Advice on next randonneur bike purchase (with trepidation)

[Tfay]

With trepidation in fear of "here's the links you're looking for" or "this is not the forum for that", but here goes.

Seeking to upgrade my experience from a frankenbike (Trek European tourer frame with just about everything below replaced plus Surly Moloko bars) to a new randonnering bike (and long distance commuter).

- 6'2, 215lbs, so need something sturdy, likely 60cm or XL size

- have bookmarked the Cycle Toussaint, Velo Orange, Surly DT or other, Kona Rove, Salsa TBD, Jamis, etc. 

- Not yet at the point for fully custom frames

Thoughts, reactions appreciated.

[Brad]

Front bag/load?  

Hard to go wrong with the Cycles Toussaint or the Velo Orange Polyvalent or the Soma Grand Randonneur.

But will you miss your Trek?  Examine deeply why you think you need to change. 

[Tfay]

Always the debate. Drop a few hundred $$$s on upgrades to the existing (new dynohub with more power, new groupset/shifter, change out tires, etc.) or go to a new bike. I was tempted to keep the bike, but had the opportunity to ride something new while on a trip, and realized the drawbacks of the current beast. It weighs in at just under 40 lbs.

[Ken Freeman]

What was the new bike?  What was good about it, and what was bad?  Why not just get one of those (whatever it is)?  What is there about the new bike that cannot be matched with one of your current frames, or another used frame?  If you buy a different new bike, how can you make sure that new one actually brings what you want?

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Ken Freeman
Ann Arbor, MI USA

[Steve Palincsar]

On 3/4/20 6:31 PM, Tfay wrote:
> Always the debate. Drop a few hundred $$$s on upgrades to the existing
> (new dynohub with more power,

Unless the "old dynohub" is a genuine Sturmey Archer Dynohub, any new
one is going to have the same power output as the old one, 6V3W.   (The
original Dynohub power output was 1.8 watts at 6 volts.)   A new one may
be lighter and it may have less resistance.


> new groupset/shifter,


which may or may not make a really meaningful difference


> change out tires,


Now you're onto something.  Tires -- which you will always need to
replace sooner or later, and which you may very well want to replace on
a brand new bike -- are the single most meaningful upgrade you can do,
and probably the most cost-effective as well.

> etc.) or go to a new bike. I was tempted to keep the bike, but had the
> opportunity to ride something new while on a trip, and realized the
> drawbacks of the current beast. It weighs in at just under 40 lbs.

"Beast" indeed!

--

Steve Palincsar
Alexandria, Virginia
USA

[Andy G]

Here's a list I made when I was looking. Generally starts at the $ side and ends with $$$.

Surly Packrat
Soma GR
Box Dog Pelican
Toussaint Velo Routier 2
Breezer Doppler Pro
Marin Nicasio+
Salsa Journeyman Claris
Masi Speciale Randonneur
Fairdale Weekender Nomad
Brodie Romulous
Twin Six Rando
Breezer Doppler Team
Masi Speciale Randonneur Elite
Black Mountain Road+
Fairdale Rockitship
VO Ployvalent
All City Gorilla Monsoon
Rawland Ulv
Crust Romanceur
Endpoint Hunter Gatherer
Elephant NFE
Ellis Strada Vango
Kona Rove ST
Surly Midnight Special
Penhale
Rawland Ravn
Crust Lightning Bolt rim 2020
Crust Lightning Bolt disc
Stanforth Skyelander
Lyonsport L'avecaise
Fitz Cyclez
Ebisu Tonbo
Norther Lyon (ended 2019)
Gallus Cycles (smallbatch)
333Fab AirLandSea
Frances
Coast
Chapman
Winter
Thompson
Firefly Allroad Ti
Bishop

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[Elton Lance]

What? No Weigle?! :)

Elton Lance

Vero Beach, FL

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[Andy G]

My list continues with a couple more but if they didn't list a price, I skipped it. My last two purchases were Rawland Stag/rSogn under $1200 for full bikes, so it's pretty much a joke that I even write down anything above a $2k frameset as wonderful as they may be.

[Ted Fay]

I was surprised at the Breezer and Marin, and some of Marin's other models. Modestly aware of them, but good to review. The lower part of the list is an ambition. 

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Francis "Ted" Fay
ted...@gmail.com

[Andy G]

The Breezer is only $744 here, if you've got a hole burning in your pocket for a heavy steel bike that looks kinda rando/gravel!

Coast should get bumped up the list a few lines now though - they had $2,500 customs before, but since added an $1,875 production model.

[David Cummings]

The bike you are looking for is currently for sale in this forum - the L’avecaise. (No affiliation, just politely averting my eyes so I do something stupid like buy another bike.)

David “Eight is nowhere near enough” in MT

[ilter]

I too noticed that nice L’avecaise, but I wonder if the tubing is a tad too light for a 215lbs rider plus 10lbs(?) brevet load. Single oversized 747 top, 858 down tube...
Ilter in Chicago

[Steve Palincsar]

Purely a matter of rider preference.  At this moment, I'm 100kg and my JP Weigle is std non-OS 7/4/7 and I love it.

On 3/7/20 9:25 AM, ilter wrote:

I too noticed that nice L’avecaise, but I wonder if the tubing is a tad too light for a 215lbs rider plus 10lbs(?) brevet load. Single oversized 747 top, 858 down tube...
Ilter in Chicago

[David Parsons]

The machine I'm riding most these days is OS 7/4/7 and @ ~210 pounds these days + 5-30 pounds of cargo up front is just fine:

It's coupled, yes, but the couplers are in the butts so they don't reinforce the .4 section of the tubing.    Remember that an OS 7/4/7 tube is about the same stiffness as a standard 9/6/9 one, so if anything it might feel kind of stiff if you're used to flexy standard-diameter tubing.

-david parsons

[David Madina]

Dave -

That’s one awesome machine. Needs a post if it’s own.

[Ted Fay]

Thanks all for your feedback. Quite the lengthy list of great opinions and bikes.

Placed the order with Cycles Toussaint late last night. Why? At some level, it just felt right. Combination of dedication to the category, right dynamics (reportedly), good specs, right price point, etc. That was about as hard a selecting which of several LBS' to use to help put it together (one recently closed :-( ). While not at all a big spender in the category, I like to spread the wealth a bit. Now just picking up the odds and ends (front rack, may delay the dynamo hub at first, etc., etc.) 

Will post separately on how it all goes. 

Here's to no glass in your path.

On Mon, Mar 9, 2020 at 12:43 PM David Madina <dmad...@gmail.com> wrote:

Dave -

That’s one awesome machine. Needs a post if it’s own.

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[David Parsons]

On Monday, March 9, 2020 at 10:43:23 AM UTC-7, David Madina wrote:

David -

That’s one awesome machine. Needs a post if it’s own.

 

I think I posted it right after I finished painting & assembling it a few months back.

But in a nutshell:   7/4/7 OS front triangle, internal wiring (both lights & di2), 1" threadless fork, Spyres, 10x8 rack,  handbuilt rear wheel & one of the Wiggle firesale SON SL front wheels,  ~600mm TT & ~520mm ST, 73/73 HTA/STA, Biopace 50/36 on a Sram Apex crank, and a pair of fenders (Honjo?  VO?  I forget) I snagged from the list a couple of years ago.  The couplers are from a coupled Rodriguez that I traded a rack for.

The pencil seatstays are because of the bad influence of Rob English.

-david parsons

[Mark in Beacon]

Second that. An attractive fabrication and the build came together nicely. Plus, purple.

[Ian A]

Congratulations on your decision. Seems like a great option.

I would encourage you not to delay going with the dynamo hub. When starting from scratch, the only additional cost is the difference between the cost of a regular hub and a dynamo one. The awesome looking Shutter Precision SV8 for rim brakes can be had for a little over $100. Shimano has great reasonable cost options too.

I have a couple of SON28 hubs, which are really nice pieces, but my Shimano 3n80 is just as good in practice. If I needed another dynamo hub today, I'd most likely chose a Shutter Precision SV8.

IanA Alberta Canada

[Ian A]

Edit: in terms of which Shutter Precision hub to choose (should you decide to go that way), please ask for opinions from the list. I am not up to date on the latest options.

IanA

[Andrew Demack]

+1 on the SP PV8. Have had one driving the lights on my commuter for a year or more now, and it's been flawless.

[Andrew Demack]

The SV8 is the small wheels version. For a 650B bike, the PV8 is the go.

[satanas]

@ David Parsons: What diameter and gauge are the purple seatstays?

[Toby Whitfield]

Andrew Demack wrote:
> The SV8 is the small wheels version. For a 650B bike, the PV8 is the go.
>
>
> On Wednesday, 11 March 2020 16:21:01 UTC+10, Andrew Demack wrote:
> +1 on the SP PV8. Have had one driving the lights on my commuter for a year or more now, and it's been flawless.
>

Although the SV8 is the small wheel version, it works fine for large wheels as long as your speed isn't super slow (think long grinding climbs fully loaded or more technical terrain). I used one for my first Rando machine, and now am using the equivalent SON hub, and never had a power shortage. I guess the other consideration is if you want to charge devices. The small wheel version is a bit lower drag.

Anyway, it's all marginal and both will do the trick.

Toby Whitfield
Toronto, Canada

[David Moeny]

On Shutter Precision, I've arrived at the point of not being a fan. My wife and I have them on 2 commuters that get truly all weather use. So far, each hub has failed within 10k miles (2-3 years) of use. SP is very good with warranty, but you need to ship to Taiwan which adds weeks to a rebuild time and rebuild cost. I have a NIB replacement from my last warranty call, if anyone wants it. My take on these is that the extra paid for other hubs is probably going to be worth it.

[Dodger]

My sp failed after 5k. All weather use. The warranty was great but I dont build wheels so it was costly with shipping and rebuild. My second sp is at around 10k with no issue. I think I will either go XT or Son next time around. Most likely Son as I am not a super fan of the look of shimano dynamo hubs. 

On Wednesday, March 11, 2020, David Moeny <dgm...@gmail.com> wrote:

On Shutter Precision, I've arrived at the point of not being a fan.  My wife and I have them on 2 commuters that get truly all weather use.  So far, each hub has failed within 10k miles (2-3 years) of use.  SP is very good with warranty, but you need to ship to Taiwan which adds weeks to a rebuild time and rebuild cost.  I have a NIB replacement from my last warranty call,  if anyone wants it.  My take on these is that the extra paid for other hubs is probably going to be worth it.

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[Tfay]

And then there was coronavirus. But the Cycles Touissant is finally up and running. I did delay on the dynamo hub, for all sorts of reasons.

Thanks to everyone for the input. Truly a 650b convert.

https://share.icloud.com/photos/06EZmLfVWsvjm-8phbpnIugpg#Rosewood_Park

[David Cummings]

That's a fine looking steed - love the cream PariMotos!