BTECH Scenerio
MOORE, ERIC LEE
There is one thing about the 12 panther scenerio that makes it
almost completely unfair. Those panters ARE CARRYING PPCs. It
does not take a genius long to figure out that slow mechs are
going to get chewed up by these guys. When you start combining
fire with PPCs, shots are going to be hitting on top of each
other fairly frequently. Even heavily armored foes begin to
stop and think when 2 or 3 PPCs hit the same location.
On the average, a light group that out number a heavy group
by 1.5 to 1 or better, will usually end up killy the heavy
group or making it a Phyrric victory for the heavies.
Mok
a.k.a. Mjr Kessel
CMDR 537th Heavy Company
(2nd Company on the horizon...<WHOA Salvage>..)
Mercs employed by Federats
How can you expect to outwit a maniacal genius on an
empty tummy?
-Eve
Mann and Machine
tai...@kosmos.wcc.govt.nz
elm...@zeus.tamu.edu (MOORE, ERIC LEE) writes:
>There is one thing about the 12 panther scenerio that makes it
>almost completely unfair. Those panters ARE CARRYING PPCs. It
>does not take a genius long to figure out that slow mechs are
>going to get chewed up by these guys. When you start combining
>fire with PPCs, shots are going to be hitting on top of each
>other fairly frequently. Even heavily armored foes begin to
>stop and think when 2 or 3 PPCs hit the same location.
Agreed! The Panther is the nastiest light mek around, why? Because
it has a PPC. Though this mek is the slowest of all the light meks,
it packs the heaviest punch. Those 10 points in one location and
you have long range and you have enough heat sinks. Fire PPC and
jump 3 and no heat buildup :). As a Kuritan I have used this mek
many times and oh the number of Wolfhounds I have killed! :-)
>On the average, a light group that out number a heavy group
>by 1.5 to 1 or better, will usually end up killy the heavy
>group or making it a Phyrric victory for the heavies.
Possibly, just stick in a few Jenners instead and see the action! :)
>a.k.a. Mjr Kessel
> CMDR 537th Heavy Company
> (2nd Company on the horizon...<WHOA Salvage>..)
> Mercs employed by Federats
Merc/Sellsword eg poor little merc-boy. With the rebuilding and
re-equiping of the House units, the mercs are missing out on all the
new toys/tech. This will mean the sellswords will lose their edge
over "Regular House" units with this policy. Before (3025) mercs
had a higher skill and morale overall, but this is being lost with
all the new technology going to proven units. Expect for "loyal",
elite merc units eg Grey Death, Eridani Light, most merc units will
go into a downward spiral in relationship to technology.
For further information read "Objective Raids Sourcebook"
Tony Taia
tai...@akeake.vuw.ac.nz
TAI...@kosmos.wcc.govt.nz
(3067: The Stacalkas-Nomen, when the Combine kicks butt!! Die Clans!!)
HEY! The WCC and VUW don't know BTEK! So you know that this is mine!
Chris Beauregard
> Agreed! The Panther is the nastiest light mek around, why? Because
>it has a PPC. Though this mek is the slowest of all the light meks,
>it packs the heaviest punch. Those 10 points in one location and
Wrong on both counts, actually. UrbanMech. The standard UM is _the_
slowest light mech, and there's only a few assault mechs as slow (unless
you get to the 10 or 15 ton SlowPoke...). The AC/10 is quite powerfull.
Now try this. Which exactly is the UrbanMech variant which replaces the
AC/10 with an AC/20? You said something about heaviest punch? Even the
SRM 4 on the Panther doesn't even things out.
Also note that the UM has one of the higher armor ratings of light
mechs, at 96 pts. The AC/20 variant (I think it's Marik, not sure) you
have to pull a little off, and probably take out the small laser, but
hey, that 20 is vicious...
>you have long range and you have enough heat sinks. Fire PPC and
>jump 3 and no heat buildup :). As a Kuritan I have used this mek
No problems with the UM either...The only advantages the Panther has over
the UM is the range and speed. The speed advantage _is_ pretty
signifigant though.
> Possibly, just stick in a few Jenners instead and see the action! :)
Hey, someone try out that scenario with UrbanMechs instead of Panthers.
Be interesting.
Also, has anyone ever tried that thing about the Atlas being able to
take on a battalion or company or some ridiculously large number of
Stringers?
>Tony Taia
> tai...@akeake.vuw.ac.nz
> TAI...@kosmos.wcc.govt.nz
Chris Beauregard cpbe...@cayley.waterloo.edu
Differently Expressed: The politically correct term for politically
correct people.
tai...@kosmos.wcc.govt.nz
>In article <1992Jul16.0...@peponi.wcc.govt.nz> tai...@kosmos.wcc.govt.nz writes:
[Superiority of Panthers deleted, see previous postings]
>Wrong on both counts, actually. UrbanMech. The standard UM is _the_
>slowest light mech, and there's only a few assault mechs as slow (unless
>you get to the 10 or 15 ton SlowPoke...). The AC/10 is quite powerfull.
>Now try this. Which exactly is the UrbanMech variant which replaces the
>AC/10 with an AC/20? You said something about heaviest punch? Even the
>SRM 4 on the Panther doesn't even things out.
I stand corrected, I must refer to my TR 3025 again. I change my post to
one of the slowest meks around [Panther].
>Also note that the UM has one of the higher armor ratings of light
>mechs, at 96 pts. The AC/20 variant (I think it's Marik, not sure) you
>have to pull a little off, and probably take out the small laser, but
>hey, that 20 is vicious...
But I think you only have a few [10] shots and the 2-3-2 movement is pathetic!
You only get a +1 to hit , if you RUN in a straight line! So the "trash can"
dies due to useless manuevering. Even the AC/20 doesn't help look at at
meksheet in the Light Mechs Book (whatever it is called)...Pathetic! This
mek is a deathtrap, but a mek is still a mek for the dispossessed :-)
>>you have long range and you have enough heat sinks. Fire PPC and
>>jump 3 and no heat buildup :). As a Kuritan I have used this mek
>No problems with the UM either...The only advantages the Panther has over
>the UM is the range and speed. The speed advantage _is_ pretty
>signifigant though.
Agreed! But we all know that the real meks are in the heavyer tonnages! :-)
>Hey, someone try out that scenario with UrbanMechs instead of Panthers.
Sounds like a much more balanced scenario. Must try it out when I have time.
>Also, has anyone ever tried that thing about the Atlas being able to
>take on a battalion or company or some ridiculously large number of Stingers?
Actually I have twice. But to make it work, you have to do the following.
make all the Stingers green pilots P:6 G:5 and the Atlas P:4 G:3.
Also the Stingers are not allowed to do Death-from-Above or Charges.
The first time, the Atlas suffered from mutliple charging *stupid* and after
a while the Atlas died from 18 point charges! The second time the Atlas ran
out of ammo and killed all the Stingers! Towards the end I just grabbed a
tree for a twenty point club attack. I had lost a medium laser at this point.
Fun game, but expect a long game........
>Chris Beauregard cpbe...@cayley.waterloo.edu
Chris Beauregard
>In article <BrHJF...@undergrad.math.waterloo.edu>, cpbe...@undergrad.math.waterloo.edu (Chris Beauregard) writes:
>>Also note that the UM has one of the higher armor ratings of light
>>mechs, at 96 pts. The AC/20 variant (I think it's Marik, not sure) you
>>have to pull a little off, and probably take out the small laser, but
>>hey, that 20 is vicious...
>
> But I think you only have a few [10] shots and the 2-3-2 movement is pathetic!
>You only get a +1 to hit , if you RUN in a straight line! So the "trash can"
Yes, but find me an UrbanMech that gets off ten or even five
shots. Especially considering the speed factors in there. There
certainly is a reason for the 'urban'. I suppose it would have an okay
survivability (okay, as compared to instant death under most other
circumstances) in a heavily forested area, although the lack of
movement would be an even greater hindrance.
>dies due to useless manuevering. Even the AC/20 doesn't help look at at
>meksheet in the Light Mechs Book (whatever it is called)...Pathetic! This
>mek is a deathtrap, but a mek is still a mek for the dispossessed :-)
Well, yeah, I didn't say it was a really good mech. Just that it was
about the slowest light mech with the heaviest firepower.
> Agreed! But we all know that the real meks are in the heavyer tonnages! :-)
Depends on how you define 'real mek'. You mean, mech's that live
longer? Mechs that pack more punch? Mechs that have a more balanced
mix of firepower, speed, and armor? Lots of light mechs do that.
Something like the Spider or OstScout <sp?> are damned fast, not too
shabby armor, and thus tend to live longer.
I personally consider a 'real mech' (where the hell did this 'mek'
spelling come from anyhow?!?) something well designed to do the job it
was supposed to do. Yes, that makes most mechs real mechs. Yup, even
<gasp> the Scorpion. Uh huh, <sigh> the JaggerMech is a real mech. And
finally, yes, the Ambassador is a real mech. Even wonsidering the fact
that it has absolutely no weapons. And finally, yes, most of those
other 100 ton munchkin mechs I keep bitchin about are real mechs. <sob>
Just not realistic mechs, but that's another story.
Dave Litchman
Actually, as long as you play intelligently, one Locust is enough to take down
an Atlas, barring extreme good luck on the part of the Atlas.
--
"Dammit Jim, I'm a free man, not a number!"
----------------------------------------------------------------------
This is a copy of the mnemonic signature virus. Remember to copy it into
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David J Low
> Actually, as long as you play intelligently, one Locust is enough to take down
> an Atlas, barring extreme good luck on the part of the Atlas.
But what if the Atlas is played just as intelligently? :-)
Against a computer opponent I'd agree with you (I've seen the equivalent
done enough times!), but against an intelligent human I'd disagree. If
you are ever in Oz, drop me a line and we'll try it out....
Actually, this reminds me of an old logic puzzle - N people (make it five
for simplicity) enter a room, each wearing either a blue hat or a red
hat, but not knowing their own colour. They do know that there are at
least two of each colour hat. The trick is to leave the room when you
have worked out your own hat's colour - and all you are allowed to do is
look at the other hats! The general solution relies on assuming that the
other people in the room are intelligent - for example:
1) I walk in and see three blue and one red hat. I immediately know
that mine is red (minimum 2 red hats) and leave.
2) I walk in and see two red and two blue hats. I have no idea about
mine. However, after a moment I see a red-hat leave. Give that he
is intelligent, my hat must be blue (the guy who left must have been
able to deduce his own colour, as in 1) above).
Of course, this can be extended to many people, and even multiple hat
colours...
Anyway, to get to the point (at last!), your tactics can only be as
good as your opponent allows them to be. This philosophy comes out a
lot in chess :-). Sometimes a "bad" move is required to draw your
opponent out where you can nail him. I guess it's no longer a bad
move then, though...This is why computers have trouble beating humans
at chess and other games of thought.
--
___ ~~ | David J. Low, Atmospheric Group, Dept. Physics
/ /-----^-/~~~ | Adelaide University, South Australia
/ /-------/~ "I'll be back"|
<__/ ' --- Arnie | E-Mail : dl...@physics.adelaide.edu.au
Andrew Ross
>Actually, as long as you play intelligently, one Locust is enough to take down
>an Atlas, barring extreme good luck on the part of the Atlas.
WHAT!!!
O.K. Fine, that Atlas is not an all-powerful 'mech killer, but look folks,
there is absolutely no way an Atlas will ever fall to a locust.
EVEN assuming that the Atlas wastes all its ammo on impossible shots
(Locusts are pretty damn fast) and EVEN assuming the Locust can remain in
whatever firing arc of the Atlas' it wants: the Locust will STILL always
be targetted by at least one Med. Laser (remember the Atlas's rear-firing
weapons). Thus we have the Locust's ML vs. an identical armament for the
Atlas (hell, even throw in the bug's MG's to give it a firepower
advantage). It comes down to a slug match, and the Atlas has 5 times the
armor of the Locust.
Andy Ross
ajr...@husc.harvard.edu --that's right, no .sig
Axly
>>Actually, as long as you play intelligently, one Locust is enough to take down
>>an Atlas, barring extreme good luck on the part of the Atlas.
>WHAT!!!
>O.K. Fine, that Atlas is not an all-powerful 'mech killer, but look folks,
>there is absolutely no way an Atlas will ever fall to a locust.
>EVEN assuming that the Atlas wastes all its ammo on impossible shots
>(Locusts are pretty damn fast) and EVEN assuming the Locust can remain in
>whatever firing arc of the Atlas' it wants: the Locust will STILL always
>be targetted by at least one Med. Laser (remember the Atlas's rear-firing
>weapons). Thus we have the Locust's ML vs. an identical armament for the
>Atlas (hell, even throw in the bug's MG's to give it a firepower
>advantage). It comes down to a slug match, and the Atlas has 5 times the
>armor of the Locust.
Well, there are Locusts that carry LRM 5's now. With a missle boat like that,
you can dance around an old style Atlas for days and stand a pretty good
chance of taking it down since all it's weaons are generally close range.
The LRM 20 may give you grief though.
As a side note, I've seen a Locust take out a Daishi, so nothing will
suprise me anymore. (How? One hit with an LRM 5.Rolls a 2. Rolls a Gyro
hit. Hits again with the LRM. Rolls ANOTHER Gyro hit. *sigh* All in all,
I'd say I made a mistake teaching my IO to play BTech.)
Axly
tai...@kosmos.wcc.govt.nz
>In article <1992Jul18.0...@peponi.wcc.govt.nz> tai...@kosmos.wcc.govt.nz writes:
[ Talk about Urbanmechs and their pathetic movement :-) ]
>Yes, but find me an UrbanMech that gets off ten or even five
>shots. Especially considering the speed factors in there. There
>certainly is a reason for the 'urban'. I suppose it would have an okay
>survivability (okay, as compared to instant death under most other
>circumstances) in a heavily forested area, although the lack of
>movement would be an even greater hindrance.
Remember that this is the cheapest mek to buy [refer to Mechwarrior 1st Ed]
so the local planetary council goes off to buy the "most efficient mech
design available, within the budget constraints". This may explain the term
"Urban" :-), cheap civil budgets!
>Well, yeah, I didn't say it was a really good mech. Just that it was
>about the slowest light mech with the heaviest firepower.
THE SLOWEST, but the AC/10 is a bit limited on the field.
>Depends on how you define 'real mek'. You mean, mech's that live
>longer? Mechs that pack more punch? Mechs that have a more balanced
>mix of firepower, speed, and armor? Lots of light mechs do that.
>Something like the Spider or OstScout <sp?> are damned fast, not too
>shabby armor, and thus tend to live longer.
The Jump 7 and fire one medium is a real pain! But a PPC to them isn't
very good for the armor or the internals. :-)
>I personally consider a 'real mech' (where the hell did this 'mek'
>spelling come from anyhow?!?) something well designed to do the job it
>was supposed to do. Yes, that makes most mechs real mechs. Yup, even
><gasp> the Scorpion. Uh huh, <sigh> the JaggerMech is a real mech. And
>finally, yes, the Ambassador is a real mech. Even wonsidering the fact
>that it has absolutely no weapons. And finally, yes, most of those
>other 100 ton munchkin mechs I keep bitchin about are real mechs. <sob>
Ambassador, dude you have copies of "Stardate" and "Stardrive" magazines?
>Chris Beauregard cpbe...@cayley.waterloo.edu
Urbanmechs are mechs too. But Awesome are just that! :-)
Tony Taia
tai...@akeake.vuw.ac.nz, TAI...@kosmos.wcc.govt.nz
3067:The Stacalkas-Nomen, when the Combine destroys the Clans!
*sigh*Not another Cluster, we'll be here till Christmas.
HEY! VUW and WCC don't know Btek, so you know that this is mine!
David J Low
> ajr...@husc10.harvard.edu (Andrew Ross) writes:
> Well, there are Locusts that carry LRM 5's now. With a missle boat like that,
> you can dance around an old style Atlas for days and stand a pretty good
> chance of taking it down since all it's weaons are generally close range.
> The LRM 20 may give you grief though.
Not to mention what happens when the Locust's ammo runs out, and the
pilot resorts to spitting out of the cockpit in an effort to make the
Atlas slip and fall....just keep on running! Proably a dead draw with
a decent sized battlefield (two maps or less may see the Locust in
trouble!).
With real tech (3025), the standard LRM locust (Marik 1M version??)
only had about 16 points of armour. THAT can cause serious grief....
:-)
David.
Chris Beauregard
>In article <BrLvG...@undergrad.math.waterloo.edu>, cpbe...@cayley.waterloo.edu (Chris Beauregard) writes:
>>Well, yeah, I didn't say it was a really good mech. Just that it was
>>about the slowest light mech with the heaviest firepower.
>
> THE SLOWEST, but the AC/10 is a bit limited on the field.
Well, I did mention the AC/20 variant...That's where heaviest firepower
comes in...
>>Something like the Spider or OstScout <sp?> are damned fast, not too
>>shabby armor, and thus tend to live longer.
>
> The Jump 7 and fire one medium is a real pain! But a PPC to them isn't
>very good for the armor or the internals. :-)
Actually, jump 8. <nitpick> The problem is hitting them with a PPC.
+4 target plus whatever terrain mods <what, you don't use terrain?!?>
really dumps your chance of hitting. You wouldn't believe how hard
three OstScouts can be on a heavy or assault. You can have it so that
one of them is almost always pumping the medium, and physical attacks,
into the rear.
Yep, I love it when I randomly end up with one of those and my opponent
gets this look of glee in his eyes. <heh> 'Specially because few
people I know of remember how fast these things are...
> Ambassador, dude you have copies of "Stardate" and "Stardrive" magazines?
Well, I got the one with the mini-mechs in it...Looked interesting.
Those things don't last all that well though...
Say, speaking of mags, anyone ever seen the White Wolf with the Useless
Mechs in it? That Ballista isn't as bad as it looks....
>Tony Taia
> tai...@akeake.vuw.ac.nz, TAI...@kosmos.wcc.govt.nz
tai...@kosmos.wcc.govt.nz
>In article <1992Jul21....@peponi.wcc.govt.nz> tai...@kosmos.wcc.govt.nz writes:
>>In article <BrLvG...@undergrad.math.waterloo.edu>, cpbe...@cayley.waterloo.edu (Chris Beauregard) writes:
[ Urbanmechs being slow etc deleted ]
>> THE SLOWEST, but the AC/10 is a bit limited on the field.
>Well, I did mention the AC/20 variant...That's where heaviest firepower
>comes in...
Oh yeah, but I think that the loss of armour and range are both huge
minus'. It allows the mech a lot of firepower, but when an Atlas can out
run you......er I don't have a lot of respect for the humble trash can! :-)
[ High speed/jump meks like Spider and Ostscout discussed ]
>> The Jump 7 and fire one medium is a real pain! But a PPC to them isn't
>>very good for the armor or the internals. :-)
>Actually, jump 8. <nitpick> The problem is hitting them with a PPC.
>+4 target plus whatever terrain mods <what, you don't use terrain?!?>
>really dumps your chance of hitting. You wouldn't believe how hard
>three OstScouts can be on a heavy or assault. You can have it so that
>one of them is almost always pumping the medium, and physical attacks,
>into the rear.
I was refering to the +4 modifer at jump-7, the jump-8 is not necessary
unless you want to move into a better position. I totally agreed with you,
as once I had a Heavy Lance spend 14 rounds trying to kill one Ostscout!
With jump-7, you also don't overheat! :-)
>Yep, I love it when I randomly end up with one of those and my opponent
>gets this look of glee in his eyes. <heh> 'Specially because few
>people I know of remember how fast these things are...
I hate it, but I can acknowledge the danger of such a situation. I just
like the bigger meks, that's just me!
>> Ambassador, dude you have copies of "Stardate" and "Stardrive" magazines?
>Well, I got the one with the mini-mechs in it...Looked interesting.
>Those things don't last all that well though...
Oh! I have Stardate #3,4,5,6 and Stardrive #1.
