Altantis almost complete!

[The Cripler]

Several weeks back, with the hearty encouragement of this forums members, I purchased my first Rivendell - a used 58cm Atlantis. It was a deal that was too good to pass up, and I have been nothing but incredibly happy that I made the leap. Since the purchase, I have been tweaking the bike fit and swapping out some parts. I was able to recoup some much needed $$$$ with the sale of my Surly LHT and host of parts from my bin. This allowed me to make some nice upgrades to the Atlantis. Since the purchase I have swapped out stems to a 100 Nitto Technimic, added a Paul Neo-retro/Touring brake combo, splurged on the Tektro TRP brake levers, rerouted my brake and derailleur cables, and finally last night added yellow Newbaums cloth tape and twine to the Noodles. All that is left to do is get some amber shellac on the bars, and I am ready to ride! Through the process I have learned alot...mostly about the "joys" of tweaking with canti brakes and the importance of taping your brake cables where you want them prior to wrapping and twining (still might have to fix this one). Here are some pics:

 

[The Cripler]

[The Cripler]

On Thursday, August 16, 2012 7:29:52 AM UTC-7, The Cripler wrote:

[Lyle Bogart]

Lookin' Good!

 

Cheers!

 

lyle

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lyle f bogart dpt

156 bradford rd

wiscasset, me 04578

207.882.6494

206.794.6937

[SteveD]

Very nice. Would like to see photos after you shellac the bars; I suspect that that will complement your Brooks nicely. How do you like the Pauls? I installed the same set on my Atlantis last month. Even thought I haven't tweak them much, they work great.

Steve
Seattle

[The Cripler]

I will definitely post some pics after I shellac the bars. I like the Pauls alot. The rear touring canti is really resposnsive and powerful. I am still having some issues with the front neo-retro. It just doesn't seem nearly as powerful and requires quite a bit of hand strength. I had my buddy who is a bike mechanic take a look and he seemed to think it was setup correctly. He seemed to think there might actually be something going on with my rim that is preventing it from working properly...maybe some grease or something on there. I'm not to sure about this, as the mini-moto I had on there locked up the front wheel without issue. Anyway, I'm gonna keep playing with it till I get it where I want. I forgot to mention one other addition to the bike. I took my old surly rear rack, rough sanded it, repainted it with altantis touch up paint, and added a couple of coats of spray on clear coat. I think it looks great and matches the frame pretty well. I guess we will see how long the paint hols up with the bags coming on and off.....

 

On Thursday, August 16, 2012 7:29:52 AM UTC-7, The Cripler wrote:

[Jeremy Till]

The most helpful article on cantilever adjustment is here:  http://sheldonbrown.com/canti-trad.html 

It sounds like, from your description (not tons of power, requires lots of hand strength) and looking at your pictures, that you might have the straddle cable set too high/long, which seems to be a common mistake with high-profile cantilevers like the Neo-Retro.  If you shorten the straddle cable, it'll effectively increase the mechanical advantage of the whole system, providing a brake that requires less hand force to produce more stopping power at the rim.  

[Mojo]

Funny how canti brakes are so simple yet quite theoretically and operationally quite complicated. As I understand canti operations, I agree with Jeremy that you will gain some mechanical advantage from a lower straddle cable. You might also run fine sandpaper along the rim braking surface just to insure it is clean and 'open' to the brake pads.

After you have ridden it for awhile, I would like to hear your comparison/contrast to the LHT, a bike with different tube diameters and thickness but very similar geometry.

[Matt Beebe]

Here's a link to a cool document describing the MA for various brake profiles:   http://www.circleacycles.com/cantilevers/canti-geometry.pdf     It even uses as an Paul Neo Retros as an example.

-Matt

[Michael Hechmer]

Very sweet looking. It reignites my Atlantis lust!  What kind of pedals am I seeing?  There is definitely a learning curve to Paul's cantis, but after a short while it will seem very easy to readjust them, or take them on & off when you want to.

Michael

[Peter Morgano]

Nice stuff, did you hand paint that rear rack or find a spray that was a good match? I am this close to just admitting defeat and bringin in my Bombadi to the LBS to have them tweak the brakes. I finally got them to stop squeaking but feel like I need to grip them like a gorilla to make them work well.  As much as I dont like the looks of v-brakes if I didnt have an attachmen to my standard levers I would go that way.

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[ted]

I only skimmed over that write up, but I think its much simpler to
stick with vertical and horizontal components at the cable attachment
to the brake. The vertical component is independent of straddle wire
angle, the horizontal part goes to infinity as the straddle wire
becomes straight. I think there is a lot less trig to work through
when you skip that whole tangent point on the straddle wire thing and
since its not necessary why bother?

[ted]

I only skimmed over that write up, but I think its much simpler to
stick with vertical and horizontal components at the cable attachment
to the brake. The vertical component is independent of straddle wire
angle, the horizontal part goes to infinity as the straddle wire
becomes straight. I think there is a lot less trig to work through
when you skip that whole tangent point on the straddle wire thing and
since its not necessary why bother?

On Aug 17, 3:26 pm, Matt Beebe <matthiasbe...@gmail.com> wrote:

[ted]

What kind of brakes do you have?
It took me a while to get the cr720s on my Bombadill to run quiet but
they are fine now.

> >> <https://lh6.googleusercontent.com/-Bp1cCFGAnwU/UC0DamiyQDI/AAAAAAAAAC...>

[Peter Morgano]

Paul touring,  I noticed now my cable straddle is pretty high but lowering it means replacement on the cables.  Will wait for a rainy day and see if I can get it right.  Front is pretty good but rear is somewhat tight.

[Peter Morgano]

I mean replacing the brake wires, not the actual cables. Not the biggest job I know but fiddling with brakes is tedious work. I like how the Pauls have adjustable tension and i would like to acutally have more snap back but then it really goes gorilla hand mode. Am I missing something to the setup?  I had the CR720s and they were easier to set up but didnt stop my 250lbs all that well, even with koolstop pads.

[ted]

Sometimes it seems that cables are the bane of my existence. I've
taken to leaving em as long as I can minimize the need to replace em
if I decide to change something. I recently replaced an old stem with
a taller one and now the front brake cable and housing are only barely
long enough to permit dragging my feet over replacing them. grrrr.

On Aug 18, 9:05 pm, Peter Morgano <uscpeter11...@gmail.com> wrote:
> Paul touring,  I noticed now my cable straddle is pretty high but lowering
> it means replacement on the cables.  Will wait for a rainy day and see if I
> can get it right.  Front is pretty good but rear is somewhat tight.

[ted]

I have never used the Pauls, and you have a fair bit more mass to slow
down than I do, so my experiences may not be relevant.
If the straddle wire end of the brake is above the pivot point (when
the pads are touching he rim) then the lower the straddle wire, the
more leverage you are going to get. That leverage comes at the expense
of greater bake lever travel which can limit how low you want to go
with some brakes (particularly low profile ones). Some folks end up
toeing in their pads a lot to stop squeel. That tends to make brakes
perform poorly (though quietly). With the 720s I need to disengage the
return springs when I set the pads. I hold both pads against the rim
at the same time, and roll the wheel forward so everything is where it
ends up under braking before tightening the bolt.
The way the Pauls are built they probably don't rock as much at the
720s do so maybe thats not as big an issue with them.

On Aug 18, 9:09 pm, Peter Morgano <uscpeter11...@gmail.com> wrote:
> I mean replacing the brake wires, not the actual cables. Not the biggest
> job I know but fiddling with brakes is tedious work. I like how the Pauls
> have adjustable tension and i would like to acutally have more snap back
> but then it really goes gorilla hand mode. Am I missing something to the
> setup?  I had the CR720s and they were easier to set up but didnt stop my
> 250lbs all that well, even with koolstop pads.
>

> On Sun, Aug 19, 2012 at 12:05 AM, Peter Morgano <uscpeter11...@gmail.com>wrote:
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> > Paul touring,  I noticed now my cable straddle is pretty high but lowering
> > it means replacement on the cables.  Will wait for a rainy day and see if I
> > can get it right.  Front is pretty good but rear is somewhat tight.

[The Cripler]

I fiddled with the Neo-Retro this weekend and it seems my blind tweaking has worked. The front brake now has much more stopping power. The rear Touring brake is still stronger though. I can actually lock up the rear wheel without a tremendous amount of hand force.

 

 

On Thursday, August 16, 2012 7:29:52 AM UTC-7, The Cripler wrote: