His dogma on you:

The Word: 

The body is the body of Christ. We are the members. Christ is the Head. 

Atheist: 

We don't believe the Word. We won't follow its instructions 


The body is given life by the Word of DNA. Without the Word, the Body is nothing but a bunch of lifeless matter.   
The Word instructs the body in the ways of righteousness. Each member of the body follows the instructions. The heart serves the body. The brain serves the body. Each member serving each other. 

The cells of the body are following the Word. Some build a heart. Some build a brain. Some build armpits. 

The cells decide one day that they are going to rebel. Why should they continue following the Word?  They start serving their own lusts. They just want to be left alone to do their own thing. No more serving others. 

The head "sees" what is going on and notices that part of the body is "sick". The Head instructs the cells to humble themselves before the Word and follow the instructions. The cells refuse. The cells become angry at the head. Why should we do what you say? They foolishly accuse the Head of seeking some glory from them. Maybe the head just wants to magnify Himself, they say. Well that's too bad, because we are going to magnify ourselves! We are going to be like the Head! 

They gather a crowd with them. They join hands with the cells around them and their movement becomes stronger and stronger. Very few cells are left serving the Body. They look at the head and they see signs of weakness. They begin to become bold in their rebellion. The Head is nearly DEAD, they shout. And they watch as the Head dies off... on the Cross. 

Atheism has finally won...  

[Smoley]

On Thursday, April 3, 2014 11:56:51 AM UTC-4, thea wrote:

On Wednesday, April 2, 2014 8:28:16 AM UTC-5, Smoley wrote:

If God is good, and God is omnipotent, then why doesn't He stop evil?

Haven't you heard how Adam sold his inheritance to Satan in the Garden of Eden when he ate what
God had specifically told him personally not to eat.

Where is this in the Word? God allowed Satan to overcome His Word and bring evil into the World, but other than that, Satan has no inheritance except the rebellious cancerous chaos that he lives by.

Adam is a type of Jesus Christ allowing Himself to "become" sin for us, in hopes that we might "become" the righteousness of God.

Adam and Eve gained a knowledge of Good and Evil by eating of the tree. God "weakened" His Word so that they would be able to "break" His Word, so that they could learn about evil without being destroyed by the Word.

 

Therefore, since he sold his inheritance, the only way God can work in this world of ours,
is when we are saying *Thank You*, because "God lives in the praises of His People."

But nobody wants to praise a God that allowed Satan into the Garden unless they understand "Why". 

 

Interesting how everything is so mixed up that we cannot discern the Truth, because Satan
is determined that we worship him instead of obeying what God said -- *Thou shalt have
no other god before me.* 

 

We should always worship what is right.  The Word is right!

[Dingbat]

On Thursday, April 3, 2014 9:12:57 AM UTC-4, Smoley wrote:

On Thursday, April 3, 2014 8:47:03 AM UTC-4, Dingbat wrote:

On Thursday, April 3, 2014 8:35:27 AM UTC-4, Smoley wrote:

On Thursday, April 3, 2014 2:52:27 AM UTC-4, Dingbat wrote:

On Wednesday, April 2, 2014 9:28:16 AM UTC-4, Smoley wrote:

If God is good, and God is omnipotent, then why doesn't He stop evil?

Does God merely ALLOW evil deeds or does God also ORDER/ CAUSE evil deeds? In Exodus 34, does God ALLOW baby donkeys' necks to be broken or does God ASK FOR baby donkey's necks to be broken?

He asked for the lamb to be slain so the donkey could go free.  If the lamb was not slain then the donkey must be slain.

Whether a lamb or donkey, some animal gets killed, for no good reason.

That's what happens when there is no law, when there is no right or wrong.

If God is under no law, then what makes him good?
 

 Are you saying that the Word, "Thou Shalt not Kill" should have been upheld?

That's good, because when the Word reigns supreme, you will be the first to bow your knee to it.  You have learned the difference between "Good and Evil" and you now understand that the Word is Good.

How do you determine whether the Word is good, evil, both or neither?

The lamb being a type of the Word.  We know this because Jesus Christ is compared to both. He was the Word, and He was the Lamb.

The only way that the "Ass" could be set free is by slaying the Word that was "contrary" to the "Ass".

Unless God is limited in his ability, there is another way for the donkey to be free - by God not demanding its life.

God humbled Himself. When this happened, it limited His ability.  He had the ability to prevent murders, but He took the backseat for little bit.  Waiting on you to bow the knee to His Word, so you can be put back into the perfect garden. 

 

If the Word had not been forsaken, as Jesus Christ was, then no "Ass" would live.

Because, the Word/Law/Righteousness can not allow for cancer to kill and destroy. Only by forsaking the Law of righteousness(for a short time) could God allow sin to "live".

Breaking a baby donkey's neck or killing a lamb in its place has nothing to do with rigteousness or sin. The donkey's neck is broken so God can claim that he owns it. Alternatively, a lamb is killed in the place in order to buy the donkey from God. Why does God need to own donkeys or sell donkeys and why does he demand payment in blood?

You say breaking the baby donkey's neck and killing a lamb has nothing to do with sin?  Then what is the problem?

Evil is the problem under discussion.
 

God already owns the donkey.

If God does evil to creatures he owns, then God causes evil, doesn't he? That law applies only to first born donkeys. Who owns second born donkeys?
 

He already owns the lamb. His word created them. Without His word, they would not live.  DNA is necessary for life.  He gave them life when He gave them the Word.

He killed the Word, and they lost their life.  This isn't rocket science.

 
Is "God causes/ does evil" rocket science?

[Smoley]

On Thursday, April 3, 2014 1:09:13 PM UTC-4, Dingbat wrote:

On Thursday, April 3, 2014 9:12:57 AM UTC-4, Smoley wrote:

On Thursday, April 3, 2014 8:47:03 AM UTC-4, Dingbat wrote:

On Thursday, April 3, 2014 8:35:27 AM UTC-4, Smoley wrote:

On Thursday, April 3, 2014 2:52:27 AM UTC-4, Dingbat wrote:

On Wednesday, April 2, 2014 9:28:16 AM UTC-4, Smoley wrote:

If God is good, and God is omnipotent, then why doesn't He stop evil?

Does God merely ALLOW evil deeds or does God also ORDER/ CAUSE evil deeds? In Exodus 34, does God ALLOW baby donkeys' necks to be broken or does God ASK FOR baby donkey's necks to be broken?

He asked for the lamb to be slain so the donkey could go free.  If the lamb was not slain then the donkey must be slain.

Whether a lamb or donkey, some animal gets killed, for no good reason.

That's what happens when there is no law, when there is no right or wrong.

If God is under no law, then what makes him good?

Galatians 5:14  For all the law is fulfilled in one word, even in this; Thou shalt love thy neighbour as thyself.

15  But if ye bite and devour one another, take heed that ye be not consumed one of another.

Is it good for God to enforce this law(Word) in heaven or not?

Everyone is complaining about how bad things on earth are. There is famine and sickness and murder and rape and evil.

Would ANY of those things exist if the Word of Galatians 5:14 was highly exalted so that ALL things were brought into subjection to it?

You don't like God when He KILLS things, do you?  What about when people kill things?. What about bacteria not loving their neighbor as themselves?. Or cancer cells?

You are CONDEMNING God for not making His creation obey the Word?  Don't you think that's a little bit hypocritical?  You want God to enforce the rules with power?

You want God to give you water and food, but you yourself aren't going to give anyone else food or water. You want God to care more about you, than He does Himself, but you don't want God telling YOU to do that, do you?

This life has nothing to do with God's goodness or badness, because it is all about the Word.  Haven't you read the Bible?  Didn't you see where Jesus Christ is the Word? The Word was made lower than God, but in the end The Word was exalted above EVERY name! 

 

 Are you saying that the Word, "Thou Shalt not Kill" should have been upheld?

That's good, because when the Word reigns supreme, you will be the first to bow your knee to it.  You have learned the difference between "Good and Evil" and you now understand that the Word is Good.

How do you determine whether the Word is good, evil, both or neither?

By your own mouth you have declared the killing of animals to be "evil". How did you determine that?   Is the Word that says, "Thou shalt not kill." good or bad?

The lamb being a type of the Word.  We know this because Jesus Christ is compared to both. He was the Word, and He was the Lamb.

The only way that the "Ass" could be set free is by slaying the Word that was "contrary" to the "Ass".

Unless God is limited in his ability, there is another way for the donkey to be free - by God not demanding its life.

God humbled Himself. When this happened, it limited His ability.  He had the ability to prevent murders, but He took the backseat for little bit.  Waiting on you to bow the knee to His Word, so you can be put back into the perfect garden. 

 

If the Word had not been forsaken, as Jesus Christ was, then no "Ass" would live.

Because, the Word/Law/Righteousness can not allow for cancer to kill and destroy. Only by forsaking the Law of righteousness(for a short time) could God allow sin to "live".

Breaking a baby donkey's neck or killing a lamb in its place has nothing to do with rigteousness or sin. The donkey's neck is broken so God can claim that he owns it. Alternatively, a lamb is killed in the place in order to buy the donkey from God. Why does God need to own donkeys or sell donkeys and why does he demand payment in blood?

You say breaking the baby donkey's neck and killing a lamb has nothing to do with sin?  Then what is the problem?

Evil is the problem under discussion.

Sin is the breaking of the Word. The Word says, "Thou shalt not kill".  Killing is a sin and it is evil.

 

 

God already owns the donkey.

If God does evil to creatures he owns, then God causes evil, doesn't he? That law applies only to first born donkeys. Who owns second born donkeys?

Then you are beginning to see why God should never turn His back on "Thou shalt not kill", right?  I'm not sure if you are getting this. It is highly important that the world understand that they do NOT WANT God turning His back on His Word.  It doesn't help anybody to trod the Word under our feet, does it?  It isn't good for God and it isn't good for us.

You keep trying to pin some evil on God, but God took it upon Himself already. He turned His back on the Word and took sin upon Himself, why?  Because you needed to see what sin really looks like. You needed to understand that you reap what you sow.  If you disregard the law, then God will disregard the Law.

God leveled the playing field here, and not because He hates you, but because you needed to get a good look at evil. You needed to gain the knowledge of Good and Evil. 

And with that knowledge you should humble yourself before the Word. You should glorify the Word and be thankful that God will soon exalt that Word even above Himself, so that all things will be in subjection to the Word. This is the conclusion of the matter. 

 

He already owns the lamb. His word created them. Without His word, they would not live.  DNA is necessary for life.  He gave them life when He gave them the Word.

He killed the Word, and they lost their life.  This isn't rocket science.

 
Is "God causes/ does evil" rocket science?

Then you should join God in exalting the Word. You should reconcile yourself with the Creator and humble yourself before the Word.  This is the only Way that ANYONE can enter into Heaven's glory.

God isn't holding evil against anybody. That isn't why we go to the lake of fire. We go because we refuse to humble ourselves and become obedient to the Word.

Jesus Christ(The Word made flesh) is the only way to heaven.

John 14:6  Jesus saith unto him, I am the way, the truth, and the life: no man cometh unto the Father, but by me.

 

[Steve in Virginia]

Yes, Thea;

I've heard that fairy tale and so, so many others. All the usual logical and rational inconsistencies remain and never resolve themselves no matter how many times the same old myths are repeated.  We won't even go into why an omnipotent-omniscient deity needs to be endlessly praised, or that in the 2nd decade of the 21st century there are true believers trying to frighten us with a cartoon demon in red footy-pajamas. a tail and a Van Dyke beard. I think it's time we bury our superstitions and grow up.

Steve

On Thursday, April 3, 2014 11:56:51 AM UTC-4, thea wrote:

[lawrey]

                   thea,

                           We all know by now that you are all mixed up and can't discern the truth. That is because you deal in lies. try dumping the god-thing, you'll soon find the truth.

[e_space]

feel better? ;-^) 

On Thursday, April 3, 2014 11:15:03 AM UTC-4, Steve in Virginia wrote:

[Observer]

On Wednesday, April 2, 2014 6:28:16 AM UTC-7, Smoley wrote:

If God is good, and God is omnipotent, then why doesn't He stop evil?

Observer

No God, though good, though evil, as they are all simply labels given to conditions and objects that humans, and their, near infinite, ignorance, used to describe what they like, don't like or what their they are afraid of (think might be harmful or beneficial)

Smoley wrote:

Because, for a short time, God has allowed the Word to be broken.

Observer

You , nor any man or woman, has ever established hat this idiotic concept of a God thing , believed in only by Christian ideologues, ever existed, rendering the above statement meaningless.

Smoley wrote:

Have you heard of the Word?

Observer

I have a very large lexicon, consequently I know and have heard of many words.

<sniped idiotic biblical bullshit> 

Smoley wrote:

God turned His back on the Word and allowed Him to be broken.

Observer

You , nor any man or woman, has ever established hat this idiotic concept of a God thing , believed in only by Christian ideologues, ever existed, rendering the above statement meaningless.

<sniped idiotic biblical bullshit> 

Smoley wrote:

Evil exists because God made His Word to be weakness.

Evil exists, only as a label, given by man what he fears may be harmful

Observer

You , nor any man or woman, has ever established hat this idiotic concept of a God thing , believed in only by Christian ideologues, ever existed, rendering the above statement meaningless.

Smoley wrote:

Evil exists because God has forsaken His Word for a short while.

 Observer

You , nor any man or woman, has ever established hat this idiotic concept of a God thing , believed in only by Christian ideologues, ever existed, rendering the above statement meaningless.

Smoley wrote:

God says, "Thou shalt not kill", but His Word was given in weakness.

When the Word was given to instruct the Body, it was given in weakness. DNA was not given in the strength of God, but rather the weakness. DNA can be corrupted.

Just as God's Word can be corrupted.

You , nor any man or woman, has ever established hat this idiotic concept of a God thing , believed in only by Christian ideologues, ever existed, rendering the above statement meaningless.

To Adam and Eve in the garden it was given in weakness. The serpent was able to overcome the Word easily in the garden.

But the serpent didn't understand 1Corinthians 1 either...

<sniped idiotic biblical bulldhit> 

God had chosen weakness, rather than strength. He had given His Word in weakness for one reason.

You , nor any man or woman, has ever established hat this idiotic concept of a God thing , believed in only by Christian ideologues, ever existed, rendering the above statement meaningless.

<sniped idiotic biblical bullshit> 

NOT with wisdom of WORDS. Not in the 'strength' of the Word, but in the weakness of the Word, so that the CROSS should be lifted up.

Because it is at the Cross where we learn everything we need to know about Good and Evil.

It is at the Cross that we learn that the Word is good and right. It is at the Cross where we learn that the breaking of that WORD is evil.  It is at the Cross where we learn the cure for Evil.

It is by the death of this body of corruption, death to our own cancerous ways, and faith in God to magnify His Word in our hearts that we might live a "cancer" free life in Heaven.

God has allowed His Word to be broken. God has allowed His Word to be weak. But He is a just God, and a holy God, and He can not allow this to go on indefinitely.

<sniped idiotic biblical bulldhit> 

Yes, His WORD was dead on the Cross. Yes, God winked (closed His eyes for a moment) so that it could happen, but He has given us assurance that He WILL raise that Word from the dead.

Will you be ready for the day when the WORD rules in all the strength of God?  Will you be ready to bow your knee to that Word?  

The day is coming.

Observer

You , nor any man or woman, has ever established hat this idiotic concept of a God thing , believed in only by Christian ideologues, ever existed, rendering the above statement meaningless.

<sniped idiotic biblical bullshit> 

The Word will no more be mocked and abused, but the Word will establish righteousness with all power and authority, and NO evil will stand in His presence.

Observer

You , nor any man or woman, has ever established hat this idiotic concept  of a God thing , believed in only by Christian ideologues, ever existed, rendering the above statement meaningless.

As I mentioned before you have a very severely malfunctioning mind, and are much in need of professional mental health care by qualified practitioners.

Psychonomist

[Rupert]

On Wednesday, April 2, 2014 3:28:16 PM UTC+2, Smoley wrote:

If God is good, and God is omnipotent, then why doesn't He stop evil?

Because, for a short time, God has allowed the Word to be broken.

So why would that be?

Countless trillions of animals have suffered excruciating torment throughout many hundreds of millions of years of evolutionary history. It's not such a "short time" really. It's been going on quite a while.

[Smoley]

You're going to be dead in less than 50 years, so what does it matter if we're cavemen or rocket scientists? Do you actually think there is any meaning in life?

If not, then lighten up don't worry about how stupid Christians are. We're all headed for nothingness, right? 

