[LSJ] Damage dealing phase(s)
henrik isaksson
simultaneous or is there a small pause between the acting minion's removal
and the blocking minion's?
/henrik isaksson
LSJ
> In a combat does the removing of blood from the minions due to damage happen
> simultaneous or is there a small pause between the acting minion's removal
> and the blocking minion's?
Simultaneous.
--
LSJ (vte...@white-wolf.com) V:TES Net.Rep for White Wolf, Inc.
Links to V:TES news, rules, cards, utilities, and tournament calendar:
http://www.white-wolf.com/vtes/
The Doctor
> "henrik isaksson" <PLEASEDONTSP...@spray.se> wrote in message news:2nbp52F...@uni-berlin.de...
>> In a combat does the removing of blood from the minions due to damage happen
>> simultaneous or is there a small pause between the acting minion's removal
>> and the blocking minion's?
>
>
> Simultaneous.
And stealing blood vs. damage ?
//Doc.
Colin McGuigan
> And stealing blood vs. damage ?
Short: Blood is stolen before damage.
Long: There are three phases:
Strike Declaration
Strike Resolution
Damage Handling
Blood is stolen in the resolution phase, but blood isn't spent to heal
damage until the damage handling phase. So if you Theft someone for 2,
you can use those 2 to heal damage. Unless you were full, in which case
they drain off before you can do so.
--Colin McGuigan
Miller Delmardigan
look:
Combat at long range
Vamp A steals too blood from the Murder of Crows
Vamp B throws a sewer lid (or whatever)
what happens? Do the Murder of Crows inflicts its damage?
MD
Izaak
"The Doctor" <D...@freemail.nl> schreef in bericht
news:4110d739$0$48933$e4fe...@news.xs4all.nl...
Stealing Blood is not dealing damage. It's a common misconception that
doing "x" damage also means losing "x blood from a strike". You do not
remove blood from receiving the damage directly. You count how much
damage is done and then you proceed to the heal damage phase, which
usually means you have to remove a blood for each point of damage, but
exceptions exist (Sword of Nuln, Regenerative Blood).
So it's like this:
1) Both minions choose strikes, for the sake of example Aisling
Sturbridge plays Theft and Lupo hits for 2 with UD Strength.
2) Strikes take effect simultaneous, so you move two blood from Lupo to
Aisling (and remove excess) and Lupo hits her for two points of damage.
Aisling does not yet lose blood during the strike resolution.
3) Any unhealed damage must be healed after the strike resolution, so
Aisling must burn two blood to heal the damage done to her, while Lupo,
who hasn't received any damage doesn't need to burn blood. This is also
the phase of combat where you play Taste of Vitae.
4) Any additional strikes can now be generated and are handled the same
way (repeat step 1-3)
5) If both minions are still ready you move on to the "end of round"
phase, where cards like Disarm and Pulled Fangs can be played and any
presses are being handled.
The simple version more or less reads: "blood stealing goes before
damage", but is technically wrong.
Izaak
> Vamp A steals too blood from the Murder of Crows
> Vamp B throws a sewer lid (or whatever)
> what happens? Do the Murder of Crows inflicts its damage?
They do.
* Vamp A steals the two blood during strike resolution.
* Simultaneously, the Murder (whose effect triggers "during strike
resolution") deals one damage to Vamp A.
* During the damage healing phase, Vamp A must burn a total of 4 blood
to heal all the damage done to him, or he or she must go to torpor.
Gregory Stuart Pettigrew
> Sturbridge plays Theft and Lupo hits for 2 with UD Strength.
> 2) Strikes take effect simultaneous, so you move two blood from Lupo to
> Aisling (and remove excess) and Lupo hits her for two points of damage.
> Aisling does not yet lose blood during the strike resolution.
> 3) Any unhealed damage must be healed after the strike resolution, so
> Aisling must burn two blood to heal the damage done to her, while Lupo,
> who hasn't received any damage doesn't need to burn blood. This is also
> the phase of combat where you play Taste of Vitae.
Incorrect, Taste of Vitae is played during "5)"
Gregory Stuart Pettigrew
> Vamp A steals too blood from the Murder of Crows
> Vamp B throws a sewer lid (or whatever)
> what happens? Do the Murder of Crows inflicts its damage?
>
Let's place everyone's effects in the proper timeline.
1. Strike Declaration
A steals two blood.
B throws a sewer lid.
Crows inflicts 1R damage.
2. Strike Resolution
A takes four damage and gains 2 blood (remove excess blood).
B takes zero damage.
Crows lose two life and is burned.
3. Damage Resolution
A now loses blood due to damage and/or plays cards to prevent damage.
Izaak
"Gregory Stuart Pettigrew" <ethe...@sidehack.sat.gweep.net> schreef in
bericht news:200408040...@sidehack.sat.gweep.net...
> > 1) Both minions choose strikes, for the sake of example Aisling
> > Sturbridge plays Theft and Lupo hits for 2 with UD Strength.
> > 2) Strikes take effect simultaneous, so you move two blood from Lupo
to
> > Aisling (and remove excess) and Lupo hits her for two points of
damage.
> > Aisling does not yet lose blood during the strike resolution.
> > 3) Any unhealed damage must be healed after the strike resolution,
so
> > Aisling must burn two blood to heal the damage done to her, while
Lupo,
> > who hasn't received any damage doesn't need to burn blood. This is
also
> > the phase of combat where you play Taste of Vitae.
>
> Incorrect, Taste of Vitae is played during "5)"
I'm only just now noticing the ELDB card text is wrong.
My CE cardtext is indeed correct. I knew something was wrong when I
typed that. You know, I actually had Taste in step 5 initially, but
decided to look up card text to be certain.
A quick request to Lasombra, could you please update the ELDB text of
Taste to say "only usable at end of round" instead of "after strike
resolution"?
Joshua Duffin
"Gregory Stuart Pettigrew" <ethe...@sidehack.sat.gweep.net> wrote in
message news:200408040...@sidehack.sat.gweep.net...
> > Combat at long range
> > Vamp A steals too blood from the Murder of Crows
> > Vamp B throws a sewer lid (or whatever)
> > what happens? Do the Murder of Crows inflicts its damage?
> >
>
> Let's place everyone's effects in the proper timeline.
>
> 1. Strike Declaration
> A steals two blood.
> B throws a sewer lid.
> Crows inflicts 1R damage.
I think "Crows inflicts 1R damage" actually belongs in (2) below. It's
not a strike-declaration effect, it's just an effect that takes place
during normal strike resolution. If, for example, Murder of Crows is
killed by the opposing minion with First Strike (or its employing
vampire is torporized with First Strike), its damage will not be applied
during regular strike resolution.
> 2. Strike Resolution
> A takes four damage and gains 2 blood (remove excess blood).
> B takes zero damage.
> Crows lose two life and is burned.
>
> 3. Damage Resolution
> A now loses blood due to damage and/or plays cards to prevent damage.
This all looks solid to me though.
Josh
lacks first strike capability
henrik isaksson
news:2nc1g9F...@uni-berlin.de...
> "henrik isaksson" <PLEASEDONTSP...@spray.se> wrote in message
news:2nbp52F...@uni-berlin.de...
> > In a combat does the removing of blood from the minions due to damage
happen
> > simultaneous or is there a small pause between the acting minion's
removal
> > and the blocking minion's?
>
>
> Simultaneous.
>
If Barry is in combat with a War ghoul, and plays blood of acid, is there no
time for a vagabond mystic to tap to heal the war ghoul for 1 which thus
survives? Or does blood of acid set up it's own little damage resolution
step after the regular one?
It's a little complicated as blood of acid doesn't know how much damage to
inflict until it's inflicted =)
/henrik isaksson
John Flournoy
Quoting from the online version of the rulebook:
"The effects of the strikes from both minions are resolved
simultaneously.
(part snipped about ranged vs. close)
When a minion or retainer takes damage (either from a strike or from
other means), he must burn blood or lose life, as appropriate (see
Damage Resolution, sec. 6.4.6). Note that the effects of a strike are
applied and then damage is resolved. This timing is important for some
special strikes, such as steal blood (see Strike Effects, sec.
6.4.5)."
So long as the strikes themselves are simultaneously taking effect,
then yes, the resolving of damage (including removing blood) are
simultaneous.
-John Flournoy
LSJ
> If Barry is in combat with a War ghoul, and plays blood of acid, is there no
> time for a vagabond mystic to tap to heal the war ghoul for 1 which thus
> survives?
Right.
> Or does blood of acid set up it's own little damage resolution
> step after the regular one?
No.
> It's a little complicated as blood of acid doesn't know how much damage to
> inflict until it's inflicted =)
Barry: Blood of Acid.
Choose Strikes:
Barry: hands for 2.
War Ghoul: hands for 4.
Resolve Strikes:
A. Apply effects (2 damage to War Ghoul. 4 to Barry.)
B. Damage handling
B.1. Prevent damage (War Ghoul prevents 1, or not).
B.2. Barry takes 4 damage (successfully inflicted). War Ghoul now
receives 4 more damage from BoA, which she could now try to
prevent. Whatever is unprevented is successful.
B.3. Burn blood/life for successful damage.
Barry burns 4 blood to heal (or goes to torpor, of course).
War Ghoul burns 5 life (assuming she prevented only 1 point).
henrik isaksson
> Barry: Blood of Acid.
>
> Choose Strikes:
> Barry: hands for 2.
> War Ghoul: hands for 4.
>
> Resolve Strikes:
> A. Apply effects (2 damage to War Ghoul. 4 to Barry.)
> B. Damage handling
> B.1. Prevent damage (War Ghoul prevents 1, or not).
> B.2. Barry takes 4 damage (successfully inflicted). War Ghoul now
> receives 4 more damage from BoA, which she could now try to
> prevent. Whatever is unprevented is successful.
> B.3. Burn blood/life for successful damage.
> Barry burns 4 blood to heal (or goes to torpor, of course).
> War Ghoul burns 5 life (assuming she prevented only 1 point).
Fine. B2 is a bit confusing, as more damage is added there, but since it's
you I buy it! =)
/henrik isaksson
Barry: 2 war ghoul frags, his big brother Dragos only 1.
The Lasombra
wrote:
>A quick request to Lasombra, could you please update the ELDB text of
>Taste to say "only usable at end of round" instead of "after strike
>resolution"?
Done.
Carpe noctem.
Lasombra