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More trailer tire/wheel issues

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johnsin...@yahoo.com

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Jul 18, 2019, 4:09:15 PM7/18/19
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I pulled my Cobra up the Sierras to Sparks, Nv and then blew the right tire (6” of tread separated and took the fender off too). Tire and wheel were Not even warm. Put on the spare and drove the final 20 miles. Next morning I jacked up one wheel and took 2 tires and rims in and got 6 ply trailer tires. After the contest, I pulled the trailer back down the western slope of the Sierras and pulled over to check things after about an hour of down hill towing. To my surprised both Hubs were too hot to keep my hand on them and the right hub was hot enough to steam as I poured a bottle of water on the inside wheel area. In downhill towing the surge brake stays on most of the time and is riding the trailer brakes............something we know to never do, right?
Are these two Instances related? I think so, I did the same trip last year and I’m thinking the overheating from downhill towing caused over pressure and weakened the 4 ply auto tires. The weakened tire blew after about 4 hours of driving on my way back up the hill, this year.
Your thoughts and experiences?
JJ

Dan Daly

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Jul 18, 2019, 4:30:44 PM7/18/19
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Your over-running dampler may be too weak. https://wingsandwheels.com/cobra-overruning-damper.html for replacements

From a 2002 Cobra manual:
5.2 Overrun brake
5.2.1 All braked trailers are equipped with a Rückmatik brake system and except
the lubrication of the overrun piston and the bell crank lever additional maintenance is not required.
5.2.2 Lubricate the overrun piston every 5,000 km or once per year with multi-purpose grease (see
lubrication plan point 10.1).

Dan Daly

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Jul 18, 2019, 4:33:10 PM7/18/19
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"damper".

chip.b...@gmail.com

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Jul 18, 2019, 5:29:06 PM7/18/19
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A year later, I'm still having the problem I've had off and on for over 20 years on my 1992 Cobra: i.e., after a moderately hard stop, the brakes occasionally jam on and stay on.

New damper strut. Disassembled and lubed the overrun tongue piston. Same for the pivot for the e-brake/hook. New brake hardware and shoes. Lubed the actuator cables. Filed out the slot in the inner tongue tube that had a very small machining discontinuity that I thought might cause the big bolt that slides in it and holds it all together to jam.

I know most owners are happy with their Al-Ko overrun brakes. But based on my experience, I'd never buy another one. I'm ready to rip out all the Al-Ko junk and go with an aftermarket axle. Apparently, if one tiny thing is wrong, you're looking at a blown tire, burned bearing, or worse. I bought a tire pressure/temp monitor last year that alerts me now when the temps start to climb but what a pain. I suspect I'll just disconnect the brake permanently.

I continue to think this is another example of European/German pilots lovingly devoting hours and hours of maintenance to their Daimlers and Cobras every year while we Americans just want to jump in our vehicles and drive 3000 miles across the country to a contest, hassle-free.

Chip Bearden

johnsin...@yahoo.com

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Jul 18, 2019, 6:16:59 PM7/18/19
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I checked the surge cylinder and it came on softly and released properly when pressure was released. I bought new 6 ply trailer tires recommended for 50 psi, which will help any overpressure caused by brake/tire heating. If the sealed bearings and brakes look OK, l’m considering a brake lock-out to fit when descending a long run, like Hwy 80, West of Reno.
JJ

Clay

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Jul 18, 2019, 6:58:23 PM7/18/19
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I have a brand new Cobra and even towing short distances on relatively flat roads the hubs are too hot to touch. I can tell from my rear view camera that the surge brake is not engaged. My conclusion re the quality of this stuff is the same as Chip's (i.e., POS). Has anybody tried the Dexter electric with the parking brake feature? Unfortunately I have to have a PB otherwise I'd be switching ASAP. Clay

Richard Pfiffner

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Jul 18, 2019, 7:31:15 PM7/18/19
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On Thursday, July 18, 2019 at 3:58:23 PM UTC-7, Clay wrote:
> I have a brand new Cobra and even towing short distances on relatively flat roads the hubs are too hot to touch. I can tell from my rear view camera that the surge brake is not engaged. My conclusion re the quality of this stuff is the same as Chip's (i.e., POS). Has anybody tried the Dexter electric with the parking brake feature? Unfortunately I have to have a PB otherwise I'd be switching ASAP. Clay

I have Dexter Axle with electric brakes on my older Cobra Trailer. Works great.

Richard
www.craggyaero.com

Clay

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Jul 18, 2019, 9:39:36 PM7/18/19
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Thanks Richard do they get hot?

caryandre...@gmail.com

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Jul 18, 2019, 10:38:49 PM7/18/19
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Euro trailers are designed and equipped with
brakes because their tow vehicles are smaller with less horsepower and smaller brakes than
Trucks and SUVs that we prefer.
Trailer brakes are redundant not necessary
with most applications in the USA.

Ramy

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Jul 18, 2019, 11:24:22 PM7/18/19
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From my anecdotal experience most blown tires happen to those who don’t trailer often. Otherwise I can’t explain how I had only one flat (not even blown) tire in 20 years and estimated over 100,000 miles of trailering all over the hot western roads and mountains. My trailer gets driven at least once per month on average. The only maintainace I done was replacing the tires every 5 years or so.
Hope I didn’t just jinxed it.

Ramy

Nick Kennedy

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Jul 19, 2019, 9:11:01 AM7/19/19
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Clay
You should have your bearings/ brakes checked out by a mechanic if you can't do it yourself.
Getting hot like you describe is not right.
Your not going to get very far with them heating up on a flat short drive.

Richard Pfiffner

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Jul 19, 2019, 9:53:28 AM7/19/19
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On Thursday, July 18, 2019 at 6:39:36 PM UTC-7, Clay wrote:
> Thanks Richard do they get hot?

No they do not get hot. Hubs are not even warm to the touch on normal drives. I have not touched them after an extended down hill drive. I will try that in the future. The only time I lost a tire was I suspect from tire age 18 years.

Richard
www.craggyaero.com

AS

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Jul 19, 2019, 10:45:22 AM7/19/19
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I cannot confirm any of these described design deficiencies! My ~2012 vintage Cobra dual-axle trainer got moved across the US from SC to NM now four times - 1,600 miles each way - plus once to CO and back over some pretty punishing road surfaces. I installed a TPM system and keep an eye on the pressure and temperature of each wheel. Even during the long descent on I-70 west of Denver or while doing the 'Million Dollar Hwy' did the tire temperature not increase notably. I always check the hubs during gas stops and never burnt my finger.
The only thing I need to change now is the damper in the over-running brake, which seems to have gotten weak.
Please note that these trailers in Germany are subject to a state inspection every two years, where the brake and light system is checked, so regular maintenance is advised and generally accepted for the sake of keeping them safe.
The argument 'they don't use large pick-ups and SUVs over there, so we don't need brakes on our trailers here' is laughable! Once the towing vehicle is no longer perfectly in line with the trailer, the trailer will try to pass you - no matter what you are sitting in. The 'Auflaufbremse' or overrunning brake system is designed to keep the trailer behind the towing vehicle longer.

Uli
'AS'

herbk...@gmail.com

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Jul 19, 2019, 12:53:09 PM7/19/19
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I'm with Uli (AS). Knocking German enschineering is just not right, you hear that, Chip? You all should learn German anyway, would help when you study our "Auflaufbremse".
Herb, J7, flying and trailering in Tscherman Enschineered machines.

chip.b...@gmail.com

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Jul 19, 2019, 7:10:41 PM7/19/19
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I've trailered my 1992 Cobra back and forth myriad times from NJ to Hobbs, Uvalde, Nephi, Cordele, TSA, etc. Most of the time everything is fine. The hubs are barely warm and everything works right.

But once in a while, from when the trailer was a few years old, a hard stop (not a locking-the-wheels, screeching-tires panic stop but just when someone cuts in front and you have to brake suddenly), the surge brake locks up and won't release. And with no backup cam, I can't see it. I just know to pull over and check right away. And now I watch the TPMS: the temperature rise seems to give me a heads up that it's happening.