Everything you are fighting for is WORTHLESS. You are wasting your time. You would be just as well off robbing a bank somewhere and living off the cash on some tropical island. Why don't you do that instead of sit in front of your computer complaining? There is no right and wrong. 

You are complaining that Christians are doing something wrong?  I don't think so. We're all just doing.  Everything is meaningless.

Go rob a bank, you will feel better.

Survival of the fittest, man.

On Thursday, April 3, 2014 9:10:33 PM UTC-4, Steve in Virginia wrote:

Actually....no.  I find it extremely disturbing that after nearly two centuries of leading the world in scientific and technical innovation we are allowing cranks, luddites and intellectual snake-oil salesmen virtually unfettered license to roll the scientific-intellectual clock back to the era of the Inquisition 

Think that's not something to keep you up at night?  Think about it. From 800 to 1100 AD Baghdad was the scientific and intellectual center of the medieval world. It's universities were open to any and all scholars, thinkers, explorers, scientists, engineers, travelers, astronomers and doctors.  Most all the ancient Greek and Roman literary and scientific classics came to Europe thru the Middle East.  Arabic medicine had no equal in the West until the 1600's.  Most of the visible stars carry Arabic names, as do the mathematical disciplines of Algebra and Algorithms.  Mathematics is based on Arabic numerals. By the early 1100's, Islam take on a fundamental and fundamentalist change thru the influence of clerics such as Abu Hamid al-Ghazali.  The rise of hardline, anti-scientific/anti-rational policies serves to hamstring scientific research so that by the 1200's the great Medieval Arabic centers of learning start to fade into memory. The dominance of scientific achievement in the Arab world falls to the superstitions and irrationalities of the true believers, and it has not substantially recovered in nearly a millennium.

What bothers me is to watch the mobs of the Army of Jesus, or Allah, or whoever demand with scripture, political pressure, bombs or terrorism that their irrationalities must always take precedence over the hard-won scientific and intellectual gains that humanity has won since the first early humans hacked a canoe out of a fallen tree trunk.   Also, when closed-minded religious charlatans and their glassy-eyed claqueurs seemed to think their myths, fables and superstitious nonsense has the same validity and significance as organic chemistry, mechanical engineering, neurosurgery, molecular genetics and astrophysics. 

Yeah, that bothers me.

Science can fly you to the Planets but it takes religion flies you into populated buildings.

[Steve in Virginia]

Actually....no.  I find it extremely disturbing that after nearly two centuries of leading the world in scientific and technical innovation we are allowing cranks, luddites and intellectual snake-oil salesmen virtually unfettered license to roll the scientific-intellectual clock back to the era of the Inquisition 

Think that's not something to keep you up at night?  Think about it. From 800 to 1100 AD Baghdad was the scientific and intellectual center of the medieval world. It's universities were open to any and all scholars, thinkers, explorers, scientists, engineers, travelers, astronomers and doctors.  Most all the ancient Greek and Roman literary and scientific classics came to Europe thru the Middle East.  Arabic medicine had no equal in the West until the 1600's.  Most of the visible stars carry Arabic names, as do the mathematical disciplines of Algebra and Algorithms.  Mathematics is based on Arabic numerals. By the early 1100's, Islam take on a fundamental and fundamentalist change thru the influence of clerics such as Abu Hamid al-Ghazali.  The rise of hardline, anti-scientific/anti-rational policies serves to hamstring scientific research so that by the 1200's the great Medieval Arabic centers of learning start to fade into memory. The dominance of scientific achievement in the Arab world falls to the superstitions and irrationalities of the true believers, and it has not substantially recovered in nearly a millennium.

What bothers me is to watch the mobs of the Army of Jesus, or Allah, or whoever demand with scripture, political pressure, bombs or terrorism that their irrationalities must always take precedence over the hard-won scientific and intellectual gains that humanity has won since the first early humans hacked a canoe out of a fallen tree trunk.   Also, when closed-minded religious charlatans and their glassy-eyed claqueurs seem to think their myths, fables and superstitious nonsense has the same validity and significance as organic chemistry, mechanical engineering, neurosurgery, molecular genetics and astrophysics. 

Yeah, that bothers me.

Science can fly you to the Planets but it takes religion to fly you into populated buildings.

Steve

On Thursday, April 3, 2014 4:23:32 PM UTC-4, e_space wrote:

[Dingbat]

On Thursday, April 3, 2014 3:09:54 PM UTC-4, Smoley wrote:

Is it good for God to enforce this law (Word) in heaven or not?

Is it good to enforce an evil law? If you get to heaven and find that heavenly law requires you to break your neighbor's neck, would you find heavenly law to be good or evil?

> You don't like God when He KILLS things, do you?  What about when people kill things?

Do you like God when he orders a baby donkey's neck broken? Would you like a neighbor who orders a puppy's neck broken?
 

What about bacteria not loving their neighbor as themselves?. Or cancer cells?

To save people and pets, we kill such bacteria with antibiotics and such cancer cells with chemotherapy. To save a baby donkey, would you kill God?
 

You are CONDEMNING God for not making His creation obey the Word?

Suppose I ask whether Hitler was good or evil to order some citizens to kill other citizens with poison gas. Am I condemning Hitler for not making his citizens obey his word? Or am I asking whether Hitler's word was good or evil?

[Rupert]

On Friday, April 4, 2014 4:36:27 AM UTC+2, Smoley wrote:

You're going to be dead in less than 50 years, so what does it matter if we're cavemen or rocket scientists? Do you actually think there is any meaning in life?

If not, then lighten up don't worry about how stupid Christians are. We're all headed for nothingness, right? 

Everything you are fighting for is WORTHLESS. You are wasting your time. You would be just as well off robbing a bank somewhere and living off the cash on some tropical island. Why don't you do that instead of sit in front of your computer complaining? There is no right and wrong. 

You are complaining that Christians are doing something wrong?  I don't think so. We're all just doing.  Everything is meaningless.

Go rob a bank, you will feel better.

Survival of the fittest, man.

Robbing a bank is not a very smart conception of where your best interests lie.

[e_space]

On Thursday, April 3, 2014 11:31:32 PM UTC-4, Steve in Virginia wrote:

Actually....no.  I find it extremely disturbing that after nearly two centuries of leading the world in scientific and technical innovation we are allowing cranks, luddites and intellectual snake-oil salesmen virtually unfettered license to roll the scientific-intellectual clock back to the era of the Inquisition 

Think that's not something to keep you up at night?  Think about it. From 800 to 1100 AD Baghdad was the scientific and intellectual center of the medieval world. It's universities were open to any and all scholars, thinkers, explorers, scientists, engineers, travelers, astronomers and doctors.  Most all the ancient Greek and Roman literary and scientific classics came to Europe thru the Middle East.  Arabic medicine had no equal in the West until the 1600's.  Most of the visible stars carry Arabic names, as do the mathematical disciplines of Algebra and Algorithms.  Mathematics is based on Arabic numerals. By the early 1100's, Islam take on a fundamental and fundamentalist change thru the influence of clerics such as Abu Hamid al-Ghazali.  The rise of hardline, anti-scientific/anti-rational policies serves to hamstring scientific research so that by the 1200's the great Medieval Arabic centers of learning start to fade into memory. The dominance of scientific achievement in the Arab world falls to the superstitions and irrationalities of the true believers, and it has not substantially recovered in nearly a millennium.

What bothers me is to watch the mobs of the Army of Jesus, or Allah, or whoever demand with scripture, political pressure, bombs or terrorism that their irrationalities must always take precedence over the hard-won scientific and intellectual gains that humanity has won since the first early humans hacked a canoe out of a fallen tree trunk.   Also, when closed-minded religious charlatans and their glassy-eyed claqueurs seem to think their myths, fables and superstitious nonsense has the same validity and significance as organic chemistry, mechanical engineering, neurosurgery, molecular genetics and astrophysics. 

Yeah, that bothers me.

Science can fly you to the Planets but it takes religion to fly you into populated buildings.

lol ... i'm with ya ... i also find it surprising, even disappointing, that so many of the planets 'intelligent' creatures get hoodwinked on religion ... blind-sided during the impressionable years, never to recover, it seems ... using religion to badger non-believers is bad enough, but to use it as a weapon stretches comprehension ... awful situation with few prospects for change unfortunately

[e_space]

On Thursday, April 3, 2014 10:36:27 PM UTC-4, Smoley wrote:

You're going to be dead in less than 50 years, so what does it matter if we're cavemen or rocket scientists? Do you actually think there is any meaning in life?

If not, then lighten up don't worry about how stupid Christians are. We're all headed for nothingness, right? 

Everything you are fighting for is WORTHLESS. You are wasting your time. You would be just as well off robbing a bank somewhere and living off the cash on some tropical island. Why don't you do that instead of sit in front of your computer complaining? There is no right and wrong. 

You are complaining that Christians are doing something wrong?  I don't think so. We're all just doing.  Everything is meaningless.

Go rob a bank, you will feel better.

Survival of the fittest, man.

man, are you fucked up or what? and that's really not a question ... the supreme height of your holyhoodwinkedness is raging ... try detox okay? and that's really a question ... 

[Dingbat]

On Thursday, April 3, 2014 12:12:34 PM UTC-4, Smoley wrote:

On Thursday, April 3, 2014 11:15:03 AM UTC-4, Steve in Virginia wrote:

You're right it's not rocket science - it's an ugly, inhumane, misogynist, violent, superstition that sees humankind as some kind of indelible stain on the universe.  Frankly, anyone who believes this vile, lunacy needs serious psychiatric counseling and probably long-term medication.   One of the things that eventually allowed me to break with Christianity, aside from its obsessive-compulsive fixation with death and suffering, is the endless recurring theme of blood-sacrifice and the need to constantly propitiate this vengeful, jealous, vindictive, murdering psychotic entity or face eternal damnation.

First of all, when the Word is ignored this is what happens. Ugly things happen.

Do ugly things happen because God allows them or because God causes them?

Suppose we stretch our imaginations to the extent of supposing that smallpox was originally beneficial and God allowed it to become disease causing.

We cannot, however, suppose that God ALLOWED the evil of breaking donkeys' necks and killing lambs. Why? The Torah didn't instruct that breaking donkeys' necks or killing lambs was ALLOWED; it instructed that these were required. The implication is that God caused the evil of breaking donkeys' necks and killing lambs, not allowed it.

[e_space]

ever hear of the expression 'barking up a tree with no cat in it'? 

[Smoley]

The law was broken. The law was weak. God turned His back on the Law and forsook it.  Why do you think God allowed Jesus Christ(the Word) to be broken on the Cross?  The law was given, but the law was not enforced.

In the Old Testament we see the Word, but you see that Israel never kept that Word. The Word was always broken. The law was never kept.

God braking the neck of the donkey was against the Word, against the law. 

When you see God breaking the neck of a donkey, you think " that is evil". You despise this breaking of the law. You are able to see the difference between what is right and what is wrong. 

God "became" evil so that we might become "good".  If you had not seen the evil, then you would not know to choose the good.  

Every time an Israelite "killed" a lamb or a donkey they were forced to see the "evil" of killing. They were drawn back to the goodness of the law, "thou shalt not kill".

It's kinda like the owner of the dog rubbing the dog's nose in the smelly pile of crap it just left on the carpet. Maybe if the dog has to smell it all day, it will learn not to do it.

Of course, people are not as smart as dogs, are they? 

[e_space]

gag!!!

[e_space]

On Friday, April 4, 2014 9:48:54 AM UTC-4, Smoley wrote:

right ... people should listen to their GOD telling them to go kill, so that they will know how evil it is ... makes sense to me ... 

[Smoley]

You would expect a person who thinks the world revolves around themselves to think that millions of years is a long time, right?  If the universe is eternal, then how long is a million years?  We think everything has to do with the way we perceive them to be, don't we?

I assume that you are referring to all the animals that have died painful deaths, right? The murdered and diseased ones?

God allowed His Word to be broken so that "sin" would appear "exceedingly sinful"

Romans 7:12  Wherefore the law is holy, and the commandment holy, and just, and good.

13  Was then that which is good made death unto me? God forbid. But sin, that it might appear sin, working death in me by that which is good; that sin by the commandment might become exceeding sinful.

Why did God need sin to become exceeding sinful?  Because He needed us to learn to choose the good and refuse the evil. He needed us to know the difference. Hence, the garden and the tree of Knowledge.

The thing that keeps most people away from God is pride. They know that His law is good, but they don't want to humble themselves and serve it. They just want God to humble Himself and serve it so they can do what they want to do while He "loves" them and serves them.

Kinda like a body that has cancer. The cancer cells want the body to sustain them so they can continue "living".

 

[e_space]

cancer cells don't "want" anything ... they are ... they don't think??? you know, sorta like you ;-^) 

 

[Smoley]

On Friday, April 4, 2014 2:14:35 AM UTC-4, Dingbat wrote:

On Thursday, April 3, 2014 3:09:54 PM UTC-4, Smoley wrote:

Is it good for God to enforce this law (Word) in heaven or not?

Is it good to enforce an evil law? If you get to heaven and find that heavenly law requires you to break your neighbor's neck, would you find heavenly law to be good or evil?

All the law is summed up in this, "Thou shalt love thy neighbor as thyself".

 

> You don't like God when He KILLS things, do you?  What about when people kill things?

Do you like God when he orders a baby donkey's neck broken? Would you like a neighbor who orders a puppy's neck broken?

That's right. It's not good, is it?  The Word of the Law should be upheld, not crucified, right?  

 

What about bacteria not loving their neighbor as themselves?. Or cancer cells?

To save people and pets, we kill such bacteria with antibiotics and such cancer cells with chemotherapy. To save a baby donkey, would you kill God?

Unless you eat His flesh and drink His blood you have no part with Him.  Unless you go by the way of Jesus Christ, crucified on the cross, then you can not enter the kingdom.

What do you think?

Is there a way to eat the flesh of God without killing Him?  You tell me.  

What is He saying here?  He is saying that unless you JUDGE God worthy of death, unless you destroy Him for the "crime of breaking the Word" then you have NO PART with Him.

Yes, it's UGLY when the Word is broken.  It shouldn't be done. The Word should be exalted.  And ALL who do not exalt the Word will be destroyed. Even God "was" judged for breaking the Word. The ones who put Him on the cross were only doing what God had put into their hearts to do.

 

You are CONDEMNING God for not making His creation obey the Word?

Suppose I ask whether Hitler was good or evil to order some citizens to kill other citizens with poison gas. Am I condemning Hitler for not making his citizens obey his word? Or am I asking whether Hitler's word was good or evil?

Except Hitler doesn't have the power to bring life back from the dead. 

[Smoley]

Tell that to the evolutionists. They seem to think that cancer wants to survive. Same with viruses. They have some desire to survive. Didn't you know that's why they were smart enough to build useful things? That's because they "knew" that the body would kick them out if they were just parasites.

The cells of the body are never aware of the body. It's because evolutionists can't see the body for all the cells. 

 

[ynot]

On Thursday, April 3, 2014 6:21:11 PM UTC+2, Smoley wrote:

>> Where is this in the Word?

It's in her head. She is delusional like you, don't you see it? If you can invent things that you say that your god did, why can;t she?

ynot

[thea]

On Thu, Apr 3, 2014 at 11:21 AM, Smoley <smo...@earthlink.net> wrote:

On Thursday, April 3, 2014 11:56:51 AM UTC-4, thea wrote:

On Wednesday, April 2, 2014 8:28:16 AM UTC-5, Smoley wrote:

If God is good, and God is omnipotent, then why doesn't He stop evil?

Haven't you heard how Adam sold his inheritance to Satan in the Garden of Eden when he ate what
God had specifically told him personally not to eat.

Where is this in the Word? God allowed Satan to overcome His Word and bring evil into the World, but other than that, Satan has no inheritance except the rebellious cancerous chaos that he lives by.

Adam had all control over his environment.  He walked and talked with God at the end of the day in the Garden of Eden.  He named all the animals.

He named all the plants, etc.

Adam had authority over all that he say.  He only had one commandment that said *don't do* -- and he disobeyed that one commandment.

God allowed him to live, but kicked him out of the Garden so he could not get a hold of the *Tree of Life* or he would have lived forever in his new found fallen state.

By the way this is Genesis 3.

Adam is a type of Jesus Christ allowing Himself to "become" sin for us, in hopes that we might "become" the righteousness of God.

Adam and Eve gained a knowledge of Good and Evil by eating of the tree. God "weakened" His Word so that they would be able to "break" His Word, so that they could learn about evil without being destroyed by the Word.

