Soave - Pondering weather helm.

[Rob Cohen "Soave" NS33 Westport, CT]

I've was avid dingy racer for many years and have been hesitant to return to racing with Soave because I didn't believe she ( or I ) was ready to perform credibly. 

One of my concerns is weather helm.  When close hauled in moderate wind last season I needed to apply about 1/4 to a half turn of steerage to keep Soave on course.  I was fighting weather helm.  Very frustrating when your goal is velocity.

Over the winter I pondered this and came up with a plan to address it, by asking myself what would I do in my Flying Scot.... increase forward mast rake.

Unfortunately I didn't see a way to do this on Soave.  

Also over the winter  I also set out to address mast wedges that would "bottom out" before fully snugging the mast in the collar ( separate but related issue).  The solution was to extend the tapered portion of the wedges up a bit by cutting into the mast shoulder and removing about 1/2" of material ( giving the wedge about another 1/2" of travel ).  This change gave the wedge about another 3/16" of thickness when bottomed out ).

I modified half of Soave's mast wedges in this way and marked them for use in the aft sections of her mast.  This ( in theory ) would give Soave an ever so slight increase in forward mat rake.  It would also permit wedges to fully sung the mast in the collar.

Yesterday was the first day I was able to test with ideal control conditions.

• Steady moderate wind ( 12 knots ) 
• Same sail that I used last season.
• Flat sea.

Earlier this season I had the the general feeling weather helm was reduced, but I hadn't really quantified by how much till yesterday.  ( HERE ) is a video of Soave's autopilot easily steering a close hauled course in 12 knots with full main.  Before the change these conditions would have required a full quarter turn ( or more ) on the wheel.

Unfortunately my speed sensor in not functioning again... so I don't have a solid assessment of improvement in  boat speed.  Based on SOG from my plotter it's about .25 knot improvement.

The only downside I've encountered is that under 8 knots steering feels awkward because of slight lee helm.  But I think I can get used to it.

Has anyone else experimented with subtle changes in mast rake ?  Did you get similar results ?

Rob

s/v SOAVE

NS33 #009

Cedar Point YC

Westport, CT

[Joe Valinoti]

Rob:  I’ve been racing iL Gatto (shoal draft) against sloops for about 20 years quite successfully.  Usually need about 12 kts of wind to point well without too much weather helm and, of course, downwind – no contest.  For some strange reason, the boat points higher and sails faster on a port tack.

 

Joe Valinoti
S/V iL Gatto NS30U #221
Sea Harbour YC
Oriental, NC USA

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[Francis Cichowski]

Hi,

I've only sailed her about two hours, double reefed, offshore, in 35-40k breeze.

Hard on the wind, she pointed beautifully and sailed hands and autopilot off.

I had to engage the autopilot, in standby, as there is no wheel lock.

So I have no experience but lots of hope.

However

By boat "Southpaw" has a 1.375 degree list to port

It is very noticeable.

Has anyone attempted your selective wedge trick to eliminate list.

WHICH

Could also result in sailing one tack different than t'other Rob.

Fran Cichowski

Southpaw N30U  #300

Spicers in Noank, CT

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[Peter DePascale]

Just to throw my two cents in. Could the speed difference on tacks have something to do with the prop offset Joe?

Pete DePascale

NS33 #006

Branford,CT

Peter DePascale

203-671-2420

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[Joe Valinoti]

I don’t think so, Peter, as it’s a folding Gori.

 

Joe Valinoti
S/V iL Gatto NS30U #221
Sea Harbour YC
Oriental, NC USA

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[Herb Huber]

Regarding mast wedges: I got a new set of the nylon/plastic wedges & found they were slightly too big to fit all the way down. A racing expert that I spoke to said that was exactly what I needed since I don't have steel cables with turnbuckles to adjust mast lean. He said to simply move some up & some down to get the desired lean at the top of my mast.

Herb G. Huber, MISTOFFELEES 30C#91, Lake Huron Nonsuch Association, Point Edward/Sarnia, Ont.

[newelljc9]

It was interesting to hear that 33's and 30's have issues with excessive weather helm. Mascouche (26C #1) had it in spades with her Botts big leech sail. I resorted to using a single reef at wind speeds over 12 knots to maximize performance. Once Pondus (26C #33) and ourselves went sailing in a 30 to 40 knot breeze double reefed single handed. We were impressed with the boats ease of handling and total control like Southpaw reported. With the double reef the sail area was concentrated in the centre of effort. 

In planning for sailing during my octogenarian years, I realised that I needed to change the rig so that I did not need to reef as often and I wanted her to be as safe and seaworthy as possible. The result was a standing gaff rig with the foot reduced by 5' which was similar to the double reefed wishbone rig and I added some extra canvas at the peak to help make up for the loss of sail area. This resulted in being able to sail with neutral helm in breezes up to 30 knots without having to take in a reef. The design permits using a single reefing pennant for making a tidy efficient reef. I have never had to use more than a single reef.

From a safety point of view, the 30 lb. boom does not hang over the cockpit and the mainsheet remains ahead of the cockpit except the bitter end going to a winch in the cockpit. This removes two causes of injuries which can be serious. The 15' 30 lb. boom replaced my old wishboom which weighed 120 lbs with its s/s extension. This weight reduction and reduced length made gybing much less stressful and a more viable option in most conditions.

Now I am 87 and have no regrets in changing the rig. There are always some tweaks that would improve the rig, but there is no urgency as I approach my 90's. This year in deference to my angina I have bought a power winch handle for raising sail.  

John Newell

Mascouche 26C #1

Toronto

On Saturday, July 12, 2025 at 9:11:20 AM UTC-4 Rob Cohen "Soave" NS33 Westport, CT wrote: