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CPTSD - Complex Post-traumatic Stress Disorder

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Sam Vaknin author of "Malignant Self-love"

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Apr 8, 2016, 12:41:07 PM4/8/16
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CPTSD

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Welcome to CPTSD. Please check out our wiki page for explanations of what CPTSD is, a list of possible treatments and explanations of some types of abuse that are difficult to recognize.

I urge you to consider getting Pete Walker's book CPTSD: From Surviving to Thriving. It is a rich source of information, help, healing, compassion and growth. Most with CPTSD who read it find it creates a sea change in how they see themselves and their past.

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22

Hi Im Richard Grannon and this is probably the best place to Ask Me Anything (self.CPTSD)

submitted by RichardGrannon

Hello my name is Richard Grannon, I will be on at 9pm GMT which is 4pm EST so you can ask me anything on CPTSD, recovery from narcissistic abuse, emotional flashbacks... or.... well... anything!

Ok my friends, thats 1 hour and 40, thankyou so much for joining in. I need to drink a protein shake, walk the dog, and prepare for the google hangout with Dana of NarcissistSupport I am doing at 8pm EST

If you can join in there too that would be great

https://plus.google.com/events/cs01k853h6rk20batjtlbclqdvg

thanks for inviting forum moderator, it was awesome, cheers!

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[–]CMK0013 9 points  

Hi Richie!! Love you and love what you do!! I recently sent you an email asking if you could do a G+ Hangout called Boundary Setting for Dummies? From how it feels when someone violates a boundary to how we should react to it.

My story is I have a hard time identifying when a boundary has been crossed. It's not until hours later after over-analyzing the shit out of it do I realize..yep, shoulda had a boundary. I'm looking for guidance on how we can get to the realization faster. Mind you, without skipping any of the feels or emotions, just identifying feelings and situations faster. Love you, love you, LOVE YOU. Stay Cool!

[–]RichardGrannon[S] 9 points  

This is the 3rd question on a really great topic. I will do it, it must be done.

stares into distance with steely resolve

[–]CMK0013 3 points  

Thanks for this! Can't wait to see it.

[–]cultivatingjoy 4 points  

This is a great question! My experience is... as we get stronger, the gap of time, between experiencing the boundary break and realization of it, gets smaller. What took me days or hours, is now taking 10-20 min. : ) Thank you Richie!! Reframe is super hard work but well worth the effort. So glad to have this alternative option to dealing with suffering.

[–]ljaries 1 point  

I would welcome a G+ on this subject too!

[–]Nannash 4 points  

Hi, Richard. What is your opinion on the types of therapy, where the therapist is silent, e.g. psychodynamic therapy. You come and you hear "How have you been doing?" and that's about it. You keep talking to yourself and there is no response. No follow-up questions. I expressed my concerns because I didn't know where my therapy was going, but the therapist just asked me back why I thought I needed to understand the process and said I might as well go and major in psychology. That was a very different experience to the one I had as a codependent at my addiction and codependency therapy centre, where my husband and I got plenty of practical advice. Is there any merit to the silence-only approach? Thank you for the work you do.

[–]RichardGrannon[S] 11 points  

Is there any merit to the silence-only approach?

No there is not at all and zero evidence that it helps and plenty of evidence that it hurts. Why do they keep using it? You may rightly ask...

Why does mainstream therapy keep doing so many things that both do not work and can hurt the client? I would ask in return.

Im so glad to hear you did get practical advice in the end!

[–]Nannash 1 point  

Thank you so much for your response, Richard! Your videos help me a lot too.

[–]Spiorog 3 points  

In the event you have a situation that therapy is not currently possible, and you have a person that has been dealing with the symptoms and issues as they appear - what would be some of the most important points you would make to that person, to carry them through until therapy is possible?

[–]RichardGrannon[S] 9 points  

You mean like a cheat sheet for coping with CPTSD until professional help gets there? A kind of first aid as it were?

Good question.

I did first aid once, it was all: stop the bleeding, plug the hole, make sure oxygen is still getting in, put out the fire, dont move them unless they are in danger, dont remove the barbed arrow etc

So how to "stop the bleeding".

You have to focus on one job and one job only: reduce the emotional flashbacks.

Step 1. acknowledge you are in a thing called an emotional flasback. Say it out loud if it helps.

Step 2. take steps to PHYSICALLY assist your body in the process of calming down: stillness, breathing, calm environment, do you need water/ food? do you need something to diminish physical pain? Acknowledge that the person is biological entity and physical stress of any kind makes flashbacks worse.

Step 3. There are techniques of state management that can only be taught and learned before the flasback begins when the person is in a relatively calm state. These techniques (being aware of and controlling inner dialogue, mental focus, physiology, internal representations are my top 4) will help them avoid flashbacks and bring themselves out of them.

Check out the short manual I just released on Amazon for more details "how to stop an emotional flashback". It wont be any good if the person is in the flashback of course.

Pete Walker offers a list of 13 strategies that you can adopt that help with emotional flashbacks

http://pete-walker.com/flashbackManagement.htm

at the bottom of the page. I hope this helps!

[–]yun-harla 1 point  

What kind of first aid were you doing that taught you how to treat barbed arrow wounds?

[–]Spiorog 1 point  

It does help. First Aid, I had not thought of it in those terms before.

Thank you.

[–]RichardGrannon[S] 3 points  

Ok my friends, thats 1 hour and 40, thankyou so much for joining in. I need to drink a protein shake, walk the dog, and prepare for the google hangout with Dana of NarcissistSupport I am doing at 8pm EST

If you can join in there too that would be great

https://plus.google.com/events/cs01k853h6rk20batjtlbclqdvg

thanks for inviting forum moderator, it was awesome, cheers!

[–]shw3nn 1 point  

Thank you so much for doing this!

[–]PJ_Svenska 1 point  

Thank you everyone! So much power and wisdom in here!

[–]shw3nn 2 points  

There were some questions asked in the announcement thread that I will repost here:

delilah-kyna asked:

Hellllllo, love your work!!! I'm really not sure if this will make sense or not. But Since learning about narcissists, I have become almost hypersensitive to narcissistic traits. And considering everyone has somewhat varying degrees of narcissistic traits, I was wondering, if you have any ideas on how I overcome completely shutting down when meeting someone when I see a typical "trait". What traits do you consider "normal" or "acceptable" and what traits are absolute "no-go" zones? 😊

/u/delilah-kyna

[–]RichardGrannon[S] 3 points  

What traits do you consider "normal" or "acceptable" and what traits are absolute "no-go" zones?

Great question and very tricky to answer. I would never get rid of someone for showing traits necessarily, but I would get rid of anyone who was showing signs of being fully "disordered".

Of the 9 traits mentioned in the DSM for signs of NPD my top 2 that I look out for very carefully are: Exploitative and Entitled.

good question that, thanks!

