Prahlada's Advaitic realization - Vishnu Purana

[V Subrahmanian]

Here is an article on the above topic:

English version: 

https://adbhutam.wordpress.com/wp-content/uploads/2021/06/e-am-pralhada-advaita-grp-english-.pdf


Kannada version:

https://adbhutam.wordpress.com/wp-content/uploads/2021/05/prahlada-advaita-grp.pdf

regards

subbu

[Bhaskar YR]

praNAms

Hare Krishna

 

Just curious to know how uttama adhikAri-s of Advaita sAdhana would explain this advaitic realization of bhakta-s like prahlAda, rAmakrishna parama haMsa, hanuman etc. coz. for them Ishwara is just a by-product of thick and dense avidyA in jeeva and there is NO Ishwara at all in Advaita paramArtha jnAna!!  It can be noted that as per uttama adhikAri-s of Advaita,  it is not just Ishwara jeeva abedha, it is total denial of Ishwaraastitva as it is just jeeva’s avidyAkruta product!! 

 

Hari Hari Hari Bol!!!

bhaskar

 

[V Subrahmanian]

The Bhāgavatam replies:

Jnanis who have nothing pāramārthik to gain out of it; yet they are overwhelmed by the guṇa-s of Īśvara (which also they know are a-pāramārthika):

आत्मारामाश्च मुनयो निर्ग्रन्था अप्युरूक्रमे। कुर्वन्त्यहैतुकीं भक्तिमित्थंभूतगणो हरिः।।भागवत 1/6/19  

Those relishing the Atman, free from bondage (or no dependence on books), display great devotion to Ishwara without any apparent reason.  The grandeur of Hari's captivating gunas compels the attention of even such Jnanis.  

regards

subbu

 

Hari Hari Hari Bol!!!

bhaskar

 

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[Bhaskar YR]

Those relishing the Atman, free from bondage (or no dependence on books), display great devotion to Ishwara without any apparent reason.

 

praNAms Hare Krishna

 

Thanks for the clarification.  But have you not read the vyAkhyAna in Advaita saMpradAya which says Ishwara is just a product of thick ajnAna / avidyA of the jeeva who cannot elevate himself to the highest truth of Advaita ??  and the concept of Ishwara not meant for uttama adhikAri-s and it is just for the tyro-s and intermediate aspirants??  Seeing the Ishwara in everything is second to that highest jnAna and it is also a sort of ajnAna only as per some dry logicians who have the conviction that Ishwara’s role in Advaita jnAna is quite mute when the front bench sAdhaka is logically quite capable of deducing this paramArtha jnAna without the help of Ishwara. 

 

And you know it is not sarcasm of any sort, as you yourself witnessed statements like this in this very forum.

 

Hari Hari Hari Bol!!

bhaskar

[Sudhanshu Shekhar]

Hare Krishna Bhaskar prabhu ji.

Just curious to know how uttama adhikAri-s of Advaita sAdhana would explain this advaitic realization of bhakta-s like prahlAda, rAmakrishna parama haMsa, hanuman etc. coz. for them Ishwara is just a by-product of thick and dense avidyA in jeeva and there is NO Ishwara at all in Advaita paramArtha jnAna!!  It can be noted that as per uttama adhikAri-s of Advaita,  it is not just Ishwara jeeva abedha, it is total denial of Ishwaraastitva as it is just jeeva’s avidyAkruta product!!

You did not pay attention to the crucial part of the siddhānta of eka-jīva-vāda which says that there have been no jñānīs ever. 

All such references which include mukti, bhakti etc are arthavāda and intended for the eulogy of Brahma-vidyā.

When one discards the entire seen as a dream, these questions are answered easily.

Māṇḍūkyakārikā may be referred to where all the jīvās seen now are equated to jīvās seen in dream.

And it should not be dismissed that these are from paramārtha. The following statement by Āchārya may be paid special attention:

व्यवहारसत्यविषये जीवानां जन्ममरणादिः स्वप्नादिजीववदित्युक्तम् । उत्तमं तु परमार्थसत्यं न कश्चिज्जायते जीव इति ।

So, it is the so called vyāvahārika jīvās which are equated with dream-jīvās. Now, we know that there are no other jīvās in dream other than me. Rest should be clear.

Also see the following:

जाग्रतो दृश्या जीवाः तच्चित्ताव्यतिरिक्ताः, चित्तेक्षणीयत्वात् , स्वप्नदृक्चित्तेक्षणीयजीववत् । [4.66]

The jīvās seen in waking are non-different from citta, on account of being seen by citta, like the jīvās seen by citta-of-swapna-dr̥k. 

न हि स्वप्ने हस्ती हस्तिचित्तं वा विद्यते ; तथा इहापि विवेकिनामित्यभिप्रायः। [4.67]

In a dream, there exists neither the elephant nor the citta-of-elephant. Similarly, here also is the case for people with discrimination. This is the purport.

यथा स्वप्नमयो जीवो जायते म्रियतेऽपि च ।तथा जीवा अमी सर्वे भवन्ति न भवन्ति च ॥ [4.68]

Just as jīvās in a dream take birth and also die, similarly all these jīvās (in waking) appear and disappear. 

यथा मायामयो जीवो जायते म्रियतेऽपि च । तथा जीवा अमी सर्वे भवन्ति न भवन्ति च ॥ [4.69]

Just as jīvās conjured by magic take birth and also die, similarly all these jīvās (in waking) appear and disappear. 

यथा निर्मितको जीवो जायते म्रियतेऽपि च । तथा जीवा अमी सर्वे भवन्ति न भवन्ति च ॥ [4.70]

Just as jīvās conjured by medicines and charms take birth and also die, similarly all these jīvās (in waking) appear and disappear.

मायामयः मायाविना यः कृतो निर्मितकः मन्त्रौषध्यादिभिर्निष्पादितः । स्वप्नमायानिर्मितका अण्डजादयो जीवा यथा जायन्ते म्रियन्ते च, तथा मनुष्यादिलक्षणा अविद्यमाना एव चित्तविकल्पनामात्रा इत्यर्थः ॥ [4.70]

Māyāmayaḥ (of 4.69) means that which is created by a magician. Nirmitakaḥ (of 4.70) means that which is created by mantra and medicine. Such jīvās created by dream, magic, medicine or charms, born of eggs etc take birth and die. Similarly, these jīvās such as humans etc are non-existent and are merely the vibrations of mind.

न कश्चिज्जायते जीवः सम्भवोऽस्य न विद्यते । एतत्तदुत्तमं सत्यं यत्र किञ्चिन्न जायते ॥ [4.71]

No jīva whatsoever is ever born. There is no source of it. This is that highest truth where nothing whatsoever is born. 

व्यवहारसत्यविषये जीवानां जन्ममरणादिः स्वप्नादिजीववदित्युक्तम् । उत्तमं तु परमार्थसत्यं न कश्चिज्जायते जीव इति । उक्तार्थमन्यत् ॥ [4.71]

The birth and death etc of (waking) jīvās was stated to be like the birth and death of jīvās created by dream-magic-medicine. That was stated only within the ambit of vyāvahārika-satya. The highest pāramārthika-satya is this alone that no jīva whatsoever is born.

Regards.

Sudhanshu Shekhar.

[Bhaskar YR]

praNAms Sri Sudhanshu prabhuji

Hare Krishna

 

You did not pay attention to the crucial part of the siddhānta of eka-jīva-vāda which says that there have been no jñānīs ever. 

 

• So being an uttama adhikAri you know that there is no jnAni, no Achaarya, no Ishwara, no shAstra and no saMpradAya and it is only you as eka jeeva has the firm conviction that you are the ONLY Chaitanya on this earth and just imagining all these things/characters due to your avidyA right??  And in short you being an eka jeeva does not need any Ishwara kAruNya, nor Acharya upadesha ( since there have been NO  JNANI-s whatsoever) all you just need is a sharp intellect and logical inferences to realize this ultimate truth.  Am I correct prabhuji??

[Sudhanshu Shekhar]

Hare Krishna Prabhu ji..

So being an uttama adhikAri you know that there is no jnAni, no Achaarya, no Ishwara, no shAstra and no saMpradAya and it is only you as eka jeeva has the firm conviction that you are the ONLY Chaitanya on this earth and just imagining all these things/characters due to your avidyA right?? 

Yes. 

And in short you being an eka jeeva does not need any Ishwara kAruNya, nor Acharya upadesha ( since there have been NO  JNANI-s whatsoever)

I need all of this. I not only imagine Īśwara/Guru/śāstra, but I also imagine the requirement of Īśwara-kāruṇya, Guru-upadeśa, śāstra-prāmāṇya, sampradāya. Just as I did in the dream. This seen is just a dream. Just as in dream, not only I imagined an Ishwara who created that dream-world, but also the requirement of Īśwara-kāruṇya, similarly now.

all you just need is a sharp intellect and logical inferences to realize this ultimate truth.  Am I correct prabhuji??

Mind is needed to understand intellectually the truth that all seen is illusory. Once this knowledge is firm without any sort of pratibandhaka whatsoever, one drops all seen, be it whatever. The connection-with-seen is also a seen.

So, one situates in present moment, without paying any attention to any seen.

Regards.

Sudhanshu Shekhar.

[V Subrahmanian]

Please read the Bhashya for the two Bh.Gita verses given below and the translation  here:  https://archive.org/details/GEDy_bhagavad-gita-bhashya-of-shankaracharya-with-translation-by-dr.-a.-g-krishna-war/page/198/mode/2up

Also, in the Brahma Sutra Bhashya 2.1.14, Shankara says: 

तदेवमविद्यात्मकोपाधिपरिच्छेदापेक्षमेवेश्वरस्येश्वरत्वं सर्वज्ञत्वं सर्वशक्तित्वं च, न परमार्थतो विद्यया अपास्तसर्वोपाधिस्वरूपे आत्मनि ईशित्रीशितव्यसर्वज्ञत्वादिव्यवहार उपपद्यते ।

Thus God's rulership, omnis- cience, and omnipotence are contingent on the limiting adjuncts conjured up by nescience; but not so in reality can such terms as "the ruler", "the ruled", "omniscience", etc., be used with regard to the Self shining in Its own nature after the removal of all limiting adjuncts through illumination.  

Shankara goes on to cite shruti and the Gita verses mentioned below in support of the above. 

Thus, the shruti and the Bh.gita and the Brahma Sutra already state that the concept of Ishwara is not paramarthika and Shankara has well addressed this point.  Post-Shankara Advaitins base everything they say firmly on the Shruti, Smriti, Sutra and Bhagavatpada. They have not said anything that wasn't already stated in these sources. 

regards

subbu    

 

किञ्च—

न कर्तृत्वं न कर्माणि लोकस्य सृजति प्रभुः ।
न कर्मफलसंयोगं स्वभावस्तु प्रवर्तते ॥ १४ ॥ Bh.Gita 5.14 

न कर्तृत्वं स्वतः कुरु इति नापि कर्माणि रथघटप्रासादादीनि ईप्सिततमानि लोकस्य सृजति उत्पादयति प्रभुः आत्मा । नापि रथादि कृतवतः तत्फलेन संयोगं न कर्मफलसंयोगम् । यदि किञ्चिदपि स्वतः न करोति न कारयति च देही, कः तर्हि कुर्वन् कारयंश्च प्रवर्तते इति, उच्यते — स्वभावस्तु स्वो भावः स्वभावः अविद्यालक्षणा प्रकृतिः माया प्रवर्तते ‘दैवी हि’ (भ. गी. ७ । १४) इत्यादिना वक्ष्यमाणा ॥ १४ ॥

परमार्थतस्तु —

नादत्ते कस्यचित्पापं न चैव सुकृतं विभुः ।
अज्ञानेनावृतं ज्ञानं तेन मुह्यन्ति जन्तवः ॥ १५ ॥  BG 5.15

न आदत्ते न च गृह्णाति भक्तस्यापि कस्यचित् पापम् । न चैव आदत्ते सुकृतं भक्तैः प्रयुक्तं विभुः । किमर्थं तर्हि भक्तैः पूजादिलक्षणं यागदानहोमादिकं च सुकृतं प्रयुज्यते इत्याह — अज्ञानेन आवृतं ज्ञानं विवेकविज्ञानम् , तेन मुह्यन्ति ‘करोमि कारयामि भोक्ष्ये भोजयामि’ इत्येवं मोहं गच्छन्ति अविवेकिनः संसारिणो जन्तवः ॥ १५ ॥

regards

subbu

 

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[Sudhanshu Shekhar]

Hare Kṛṣṇa,

I request learned members to carefully peruse verses 68 to 71 of Alātaśānti Prakaraṅa of Māṅḍūkyakārikā and the bhāṣya thereupon.

Śankara's commentary thereupon translated by Swami Gambhīrānanda:

Māyāmayaḥ, means one that is created by a magician; and nirmitakaḥ, means created by medicines, charms etc. As egg-born creatures and others, created in dreams or by magic and incantation, take birth and die, so also do such creatures as human beings who are non-existent and are merely imagined on Consciousness. This is the idea.

It has been said that the birth, death, etc. of creatures within the range of empirical existence are like those of the creatures in dream etc., and that the highest truth is that where no creature undergoes birth. The remaining portion was explained before ( Kārikā, III. 48 ).

यथा स्वप्नमयो जीवो जायते म्रियतेऽपि च ।

तथा जीवा अमी सर्वे भवन्ति न भवन्ति च ॥ ६८ ॥

यथा मायामयो जीवो जायते म्रियतेऽपि च ।

तथा जीवा अमी सर्वे भवन्ति न भवन्ति च ॥ ६९ ॥

यथा निर्मितको जीवो जायते म्रियतेऽपि च ।

तथा जीवा अमी सर्वे भवन्ति न भवन्ति च ॥ ७० ॥

मायामयः मायाविना यः कृतो निर्मितकः मन्त्रौषध्यादिभिर्निष्पादितः । स्वप्नमायानिर्मितका अण्डजादयो जीवा यथा जायन्ते म्रियन्ते च, तथा मनुष्यादिलक्षणा अविद्यमाना एव चित्तविकल्पनामात्रा इत्यर्थः ॥

My explanation:

In these, ācārya clearly says that just as the jīvās created in dream, created by magic etc are born and they die, similarly, these jīvās of the nature of humans etc are merely imaginations of mind and they are certainly non-existent.

Please note that this non-existence is not only from the paramārtha view. Certainly, from the paramārtha view, there is non-existence of jīvās, but there is also absence of perception. Hence, equating them to dream-jīvās is meaningless from paramārtha. This is explained in next verse.

न कश्चिज्जायते जीवः सम्भवोऽस्य न विद्यते ।

एतत्तदुत्तमं सत्यं यत्र किञ्चिन्न जायते ॥ ७१ ॥

व्यवहारसत्यविषये जीवानां जन्ममरणादिः स्वप्नादिजीववदित्युक्तम् । उत्तमं तु परमार्थसत्यं न कश्चिज्जायते जीव इति । उक्तार्थमन्यत् ॥

Here Ācārya clarifies that it is only at empirical level that the jīvās are equated with dream-jīvās. From paramārtha, there is just no birth of jīvās. 

So, at vyavahāra level, the jīvās and their birth-death are equated with dream-jīvās whereas in paramārtha, the jīva and birth-date thereof itself is rejected.

It is the clearest exposition of eka-jīva-vāda from vyavahāra- driṣṭi. It should be noted that eka-jīva-vāda is not a paramārth view. It is an empirical view and hence within the realm of adhyāropa and vivarta. It is negated through apavāda.

SSSS ji did not understand that eka-jīva-vāda is not presented in paramārtha view in sampradāya. Hence, erroneously, making an incorrect description of sampradāya view regarding eka-jīva-vāda, he erred in his explanation of these verses. And hence his explanation is liable to be rejected on account of incorrect appreciation of eka-jīva-vāda. His vivriti however says exaclty what eka-jīva-vāda says because that is what bhāṣyakāra says here in these verses.

Regards.

Sudhanshu Shekhar.