Non-Brifter Brifter (from Blug Post)

[Daniel]

In Grant's Thanksgiving day post, he included a photo and short
description of a new brake lever with a downtube shifter boss. This
really intrigued me and I did a very little googling about it and came
back with a few points of interest:

1) Manfacturer site (they're MUSA--in Portland, of course): http://retroshift.com/
2) Short official demo video: http://vimeo.com/32392053
3) A forum discussion with the creator (including some good pictures),
indicating a $240 expect price (without shifter):
http://forums.roadbikereview.com/components-wrenching/retroshift-264420.html

These piqued my interest because I'm in the process of getting a bike
ready for my wife and since shes been off a bike or so long, I'm
planning to go the brifter route with her. These caught my eye, but
I'll probably end up going with a pair of 8 speed Campys that I
already own.

[Tim McNamara]

On Nov 27, 2011, at 11:24 PM, Daniel wrote:

> In Grant's Thanksgiving day post, he included a photo and short
> description of a new brake lever with a downtube shifter boss. This
> really intrigued me and I did a very little googling about it and came
> back with a few points of interest:
>
> 1) Manfacturer site (they're MUSA--in Portland, of course): http://retroshift.com/

And they have a basically useless Web site. They don't even have an actual photograph of their product that I could find, just some breathless hype and an unhelpful photo of a guy on a 'cross bike who might (or might not) be using their product.

[David Yu Greenblatt]

I agree, annoying website.
The video shows the product: http://vimeo.com/32392053
My initial reaction is that $240 is expensive if the downtube shifters are not included.
I can see the appeal of a system that is between bar-ends and brifters in the performance/durability continuum for super-muddy cyclocross racing, but IMO it would also make sense for the product to be priced accordingly (e.g., about half what they are asking).

David G, Madison WI

[Mojo]

I also agree. A website like that will just turn potential customers away...like me for instance.

The price is out there too. I dare say I don't see a bright future for this company.

[Michael_S]

Pretty cool idea. You can click on the cross racer pic on their site and see the design fairly well.  The $240 price sound steep if that's what it will cost, but I would probably want to try them out for mixed terrain rides. 

 

~nike

[franklyn]

Unless the ergonomics is superior to shifters mounted on Kelly Take-
off's (and I have no way of knowing since I haven't used either), then
Kelly Take-offs are definitely better value.

Franklyn

[PATRICK MOORE]

And I've not used brifters, but I have used Kellys and they are quite nice if you do a lot of shifting. I set mine up on a half stepped Riv using old Campy Record down tube shifters and the Kellys allowed me to shift from the ramps, the hoods and the hooks and, best, to doubleshift both levers simultaneously (something I never could do with bar end shifters). 

However, I shift much less now-a-days so dt shifters work perfectly well for me, as do the very excellent Silver bar end shifters (the best I've used).

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[William]

I read the forum thread, and the $240 was brought up by the guy who apparently is the retroshift guy.  He said $240 is the expected cost of a 10speed setup.  It was in the sentence where he was comparing the cost to Ultegra brifters ($340) and Dura Ace brifters (>$400).  I take that to mean that the person that buys Retroshift parts and buys Dura-Ace 10 speed downtube shifters to go on them, that person will be laying out $240 total.  You can get Dura Ace downtube 10-speed shifters for about $100, so I read the above comment to mean that the Retroshift things will be in the ballpark of $140.  

Later he says the Retroshift will be sold naked, so you can provide whatever shifter you like.  Just because the "expected cost of a 10-speed setup" will be $240 and they "will be sold naked" does not mean the naked parts will be $240.  

[David]

You can do friction brifters with these, had been wondering if anyone was ever going to bother coming up with that.  Are these brake lever of their own design or some sort of modification that bolts on to existing levers?

[Michael_S]

I hadn't looked at the Kelly take-offs before... not anywhere near as well designed as this Retroshift lever. And it's designed to work with the Tektro/CaneCreek lever ( my fav's) .  If it's really $240 for the naked lever I 'll think twice, but probably buy it for the 650B rig. 

 

Now to shop for 8 speed down tube shifters.... I prefer indexed for techncial off road riding. Friction is fine for road/commuting/touring. 

 

Silver and I like the logo too.  Wasn't too excited about the Taiwan comment designer made. Wonder if these will be MUSA?

 

~mike

[DustyMerkin]

These seem gimmicky.

[PATRICK MOORE]

They seem (at first sight) very possibly a very good idea; my question would rather be: if they are so good, why didn't someone think of these before? Or, if someone did, why didn't they catch on?

On Mon, Nov 28, 2011 at 3:16 PM, DustyMerkin <samco...@gmail.com> wrote:

These seem gimmicky.

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[Michael_S]

check out this link for more info and a possible answer to your question Patrick. He also mentions price is $140 w/o shifters.

 

 

http://www.bikerumor.com/2011/11/28/first-look-retroshift-brake-shift-levers-for-cyclocross/

 

~mike

[robert zeidler]

Brifters work fine in 99% of everything.

[rperks]

Mike,
Thanks for pointing that info source out. These have some attraction
for me, but....

The shift cables will be kind of in the way with a bar bag. Also, I
am wondering if there is a greater challange setting up the brake
cables with all that gear in front of the spot one usually threads the
cable into? I am sure these will get some traction, then time will
tell how they play out.