[–]Delilah-Kyna 1 point  

THANK YOU!!! Thanks so much can for posting this in here. Time got carried away and I totally missed it!!! You are a legend! Thanks also Richard, I'll go search up this now!! Big hugs to all of you!

[–]shw3nn 1 point  

You are very welcome :)

[–]Sun_will_rise_again 2 points  

I was sexually, physically abused from the age 14- 28 by my much old "ex"....He was 30 when I met him at 14.

It's been about two years now since he was arrested and I finally got a restraining order...I would like to try dating but I'm terrified. He was the only guy I was ever with.

I recently started hanging out with a really sweet guy who wants to have a relationship but I've been shying away...he seems nice but then again I can't trust anyone...I have a hard time even trusting my own judgement...i don't want to get trapped in a violent relationship again.

How should I handle this? I don't tell people about my past or PTSD... My family/friends don't know and I'd really like to keep it that way..but If i was to date someone, I feel like it would probably be only a matter of time before I have to explain why I am the way I am.

[–]RichardGrannon[S] 2 points  

"but If i was to date someone, I feel like it would probably be only a matter of time before I have to explain why I am the way I am."

Yes it would be. But only when you are ready and you are sure its the right person.

The key to handling CPTSD is to reduce the emotional flashbacks. That is the sine qua non (pretentious way of saying "key ingredient") for all resolution of CPTSD.

The problem for you and all of us with CPTSD in relationships is this:

relationships require love love requires intimacy intimacy requires vulnerability

And... nothing brings on a full blown hum dinger of a flashback like vulnerability!!

So you have this awkward "Push pull" catch 22 where you want to get closer to the other person but everytime you do all the alarms start going off and you feel compelled to pull away. The closer you get, the louder the alarms.

This will drive you and your partner mad. It is known (and there is research that backs this) that ptsd/cptsd people actually can emotionally dysregulate perfectly healthy people with our own emotional rollercoasters. Its what the hippies would call a "contact high" or as the NLP people say: "your state transmits".

In effect, he also would learn to be "triggered" by intimacy, even if he had no trauma of his own.

So, what to do?

  1. study and control and reduce the emotional flashbacks

  2. find a good therapist and do some compassionate dialogue around the issues you mentioned

  3. find a good partner who is cool enough that they can understand you have issues around intimacy and be compassionate to what the triggers and the cause is

  4. all work together to make it work

For people with C/PTSD time and again it has been shown it helps enormously when the partner of the client with CPTSD is actively involved in the therapeutic process.

We work better together. Isnt that a nice idea?

All the best to you.

[–]JimJames1984 2 points  

How did you transition from a career in being a bouncer to being an expert on CPTSD, without formal education.

Do people take your advice with a grain a salt because you don't have the certification ?

Or does it not matter, as long as you are helpful to them.

I'm looking to change careers but afraid of being an imposter .

[–]RichardGrannon[S] 5 points  

Hi JimJames

Great question.

"How did you transition from a career in being a bouncer to being an expert on CPTSD, without formal education."

The short answer is, I didnt. I do have formal qualifications in psychology and quite a few years of experience. I will follow up with a video about my background on my youtube channel. If my first post on this AMA is me tootin my horn about my qualifications and experience Im going to seem a bit of todger ;)

"Do people take your advice with a grain a salt because you don't have the certification ?"

Im not sure who is aware of my certs and who isnt, some are on my website spartanlifecoach.com if people want to check them out. Nobody ever tells me they arent taking me seriously, perhaps they are just being polite!!

"Or does it not matter, as long as you are helpful to them."

To me it matters. Narcissistic abuse and CPTSD are such sensitive subjects I think you have to be pretty well studied to tackle them because if you mishandle or misinform people the results could be disastrous.

A psychology related education to bachelors degree standard would be the minimum for me.

"I'm looking to change careers but afraid of being an imposter ."

It depends what you want to do, if you are looking to coach, then please dont. If you want to make youtube videos that share information and offer support coming from a place of compassion then please do.

If you are doing it for money, with no qualification that might be a recipe for disaster.

If you are afraid of being an imposter then just stay absolutely brutally honest: never claim overtly or imply that you are something you arent.

Never focus on the money, focus on helping as many people as you can the very best you can.

ps You mentioned I was an expert on CPTSD. Im not an expert on CPTSD or Narcissistic Abuse, Im very new to this field relatively speaking. Im not sure what makes an expert, but I dont feel I am one.

Great question, thankyou.

[–]PJ_Svenska 2 points  

"polite"? we are people-pleasers ;) :P~

[–]dharbott 3 points  

Well, I'm an IT consultant (er, was...) with no knowledge of CPTSD, Narcs, codependency etc - until it hit me right between the eyes 12 months ago... I now feel I'M more qualified than many counsellors, simply because I have been through it... Don't worry, I'm not planning on being a councellor (apart from my own). So, IMHO qualifications can be BS anyway...

[–]_Moby_Dick -1 points  

FYI he is formally trained. He is a psychologist and master practitioner of NLP.

[–]ariagrayx 5 points  

He is a type of therapist, but he is not a psychologist. You do not become a psychologist by getting a bachelors degree in Psychology. I know, because I have one.

Not to discredit Richard, because as I said, he is a therapist. Just wanted to clarify that he is not a psychologist.

[–]_Moby_Dick 1 point  

Hmm...Well, I don't know him so I cannot in fact speak for his qualifications. I've just watched so many of his YouTube videos in which he refers to himself as a 'psychologist' so I hope he's using the term correctly according to the regulations in his part of the world.

I know that qualifications for the title of psychologist differ from country to country and in the U.S. becoming a psychologist requires a master's degree AND licensing (one of my parents did it). A bachelors in psych definitely does not make you a therapist either though...It does not make you anything except a person with a bachelor's degree. You still need a masters + the correct licensing to become a therapist, at least in America.

Maybe we are getting lost in translation. I hope that is the case because adopting these terms loosely would be a sham.

[–]Amy516 1 point  

I realize that I am a people pleaser who is always looking for approval from others. How do I stop this madness? The behavior is so ingrained that I don't even realize it when I am doing it.

[–]RichardGrannon[S] 6 points  

Overcoming people pleaser syndrome/co dependency is notoriously tough. And you have hit on the core of the toughness: 90% of the time we dont even know we are doing it until afterwards!

People pleasing or "fawning" as a trauma-response and behaviour pattern is rooted in a whole cluster of negative beliefs about yourself and about reality, especially as it pertains to intimacy or "high value" subjects.

If you can reduce your emotional flashbacks, identify the limiting beliefs and slowly, slowly change them you will find yourself unconsciously stopping yourself on the verge of fawning instead of diving into the pool of self neglect and coming out soggy with invisible goo.

You have identified the hardest step, the first step: becoming consciously aware that it is happening in the first place. So you are already making progress, keep going!

[–]Amy516 1 point  

Thank you for the response! It's only through watching your videos that I even realized what I was doing--and how long I have been doing it.

[–]avinasser 0 points  

Big fan from SFS days. I like your SLC channel but why, oh why, do you have to focus so much on narcissism? I understand that it's something you attract in partners and all, but you have a lot of great things to say about all kinds of life psychology stuff (map is not the territory, don't run from pain, etc) and your focus on just narcissism probably excludes at least half your dedicated viewership.

[–]RichardGrannon[S] 2 points  

Yes you are right. I will redirect this ship and plot a fresh course for the rest of the year. Less Narco stuff and more of the things from the StreetFightSecrets combat psychology/philosophy times. Much healthier. Thanks.

[–]PJ_Svenska 1 point  

Richard hi! Thank you for all your work!!!

I wonder if you know of some source of information on somatic problems while processing/healing from CPTDS. I only recently got correct diagnosis and treatment and past 6 months my therapy really started happening alongside very intensive group therapy in PTSD-mindfluness. (Sorry for horrible English, I am Swedish)

Past six months unfortunately I developed extreme hypersensitivity to light, movement and esp sound and a range of wierdo somatic problems such as unitchable itching creepy feeling under my skin and pains im legs and feet. A friend suggested looking at fibromyalgia and unfortunately I can tick most boxes on that criteria checklist :( So it seems digging around in the smellier parts of my psyche causes my whole system to collaps so badly it's sometimes impossible to even get out to see therapists. I really really hate this but I know I am on the right track, therapy and own work is going great but know I'm just getting started on a long journey. What to do? Slow down? Force it? Body is making itself unignorable: is it a protest? Or some sort of body memory? Is this common? Normal? Will it pass? I turn to my CPTSD guru to say "there, there" :)

[–]RichardGrannon[S] 1 point  

Hej San!

This is outside of my field of understanding and the danger here is if you do have a physical illness and we write it off as part of a flashback then this would be... well, disastrous.

Please see a doctor asap.

"I turn to my CPTSD guru to say "there, there" :)"

Gosh, I wish I could. Maybe, having told you to seek medical care I can move to: lets assume it is psychosomatic, which I cannot know.

But if it were...

Definitely slow down, definitely dont force it. You asked if it is a protest?

Well reaching into my distant past to my Louise L Hay days Im pretty sure she would recommend listening to the sensation and finding out what it is "saying".

You said protest, so yes perhaps it is a protest.

Reaching to the Connirae Andreas section of my brain I would ask "what do you think this part of you might be protesting about? if it could speak what would it say? What does it need you to know?"

Im sorry to be so fluffy, I hope this helps a bit.

Final thought: never ignore feelings emotional or physical, this is classic for CPTSD sufferers to do and it is a great example of self neglect.

Tack så mycket for the question.

ps final final thought, if its psychosomatic, then creepy skin feeling would be an unwelcome invasion and infraction of boundaries and pain and legs and feet would be an unwillingness to move forward in life. If its psychosomatic.

Enough caveats? Ok. I wish you all the best in your full recovery to health.

[–]PJ_Svenska 1 point  

Hejsan :) Thank you so much, yes, forgot to say, have seen doctors, they find absolutely nothing. One of therapists, mindfulness/yoga/pshchologist says she's seen this a few times but (sorry long story) the mindfulness project has been cancelled but they keep following it through pro bono and that excludes q's and a's with them and I have nowhere to turn. So yes I think its psychosomatic. Was hoping you would have heard of similar experiences. Well yes and no :) Thx again, will follow your leads and think best remedy is to find and cultivate that self-empathy everybody waffles about ;)

[–]RichardGrannon[S] 2 points  

Self compassion is the fuel that runs the self healing engine ;)

None of that and the engine will simply not run.

[–]PJ_Svenska 3 points  

Midlife and only just beginning to understand self-compassion. Or rather, to allow it. I've avoided such a long time to look at myself in the mirror but today I met my eyes and saw a glimpse of another person - someone more serious and grown up. A bit old and tired but genuine. Wierd, but trying to get used to it, will try to hold on to her, just a few seconds at least, now and then. But she scares me, I mean I get afraid at really looking at myself, even more so looking at the world, acknowledging the grittyness. Guess thats maturing. Slowly becoming 3D, layers of self!

[–]yun-harla 1 point  

I get physical symptoms from my anxiety and CPTSD too, not as bad or as complex as yours. But I can tell you, from a non-medical, non-professional standpoint, that forcing your way through this stuff doesn't help. You really do have to be self-compassionate. Self-compassion is a muscle, it gets stronger the more you use it.

In my experience, what's happening (whether or not my condition is psychosomatic or, like some of my physical disabilities, exacerbated by stress) is this: your body needs to be kind to itself. Yes, you can push yourself through your symptoms in an emergency, but only in the short run. In the long run, your body is telling you to slow down and stop harming yourself. If your symptoms are psychosomatic, it's because you're not listening to the compassionate, self-preserving part of your mind, so your mind has to turn to your body to get the "hey, slow down, stop forcing it" message through to you.

It's like going for a run when you haven't been drinking enough water or eating enough food: your blood pressure is too low, your blood sugar is too low, and your brain isn't getting enough oxygen -- so no matter how much you tell yourself "mind over matter, I should keep going!" at some point your body will rebel against you. You will pass out. This is your body's way of returning blood flow to your head and conserving your precious, limited resources.

No matter what is happening, stress is probably making it worse. That includes psychological stress. Stress exacerbates so many things in so many ways -- from releasing cortisol (a hormone that can fuck you up long-term, although it can get you through short emergencies better) to impairing your sleep to biological mechanisms we don't even know about yet. Don't underestimate stress.

Also, just because something is psychosomatic doesn't mean it's not a real illness or disability. The brain is an organ too.

Jon Kabat-Zinn has some good books on mindfulness meditation, and there's another book I like called "The Mindful Path to Self-Compassion." Not sure if you can get them affordably in Sweden, but I'm sure there's at least something similar!

[–]PJ_Svenska 1 point  

Thank you so much for your kind and caring reply.

Maybe I am using the word psychosomatic wrong - what I mean by it is that the physical illness is very real in its manifestation at least but that I suspect it stems in locked-up trauma reactions ( I hope I am making sense). All these physical things that are so much crippling me only began with my really starting to listen inward, to feel the feels, through therapy.

So it's so disappointing having to slow down my progress because I can't bloody handle it :( Like chemo therapy - getting sick from the cure. But yes. I guess slowing down. But I don't want to! Everything in life is slowed down to minimum, the only thing I do is therapy and now my body says I can't even handle that? I do want to force through a bit. I am still not sure wheather to hide this from myself anymore, I am sick and tired of it :/ Anyway, will definately check out Kabat-Zinn, also ordered Complex PTSD: From Surviving to Thriving by Pete Walker :)

It sounds like you've come a long way in your recovery :) I wish you all the best!

