To Nwada MsJoe: Ebele On A Political Prowl? Army not with Buhari's origin...

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Jan 3, 2015, 10:51:15 PM1/3/15
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Nwada MsJoe,
I just saw your two rejoinders below, so let me sum up my position as follows:
 
(i) As prescribed by the Nigerian constitution, General Buhari is academically qualified to be president.
 
(ii) The constitution's prescription, with respect to education, is in section 131(d) and it reads: "he [candidate for president] has been educated up to at least School Certificate level or its equivalent.
 
(iii) The constitution does not mandate the possession of a school certificate, it merely mandates an educational level equivalent to it. In other words, a person who sat for the school certificate and scored F9 in all subjects is eligible to run for president -- that the person flunked did not remove the fact that he/she had been educated up to that stage. The key message from the framers of the constitution is level of education, not the successful obtaining of a certificate at the end of that education.
 
(iv) Whether Buhari passed the school certificate examination or not, at the point of his joining the army, there is no doubt that he was educated up to school certificate level and that fulfils the constitutional requirement -- there is a big difference between level of education and certificates obtainment at that level or at any other level.
 
(vi) Every course attended by Buhari while a cadet and years after his commissioning as an officer was superior to school certificate level education. These course takings progressed over the years, such that I do not doubt those who claim that his cumulative educational attainment while in the military is a Master's degree equivalent.
 
(vii) Colin Powell went into the army with a university degree, Buhari went with a school certificate level education but their progression in the army (with respect to rank promotions) mirrored each other. If they were once classmates at the War College, as you indicated, they would still obtain the same certificate upon completion except that, with Powell's MBA degree, certain courses taken by Buhari would have been waived for him (this comparison of Buhari and Powell is borderline false equivalence drawing; commissioned officers in the US armed forces are almost always holders of university degrees).
 
(viii) My disappointment with my fellow Buharites is that they are minimizing the import of Buhari's obligation to forward his certificates to INEC. They are also proffering specious excuses in fending off legitimate and reasoned critics (not the irredeemable idiots who fabricate anything and everything, however unintelligent, against Buhari).
 
(iv) "Ebele On A Political Prowl?" is not diversionary, it is a cautionary call to the Buhari team, to not fall into the president's renown cleverness in using his opponents political untidy steps to vanquish them. INEC cannot disqualify Buhari if his certificates are not verified but can an election tribunal quash his anticipated election victory over a lack of proper certificates' verification? Except to Ayo and those running the campaign, it makes no sense taking a chance to find that out.
 
Time constraint insists that I stop here for now. My clarification notwithstanding, your piece remains excellent.
 
Happy New Year, dear.      
 

Nebukadineze Adiele
Reject Religion; Revive Reasoning!
 
In a message dated 1/3/2015 7:32:30 P.M. Eastern Standard Time, msjo...@aol.com writes:
Uncle Ayo:

If there is  a formal  challenge to the truthfulness of Buhari's submission to the INEC, yes the INEC will revert the matter to the party. As of now, there is no information about a formal objection.  Why don't you find out from the INEC to know whether what I have written about the process is untrue?

After the initial jab from PDP and counter weighing from the erudite Professor Osibanjo for APC VP, less has been heard from the official camps. The lob and counter lob via mainstream and alternative media, waterholes, etc. resulted from Buhari's manner of submission of his qualification.  If there is a challenge, this  can be resolved when he gets the  certificate from where he says  it is being kept. He can also do so without a challenge.  

Let me ask you something. You may require  a prospective employee to submit his/her resume and the person complies. Since you have to rely on the accuracy of the claims, will you, in your correct senses, hold fast to your position  that the prospective employee has complied and fit to be hired if there are questions on material deficiencies in the resume? Let us say you require at least a paralegal certification, even if someone has taken courses in an astronaut program,  will that person not explain the relevance to your minimum expectation? So why are  Buharists  fueling rather than settling the question? 

The content standards of the military training can be compared (curriculum mapping) with WAEC's to see whether the military officer acquired the content,  knowledge, and skills of people fit for higher education. It could even be determined whether the military training surpassed WAEC's standards. For example, climbing the mountains in drilling could be Physical Education. What could be  Math, Geography, English, Chemistry, etc. in the military school? What exactly are successful graduates to know and be able to do in each discipline, which is the performance standard.

