Gerrit supporting L10N may be a good idea at current timing

[滕龙]

Hello! Everyone:

My name is Teng Long (English name: Dyrone), I'm an engineer working at Alibaba in Hang Zhou, China; I'm responsible for Alibaba's Gerrits and other code services or products.

Although I haven’t been to Gerrit for a long time (just from last year). I think Gerrit is a very good product and has some unique code management concepts. The community is good too, I got a lot of help in it, I also gained a lot, and I also want to give back to the community.

Back to the topic, ever since I got in touch with Gerrit, I've been having a problem that is why Gerrit does not support I18N (or L10N). This can benefit more people, especially English is not the mother language regions, like China. This will not only make more people understand and use Gerrit but also make the community more active and the ecology more complete.

Previously, Gerrit was experiencing the process of upgrading the UI from GWT to Poly-UI. So, now may be the time to consider the internationalization. This is not a simple task and involves front-end, back-end, documentation and need some supporting processes and tools, such as how to manage the modification and publishing of international content. I think git L10N is a very good example, git has a role named L10N coordinator responsible for the relative L10N work(https://github.com/git/git/blob/master/po/README). Git is written in C and uses `gettext` for message format. But Gerrit is more complex，take a look at it separately（maybe not complete）:

  1. Documents: Maybe we can use a common message format tool like `gettext` or some else. When some new documentation's modifications come in, the coordinator is responsible for it to make L10N works done. Granularity may need to be considered, for example, git is a minor version (like 2.25) to update international content when it releases, not every tiny version (like 2.25.1). I don't mean that we should follow git's way, but maybe it needs to be considered.

  2. Front-end: Gerrit looks like use polymer2.0 now, maybe L10N can be supported with polymer localize

  3. Back-end: It contains a lot of content with back-end. I think the command-line interface and the normal and abnormal prompt information provided to the front end should be given priority, followed by API, LOG, PGM prompt, etc. (I think that may not even need internationalization, but it also needs to be considered).

Above are some of my thoughts on L10N. I hope Gerrit can support it as soon as possible so that more people can overcome the language barrier. At the same time, I will try my best to help if necessary. Although my English is not very good, I think my Chinese should be fine 😂.

Thanks.

[Saša Živkov]

On Wed, Mar 18, 2020 at 4:16 PM 滕龙 <dyron...@gmail.com> wrote:

Hello! Everyone:

My name is Teng Long (English name: Dyrone), I'm an engineer working at Alibaba in Hang Zhou, China; I'm responsible for Alibaba's Gerrits and other code services or products.

While I leave it to frontend developers to comment on your L10N proposal, I find it cool that Alibaba is using Gerrit.

Just out of curiosity, if possible could you give us some numbers: how many Gerrit servers, how many users, repositories, changes etc...

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[滕龙]

Glad to meet you Zivkov!

If you have some inputs or ideas about the L10N, please contact me anytime.

Alibaba is using Gerrit for nearly 8 years,  I can answer the curiosity with general data:

                       Servers: Six Gerrit clusters for different development departments, about 20 servers

                       Users： 2 Thousand +

                       Repositories:  20 Thousand +

                       Changes:  Hundreds of thousands 

在 2020年3月19日星期四 UTC+8下午7:59:34，zivkov写道：

On Wed, Mar 18, 2020 at 4:16 PM 滕龙 <dyron...@gmail.com> wrote:

Hello! Everyone:

My name is Teng Long (English name: Dyrone), I'm an engineer working at Alibaba in Hang Zhou, China; I'm responsible for Alibaba's Gerrits and other code services or products.

While I leave it to frontend developers to comment on your L10N proposal, I find it cool that Alibaba is using Gerrit.

Just out of curiosity, if possible could you give us some numbers: how many Gerrit servers, how many users, repositories, changes etc...

Although I haven’t been to Gerrit for a long time (just from last year). I think Gerrit is a very good product and has some unique code management concepts. The community is good too, I got a lot of help in it, I also gained a lot, and I also want to give back to the community.

Back to the topic, ever since I got in touch with Gerrit, I've been having a problem that is why Gerrit does not support I18N (or L10N). This can benefit more people, especially English is not the mother language regions, like China. This will not only make more people understand and use Gerrit but also make the community more active and the ecology more complete.

Previously, Gerrit was experiencing the process of upgrading the UI from GWT to Poly-UI. So, now may be the time to consider the internationalization. This is not a simple task and involves front-end, back-end, documentation and need some supporting processes and tools, such as how to manage the modification and publishing of international content. I think git L10N is a very good example, git has a role named L10N coordinator responsible for the relative L10N work(https://github.com/git/git/blob/master/po/README). Git is written in C and uses `gettext` for message format. But Gerrit is more complex，take a look at it separately（maybe not complete）:

  1. Documents: Maybe we can use a common message format tool like `gettext` or some else. When some new documentation's modifications come in, the coordinator is responsible for it to make L10N works done. Granularity may need to be considered, for example, git is a minor version (like 2.25) to update international content when it releases, not every tiny version (like 2.25.1). I don't mean that we should follow git's way, but maybe it needs to be considered.

  2. Front-end: Gerrit looks like use polymer2.0 now, maybe L10N can be supported with polymer localize

  3. Back-end: It contains a lot of content with back-end. I think the command-line interface and the normal and abnormal prompt information provided to the front end should be given priority, followed by API, LOG, PGM prompt, etc. (I think that may not even need internationalization, but it also needs to be considered).

Above are some of my thoughts on L10N. I hope Gerrit can support it as soon as possible so that more people can overcome the language barrier. At the same time, I will try my best to help if necessary. Although my English is not very good, I think my Chinese should be fine 😂.

Thanks.

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[Luca Milanesio]

On 19 Mar 2020, at 12:09, 滕龙 <dyron...@gmail.com> wrote:

Glad to meet you Zivkov!

If you have some inputs or ideas about the L10N, please contact me anytime.

Alibaba is using Gerrit for nearly 8 years, 

Wow, impressive. I don't believe I've ever found anyone from Alibaba (before you) writing to the mailing list.

Glad it has been working successfully for so long ;-)

I can answer the curiosity with general data:

                       Servers: Six Gerrit clusters for different development departments, about 20 servers

What clustering are you using?

HA? multi-site? other?

                       Users： 2 Thousand +

                       Repositories:  20 Thousand +

                       Changes:  Hundreds of thousands 

It's big, but not huge as installation.

Are the 2k users spread across the different clusters?

Luca.

在 2020年3月19日星期四 UTC+8下午7:59:34，zivkov写道：

On Wed, Mar 18, 2020 at 4:16 PM 滕龙 <dyron...@gmail.com> wrote:

Hello! Everyone:

My name is Teng Long (English name: Dyrone), I'm an engineer working at Alibaba in Hang Zhou, China; I'm responsible for Alibaba's Gerrits and other code services or products.

While I leave it to frontend developers to comment on your L10N proposal, I find it cool that Alibaba is using Gerrit.

Just out of curiosity, if possible could you give us some numbers: how many Gerrit servers, how many users, repositories, changes etc...

Although I haven’t been to Gerrit for a long time (just from last year). I think Gerrit is a very good product and has some unique code management concepts. The community is good too, I got a lot of help in it, I also gained a lot, and I also want to give back to the community.

Back to the topic, ever since I got in touch with Gerrit, I've been having a problem that is why Gerrit does not support I18N (or L10N). This can benefit more people, especially English is not the mother language regions, like China. This will not only make more people understand and use Gerrit but also make the community more active and the ecology more complete.

Previously, Gerrit was experiencing the process of upgrading the UI from GWT to Poly-UI. So, now may be the time to consider the internationalization. This is not a simple task and involves front-end, back-end, documentation and need some supporting processes and tools, such as how to manage the modification and publishing of international content. I think git L10N is a very good example, git has a role named L10N coordinator responsible for the relative L10N work(https://github.com/git/git/blob/master/po/README). Git is written in C and uses `gettext` for message format. But Gerrit is more complex，take a look at it separately（maybe not complete）:

  1. Documents: Maybe we can use a common message format tool like `gettext` or some else. When some new documentation's modifications come in, the coordinator is responsible for it to make L10N works done. Granularity may need to be considered, for example, git is a minor version (like 2.25) to update international content when it releases, not every tiny version (like 2.25.1). I don't mean that we should follow git's way, but maybe it needs to be considered.

  2. Front-end: Gerrit looks like use polymer2.0 now, maybe L10N can be supported with polymer localize

  3. Back-end: It contains a lot of content with back-end. I think the command-line interface and the normal and abnormal prompt information provided to the front end should be given priority, followed by API, LOG, PGM prompt, etc. (I think that may not even need internationalization, but it also needs to be considered).

Above are some of my thoughts on L10N. I hope Gerrit can support it as soon as possible so that more people can overcome the language barrier. At the same time, I will try my best to help if necessary. Although my English is not very good, I think my Chinese should be fine 😂.

Thanks.

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[滕龙]

Hi Luca, nice to meet you again and thank you for the help for a long time.

 

What clustering are you using?

HA? multi-site? other?

We are using part of HA and other self-developed modules to let the whole distributed architecture work, this is the work I had done last year. There still exists some problems, but the overall service and function have been stabilized. I will continue to work on it to make it better at Alibaba and make more communications with the community.

Are the 2k users spread across the different clusters?

No, they are using their self cluster without across. It is only due to long historical reasons. After taking over last year, I began to learn about Gerrit and try to solve the problems of stability, throughput, and scalability through some transformations.

By the way, I am still waiting for your book💐 , are you remember?

在 2020年3月19日星期四 UTC+8下午8:15:17，lucamilanesio写道：

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[Luca Milanesio]

On 19 Mar 2020, at 12:30, 滕龙 <dyron...@gmail.com> wrote:

Hi Luca, nice to meet you again and thank you for the help for a long time.

 

What clustering are you using?

HA? multi-site? other?

We are using part of HA and other self-developed modules to let the whole distributed architecture work, this is the work I had done last year. There still exists some problems, but the overall service and function have been stabilized. I will continue to work on it to make it better at Alibaba and make more communications with the community.

Are the 2k users spread across the different clusters?

No, they are using their self cluster without across. It is only due to long historical reasons. After taking over last year, I began to learn about Gerrit and try to solve the problems of stability, throughput, and scalability through some transformations.

By the way, I am still waiting for your book💐 , are you remember?

I know :-( having a Chinese version would be nice ... I am still pushing the publisher to agree on it.

The funny thing about writing books, is that the IP belongs to the publisher and NOT to the author ... that's the world of publishing works.

Luca.

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[滕龙]

I agree with that 😄

在 2020年3月19日星期四 UTC+8下午8:36:27，lucamilanesio写道：

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[Ben Rohlfs]

Hi Dyrone,

great to have to have you and Alibaba in the Gerrit community!

We have discussed your proposal to localize Gerrit in today's ESC meeting. We would all love to have Gerrit localized and can see the overall positive impact that would have. Unfortunately we have a hard time prioritizing L10N over other work that we have planned for this year. And we are in doubt about the feasibility of an external contribution without prior Gerrit dev experience.

Gerrit's dev team is small (~10, not ~100) and we are in the process of paying off substantial tech debt, especially on the frontend side. Polymer 2 was just one of many steps to take. And we have decided to invest substantially in A11Y over the next few quarters. Maybe we can re-evaluate this request next year when tech debt is mostly paid off and A11Y is on a level that we are happy with.

Sorry for having such a disappointing answer for something that by itself would be a really nice feature to have.

Regards, Ben

On Wed, Mar 18, 2020 at 4:16 PM 滕龙 <dyron...@gmail.com> wrote:

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[滕龙]

Hi, Ben Rohlfs!

Happy to see you discussed L10N on ESC. It's ok to me because I just want Gerrit to be better and more people like to use it. :)

Actually, I put a fraction of the time in the back-end of Gerrit L10N this week. I totally understand your consideration and will pause the job at hand and wait for a suitable time to rethinking about Gerrit L10N.

Thanks

Dyrone Teng

在 2020年3月24日星期二 UTC+8下午9:42:31，Ben Rohlfs写道：

Hi Dyrone,

great to have to have you and Alibaba in the Gerrit community!

We have discussed your proposal to localize Gerrit in today's ESC meeting. We would all love to have Gerrit localized and can see the overall positive impact that would have. Unfortunately we have a hard time prioritizing L10N over other work that we have planned for this year. And we are in doubt about the feasibility of an external contribution without prior Gerrit dev experience.

Gerrit's dev team is small (~10, not ~100) and we are in the process of paying off substantial tech debt, especially on the frontend side. Polymer 2 was just one of many steps to take. And we have decided to invest substantially in A11Y over the next few quarters. Maybe we can re-evaluate this request next year when tech debt is mostly paid off and A11Y is on a level that we are happy with.

Sorry for having such a disappointing answer for something that by itself would be a really nice feature to have.

Regards, Ben

On Wed, Mar 18, 2020 at 4:16 PM 滕龙 <dyron...@gmail.com> wrote:

Hello! Everyone:

My name is Teng Long (English name: Dyrone), I'm an engineer working at Alibaba in Hang Zhou, China; I'm responsible for Alibaba's Gerrits and other code services or products.

Although I haven’t been to Gerrit for a long time (just from last year). I think Gerrit is a very good product and has some unique code management concepts. The community is good too, I got a lot of help in it, I also gained a lot, and I also want to give back to the community.

Back to the topic, ever since I got in touch with Gerrit, I've been having a problem that is why Gerrit does not support I18N (or L10N). This can benefit more people, especially English is not the mother language regions, like China. This will not only make more people understand and use Gerrit but also make the community more active and the ecology more complete.

Previously, Gerrit was experiencing the process of upgrading the UI from GWT to Poly-UI. So, now may be the time to consider the internationalization. This is not a simple task and involves front-end, back-end, documentation and need some supporting processes and tools, such as how to manage the modification and publishing of international content. I think git L10N is a very good example, git has a role named L10N coordinator responsible for the relative L10N work(https://github.com/git/git/blob/master/po/README). Git is written in C and uses `gettext` for message format. But Gerrit is more complex，take a look at it separately（maybe not complete）:

  1. Documents: Maybe we can use a common message format tool like `gettext` or some else. When some new documentation's modifications come in, the coordinator is responsible for it to make L10N works done. Granularity may need to be considered, for example, git is a minor version (like 2.25) to update international content when it releases, not every tiny version (like 2.25.1). I don't mean that we should follow git's way, but maybe it needs to be considered.

  2. Front-end: Gerrit looks like use polymer2.0 now, maybe L10N can be supported with polymer localize

  3. Back-end: It contains a lot of content with back-end. I think the command-line interface and the normal and abnormal prompt information provided to the front end should be given priority, followed by API, LOG, PGM prompt, etc. (I think that may not even need internationalization, but it also needs to be considered).

Above are some of my thoughts on L10N. I hope Gerrit can support it as soon as possible so that more people can overcome the language barrier. At the same time, I will try my best to help if necessary. Although my English is not very good, I think my Chinese should be fine 😂.

Thanks.

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