I could bend the CrMo Nitto rack to make it level, right?

[James Warren]

My front mini-rack (not a Mark's, the fork-crown-hole mount style) has a slope to it when mounted on my Atlantis:

http://www.flickr.com/photos/46035786@N07/7122164137/in/photostream/


I'm probably splitting hairs, because the picture seems to exaggerate it, and the function is fine. But, in the constructeur spirit, I'm thinking of making it level.
There is no reason I could not make a slight bend to the tubular CrMo rack, correct? I actually know the answer to that; I'm wondering if anyone has tried it on this rack?

Thanks,
Jim W.


p.s. Perhaps instead I should use those top-of-the-fork-crown mounts that I had added to the frame and put on a Mark's rack. On all the Hunqapillars, Bombadils, and Atlantis's out there that have them, those seem to be the least used cool Rivendell thing.

[rcnute]

Jim: I can't say but if you decide to forego the Mini I will be glad
to take it off your hands. :)

Ryan

[Michael Hechmer]

It looks like the fork mounts are a little low.  I don't think you can hurt the rack, but I would start by straightening the stays to the fork blades and then the connector to the crown.  A little at a time is probably best.

Michael

[William]

Measure the distance to test Michael's theory.  The easiest measurement is from the center of the dogbone boss, along the fork blade to the tippy top of the crown.  All these Riv crowns are close enough in height that this distance will be really close.  Both my Bombadil and my Hilsen measure 150mm from the center of the dogbone to the top of the crown. 

[ted]

That surprises me, I thought the Atlantis had a higher crown than
most. The pictures show so much room over the tires.
If I recall correctly, when I fit my mini racks I mounted the fork
crown attachment and then adjusted the legs so they lined up with the
dogbone. I think that mostly involved straightening out the mid leg
bend a bit.
If you wanted to use canti's and the center crown rack attachment is
getting in the way, going to the Mark's rack with the crown top
attachments would solve that problem. Also I think the cr720s the
straddle winds up high enough to clear the center rack mount (works on
my bikes anyway).
Is the canti stud to fork crown distance the same on all your bikes?

[Phil Bickford]

While we wait with bated breath for Michael's reply with the measurement, I'd thought I would call attention to the distance between the brake post braze-on and the rack braze-on. Does anyone else think they are a bit close?

Is this a standard Atlantis 2 (that does mean it's a 700c?) fork for cantilever brakes, though he is running v-brakes? He mentioned added braze-ons on top of the fork crown. Did the same builder install the present (dogbone) braze-ons?

I wouldn't go bending the present rack with out answering these questions. Oh, and another one. Does anyone else think the tire clearance look larger than normal for JBs?

Phil B

[James Warren]

Interesting questions, Phil. As the owner, I've wondered the same thing about a few of them.

It is a standard Atlantis from either the 2000 or 2001 batch. (I got it in 2001.) I think it was from the second batch ever made. Early on, the Atlantis evolved a bit in that the very early 700C ones might not have had the same clearance as one from like 2004 or so. I recall being told in 2001 that a real 2 inch knobby wouldn't fit so well in the rear on mine while on future Atlantis's, it would.

When I brought the frame in to discuss repaint a year ago, Mark helped me to mark where the fork mini-rack braze-ons should go, and we did it based on my desired use of the Nitto mini-rack (unless I messed up at the time and said mini-Mark's rack which is possible!)

Once the bike was repainted, I immediately noticed how close the rack braze-ons were to the brake posts, but I was already using V-brakes so I wasn't worried. (It did prevent me from switching to Tektro cantis, as I had intended.) Michael asked why I went with V's. A few years ago, when Rivendell started selling the Tektro V-Brake lever, I loved the shape and wanted to try it, and at the same time, they had Deore V-Brakes at a good bargain. So I went for it. I like them.

Yes, the same builder made all the additions to my Atlantis at the time of the repaint: dogbone mini-rack mounts front and rear, kickstand plate, braze-ons on the fork crown.

Interesting that you mention the tire clearance being larger than normal. I wouldn't have expected that to be greater on mine than on later Atlantis's. Are you referring specifically to tire clearance above the tire? I've had fenders on my Atlantis before, and in the front, they sit WAY higher than the tire, and it looks a little weird. I had figured that all Atlantis's were this way, but I've never really compared mine to others in this detail. The high fender seems consistent with an observation that the clearance above the tire is large.

So to sum up, my Atlantis was a standard one for 2001, but maybe being an early one, it now seems atypical in a few regards compared to the majority of the frames made in the bike's 12 year history. I already figured that when I saw how close the mini-rack braze-ons are to the brake posts. I know current Atlantis's on Rivbike are not like that; there is more room, which means that now the braze-ons are lower than they are on mine. So now, let me think, extra high vertical clearance above the tire would be consistent with the rack braze-on being closer to the brakes, right? So does this mean that on my Atlantis, and presumably on the other early ones, the fork crown was just higher above the wheel axle than they are now? Does that mean my head tube is shorter, and my fork blades are longer?

FWIW, another way that mine and the other early 64's were different is that they have 62 cm top-tubes on the 64 cm frame size. The majority of 64's that came later had 60 cm top-tubes.

-Jim W.

p.s. When I get home, I'll do the measurement that William mentioned.

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[Michael Hechmer]

Well Olie, isn't this a fine kettle of fish!

Apparently, as the tire clearance under the crown increases, the canti studs remain a constant distance from the drop outs, but the rack braze-ons need to move up from the drop outs to remain a constant distance from the crown hole.  Eventually one impinges on the other.  Here's what mine look like on a fork that is designed for 35mm (actual) tires & fenders.

https://www.me.com/gallery/#100029/IMG_1471

This has lots of space for Cantis.  You might be better off accepting the offer to buy the rack and replacing it with one that mounts through the brake studs. This is common with cantis,but I don't know that I have ever seen it with V brakes. Or buy the adapter nuts and mount this rack through the canti posts.  Or accept that we live in an imperfect  but completely whole universe, and a front rack with a slight tilt is fine just the way it is.

Michael

BTW our 45 degree temps are now matched with 30mph winds and Vermonters, a hardy lot, are all complaining about how cold it is.

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[Minh]

Hmmm, i went downstairs to check my Hillborne and sure enough the dog-bones are much lower then on your atlantis with relation to the canti-bosses.  If this were my bike i'd see if i could bend the two arms to try and level it.  if that was too much work i'd just live with the unlevelness, while i think a mark's rack would give you a little more flexibilty to adjust it out, it's not the end of the world.  put a lil'loafer on the front and you won't even notice!

[Ryan Ray]

Looking at your red Atlantis, I feel sorry for everyone with the
slower, minty colored Atlanti.

And you aren't splitting hairs with that rack. I would spend some time
fixing it too.

Ryan




On Apr 29, 8:24 am, James Warren <jimcwar...@earthlink.net> wrote:

[Peter Morgano]

Would a mark's rack in the front work better? You would need a bolt an nut setup through the fork crown of course and you would have to buy another rack but for self confessed OCD people like myself that is a small price to pay to have "perfection."  Its a bit like fenderlines though, where alot of the times they work fine but are unpleasing to the eyes so they draw more attention than is really necessary. If only I could take my own advice on this though....

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[Earl Grey]

I have successfully bent a Nitto M-12 (mounts to the canti posts) to
fit level on a bike that also has huge clearance between tire and fork
crown: http://www.flickr.com/photos/gernothuber/6126662617/ (shown
with 52mm knobbies and fenders!)

Worked quite well, so I wouldn't worry about bending the Nitto Mini.
However, you have another brand new option. Compass Bicycles now
carries a custom Grand Bois Nitto front rack designed for greater
distance between canti posts and fork crown hole:
http://www.compasscycle.com/racks_gb_wide.html (Click on the image
showing both racks to see the appropriate measurements)

I would pick this option over a Mark's because like the Mini this rack
is non-adjustable and thus much stronger (and perhaps the most
beautiful of all of them).

Good luck,

Gernot

[William]

"Is the canti stud to fork crown distance the same on all your bikes?"

I have four bikes, two rivendells.  One of the Rivendells has canti posts, so yes the canti posts on all my Rivendells with canti posts are the same.  :)

Both of my bikes that take a Nitto mini front rack (one riv and one Rawland) needed zero rack manipulation to make the rack fit and both have it level.  My other two bikes have a Marks rack in front

[Brian Hanson]

No reason not to bend.  I just did the strut bends on a PlatRack with no issues:

http://stonehog.wordpress.com/2012/04/29/rack-mounting-variation/

Here's the Rivendell video that shows the method pretty well - pertinent bit at about a minute in:

http://youtu.be/65yQS1AuAfc

Have fun!

Brian 

Seattle, WA

[Phil Bickford]

Put down the hammer James, .....and back away slowly.

I wouldn't bend it. Sell it to the highest bidder and buy yourselve a
Marks Rack.

I don't see what you will gain. Bending the top center strut could
make the rack level, but how do you hope to lengthen the bottom struts
to match? Straightening them won't make them much longer, and then
they'll probably get in the way of the brakes anyway.

You've got an odd duck there, a fork with way long legs. The dog-bone
braze-ons should have been located measuring down from the hole in the
fork crown, not up from the dropouts.

Just to check before you buy I'd take the rear rack off and try it on
the front. Remember the Mark's comes with two sets of different
length struts.

Good Luck

Phil B

[James Warren]

Thank you. But just to clarify, they were measured down from the hole.