Confusion using experts4solutions
126 views
Skip to first unread message
Jim Karsten
Apr 27, 2011, 2:25:03 PM4/27/11
to web...@googlegroups.com
We are working on a new web2py project. We are making progress and web2py has certainly improved our production but we could use some help. The experts4solutions site looks very promising but currently it doesn't provide details for handling various issues.
We posted a couple of small jobs on elance, oDesk and vWorker, then sent the links each member of experts4solutions.
Some of the issues the freelancing sites handle that we have a concern about include: job posting tools, contractor filtering tools, payment processing, commitment guarantees (for example, payment held in escrow), dispute settlements and arbitration, legal terms and software licences.
Is our approach acceptable? What have others done in the past?
Regards,
Jim Karsten
We posted a couple of small jobs on elance, oDesk and vWorker, then sent the links each member of experts4solutions.
Some of the issues the freelancing sites handle that we have a concern about include: job posting tools, contractor filtering tools, payment processing, commitment guarantees (for example, payment held in escrow), dispute settlements and arbitration, legal terms and software licences.
Is our approach acceptable? What have others done in the past?
Regards,
Jim Karsten
Steve
May 1, 2011, 10:17:39 PM5/1/11
to web2py-users
I too would like to know what is the best way to interact with the
experts4solutions list. Do we just spam the list with the work I
have?
experts4solutions list. Do we just spam the list with the work I
have?
Massimo Di Pierro
May 1, 2011, 11:22:31 PM5/1/11
to web2py-users
experts4solutions should be considered an association of web2py
experts.
experts4solutions does not take programming jobs. The members and/or
the companies of members take the jobs and write the contracts.
As an association we do not open the doors to everybody but only to
those programmers who have proven themselves with web2py. The
acceptance rules currently require my approval or 5 endorsements. They
will be made even more strict as time goes by. By restricting
membership the association guarantees the professionally of its
members.
You can read more about the services provided by the association
directly on the web site.
It is my experience that members have no interest in competing for the
jobs which are usually posted on oDesk, rent-a-coder which tipically
range $100-$1000. I know members who have contracted jobs for $5000
and above. At least three members have engaged in long term contracts.
Two members been switched career as a result.
The goal of experts4solution is not to provide cheap workforce but to
provide highly skilled workforce.
If you email the association, the emails get forwarded to
http://groups.google.com/group/experts4solutions (*)
and we all (should) get them.
I strongly recommend that you contact individual members that are
close to you geographically.
In general, interaction in person works better.
Massimo
(*) If you are an approved member of experts4solution but not member
of the google group, this is a mistake and please email me to let me
know. the two are sync-ed manually and errors may occur.
experts.
experts4solutions does not take programming jobs. The members and/or
the companies of members take the jobs and write the contracts.
As an association we do not open the doors to everybody but only to
those programmers who have proven themselves with web2py. The
acceptance rules currently require my approval or 5 endorsements. They
will be made even more strict as time goes by. By restricting
membership the association guarantees the professionally of its
members.
You can read more about the services provided by the association
directly on the web site.
It is my experience that members have no interest in competing for the
jobs which are usually posted on oDesk, rent-a-coder which tipically
range $100-$1000. I know members who have contracted jobs for $5000
and above. At least three members have engaged in long term contracts.
Two members been switched career as a result.
The goal of experts4solution is not to provide cheap workforce but to
provide highly skilled workforce.
If you email the association, the emails get forwarded to
http://groups.google.com/group/experts4solutions (*)
and we all (should) get them.
I strongly recommend that you contact individual members that are
close to you geographically.
In general, interaction in person works better.
Massimo
(*) If you are an approved member of experts4solution but not member
of the google group, this is a mistake and please email me to let me
know. the two are sync-ed manually and errors may occur.
Jim Karsten
May 2, 2011, 9:32:00 PM5/2/11
to web...@googlegroups.com
Just to clarify, I posted on the freelance sites not to get coders competing for jobs, but to make use of their tools. I have lots of work and a healthy budget and I'm looking for a web2py professional. The job postings were intended to be just a stepping stone.
Jim Karsten
Jim Karsten
Ross Peoples
May 3, 2011, 1:39:04 PM5/3/11
to web...@googlegroups.com
Experts4solutions has hooked me up with someone nearby looking to do a long term job which plans to sell a web2py app as an appliance. Instead of getting paid up front or by the hour, I chose to take a percentage of profits, since it's just me and the other person working on it. I can only devote 10 to 20 hours a week to it, as I have a day job, but if jobs keep coming down the pipeline, I could actually make a career out of web2py.
Jim or Steve, if you have any small jobs that only take a few hours to do, I'd be happy to take a look. As I said, most of my time is spent at my day job or working on a big project during the weekend, but if there's some small things that I can work on during the week after work to make some extra cash, I would be very interested. Feel free to email me.
Ross
Massimo Di Pierro
May 3, 2011, 2:39:34 PM5/3/11
to web2py-users
I did not know Ross (or I did not remember). That means there are even
more people doing experts4solution work than I thought.
Massimo
more people doing experts4solution work than I thought.
Massimo
Plumo
May 3, 2011, 7:14:43 PM5/3/11
to web...@googlegroups.com
$0.02 ...
This can mean the other guy doesn't need to invest anything - neither time nor money. Ideas are cheap.
So there is no risk for them, but there is a high risk that you will never get paid since most web apps go no where.
If they really believe in their idea they should be willing to invest some money upfront.
Jason Brower
May 5, 2011, 3:13:52 PM5/5/11
to web...@googlegroups.com
I too have been contacted through it. No money yet, but I do get contacts.
Massimo Di Pierro
May 5, 2011, 3:44:09 PM5/5/11
to web2py-users
I agree this Plumo.
"I want a facebook clone or other web site targeted to community XYZ"
is not an idea worth any money.
The ideas worth money are those that translate directly into code that
you would not know how to write yourself.
We all have good ideas that do not carry on because have no time.
There are lots of people out there that are great salespeople (and
there is lots of value in that) but it is them who should work for you
(you who make a product), not you for them. If selling and making
money becomes more important than the quality of the product, the
product sucks and you lose interest.
I have been there. I suggest:
1) attach a price to any work done by any party
2) agree to percentages of ownership
3) agree on partial deadlines and figure out who owns what (time or
money) to the company
4) put the money into a bank account even if unused.
5) Agree on conditions for getting out at any time without or without
default.
6) As a developer, make sure that if things do not work out at least
you do not lose ownership of your work.
7) If it does not work because the other party did not put the money
due in, they still owe you money if you did your part.
8) Having connections is an asset if your are looking for a job, does
not help you much if you hope to sell a product to those
"connections". If the product is good, people you do know know are
more likely to buy from you than your closest friends and colleagues.
"I want a facebook clone or other web site targeted to community XYZ"
is not an idea worth any money.
The ideas worth money are those that translate directly into code that
you would not know how to write yourself.
We all have good ideas that do not carry on because have no time.
There are lots of people out there that are great salespeople (and
there is lots of value in that) but it is them who should work for you
(you who make a product), not you for them. If selling and making
money becomes more important than the quality of the product, the
product sucks and you lose interest.
I have been there. I suggest:
1) attach a price to any work done by any party
2) agree to percentages of ownership
3) agree on partial deadlines and figure out who owns what (time or
money) to the company
4) put the money into a bank account even if unused.
5) Agree on conditions for getting out at any time without or without
default.
6) As a developer, make sure that if things do not work out at least
you do not lose ownership of your work.
7) If it does not work because the other party did not put the money
due in, they still owe you money if you did your part.
8) Having connections is an asset if your are looking for a job, does
not help you much if you hope to sell a product to those
"connections". If the product is good, people you do know know are
more likely to buy from you than your closest friends and colleagues.
GoldenTiger
May 6, 2011, 12:15:46 PM5/6/11
to web...@googlegroups.com
>> Massimo Di Pierro:
>> I did not know Ross (or I did not remember). That means there are even
>> more people doing experts4solution work than I thought
Me too.
My current job is because web2py. It is a high-paying job, no schedules, and I work from home.
The job requirements were "an expert programmer with extensive demonstrable knowledge of Python for Network Administration and Web Development"
They had never heard of web2py, but they really liked it when I showed.
I am developing an intranet application for an official organization in my area.
>> I did not know Ross (or I did not remember). That means there are even
>> more people doing experts4solution work than I thought
My current job is because web2py. It is a high-paying job, no schedules, and I work from home.
The job requirements were "an expert programmer with extensive demonstrable knowledge of Python for Network Administration and Web Development"
They had never heard of web2py, but they really liked it when I showed.
I am developing an intranet application for an official organization in my area.
Massimo Di Pierro
May 6, 2011, 1:15:25 PM5/6/11
to web2py-users
:-)
On May 6, 11:15 am, GoldenTiger <goldenboy...@gmail.com> wrote:
> * >> Massimo Di Pierro*:
> * >> I did not know Ross (or I did not remember). That means there are even
> *
On May 6, 11:15 am, GoldenTiger <goldenboy...@gmail.com> wrote:
> * >> Massimo Di Pierro*:
> * >> I did not know Ross (or I did not remember). That means there are even
>
> >> more people doing experts4solution work than I thought
> *
> >> more people doing experts4solution work than I thought
> Me too.
> My current job is because web2py. It is a high-paying job, no schedules, and
> I work from home.
> The job requirements were "an expert programmer with extensive demonstrable
> knowledge of Python for Network Administration and Web Development"
> They had never heard of web2py, but they really liked it when I showed.
> I am developing an intranet application for an official organization in my
> area.*
> My current job is because web2py. It is a high-paying job, no schedules, and
> I work from home.
> The job requirements were "an expert programmer with extensive demonstrable
> knowledge of Python for Network Administration and Web Development"
> They had never heard of web2py, but they really liked it when I showed.
> I am developing an intranet application for an official organization in my
> *
Jason Brower
May 6, 2011, 1:40:44 PM5/6/11
to web...@googlegroups.com
Awww... Massimo... is that a tear? I knew you had made a good product,
but I didn't know you were man enough to cry about it. :)
but I didn't know you were man enough to cry about it. :)
:P
Reply all
Reply to author
Forward
0 new messages