Future Rivs

[Joe Bernard]

While we're on the subject of guessing what the new Rivendell is, I'd
like to offer up my own "gosh, I wish they would do this" bike.

I'd like a 26-inch-wheel City Bike with an IGH, dynohub, and drum
brakes. Preferably butterscotch color.

Joe "I like dreamin" Bernard
Fairfield, CA.

[Montclair BobbyB]

Joe:

I agree... that would be awfully cool. FWIW I've built up more than
one of these types of bikes (with older mountain frames) and have been
really pleased with the results; some with rim brakes, others with
drums...

Here are a few:

Stumpjumper - http://tinyurl.com/26mk55t
Mongoose - http://tinyurl.com/5uu23l6
Rockhopper - http://tinyurl.com/3oxqghk

These are great, but a Riv version would be the piece de resistance...
and yes, butterscotch of course, maybe even 650B.

BB

[William]

There are two Rivs in my future that I can foresee. The standard one
is that I'll probably upgrade my 56 Hillborne to a 58 Atlantis. I
want the MUSA, I want the looks (two tone paint, and those lovely
chainstays) and I want just a teensy weensy bit more clearance to run
700x50s.

The non-standard one that I'll buy as a custom if I have to, but would
be delighted to see standard would be a full-on Riv Rando bike. I
think of it as a 650B Roadeo with cantilevers. If I do it as a custom
I'll put a pump peg behind the seat tube, have Nobilette make a
connectorless dynamo fork, plus a couple other little details that
I've come up with.

On Jun 21, 7:14 am, Montclair BobbyB <montclairbob...@gmail.com>
wrote:

> Joe:
>
> I agree... that would be awfully cool.  FWIW I've built up more than
> one of these types of bikes (with older mountain frames) and have been
> really pleased with the results; some with rim brakes, others with
> drums...
>
> Here are a few:
>
> Stumpjumper -http://tinyurl.com/26mk55t
> Mongoose -http://tinyurl.com/5uu23l6

> Rockhopper -http://tinyurl.com/3oxqghk

[cyclotourist]

You should check out the Velo Cult branded bikes being made by Nobilette.  I think that's pretty close to what you're looking at.  Check w/ Esteban who has proto-velo-culto.

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Cheers,
David
Redlands, CA

...in terms of recreational cycling there are many riders who would probably benefit more from
improving their taste than from improving their performance. - RTMS

[PATRICK MOORE]

Speaking of the Roadeo, how does it perform strictly as a smooth
pavement road bike -- or is it the wrong product for that niche? My
stable has really more than I need, but it doesn't hurt to dream of
even more excess, and one niche would be a top end road -- strictly
road, tires no wider than 26 (I'm not that heavy and our roads are
decent), no fenders or rack; in short, a full-indulgence gofast --
built for such speed as I can maintain.

In terms of mere performance at this role, would an RB-1 be just as
good? An ebay Merlin or Lightspeed? Fix up the old Motobecane Grand
Record? Other models, not excluding the latest?

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When all the stars are dead.
(Rilke, Buddha in Glory)

[Michael_S]

rather than canti's William you should spec. the Paul Racers in the
braze on version.They are the best stopping brakes I've ever ridden
short of hydro discs.

I had a small custom builder do that Rando bike but that fits Jack
Browns with fenders. Standard diameter tubes, rear pump peg,custom
front rack that attaches to Racer braze on studs. My only shortcoming
was the dynamo fork. oh... besides me.

~mike

> > > Fairfield, CA.- Hide quoted text -
>
> - Show quoted text -

[William]

Pictures!

[Steve Palincsar]

On Wed, 2011-06-22 at 15:43 -0700, lukemcg wrote:
> Personally, Riv offers enough current options for adults. Would love
> to see Grant put his mind to qork on an age 9+ bike. It is really
> awful to shop for kids bikes to find hydraulic, knobby tired mountain
> bikes with too many gears.

But how many people want to spend the kind of money Rivs go for for a
kid's bike?

\

[Peter Pesce]

Sasha White did a kid's bike - 26" wheels with a low saddle and really cool look. He thought it was good for 5 years - age 7 -12.
Very Riv-ish IMHO.
http://bikeportland.org/2011/02/26/a-bike-for-kids-from-sacha-white-of-vanilla-bicycles-48741

[lukemcg]

Personally, Riv offers enough current options for adults. Would love
to see Grant put his mind to qork on an age 9+ bike. It is really
awful to shop for kids bikes to find hydraulic, knobby tired mountain
bikes with too many gears.

Too much emphasisnon the wrong things.

Luke

[William]

Is it just a coincidence that Sasha White thinks it will be good for 5
years, and the waiting list for a Vanilla is also 5 years? :)

On Jun 22, 4:08 pm, Peter Pesce <petepe...@gmail.com> wrote:
> Sasha White did a kid's bike - 26" wheels with a low saddle and really cool
> look. He thought it was good for 5 years - age 7 -12.

> Very Riv-ish IMHO.http://bikeportland.org/2011/02/26/a-bike-for-kids-from-sacha-white-o...

[Peter Pesce]

Good point.
Better order it when your kid starts walking!

In any case, if Riv could design a smart kids frame and get it made for $600 or so, seems like there are plenty of people on this list who'd spend that, knowing they could build it up with spare parts they already have (ok , maybe not the 150mm cranks!) and sell it to another list member when the kid outgrew it. Seems like a perfect Riv idea to me - the infinitely reused bike frame.

[cyclotourist]

I hear ya' on the lack of kid bike options.  If you don't know about them, Islabike in the UK is a great resource.  Unfortunately, they don't have a NA distributor, so shipping is prohibitive from the UK.  So email 'em and encourage them to get one post haste (that's the way they talk there, be sure to pepper your email with it)!!!

http://www.islabikes.co.uk/

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[Brian Hanson]

Interesting that this topic came up.  I was talking about this very thing with Grant last week on a quick visit to HQ.  He indicated that he has thought through this quite a bit, and he said he felt he would have to keep the price way down to avoid it being a bike that rich parents buy their kids because they (the parents) want an exclusive bike.  He mentioned a price point far south of $600, BTW.  Said it would have to be steel an lugged, but it would be a challenge to design as he couldn't ride it, and he hasn't ever done "kid bike design".

I think it would be super cool, but I would really wonder if this would be anything other than a non-profit exercise.  I can see a market for nice kid bikes - but perhaps for another startup bike maker?  I think Riv may be better off focusing on its core competencies.  There seems to be more and more folks into Grant's non-racing velosophy - why muddy the focus of his small shop with a new audience.  There may be more risk from a litigation standpoint when kids are involved.

Now that I've said that, I could see a Riv design that improved on the Big Dummy and maybe created something that was tandem-able so kids could ride along?  Sort of a longer Bombadil with an extra seat?  He has the diagatube down...

Brian

Seattle

[Thomas Lynn Skean]

Far south of $600 for a complete bike? Sounds too good to be true.
Really. And maybe isn't what you meant? If it is what you meant, then
I'd consider buying one on the theory that it would be at least as
good as any $300 complete bike option I have. And I'd feel more
comfortable with where it was made (presumably Taiwan and under
satisfactory conditions). And it probably would have graphics I and my
child could both like. And I expect it would actually look like a
bike, with round tubes and normal-ish tires and no suspension. And
it'd fit fenders and racks and bags. And it'd be lugged! :)

Far south of $600 for a frameset? I can *imagine* it being true.
Taiwan-made, substantially less profit. Maybe? Surely the actual mass
of frame tubing doesn't explain too much of the retail price of a
bike. So that $400+ difference between a SimpleOne frameset's price
and a kid's bike frameset's price would be mostly from a profit
difference, right?

Well...if it were an RBW product, sold soup-to-nuts with the
enthusiasm and passion and involvement and dedication that Mr.
Petersen and crew attach to the standard RBW bike line, then I could
see spending that kind of money for a frameset and expecting not to be
disappointed.

If, however, it were something other than that (a new brand, a "Grant-
designed" bike, a joint marketing venture, etc.), it'd take a *lot* of
work (probably more work than has taken place in the universe to date)
to convince me it'd have the same reliability, versatility, durability
and comfort I'd expect from today's RBW bikes. And, for that kind of
money, that's what I'd want my child to have: the full RBW package.
The $300 complete bike is "good enough" and doesn't guarantee a
downgrade if it ever needs replacing at your own expense. (Would you
pay for the *second* $600 frameset?)

Yours,
Thomas Lynn Skean

On Jun 23, 2:25 am, Brian Hanson <stone...@gmail.com> wrote:
> Interesting that this topic came up.  I was talking about this very thing
> with Grant last week on a quick visit to HQ.  He indicated that he has
> thought through this quite a bit, and he said he felt he would have to keep
> the price way down to avoid it being a bike that rich parents buy their kids
> because they (the parents) want an exclusive bike.  He mentioned a price
> point far south of $600, BTW.  Said it would have to be steel an lugged, but
> it would be a challenge to design as he couldn't ride it, and he hasn't ever
> done "kid bike design".
>
> I think it would be super cool, but I would really wonder if this would be
> anything other than a non-profit exercise.  I can see a market for nice kid
> bikes - but perhaps for another startup bike maker?  I think Riv may be
> better off focusing on its core competencies.  There seems to be more and
> more folks into Grant's non-racing velosophy - why muddy the focus of his
> small shop with a new audience.  There may be more risk from a litigation
> standpoint when kids are involved.
>
> Now that I've said that, I could see a Riv design that improved on the Big
> Dummy and maybe created something that was tandem-able so kids could ride
> along?  Sort of a longer Bombadil with an extra seat?  He has the diagatube
> down...
>
> Brian
> Seattle
>

> On Wed, Jun 22, 2011 at 8:31 PM, cyclotourist <cyclotour...@gmail.com>wrote:
>
>
>
> > I hear ya' on the lack of kid bike options.  If you don't know about them,
> > Islabike in the UK is a great resource.  Unfortunately, they don't have a NA
> > distributor, so shipping is prohibitive from the UK.  So email 'em and
> > encourage them to get one post haste (that's the way they talk there, be
> > sure to pepper your email with it)!!!
>
> >http://www.islabikes.co.uk/
>

> > On Wed, Jun 22, 2011 at 3:43 PM, lukemcg <luke...@gmail.com> wrote:
>
> >> Personally, Riv offers enough current options for adults. Would love
> >> to see Grant put his mind to qork on an age 9+ bike.  It is really
> >> awful to shop for kids bikes to find hydraulic, knobby tired mountain
> >> bikes with too many gears.
>
> >> Too much emphasisnon the wrong things.
>
> >> Luke
>
> >> --
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>
> > --
> > Cheers,
> > David
> > Redlands, CA
>

> > *...in terms of recreational cycling there are many riders who would
> > probably benefit more from
> > improving their taste than from improving their performance.* - RTMS

>
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> >http://groups.google.com/group/rbw-owners-bunch?hl=en.- Hide quoted text -

[Damian]

I just ordered an Islabike Beinn 24" for my daughter.

It was so refreshing to find a company that takes children's bikes
seriously and doesn't just lazily try to shrink an adult's bike and
imagine that that will do the job.

Children's bodies have different relative dimensions and kids bikes so
often fit really poorly and weigh a ton that they're just not much fun
for the kids to ride. Also, they all have suspension as mentioned
earlier which is even more useless for kids than adults and just adds
to the weight of the bike. They also have 18 gears that are unneeded
and not understood. Drives me nuts! not to mention the terrible
quality of all the components. Urrrgh!

I'm so looking forward to getting it it's ridiculous! Definitely much
more excited about it than she is! Racks! Mudguards (fenders)!
Propstand! Yes!!

There must be an equivalent for you guys in NA.

Damian

> *...in terms of recreational cycling there are many riders who would
> probably benefit more from
> improving their taste than from improving their performance.* - RTMS

[Montclair BobbyB]

Hah.... add it to the questionnaire as part of prenatal planning...

Things you can begin planning for NOW...
- Will you and your wife be planning to send your son/daughter to
college?
- Will you and your wife be planning a custom Vanilla bicycle for your
son/daughter's 5th birthday?

> > Very Riv-ish IMHO.http://bikeportland.org/2011/02/26/a-bike-for-kids-from-sacha-white-o...- Hide quoted text -

[Montclair BobbyB]

For me, it would be a Riv folding bike, preferably with 26in wheel...
This so I could take my Riv on the train (and stick it to the
bureacrats at Amtrak).

BB

On Jun 23, 7:06 am, Thomas Lynn Skean <thomaslynnsk...@comcast.net>
wrote:

> > >http://groups.google.com/group/rbw-owners-bunch?hl=en.-Hide quoted text -
>
> > - Show quoted text -- Hide quoted text -

[EricP]

Folding would be nice. Although there was a Bromptom around RBWHQ at
one time, I believe. (Wasn't it in a Reader?)

The one I'd love straight gauge tubing, one bottle mount on the
downtube, maybe hi-ten stays if cheaper, semi-horizontal dropouts.
With slightly shorter chainstays than the Atlantis or Hillborne and
maybe a skosh higher bottom bracket. Think the old "sport touring"
bike with clearances for much wider tires, like 40s w/fenders on 700C,
single speed or geared.

To me, that would make a great utility/commuting/anything type of
bike.

Eric Platt
St. Paul, MN

On Jun 23, 10:57 am, Montclair BobbyB <montclairbob...@gmail.com>
wrote:

[cyclotourist]

Yes, that is a GREAT bike!  No, we don't have anything like them here.  All the majors have a few kid bikes, but they are tremendously heavy (my kid's 24" Trek MTB weights 30lbs, the same as my Surly 29er!) and not elegant in the least (clunky sus, cheap components).  The only other option is a 24" Redline Conquest 24" which I also have.  It weighs 20lbs and is a very nice bike. 

But those are just singletons, not a whole company dedicated to kid's cycling.  That is a glaring hole in the market, and I think someone could move into that niche and be the NA distributor or that Islabikes itself should move into the NA market directly.  I don't think Riv should do it, that's not their mission.  QBP might be able to pull it off as they seem to let their partners run with things (Surly, Salsa).  But unless it happens soon, my kids won't be able to take advantage of it!!!

Report back on the bike when it comes in :-)

improving their taste than from improving their performance. - RTMS

[Peter Pesce]

Seems to me Schwinn (and maybe Huffy, etc) made a pretty good line of kid's bikes back in the day.
By LBS as a kid was a stand-alone Schwinn dealer. They later added other brands, or course, but my friends and I all got Stingrays (and Varsitys and LeTours) from that shop.
The problem is that mass market kids bikes are made to look like shrunken adult bikes, complete with suspension, too many gears, etc. There wasn't really an "adult" version of the Stingray!

[Leslie]

How funny that the conversation turned this way...

Just a couple of months ago, I was shopping for a new bike for my
daughter, and I'd sent a similar note to Grant, saying it'd be
interesting to see his 'expanded sizing' ideas used for a kids bike.

Then recently, Yehuda's had his 'grow bike' idea in the strip.

I'd have loved to have gotten a Riv for my daughter, but alas, went
more conventional...

http://www.trekbikes.com/us/en/bikes/mountain/sport/skye/skye/#

Got her the smallest size. It's a nice bike, since it's a women's
bike instead of a kids' bike, it has 26" wheels instead of kids
wheels. She'd turned 9 just before, and has been loving it
http://www.flickr.com/photos/leslie_bright/5840945443/in/photostream/
.

But if I could have gotten a Riv 'kids' frame for her instead, that
would have been really lovely. A small Betty Foy might have worked,
but, I didn't want to spend *that* much on a bike that could possibly
get outgrown; this bike, it'll last her until she is grown (even I
can ride it), and then she can get a 'grown-up bike' at that point.

[John Speare]

I gotta share this here.

 

My buddy is a framebuilder and hooked me up with a sweet kid bike for my 8 yo daughter last Chrismass.

 

The connection which really makes this Riv-related, is that the donor frame for the tube set came from a 89 RB-1.

 

http://cyclingspokane.blogspot.com/search/label/maddie%20xmass%20bike

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[Peter Pesce]

That is so fantastic! Thanks for sharing it.

[Leslie]

John, that's awesome. She'll treasure that, and pass it down to her
kids. Wow....

[William]

Taking it back to the Original Post: What bike(s) would you like to
see Riv implement in the future?

The one I'm shocked nobody brought up (or maybe it's because we've all
said it so much that it needs no more saying) was the Riv Tandem.

[Seth Vidal]

On Thu, Jun 23, 2011 at 5:59 PM, William <tape...@gmail.com> wrote:
> Taking it back to the Original Post:  What bike(s) would you like to
> see Riv implement in the future?
>
> The one I'm shocked nobody brought up (or maybe it's because we've all
> said it so much that it needs no more saying) was the Riv Tandem.
>

Last year when riv made the "if you want a custom do it now" request,
I emailed and said I'd put down a deposit on a tandem right now if
they'd be willing to do it.

I got a reply back that said they would love to do it but wouldn't
feel right taking a deposit on something that isn't even on the
horizon nor likely to be anytime soon.

-sv

[William]

I can still want it to happen, though. Even if it's not likely and
even if I couldn't afford it.

On Jun 23, 3:28 pm, Seth Vidal <skvi...@gmail.com> wrote:

[Philip Williamson]

I'd like to see a Rivendell bike trailer with a Nigel Smythe bag like
this Jack Taylor / Goëland in Bicycle Quarterly:
http://www.bikequarterly.com/images/GBwTrailer.jpg

And a production version of their ill-fated Mountain Fixie, optimized
for drop bars. Ideally, with a limited run of Cunningham drop bars
like they did with the Bullmoose. Derailler hanger, kickstand plate
and fender mounts would be acceptable, but I'm not talking about an
overbuilt Fargo rig with 40,000 braze-ons. Just a fun, light, knock-
around-in-the-woods bike with a long headtube and a long seatpost. Any
wheel size would be fine. A complementary super-rise Nitto threadless
stem, either lugged or not, painted or not, would be a fantastic
bonus.

I'd like to see that more than the trailer, but it's about as likely.
Philip

Philip Williamson
www.biketinker.com

[Peter Pesce]

I love that trailer (at least I think I do -. never seen one in person).
Hadn't thought about Riv doing one with a matching bag. Cool idea!
Although the world needs a $1500 lugged steel trailer about as much as a $1500 lugged steel kids bike...

On Friday, June 24, 2011 2:17:09 PM UTC-4, Philip Williamson wrote:

I'd like to see a Rivendell bike trailer with a Nigel Smythe bag like
this Jack Taylor / Goëland in Bicycle Quarterly:
http://www.bikequarterly.com/images/GBwTrailer.jpg

And a production version of their ill-fated Mountain Fixie, optimized
for drop bars. Ideally, with a limited run of Cunningham drop bars
like they did with the Bullmoose. Derailler hanger, kickstand plate
and fender mounts would be acceptable, but I'm not talking about an
overbuilt Fargo rig with 40,000 braze-ons. Just a fun, light, knock-
around-in-the-woods bike with a long headtube and a long seatpost. Any
wheel size would be fine. A complementary super-rise Nitto threadless
stem, either lugged or not, painted or not, would be a fantastic
bonus.

I'd like to see that more than the trailer, but it's about as likely.
 Philip

 Philip Williamson
www.biketinker.com

[Ron MH]

Brompton - best kid's bike ever! A bike that will literally grow with
the child. A child needs to be a minimum size, but beyond that, the
sky's the limit with a Brompton!