 

Adam was not a type of anything.  He was made in God's image, and was made to create his children in his image -- which you as a man are capable of doing. 

Adam's life has nothing to do with Christianity except to point out that *original sin* came into being because of his disobedience.

When Adam believed what Satan said - he gave up what God had planned for Him.

To believe that God made Adam sin, is error in judgement.

All men now have a sin nature which they pass on to their offspring, because they have not learned how to walk and talk with God.

 

Therefore, since he sold his inheritance, the only way God can work in this world of ours,
is when we are saying *Thank You*, because "God lives in the praises of His People."

But nobody wants to praise a God that allowed Satan into the Garden unless they understand "Why". 

The *why* is given when Jesus was tempted by Satan before he started his ministry.  Satan offered him everything
this old world had to offer:  Kingdoms, tuning stones into bread, cast yourself to the ground as the angels have charge over you,

all these things will I give you, if you will fall down and worship me (Satan is speaking here).  Matthew 4.

So Satan, was in control of all these things.

Satan is in control of all these things today, also.  We only have one way to get the power and presence of God Almighty into any

given situation of our life, and that is I Thessalonians 5:18 -- Be thankful for all things, for this is the will of God in Christ Jesus concerning you.*

Because God lives in the Praises of His People.  And Jesus only has authority on this earth, when we given HIM the authority by Praising

Him continually.  Psalm 22:3.


 

 

Interesting how everything is so mixed up that we cannot discern the Truth, because Satan
is determined that we worship him instead of obeying what God said -- *Thou shalt have
no other god before me.* 

 

We should always worship what is right.  The Word is right!

Our problem in today's *Age of Grace* is that the Bible, the Word, has been so maligned, by mixing up law and grace,
that it has become *null and void*.

Show me a man who truly knows how to listen and do what the Lord is telling him to do, and I will show you an uncommon

man, doing what we consider uncommon things - loving everyone and not condemning anyone.

 

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[Rupert]

What's that got to do with the trillions of animals who suffered excruciating torment for hundreds of millions of years before humans ever got here?

[Dingbat]

On Friday, April 4, 2014 11:00:28 AM UTC-4, thea wrote:

On Thu, Apr 3, 2014 at 11:21 AM, Smoley <smo...@earthlink.net> wrote:

On Thursday, April 3, 2014 11:56:51 AM UTC-4, thea wrote:

On Wednesday, April 2, 2014 8:28:16 AM UTC-5, Smoley wrote:

If God is good, and God is omnipotent, then why doesn't He stop evil?

Haven't you heard how Adam sold his inheritance to Satan in the Garden of Eden when he ate what
God had specifically told him personally not to eat.

Where is this in the Word? God allowed Satan to overcome His Word and bring evil into the World, but other than that, Satan has no inheritance except the rebellious cancerous chaos that he lives by.

Adam had all control over his environment.  He walked and talked with God at the end of the day in the Garden of Eden.  He named all the animals.

What name did he give to the giraffe?
 

He named all the plants, etc.

What name did he give to the Joshua tree?
 

Adam had authority over all that he say.  He only had one commandment that said *don't do* -- and he disobeyed that one commandment.

God allowed him to live, but kicked him out of the Garden so he could not get a hold of the *Tree of Life* or he would have lived forever in his new found fallen state.

If Adam had eaten of the tree of life, would God be powerless to make Adam mortal?

By the way this is Genesis 3.

Adam is a type of Jesus Christ allowing Himself to "become" sin for us, in hopes that we might "become" the righteousness of God.

Adam and Eve gained a knowledge of Good and Evil by eating of the tree. God "weakened" His Word so that they would be able to "break" His Word, so that they could learn about evil without being destroyed by the Word.

 

Adam was not a type of anything.  He was made in God's image, and was made to create his children in his image -- which you as a man are capable of doing. 

Adam's life has nothing to do with Christianity except to point out that *original sin* came into being because of his disobedience.

When Adam believed what Satan said - he gave up what God had planned for Him.

When Satan says something that's correct, is it wrong to believe Satan?

To believe that God made Adam sin, is error in judgement.

All men now have a sin nature which they pass on to their offspring, because they have not learned how to walk and talk with God.

If you walk and talk with God before having children, do you pass a sin nature to offspring?

[Dingbat]

On Friday, April 4, 2014 9:48:54 AM UTC-4, Smoley wrote:

On Friday, April 4, 2014 6:48:45 AM UTC-4, Dingbat wrote:

On Thursday, April 3, 2014 12:12:34 PM UTC-4, Smoley wrote:

On Thursday, April 3, 2014 11:15:03 AM UTC-4, Steve in Virginia wrote:

You're right it's not rocket science - it's an ugly, inhumane, misogynist, violent, superstition that sees humankind as some kind of indelible stain on the universe.  Frankly, anyone who believes this vile, lunacy needs serious psychiatric counseling and probably long-term medication.   One of the things that eventually allowed me to break with Christianity, aside from its obsessive-compulsive fixation with death and suffering, is the endless recurring theme of blood-sacrifice and the need to constantly propitiate this vengeful, jealous, vindictive, murdering psychotic entity or face eternal damnation.

First of all, when the Word is ignored this is what happens. Ugly things happen.

Do ugly things happen because God allows them or because God causes them?

Suppose we stretch our imaginations to the extent of supposing that smallpox was originally beneficial and God allowed it to become disease causing.

We cannot, however, suppose that God ALLOWED the evil of breaking donkeys' necks and killing lambs. Why? The Torah didn't instruct that breaking donkeys' necks or killing lambs was ALLOWED; it instructed that these were required. The implication is that God caused the evil of breaking donkeys' necks and killing lambs, not allowed it.

The law was broken. The law was weak. God turned His back on the Law and forsook it.  Why do you think God allowed Jesus Christ(the Word) to be broken on the Cross?  The law was given, but the law was not enforced.

In the Old Testament we see the Word, but you see that Israel never kept that Word. The Word was always broken. The law was never kept.

God braking the neck of the donkey was against the Word, against the law. 

When you see God breaking the neck of a donkey, you think " that is evil". You despise this breaking of the law. You are able to see the difference between what is right and what is wrong. 

Produce a document where Torah following Hebrews wrote that God gave them evil laws to teach them the difference between right and wrong. If you don't know of any such document, how do you know that God gave them such laws to teach them this?

God "became" evil so that we might become "good".  If you had not seen the evil, then you would not know to choose the good.  

Every time an Israelite "killed" a lamb or a donkey they were forced to see the "evil" of killing. They were drawn back to the goodness of the law, "thou shalt not kill".

Produce a document where they say that following God's evil laws forced them to see that they were committing evil by following such laws.
 

[Smoley]

On Friday, April 4, 2014 11:00:28 AM UTC-4, thea wrote:

On Thu, Apr 3, 2014 at 11:21 AM, Smoley <smo...@earthlink.net> wrote:

On Thursday, April 3, 2014 11:56:51 AM UTC-4, thea wrote:

On Wednesday, April 2, 2014 8:28:16 AM UTC-5, Smoley wrote:

If God is good, and God is omnipotent, then why doesn't He stop evil?

Haven't you heard how Adam sold his inheritance to Satan in the Garden of Eden when he ate what
God had specifically told him personally not to eat.

Where is this in the Word? God allowed Satan to overcome His Word and bring evil into the World, but other than that, Satan has no inheritance except the rebellious cancerous chaos that he lives by.

Adam had all control over his environment.  He walked and talked with God at the end of the day in the Garden of Eden.  He named all the animals.

He named all the plants, etc.

Adam had authority over all that he say.  He only had one commandment that said *don't do* -- and he disobeyed that one commandment.

Except His wife?

 

God allowed him to live, but kicked him out of the Garden so he could not get a hold of the *Tree of Life* or he would have lived forever in his new found fallen state.

By the way this is Genesis 3.

God needed man to eat of the tree of knowledge of Good and Evil. It was necessary that we find out the difference to the fullest extent possible. Even to the extent of the evil of death.  All evil needed to be known so that man could understand "why" to choose the Good.  
There is a difference between being told "evil" and knowing "evil".

 

Adam is a type of Jesus Christ allowing Himself to "become" sin for us, in hopes that we might "become" the righteousness of God.

Adam and Eve gained a knowledge of Good and Evil by eating of the tree. God "weakened" His Word so that they would be able to "break" His Word, so that they could learn about evil without being destroyed by the Word.

 

Adam was not a type of anything.  He was made in God's image, and was made to create his children in his image -- which you as a man are capable of doing. 

Adam's life has nothing to do with Christianity except to point out that *original sin* came into being because of his disobedience.

Adam has nothing to do with Christianity?

1 Corinthians 15:45  And so it is written, The first man Adam was made a living soul; the last Adam was made a quickening spirit.

46  Howbeit that was not first which is spiritual, but that which is natural; and afterward that which is spiritual.

47  The first man is of the earth, earthy: the second man is the Lord from heaven.

48  As is the earthy, such are they also that are earthy: and as is the heavenly, such are they also that are heavenly.

49  And as we have borne the image of the earthy, we shall also bear the image of the heavenly.

I guess Paul didn't realize that Adam had nothing to do with Christianity.  
Jesus Christ was both Adams.  He took on the form of a man and "became" sin for us. This is pictured by His "eating" of the fruit.

Jesus Christ is also God in heaven who put off the old man of sin through death and is now seated on the throne of Heaven.

Adam has everything to do with Christianity.

 

When Adam believed what Satan said - he gave up what God had planned for Him.

To believe that God made Adam sin, is error in judgement.

2 Corinthians 5:21  For he hath made him to be sin for us, who knew no sin; that we might be made the righteousness of God in him.

 

All men now have a sin nature which they pass on to their offspring, because they have not learned how to walk and talk with God.

The sin nature was given to us by the first Adam. We got our bodies for the "first Adam".  

The sin nature was taken away from us by the Second Adam. We lost our bodies on the Cross.

God gave us a sin nature for a short amount of time.  We needed to learn some things by eating of the tree of knowledge, so we could understand good and evil.

After we learn this. There is no more need for the "body".

God is like a Doctor who inoculates his patient with a deadly disease. The Doctor doesn't want the patient to die. The Doctor needs the patient to develop a "resistance" to the disease. 

 

 

Therefore, since he sold his inheritance, the only way God can work in this world of ours,
is when we are saying *Thank You*, because "God lives in the praises of His People."

But nobody wants to praise a God that allowed Satan into the Garden unless they understand "Why". 

The *why* is given when Jesus was tempted by Satan before he started his ministry.  Satan offered him everything
this old world had to offer:  Kingdoms, tuning stones into bread, cast yourself to the ground as the angels have charge over you,

all these things will I give you, if you will fall down and worship me (Satan is speaking here).  Matthew 4.

So Satan, was in control of all these things.

Satan is only in "control" of cancer.  He is the Father of cancer. He is the one gathering the cells to rebel against the Head. He has quite a large crowd and it is growing.

 

Satan is in control of all these things today, also.  We only have one way to get the power and presence of God Almighty into any

given situation of our life, and that is I Thessalonians 5:18 -- Be thankful for all things, for this is the will of God in Christ Jesus concerning you.*

Because God lives in the Praises of His People.  And Jesus only has authority on this earth, when we given HIM the authority by Praising

Him continually.  Psalm 22:3.

The ONLY way to get the power is to take up your Cross and follow the Lord Jesus Christ out of this world and into the next. 

 

Interesting how everything is so mixed up that we cannot discern the Truth, because Satan
is determined that we worship him instead of obeying what God said -- *Thou shalt have
no other god before me.* 

 

We should always worship what is right.  The Word is right!

Our problem in today's *Age of Grace* is that the Bible, the Word, has been so maligned, by mixing up law and grace,
that it has become *null and void*.

Show me a man who truly knows how to listen and do what the Lord is telling him to do, and I will show you an uncommon

man, doing what we consider uncommon things - loving everyone and not condemning anyone.

The Word is never wrong.

 

 

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[Observer]

On Thursday, April 3, 2014 9:21:11 AM UTC-7, Smoley wrote:

On Thursday, April 3, 2014 11:56:51 AM UTC-4, thea wrote:

On Wednesday, April 2, 2014 8:28:16 AM UTC-5, Smoley wrote:

If God is good, and God is omnipotent, then why doesn't He stop evil?

Haven't you heard how Adam sold his inheritance to Satan in the Garden of Eden when he ate what

God had specifically told him personally not to eat.

Observer

The entirety of the so-called word is a product of a violent, uneducated, superstitious,  primitive , stupefied, people who knew almost nothing of the universe in which they live, nor how it functioned. This psychotic crap is what you are depending on for guidance in how to live a decent life. The result being that you demonstrate psychotic attitudes, abject ignorance of the world about you, and that your mind has been taken from you, as has your very humanity by this filthy superstitious meme.

Where is this in the Word? God allowed Satan to overcome His Word and bring evil into the World, but other than that, Satan has no inheritance except the rebellious cancerous chaos that he lives by.

Smoley wrote:

Adam is a type of Jesus Christ allowing Himself to "become" sin for us, in hopes that we might "become" the righteousness of God.

Adam and Eve gained a knowledge of Good and Evil by eating of the tree. God "weakened" His Word so that they would be able to "break" His Word, so that they could learn about evil without being destroyed by the Word..

Observer

Smoley, are you too stupid to understand that what cannot be discovered through the process of reason, logic scientific method, a reasonable reliance on the produce thereof, and tempered by critical thinking must needs be rejected as meaningless?

 Smoley wrote:

Therefore, since he sold his inheritance, the only way God can work in this world of ours,

is when we are saying *Thank You*, because "God lives in the praises of His People."

Observer

Abject mind vomit which could not be further from the truth. You are, after all, pretty stupid, aren't you? 

Smoley wrote:

But nobody wants to praise a God that allowed Satan into the Garden unless they understand "Why". 

Observer

Intelligent, well educated adults do not pay homage to phantasms which are purely the product of imagination's gone amok.

 

Smoley wrote:

Interesting how everything is so mixed up that we cannot discern the Truth, because Satan

is determined that we worship him instead of obeying what God said -- *Thou shalt have

no other god before me.*  

Observer

You are far too uneducated and to state the psychosis to understand the following, but I shall offer it anyway.

Hans Vaihinger

From Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Hans Vaihinger

Vaihinger.jpg

Born September 25, 1852

Nehren

Died December 18, 1933

Halle

Era 20th-century philosophy

Region Western Philosophy

School Neo-Kantianism

Main interests idealism, positivism

Notable ideas fictionalism, instrumentalism, nominalism

Influenced by[show]

Influenced[show]

Hans Vaihinger (German pronunciation: [hans ˈfaɪɪŋɐ];[1] September 25, 1852 – December 18, 1933) was a German philosopher, best known as a Kant scholar and for his Die Philosophie des Als Ob (The Philosophy of 'As If'), published in 1911, but written more than thirty years earlier.[2][3]

Vaihinger was born in Nehren, Württemberg, Germany, near Tübingen, and raised in what he himself described as a "very religious milieu". He was educated at Tübingen, Leipzig, and Berlin, became a tutor and later a philosophy professor at Strasbourg before moving to the university at Halle in 1884. From 1892, he was a full professor.

Philosophy of As If[edit]

In Philosophie des Als Ob, Vaihinger argued that human beings can never really know the underlying reality of the world, and that as a result we construct systems of thought and then assume that these match reality: we behave "as if" the world matches our models. In particular, he used examples from the physical sciences, such as protons, electrons, and electromagnetic waves. None of these phenomena have been observed directly, but science pretends that they exist, and uses observations made on these assumptions to create new and better constructs.[2]

Vaihinger admitted that he had several precursors, especially Jeremy Bentham's Theory of Fictions. In the preface to the English edition of his work, Vaihinger expressed his Principle of Fictionalism. This is that "an idea whose theoretical untruth or incorrectness, and therewith its falsity, is admitted is not for that reason practically valueless and useless; for such an idea, in spite of its theoretical nullity, may have great practical importance." Moreover, Vaihinger denied that his philosophy was a form of skepticism because skepticism implies a doubting, whereas in his 'as if' philosophy the acceptance of patently false fictions is justified as a pragmatic non-rational solution to problems that have no rational answers.[4]

This philosophy, though, is wider than just science. One can never be sure that the world will still exist tomorrow, but we usually assume that it does. Alfred Adler, the founder of Individual Psychology, was profoundly influenced by Vaihinger's theory of useful fictions, incorporating the idea of psychological fictions into his personality construct of a fictional final goal.

Vaihinger’s philosophy of 'as if' can be viewed as one of the central premises upon which George Kelly's personal construct psychology is based. Kelly credited Vaihinger with influencing his theory, especially the idea that our constructions are better viewed as useful hypotheses rather than representations of objective reality. Kelly wrote: "Vaihinger's 'as if' philosophy has value for psychology (...) Vaihinger began to develop a system of philosophy he called the "philosophy of 'as if' ". In it he offered a system of thought in which God and reality might best be represented as paradigms. This was not to say that either God or reality was any less certain than anything else in the realm of man’s awareness, but only that all matters confronting man might best be regarded in hypothetical ways".[5]

Frank Kermode's The Sense of an Ending (1967) was an early mention of Vaihinger as a useful methodologist of narrativity. He says that "literary fictions belong to Vaihinger’s category of 'the consciously false.' They are not subject, like hypotheses, to proof or disconfirmation, only, if they come to lose their operational effectiveness, to neglect."[6]

Later, James Hillman developed both Vaihinger and Adler's work with psychological fictions into a core theme of his work Healing Fiction in which he makes one of his more accessible cases for identifying the tendency to literalize, rather than "see through our meanings," (HF 110) with neurosis and madness.[7]

[\Quote]

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hans_Vaihinger

Smoley wrote:

 

We should always worship what is right.  

Observer

Bull shit!

Smoley wrote:

The Word is right!

Observer

 The veracity of this idiotic nonsense has never been and can never be substantiated. You have been duped by primitive nonsense.

Because, for a short time, God has allowed the Word to be broken.

Have you heard of the Word?

<sniped superstitious , psychotic filth>

Observer

I wish you well and above all hope that you will seek out professional psychiatric counseling as you are obviously extremely demented.

Psychonomist

[Loopflanger]

On Thursday, April 3, 2014 6:12:57 AM UTC-7, Smoley wrote:

That's what happens when there is no law, when there is no right or wrong.

You don't need a law to know there's something wrong  with &/or problematical  abt something because the causes & effects speak for themselves. 

 

[Loopflanger]

On Thursday, April 3, 2014 7:36:27 PM UTC-7, Smoley wrote:

 

We're all headed for nothingness, right? 

That's irrelevant. The quality of life is an issue until you're dead. Then there's future generations to consider.

[Smoley]

If you want to talk about the blunders of evolution, then let's do it. But the Bible says that all things were created just 6,000 years ago.

 

If evolution were true, then there would be no Word of Life. All things would be considered a cancer or a virus. and yes, that would explain the excruciating pain.

 

[passerby31416@gmail.com]

Because in the Tree of Life, all things that can happen, do happen. It maximizes Life. To remove all branches with sorrow would eliminate 99.999999999999999999999...% of all life.

Blessed are the Poor, for theirs is to win the lottery and find true love that doesn't fade, in the Many Worlds of the Kingdom of the Father.  

[Observer]

Observer

You with your sub standard intelligence and almost nonexistent education chose to criticise hundreds of thousands of the best trained, most intelligent, best equipped scientific minds the world has ever produced?

That is rich. 

 You sir or madam are among the most arrogant of fools ever to draw breath.

Fact[edit]

Main article: Scientific fact

Fact is often used by scientists to refer to experimental or empirical data orobjective verifiable observations.^[15][16] "Fact" is also used in a wider sense to mean any theory for which there is overwhelming evidence.^[17]

A fact is a hypothesis that is so firmly supported by evidence that we assume it is true, and act as if it were true. —Douglas Futuyma^[18]

Evolution is a fact in the sense that it is overwhelmingly validated by the evidence. Frequently, evolution is said to be a fact in the same way as the Earth revolving around the Sun is a fact.^[18][19] The following quotation from H. J. Muller, "One Hundred Years Without Darwin Are Enough" explains the point.

There is no sharp line between speculation, hypothesis, theory, principle, and fact, but only a difference along a sliding scale, in the degree of probability of the idea. When we say a thing is a fact, then, we only mean that its probability is an extremely high one: so high that we are not bothered by doubt about it and are ready to act accordingly. Now in this use of the term fact, the only proper one, evolution is a fact.^[20]

The National Academy of Science (U.S.) makes a similar point:

Scientists most often use the word "fact" to describe an observation. But scientists can also use fact to mean something that has been tested or observed so many times that there is no longer a compelling reason to keep testing or looking for examples. The occurrence of evolution in this sense is fact. Scientists no longer question whether descent with modification occurred because the evidence is so strong.^[21]

Gould also points out that "Darwin continually emphasized the difference between his two great and separate accomplishments: establishing the fact of evolution, and proposing a theory—natural selection—to explain the mechanism of evolution."^[22] These two aspects are frequently confused. Scientists continue to argue about particular explanations or mechanisms at work in specific instances of evolution, but the fact that evolution has occurred and is still occurring is undisputed.

A common misconception is that evolution cannot be observed because it all happened millions of years ago and the science does not therefore depend on facts (in the initial sense above). However both Darwin and Wallace, the co-founders of the theory, and all subsequent biologists depend primarily on observations of living organisms; Darwin concentrated largely on the breeding of domesticated animals whereas Wallace started from the biogeographicaldistribution of species in the Amazon and Malay Archipelago. In the early twentieth century, population genetics had centre stage, and more recentlyDNA has become the main focus of observation and experimentation.

Philosophers of science argue that we do not know mind-independent empirical truths with absolute certainty: even direct observations may be "theory laden" and depend on assumptions about our senses and the measuring instruments used. In this sense all facts are provisional.^[10][23]

Theory[edit]

Main article: Scientific theory

The scientific definition of the word "theory" is different from the colloquialsense of the word. In the vernacular, "theory" can refer to guesswork, a simple conjecture, an opinion, or a speculation that does not have to be based on facts and need not be framed for making testable predictions.

However, in science, the meaning of theory is more rigorous. A scientific theory is "a well-substantiated explanation of some aspect of the natural world, based on a body of facts that have been repeatedly confirmed throughobservation and experiment."^[24] Theories are formed from hypotheses that have been subjected repeatedly to tests of evidence which attempt to disprove or falsify them. In the case of evolution through natural selection, Darwin conceived the hypothesis around 1839, and made a first draft of the concept three years later in 1842. He discussed this widely with many of his intellectual companions, and conducted further research in the background to his other writings and work. After years of development, he finally published his evidence and theory in On the Origin of Species in 1859.^[25]

Paychonomist

[Smoley]

On Friday, April 4, 2014 9:08:27 PM UTC-4, Observer wrote:

On Friday, April 4, 2014 4:26:44 PM UTC-7, Smoley wrote:

On Friday, April 4, 2014 12:50:27 PM UTC-4, Rupert wrote:

On Friday, April 4, 2014 4:06:13 PM UTC+2, Smoley wrote:

On Thursday, April 3, 2014 9:21:25 PM UTC-4, Rupert wrote:

On Wednesday, April 2, 2014 3:28:16 PM UTC+2, Smoley wrote:

If God is good, and God is omnipotent, then why doesn't He stop evil?

Because, for a short time, God has allowed the Word to be broken.

So why would that be?

Countless trillions of animals have suffered excruciating torment throughout many hundreds of millions of years of evolutionary history. It's not such a "short time" really. It's been going on quite a while.

You would expect a person who thinks the world revolves around themselves to think that millions of years is a long time, right?  If the universe is eternal, then how long is a million years?  We think everything has to do with the way we perceive them to be, don't we?

I assume that you are referring to all the animals that have died painful deaths, right? The murdered and diseased ones?

God allowed His Word to be broken so that "sin" would appear "exceedingly sinful"

Romans 7:12  Wherefore the law is holy, and the commandment holy, and just, and good.

13  Was then that which is good made death unto me? God forbid. But sin, that it might appear sin, working death in me by that which is good; that sin by the commandment might become exceeding sinful.

Why did God need sin to become exceeding sinful?  Because He needed us to learn to choose the good and refuse the evil. He needed us to know the difference. Hence, the garden and the tree of Knowledge.

The thing that keeps most people away from God is pride. They know that His law is good, but they don't want to humble themselves and serve it. They just want God to humble Himself and serve it so they can do what they want to do while He "loves" them and serves them.

Kinda like a body that has cancer. The cancer cells want the body to sustain them so they can continue "living".

 

What's that got to do with the trillions of animals who suffered excruciating torment for hundreds of millions of years before humans ever got here?

If you want to talk about the blunders of evolution, then let's do it. But the Bible says that all things were created just 6,000 years ago.

 

If evolution were true, then there would be no Word of Life. All things would be considered a cancer or a virus. and yes, that would explain the excruciating pain.

Observer

You with your sub standard intelligence and almost nonexistent education chose to criticise hundreds of thousands of the best trained, most intelligent, best equipped scientific minds the world has ever produced?

That is rich. 

What is the intelligence standard?  You've got hundreds of thousands of the devil's sock puppets mindlessly supporting the appearance of wisdom.  It's all fluff dressed up really nice. 

 You sir or madam are among the most arrogant of fools ever to draw breath.

Said the guy who just called me sub standard with an almost non-existent education. 

Fact[edit]

Main article: Scientific fact

Fact is often used by scientists to refer to experimental or empirical data orobjective verifiable observations.^[15][16] "Fact" is also used in a wider sense to mean any theory for which there is overwhelming evidence.^[17]

A fact is a hypothesis that is so firmly supported by evidence that we assume it is true, and act as if it were true. —Douglas Futuyma^[18]

Evolution is a fact in the sense that it is overwhelmingly validated by the evidence. Frequently, evolution is said to be a fact in the same way as the Earth revolving around the Sun is a fact.^[18][19] The following quotation from H. J. Muller, "One Hundred Years Without Darwin Are Enough" explains the point.

Except that the earth follows a specific pattern. Evolution follows a chaotic pattern. Not even close to the same thing.

 

There is no sharp line between speculation, hypothesis, theory, principle, and fact, but only a difference along a sliding scale, in the degree of probability of the idea. When we say a thing is a fact, then, we only mean that its probability is an extremely high one: so high that we are not bothered by doubt about it and are ready to act accordingly. Now in this use of the term fact, the only proper one, evolution is a fact.^[20]

So you are saying that this evolutionists just made an excuse?  He said that his theory is so full of fact that there is no need to be bothered by doubt. This explains why no one doubts it.

Proclaim it to be Fact. That should solve the problem!

Scientists most often use the word "fact" to describe an observation. But scientists can also use fact to mean something that has been tested or observed so many times that there is no longer a compelling reason to keep testing or looking for examples. The occurrence of evolution in this sense is fact. Scientists no longer question whether descent with modification occurred because the evidence is so strong.^[21]

So, he quotes one sentence of evolution as a fact. Does this sentence have anything to do with DNA from chaos?  It was hard for me to see the connection here.

 

Gould also points out that "Darwin continually emphasized the difference between his two great and separate accomplishments: establishing the fact of evolution, and proposing a theory—natural selection—to explain the mechanism of evolution."^[22] These two aspects are frequently confused. Scientists continue to argue about particular explanations or mechanisms at work in specific instances of evolution, but the fact that evolution has occurred and is still occurring is undisputed.

Actually, diversity is better explained by understanding that the Creator actually wrote the Word of the Code to be recombined to create diversity. Like creating blue paint and red paint and giving someone the freedom to mix the two in any amount. Some would have mostly blue, some would have mostly red but most would have some color in between. And most likely there would be no two colors the same.

Sure evolution is happening IN the colors, but evolution did not create the colors, neither did evolution create the paint. Evolution is working with the ingredients supplied to it by the Word of God.

I'll go with the fact of evolution, but not the fiction. I have my own "fiction". 

A common misconception is that evolution cannot be observed because it all happened millions of years ago and the science does not therefore depend on facts (in the initial sense above). However both Darwin and Wallace, the co-founders of the theory, and all subsequent biologists depend primarily on observations of living organisms; Darwin concentrated largely on the breeding of domesticated animals whereas Wallace started from the biogeographicaldistribution of species in the Amazon and Malay Archipelago. In the early twentieth century, population genetics had centre stage, and more recentlyDNA has become the main focus of observation and experimentation.

Philosophers of science argue that we do not know mind-independent empirical truths with absolute certainty: even direct observations may be "theory laden" and depend on assumptions about our senses and the measuring instruments used. In this sense all facts are provisional.^[10][23]

I"m confused.... Did He just say that we are NOT sure that robbing a bank is wrong? Killing things might not be bad either, huh?

 

Theory[edit]

Main article: Scientific theory

The scientific definition of the word "theory" is different from the colloquialsense of the word. In the vernacular, "theory" can refer to guesswork, a simple conjecture, an opinion, or a speculation that does not have to be based on facts and need not be framed for making testable predictions.

However, in science, the meaning of theory is more rigorous. A scientific theory is "a well-substantiated explanation of some aspect of the natural world, based on a body of facts that have been repeatedly confirmed throughobservation and experiment."^[24] Theories are formed from hypotheses that have been subjected repeatedly to tests of evidence which attempt to disprove or falsify them. In the case of evolution through natural selection, Darwin conceived the hypothesis around 1839, and made a first draft of the concept three years later in 1842. He discussed this widely with many of his intellectual companions, and conducted further research in the background to his other writings and work. After years of development, he finally published his evidence and theory in On the Origin of Species in 1859.^[25]

Dear Darwin, many advances in science have been made since your day. You will be glad to hear that most people, however, have refused to advance with the new scientific discoveries. They are sticking with you. This should make your day.

 

Paychonomist

What did I learn from this?  Evolution mixes paint, therefore the paint mixer, the paint can, the paint, the colors and the painter are all products of evolution..  This is a fact and we don't question facts. End of story. 

DNA is not the "Word of God" it's just a jumbled up mess of proteins and other stuff that randomly happened to tell the members of the body to work and serve one another in love.

Now with my new understanding of things, I now proclaim DNA as the writer of the Word.

 Galatians 5:13  ¶For, brethren, ye have been called unto liberty; only use not liberty for an occasion to the flesh, but by love serve one another.

14  For all the law is fulfilled in one word, even in this; Thou shalt love thy neighbour as thyself.

[Rupert]

On Saturday, April 5, 2014 1:26:44 AM UTC+2, Smoley wrote:

What's that got to do with the trillions of animals who suffered excruciating torment for hundreds of millions of years before humans ever got here?

If you want to talk about the blunders of evolution, then let's do it. But the Bible says that all things were created just 6,000 years ago.

 

If evolution were true, then there would be no Word of Life. All things would be considered a cancer or a virus. and yes, that would explain the excruciating pain.

 

You really need to do something about your horrifying ignorance.

First of all, here's a city settlement older than 6000 years:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/%C3%87atalh%C3%B6y%C3%BCk

Now start learning the basics of how we know the age of the earth:

http://www.talkorigins.org/faqs/faq-age-of-earth.html#howold

[ynot]

On Saturday, April 5, 2014 5:11:26 AM UTC+2, Smoley wrote:

 You sir or madam are among the most arrogant of fools ever to draw breath.

Said the guy who just called me sub standard with an almost non-existent education. 

Yes; the guy that said that you have a  " sub standard with an almost non-existent education " is the guy that said that you are " among the most arrogant of fools ever to draw breath.". Then what?  What is your point ? You don't even make any sense. You can't construct an English phrase. But you are so full of yourself, so arrogant  that  you dare to talk about things that you have no idea what they are or how they work.

So you are saying that this evolutionists just made an excuse?  He said that his theory is so full of fact that there is no need to be bothered by doubt. This explains why no one doubts it.

 

You are so ignorant of the English language. NO, he did not say that. Just read those 2 paragraphs 20 times and then get someone with some education to explain them to you. Till then please refrain from commenting on the contents of that reply.

Proclaim it to be Fact. That should solve the problem!

You mean like what you and your ilk proclaim about the buybull being a fact?
 

 >>  .............................. but not the fiction.

>> I have my own "fiction".

You can say that again and again. That you have a lot together with delusion and gullibility and ignorance. And arrogance.

>> I"m confused....

You wouldn't be. Just learn what evolution is and you will understand what was said.

>> Did He just say that we are NOT sure that robbing a bank is wrong? Killing things might not be bad either, huh?

You got it. You see, it is not that difficult to understand what evolution is all about. Now go to your church and spread the WORD what evolution is. It is all about robbing banks. What a wast of time; you take any pleasure that anyone may have in having a conversation with guys like you.

ynot

[Smoley]

On Saturday, April 5, 2014 10:43:09 AM UTC-4, ynot wrote:

On Saturday, April 5, 2014 5:11:26 AM UTC+2, Smoley wrote:

 You sir or madam are among the most arrogant of fools ever to draw breath.

Said the guy who just called me sub standard with an almost non-existent education. 

Yes; the guy that said that you have a  " sub standard with an almost non-existent education " is the guy that said that you are " among the most arrogant of fools ever to draw breath.". Then what?  What is your point ? You don't even make any sense. You can't construct an English phrase. But you are so full of yourself, so arrogant  that  you dare to talk about things that you have no idea what they are or how they work.

So you are saying that this evolutionists just made an excuse?  He said that his theory is so full of fact that there is no need to be bothered by doubt. This explains why no one doubts it.

 

You are so ignorant of the English language. NO, he did not say that. Just read those 2 paragraphs 20 times and then get someone with some education to explain them to you. Till then please refrain from commenting on the contents of that reply.

Proclaim it to be Fact. That should solve the problem!

You mean like what you and your ilk proclaim about the buybull being a fact?

Oh, it absolutely is a fact that the members of the Body must obey the Word and serve one another in love.  IF the members of your body did not obey this law, then you would die a very very painful death.(Like Jesus Christ)

Each member of your body must obey the word. It's good that the Word of God hasn't been completely destroyed from within you for your own good.

If you got cancer and the members of your body forgot the Word, then you would understand why the Word of God is good for you. 

Just remember, if this happens, it is only to show you that God's Word is good and you should magnify it, rather than fight against it.

And to show you that the breaking of God's Word is wrong, evil, destructive, and cancerous.

The Goodness of God and the Wickedness of Cancer.  This is the understanding that comes from "eating of the tree of knowledge of Good and Evil". 

[e_space]

you suck BIG ONES man! and that is an understatement ... 

[Observer]

Smoley wrote:

What is the intelligence standard?  You've got hundreds of thousands of the devil's sock puppets mindlessly supporting the appearance of wisdom.  It's all fluff dressed up really nice. 

Observer

Not only intelligence. It's years scientific training, the best equipment ever devised by human kind, and adherence to the combined use of reason, logic, scientific method, a reasonable reliance on the produce thereof, and the temperance supplied by the clear and concise rules of critical thinking. All of which you too fucking stupid understand.

Furthermore belief in God's or a God, demons, devils, angels and other unnatural creatures demonstrates the abject ignorance of the believer. There is no evidence for the existence of such using the above-mentioned combination of intellectual processes known to be the only reliable processes by which truly useful data can be acquired and known to spell out the most eloquent and probable processes by which objective reality functions. Are you too stupid understand that also?

 You sir or madam are among the most arrogant of fools ever to draw breath.

Smoley wrote:

Said the guy who just called me sub standard with an almost non-existent education. 

Observer

You demonstrate by arriving and your inability to think clearly, as well as your commitment to superstitious filth that that is what must be the case.

Fact[edit]

Main article: Scientific fact

Fact is often used by scientists to refer to experimental or empirical data orobjective verifiable observations.[15][16] "Fact" is also used in a wider sense to mean any theory for which there is overwhelming evidence.[17]

A fact is a hypothesis that is so firmly supported by evidence that we assume it is true, and act as if it were true. —Douglas Futuyma[18]

Evolution is a fact in the sense that it is overwhelmingly validated by the evidence. Frequently, evolution is said to be a fact in the same way as the Earth revolving around the Sun is a fact.[18][19] The following quotation from H. J. Muller, "One Hundred Years Without Darwin Are Enough" explains the point.

Smoley wrote:

Except that the earth follows a specific pattern. Evolution follows a chaotic pattern. Not even close to the same thing.

Observer

Had you any education regarding the subject of evolution. You would not make such an idiotic commentary. Evolution operates in accordance with the same laws as does the chemistry which proceeded it. Aside from the uncertainty principle, what we know about evolution allows us to make accurate forecasts and to do science, by which thousands of lives are saved every year.

 

There is no sharp line between speculation, hypothesis, theory, principle, and fact, but only a difference along a sliding scale, in the degree of probability of the idea. When we say a thing is a fact, then, we only mean that its probability is an extremely high one: so high that we are not bothered by doubt about it and are ready to act accordingly. Now in this use of the term fact, the only proper one, evolution is a fact.[20]

So you are saying that this evolutionists just made an excuse?  He said that his theory is so full of fact that there is no need to be bothered by doubt. This explains why no one doubts it.

Proclaim it to be Fact. That should solve the problem!

Scientists most often use the word "fact" to describe an observation. But scientists can also use fact to mean something that has been tested or observed so many times that there is no longer a compelling reason to keep testing or looking for examples. The occurrence of evolution in this sense is fact. Scientists no longer question whether descent with modification occurred because the evidence is so strong.[21]

Smoley wrote:

So, he quotes one sentence of evolution as a fact. Does this sentence have anything to do with DNA from chaos?  It was hard for me to see the connection here.

Observer

What do you mean DNA from chaos? DNA is the natural result of the chemistry which proceeded it, and as part and parcel of a near endless chain of causal events.

Part of which is reflected in the emergence of the universe as we now know it.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_embedded&v=EjaGktVQdNg

I am alive bother trying to help you as you to thickheaded to even want to learn what is most probably actual, as opposed to one is simply an idiotic superstition/meme.

Gould also points out that "Darwin continually emphasized the difference between his two great and separate accomplishments: establishing the fact of evolution, and proposing a theory—natural selection—to explain the mechanism of evolution."[22] These two aspects are frequently confused. Scientists continue to argue about particular explanations or mechanisms at work in specific instances of evolution, but the fact that evolution has occurred and is still occurring is undisputed.

Actually, diversity is better explained by understanding that the Creator actually wrote the Word of the Code to be recombined to create diversity. Like creating blue paint and red paint and giving someone the freedom to mix the two in any amount. Some would have mostly blue, some would have mostly red but most would have some color in between. And most likely there would be no two colors the same.

Smoley wrote:

Sure evolution is happening IN the colors, but evolution did not create the colors, neither did evolution create the paint. Evolution is working with the ingredients supplied to it by the Word of God.

Observer

Wrong, the universe itself is constantly evolving and everything there within is the product of its natural evolution. No gods necessary the member what you witness in the above commentary by Dr. Krauss one of worlds most preeminent physicists was work is based entirely on sound scientific data.

Smoley wrote

I'll go with the fact of evolution, but not the fiction. I have my own "fiction". 

Observer

Specifically delineate what you think is fictitious and then supply us with scientific data establishing your case. A company, it with a peer-reviewed scientific paper published in one of the better scientific Journals.

A common misconception is that evolution cannot be observed because it all happened millions of years ago and the science does not therefore depend on facts (in the initial sense above). However both Darwin and Wallace, the co-founders of the theory, and all subsequent biologists depend primarily on observations of living organisms; Darwin concentrated largely on the breeding of domesticated animals whereas Wallace started from the biogeographicaldistribution of species in the Amazon and Malay Archipelago. In the early twentieth century, population genetics had centre stage, and more recentlyDNA has become the main focus of observation and experimentation.

Philosophers of science argue that we do not know mind-independent empirical truths with absolute certainty: even direct observations may be "theory laden" and depend on assumptions about our senses and the measuring instruments used. In this sense all facts are provisional.[10][23]

I"m confused.... Did He just say that we are NOT sure that robbing a bank is wrong? Killing things might not be bad either, huh?

 

Theory[edit]

Main article: Scientific theory

The scientific definition of the word "theory" is different from the colloquialsense of the word. In the vernacular, "theory" can refer to guesswork, a simple conjecture, an opinion, or a speculation that does not have to be based on facts and need not be framed for making testable predictions.

However, in science, the meaning of theory is more rigorous. A scientific theory is "a well-substantiated explanation of some aspect of the natural world, based on a body of facts that have been repeatedly confirmed throughobservation and experiment."[24] Theories are formed from hypotheses that have been subjected repeatedly to tests of evidence which attempt to disprove or falsify them. In the case of evolution through natural selection, Darwin conceived the hypothesis around 1839, and made a first draft of the concept three years later in 1842. He discussed this widely with many of his intellectual companions, and conducted further research in the background to his other writings and work. After years of development, he finally published his evidence and theory in On the Origin of Species in 1859.[25]

Dear Darwin, many advances in science have been made since your day. You will be glad to hear that most people, however, have refused to advance with the new scientific discoveries. They are sticking with you. This should make your day.

 

Paychonomist

Smoley wrote:

What did I learn from this?

Observer

Apparently nothing, you haven't got the mental acuity to come close to understanding. Again you demonstrate what we must assume to be a combination of ignorance and abject stupidity.

Smoley wrote:

  Evolution mixes paint, therefore the paint mixer, the paint can, the paint, the colors and the painter are all products of evolution..  This is a fact and we don't question facts. End of story. 

Observer

A very poor attempt an analogy, what are you three years old?

Why is it that you can give us no reason, in accordance with the combined rules of reason, logic, scientific method, a reasonable reliance on the produce thereof tempered by the clear and concise rules of critical thinking for or considering that a God thing ever existed or committed any act in or upon this universe?

Of course I can answer my own question the probability of such is so small as to be absolutely ridiculous as a consideration of how objective reality functions.

Smoley wrote:

DNA is not the "Word of God" it's just a jumbled up mess of proteins and other stuff that randomly happened to tell the members of the body to work and serve one another in love.

Observer

DNA is but a tiny segment of a near endless chain of causal events. With the exception of some anomalies caused by the uncertainty principle, the behavior of evolution is greatly predictable.

Smoley wrote:

Now with my new understanding of things, I now proclaim DNA as the writer of the Word.

Observer

Stupid commentary.

Smoley wrote:

 Galatians 5:13  ¶For, brethren, ye have been called unto liberty; only use not liberty for an occasion to the flesh, but by love serve one another.

14  For all the law is fulfilled in one word, even in this; Thou shalt love thy neighbour as thyself.

Observer

Again you post psychotic nonsense in the hope that those who know better will suddenly and magically change their mind by reading what they know to be utter nonsense. Once again, causing us to focus, on your ignorance and stupidity.

Nonetheless, I wish you well.

Psychonomist

[thea]

Maybe we are reading the record we have been given wrong.  Maybe a human man was here, but because of smaller bones, etc. has completely

gone from the record.  Or maybe, since the being was a *heavenly being* it won't show up in the records which we have to see.

thea
 

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[thea]

On Fri, Apr 4, 2014 at 4:01 PM, Smoley <smo...@earthlink.net> wrote:

On Friday, April 4, 2014 11:00:28 AM UTC-4, thea wrote:

On Thu, Apr 3, 2014 at 11:21 AM, Smoley <smo...@earthlink.net> wrote:

On Thursday, April 3, 2014 11:56:51 AM UTC-4, thea wrote:

On Wednesday, April 2, 2014 8:28:16 AM UTC-5, Smoley wrote:

If God is good, and God is omnipotent, then why doesn't He stop evil?

Haven't you heard how Adam sold his inheritance to Satan in the Garden of Eden when he ate what
God had specifically told him personally not to eat.

Where is this in the Word? God allowed Satan to overcome His Word and bring evil into the World, but other than that, Satan has no inheritance except the rebellious cancerous chaos that he lives by.

Adam had all control over his environment.  He walked and talked with God at the end of the day in the Garden of Eden.  He named all the animals.

He named all the plants, etc.

Adam had authority over all that he say.  He only had one commandment that said *don't do* -- and he disobeyed that one commandment.

Except His wife?

His wife was made (Genesis 3) after Adam was told not to eat.  His wife got it second hand from Adam that she was not to eat and second hand from the Snake.

In other words, Adam's wife was fooled because she did not directly hear God tell her not to eat.

 

 

God allowed him to live, but kicked him out of the Garden so he could not get a hold of the *Tree of Life* or he would have lived forever in his new found fallen state.

By the way this is Genesis 3.

God needed man to eat of the tree of knowledge of Good and Evil. It was necessary that we find out the difference to the fullest extent possible. Even to the extent of the evil of death.  All evil needed to be known so that man could understand "why" to choose the Good.  
There is a difference between being told "evil" and knowing "evil".

Only if you believe that heaven needs you to fill up the space vacated by Satan and his angels, when he was kicked out.

And, that means that you will also have to believe that when Satan sinned (in and of himself) that there is no salvation for Satan.
 

 

Adam is a type of Jesus Christ allowing Himself to "become" sin for us, in hopes that we might "become" the righteousness of God.

Adam and Eve gained a knowledge of Good and Evil by eating of the tree. God "weakened" His Word so that they would be able to "break" His Word, so that they could learn about evil without being destroyed by the Word.

 

Adam was not a type of anything.  He was made in God's image, and was made to create his children in his image -- which you as a man are capable of doing. 

Adam's life has nothing to do with Christianity except to point out that *original sin* came into being because of his disobedience.

Adam has nothing to do with Christianity?

1 Corinthians 15:45  And so it is written, The first man Adam was made a living soul; the last Adam was made a quickening spirit.

46  Howbeit that was not first which is spiritual, but that which is natural; and afterward that which is spiritual.

47  The first man is of the earth, earthy: the second man is the Lord from heaven.

48  As is the earthy, such are they also that are earthy: and as is the heavenly, such are they also that are heavenly.

49  And as we have borne the image of the earthy, we shall also bear the image of the heavenly.

I guess Paul didn't realize that Adam had nothing to do with Christianity.  
Jesus Christ was both Adams.  He took on the form of a man and "became" sin for us. This is pictured by His "eating" of the fruit.

Jesus Christ is also God in heaven who put off the old man of sin through death and is now seated on the throne of Heaven.

Adam has everything to do with Christianity.

I have a question for you -- since the only way Adam could be redeemed, do you believe when God made them coats of skins, that the blood sacrificed right then

made them acceptable for heaven?

 

 

When Adam believed what Satan said - he gave up what God had planned for Him.

To believe that God made Adam sin, is error in judgement.

2 Corinthians 5:21  For he hath made him to be sin for us, who knew no sin; that we might be made the righteousness of God in him.

This 2 Corinthians verse is talking about the Lord Jesus Christ, being made sin for us, and died on the Cross shedding His Blood, that through

Him (Jesus) we are made acceptable to God the Father.

 

 

All men now have a sin nature which they pass on to their offspring, because they have not learned how to walk and talk with God.

The sin nature was given to us by the first Adam. We got our bodies for the "first Adam".  

The sin nature was taken away from us by the Second Adam. We lost our bodies on the Cross.

God gave us a sin nature for a short amount of time.  We needed to learn some things by eating of the tree of knowledge, so we could understand good and evil.

After we learn this. There is no more need for the "body".

God is like a Doctor who inoculates his patient with a deadly disease. The Doctor doesn't want the patient to die. The Doctor needs the patient to develop a "resistance" to the disease. 

 

 

God is not like anything we know.  His Majesty is far beyond what we can imagine.

We don't get a *resistance* to anything.  You will sin until the day you die.

We are only made righteous by getting under the Blood of the Cross of Calvary and staying there.

It is not who we are, where we are, where we have been, or where we think we are going --it is the Blood

Covering making us *acceptable in the beloved* (Ephesians 1)

 

Therefore, since he sold his inheritance, the only way God can work in this world of ours,
is when we are saying *Thank You*, because "God lives in the praises of His People."

But nobody wants to praise a God that allowed Satan into the Garden unless they understand "Why". 

The *why* is given when Jesus was tempted by Satan before he started his ministry.  Satan offered him everything
this old world had to offer:  Kingdoms, tuning stones into bread, cast yourself to the ground as the angels have charge over you,

all these things will I give you, if you will fall down and worship me (Satan is speaking here).  Matthew 4.

So Satan, was in control of all these things.

Satan is only in "control" of cancer.  He is the Father of cancer. He is the one gathering the cells to rebel against the Head. He has quite a large crowd and it is growing.

Then if you believe this -- cure yourself and let us know that you can.

 

Satan is in control of all these things today, also.  We only have one way to get the power and presence of God Almighty into any

given situation of our life, and that is I Thessalonians 5:18 -- Be thankful for all things, for this is the will of God in Christ Jesus concerning you.*

Because God lives in the Praises of His People.  And Jesus only has authority on this earth, when we given HIM the authority by Praising

Him continually.  Psalm 22:3.

The ONLY way to get the power is to take up your Cross and follow the Lord Jesus Christ out of this world and into the next. 

And with this type of thinking -- you end up trying to be *good enough* in and of yourself, never knowing the peace, joy, etc. that comes

from *Praising the Name of Jesus* constantly and seeing miracles happen every day of your life.

 

Interesting how everything is so mixed up that we cannot discern the Truth, because Satan
is determined that we worship him instead of obeying what God said -- *Thou shalt have
no other god before me.* 

 

We should always worship what is right.  The Word is right!

Our problem in today's *Age of Grace* is that the Bible, the Word, has been so maligned, by mixing up law and grace,
that it has become *null and void*.

Show me a man who truly knows how to listen and do what the Lord is telling him to do, and I will show you an uncommon

man, doing what we consider uncommon things - loving everyone and not condemning anyone.

The Word is never wrong.

 

 

Fine -- then I will take a text out of context and throw it at you:

*eye for an eye, and tooth for a tooth* --

is this what you follow.

When you put it in context and take Matthew 5:28 and 29 together, (the Sermon on the Mount -- are the laws of the 1,000 year reign of Jesus which is prophesied to come)

you get what Jesus wants you to believe.

 

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[Dingbat]

On Sunday, April 6, 2014 8:08:47 AM UTC-4, thea wrote:

I have a question for you -- since the only way Adam could be redeemed, do you believe when God made them coats of skins, that the blood sacrificed right then

made them acceptable for heaven?

Do you believe that God doesn't have the ability to redeem without shedding blood?

 

 

When Adam believed what Satan said - he gave up what God had planned for Him.

To believe that God made Adam sin, is error in judgement.

 

If Adam's sin was necessary, mustn't his sin have been in accordance with God's plan?
 http://forums.catholic.com/showthread.php?t=444694

"O happy fault, O necessary sin of Adam, which gained for us so great a Redeemer!" 

[thea]

On Sun, Apr 6, 2014 at 8:12 AM, Dingbat <ranjit_...@yahoo.com> wrote:

On Sunday, April 6, 2014 8:08:47 AM UTC-4, thea wrote:

I have a question for you -- since the only way Adam could be redeemed, do you believe when God made them coats of skins, that the blood sacrificed right then

made them acceptable for heaven?

Do you believe that God doesn't have the ability to redeem without shedding blood?

Abel in Genesis 4 brought a *blood offering* when he sacrificed.  His twin brother Cain killed him

because of it.  Read Genesis 4.

And, so from the beginning of the Bible you have a *blood* offering for the remission of sins past.

However, we also learn throughout the Bible that you are not to sacrifice your children or yourselves,

as you are a particular subject that God loves.

When Jesus came to earth, God sacrificed His Son, that we don't have to kill animals anymore,

because we have His dying on Calvary as our Blood Covering.

thea


 

 

 

When Adam believed what Satan said - he gave up what God had planned for Him.

To believe that God made Adam sin, is error in judgement.

 

If Adam's sin was necessary, mustn't his sin have been in accordance with God's plan?
 http://forums.catholic.com/showthread.php?t=444694

"O happy fault, O necessary sin of Adam, which gained for us so great a Redeemer!" 

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[Dingbat]

On Monday, April 7, 2014 5:56:39 AM UTC-4, thea wrote:

On Sun, Apr 6, 2014 at 8:12 AM, Dingbat <ranjit_...@yahoo.com> wrote:

On Sunday, April 6, 2014 8:08:47 AM UTC-4, thea wrote:

I have a question for you -- since the only way Adam could be redeemed, do you believe when God made them coats of skins, that the blood sacrificed right then

made them acceptable for heaven?

Do you believe that God doesn't have the ability to redeem without shedding blood?

Abel in Genesis 4 brought a *blood offering* when he sacrificed.  His twin brother Cain killed him

because of it.  Read Genesis 4.

And, so from the beginning of the Bible you have a *blood* offering for the remission of sins past.

Genesis 4 doesn't say Abel's and Cain's made offerings in order to get sins remitted.
 

However, we also learn throughout the Bible that you are not to sacrifice your children or yourselves,

as you are a particular subject that God loves

Not throughout, since this says humans dedicated to the Lord must be sacrificed:
 Leviticus 27: 28-9 Notwithstanding no devoted thing, that a man shall devote unto the LORD of all that he hath, both of man and beast, and of the field of his possession, shall be sold or redeemed: every devoted thing is most holy unto the LORD. None devoted, which shall be devoted of men, shall be redeemed; but shall surely be put to death.

An example is the sacrifice of Jephthah's daugher.

.

When Jesus came to earth, God sacrificed His Son, that we don't have to kill animals anymore,

because we have His dying on Calvary as our Blood Covering.

Does Jesus agree with this? If so, how do you know he agrees?
 

[Loopflanger]

On Saturday, April 5, 2014 8:01:58 AM UTC-7, Smoley wrote:

Oh, it absolutely is a fact that the members of the Body must obey the Word and serve one another in love.

It's the will of Landru.  "Landru is gentle. It is the word of Landru".

[Only 3:26]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nZMuBIJxmnA

"Landru must die!"

[V]

That is a great question. If God is almighty and he knows what we are experiencing in pain. Why would he allow us to suffer? Why Does God Allow Suffering?

Has God caused the suffering in the world?

What issue was raised in the garden of Eden?

How will God undo the effects of human suffering?

Please notice the following article as to why God does allow suffering -> http://wol.jw.org/en/wol/d/r1/lp-e/1102005141

[e_space]

actually, its a silly question considering the ones usually asking it don't believe in your GOD ... what makes it a valid question is that no christian has a coherent answer ... 

[Dingbat]

On Monday, April 7, 2014 8:45:22 AM UTC-4, V wrote:

That is a great question. If God is almighty and he knows what we are experiencing in pain. Why would he allow us to suffer? Why Does God Allow Suffering?

Has God caused the suffering in the world?

If God ordered lambs killed or donkeys' necks broken, who other than God caused the suffering of those lambs and donkeys when men complied with his orders?

What issue was raised in the garden of Eden?

How will God undo the effects of human suffering?

Please notice the following article as to why God does allow suffering -> http://wol.jw.org/en/wol/d/r1/lp-e/1102005141

Is there an article on why God causes suffering of donkeys, lambs, snakes, etc.?

[Smoley]

On Monday, April 7, 2014 10:30:11 AM UTC-4, Dingbat wrote:

On Monday, April 7, 2014 8:45:22 AM UTC-4, V wrote:

That is a great question. If God is almighty and he knows what we are experiencing in pain. Why would he allow us to suffer? Why Does God Allow Suffering?

Has God caused the suffering in the world?

If God ordered lambs killed or donkeys' necks broken, who other than God caused the suffering of those lambs and donkeys when men complied with his orders?

God ordered the killing of the lamb in response to sin. If the people did not sin, then no blood would be shed.

Even when the people sinned, it was the lamb that was to die, not the people. If the lamb was not killed, then the donkey had to die.

Sin is cancerous and destructive. It is important that we understand that. All of these things are spiritual types of the consequences of "evil".

When we sin by rebelling against the Word, we reap death.  Cancer is a clear picture of this.  But we can also see that rebelling against the Word of "thou shalt not kill" sheds blood.  It happens all over the world. People not obeying the Word are shedding innocent blood.  This is the picture that we see here.

But all the unbelieving can see is that God broke His own word and "killed" an animal.  Can't you see how God's Word should not be broken by man or God?  It causes a bloody mess for us all.

The breaking of the Word, the killing of the lamb was the only way that we could understand the consequences of "sin".  

 

What issue was raised in the garden of Eden?

How will God undo the effects of human suffering?

Please notice the following article as to why God does allow suffering -> http://wol.jw.org/en/wol/d/r1/lp-e/1102005141

Is there an article on why God causes suffering of donkeys, lambs, snakes, etc.?

The Word will show you.  You understand that breaking the Word of "Thou shalt not kill" is bad, right?  You understand that not "loving thy neighbor" is bad, right?  You understand that God should uphold these Words and banish all that will not, right?

Well, He will very soon, but until then, we are all in school learning about "Good and Evil". By the time graduation comes, you will have enough "knowledge" to choose to serve one or the other.

Some will go to "evil" in the lake of fire. Some will go to 'good' in Heaven.

[Smoley]

On Sunday, April 6, 2014 9:12:33 AM UTC-4, Dingbat wrote:

On Sunday, April 6, 2014 8:08:47 AM UTC-4, thea wrote:

I have a question for you -- since the only way Adam could be redeemed, do you believe when God made them coats of skins, that the blood sacrificed right then

made them acceptable for heaven?

Do you believe that God doesn't have the ability to redeem without shedding blood?

God had the ability to "say" this is evil, but the picture is much clearer when you can experience it for yourself.  

God doesn't "say" only, and expect us to "believe".  He provides much evidence.

[Smoley]

On Sunday, April 6, 2014 8:08:47 AM UTC-4, thea wrote:

On Fri, Apr 4, 2014 at 4:01 PM, Smoley <smo...@earthlink.net> wrote:

On Friday, April 4, 2014 11:00:28 AM UTC-4, thea wrote:

On Thu, Apr 3, 2014 at 11:21 AM, Smoley <smo...@earthlink.net> wrote:

On Thursday, April 3, 2014 11:56:51 AM UTC-4, thea wrote:

On Wednesday, April 2, 2014 8:28:16 AM UTC-5, Smoley wrote:

If God is good, and God is omnipotent, then why doesn't He stop evil?

Haven't you heard how Adam sold his inheritance to Satan in the Garden of Eden when he ate what
God had specifically told him personally not to eat.

Where is this in the Word? God allowed Satan to overcome His Word and bring evil into the World, but other than that, Satan has no inheritance except the rebellious cancerous chaos that he lives by.

Adam had all control over his environment.  He walked and talked with God at the end of the day in the Garden of Eden.  He named all the animals.

He named all the plants, etc.

Adam had authority over all that he say.  He only had one commandment that said *don't do* -- and he disobeyed that one commandment.

Except His wife?

His wife was made (Genesis 3) after Adam was told not to eat.  His wife got it second hand from Adam that she was not to eat and second hand from the Snake.

In other words, Adam's wife was fooled because she did not directly hear God tell her not to eat.

Actually, I was making a little joke about how men have no control over their wives.

But since you brought it up.  Eve is a type of us. We did not understand "evil"  We didn't know that evil causes cancer.

Adam is a type of Christ who knew that evil is cancerous and destructive.  But Christ took the cancer upon Himself because He loved His wife.

Some say that Christ could have just explained about cancer to Eve. Does this work? When you tell your child that the stove is hot, does the child avoid the heat?  No, the child must find out for themselves the meaning of "hot" before the child "believes" in avoiding "hot". 

 

 

God allowed him to live, but kicked him out of the Garden so he could not get a hold of the *Tree of Life* or he would have lived forever in his new found fallen state.

By the way this is Genesis 3.

God needed man to eat of the tree of knowledge of Good and Evil. It was necessary that we find out the difference to the fullest extent possible. Even to the extent of the evil of death.  All evil needed to be known so that man could understand "why" to choose the Good.  
There is a difference between being told "evil" and knowing "evil".

Only if you believe that heaven needs you to fill up the space vacated by Satan and his angels, when he was kicked out.

And, that means that you will also have to believe that when Satan sinned (in and of himself) that there is no salvation for Satan.

I have no idea what you mean by this. 

Adam is a type of Jesus Christ allowing Himself to "become" sin for us, in hopes that we might "become" the righteousness of God.

Adam and Eve gained a knowledge of Good and Evil by eating of the tree. God "weakened" His Word so that they would be able to "break" His Word, so that they could learn about evil without being destroyed by the Word.

 

Adam was not a type of anything.  He was made in God's image, and was made to create his children in his image -- which you as a man are capable of doing. 

Adam's life has nothing to do with Christianity except to point out that *original sin* came into being because of his disobedience.

Adam has nothing to do with Christianity?

1 Corinthians 15:45  And so it is written, The first man Adam was made a living soul; the last Adam was made a quickening spirit.

46  Howbeit that was not first which is spiritual, but that which is natural; and afterward that which is spiritual.

47  The first man is of the earth, earthy: the second man is the Lord from heaven.

48  As is the earthy, such are they also that are earthy: and as is the heavenly, such are they also that are heavenly.

49  And as we have borne the image of the earthy, we shall also bear the image of the heavenly.

I guess Paul didn't realize that Adam had nothing to do with Christianity.  
Jesus Christ was both Adams.  He took on the form of a man and "became" sin for us. This is pictured by His "eating" of the fruit.

Jesus Christ is also God in heaven who put off the old man of sin through death and is now seated on the throne of Heaven.

Adam has everything to do with Christianity.

 

I have a question for you -- since the only way Adam could be redeemed, do you believe when God made them coats of skins, that the blood sacrificed right then

made them acceptable for heaven?

I believe that God started class right there. He shed the blood, and that was the first lesson on "evil" that Adam and Eve learned.

Galatians 3:24  Wherefore the law was our schoolmaster to bring us unto Christ, that we might be justified by faith.

25  But after that faith is come, we are no longer under a schoolmaster. 

We are all in school, learning about "good" and "evil".  When we "believe" the Word, then we have graduated.  Just like when the child learns what "hot" is you no longer need to "teach" him.

He will now "believe" on his own, it's burned into his very existence.  The faith of the parent is now the faith of the child.

 

 

When Adam believed what Satan said - he gave up what God had planned for Him.

To believe that God made Adam sin, is error in judgement.

2 Corinthians 5:21  For he hath made him to be sin for us, who knew no sin; that we might be made the righteousness of God in him.

This 2 Corinthians verse is talking about the Lord Jesus Christ, being made sin for us, and died on the Cross shedding His Blood, that through

Him (Jesus) we are made acceptable to God the Father.

 John 14:9  Jesus saith unto him, Have I been so long time with you, and yet hast thou not known me, Philip? he that hath seen me hath seen the Father..

1 John 5:7  For there are three that bear record in heaven, the Father, the Word, and the Holy Ghost: and these three are one.

John 1:14  And the Word was made flesh, and dwelt among us, (and we beheld his glory, the glory as of the only begotten of the Father,) full of grace and truth.

 

 

All men now have a sin nature which they pass on to their offspring, because they have not learned how to walk and talk with God.

The sin nature was given to us by the first Adam. We got our bodies for the "first Adam".  

The sin nature was taken away from us by the Second Adam. We lost our bodies on the Cross.

God gave us a sin nature for a short amount of time.  We needed to learn some things by eating of the tree of knowledge, so we could understand good and evil.

After we learn this. There is no more need for the "body".

God is like a Doctor who inoculates his patient with a deadly disease. The Doctor doesn't want the patient to die. The Doctor needs the patient to develop a "resistance" to the disease. 

 

 

God is not like anything we know.  His Majesty is far beyond what we can imagine.

We don't get a *resistance* to anything.  You will sin until the day you die.

We are only made righteous by getting under the Blood of the Cross of Calvary and staying there.

It is not who we are, where we are, where we have been, or where we think we are going --it is the Blood

Covering making us *acceptable in the beloved* (Ephesians 1)

I believe you have a very shallow understanding of the Word.  Of course we will sin until the day we die, but it is by the death of these sinful bodies that we are able to escape sin and "become" the righteousness of God in our new sinless bodies.  It is by going through the "blood" that we are able to understand what "sin" is and to learn to refuse it. Without the shedding of blood there is NO remission of sins. That's because until sin caused the shedding of innocent blood, we did not understand the wickedness of it.  That is why we must go through the blood. 

You need to think more about your faith, because you have no reason to believe what you believe. Many people in the church carry on in your condition until one day they leave the church. Why? because their roots do not go deep in their faith. They only have a shallow "belief". 

 

 

Therefore, since he sold his inheritance, the only way God can work in this world of ours,
is when we are saying *Thank You*, because "God lives in the praises of His People."

But nobody wants to praise a God that allowed Satan into the Garden unless they understand "Why". 

The *why* is given when Jesus was tempted by Satan before he started his ministry.  Satan offered him everything
this old world had to offer:  Kingdoms, tuning stones into bread, cast yourself to the ground as the angels have charge over you,

all these things will I give you, if you will fall down and worship me (Satan is speaking here).  Matthew 4.

So Satan, was in control of all these things.

Satan is only in "control" of cancer.  He is the Father of cancer. He is the one gathering the cells to rebel against the Head. He has quite a large crowd and it is growing.

Then if you believe this -- cure yourself and let us know that you can.

The Word is the cure.  Cancer can only be cured by magnifying the Word, by coming to the Word to be "rewritten" by the Word of His righteousness. We must give up the corruption of our own way, and come to the Word for righteousness. 

 

Satan is in control of all these things today, also.  We only have one way to get the power and presence of God Almighty into any

given situation of our life, and that is I Thessalonians 5:18 -- Be thankful for all things, for this is the will of God in Christ Jesus concerning you.*

Because God lives in the Praises of His People.  And Jesus only has authority on this earth, when we given HIM the authority by Praising

Him continually.  Psalm 22:3.

The ONLY way to get the power is to take up your Cross and follow the Lord Jesus Christ out of this world and into the next. 

And with this type of thinking -- you end up trying to be *good enough* in and of yourself, never knowing the peace, joy, etc. that comes

from *Praising the Name of Jesus* constantly and seeing miracles happen every day of your life.

Salvation is by faith, given to us as a free gift when we believe the truth of the Word that was given. The miracle of the resurrection will bring eternal peace and joy, because we will be cancer free there. 

 

Interesting how everything is so mixed up that we cannot discern the Truth, because Satan
is determined that we worship him instead of obeying what God said -- *Thou shalt have
no other god before me.* 

 

We should always worship what is right.  The Word is right!

Our problem in today's *Age of Grace* is that the Bible, the Word, has been so maligned, by mixing up law and grace,
that it has become *null and void*.

Show me a man who truly knows how to listen and do what the Lord is telling him to do, and I will show you an uncommon

man, doing what we consider uncommon things - loving everyone and not condemning anyone.

The Word is never wrong.

 

 

Fine -- then I will take a text out of context and throw it at you:

*eye for an eye, and tooth for a tooth* --

is this what you follow.

When you put it in context and take Matthew 5:28 and 29 together, (the Sermon on the Mount -- are the laws of the 1,000 year reign of Jesus which is prophesied to come)

you get what Jesus wants you to believe.

 

The thousand year reign is a time when the Word is magnified above all.  Thou shalt no kill and thou shalt love thy neighbor as thyself will rule supreme with a "rod of iron".  

So, I agree with you here.  You poke someone's eye out then, and you will have your own eye poked out. 

You want to be cancerous, then you will be filled with cancer.

 

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[Dingbat]

On Monday, April 7, 2014 12:21:09 PM UTC-4, Smoley wrote:

On Monday, April 7, 2014 10:30:11 AM UTC-4, Dingbat wrote:

On Monday, April 7, 2014 8:45:22 AM UTC-4, V wrote:

Has God caused the suffering in the world?

If God ordered lambs killed or donkeys' necks broken, who other than God caused the suffering of those lambs and donkeys when men complied with his orders?

God ordered the killing of the lamb in response to sin.

Wrong. In Exodus 34, he wants a first born baby donkey or (lamb as a substitute) killed because first born animals belong to him, not because of any sin.

“The first offspring of every womb belongs to me, including all the firstborn males of your livestock, whether from herd or flock. Redeem the firstborn donkey with a lamb, but if you do not redeem it, break its neck. - Exodus 34:10-20

[Smoley]

On Monday, April 7, 2014 2:42:01 PM UTC-4, Dingbat wrote:

On Monday, April 7, 2014 12:21:09 PM UTC-4, Smoley wrote:

On Monday, April 7, 2014 10:30:11 AM UTC-4, Dingbat wrote:

On Monday, April 7, 2014 8:45:22 AM UTC-4, V wrote:

Has God caused the suffering in the world?

If God ordered lambs killed or donkeys' necks broken, who other than God caused the suffering of those lambs and donkeys when men complied with his orders?

God ordered the killing of the lamb in response to sin.

Exodus 34:19  All that openeth the matrix is mine; and every firstling among thy cattle, whether ox or sheep, that is male.

20  But the firstling of an ass thou shalt redeem with a lamb: and if thou redeem him not, then shalt thou break his neck. All the firstborn of thy sons thou shalt redeem. And none shall appear before me empty.

It's a picture of the Cross.  Many times in the Bible Jesus is referred to as "The Lamb that was slain."  He is also referred to as the 'Word' "that was slain. Or the "handwriting of ordinances against us".

The picture is the lamb being slain so that the "ass" doesn't have to be slain. The Word that was against us, was nailed to the cross,"taken out of the way" so that we might live long enough to learn the difference between Good an evil. Otherwise sin and rebellion would be "judged" immediately by the power of the Word.

But why does this matter to an atheist?  Do you think killing is wrong?  Should one who kills be killed? What should be done with God then?

[Loopflanger]

On Monday, April 7, 2014 5:45:22 AM UTC-7, V wrote:

 Why Does God Allow Suffering?

Because he doesn't exist. There are real explanations for suffering so why bother with this god character in the first place?
 

[Loopflanger]

On Monday, April 7, 2014 5:45:22 AM UTC-7, V wrote:

 Why Does God Allow Suffering?

[Loopflanger]

On Monday, April 7, 2014 9:21:09 AM UTC-7, Smoley wrote:

God ordered the killing of the lamb in response to sin.

Isn't wasting food,  a sin?

 

[Hippie]

On Thursday, April 3, 2014 11:15:03 AM UTC-4, Steve in Virginia wrote:

You're right it's not rocket science - it's an ugly, inhumane, misogynist, violent, superstition that sees humankind as some kind of indelible stain on the universe.  Frankly, anyone who believes this vile, lunacy needs serious psychiatric counseling and probably long-term medication.   One of the things that eventually allowed me to break with Christianity, aside from its obsessive-compulsive fixation with death and suffering, is the endless recurring theme of blood-sacrifice and the need to constantly propitiate this vengeful, jealous, vindictive, murdering psychotic entity or face eternal damnation.

Frankly, I've never understood how the religious can in one breath go on and on about how they "love" their fellow man and in another breath pronounce that every non-believers has a one-way, first-class ticket on the hell-bound train.  The they do it with the same infantile glee usually reserved for a 4-year old who has managed to successfully snatch a handful of M&M's from the candy jar and secretly wolfed them down without mommy knowing it, just before dinner. 

Truthfully, I'd have more respect for the religious if they just said, "You non-believers can all go fuck yourselves.  We're right and you're all gonna die horrible and burn in hell forever.  God loves only the people who believe the way we do and if you're not with us you're against us.  Period.  It's just too damn bad we can't drag your, atheist, agnostic, humanist, logical, rational, bible-criticizing, scientific method, materialist, questioning asses out into the public square and burn you alive like we could in the good old days."  At least the religious would be honest about who they are and they wouldn't have to constantly pretend sufferance towards people they either openly revile or secretly despise but are forced by dogma, social convention or law to cloak their passive-aggression behind a mask of piety and false tolerance.

Steve

Steve that is the best reply I've ever read. It's so true and not sopposed to be funny, but I cant stop laughing. WOW!

 

On Thursday, April 3, 2014 9:12:57 AM UTC-4, Smoley wrote:

On Thursday, April 3, 2014 8:47:03 AM UTC-4, Dingbat wrote:

On Thursday, April 3, 2014 8:35:27 AM UTC-4, Smoley wrote:

On Thursday, April 3, 2014 2:52:27 AM UTC-4, Dingbat wrote:

On Wednesday, April 2, 2014 9:28:16 AM UTC-4, Smoley wrote:

If God is good, and God is omnipotent, then why doesn't He stop evil?

Does God merely ALLOW evil deeds or does God also ORDER/ CAUSE evil deeds? In Exodus 34, does God ALLOW baby donkeys' necks to be broken or does God ASK FOR baby donkey's necks to be broken?

He asked for the lamb to be slain so the donkey could go free.  If the lamb was not slain then the donkey must be slain.

Whether a lamb or donkey, some animal gets killed, for no good reason.

That's what happens when there is no law, when there is no right or wrong.  Are you saying that the Word, "Thou Shalt not Kill" should have been upheld?

That's good, because when the Word reigns supreme, you will be the first to bow your knee to it.  You have learned the difference between "Good and Evil" and you now understand that the Word is Good.

 

The lamb being a type of the Word.  We know this because Jesus Christ is compared to both. He was the Word, and He was the Lamb.

The only way that the "Ass" could be set free is by slaying the Word that was "contrary" to the "Ass".

Unless God is limited in his ability, there is another way for the donkey to be free - by God not demanding its life.

God humbled Himself. When this happened, it limited His ability.  He had the ability to prevent murders, but He took the backseat for little bit.  Waiting on you to bow the knee to His Word, so you can be put back into the perfect garden. 

 

If the Word had not been forsaken, as Jesus Christ was, then no "Ass" would live.

Because, the Word/Law/Righteousness can not allow for cancer to kill and destroy. Only by forsaking the Law of righteousness(for a short time) could God allow sin to "live".

Breaking a baby donkey's neck or killing a lamb in its place has nothing to do with rigteousness or sin. The donkey's neck is broken so God can claim that he owns it. Alternatively, a lamb is killed in the place in order to buy the donkey from God. Why does God need to own donkeys or sell donkeys and why does he demand payment in blood?

You say breaking the baby donkey's neck and killing a lamb has nothing to do with sin?  Then what is the problem?

God already owns the donkey. He already owns the lamb. His word created them. Without His word, they would not live.  DNA is necessary for life.  He gave them life when He gave them the Word.

He killed the Word, and they lost their life.  This isn't rocket science.

[thea]

Smoley:

I am aware of one thing.  I am in my 70's.  I do not take any kind of drug.

I am not in any pain whatever.

I have good health.  But I also watch what I put in my mouth.  I also watch

to be careful not to hurt myself - as I am one of those that moves too fast for
old bones to keep up with.

i also know that when I start to hurt, I immediately say, "Pain, be gone in the

Name of Jesus Christ of Nazareth."  And pain always leaves.

So I do know that God the Father of our Lord Jesus Christ heals today without some

extraordinary pastor of some kind standing over you.

Have you ever heard of Thanking Jesus all the Time so HE can work in this world.

God does not have the power to do anything on earth, because Adam gave His

authority away.

God lives in the Praises of those who will say, Thank You, and gives all blessings

all the time, when we Praise the Name of Jesus Christ.

thea

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[Smoley]

On Thursday, April 17, 2014 12:14:56 PM UTC-4, thea wrote:

Smoley:

I am aware of one thing.  I am in my 70's.  I do not take any kind of drug.

I am not in any pain whatever.

I have good health.  But I also watch what I put in my mouth.  I also watch

to be careful not to hurt myself - as I am one of those that moves too fast for
old bones to keep up with.

i also know that when I start to hurt, I immediately say, "Pain, be gone in the

Name of Jesus Christ of Nazareth."  And pain always leaves.

So I do know that God the Father of our Lord Jesus Christ heals today without some

extraordinary pastor of some kind standing over you.

Have you ever heard of Thanking Jesus all the Time so HE can work in this world.

God does not have the power to do anything on earth, because Adam gave His

authority away.

God lives in the Praises of those who will say, Thank You, and gives all blessings

all the time, when we Praise the Name of Jesus Christ.

thea

Well, it is good to see someone that is actually thanking God for life and goodness.

 

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[e_space]

On Thursday, April 17, 2014 10:09:47 PM UTC-4, Smoley wrote:

On Thursday, April 17, 2014 12:14:56 PM UTC-4, thea wrote:

Smoley:

I am aware of one thing.  I am in my 70's.  I do not take any kind of drug.

I am not in any pain whatever.

I have good health.  But I also watch what I put in my mouth.  I also watch

to be careful not to hurt myself - as I am one of those that moves too fast for
old bones to keep up with.

i also know that when I start to hurt, I immediately say, "Pain, be gone in the

Name of Jesus Christ of Nazareth."  And pain always leaves.

So I do know that God the Father of our Lord Jesus Christ heals today without some

extraordinary pastor of some kind standing over you.

Have you ever heard of Thanking Jesus all the Time so HE can work in this world.

God does not have the power to do anything on earth, because Adam gave His

authority away.

God lives in the Praises of those who will say, Thank You, and gives all blessings

all the time, when we Praise the Name of Jesus Christ.

thea

Well, it is good to see someone that is actually thanking God for life and goodness.

yep ... there are still some brainwashed people around ... don't believe me? just check the closest mirror ... 

[thea]

e_space:

How are you today.

Do you know how much longer you are going to be alive on planet earth?

Do you have a destiny in mind for eternity?

I live today, and maybe be gone tomorrow, but I know who holds my tomorrows

in His Hand, and am confident that HE will take me home to be with HIM for
all eternity.

thea

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[e_space]

i have a pulse, so i guess i'm okay ... thanks for asking ... your confidence is reassuring ... to yourself ... i'm glad you find comfort in your belief, hope and faith ... i don't know for sure what will happen after i die ... i guess i will find out, or not ... unlike you however, i will not speculate, or claim to know ... i do have a concept of a 'spiritual' energy, but it is FAR FAR FAR removed from your GOD concept, which i find to be a laughable concoction of man made stories designed to brainwash individuals through fear and intimidation ... you know what i mean, don't you? ;-^)

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[thea]

Thank you for answering, e_space.

Yes I know what you mean.

I believe that we all, in whatever we believe, were brainwashed into seeing life as we live it.

The brainwashing that is now taking place on TV and in the newspapers, etc. is interesting

to watch.

If the Bible is True - GOD IS LOVE.

Premise is true:   God is Love and HE sent His Son that we all would be accepted by

Him, not for what we have done,  but what He did to redeem us back to Himself.

Quite a story, as the Bible also says:

*Every man shall bow and confess that Jesus is Lord of Lords, and King of Kings.*

I have found through growing up in a parsonage, that there were many things expected of
me, just because I was the preacher's kid, PK, (not a goat, a child).  And, when I learned

to turn loose of all the have to's, I discovered that Jesus didn't demand anything from us

except that we say, *Thank You, Jesus*, for everything.

In watching life go bye, I have found that I have peace, joy and contentment, in whatever
state of affairs I find myself in, because I thoroughly believe that my life amounts to something

as I Praise the Name of Jesus.  A miracle is always just around the next corner.

To live without an anchor of faith in something (nothing is also an anchor), I feel that mankind

can achieve much more.

thea

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[Dingbat]

On Thursday, April 17, 2014 12:14:56 PM UTC-4, thea wrote:

i also know that when I start to hurt, I immediately say, "Pain, be gone in the

Name of Jesus Christ of Nazareth."  And pain always leaves.

Do you never use painkillers? Would you undergo surgery without anaesthetic? 

[e_space]

On Saturday, April 19, 2014 9:03:44 AM UTC-4, thea wrote:

Thank you for answering, e_space.

Yes I know what you mean.

I believe that we all, in whatever we believe, were brainwashed into seeing life as we live it.

The brainwashing that is now taking place on TV and in the newspapers, etc. is interesting

to watch.

no all people rely on what they are told by others to come to their conclusions ... as it relates to "spirit", one must do this alone ... which, it seems, virtually no one does ... 

 

If the Bible is True - GOD IS LOVE.

Premise is true:   God is Love and HE sent His Son that we all would be accepted by

Him, not for what we have done,  but what He did to redeem us back to Himself.

Quite a story, as the Bible also says:

*Every man shall bow and confess that Jesus is Lord of Lords, and King of Kings.*

I have found through growing up in a parsonage, that there were many things expected of
me, just because I was the preacher's kid, PK, (not a goat, a child).  And, when I learned

to turn loose of all the have to's, I discovered that Jesus didn't demand anything from us

except that we say, *Thank You, Jesus*, for everything.

In watching life go bye, I have found that I have peace, joy and contentment, in whatever
state of affairs I find myself in, because I thoroughly believe that my life amounts to something

as I Praise the Name of Jesus.  A miracle is always just around the next corner.

To live without an anchor of faith in something (nothing is also an anchor), I feel that mankind

can achieve much more.

you are reliant on what you have been told for your anchor ... build your own is my suggestion ... 

 

thea

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[thea]

On Mon, Apr 21, 2014 at 4:54 AM, e_space <espac...@gmail.com> wrote:

On Saturday, April 19, 2014 9:03:44 AM UTC-4, thea wrote:

Thank you for answering, e_space.

Yes I know what you mean.

I believe that we all, in whatever we believe, were brainwashed into seeing life as we live it.

The brainwashing that is now taking place on TV and in the newspapers, etc. is interesting

to watch.

no all people rely on what they are told by others to come to their conclusions ... as it relates to "spirit", one must do this alone ... which, it seems, virtually no one does ... 

e_space, I came to this conclusion about 40 some years ago when I realized that *pastors* could only spout what their denomination wanted them

to say in order to get their retirement from the denomination.

It was an interesting time for me to realize that I didn't need a *church* telling me anything -- I could get on my knees and ask God to show me
what the Bible said - and I would be taught from the Bible how it goes together - and how fabulous a book it really is.

The genealogy of Jesus is interesting in that you are seeing stories of what happened in peoples lives a long time ago.  However, they have

never applied to us in the here and now - and that is where the *church* and it's witches brew have caused all sorts of problems.

thea

 

If the Bible is True - GOD IS LOVE.

Premise is true:   God is Love and HE sent His Son that we all would be accepted by

Him, not for what we have done,  but what He did to redeem us back to Himself.

Quite a story, as the Bible also says:

*Every man shall bow and confess that Jesus is Lord of Lords, and King of Kings.*

I have found through growing up in a parsonage, that there were many things expected of
me, just because I was the preacher's kid, PK, (not a goat, a child).  And, when I learned

to turn loose of all the have to's, I discovered that Jesus didn't demand anything from us

except that we say, *Thank You, Jesus*, for everything.

In watching life go bye, I have found that I have peace, joy and contentment, in whatever
state of affairs I find myself in, because I thoroughly believe that my life amounts to something

as I Praise the Name of Jesus.  A miracle is always just around the next corner.

To live without an anchor of faith in something (nothing is also an anchor), I feel that mankind

can achieve much more.

you are reliant on what you have been told for your anchor ... build your own is my suggestion ... 

 

Thanking the God and Father of our Lord Jesus Christ for teaching me that *no human being* can give the whole truth to you all the time.

When I discovered the error of Romans 1:21 that KJV Scofield was giving, that everyone bows down to, I knew that I could not
depend on anything anyone told me. 

If I don't see it, I don't know it.

Reminds me of Philosophy 101 where you are immediately told you *know nothing*.

thea

 

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[e_space]

On Monday, April 21, 2014 9:53:28 AM UTC-4, thea wrote:

On Mon, Apr 21, 2014 at 4:54 AM, e_space <espac...@gmail.com> wrote:

On Saturday, April 19, 2014 9:03:44 AM UTC-4, thea wrote:

Thank you for answering, e_space.

Yes I know what you mean.

I believe that we all, in whatever we believe, were brainwashed into seeing life as we live it.

The brainwashing that is now taking place on TV and in the newspapers, etc. is interesting

to watch.

no all people rely on what they are told by others to come to their conclusions ... as it relates to "spirit", one must do this alone ... which, it seems, virtually no one does ... 

e_space, I came to this conclusion about 40 some years ago when I realized that *pastors* could only spout what their denomination wanted them

to say in order to get their retirement from the denomination.

It was an interesting time for me to realize that I didn't need a *church* telling me anything -- I could get on my knees and ask God to show me
what the Bible said - and I would be taught from the Bible how it goes together - and how fabulous a book it really is.

The genealogy of Jesus is interesting in that you are seeing stories of what happened in peoples lives a long time ago.  However, they have

never applied to us in the here and now - and that is where the *church* and it's witches brew have caused all sorts of problems.

the "bible" and the "church" relate to "religion" ... i was talking about "spirit" ... this has NOTHING to do with religion ... religion bastardizes spiritual concepts ... it doesn't lead to it, or enhance it in any way ... nothing of any value has been written about spirit ... you either are in touch with it through your own desire and efforts, or not ... a book surely will not lead you there ... in other words, the bible holds no interest or value for me ... 

 

thea

</div

...

[Dingbat]

On Monday, April 21, 2014 9:53:28 AM UTC-4, thea wrote:

e_space, I came to this conclusion about 40 some years ago when I realized that *pastors* could only spout what their denomination wanted them

to say in order to get their retirement from the denomination.

It was an interesting time for me to realize that I didn't need a *church* telling me anything -- I could get on my knees and ask God to show me
what the Bible said - and I would be taught from the Bible how it goes together - and how fabulous a book it really is.

What would happen if you were to get down on your knees and ask God to show you what the Koran says, be taught from the Koran how it goes together, and how fabulous a book the Koran really is? Would God oblige? Well, he didn't oblige you the first time, since you once admitted that you learnt your dispensationalist theology from a dispensationalist preacher (i.e., that you didn't learn it from God). 

[Observer]

On Thursday, April 3, 2014 12:09:54 PM UTC-7, Smoley wrote:

On Thursday, April 3, 2014 1:09:13 PM UTC-4, Dingbat wrote:


On Thursday, April 3, 2014 9:12:57 AM UTC-4, Smoley wrote:


On Thursday, April 3, 2014 8:47:03 AM UTC-4, Dingbat wrote:


On Thursday, April 3, 2014 8:35:27 AM UTC-4, Smoley wrote:


On Thursday, April 3, 2014 2:52:27 AM UTC-4, Dingbat wrote:

On Wednesday, April 2, 2014 9:28:16 AM UTC-4, Smoley wrote:
If God is good, and God is omnipotent, then why doesn't He stop evil?

Does God merely ALLOW evil deeds or does God also ORDER/ CAUSE evil deeds? In Exodus 34, does God ALLOW baby donkeys' necks to be broken or does God ASK FOR baby donkey's necks to be broken?

He asked for the lamb to be slain so the donkey could go free. If the lamb was not slain then the donkey must be slain.

Whether a lamb or donkey, some animal gets killed, for no good reason.

That's what happens when there is no law, when there is no right or wrong.

If God is under no law, then what makes him good?

Smoley wrote:

Galatians 5:14 For all the law is fulfilled in one word, even in this; Thou shalt love thy neighbour as thyself.

Observer

The above the seven words, incidentally, which like most of what you cut-and-paste is an absurdity, unless change is made to the meaning of the word love to accommodate your superstitious predispositions.

Smoley wrote: this

15 But if ye bite and devour one another, take heed that ye be not consumed one of another.

Observer

WTF? No lesson here at all, just more mindless crap.

Smoley wrote:

But Is it good for God to enforce this law(Word) in heaven or not?

Observer

More absurdities. Why you believe in the God thing, especially this horrific,lidiotic, sadistic and obviously stupid one conceptualized only in the minds of Christian ideologues, is left by you completely unexplained.

It must be assumed that you used some intellectual process which rendered you do vulnerable such a stupid belief.

Why don't you explain it to us what were the steps which seduced you in the believing the nonsense of Christianity?

If you cannot explain it, and you cannot justify it, then in the mind of anyone capable of rational thought it must be dismissed as meaningless psychopathy.

V
Everyone is complaining about how bad things on earth are. There is famine and sickness and murder and rape and evil.
Would ANY of those things exist if the Word of Galatians 5:14 was highly exalted so that ALL things were brought into subjection to it?

You don't like God when He KILLS things, do you? What about when people kill things?. What about bacteria not loving their neighbor as themselves?. Or cancer cells?

You are CONDEMNING God for not making His creation obey the Word? Don't you think that's a little bit hypocritical? You want God to enforce the rules with power?

Smoley wrote:
You want God to give you water and food,

Observer

Not at all. I simply want water, and food, enough to satisfy my needs, and which is available to me in the natural world by natural processes without recourse to the stupid idea that this Christian God thing has anything to do with it

Smoley wrote:
but you yourself aren't going to give anyone else food or water.

Observer

You, dimwit, accuse without cause and with absolutely no information as to how I behave in relation to my fellow man.

You are indeed a stupid fuck.

Smoley wrote:

You want God to care more about you, than He does Himself, but you don't want God telling YOU to do that, do you?

Observer

Look you, simpleminded oaf, lacking all belief n your,dumb ass,idea of a God thing, how would it be possible for me to want what I expect to be nonexistent to do anything?


Smoley wrote:
This life has nothing to do with God's goodness or badness, because it is all about the Word. Haven't you read the Bible? Didn't you see where Jesus Christ is the Word? The Word was made lower than God, but in the end The Word was exalted above EVERY name!

Observer

I have read what you call " the word" and found it not only inadequate, but steeped in psychopathy, violent admonitions and abject superstition.

Smoley wrote:
Are you saying that the Word, "Thou Shalt not Kill" should have been upheld?
That's good, because when the Word reigns supreme, you will be the first to bow your knee to it. You have learned the difference between "Good and Evil" and you now understand that the Word is Good.

Observer

It's kind of fun to have you around here as new supply so many things for us to laugh at.

The ideas and good and evil are best described as follows:

Good is that which the oserver judges to be beneficial and evil is that which he or she thinks to be in some way threatening. These are clearly constructs of the human mind and have no validity other than as indicated above.




How do you determine whether the Word is good, evil, both or neither?


Smoley wrote:
By your own mouth you have declared the killing of animals to be "evil". How did you determine that? Is the Word that says, "Thou shalt not kill." good or bad?

Observer

Look at the definitions of good and evil above.

Smoley wrote:
The lamb being a type of the Word. We know this because Jesus Christ is compared to both. He was the Word, and He was the Lamb.

Observer

If indeed this poor itinerant preacher ever existed, he would just a diluted man unable to grasp the functions of reality, much less to describe them, blical nonsense notwithstanding .

Should you ever attain a useful education inclusive of but not restricted to physical sciences prhaps you might be loose from the bonds of this psychotic superstitious filth and become able to think and reason for yourself.

At present we remained not rather than uneducated oaf trapped in a dangerous and violence, producing meme which must be expunged from human consciousness. If we are to survive as a species.

The only way that the "Ass" could be set free is by slaying the Word that was "contrary" to the "Ass".

Unless God is limited in his ability, there is another way for the donkey to be free - by God not demanding its life.

Smoley wrote:
God humbled Himself. When this happened, it limited His ability. He had the ability to prevent murders, but He took the backseat for little bit. Waiting on you to bow the knee to His Word, so you can be put back into the perfect garden.

Observer

There is no extra biblical evidence that either this idiotic concept of a "God thing "is real, or that it ever committed any act in or upon this universe, nor that it is in any way necessary to explain the existence or functions of said universe.

Conversely science has provided data extremely useful in approximating what is and is not probable and descriptive of the universal functions.

If the Word had not been forsaken, as Jesus Christ was, then no "Ass" would live.

Smoley wrote:

Because, the Word/Law/Righteousness can not allow for cancer to kill and destroy. Only by forsaking the Law of righteousness(for a short time) could God allow sin to "live".

Observer

That is absolutely hilarious. Damn you made me spill my coffee.

Breaking a baby donkey's neck or killing a lamb in its place has nothing to do with rigteousness or sin. The donkey's neck is broken so God can claim that he owns it. Alternatively, a lamb is killed in the place in order to buy the donkey from God. Why does God need to own donkeys or sell donkeys and why does he demand payment in blood?

You say breaking the baby donkey's neck and killing a lamb has nothing to do with sin? Then what is the problem?

Smoley wrote:
Evil is the problem under discussion.

Observer

See the definitions of good and evil, I posted above.


Sin is the breaking of the Word. The Word says, "Thou shalt not kill". Killing is a sin and it is evil.

Unless you can provide evidence or even inference produced of the combined use of logic reason scientific method, a reasonable reliance on the produce thereof, and tempered by the clear and concise rules of critical thinking,for the existence of this dumb ass Christian idea of a*God thing*, then you cannot establish that such as sin ever existed (in that sin is supposed to be in rebellion against this God thing, for which no evidence using the above intellectual tools, has ever been forthcoming.)

God already owns the donkey.

If God does evil to creatures he owns, then God causes evil, doesn't he? That law applies only to first born donkeys. Who owns second born donkeys?

Smoley wrote: thanks

Then you are beginning to see why God should never turn His back on "Thou shalt not kill", right? I'm not sure if you are getting this. It is highly important that the world understand that they do NOT WANT God turning His back on His Word. It doesn't help anybody to trod the Word under our feet, does it? It isn't good for God and it isn't good for us.

Observer

Not only does it do good to denigrate this psychotic superstitious filth, but it is necessary to the survival of our species that we reject completely what flys in the face of all data produced by the use of the, above-mentioned, tools of intellectual inquiry.

Psychonomist 

Smoley wrote:

You keep trying to pin some evil on God, but God took it upon Himself already. He turned His back on the Word and took sin upon Himself, why? Because you needed to see what sin really looks like. You needed to understand that you reap what you sow. If you disregard the law, then God will disregard the Law.

God leveled the playing field here, and not because He hates you, but because you needed to get a good look at evil. You needed to gain the knowledge of Good and Evil.

And with that knowledge you should humble yourself before the Word. You should glorify the Word and be thankful that God will soon exalt that Word even above Himself, so that all things will be in subjection to the Word. This is the conclusion of the matter.

He already owns the lamb. His word created them. Without His word, they would not live. DNA is necessary for life. He gave them life when He gave them the Word.

He killed the Word, and they lost their life. This isn't rocket science.

Is "God causes/ does evil" rocket science?

Then you should join God in exalting the Word. You should reconcile yourself with the Creator and humble yourself before the Word. This is the only Way that ANYONE can enter into Heaven's glory.
God isn't holding evil against anybody. That isn't why we go to the lake of fire. We go because we refuse to humble ourselves and become obedient to the Word.

Jesus Christ(The Word made flesh) is the only way to heaven.

John 14:6 Jesus saith unto him, I am the way, the truth, and the life: no man cometh unto the Father, but by me.

[John Stockwell]

>If God is good, and God is omnipotent, then why doesn't He stop evil?

For the same reason that Superman doesn't stop Al Quaeda.

What is evil?

Humans are dangerous. We call people who are deliberately dangerous "evil".

The universe has never been safe.

-John

[thea]

On Mon, Apr 21, 2014 at 9:08 AM, e_space <espac...@gmail.com> wrote:

On Monday, April 21, 2014 9:53:28 AM UTC-4, thea wrote:

On Mon, Apr 21, 2014 at 4:54 AM, e_space <espac...@gmail.com> wrote:

On Saturday, April 19, 2014 9:03:44 AM UTC-4, thea wrote:

Thank you for answering, e_space.

Yes I know what you mean.

I believe that we all, in whatever we believe, were brainwashed into seeing life as we live it.

The brainwashing that is now taking place on TV and in the newspapers, etc. is interesting

to watch.

no all people rely on what they are told by others to come to their conclusions ... as it relates to "spirit", one must do this alone ... which, it seems, virtually no one does ... 

e_space, I came to this conclusion about 40 some years ago when I realized that *pastors* could only spout what their denomination wanted them

to say in order to get their retirement from the denomination.

It was an interesting time for me to realize that I didn't need a *church* telling me anything -- I could get on my knees and ask God to show me
what the Bible said - and I would be taught from the Bible how it goes together - and how fabulous a book it really is.

The genealogy of Jesus is interesting in that you are seeing stories of what happened in peoples lives a long time ago.  However, they have

never applied to us in the here and now - and that is where the *church* and it's witches brew have caused all sorts of problems.

the "bible" and the "church" relate to "religion" ... i was talking about "spirit" ... this has NOTHING to do with religion ... religion bastardizes spiritual concepts ... it doesn't lead to it, or enhance it in any way ... nothing of any value has been written about spirit ... you either are in touch with it through your own desire and efforts, or not ... a book surely will not lead you there ... in other words, the bible holds no interest or value for me ... 

 

God is to be worshiped in *spirit* and in *truth*.

And, I agree that there is a certain *knowing* of the *spirit* when something is true or false.

It is called being *sensitive*.

And, I agree that this *knowing* is an inner something, that we can only become aware of when we are searching

for ourselves, by ourselves for that something that fulfills the deepest longings of our *so called souls*.

thea

 

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[Dingbat]

On Monday, April 7, 2014 2:57:40 PM UTC-4, Smoley wrote:

On Monday, April 7, 2014 2:42:01 PM UTC-4, Dingbat wrote:

On Monday, April 7, 2014 12:21:09 PM UTC-4, Smoley wrote:

On Monday, April 7, 2014 10:30:11 AM UTC-4, Dingbat wrote:

On Monday, April 7, 2014 8:45:22 AM UTC-4, V wrote:

Has God caused the suffering in the world?

If God ordered lambs killed or donkeys' necks broken, who other than God caused the suffering of those lambs and donkeys when men complied with his orders?

God ordered the killing of the lamb in response to sin.

Exodus 34:19  All that openeth the matrix is mine; and every firstling among thy cattle, whether ox or sheep, that is male.

20  But the firstling of an ass thou shalt redeem with a lamb: and if thou redeem him not, then shalt thou break his neck. All the firstborn of thy sons thou shalt redeem. And none shall appear before me empty.

It's a picture of the Cross.  Many times in the Bible Jesus is referred to as "The Lamb that was slain."  He is also referred to as the 'Word' "that was slain. Or the "handwriting of ordinances against us".

The picture is the lamb being slain so that the "ass" doesn't have to be slain. The Word that was against us, was nailed to the cross,"taken out of the way" so that we might live long enough to learn the difference between Good an evil. Otherwise sin and rebellion would be "judged" immediately by the power of the Word.

But why does this matter to an atheist?  Do you think killing is wrong?  Should one who kills be killed? What should be done with God then?

Why does it not matter to a theist if God kills for fun?