  You see, Uncle Ayo, there is no need to harp on the obvious. The contention is not whether Buhari is clever or competent  to be head of state  in a civilian democracy. If there is no comparable certification, he may have moved up the military ladder by means removed from minimum academic proficiency. There are military brasses in third world places who cannot write a concept paper. If they are normal and sober, they hire skilled technocrats. It also happens in civilian quarters.  For example, Gambia's Yayah Jammeh's official title is His Excellency Sheik Professor Alhaji Doctor Yayah A. JJ Jammeh. This change happened after he dropped his earlier additions of Babili Mansa and Nasirudeen.  The hired aides normalize the eccentricities, including demonstrative sessions on how the president  "cures HIV/AIDS." Would the election board count that as medical education?

 With much hope and optimism, I look forward to a cerebral debate between Buhari and Jonathan.

Lol, what do you mean you know  that I have more important things for Africa and humanity? Hahaha,  is  Nigeria not in Africa and are the citizens not humans? This is very important. It is not a futile waste of time. Nigeria is a pivotal giant of Africa with domestic and foreign relations ramification, and Africa's ascendancy  in the global dispensation. We have to know that whoever leads  at this time in the 21st century is acquainted with basic civilization and instinctive ability to reason rationally. What is more elementary than just respecting the requirement?  It is also a mentality case. 

Let me digress to explain the mentality issue. When Yar'adua failed to constitutionally transfer power to  Jonathan before he went unconscious in Saudi Arabia, the executive paralysis was palpable. The painfully hapless VP was legally restricted as various agitators in the republic called for practical measures. In the fluid dynamics, the potential for military mischief could not be discounted with a constitutional crisis.  A person with a typical khaki mentality could have  gambled with a plausible right to power and ignore the legislature whose role was silent in the constitution.  The averted chaos is left to imagination. Nigerians proved the nascent democracy was there to stay. You see why at least a secondary, non-military education is not a useless requirement? lol, lol, lol.  Some of the online commentaries and Vin's di wan kill me with laff. Sometimes humor is good for the soul.

Uncle Ayo, stay blessed, and have a productive 2015.
MsJoe
To Lead You Must be a Servant
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From: pachusim <pach...@yahoo.com>
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Sent: Sat, Jan 3, 2015 2:08 pm
Subject: Re: Ms Joe: Re: Ebele On A Political Prowl? Army not with Buhari's original certificates.
Aye:

You must be kidding, right?

Sent from my LG G Pad 7.0 LTE, an AT&T 4G LTE tablet
"The INEC accepts sworn affidavits to the effect that the candidate meets the requirement.  It is not the job of the INEC to pick quarrel and disqualify a candidate who does not bring the physical certificate. However, when a formal  objection is raised, the INEC will have to send the matter to the party to address/redress. It cannot stick to the challenged affidavit." . . . . Ms Joe

Ms Joe,

Has "a formal objection" been raised?
Yes, "it is an issue of compliance", and Buhari has complied.
Why then "has (it) become  no small source of amusement to watchers of African follies"?

I know you have important things you do with your time for Africa and humanity. I am surprised you joined time wasters to waste your time. Questioning academic qualification of a retired General, a former Head of State who has contested for the same position three times in the past, under the same qualification requirements is what "has become no small source of amusement to watchers of African follies".
 
Ayo Ojutalayo

My dear Neb:
 
 Your candidate's camp can deep six what has become  no small source of amusement to watchers of African follies. This is not to say a candidate has no sense or more sense; it is an issue of compliance.  As a learned person, you will admit that your guy's team  has to come up with a precise answer  since the constitution, which he aspires to swear that he will uphold,  requires a minimum certificate as evidence of having passed a  standardized, secondary school terminal exam.  It has to do with  content and performance standards.  
 
At his disposal, Buhari has means to prove that when he could have been in secondary school in Nigeria,   he  did,  took the terminal exam that was administered in the day and was a successful  student.  It is very simple. If he did not attain a secondary school certificate,  a more complicated explanation or alternative assessment can still be broken down for the polity. There is no need for APC to try to obscure the saliency of the point with digressionary questions like: Ebele on a Political Prowl? Well, Ebele is not the author that section of the constitution.
 
Yes, you are right. The INEC accepts sworn affidavits to the effect that the candidate meets the requirement.  It is not the job of the INEC to pick quarrel and disqualify a candidate who does not bring the physical certificate. However, when a formal  objection is raised, the INEC will have to send the matter to the party to address/redress. It cannot stick to the challenged affidavit.
 
If Buhari does not have the minimum certificate, entry to the Nigerian military may not have required a secondary education or it was waived for some. There is no supernatural explanation. The INEC does not have the same powers to  waive the qualification for a civilian, public office by military reasoning. Therein lies the  problem. It is the onus of the Buhari campaign to produce evidence of an equivalent secondary school certificate or more.
 
