Continuing Time
Craig Becker
d_m...@pain.la.ca.us (Daniel Keys Moran) writes:
[lotsa stuff about Trent, Denice, and the Continuing Time deleted]
So, I still wanna know: did he walk through the f***ing wall or not?
:-)
Craig
--
-- "You can expect virtually Craig Becker, Object Technology Products --
-- anything from a people who had Internet: cra...@ot.austin.ibm.com --
-- nuclear weapons in the early IBM TR: cra...@woofer.austin.ibm.com --
-- seventeenth century." VNET: CRAIGB at AUSVM1 --
Sean Eric Fagan
>So, I still wanna know: did he walk through the f***ing wall or not?
I think it was a hologram of Trent, controlled by RtWaP, to delay the PKF.
Of course, since Mr. Moran might be reading this himself, he can tell me if
I'm right or not 8-). (Yeah, like he's *really* got nothing better to do
than read r.a.s.w. I'd rather he keep writing and get more books published,
actually... 8-))
--
Sean Eric Fagan | "You can't get lost in one room, no matter how
s...@kithrup.COM | little effort you make to learn your way around."
-----------------+ -- William E Davidsen (wil...@crd.GE.COM)
Any opinions expressed are my own, and generally unpopular with others.
Nathan D. Johnson
>In article <1992Aug26.1...@awdprime.austin.ibm.com> cra...@ot.austin.ibm.com writes:
>>So, I still wanna know: did he walk through the f***ing wall or not?
>I think it was a hologram of Trent, controlled by RtWaP, to delay the PKF.
>Of course, since Mr. Moran might be reading this himself, he can tell me if
>I'm right or not 8-). (Yeah, like he's *really* got nothing better to do
>than read r.a.s.w. I'd rather he keep writing and get more books published,
>actually... 8-))
Just for the heck of it, I'll throw in my alternate explanation, that Trent
walked through a hologram of a wall. I will even try supporting it with
references. Then if I'm wrong DKM can point out my errors, and I'll shut up.
First, Trent was in the room because he had been seen entering the room and in
my opinion, creating a plausable hologram of Trent would seem to require a lot
of information and given the time frame, I just don't see it happening.
Further, that level was full of Peaceforcers, including elites, specificly
looking for Trent. Even he would have difficulty escaping detection, and
without some hint by the author, I am unwilling to just assume he was really
stealthy. The other reason I say he was in the room has to do with the comment
Trent makes in the begining of the scene right after he 'walks through the
wall.' [my sister has my copies of EE and TLR, and has for the past year, so
forgive my vague referencing] Trent says 'xxx meters to the airlock' [see
previous apology], which is _precisely_ how far the meeting room in which he
was 'trapped' was from the airlock (Check the first scene in which the meeting
room appears, when Melissa(sp?) takes Trent to view the spy-sat pictures of the
attack, Trent mentions it there). This seems to be a strong hint.
Trent's escape, in my opinion, was made by taking a hologram of the wall, a
typically boring _non-moving_ subject, and then cutting a hole in the wall with his nifty knife-thing[I have GOT to get those books back] and projecting the
image of the untouched wall over the hole. Then Trent can just step through the
hole, and astound the PKF. Notice: There was a hologram projector in the room,
as we know from the previous scene there. Trent has used the cut-a-hole-and-
walk-through-it method for escape before.
Also, Vance, who is no dummy, immediately rushes to The Correct Airlock, which
is the one nearest the meeting room(if it is not, then what possible reason is
there for Trent's remark about how far away it was? the comment would make no
sense, since if trent were using a hologram to draw them away, he would not
then use the airlock closest to them)
Well that ended up being longer and less coherent than I had hoped for.
{condensed version: Trent enters room. Trent takes hologram of wall. Trent cuts
hole in wall. Trent projects hologram over hole. PKF enters room. Trent smiles.
trent walks through hole{looks like Trent walks through wall}. PKF jaws drop.
Trent runs like hell.}
I guess in the end I think Occom cuts up your hologram more than mine.
Nate {krm clued me into the theory, though}
B
B
whole in wall. Trent projects hologram over hole.
Rodrick Su
In article <BtMMu...@news.cso.uiuc.edu> ndj2...@uxa.cso.uiuc.edu (Nathan D. Johnson) writes:
>Trent's escape, in my opinion, was made by taking a hologram of the wall, a
>typically boring _non-moving_ subject, and then cutting a hole in the wall with his nifty knife-thing[I have GOT to get those books back] and projecting the
>image of the untouched wall over the hole. Then Trent can just step through the
>hole, and astound the PKF. Notice: There was a hologram projector in the room,
>as we know from the previous scene there. Trent has used the cut-a-hole-and-
>walk-through-it method for escape before.
>
>{condensed version: Trent enters room. Trent takes hologram of wall. Trent cuts
>hole in wall. Trent projects hologram over hole. PKF enters room. Trent smiles.
>trent walks through hole{looks like Trent walks through wall}. PKF jaws drop.
>Trent runs like hell.}
Except there is one problem. Prior to the scene, Trent was heading
up an elevator. PKF have basically have him, as they knows where he
is heading. Thus the guards were posted outside the shaft to
capture him. Trent himself was astonished at the fact that no guard
was outside when he got out of the lift. He also heard the joyous
shouts of PKFs that 'We got him'. Why not go and see the fun? That
was what the guards outside the lift did, and left their post wide
open. He then proceed onto his less than sane of escape, original
plan. I don't think Trent have enough time for the things you said.
also, had it simply been a holographic wall, Trent's act wouldn't have
been classified as a mirical. Remember that there are well over 30
PKF and some 10 Elite. Someone is bound to try to touch the wall.
As for been seeing entering the room, that can also bee accomplish
with hologram as well. Remember RtWaP's goal is to create a
diversion for Trent, and he will have to make people think for a
while.
--
[ Rodrick Su ]-----------------------------------------------------]
[----------------------[ A bomb lives only as it is falling. ]
[ r...@cats.ucsc.edu ]------------------------[ ``Use of Weapons'' ]
[ r...@ucscb.ucsc.edu ]------------------------[ Iain M. Banks ]
John Stracke
>s...@kithrup.COM (Sean Eric Fagan) writes:
>
>>In article <1992Aug26.1...@awdprime.austin.ibm.com> cra...@ot.austin.ibm.com writes:
>>>So, I still wanna know: did he walk through the f***ing wall or not?
>
>>I think it was a hologram of Trent, controlled by RtWaP, to delay the PKF.
>
>>Of course, since Mr. Moran might be reading this himself, he can tell me if
>>I'm right or not 8-). (Yeah, like he's *really* got nothing better to do
>>than read r.a.s.w. I'd rather he keep writing and get more books published,
>>actually... 8-))
Myself, I don't really want to hear from him. I think it's *supposed*
to be a Mystery (in the religious sense--"Once there was a thief, and
the thief was God").
>Just for the heck of it, I'll throw in my alternate explanation, that Trent
>walked through a hologram of a wall. I will even try supporting it with
Yes! It's perfect! It's logical. It's plausible. It works.
Of course, I still would prefer to think that he really *did* walk
through the wall. Remember what Dr. Montignet said about the errors
that made him a nontelepath: he was "different. Not better, or worse.
Just different". We *don't* *know* what Trent's Gifts are; they could
very well include walking through walls. (Maybe the thief really is
God.)
>First, Trent was in the room because he had been seen entering the room and in
>my opinion, creating a plausable hologram of Trent would seem to require a lot
>of information and given the time frame, I just don't see it happening.
Yes, but Ralf might very well have the information on hand--he was
Trent's Image, after all. And he certainly had the processing
power--remember, he grabbed the nodes that Trent and Watchdog had been
fighting over.
OH! Just remembered something important: in the scene where Trent
walks through the wall, he *does* *not* *speak*. This is very
unTrentish.
Trent has never had his voiceprint taken.
Ralf could have done a hologram, but nobody could have done sound.
OK, so it looks like we have two possible explanations. And I don't
really see why Trent the Uncatchable would have ducked into a room
with only one exit, or refrained from taunting Vance.
Further commentary?
--
/===========================================================================\
|John (Francis) Stracke |My opinions are my own.| The Player's |
|Natl. Science Center Foundation|=======================/ Litany: |
|Augusta, GA |The Wind is the Storm, and the Storm is |
|fra...@galois.nscf.org | Data, and the Data is Life.--D.K. Moran |
\===========================================================================/
(Formerly fra...@dogwood.atl.ga.us,fra...@zaphod.uchicago.edu)
--
/===========================================================================\
|John (Francis) Stracke |My opinions are my own.| The Player's |
|Natl. Science Center Foundation|=======================/ Litany: |
|Augusta, GA |The Wind is the Storm, and the Storm is |
Charles Leggett
Trent manages to walk through the wall. Remember that the whole foundation of
the novels are "Continuing Time", where several of the characters are time
travellers. As one poster recently mentioned, we don't know what all of Trent's
talents are. Time travel could be one of them (I seem to recall that the
'Novembers' have the gene for time travel, and they are the descendents of
Danielle (?)). So it is possible that at some point in the future he comes back
(perhaps to find out exactly how he managed to walk through a wall when he
doesn't recall doing it himself :-) ), and either manages to walk through a
solid object himself (though this would not be fun if there were vacuum on the
other side...) or sets up a hologram to mimic this. I think that the hologram
of Trent walking though a solid wall is by far the likeliest scenario, whether
he sets it up himself, or Ralph does it, or some as yet unnamed third party.
In any case, I'm very pleased to see that we will be getting more books in
the future...
------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Charles Leggett | "Unto each man is given the key that
| will open the door to Heaven. The same
leg...@mich.physics.lsa.umich.edu | key unlocks the gates of Hell."
University of Michigan | - ancient Buddist proverb
------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Curtis Yarvin
Holograms not opaque.
c
Rodrick Su
In article <leggett.714932169@a-l3um6> leg...@a-l3um6.cern.ch (Charles Leggett ) writes:
> One other possibility that no one else seems to have mentioned as to how
>Trent manages to walk through the wall. Remember that the whole foundation of
>the novels are "Continuing Time", where several of the characters are time
>travellers. As one poster recently mentioned, we don't know what all of Trent's
>talents are. Time travel could be one of them (I seem to recall that the
>'Novembers' have the gene for time travel, and they are the descendents of
>Danielle (?)). So it is possible that at some point in the future he comes back
Except that Trent and Denise are not related in any way except their
name. Trent is also the only failed telepath from project Superman.
Nathan D. Johnson
> Except there is one problem. Prior to the scene, Trent was heading
> up an elevator. PKF have basically have him, as they knows where he
> is heading. Thus the guards were posted outside the shaft to
> capture him. Trent himself was astonished at the fact that no guard
> was outside when he got out of the lift. He also heard the joyous
> shouts of PKFs that 'We got him'. Why not go and see the fun? That
> was what the guards outside the lift did, and left their post wide
> open. He then proceed onto his less than sane of escape, original
> plan. I don't think Trent have enough time for the things you said.
> also, had it simply been a holographic wall, Trent's act wouldn't have
> been classified as a mirical. Remember that there are well over 30
> PKF and some 10 Elite. Someone is bound to try to touch the wall.
You forget, the elevator that Trent was in is found open by Vance(Melissa was
startled to discover it open, since it had been empty just a few moments
before. Trent was NOT in the elevator. The guard that wasn't there was the one
at the airlock. Re-read the section.
I don't see that it would have taken very much time either.
Finally, It is not impossible that trent glued the wall back in place, but
even if he didn't, the PKF still had work to do trying to find him. If in the
aftermath, the officials explain that trent actually used an easily explained
setup for his supposed miracle, then maybe they would believe it. Then again,
try convincing Christians that christs body was probably removed from the tomb
by his followers, a much more _plausable_ explanation than resurection. Given
a choice between having seen someone who had walked through the PKF spacebase
earlier and who had again managed to elude escape by laumching himself up to
a spaceship and whom YOU had SEEN walk through a wall, and the explanation of
the government, which would you choose?
Sean Eric Fagan
>the novels are "Continuing Time", where several of the characters are time
>travellers. As one poster recently mentioned, we don't know what all of Trent's
>talents are. Time travel could be one of them (I seem to recall that the
>'Novembers' have the gene for time travel, and they are the descendents of
>Danielle (?)).