Looks like a fun reason to build up another bike.

Rob
-
http://oceanaircycles.com/

On Nov 28, 3:19 pm, Michael_S <mikeybi...@rocketmail.com> wrote:
> check out this link for more info and a possible answer to your question
> Patrick. He also mentions price is $140 w/o shifters.
>

> http://www.bikerumor.com/2011/11/28/first-look-retroshift-brake-shift...
>
> ~mike

[William]

Yeah, those appear to be as bad or worse than Shimano brifters for cable routing around a handlebar bag or basket.  

[William]

...but for those that don't run stuff like that up front, they look fun to try.  I run Tektro R200A brakelevers on a couple bikes, so I could try them out without even wrapping the bars.  

[James Warren]

Not for the front shifting if you want to do a triple and design your own gear ratios. Limitations arise from the indexed positions of the front and limited ability to trim.

-Jim W.

(Not in the 1%)

[Michael_S]

a tisket a tasket a red and yellow basket...

Looks to me like the cable sit up high, like old-skool brakes. Plenty of room for a rando bag ( or a purple and fushia basket ;^)  )  but maybe not a bar bag.  

I'm still interested in the 1st batch. 

~mike

[Jason Hartman]

On Mon, Nov 28, 2011 at 5:18 PM, PATRICK MOORE <bert...@gmail.com> wrote:

They seem (at first sight) very possibly a very good idea; my question would rather be: if they are so good, why didn't someone think of these before? Or, if someone did, why didn't they catch on?

They have been thought of before. 

See number 11 here:

http://www.blackbirdsf.org/rebour/images/1949.10.3.jpg

and number 6 and 8 here:

http://www.blackbirdsf.org/rebour/images/1951.11.4.jpg

I cant say why they never caught on.

Jay Hartman

[Patrick in VT]

On Nov 28, 10:40 am, David Yu Greenblatt
<david.yu.greenbl...@gmail.com> wrote:

> I can see the appeal of a system that is between bar-ends and brifters in

> the performance/durability continuum for super-muddy cyclocross racing . . .

i can't see the advantage over normal brifters for racing cyclocross.
STI, SRAM, Campy all go through a cassette plenty fast; they're all
more ergonomic than these things (which means better lever feel and
control); and it takes more than shifter to switch gears in a muddy
'cross race - if the conditions are that bad, the entire drivetrain
gets compromised and gunked up. hence, the pit bike.

anyway, they might be fun to try in other applications ... but,
brifters work great. if somebody really wants to shift from the
hoods, there are better options than this hack.

[Steve Palincsar]

On Mon, 2011-11-28 at 17:58 -0800, James Warren wrote:
> Not for the front shifting if you want to do a triple and design your own gear ratios. Limitations arise from the indexed positions of the front and limited ability to trim.

Not to mention the fact that different derailleurs have different cable
pull requirements, so it's unlikely that you could, for example,
successfully index a Campagnolo front derailleur with a Shimano brifter,
or a Shimano MTB front derailleur (oh so useful for those 22/32/44
microdrive cranks) with a Shimano brifter.

[Joe Bernard]

My 0.02 is...I don't get it for anything but cx racing. Bar-ends are a simple and easy to use system for regular riding. Why would I need an expensive application jammed into my brake levers so I can shift sideways, which doesn't have the leverage of pull-up/push-down?

[robert zeidler]

This much is true, but you can "stretch" the limits of the Fder, and
then combine that w/ a Harris custom casette.

[Steve Palincsar]

On Mon, 2011-11-28 at 11:10 -0800, David wrote:
> You can do friction brifters with these, had been wondering if anyone
> was ever going to bother coming up with that.

The shifting motion as seen in the video doesn't seem to offer enough
control for successful friction shifting.

[Jeremy Till]

Here's a closeup view, from Paul Sadoff of Rock Lobster who's trying them on his "dirt road" bike:

http://rocklobstershop.blogspot.com/2011/11/retro-shift-in-da-house.html

[Sean Whelan]

Campagnolo Front Ergo Shifters are not really indexed. Lots of little clicks and trimming options. I haven't tried the ones newer than 2007, but the above is true up until then... Thanks, Sean --- On Mon, 11/28/11, Steve Palincsar <pali...@his.com> wrote:

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[Joe Bernard]

I believe that is no longer true with the new Campy Ergos. I remember a bit of kerfuffle over it.

[Jim Thill - Hiawatha Cyclery]

I've been using Paul and IRD thumbie mounts to get the shifters off the bar-ends simply so I can use swanky bar-end plugs. This new gizmo would serve the same purpose.

[Seth Vidal]

Do-tell us about your swanky bar-end plugs.

-sv

[Jim Thill - Hiawatha Cyclery]

I think the variously colored anodized Nitto bar plus look nice.

[EricP]

Just realized another possible use for these - can't really fit pogies
on drop bars with bar end shifters. Will have to cut through
handlebar tape, and remove shifters/plugs before installing a pair on
my Hillborne before the snow flies.

Eric Platt
St. Paul, MN

On Nov 29, 2:34 pm, Jim Thill - Hiawatha Cyclery <thill....@gmail.com>
wrote: