replacing old fridge unit - has anyone installed a CoolBlue unit?

[Kristin Pederson]

Hello!

Looks like my fridge unit has pooped out. It's currently a water-cooled system, which I understand is recommended for tropical environments, which is the goal. 

However, a friend recommended the CoolBlue system (https://www.cruiserowaterandpower.com/coolblue-overview/) which is an air-cooled system. This system is about twice the price of a new water-cooled system, but has greater efficiency, lower power usage, and would allow me to remove a pump, close one thru-hull and repurpose a second to my water-maker when I install that. Has anyone used a CoolBlue system? Is it as good as it sounds? 

Thanks for any advice and sharing first hand experience!!

-Kristin

[Michael Moradzadeh]

I installed one on Cayenne maybe 20 years ago.  Loved it.  Way simpler than water cooling

Sent from my iPhone

On Sep 12, 2021, at 10:12 AM, Kristin Pederson <pederson...@gmail.com> wrote:

Hello!

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[John Baudendistel]

Kristin

Over 25 years we went through 3 systems.  In order below.  

1 original Adler Barbor the HD French or Italian motor which ran 3 galvanized Arctic 2” x 12 x 12” holding plates 2 in the freezer one large one in the fridge.  Old school like fishing boats.  The system was also engine driven.  Old style systems.  Ran a decade. 

2. Sea Frost 1/2 hp dc and the same style plates above.  Water cooled.  An amp hog drawing 50 amps.  Although runs for a while then shuts off.  Don’t do these systems.  Had to rebuild the amp hog motor twice.  Ran 3-5 years junk. 

3. The best.  Two Adler Barbour systems.  With their holding plates 1” x 10” x 18” in each the refer and the freezer.  Awesome.  3.5 amps about 40% of the time.  Air cooled, could have water cooled if you wanted to, we did not.  Ice cream and frozen meats in the freezer.  Fridge temps in the refer.  A B phased out their holding plate systems 5-6 years ago.  Go with their standard refer box.  Makes some ice cubes and hold a quart of ice cream and two steaks!  $1800+ or ~ and you can install it without an AC tech.  

CoolBlue uses the same Danfoss variable speed motor I believe.  Can’t go wrong with that either.  

Note that the cool blue and the Adler Barbour use the same danfoss variable speed compressor, get the larger one, then forget about the refer for the next 15 years.  Also just use the simple analog thermostats less to break.  

Use remote temp monitors outside the boxes.  We had Radio Shack wireless temp sensors which monitored the temps about the 1/2 way point in each box.  Simple replace the batt once a year.  We stuck ours to the microwave with the built in magnets.  Monitored two wireless temps.  #3 ran 7-8 years. Still running.  

If you have a P 40 use one AB system with a spill over from the freezer to the fridge.  We had the room for two separate systems one for each the refer and one for the freezer, although on a P 42. 

Hope this helps.  

Thanks, 

John B

On Sep 12, 2021, at 5:47 PM, Michael Moradzadeh <cayen...@gmail.com> wrote:

I installed one on Cayenne maybe 20 years ago.  Loved it.  Way simpler than water cooling

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[Donal Botkin]

Hello Kristin,

View[+]Finder here.  I installed a Defender Industries private label cold plate system in 1998 that is still working despite dying on several occasions. Here is the short version of the story:

The original setup for the compressor, etc. was enclosed in a stainless steel box that was not intended to be opened by the customer. It was meant to run on 12VDC or 120VAC by internal switching and was water cooled by an external pump. 

ACT I (San Francisco Bay, 1998) Working just fine . . .

ACT II (on the way to Hawaii, 1999) Overheated and shut down due to loss of cooling water. Yes, a P40 can heel far enough (or surf) to let air into the water intake for the salt-water plumbing. Turned out there was an inverter in the box to run the AC compressor and several FET’s on the board let their smoke out.

ACT III (repairs in Hawaii, 2000) I removed the internal inverter so the fridge was AC only. No problem there; house inverter was available. Fridge working again.

ACT IV (Kosrae, FSM anchored in a river, 2000) Fridge died (again) due to silt from river clogging condenser heat exchanger. Solution was to flush the system and go to sea.

ACT V (New Zealand, up a river again, 2002) I replaced the open-system cooling with a closed-system comprising a heater coil from a wrecked Toyota and a muffin fan. clear plastic tube from pump to condenser to coil and back finished the job. 

That is pretty much my tale of the fridge. If your fridge is by some coincidence the same as mine, and you want to save some money, and you enjoy working with electricity in confined spaces, I recommend the solution above. At the very least the closed-loop cooling will let you put some distance between the heat from the condenser and the boat interior. 

Cheers,

Donal

View[+]Finder

Donal B. Botkin

556 Shagbark St

Windsor, CA  95492

415 497-5411

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[Matthew Davidson]

If you are a FaceBooker... join the Passport 40 Sailing Owners Group on FB. There is a file saved showing how we swapped out our old 

[Marty McOmber]

Hi all,

This is another area where we did an extensive overhaul on our Passport 40, hull 75.  And I couldn't be happier with the results.  

We started by removing the old icebox and all the insulation. This required removing the countertop and fiddles, which we eventually replaced with Corian. Down to the hull, I started from scratch and built insulation to about an R-40 standard using pink board insulation for structure, and layers of aerogel to add insulation value. Then built a new box in place with fiberglass and wood and finished the inside with two-part Interlux perfection. We decided to make it a spill-over unit, which means we had one smaller compartment for a freezer and the cool air from this spills over to the larger refrigerator side via a small muffin fan.  

I kept the refrigeration simple, going with a Vitrifrigo external compressor (ND50CB4-QV (ND50OR-VFA-AC-GR) PreCharged Cooling Unit Danfoss Comp. (suremarineservice.com)) and a large evaporator plate, which I bent to fit the freezer unit. The Vitrifrigo uses the Danfoss 50 compressor (and also models with the 35 as well). The compressor sits just aft of the icebox in the compartment under the cockpit. It is currently air cooled, which is great for the Pacific Northwest. But I plan on adding a keel cooler before we head toward warmer climates. It seems to me like the best of both worlds and doesn't require all the challenges of a water cooled system. 

As for holding plates, I considered that approach, but it seems like the industry has moved decisively away from them and are now focused nearly exclusively on evaporators for energy efficiency. Here's a good post by a marine refrigerator company about that: RIP Holding Plates (coastalclimatecontrol.com) 

Here are a few pics from the project (sadly a lot were lost mwhen I dropped a cell phone overboard that year). https://photos.app.goo.gl/MAV2iEbAQxnThpgKA

I've used this set up for six years now. The freezer side of the spillover is held at 4 degrees F. And the fridge side at an average of 37, with a typical max and min of 40 and 35 respectively.  Best of all, the unit only draws about 6 amps and runs only about 20 minutes out of every hour.  The focus on good insulation really helped in that regard. It did wonderfully when the temperature hit 105 degrees in Seattle for three staight days this summer. 

For monitoring temp inside the boxes, we just bought an external unit off Amazon. It shows both freezer and fridge and has set point alarms for min and max temps for both.  Works off AA batteries and has two sending units that sit in the respective boxes.  

Hope this is helpful information.  

Cheers,

Marty McOmber

P40 Rounder, #75, Seattle

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[Kenyon Stewart]

Hi Kristin,

Great advice by all.  Outbound came with an old AC compressor and holding plate system.  It never worked great and the compressor failed after about a year.  I did pretty much what Marty outlined, removing the counters and rebuilding from the ground up with new insulation.  The 47s have separate fridge and freezer, so that means 2 systems, so twice as much money.  I decreased the size of the freezer fairly dramatically and increased the amount of insulation.  Like Marty said, the industry has kind of abandoned holding plates for the most part, but you can still get them from a few manufacturers.  My advice would be to not think about it in terms of brands like Adler Barbour vs CoolBlue or whatever.  Most brands today don't manufacture much of anything, they just put pieces together from different manufacturers to build systems.  I would also be very skeptical of statements like "uses 1/2 the power as other 12v Systems".  The laws of physics are the same for all of these systems and there are no shortcuts despite whatever marketing claims they make.  You will find that pretty much 100% of DC based systems use Danfoss compressors of different sizes (35, 50, 80).   

In terms of design there are really only a few choices that you will be making for each part of the system (apologies if it gets a little technical):

1) Two systems or one?  Freezer spillover design vs separate fridge and freezer system.  Your current box design may dictate that.

2) Compressor:  DC, AC, Engine Driven or some combination.  As discussed, DC has pretty much become the dominant system and I would encourage you to go that route.  Add more charging and battery capacity instead of a maintenance nightmare engine driven compressor (See John Baudendistel's experience on that).  The Danfoss DC compressors are variable speed.  Some manufacturers have electronic controllers that manage the compressor speed depending on battery state which can improve efficiency.  Contrary to the old holding plate systems with huge compressors, it is more efficient to run these small compressors at lower speeds for a longer time.  This is how they are typically set to run, but these controllers sense when your alternator or battery charger kicks in and ramps up compressor speed to take advantage of excess charge current.

3) Evaporator:  Absorb the heat inside the fridge, evaporator vs holding plate.  Evaporators are thin aluminum and are pretty efficient at absorbing the heat from their surroundings with systems designed to run more often but with much smaller compressors.  Holding plates are not used as much mainly because compressors and system designs have changed.  You would typically run a big AC or engine driven compressor less often but consuming much more energy to freeze a solution inside of the large holding plates.  This was basically a modern replacement for buying big blocks of ice, you just re-freeze your own ice block once every day or two and it will slowly absorb heat inside the fridge.  The modern small DC compressors now available just aren't big enough to freeze a very large holding plate which is one reason you don't see them very often any more. Holding plate systems also have another inherent drawback which is that the temperature of the box will fluctuate much more.  Evaporators systems are designed to run more frequently and maintain a steadier temp.  This keeps food fresh much longer than letting the temp go up and down in big swings during your holding plate freeze/thaw cycles.

3a) Expansion mechanism:   There are different mechanisms for converting the compressed liquid refrigerant to a gas which is the step that makes your refrigerator cold.  Most evaporators today use a capillary tube type expansion device built into the evaporator.  These are prone to clogging and are not serviceable or replaceable.  If it clogs, you have to remove the entire evaporator and replace it with a new evaporator.  The alternative is an expansion valve.  These are less common, more expensive, but can be serviceable in the event of clogging.  You will mostly find capillary tube types today, so the choice is often made for you.  I don't know of a 

4) Condenser: How to get rid of the heat?  Basically air cooled vs water cooled.  Household refrigerators, air conditioners, and the majority of boat systems use air cooling to get rid of the heat.  They are quieter, more simple and, depending on where you sail, use less energy.  Water cooling can provide more heat transfer capability if needed, but is more complex to maintain and there are a couple of variations to choose from.

5) Thermostat: Thermostat can be either a simple mechanical unit or electronic probe with digital display and control.  

In summary, you will likely be installing a system with a Danfoss 50 DC compressor that uses air or water cooling to dispose of waste heat and an aluminum evaporator inside the refrigerator box.  This represents 90% of what is available in the market today regardless of whether it says Adler Barbour, CoolBlue, Vitrifrigo, Frigoboat...  We have two mostly identical Frigoboat systems on Outbound for fridge and freezer that were installed in 2009.  They have been fairly reliable, but have needed some maintenance.  We have replaced the controller for one of the compressors and the evaporator on the fridge system due to contamination which entailed a full system vacuum, clean, and recharge.  

My Recommendations:

Make sure you do all the calculations for sizing your system correctly, being very realistic about the insulation or lack thereof in the original Passport refrigerator boxes.

If possible add insulation and improve sealing at the doors.

Use as few connections as possible in the refrigerant lines and make sure that they are all tightened correctly to avoid leaks.

A good sized dryer/filter in the system or the ability to add one.  Boat systems are much more likely to get some moisture and contaminants in the system than a standard household unit because they have connectors and are not sealed systems.  A good dryer/filter can keep them from clogging your system.

I personally prefer digital thermostats as I can easily change the set temps and monitor the systems.  Mine have had no issues for 12 years.

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[Kyle Lobisser]

good discussion here. One thing I want to point out is that there are different types of water cooled system. We have frigoboat keel coolers which are heat exchangers between the refrigerant and seawater, mounted on the exterior of the hull. This is a bit different from what I think is being described, where seawater is being pulled into the boat and through a heat exchanger with refrigerant on the other side and then expelled (like your raw-water engine cooler). Oddly our boat did not come with any of the other refrigerator components, and I don't see any evidence of an install. So it seems the previous owner started down the install path but then aborted. He used the boat primarily as a day sailer. I'm hoping to finish it soon, and have heard/read good things about frigoboat.

[Mathias Schmidt]

Can confirm regarding the frigoboat + keel cooler system, I have been very happy with it over the years and it's not a huge electrical draw. One bit of experience that may be valuable here - early on in my ownership of my P42 Gadget, I had to replace the evaporator plates in both the fridge and the freezer boxes, as the refrigerant had stopped flowing properly and the plates were no longer getting cold. Both of these events happened after a particularly rough passage, which is not uncommon; contaminants in the system can become dislodged in rough conditions, which make their way to the tiny inlet tube at the start of the evaporator plate and clog it. The solution to this is to install an in-line dryer/separator device, a ~12" long section of tubing + a filter which you can install at any connection point along the lines. Frigoboat sells these, and they're well worth it - I've had many more rough passages since then with no issues.

Replacing an evaporator plate with the associated ~15' of stiff copper plumbing without removing any cabinetry is possible, just very very time consuming...

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