Training that does not require any academic prerequisite or qualification may not  meet the letter of the law. For example, if the Nigerian military sends its officers for a specific  course, the receiving  institution will not be asking how the people qualified as brigadiers and other soldierly titles in their own countries in the first place.   In that short stay, the soldiers do not follow a regular college curriculum. Just like professional enhancements, one has to qualify for the profession. Whatever on-going training is not a substitute for the minimum qualification to obtain the position. While at it, one may even learn new trade.
 
 Someone mentioned that Buhari went to the same program with the retired four star general in the US Army, former National Security Advisor, former Chairman of the Joint Chiefs of Staff and former US Secretary of State Colin Powell. This  even strengthens  the argument against Buhari's contention. Powell graduated from high school in Bronx, NY; received a BS degree in geology from the City College, NY; and an MBA from George Washington University. The military training was not his academic qualification.
 
If we follow your argument, nothing stops anyone from taking any training and declaring that the stipulated academic requirement  to run for public office is irrelevant. That is anarchical tendency. lol. Usually, the admitting institution will  formally assess the credentials of the incoming student to determine if they meet or exceed admission requirements. But if Buhari went through his own schooling and training where nothing of sort was required, does he intend to turn the law upside down at the expense of national sanity? 
 
Stay blessed and take care,
MsJoe
.
 
 
 
cannot be more simple than that.
 
 
 
 
 
that or he does not.
 
 
 equivalence of the secondary school WAEC?
 
 
an academic gateway.
 
 
. any
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
In a message dated 1/3/2015 1:28:56 A.M. Eastern Standard Time, TalkN...@yahoogroups.com writes:
 
Don't make any plans for the inauguration of Buhari as president of Nigeria. It will not happen. Gbam!

And I am

Ezeana Igirigi Achusim
Odi-Isaa
Nwa Dim Orioha 


On Saturday, January 3, 2015 12:15 AM, "Ezeana Igirigi Achusim pach...@yahoo.com [NaijaObserver]" > wrote:


 
Nwanna:

The certificate saga will be rendered moot after February 14, 2015. If there was a chance Buhari will prevail on February 14, 2015, the certificates issue would not have been raised until after the election to keep him from taking office. The issue was brought up at this time to increase the margin of the arse whooping on February 14, 2015. Watch for more damning disclosures as the election date approaches. Don't make any plans for the inauguration of Buhari as president of Nigeria. It will not happen. 

And I am

Ezeana Igirigi Achusim
Odi-Isaa
Nwa Dim Orioha 

Sent from my iPhone

On Jan 2, 2015, at 11:07 PM, Nebuka...@aol.com [TalkNigeria] <TalkN...@yahoogroups.com> wrote:

 
  • Furthermore, in the unlikely event Buhari wins, there’s a real risk PDP will go to court to challenge his eligibility to be president. His election could then be nullified. Nafata
 
I am certain that Buhari's imminent victory in February will not be an unlikely event, but the sentiment expressed by Nafata, with respect to PDP overturning his victory at the courts based on lack of qualification, is correct and it is one of my concerns over this certificate issue. Anyone who thinks that it is going to be swept under the carpet is just not being in reality. If it is not dealt with now, satisfactorily I might add, the consequences will still be felt even after the elections. 
 
I do not like the manner with which this certificate issue has been handled. My dislike for the way it has been handled has been heightened by Army's denial of holding any certificates of Buhari's. If we assume that the Army holds the certificates, what stopped the General's handlers from sending photocopies (alongside the affidavit) to INEC?
 
Even if General Buhari does not have the constitution's  minimum education requirement for president (high school diploma) as rumored by the usual suspects, the aggregate of all his military training courses has far surpassed WASC -- as a matter of fact, a rank of General is in the league of PhD holding (it is an expert level rank in the Army, just as is a PhD in civilian life). General Buhari's handlers should immediately forward all certificates of his to INEC today, not tomorrow! If the certificates are lost, then an affidavit to that effect should be sworn forthwith and transmitted to INEC.
 
It will be a travesty if Buhari fails to become our next president through disqualification. Pastor Joe has been consistent in his claim that president Jonathan is an expert at using the powers of the presidency (not tyrannically, but cunningly) to vanquish political opponents. Indeed, Ebele has an impeccable track record in so doing and I smell that this certificategate is another of such shrewd political overkill. If there is any fishiness in General Buhari's education and certifications, it seems to me that Ebele has found it and is milking it for a political knockout. PDP's sudden branding of Buhari, a whole retired General of the Nigerian army, as "a semi-illiterate" must have been informed by something not visible to everybody. I hope that they are wrong.
 
That a man as administratively clueless as president Jonathan could be this daredevilry in political marksmanship makes me wanna holler! The clueless-ness going on with Buhari's certificates submission must be rectified now because, if the shoe was on the other foot, I would have raised hell by now and so would have other Buharites done too. We are not hypocrites, so let us correct ourselves now. 
 

Nebukadineze Adiele
Reject Religion; Revive Reasoning!
 
In a message dated 1/2/2015 11:06:02 P.M. Eastern Standard Time, vin_mo...@yahoo.com writes:
Secondly, our constitution only requires a minimum of secondary school certification for presidential candidates, not army certification.
Let Buhari produce evidence he properly graduated from a secondary school. I say this with all seriousness because I’m aware of soldiers who went on courses abroad, but only had standard six primary school certification. The military academies abroad train whatever soldiers we send them. They leave it to our military to select candidates.
 
  

Alagba Nafata

It is taking too long to produce this WAEC.
Ayo says that he AYO has seen it , that Buhari has one.
INEC has not seen it.
Army has not seen it.

APC and Buhari are holding back on us.

Yes OoOo. We keep sending potential coup plotters  for Political discussion.

All the courses Buhari went to are each less than six months and are not Diploma courses.

Buhari should  go to Onibolaje at palmgroove and Ikorodu road and print out something.

Chicago state will do.

Hint...
He joined cadet 1962...
please GOD should help before he produces a 1970 WAEC  papers.
vin.....///
....Born to tell the truth
....they are listening indeed
... thick walls will  fall


On Friday, January 2, 2015 10:03 PM, "Nafata Bamaguje bama...@googlemail.com [talkhard]" <talk...@yahoogroups.com> wrote:


 
“Try to learn how the Nigerian Army handles training and certification of its officers. A soldier that graduates from NMC, Aldershot, Sandhurst, or Carlise is not awarded a certificate which he keeps unlike attendance at a civilian university at the officer's own initiative” – Stevek
 
You are missing the point here. First Buhari unintelligently told a blatant lie that has been debunked by our Army.
If you have issues with the Army’s statement, take it up with them, not with me. Perhaps Buhari expected his army buddies to back him up and not publicly disgrace him.
 
Secondly, our constitution only requires a minimum of secondary school certification for presidential candidates, not army certification.
Let Buhari produce evidence he properly graduated from a secondary school. I say this with all seriousness because I’m aware of soldiers who went on courses abroad, but only had standard six primary school certification. The military academies abroad train whatever soldiers we send them. They leave it to our military to select candidates.
 
Admittedly, standard six back then was above what obtains today. Nonetheless, Buhari should comply with the letter of the law, after all you are marketing him as a principled “rule of law” candidate.
 
Furthermore, in the unlikely event Buhari wins, there’s a real risk PDP will go to court to challenge his eligibility to be president. His election could then be nullified.
APC is well advised to dump Buhari and save itself that embarrassment.

If I were PDP, I won’t wait till the election, but will get someone to file a suit challenging Buhari’s suitability for office. Even if Buhari is eventually cleared, he would have been distracted from campaign for weeks… tied down in the court. Many of his supporters will then go to the polls believing Buhari has been disqualified.
 
“What's with you anyway? Why don't you try to find out about these kind of things before you start maligning and villifying?” - Stevek
 
You are the one who hasn’t bothered to read the Vanguard report of Army denial. Take your own advice and read the news report before commenting.
 
Nafata




From: Stevek stev...@yahoo.com [talkhard] <talk...@yahoogroups.com>
Date: Sat, Jan 3, 2015 at 1:00 AM
Subject: Re: [talkhard] Army not with Buhari’s original copies of certificates
To: "talk...@yahoogroups.com" <talk...@yahoogroups.com>, Bring your baseball bat <naijao...@yahoogroups.com>, "NIgerianW...@yahoogroups.com" <NIgerianW...@yahoogroups.com>, "Niger...@yahoogroups.com" <Niger...@yahoogroups.com>


 
Nafata,
Try to learn how the Nigerian Army handles training and certification of its officers.
A soldier that graduates from NMC, Aldershot, Sandhurst, or Carlise is not awarded a certificate which he keeps unlike attendance at a civilian university at the officer's own initiative.
The record of the soldier's course and graduation is sent to unit clerk of the soldier's unit which is then communicated to the Nigerian Army Pay and Records Office for the record.
What's with you anyway? Why don't you try to find out about these kind of things before you start maligning and villifying?
From:"Nafata Bamaguje bama...@googlemail.com [talkhard]" <talk...@yahoogroups.com>
Date:Fri, Jan 2, 2015 at 6:39 PM
Subject:[talkhard] Army not with Buhari’s original copies of certificates

 

“Few days after the former Head of State and Presidential candidate of the All Progressives Congress, APC, Major General Muhammadu Buhari, rtd explained in an affidavit submitted to the Independent National Electoral Commission, INEC, that all his academic credentials were with the Military Board, the Army have stated that they do not keep the certificates of any serving or retired officer or soldier” – Vanguard
 
It’s not looking good for the supposedly upright and principled General Buhari to be caught in such a barefaced lie.
It does not at all speak well of his intelligence to tell a blatant lie, which can easily be disproved.
What does he take Nigerians for? Unthinking mindless automatons like his worshipful followers who would uncritically accept anything he says?
Doesn’t he have professional publicists to advise him on how to handle embarrassing situations like this?
Is that how he will run the country in the unlikely event he wins 2015 election… embarrass the nation with avoidable gaffes and even more cluelessness than Jonathan?
 
Because of the violent nature of Buhari’s supporters, INEC overlooked the General’s lack of basic qualifications in previous elections.
Now the electoral body which is statutorily mandated to ensure candidates meet election requirements, has disingenuously passed the buck… insulting our intelligence that it is APC’s responsibility.
Really? If political parties are responsible for verifying candidates’ credentials, they can present any illiterate and claim his/her credentials have been verified.
It’s time for APC to pull the plug on Buhari, and spare the nation further embarrassment.
 
Nafata



 




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Ayo Ojutalayo

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Jan 3, 2015, 11:18:26 PM1/3/15
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"INEC cannot disqualify Buhari if his certificates are not verified but can an election tribunal quash his anticipated election victory over a lack of proper certificates' verification? Except to Ayo and those running the campaign, it makes no sense taking a chance to find that out." . . . . Nebukadineze Adiele 

I am surprised that an Attorney would think an election tribunal can quash an election victory because INEC did not sight the certificates of the winner (not that the winner was not academically qualified). The surprise becomes annoying because this is someone that is ordinarily a Buhari supporter. His unlawyerly writings can therefore confuse other Buhari supporters.
 
Ayo Ojutalayo

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Oderaigbo

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This acute idiot called Nebuchadnezzar is a complete disgrace to Igbo nation,then i am sure that his kinsmen may have placed a certain curse on him and say ZUZURU GABA .
When he opens his mouth to talk ,you find out he reasons through the anus.
Bia this ikwurigba called Nebu ,you are not the only man that failed in everything you tried in life ,so stop trying to make yourself to be heard .
Now zuzu pua ebea ikwurigba
 
Mazi Odera
Truth is our standard,accept it in good faith or
we shove it down your throat.The Choice is yours.
I am off but on


Ayo Ojutalayo

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An Attorney does not depend on abuse and vulgar words to win a debate the way Nebu does. He is quick to identify a dumb person, an an idiot etc etc instead of marshaling points to convince his readers. 
 
Ayo Ojutalayo

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Subject: Re: [africanworldforum] To Nwada MsJoe: Ebele On A Political Prowl? Army not with Buhari's origin...

Wilson Iguade

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"An Attorney does not depend on abuse and vulgar words to win a debate the way Nebu does."
By Ayo Ojutalayo

Ayo,

You are indeed a true LIAR or just saying stuffs you have no facts about. Based on your quote above, please identify where, what jurisdiction is Nebu "an attorney"?

Ayo, you have repeatedly qualified Nebu as "an attorney", please provide the evidence that Nebu is "an attorney". Name the law school and or the jurisdiction that licensed Nebu as "an attorney"?

Ayo, you are truly a demented person, and you are truly an example of what is WRONG with Nigeria, you just make up shit to deceive people as you are making up lies about Buhari and making up lies about Nebu - you know very very well you are lying to deceive this audience.

Ayo, everything about you I am beginning to see are lies lies and more lies, and you are a major advocate of Buhari. You exhibit your lies, which makes the worst of Buhari. Seriously, your character as shown here and your conduct really is harming Buhari.

Shame me, Wilson Iguade, tell us the basis for repeatedly calling Nebu "an attorney" when he is ABSOLUTELY NOT an attorney and you know this. Tufiaka 


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