Torvus Bloodbeard Question
adam....@ngc.com
Independent: During any Methuselah's minion phase, you may burn the
Edge to untap Torvus. +1 strength.
Question: When is it too late to burn the edge?
Someone is bleeding a methuselah, it is possible that the edge will be
lost here, when is it too late to use Torvus's ability?
LSJ
> Torvus Bloodbeard
>
> Independent: During any Methuselah's minion phase, you may burn the
> Edge to untap Torvus. +1 strength.
>
>
> Question: When is it too late to burn the edge?
When you no longer have it.
> Someone is bleeding a methuselah, it is possible that the edge will be
> lost here, when is it too late to use Torvus's ability?
Burn it before burning the pool (after all the other block
attempts, reactions, modifiers, etc.)
--
LSJ (vte...@white-wolf.com) V:TES Net.Rep for White Wolf, Inc.
V:TES homepage: http://www.white-wolf.com/vtes/
Though effective, appear to be ineffective -- Sun Tzu
Colin McGuigan
After all blocks have failed and there are no new blocks, and when
everyone passes on playing an effect. 1.6.1.6 governs who has to play
effects first (acting meth, defending meth, then others clockwise from
the acting).
--Colin McGuigan
adam....@ngc.com
So therefore, if the control of Torvus is the "third party", then after
the bleed is "let through", it is too late for me to burn the edge,
since the defending meth has to lose the pool, thus giving the acting
minion the edge (then I would get to play effects but by then its too
late.)
However, if the Torvus's meth is the acting or defending meth, then it
is NOT too late, since the controller can choose which effect to happen
first.
Example: If Torvus controller has the edge, and Torvus bleeds, before
the bleed is completed, can Torvus's controller burn the edge (and
untap) then regain the edge for Torvus's bleed?
LSJ
> So therefore, if the control of Torvus is the "third party", then after
> the bleed is "let through", it is too late for me to burn the edge,
> since the defending meth has to lose the pool, thus giving the acting
> minion the edge (then I would get to play effects but by then its too
> late.)
>
> However, if the Torvus's meth is the acting or defending meth, then it
> is NOT too late, since the controller can choose which effect to happen
> first.
>
> Example: If Torvus controller has the edge, and Torvus bleeds, before
> the bleed is completed, can Torvus's controller burn the edge (and
> untap) then regain the edge for Torvus's bleed?
The Edge-bearer can choose to part with it in the same timing
window as he or she could play Folderol or (if acting) Spying Mission.
Morgan Vening
>So therefore, if the control of Torvus is the "third party", then after
>the bleed is "let through", it is too late for me to burn the edge,
>since the defending meth has to lose the pool, thus giving the acting
>minion the edge (then I would get to play effects but by then its too
>late.)
Not how I see it.
P1 "I bleed".
P2 "I don't block".
P3-5 must decline block attempts.
P1 " I don't play anything." (Bleed Boost, etc)
P2 "I don't play anything." (Bounce, Bleed Reduc, etc)
P3-5 again, must decline to play anything.
So you can do it just before the bleed actually hits, but that will
initate another round of activity. As I remember it, everyone must
pass without any effect, for the action to progress. If they just zip
past, you can require it be backed up a step.
>However, if the Torvus's meth is the acting or defending meth, then it
>is NOT too late, since the controller can choose which effect to happen
>first.
>
>Example: If Torvus controller has the edge, and Torvus bleeds, before
>the bleed is completed, can Torvus's controller burn the edge (and
>untap) then regain the edge for Torvus's bleed?
This can happen, but can be affected as above. In that you, as the
acting methuselah, would have to declare it first (step 4 above), OR
bank on someone else at the table reacting. If you go "Don't play
anything", and noone else acts, the bleed resolves, and you miss your
window. If, after declined blocks, you go "I untap Torvus by burning
the Edge", other players can react, possibly reducing the bleed to
zero, and you don't untap.
Morgan Vening
Colin McGuigan
> So therefore, if the control of Torvus is the "third party", then after
> the bleed is "let through", it is too late for me to burn the edge,
> since the defending meth has to lose the pool, thus giving the acting
> minion the edge (then I would get to play effects but by then its too
> late.)
No. The bleed being "let through" only happens once all have passed.
Eg, any of the 3rd party Methuselahs could play Folderol.
So, if anytime after the blocking stage has passed, all Methuselahs pass
-- then it's too late.
> Example: If Torvus controller has the edge, and Torvus bleeds, before
> the bleed is completed, can Torvus's controller burn the edge (and
> untap) then regain the edge for Torvus's bleed?
Yes (assuming that the bleed isn't subsequently reduced to 0 by, eg,
Telepathic Counter).
--Colin McGuigan