Denise has the Gifts of the House of November -- as is stated in _Emerald
Eyes_, at the end.
The god Storyteller (arrogant SOB, ain't it? Of course, he has a *right* to
be so...) is descended from Carl Castanaveras, and either Denise or David,
but that is all we know.
What's-his-name, the second time traveller from EE, says in _The Long Run_
that his eyes (all black, no whites) won't appear in a human for several
hundred years. *That* person is probably the ancestor of Storyteller, and
all the other time travellers -- and is undoubtedly a descendent of Carl.
Trent is almost certainly "human." He's just 'perfect.' Also intelligent,
fast reflexes, and had a great deal of training and incentive. He is, in
other words, a survivor.
John Stracke
They can't be made up on the fly by a computer and projected, either.
Willing suspension of disbelief.
--
/===========================================================================\
|John (Francis) Stracke |My opinions are my own. |
|Natl. Science Center Foundation|===========================================|
|Augusta, GA | E pui muove! |
|fra...@galois.nscf.org | -- Galileo |
\===========================================================================/
(Formerly fra...@dogwood.atl.ga.us,fra...@zaphod.uchicago.edu)
--
/===========================================================================\
|John (Francis) Stracke |My opinions are my own. |
|Natl. Science Center Foundation|===========================================|
|Augusta, GA | E pui muove! |
John Stracke
>r...@cats.ucsc.edu (Rodrick Su) writes:
>> was outside when he got out of the lift. He also heard the joyous
>> shouts of PKFs that 'We got him'. Why not go and see the fun? That
[...]
>You forget, the elevator that Trent was in is found open by Vance(Melissa was
>startled to discover it open, since it had been empty just a few moments
Right--"Less than five seconds", she says.
>before. Trent was NOT in the elevator. The guard that wasn't there was the one
>at the airlock. Re-read the section.
>I don't see that it would have taken very much time either.
Me, either. I thought about it, when I posted for the hologram
side--after all, there's only a few instants between the time he was
spotted and the time they went in--but remembered: "For the first
time, it struck Vance on an emotional level that Trent really *was* a
genie. He moved at a speed approaching that of a Peaceforcer
Elite...." (probably a couple of words wrong there, but it's
close--that line sticks with me).
Also, they waited outside the door for a bit. The door refused to
open, so Vance told it that, if it would not open, they would open
fire, and the young man inside would almost certainly be injured. It
opened.
Ah! Another point: when they got inside, Trent was standing immobile
at the far end of the room; when Vance said it was over, he nodded,
smiled, turned around, and walked out. This sounds like a setup
designed to cut down on processing time for the holo.
>Finally, It is not impossible that trent glued the wall back in place, but
I believe he had lost the glue by this time. I'll have to reread.
>even if he didn't, the PKF still had work to do trying to find him. If in the
>aftermath, the officials explain that trent actually used an easily explained
>setup for his supposed miracle, then maybe they would believe it. Then again,
>try convincing Christians that christs body was probably removed from the tomb
No, thank you, I want to keep my various organs and appendages where
they are. ;-)
--
/===========================================================================\
|John (Francis) Stracke |My opinions are my own. |
|Natl. Science Center Foundation|===========================================|
|Augusta, GA |If God had not given us duct tape, it would|
|fra...@galois.nscf.org | have been necessary to invent it. |
\===========================================================================/
(Formerly fra...@dogwood.atl.ga.us,fra...@zaphod.uchicago.edu)
--
/===========================================================================\
|John (Francis) Stracke |My opinions are my own. |
|Natl. Science Center Foundation|===========================================|
|Augusta, GA |If God had not given us duct tape, it would|
Simon Tong
Ralf and Johnny Johnny to represent a human in a computer
network ?
This is slightly different from Gibson's idea of a person being
'inside' a matrix him/herself. Do you think Moran's version is
more attainable ?
Regards,
Simon Tong
Al Billings
>
>[lotsa stuff about Trent, Denice, and the Continuing Time deleted]
>
>So, I still wanna know: did he walk through the f***ing wall or not?
>
>:-)
No! It was the Goddamn hologram from his buddy the AI!!!
Wassail,
Al Billings
mi...@u.washington.edu
/\ /\ +----------------------------------------+
/__\/__\ | "I know that I hung on the windy tree | |
/\ /\ /\ | all of nights nine, wounded by Gar, | |
/__\/__\/__\ | given to Odhinn, myself to myself, | |
/\ /\ | upon that tree of which none can tell | |
/__\/__\ | from what root it rises." | ______|______
+----------------------------------------+
John Stracke
In article <FRANCIS.92...@galois.dogwood.atl.ga.us>
fra...@dogwood.atl.ga.us (John Stracke--that's me) writes:
>In article <BtnLv...@news.cso.uiuc.edu> ndj2...@uxa.cso.uiuc.edu (Nathan D. Johnson) writes:
>
>>You forget, the elevator that Trent was in is found open by Vance(Melissa was
>>startled to discover it open, since it had been empty just a few moments
>
>Right--"Less than five seconds", she says.
Excuse me--forty-five seconds.
[...]
>>Finally, It is not impossible that trent glued the wall back in place, but
>
>I believe he had lost the glue by this time. I'll have to reread.
I checked last night, and he had indeed lost (or used up) the glue.
See page 356. (As rare as this book is, I'm assuming there aren't
multiple publications of it.) He had the emblade, a spraytube of
fadeaway, a sonic bomb, and a spool of fineline. No glue.
OK, what do you guys think? This would seem to make it difficult to
impossible to believe the hologram-of-a-wall idea, since, as someone
pointed out, there were too many people there not to notice a hole cut
in the wall (also, somebody would notice eventually, right? ;-). The
voiceprint problem is the only explanation *I* can think of for
Trent's silence (this is the guy who, with a PKF Elite [Garon]
standing a few meters away, said "Catch me if you can"--not someone
naturally inclined to shut up). I think I'm back to the
hologram-of-Trent idea.
--
/===========================================================================\
|John (Francis) Stracke |My opinions are my own. |
|Natl. Science Center Foundation|===========================================|
|Augusta, GA | We want forty million helicopters |
|fra...@galois.nscf.org | and a dollar!--"Dinosaurs" |
\===========================================================================/
(Formerly fra...@dogwood.atl.ga.us,fra...@zaphod.uchicago.edu)
--
/===========================================================================\
|John (Francis) Stracke |My opinions are my own. |
|Natl. Science Center Foundation|===========================================|
|Augusta, GA | We want forty million helicopters |
John Stracke
Try "attainable", period--Gibson's idea is not practical, simply on
the grounds that brains think too slowly. If a human (or genie) went
into the Crystal Wind alone, the natives (web angels, AIs), could tear
hir to shreds. The Image reacts with the speed of the Wind. At the
same time, guided by a human mind, it avoids the flexibility
difficulties that would probably plauge the ferrets in Brin's _Earth_.
(Also, with a human hand at the controls, as it were, it's much less
likely to run away from home as Ring did.)
--
/===========================================================================\
|John (Francis) Stracke |My opinions are my own. |
|Natl. Science Center Foundation|===========================================|
|Augusta, GA |Belief is not relevant to truth. |
|fra...@galois.nscf.org | -- Von Neumann ?? |
\===========================================================================/
(Formerly fra...@dogwood.atl.ga.us,fra...@zaphod.uchicago.edu)
--
/===========================================================================\
|John (Francis) Stracke |My opinions are my own. |
|Natl. Science Center Foundation|===========================================|
|Augusta, GA |Belief is not relevant to truth. |
Nathan D. Johnson
>I checked last night, and he had indeed lost (or used up) the glue.
>See page 356. (As rare as this book is, I'm assuming there aren't
>multiple publications of it.) He had the emblade, a spraytube of
>fadeaway, a sonic bomb, and a spool of fineline. No glue.
>OK, what do you guys think? This would seem to make it difficult to
>impossible to believe the hologram-of-a-wall idea, since, as someone
>pointed out, there were too many people there not to notice a hole cut
>in the wall (also, somebody would notice eventually, right? ;-). The
>voiceprint problem is the only explanation *I* can think of for
>Trent's silence (this is the guy who, with a PKF Elite [Garon]
>standing a few meters away, said "Catch me if you can"--not someone
>naturally inclined to shut up). I think I'm back to the
>hologram-of-Trent idea.
As I said, I don't have my copy of the book (they've been in Southern Illinois
for a year now) so page references help me not at all [feel free to include
them for the rest of the world though] I'll take your word for it on any
contents that I don't specifically remember differently, and those to if you
check first.
I am not sure that the discovering of the hole would be a problem in the grand
scheme. First of all, when the PKF first saw it, they believed it was for real,
and subsequently returned to chasing Trent. Why would they have continued into
the room? They couldn't walk through the wall. Second, the news was obviously
spread relatively quickly, since the captain/pilot/whatever of the Jack of
Shadows heard about it ( he asks Trent about it when Trent wakes up I think )
And all that is really neccesary for the story to stick is for some outside
person to hear it and believe it. It seems quite plausible that someone might
have sent a message on an unsecured channel right after the incident. But there
would be no reason for the truth,, when discovered to be announced to the
world, so if a free-lunie hears a shocked PKFer say Trent had walked through
a wall, and the government, which isn't trusted on Earth, and is distrusted on
the moon, later gives a plausable story, but only after much delay, what is
the free-lunie to believe?
The two big problems that I have with the hologram of Trent problem, which I
will need answers to before I can consider your solution, are:
1 Where is Trent after he leaves the elevator?
2 Why does he make the comment about how far it is from the meeting room to
the airlock?
I would look at these in context more, to see if I could find a solution, but
I don't have my copy.
Nate.
Rodrick Su
In article <Btq4A...@news.cso.uiuc.edu> ndj2...@uxa.cso.uiuc.edu (Nathan D. Johnson) writes:
>The two big problems that I have with the hologram of Trent problem, which I
>will need answers to before I can consider your solution, are:
>1 Where is Trent after he leaves the elevator?
He heads straight for a locker room to get a scale suit.
Nathan D. Johnson
<deleted:I asked, where was Trent?>
> He heads straight for a locker room to get a scale suit.
I think That I have some trouble with the timing on that. I don't think either
of us is going to convince the other, though. Especially since I have no copy
on hand to use for evidence, or to correct my memory.
Nate
Steven J Owens
>In article <30...@ariel.its.unimelb.EDU.AU> st...@ariel.its.unimelb.EDU.AU (Simon Tong) writes:
>
>>What do people think of Moran's concept of using an "image" like
>>Ralf and Johnny Johnny to represent a human in a computer
>>network ?
>>This is slightly different from Gibson's idea of a person being
>>'inside' a matrix him/herself. Do you think Moran's version is
>>more attainable ?
>
>Try "attainable", period--Gibson's idea is not practical, simply on
>the grounds that brains think too slowly. If a human (or genie) went
>into the Crystal Wind alone, the natives (web angels, AIs), could tear
>hir to shreds. The Image reacts with the speed of the Wind. At the
>same time, guided by a human mind, it avoids the flexibility
>difficulties that would probably plauge the ferrets in Brin's _Earth_.
Well, my copies of Emerald Eyes and The Long Run are 1400
miles away, but if I recall correctly, the Image is essentially a
bundle of programs that preprocess network data into something
slightly more intelligible to human minds, and act as the player's
hands on the network.
I've been trying to come up with a pithy phrase to describe
the relationship, which is sort of the inverse of a client-server
relationship, but nothing particularly comes to mind, except possibly
"agent", which is still an incomplete analogy. The relationship is a
little fuzzier than what I've described, which is where the "magic" of
the player-image interaction comes in.
Attainable? Moran is certainly more into the technology than
Gibson is, witness the fact that he's on the Internet. Gibson's first
two novels were written on a typewriter, his third on an Apple IIe.
Perhaps his vision is more attainable, but it's still a dream of the
far distant future. Go hang out on alt.cyberpunk or Fidonet's SF-lit
echo (unless it's gone away in the last few years since I stopped
reading it). They discuss the technological possiblities fairly
frequently.
Steven J. Owens
scr...@unix.cis.pitt.edu
(I wonder if anybody's ever shown DKM the mud-scene...)
Daniel Keys Moran
over here -- this being the damn wall again.
Relax, okay? Think whatever you like about it. David Gerrold thought
that Trent had walked through the wall (and was pissed that I hadn't set
up Trent's ability to do so more thoroughly); Amy Stout, my former editor
at Bantam who I love and who is one of the very nicest people I've ever
met, decided instantly upon reading the mss. that Trent had never walked
through the wall, that it was a holograph set up by Ralf the Wise and
Powerful.
All I'm really inclined to say about it is, I ain't saying.
I will say that one argument I've been told about is incorrect. Trent
did not cut through the wall with an emblade, and then display a holof of
the wall over the hole in the wall. The wall was solid. So ... either
Trent walked through the wall, or Ralf animated a holo of him walking
through the wall.
It's not an accident, BTW, that all that setup regarding the holo
theory is there. By the time of the AI War, Mohammed Vance has figured
out that it was just a holo, and tells Trent so just before killing him.
Whether that's a correct deduction or not, I ain't saying.
Was told today by Betsy Mitchell at Bantam that "The Last Dancer" is
scheduled for Fall '93. I wish it could be sooner, but it's out of my
hands. However, next books in the series should come pretty quick on its
heels.
We now return you to your regularly scheduled arguing....
"There are no longer "dancers," the possessed. The cleavage of men into
actors and spectators is the central fact of our times. We are obsessed
with heroes who live for us and whom we punish . . . We have
metapmorphised from a mad body dancing on hillsides to a pair of eyes
staring in the dark." -- Jim Morrison, quoted in "The Last Dancer."
Euan Troup, AT Parkes.
duBois in the 'Exodus Bible' which says:
"It happened as you have heard it.
"I was there."
So the PKF really do think Trent walks through walls. And they're the
ones who'd try to find any plausible explanation. The quote is at the beginning
of chapter 15 of the section called 'The Wall - 2069-2070 Gregorian'. (Hey -
I've just noticed a quote here which says that miracles occur only among people
disposed to believe in miracles - and the PKF are mostly Catholic - make of it
what you will, but I know that this is one of the reasons why I enjoyed this
book a lot, and I'm desperate to read the new ones. I may even consider buying
the hardcovers and bugger the balance of payments.
>The two big problems that I have with the hologram of Trent problem, which I
>will need answers to before I can consider your solution, are:
>1 Where is Trent after he leaves the elevator?
>2 Why does he make the comment about how far it is from the meeting room to
>the airlock?
>I would look at these in context more, to see if I could find a solution, but
>I don't have my copy.
> Nate.
>
Euan Troup, etr...@atnf.csiro.au
..mostly harmless Disclaimer: I frame no hypotheses.
Nathan D. Johnson
> There _is_ a problem with this scenario - There's a quote from Melissa
> duBois in the 'Exodus Bible' which says:
> "It happened as you have heard it.
> "I was there."
> So the PKF really do think Trent walks through walls. And they're the
>ones who'd try to find any plausible explanation. The quote is at the beginning
>of chapter 15 of the section called 'The Wall - 2069-2070 Gregorian'. (Hey -
>I've just noticed a quote here which says that miracles occur only among people
>disposed to believe in miracles - and the PKF are mostly Catholic - make of it
>what you will, but I know that this is one of the reasons why I enjoyed this
>book a lot, and I'm desperate to read the new ones. I may even consider buying
>the hardcovers and bugger the balance of payments.
>>The two big problems that I have with the hologram of Trent problem, which I
>>will need answers to before I can consider your solution, are:
>>1 Where is Trent after he leaves the elevator?
>>2 Why does he make the comment about how far it is from the meeting room to
>>the airlock?
>>I would look at these in context more, to see if I could find a solution, but
>>I don't have my copy.
>> Nate.
>>
>Euan Troup, etr...@atnf.csiro.au
>..mostly harmless Disclaimer: I frame no hypotheses.
Well, since Daniel Keys Moran himself has said it is wrong, and since I did
not recall the quote by Ms. duBois, I will, concede that I was wrong, and, as
promised shut up.
Nate
Sean Eric Fagan
>(Hey -
>I've just noticed a quote here which says that miracles occur only among people
>disposed to believe in miracles - and the PKF are mostly Catholic
You know... I just read that quote last night, and wasn't able to figure out
what it was doing there. Now it makes a *lot* of sense.
Okay, so I'm *slow*. I still think it was a *very* nice touch to the feel
of the story.