Does anyone have Stardate #1,2 and were there any issues after Stardrive #1?
>Say, speaking of mags, anyone ever seen the White Wolf with the Useless
>Mechs in it? That Ballista isn't as bad as it looks....
Never seen it as New Zealand is a very long way away! My Challenge mags.
take six months to get here :-(
>Chris Beauregard cpbe...@cayley.waterloo.edu
>Differently Expressed: The politically correct term for politically
>correct people.
And I am.....
Dave Litchman
>From article <1992Jul19.0...@admiral.uucp>, by da...@admiral.uucp (Dave Litchman):
>> Actually, as long as you play intelligently, one Locust is enough to take down
>> an Atlas, barring extreme good luck on the part of the Atlas.
>
> But what if the Atlas is played just as intelligently? :-)
>
> Against a computer opponent I'd agree with you (I've seen the equivalent
> done enough times!), but against an intelligent human I'd disagree. If
> you are ever in Oz, drop me a line and we'll try it out....
Well, the time I tried the scenario, I was commanding the Locust, and another
player, who I would describe as 'experienced' drove the Atlas. Based on the
outcome of that battle, and the general design of both 'mechs, I'll put my
money on the Locust every time. The Locust makes up for its lack of firepower
and armor with its speed and flexibility.
In the battle I staged, I made sure that every round I was in a position to
fire, I was in the Atlas' read arc, because 1, the armor is thinner there
(relatively) and 2) all he can bring to bear from that position are his two
read mounted ML's, or, if he torso-twists, one of the lasers in either arm.
Also, I always traveled the 10 hexes necessary for a +4 to-hit modifier, and
stayed 8 hexes away at all times. So, if he fired his MLs at me, he'd need a
12 to hit if he did nothing but stand there, and if he moved at all he couldn't
hit me, period. I didn't allow him to bring his front arc weapons to bear, but
if he had managed it, He still would have needed 12's for his AC/20 and SRM6,
with a minimum of 10 for the LRM20 (if he somehow managed to get the LRM20 to
bear on me without him having to move). I usually needed to roll 10's to hit
with my paired ML's (I do love that Steiner Locust!) but I was rolling 10's a
lot more often that he rolled 12's. He did manage to hit me twice, one hit the
armnor soaked up, the other resulted in an internal, but no crit, while I just
whittled his rear armor down until I got enough CT/Rear crits to drop him.
Chris Beauregard
>In article <BrqMu...@undergrad.math.waterloo.edu>, cpbe...@undergrad.math.waterloo.edu (Chris Beauregard) writes:
>>Say, speaking of mags, anyone ever seen the White Wolf with the Useless
>>Mechs in it? That Ballista isn't as bad as it looks....
>
> Never seen it as New Zealand is a very long way away! My Challenge mags.
>take six months to get here :-(
This one came out about 3 years ago. Number 12, or thereabouts.
The useless mechs are fairly interesting, in that most of them break
rules. As an example, the Meteor jumps further than it walks.
Something like 4/6/8 movement. Designed specifically for DFA. Since
it's ~70 tons, that kinda thing hurts. No penalties mentioned for
jumping like that...(We used the house rule that jumping wasn't a
problem, landing required a piloting roll with a +1 target modifier for
every hex past walking max that you jumped...Also works for those times
when you lose actuators but not jets...) The Sprite was a 15 ton
shitbox, and the Jack-in-Box (or something like that) was...well, two
mechs. Jack was a small mech (really more of an exoskeleton) that actee
as the head of Box. When Box got the shit blown out of it, Jack leaped
out and carryed the mechwarrior to safety. Neat idea. Bad mech. The
Ballista was a fairly decent mech (in comparison) 60 tonner with 2 LRM
20's and an LRM 10. Fairly heavy armor, except for the arms (none - not
that it needed anything there...). Had this slight ammo problem also,
if my memory is correct. One other ammo problem involved the storage of
1 ton of LRM 10 ammo in the head...
As I said, mostly useless mechs. This is not a personal opinion either,
folks, that was the title of the article....