I'm a mechanical engineer originally. I've been doing brake work for almost 50 years on my vehicles. I worked for 10 years for a company that made OEM and aftermarket brake parts. IMO, there's some vulnerability in the Al-Ko system that--when triggered--causes bad things to happen. As I detailed before, I've tried nearly everything this time. It locked up on the way back from TSA/Dallas last summer so I did a lot of maintenance/adjustment/replacement then and thought I had it fixed. And apparently I did--for a while. But on the way back from Columbus, OH last month (after the Stds. were postponed), I had to brake hard. I pulled over a few miles later and, sure enough, same problem. I just disconnected the brake system then to get home (I've had a lot of practice). More work after that. Last week on the way to and from Blairstown, the same problem. I'm running out of things to do.

There's a problem. I'm sure something is out of adjustment or alignment or something somewhere. And when that happens, disaster. As much as I love [most] German engineering, I shouldn't have to ship the trailer back to Germany to get it to work right! :)

Chip Bearden

JS

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Jul 19, 2019, 7:34:04 PM7/19/19
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Chip, if it started after Dallas perhaps a bullet from the "Who shot JB?" incident got lodged in the brakes.
Jim

uncl...@ix.netcom.com

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Jul 19, 2019, 8:53:51 PM7/19/19
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On Friday, July 19, 2019 at 7:34:04 PM UTC-4, JS wrote:
> Chip, if it started after Dallas perhaps a bullet from the "Who shot JB?" incident got lodged in the brakes.
> Jim

Too cruel!
UH

Dan Marotta

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Jul 19, 2019, 10:08:59 PM7/19/19
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JR...

On 7/19/2019 5:34 PM, JS wrote:
> Chip, if it started after Dallas perhaps a bullet from the "Who shot JB?" incident got lodged in the brakes.
> Jim

--
Dan, 5J

AS

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Jul 19, 2019, 11:35:56 PM7/19/19
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Chip,

don't get me wrong - that has nothing to do with waving the German engineering flag! I am a ME too and deal a lot with complex mechanical systems.
Your brake system is purely made up from levers, cams, pull-rods, bell-cranks and maybe a set of Bowden-Cables. Somewhere in that system is one element, which - when you brake hard - goes into a lock-up condition and won't release. It could be a cam that rotates too far or a pull rod, which gets hung up somehow. I found a few YouTube videos showing how to adjust an ALKO Auflaufbremse but they are all in German.
Have you contacted Spindelberger (or W&W) to get a schematic for your axle and brake set-up? I am sure they can provide you with a trouble shooting guide and an adjustment instruction. With some additional info, you can return the system to function properly - it's not rocket surgery!

Uli
'AS'

Charlie M. (UH & 002 owner/pilot)

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Jul 20, 2019, 12:37:03 PM7/20/19
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OK...general tire info from someone that does PT work in a tire shop.....

BTW....I did a real long reply to this thread.....whatever reason it evaporated.......

Tires....age is a killer.

On pretty much ANY tire is a mold date. Shop should NOT sell as new beyond 3 years from mold date.
Period.
At least in the US (likely other locations), should be a molded oval about 1"X1/2"...,,(metric.....figure it out....inches landed on the moon...nuff said.....yes, biased....).
There should be a 4 digit number......first 2 is week of the year .....0-52, last 2 is last 2 of year........
So.....a "4217" is......42'nd week of the year 2017.

"Thou shall not sell as new beyond 3 years from mold date".
Period. I believe US law.
Prime reason, from decades of dealing with tires,.....age....usually UV aging added to low pressure. Ramy does a lot of travel....so he is on the good side. He checks pressures, does miles, a perfect tire/I'm loses some pressure over time....not counting the "rule of thumb" that tire pressure changes about 1 PSI/*F change in temp. Metric guys.....figure it out...
Sitting on low/flat tires does NOT help.
Old tires lose their flexing, thus overheat and tread thrown.

Yes, US is usually longer trips at higher speeds.
No slight on other regions.

I see more blown tires from trailers sitting for years, likely low in pressure, then subjected to high highway speeds with aged tires.

Discuss......

George Haeh

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Jul 20, 2019, 12:43:02 PM7/20/19
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I had one brake lock up going over an abrupt slab transition at a bridge. According to the skid marks, the wheel lined up behind the hitch, then the brake let go. Acceleration and counter steering jackknifed me into the ditch.

Trailer manual advice is to hold steering straight and tap brakes.

Have you read your trailer manual?

Yes, you can crash a Puch and walk away. But the car was a write-off.

hret...@aol.com

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Jul 20, 2019, 1:59:56 PM7/20/19
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Chip....how do you disconnect the brake system?

R

Dave Nadler

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Jul 20, 2019, 2:39:11 PM7/20/19
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On Saturday, July 20, 2019 at 1:59:56 PM UTC-4, hret...@aol.com wrote:
> ....how do you disconnect the brake system?

https://www.homedepot.com/s/sawzall?NCNI-5

Beat ya to it Bob K. !!

chip.b...@gmail.com

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Jul 22, 2019, 7:05:54 PM7/22/19
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Temporary (!) ways to disconnect the surge brake on my 1992 Cobra:

1. The aft end of the long brake rod under the trailer (just ahead of the axle) is threaded and attaches to the "splitter" plate that pulls the Bowden cables, one for each brake. IIRC, there's a nut and a lock nut: just remove these and pulling on the brake rod will have no effect on the brakes. Make sure the aft end of the brake rod can't fall down and drag if the emergency brake is actuated. If so, cable tie it to the bracket under the trailer.

2. Recently I disassembled the front pivot for the hook that is pushed by the end of the surge brake tube inside the tongue. That hook then pulls the brake rod, which runs under the trailer. On my trailer, remove one bolt and the hook and emergency brake assembly fall out. You could just tie up the front end of the brake rod and the emergency brake handle and mechanism with a shock cord. Fold the handle down before you do this, though. This would disconnect the brake but it might also allow the sliding tongue to compress even more than normal when braking. I don't think so--there's an internal stop--but I'm not going to try this until I check.

3. The ends of the Bowden cable housings bolt into the splitter plate. So if you unthread the cable housings, the cables can't be actuated. If they're flopping around loose, tie them up so they can't drag.

Methods 1 and 3 involve crawling under the trailer. It's not bad; you don't have to jack it up. Method 1 is quicker and easier. But method 2 would be easier still if it doesn't cause harm.

And, of course, you have to be careful when reassembling that you don't thread things up too tight and actuate the Bowden cables, then drive around with the brakes partially applied. In my experience, it's very easy to see when the cables are slack and when they're under tension.

Of course, a brake system that works every time would eliminate the need for any of this.

Chip Bearden

hret...@aol.com

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Jul 22, 2019, 7:31:12 PM7/22/19
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OK...thanks....I’ll print this out and save for reference should the need arise.

R

JS

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Jul 22, 2019, 10:03:52 PM7/22/19
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Interesting.
Only owned 7 Cobras and a Komet so far, yet to find the need to disable the brake system.
But I've gone the other way...
Put hydraulic brakes on the Nimbus trailer, since a mechanical AlKo system wasn't available at the time. Someone had damaged the old axle on the Pfeiffer, and it had no brakes when I bought it.
Probably did 3 or 4000 miles before replacing the axle, and found it no fun driving a trailer without brakes.
Jim

chip.b...@gmail.com

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Jul 23, 2019, 4:17:36 AM7/23/19
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A Pfeiffer and Komet we owned for years were troublefree. I can't recall whether the Komet had the automatic feature that allowed you to back up without locking out the surge brake but the Pfeiffer did not. Maybe the added complication makes the system a bit sensitive.

When the system works, as it normally does, it works well. But when it doesn't, the failure mode can be catastrophic: failed bearings and cooked brake lining crumbling off the brake shoes (I've never had a tire fail because of it). It's probably something simple. But it's not because of neglect, lack of knowledge of conventional brake systems, or motivation.

Chip Bearden

Nick Kennedy

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Jul 23, 2019, 9:06:49 AM7/23/19
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I have a 1990 Cobra with non functioning brakes due to a blowout where I didn't catch it and drug the trailer quite a ways and tore up the drum assembly.
I've got to get a Dexter Axel on there with electric brakes. I think having functioning trailer brakes even at fairly low weights is very important.
A pickup pulled out in front of me this summer and I had a wild scary close call, having trailer brakes would have been very good. I was lucky I didn't T-Bone him and have a very nasty accident. Highway travel is dangerous.

markm...@gmail.com

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Jul 23, 2019, 11:14:42 AM7/23/19
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"Highway travel is dangerous."


Nick- we didn't worry so much about dangerous situations when we were hang gliding with JZ and Zoardog. What changed? Lightning strike or something? ;-P~~~~

johnsin...@yahoo.com

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Jul 23, 2019, 1:28:15 PM7/23/19
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I pulled the drum off the wheel that was hot enough to steam water Both ends of the sealed bearing fell out along with most of the ball bearings! I believe the bearing was in the process of failing from overheated brakes after an hour of down hill towing......hwy80 west of Reno. W&W didn’t have the replacement and Cobra is on Holiday, but I was able to find it on line for $45/ea after giving ID 30mm, OD 60mm, H 37mm ( old bearing was. Armed AL-KO 581736).
This is the second time I have had very hot brakes after an extended downhill tow. I have fitted a simple brake lock-out that prevents the surge brake from surging! It consists of a piece of plastic pipe who’s ID matches the OD of the surge cylinder (2” pipe X3.75” for my Cobra), split it into two halves with a hacksaw and place them on the surge brake in the fully extended position. Secure them with two hose clamps and I’m good to go down the Sierras without hot brakes! E-mail me for photo.
JJ

PS, my blown tire was most probably age related, these new looking tires all have a born on date of 99!

JS

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Jul 23, 2019, 8:39:04 PM7/23/19
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I just changed the tongue damper on a 10/2007 Cobra.
Had been in procrastination mode. Perhaps others put that job off too?
Thanks for keeping the thread going as a reminder!
It took 90 minutes from chocking and jacking the trailer prior to removal until rolling it out with the new part installed.
This part I believe is critical in maintaining good braking behaviour.

There is an Al-Ko Workshop manual, covering axles, brakes, hitches and overrun devices. It also has lists of lubricants and accessories.

http://www.tabberiet.dk/T%40B-siden/Info_files/Workshop%20Manual%20AL-KO.pdf

The missing information for those with the square tongue:

Remove the jockey wheel.
After disconnecting the brake rod, remove the two bolts holding the drawbar onto the tongue.
Remove the drawbar.

Tools:
17mm open end for the brake rod. 19mm socket and open or box for the other bolts. Alignment tool for the new damper. Torque wrench.
Options:
Hammer, beer.
Jim

Nick Kennedy

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Jul 23, 2019, 8:44:41 PM7/23/19
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JS is spot on
I was taught if you can't fix it with a hammer its probably electrical.

markm...@gmail.com

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Jul 23, 2019, 9:38:09 PM7/23/19
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> I was taught if you can't fix it with a hammer its probably electrical.

You can also solve electrical issues with a hammer. Even software issues. Try Windows 10 and keep a pummeling device handy.

Dan Marotta

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Jul 24, 2019, 10:40:11 AM7/24/19
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Windows 10 is not an operating system, it is a "Service".  Just ask 'em...

On 7/23/2019 7:38 PM, markm...@gmail.com wrote:
>> I was taught if you can't fix it with a hammer its probably electrical.
> You can also solve electrical issues with a hammer. Even software issues. Try Windows 10 and keep a pummeling device handy.
>

--
Dan, 5J

CindyB

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Jul 25, 2019, 5:18:44 PM7/25/19
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On that Windows 10 reference..... a disservice. And that should complete the thread drift. Drift - that might close the loop back to scary braking and no braking.

johnsin...@yahoo.com

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Jul 26, 2019, 2:18:07 PM7/26/19
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Just took my Cobra for a test drive, 20 miles with moderate up and down grades..........everything’s cool! A month ago, I blew a tire ( my bad, the great looking tire was actually 20 years old). Bought 6 ply trailer tires rated for 50 psi ( original tires were 3 ply rated at 35 psi). Next time out, I had hot brakes......really hot right brake after an hour of down hill towing. I have seen this before on another Cobra trailer. My surge damper checks OK, I believe the surge brake is holding more or less constant trailer braking during extended down grade towing. This causes hot brakes! Hot brakes cause bearing failure!
My fix consisted of new tires, new right wheel bearing and locking out the surge break for extended down hill towing. My F-150 has plenty breaking power for a 1600# trailer..........I may just leave the brakes locked out all the time. All I want and need is reliable, trouble free towing!
JJ
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