>Tony Taia
> tai...@akeake.vuw.ac.nz, TAI...@kosmos.wcc.govt.nz
UNFORGETTABLE ... IN EVERY WAY . AND FOREVERMORE .. THATS HOW WELL STAY
[Stuff deleted]
> In the battle I staged, I made sure that every round I was in a position to
> fire, I was in the Atlas' read arc, because 1, the armor is thinner there
> (relatively) and 2) all he can bring to bear from that position are his two
> read mounted ML's, or, if he torso-twists, one of the lasers in either arm.
> Also, I always traveled the 10 hexes necessary for a +4 to-hit modifier, and
> stayed 8 hexes away at all times. So, if he fired his MLs at me, he'd need a
> 12 to hit if he did nothing but stand there, and if he moved at all he couldn't
> hit me, period. I didn't allow him to bring his front arc weapons to bear, but
> if he had managed it, He still would have needed 12's for his AC/20 and SRM6,
> with a minimum of 10 for the LRM20 (if he somehow managed to get the LRM20 to
> bear on me without him having to move). I usually needed to roll 10's to hit
> with my paired ML's (I do love that Steiner Locust!) but I was rolling 10's a
> lot more often that he rolled 12's. He did manage to hit me twice, one hit the
> armnor soaked up, the other resulted in an internal, but no crit, while I just
> whittled his rear armor down until I got enough CT/Rear crits to drop him.
I would assume then that there were no other players on the board
other than your Locust and the Atlas?
You have to remember that the Locust would have to get in behind the
Atlas first so it would have to be a suprise attack or bad initiatve
on the half of the atlas?
But i agree with you, in a scenario i played, my Charger was bearing
down on an Archer, and from out of nowhere a Locust got behind me,
the Charger pilot was not impressed, he had no rear armour left by
the time that another of my mechs (another Locust) arrived to save
the Chargers butt!
>
>
> --
> "Dammit Jim, I'm a free man, not a number!"
> ----------------------------------------------------------------------
> This is a copy of the mnemonic signature virus. Remember to copy it into
> your .signature file later. Join the fun!
--
This is just a test .sig
I suppose i should make it bigger, but i cant be bothred.
All the ideas expressed are mine and therefore MUST be correct
I will allow you to be wrong in your ignorance however.
Axly
> You have to remember that the Locust would have to get in behind the
> Atlas first so it would have to be a suprise attack or bad initiatve
> on the half of the atlas?
Not really. If the Atlas moves, it isn't going to be able to hit at all.
So if you win initiative, you go behind him. If you lose, you just move around
so he is forced to take a shot that has a 13 to hit and wait to win initiative
again. Patience is a virtue when driving a trashcan.
> But i agree with you, in a scenario i played, my Charger was bearing
> down on an Archer, and from out of nowhere a Locust got behind me,
> the Charger pilot was not impressed, he had no rear armour left by
> the time that another of my mechs (another Locust) arrived to save
> the Chargers butt!
>
One Mech that I've seen growing in popularity is one of the Solaris
'Mechs that is basically a Locust with a Large Pulse Laser. Speed
and armor are comparable to the original, although this 'Mech does
weigh in at 25 tons. Still, I've found this to be one of the most
useful variant 'Mechs designed yet.
Axly
UNFORGETTABLE ... IN EVERY WAY . AND FOREVERMORE .. THATS HOW WELL STAY
> c903...@cc.newcastle.edu.au (UNFORGETTABLE ... IN EVERY WAY . AND FOREVERMORE .. THATS HOW WELL STAY) writes:
>
>
>
>> You have to remember that the Locust would have to get in behind the
>> Atlas first so it would have to be a suprise attack or bad initiatve
>> on the half of the atlas?
>
> Not really. If the Atlas moves, it isn't going to be able to hit at all.
> So if you win initiative, you go behind him. If you lose, you just move around
> so he is forced to take a shot that has a 13 to hit and wait to win initiative
> again. Patience is a virtue when driving a trashcan.
>
So we have an Atlas pilot with standard gunnery and piloting skills?
I dont know of any hose that would put a person in the biggest mech
availiable who isnt a good shot/pilot ! :) .. but theni have been
kown to be wrong :)
A pilot with gunnery 2 _SHOULD_ ( well, i mean MIGHT really) be able
to get atleast one shot with his main weapon in before the locust
finnaly gets in behind him.
> One Mech that I've seen growing in popularity is one of the Solaris
> 'Mechs that is basically a Locust with a Large Pulse Laser. Speed
> and armor are comparable to the original, although this 'Mech does
> weigh in at 25 tons. Still, I've found this to be one of the most
> useful variant 'Mechs designed yet.
I have had some mail about this locust, but id like to get the
stats for it ... ifsome nice person out there wants to post them
to me :)
--
This is just a test .sig
I suppose i should make it bigger, but i cant be bothred.
All th ideas expressed are mine and therefore MUST be correct
I will allow you to be wrong in your ignorance however.
David J Low
In article <BruL3...@news.cso.uiuc.edu>, dv5...@uxa.cso.uiuc.edu (Axly) writes:
>> You have to remember that the Locust would have to get in behind the
>> Atlas first so it would have to be a suprise attack or bad initiatve
>> on the half of the atlas?
>
> Not really. If the Atlas moves, it isn't going to be able to hit at all.
> So if you win initiative, you go behind him. If you lose, you just move around
> so he is forced to take a shot that has a 13 to hit and wait to win initiative
> again. Patience is a virtue when driving a trashcan.
OK, let's do something I generally hate and look at the numbers :-)
Assume base Gunnery targets 4/6/8 for both. The Locust can get a
maximum movement modifier of +4 by using no more than 2 turns/other
terrain modifiers. To stay behind the Atlas, it will HAVE to make
more than this in general. So, say a movement modifier of +3 on every
round (uses no more than 5 extra MP in turns, etc..). The Atlas must
as least walk each turn, and probably gets no more than +1 defensive
modifier.
If the Locust keeps at long range, the Atlas needs 8+3+1=12 to hit,
and conceivably more. Fine, let's say it misses. The Locust needs
8+2+1=11, conceivably only 10, so it hits one time in six shots. Not
bad. Note that if the Locust closes to medium range, the Atlas'
to-hits become achievable, and cannot be ignored.
Now, we have the Locust behind the Atlas at a range of 8 (a scenario
which Dave Lichtman and I considered). What does the Locust do if it
loses initiative? If it runs away, the Atlas simply turns to face it.
Now, the Locust cannot get behind the Atlas again unless the terrain
is so heavy as to prevent shots! And if the Locust accepts the risks
of a side shot, the LRM20 comes into play. Consider a Locust 20 hexes
away in front of the Atlas - if the Atlas ONLY turns in place, how
does the Locust get behind it without getting closer than 7 hexes,
ignoring the LRMs?
The Atlas will run into problems if it attempts to close the range
itself, since then the Locust may have enough movement to get past and
into the rear arc. Otherwise, it's just a matter of time before the
Locust soaks up enough random hits to die. Special terrain will always
present problems, but that's why a light lance can beat an Atlas in a
city :-) [refer a scenario in an early BattleTechnology, pitting Atlas
against UrbanMech+Panther+Stinger in a city]
Dave Litchman
> One Mech that I've seen growing in popularity is one of the Solaris
> 'Mechs that is basically a Locust with a Large Pulse Laser. Speed
> and armor are comparable to the original, although this 'Mech does
> weigh in at 25 tons. Still, I've found this to be one of the most
> useful variant 'Mechs designed yet.
Oh yeah, the Kafka, also known as the 'Locust on steroids'. I haven't had a
chance to play it, but I like the design.
Dave Litchman
>In article <1992Jul21.1...@admiral.uucp>, da...@admiral.uucp (Dave Litchman) writes:
>
> [Stuff deleted]
>
> other than your Locust and the Atlas?
Yup, just me an' Smiley...
>
> You have to remember that the Locust would have to get in behind the
> Atlas first so it would have to be a suprise attack or bad initiatve
> on the half of the atlas?
Not really. The ratio of won initiatives/lost initiatives went about as usual.
If I won initiative, I let him move, then got into position. If he won, I just
got far enough away so that he couldn't draw a bead on me.