[–]jeulie 1 point  

ps final final thought, if its psychosomatic, then creepy skin feeling would be an unwelcome invasion and infraction of boundaries and pain and legs and feet would be an unwillingness to move forward in life. If its psychosomatic.

Re: Yay I have been extremely traumatised for soo long and I have anaphylaxis !!! So it's this toxicity stuff - I need to self sooth to get through CPTSD and grounding techniques work for me!!

[–]PJ_Svenska 1 point  

Thank you for commenting, we're not alone in this, I see. Sending warm hug (we do that in Sweden, I know it seems a bit much) :) Had to google anaphylaxis, seems no picnic.

[–]shw3nn 1 point  

vabinexicuba asked:

Hi Mr Grannon. In one of your recent videos, you mentioned that fixing personal boundaries takes around five to six months.

My question is: how? Using which approach? Meditation, or some specialized therapy?

/u/vabinexicuba

[–]RichardGrannon[S] 2 points  

I do cover it a bit in the self assertiveness course, but maybe it needs its own course to properly explain how I think this is best attempted.

[–]RichardGrannon[S] 3 points  

I will definitely cover this in a course, thanks Moby and Shw3nn!

[–]irbluebutterfly 2 points  

If you're interested, this exercise helped me a lot.

Practice: Complete the following statements:

People may not...

I have a right to ask for...

To protect my time and energy, it's okay to...

Then, finish each sentence with at least 12 examples (or more)

Article link: http://www.mommd.com/settingboundaries.shtml

[–]_Moby_Dick 1 point  

I second this question, Richard. Ever since you mentioned it your recent Google hangout, I have been wishing for more info.

[–]shw3nn 1 point  

AuntMidnight asked:

How does an adult child with CPTSD cope with a bullying covert NPD father? Is "cutting off" the only solution? Also, how do I educate my next therapist about CPTSD? It's AMAZING to me that most don't know about PTSD caused from childhood trauma - seems so obvious. :)

/u/AuntMidnight

[–]RichardGrannon[S] 2 points  

Is "cutting off" the only solution?

It isnt but it might be the most expedient one. Managing a relationship with a true Cluster B is an exhausting test of skill, patience and black belt levels of self control.

"Also, how do I educate my next therapist about CPTSD?" Im only half joking: sell them on the idea that if they bother their arse to read Pete Walkers book they will get a lot more customers and be much more effective in their work.

If they refuse to acknowledge what is so patently obvious then switch therapists. I honestly am flabbergasted that in 2016 anyone with half a brain would deny its existence or effect.

Thankyou AuntMidnight :)

[–]AuntMidnight 3 points  

Thank you Richard, for your humor, time and the validation you give all of us recovering from mental/emotional abuse.

[–]Vegan_wordsmith 1 point  

Hello Richard, My name is Dan. Firstly I love your videos so thank you for taking the time to out them out there. Your straight talking approach and influences of eastern philosophy mirror my own beliefs and presuppositions.

I am a single dad, working a job I have very little interest in and balancing the two has burned me out many times.

I have recently qualified as an NLP practitioner. I took the course as both a self development investment and to be the first step in starting my own therapy / coaching business. I have found it very useful in managing the social anxiety issues that have plagued me since my teens and I have also found it useful for helping my son and others overcome difficulties. However it has left me with a lot of questions and feeling I need a mentor or some way of getting experience.

What would you recommend should be my next steps in furthering my knowledge and experience so I can be the best I can be?

Would you consider assisting in any training or coaching for a determined, curious genuine guy who needs a little guidance so he can help others?

[–]RichardGrannon[S] 2 points  

What would you recommend should be my next steps in furthering my knowledge and experience so I can be the best I can be?

It would be to go niche. What fascinates you? What inspires you the most? What would you love to help people with?

Do that.

"Would you consider assisting in any training or coaching for a determined, curious genuine guy who needs a little guidance so he can help others?"

I would but Im afraid at this moment I just dont have the time and the mental energy to do a really amazingly good job.

My advice would be, do NOT do what everyone else in the NLP community is doing, most of the people who qualify never work. Not a one of them! Do your own thing. And be real. Have a little swagger and a little funk to you. Dont be a white washed corporate cardboard cut out offering "coaching".

Choose your most passionate niche and get in there.

Last bit of advice: never be afraid to work for free.

Builds up the good karma. Cant buy good karma

All the best mate!

[–]LolatheDestroyer 1 point  

I've broken with my Narc about two weeks ago, and have been doing your hypno therapy sessions for 7 days now. It's great for the overal situation, but do you have any tips what I can do to calm myself down (immediately) when I get a message from him and my adrenaline peaks to high levels and tempted to message him back? I can't seem to control my impulses and tendency for righteousness

[–]RichardGrannon[S] 2 points  

Yes you want to smite him with righteous indignation, tell him what a flipping tool he is and send him long wordy messages explaining the reality of what he is done.

I think in the "how to take revenge on a narcissist" book the first thing we advised people is do the opposite of what your instinct is telling you.

Everyone gets that same feeling you are getting, do not fall prey to the temptation.

My recommendation would be to study some "state management" techniques and to learn how to control emotional flashbacks. At this point you will have some of the symptoms of "narcissistic abuse victim syndrome" a term coined by Sam Vaknin for the cluster of symptoms that manifest post abuse. You are probably going through a series of flashbacks right now, it would be good if you could learn how to manage them. Ive given advice on how to do that elsewhere in this AMA.

Also your HPA axis is dysregulated right now which means your adrenal gland will be over-firing in response to external stimuli. Be aware of that. As the adrenaline flows through you be aware of how it feels, hear the thud in your ears, feel your shaky hands and then observe, but dont react to, the torrent of thoughts that surge up powered with strong feeling demanding that you "do something".

Adrenaline is an endogenous drug that makes you want to take action. Do not obey its call.

There were different techniques I used to use and teach when doing security work for handling adrenaline spikes, remind me via email Lola and I will do a youtube video on them.

A slow release of adrenaline is not as upsetting as a spike, if you can SLOOOW it down in your own head, imagine its a valve, tell it to slow release, see it sloooooow releasing, see yourself riding the wave of the adrenaline, this might help a bit. Remember:Non Serviam.

[–]LolatheDestroyer 1 point  

Awesome, thank you so much :) I'll remind you and look forward to that video!

[–]comeahnshelly 1 point  

Hello Richard!

I've followed your videos for about the last 3 years. I have also been in therapy for the last year and a half. I wanted to say thank you for all your passion and understanding. During the beginning of recovery I felt like I really "fed off" the validation your videos gave me. I realized after a while that although it felt really good to just sit there and feel good about myself that eventually I had to pull myself away and be an active participant in my recovery. However I feel if anyone were to tell me to do so, I would be reluctant or maybe even hurt.

My question is if you have ever come across someone who just doesn't seem to want to "get better" from dwelling in their abuse and history of abuse. What did you do to encourage them to move forward without triggering them further into their victim-hood (for a lack of a better word)?

[–]RichardGrannon[S] 2 points  

What did you do to encourage them to move forward without triggering them further into their victim-hood (for a lack of a better word)?

Ive seen it and Ive lived it myself. I say nothing because I know if I do I will break rapport and when they are ready, in their own time, they wont listen to me.

What I would sometimes do, maybe, if Im looking for a more sneaky approach is start talking about getting out of the comfort zone and "Not running from pain" - these all contain subliminal messages for the viewers stuck in their comfy victimhood.

Bearing in mind that for some people out there (to be clear: certainly not you) with certain personality disorders that this will change nothing, feeling persecuted is just part of their psychological makeup and they like it just fine that way.

[–]figuration 1 point  

Hopefully this is worthwhile/relevant enough since it's sibling, not a parent, I believe my sister has NPD (officially we've heard about BPD but there was something else she wouldn't tell us that we suspect is NPD.. many signs). My parents aren't in the best health, especially my mom. I'm worried about what she may do if/when my mom passes away. I've dealt with the situation thus far by 100% avoiding her because I tend to be a people pleaser, even though I don't like her at all (I have my own anxiety issues). I'm not sure how I would interact with such a person when it comes down to it, because I'd be surprised if we didn't hear from her in such a situation, especially to try to get stuff. What techniques/readings might be useful us? Or maybe my mom, because she keeps reaching out to my sister and being hurt (but less now that she's seeing that nothing will change).

[–]RichardGrannon[S] 2 points  

Teaching people how to deal with the personality disordered requires more time and care than I quickly answer in this format Im afraid.

Dealing with a Cluster B is notoriously hard work and requires a very high level understanding of the subject if you arent going to get burned as it were.

"What techniques/readings might be useful us? "

Remember that any and all interaction with a true Cluster B is an opportunity to abuse and exploit, nothing more. To that extent the person will of course pretend to be something they are not and pretend to be experiencing they are not in order to...

... Garner a certain reaction.

The whole game is about provoking a certain emotion and a specific reaction in you.

Remember that, its not much, but its a starting point.

Thankyou.

[–]KaliEarth 1 point  

Hello Richard:)

Your videos and courses have helped me a lot over the past year – Thanks a million!

My question is; in your opinion, have I just been dating a (covert) narcissist and if so, how do I overcome the urge to go back?

Just a short'ish despcription: I met a guy about two months ago, physical and mental attraction was immediate and super intense. We behaved like a couple instantly, cooking meals, holding hands in public, sleeping together many nights of the week – Very unusual for me. I knew all along that we were probably incompatible, he's 10 years younger, timing was off completely – However I was so drawn to him and knew that I needed something from him. Attention, physical closeness, someone to be with, to feel connected. He was full on from the get go, intense conversation, very open about his past relationships, previous hurts, couldn't remember his childhood, talked about his difficulty connecting to his feelings and emotions, he said he needed someone to teach him how to feel (!). He said to me on several occations "what happens if you get tired of me?". Overtly "vulnerable" I thought. I was so perplexed about his openness, but felt an intense need to have these deep conversations as well, but still on many occations thought ”is he bullshitting me?”. I wasn't sure I could trust him at all.

I felt confused but happy to be with someone open to sharing with me.

However, I sensed that he was somewhat disinterested in me sometimes. His attention came and went. At a point two-three weeks in we had a talk about our ”status” and he said that he felt like I was a friend. I immediately got angry and very upset and felt tricked and manipulated by him. We were behaving just like a couple and on his initiative mostly. I liked it and needed it, though. It caused a shift in our dynamics when he told me that he didn't have ”romantic” feelings for me. I felt confused, angry, lost. At some point I knew I couldn't continue because I developed very strong feelings for him, but couldn't see a future with him, as we were completely different places in life. So my head made the desicion, not my heart.

However, I couldn't seem to act on it at all. Everytime I saw him I wanted a little bit more, like a drug I couldn't quit. When I was not with him I couldn't breathe, sleep or concentrate on anything. I knew I had to end it, and talked to him about it (which was probably unfair of me, but I thought I could somehow fix it so that we could make it work as by magic). After that he got really nasty and started being mean to me, critisising personal things about me. Again I thought ”is this happening?”. I was in intense emotional turmoil all the time. When we were together I felt safe in an unsafe way, always trying to make him smile and be present which made me happy for a moment. The sex was amazing, mindblowing, addictive.

When I finally said to him that I wanted to stop dating, I cried and cried like somebody died. He said he was sad as well, but when I texted him a week later he said that he hadn't really thought much about it since. Which is probably the most upsetting thing to deal with. It was so intense, we became so close, and then he ”didn't really think about it much since then”. I feel like I carried all the emotions in the ”relationship” and he always claimed that he didn't really have many emotions at all.

Confusion, anger and sadness is what I'm left with – and an overwhelming longing to contact him. I miss him so much my heart burns. I know that it's no good but I'm obsessed with the thought of him, feeling him, kissing him, being with him. I feel left behind. Lonely. Lost.
I feel sick that I can't see clearly in this. On top of everything I blame myself for getting into a mess like this because I knew from the start it would be trouble and heartache. I was the one who ended it as well, so maybe I'm the bad person? I'm confused.

Question is, what's your take on my story? Narcissist alert or not? I know that I'm as much a party in this as he is. How can I fight the urge I have to call him, see him? How can I deal with the feelings of being left behind? I left him, why am I feeling left behind?

Thanks for your time and for doing this AMA:)

[–]allenizabeth 1 point  

oh my god, are you me. I went through this exact same thing. it sucks. a lot.

[–]KaliEarth 1 point  

Oh cool, in a sad way I guess;) Well Richard didn't voice his opinion on this - so what's your take? Did "we" encounter a narcissist or not? How do you feel about your experience now?

[–]HastingsBattleOf 1 point  

Hi Richard, what sort of resources are out there to help me deal with flashbacks?

[–]RichardGrannon[S] 3 points  

Now see here Battle of Hastings with your love of the great English longbow dont you be "firing" questions at me that make me "target" you for some righteous selling of my products.

Sorry I really havent had enough sleep recently.

Ahem...

http://www.amazon.com/Richard-Grannon/e/B01DKKG4L0

and also

http://spartanlifecoach.com/first-aid-kit-course/

And for what its worth I really was told that Archery soothes the soul by a Sufi mystic. But I dont think I can dispense that as actual advice.

All the best!

[–]HastingsBattleOf 2 points  

In the words of Pat Benatar, 'hit' me with your best shot. Also, thank you for all you do.

[–]KlutchAtStraws 1 point  

I was in a toxic relationship for 5 years. I've been out of it for nearly 4 but I still get periods where I'll remember an argument (ie when I was taking an earful and not doing much to defend myself) and I'll get really angry and think of things I wish I said to the point where I'm almost shaking with anger. It was a narcissist and empath dynamic. How do I shake this off and get past it? I don't want that experience continuing to have any kind of hold over me.

[–]RichardGrannon[S] 1 point  

How do I shake this off and get past it? I don't want that experience continuing to have any kind of hold over me.

I dont know for sure, but I would suggest that maybe your unconscious mind is not yet fully satisfied that were you put in the same situation again you wouldnt fail to defend yourself again.

Your unconscious is helpfully sending you annoying nudges to do something about it so it can relax and feel "safe" again.

Please watch this short clip https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GXYVxYRAR5c

[–]KlutchAtStraws 1 point  

Thanks very much. I've followed your stuff for a while and it's cool to see you here.

[–]Amy-P 1 point  

My ex is a covert narcissist which I found out a few months ago. I recently embarrassed and exposed his abuse in social media as a way to fight back and also bring the abuse from the darkness to the light...My question is...My anger and rage about it all make me feel like I want to decimate him and ruin his life forever. I know it will pass but...Isn't that narcissistic? Is that a narcissist trait coming out in me? It is not permanent or pervasive, just isolated. Still I wondered. I have been diagnosed on the BPD spectrum but was described to me as very mild on the spectrum.

[–]RichardGrannon[S] 1 point  

Has he decimated you and ruined your life forever?

[–]Amy-P 1 point  

No. But just given me maybe a few years to get through to where I'm fine. So...still don't know the answer. I'm showing narcissism with such an intense reaction?

[–]RichardGrannon[S] 1 point  

Im sorry if I dont answer these in order, Im new to this :)

[–]lessonlearned2015 1 point  

Hey Richard! Your videos and course has helped me so much. Here's the one point where I'm stuck, though: I'm in a new relationship and am having SUCH a hard time trusting him. Logically, I think he's a trustworthy person, but I'm just terrified to let go. I feel like my entire life will be swept out from underneath me, just like it was in my marriage to a "severe case of NPD and antisocial personality disorder" (my ex-husband's diagnosis from two separate therapists). Will I ever trust again? How can I relax and stop this constant anxiety that any amount of happiness is just going to be ripped away again?

[–]RichardGrannon[S] 2 points  

Sure thing, check out my answer to "sunwillriseagain" above, here is a bit of it that pertains to the feeling that everything will go wrong and why you feel that way, full answer on the other reply, please read it :) thankyou

"The key to handling CPTSD is to reduce the emotional flashbacks. That is the sine qua non (pretentious way of saying "key ingredient") for all resolution of CPTSD. The problem for you and all of us with CPTSD in relationships is this: relationships require love love requires intimacy intimacy requires vulnerability And... nothing brings on a full blown hum dinger of a flashback like vulnerability!! So you have this awkward "Push pull" catch 22 where you want to get closer to the other person but everytime you do all the alarms start going off and you feel compelled to pull away. The closer you get, the louder the alarms."

[–]mkmkmk2828 1 point  

Hi Richard, Your videos have helped me tremendously to figure out the chaos in my life but now that I have little or no contact with my family because I was scapegoat, which is impossible to relinquish at this point. I have noone to lean on in times of trouble and noone to share with. It's going to be really hard work to to find people who are conscious in this world and that I can begin to trust. Any suggestions of where to start?

[–]Marielle-69 1 point  

After having a history with a narcissistic mom, sisters, best friend, father of my child and cutting them all out of my life I like to know how do I get to a point of trusting people and let them get close to me again, it's pretty lonely this way.

[–]PJ_Svenska 1 point  

Warhound88 I dont want to intrude by replying directly on your question but you inspired me, I hope it's ok I adress you and Richard.

I grew up w NPD mother and schizoid personality disorder (SPD) dad. My greatest guilt in all this is not actually the bad stuff they did to me but the good stuff I turned my back on/denied myself. I was of course super afraid of pretty much anything to do with other people but also I refused (or tried to) letting my parents see me happy or enjoying life, maybe out of spite but definately in order to be consistant, it was kind of the only thing that kept my identity together.

I couldn't stand my mother leeching on even my happy moments, i have early memories of this and remember the creepy crawly disgust i felt, her eyes on me spoiled whatever I had. But all along the worst pain for me was constantly denying myself access to anything at all that was bright, happy, natural, spontaneous. Like I was a starving child offered a smorgosboard but not wanting to eat knowing or suspecting it was all poisoned. I just sat in my room alone pretty much every day in nothingness or intense anxiety attacks. I still to this day grieve more for all that I denied myself, I beat myself up about that constantly, feeling it was a choice I had - but was it??

Is it even possible in any narc relationship to separate the good from the bad, is it all just fool's gold?

[–]lavidabrooklyn 1 point  

Hi Richard is this still on? Just signed up to red dit @4pm EST. Hope I haven't missed it!

[–]RichardGrannon[S] 3 points  

Its on like donkey kong

[–]lavidabrooklyn 1 point  

Hey cool. I posted a question also..

[–]irbluebutterfly 1 point  

What are your thoughts on inverted narcissism? I'm starting to think it's synonymous with a CPTSD codependent.

[–]RichardGrannon[S] 1 point  

No. But I hear you.

Did you know Sam Vaknin created the term? I had to have him explain it to me in simple talk before I could grasp it and he did say his explanation was a bit convoluted .

The inverted narcissist is simply put a narcissist, of the vulnerable or covert variety, who is obsessed with the idea of being persecuted by overt narcissists.

I also thought it meant co-dependent in some sense.

And certainly if a CPTSD codependent of the fight/fawn trauma response developed grandiose fantasies of which they were ashamed, hid behind a shell personality and became obsessed with the power of their own victimhood then they could be said to vector into an inverted narcissist.

But not synonymous. You could also be a CPTSD codependent with zero narcissistic traits.

[–]irbluebutterfly 1 point  

I see what you're saying. An inverted narcissist would get its supply from the maltreatment of another narcissist. A "normal" narcissist revels in their power. An inverted narcissist revels in their victimhood. Am I understanding that correctly? (If you ever get back here to see this :)

No, I didn't know that was Vaknin's doing. Cool.

[–]Macgyv 1 point  

Hello Richard, I was wondering if you could recommend some books on the subjects of cptsd and cluster b personalities.

[–]LaraRosa 1 point  

Hi Richard, love your videos, have found them super helpful in identifying my issues and in working towards resolving them. You mentioned in your recent google hangout about affirmations about using them to develop a sense of yourself as an adult, as opposed to feeling more childlike, I think you actually used the term 'man-child'. I can very much relate to this, having a sense of myself at times as an adult, but struggling to sustain this as a general state of being, and in particular in work contexts and around authority figures or people who are stronger/louder than me. Could you offer any advice on techniques to address this, for instance affirmations of anything else you might suggest. If affirmations, what sort and how to use them? Many thanks!

[–]Lavenderbowie 1 point  

Richard, you're amazing. I want to know what you think. My ex narc lives in another city which I visit frequently. I'm never at ease when I'm there and am constantly looking out for him and avoiding places he may be. I freak out at the idea of seeing him. I can't even look at him on FB as I literally feel my stomach doing flips and my heart starts racing. What can I do to calm the hell down about bumping into to him? Why can I not even look at him? I think it's fairly melodramatic.

[–]lavidabrooklyn 1 point  

Heres my question....Ok I'll throw a question out anyway :-). I'm dealing with death of narc dad, loss of job (had to resign to help care for him on other coast of U.S.), and immediate upcoming loss of my home of 30 years (due to family financial needs/will arrangements/etc). I know that normally a time of grief & trauma are not good times to make major life decisions - such as moves to another state, change of jobs, change of home - but I do not have much choice, it seems. Any suggestions for how to stay grounded during all of this, which includes an ongoing (about a year so far) personal research/learning curve/healing process re dark triad people on my life? I have emailed you recently under another name but perhaps you will recognize the story :-)

[–]ThrowawayTom1234 1 point  

Do Narcissists feel self-loathing? Would a narcissist get a glimpse of himself in a reflective surface and hate himself and feel awful?

How cynical should someone in their mid-20s be?

[–]RichardGrannon[S] 1 point  

ah ha! the ones with the most upvotes go to the top, got it!

[–]PJ_Svenska 1 point  

above comments field theres a "sort by" dropdown thingy

[–]X3nah13 1 point  

what are your thoughts on clients being honest and addressing suicidal thoughts or feelings in a treatment session? I'm afraid to discuss this because in the past the treatment solution was to add medication that only amplified my suicidal thoughts and ideation.

[–]Cranksta 1 point  

Hi there!

I have BPD caused by lifelong child abuse by my NPD mother. I've just started EMDR, and I have hopes, but what is the real prognosis for someone like me? Am I doomed to become my abuser?

Edit: I ask because I've seen similarities between CPTSD and BPD and I wonder if you see the same link?

[–]yun-harla 2 points  

If you're treating your BPD, and really committing to working on it long-term (even though it's scary and threatening and exhausting sometimes), you're not doomed. BPD is a pattern of thoughts and feelings, not of actions. You choose how you treat others (and yourself), and over time, you can learn to regulate your thoughts and feelings better too.

I'm not an expert, but I do a lot of reading on BPD (my mom has it and refuses treatment). It's manageable. And people who have it and work to manage it? They are my heroes. If you already know you have it and you're working on it -- and if EMDR doesn't work, try DBT -- you're awesome and I have a lot of hope for you.

[–]Cranksta 2 points  

My therapist want's to help start me on DBT too, but I literally just met her yesterday after not having one for two months. We haven't started anything yet.

I don't know if I'll actually survive treatment, but I'm trying. Thank you for talking to me.

[–]yun-harla 2 points  

You survived your childhood. You can survive this.

[–]Cranksta 2 points  

Haha, I didn't really have a choice. Thank you though.

[–]shannonrubin 1 point  

Richard, HI- two questions. Since leaving my 33 year marriage with, (what I have come to understand in only the last year is a raging, yet tricky covert narcissist), I have been scouring the literature and the available resources such as yours.

1) I haven't seen a narcissist/dependency relationship described that lasted more than 16 years- (difficult one for me to swallow having done this for 33). Am I that much of an outlier?

2) As I started unraveling this puzzle and getting stronger, he went on a major discard/smear campaign against me, which is why I left. Since, my 29 year old daughter has discarded me now as well and it is she, not him, that has gone full "no contact" with me. She tells me that I have broken her with my C-PTSD behaviors and that until I fix it- (and despite my detailed tries of apology and accountability she says I'm not giving her what she requires)- she wants nothing to do with me. Her words, tone and behavior are creepily similar, sometimes verbatim, to his. Is this part of the deal with this. It is heartbreaking to me- while she has always been his "favorite", she did not previously behave this way. I am beginning to see that it may be as futile as it was with him- maybe I've lost her forever. (My 32 year old daughter's reaction is very different- says since I left she feels she's "got me back again".)

Would love your input on this- I'm still very raw in the recovery process.

[–]GatmanBegins 1 point  

Hi Richie thanks for the AMA, me and my currently ex- girlfriend (because of all the narc bs) love your videos.

I was raised by narcissistic household, all my friends are narcs and i am co-dependant and suffer from CPTSD, anxiety and depression and I'm a narc.

I don't want to be that person but I get defensive at the first sign of conflict, I act childish and passive aggressive.

I am trying to change. Any words of wisdom?

[–]X3nah13 1 point  

In the past i have let mental health professionals run the session allowing them to make assumptions and place blame and responsibility on me because i cannot simply do 'whatever' to 'fix' the problem. Is it out of place for the client to take charge of the session/ educate the 'therapist' about their condition/ ask the therapist to read up on my condition and make suggestions about methods of treatment?

[–]cultivatingjoy 1 point  

My question is regarding CPTSD 1) Does this sometimes manifest as ADHD or some form of it? I've healed so many wounds and opened so many beautiful parts of my life, because of your training... But this one is still a huge struggle. I'm scatter brained and forget things that are important to me. I then fall into a shame spiral and feel so broken and helpless. I feel like I'm self sabotaging. I'm very hard on my self. Your self affirmations bit is very helpful.
I want to be authentic and real about who I am. However, who I have been, is not really who I am. Its hard to know the difference sometimes. 2) Is it typical to be a bit intense and recluse when healing from people pleaser and recognizing flash backs? 3) How do we know when to lean into discomfort to promote growth?

[–]lanaluv 1 point  

Hi, love watching your video's 😁 not a question but a bit about myself.. I lived with a man with Narcissistic Personality Disorder for 9 years( didn't know then he had it) he drove me mad, constantly feeling the need to put me down, control everything about my life etc until I got to the points where I was going to kill myself as I thought I was worthless. He eventually left me thank the Lord and I was a shadow of my former self. But unbelievably I'm with a man now with BPD for the last for years and he has brought out a better version of myself in my eyes. He is cluster C, had a traumatic childhood and I've studied BPD ass much as I can and he definitely has no emotional skin. And I do now think I understand him well. Even though he has BPD and has displayed classic BPD behaviors before we got together, he had helped me recover from the mess I was and even though he doesn't understand or feel a lot of my emotions, I know without a doubt that he loves me as I do him ( truely madly deeply ) he says he fell in love with me as a boy ( we were 10 when we met, 46 now) and he still feels that feeling every time he looks at me. And I feel the same about him, we we're childhood sweetheart s that never had the courage even in our teenage years to tell each other how we felt about each other. Now at long last we are together and it isn't always perfect but it is for us. I've never been treated so well in my life, he appreciates every little thing I do as I do him and I've never loved a man so deeply in my life. He thinks he's unlovable but I see how beautiful he is on the inside, I do get glimpses of that boy I fell in love with when we were both innocents. I cannot express how much love I have for him and feel blessed when I look at him. I don't expect anything from him nor him from me and it's perfect! Just thought I'd share, hope you don't mind. He's watched all of your videos too and thinks you're spot on all the time

[–]emotnallydsregulated 1 point  

Is it normal to bounce back and forth between feeling confident in the progress I am making and aiming for from day to day? Such as dependent on what others reactions are in order to tell me or validate how I should feel?

[–]NicoleZy 1 point  

Thank you Richard for all your work on the YouTube Videos. You mentioned a change would be seen within 2 weeks and I wonder if this was part of your NLP programming (grateful if it was) and have to say since watching your videos have felt incredible progress in untangling from the constant thoughts of the malignant narcissist ex. I totally have that evil wicked voice in my head when doing affirmations (you compare to some character from Lord of the Rings). Further guidance on how to progress, example wording to re-write the narrative would be helpful especially when it comes to relationships

[–]Amy-P 1 point  

[–]RichardGrannon[S]

Has he decimated you and ruined your life forever?

[–]Amy-P

No. But just given me maybe a few years to get through to where I'm fine. So...still don't know the answer. I'm showing narcissism with such an intense reaction?

(Re: "My ex is a covert narcissist which I found out a few months ago. I recently embarrassed and exposed his abuse in social media as a way to fight back and also bring the abuse from the darkness to the light...My question is...My anger and rage about it all make me feel like I want to decimate him and ruin his life forever. I know it will pass but...Isn't that narcissistic? Is that a narcissist trait coming out in me? It is not permanent or pervasive, just isolated. Still I wondered. I have been diagnosed on the BPD spectrum but was described to me as very mild on the spectrum.")

[–]X3nah13 1 point  

Thank you Richard, for the resources and empathy. Its devastating to seek help for very real pain and because of lack of understanding having to continue to experience and manage the pain alone. It is truly helpful to receive validation. I'm really glad to have found your videos. I've started seeing improvement (in myself) immediately.

[–]Quadrewple 1 point  

Richard, thanks to your channel, years of therapy, meditation, and the study of philosophy and psychology, my flashbacks have gone from things which I did not understand, to things I recognized happening to me dozens of times a day, to more mild forms of emotional dis-regulation which I can sometimes go days without having.

My question is regarding relating to people who have not healed from trauma (because they did not experience it). I know that for me, basically every waking second of these past 2 years my mindset has been singularly focused on reducing flashbacks, reducing my physical pain which was linked with it, and reducing my people pleasing tendencies at ALL costs.

The hand I was dealt and the journey I have taken make it very difficult to relate to people who've been relatively unhindered or even enriched by their upbringings. I am nearly 25 years old and would like to date, something which I was completely incapable of doing before. Other than allowing more time to pass, is there any advice you have to help me deal with this problem? I expect the prognosis will remain difficult for the foreseeable future.

[–]Frankie-Frankie 1 point  

Hi Richard. I am a middle aged female trying to keep away from a man with NPD. We went through the multiple cycles of evaluation then devaluation over the last two years. I got involved in this relationship one year after I lost my husband to brain cancer and suffering CPTSD from long term caregiving (as well as childhood abuse). The narc was a long time friend I thought I knew and could trust. Due to my incredible state of grief and trauma (which left me a shell of a human), he easily took charge, built me up, and I became completely dependent on him. The relationship with the narc involved a slow progress into many levels of emotional, mental, and sexual abuse. The narc's own cancer treatment affected his sexual abilities and, therefore, feels he can't move on to a replacement for me (I am the only one he's "been with" since and I have helped him restore some of his abilities over time). Because he is too embarrassed to find another partner he absolutely will not stop pursuing me no matter what I try (no contact, grey rock, backing away slowly, police warning, etc... I fear that the public record of a restraining order may lead to my physical harm). He always finds a way to break me down as he simply will not give up. Periods of no contact fill me with a great amount of anxiety because I don't know when he'll pop up. Also, and this is hard to explain... I feel a kind of addiction to his praise. This all makes it so incredibly difficult to remain strong against his multiple tactics to get me back. I'm beginning to feel that I need to do something drastic to escape this. What can you tell me about dealing with a narc who won't move on due to a failing body? He is somatic and has prided himself on his sexuality his whole life.

[–]Nikkigm 1 point  

Hi ...struggling to put into words...cross with myself for ignoring the signs for choosing to not listening to his warnings (have similar training as you.....find it can be a blessing and a curse). Went into relationship with high functioning BPD narc. He smelt out my wounds, love bombed me, then totalling and utterly abandoned me, without word or warning. Left me in a really bad place....... Aware I've been unable to separate the 'professional' me from 'me'. I know I didn't break him and I don't need to fix him. Can't stop caring, no closure, so many unanswered questions and concerned, as it's very possible we will meet professionally. What I am really noticing is how all my 'cluster b' traits appear stronger, more apparent and it worries me. Could this be just my awareness, my boundary setting, finally finding 'me'? Know I've retreated to my place of safety, rebuilt a wall so high, so strong. This pain has no words, guessing that comes from my initial wounds occuring pre-verbal.

[–]Jeanette01 1 point  

Hi Richie I've been following you for a while at u have helped me to understand why I have keep entering into abusive relationships whilst watching your session on nassistic people and sex you said that narssasists are detached from sex and often enter into relationships they know will end as a form of control I then went into a bit of a panic sm I a nassisticist or can people with cpcsd have some nassisticistic traits I was sexually abused as a child and my father was a complete nassisticist and my mother was and still is very manipulative. Long story short I've always been a people pleaser and put others needs be four my own including in the bedroom I have been in several physicaly abusive relationships does that make me nassisticistic confused.com I don't want to be one of them. Once again thank you for all your work kind regards Jeanette x

[–]Ohamiboringyou 1 point  

Ack! I've been dumped and I've done everything wrong. I've been needy and slightly stalkery, I yelled at him in public and told him I hoped he got little dick cancer and I'm constantly in panicky utter rejection emotional turmoil and I quit my job cause I'm a wreck. I don't think he's a narc necessarily but I'm losing my mind. I'm trying to get on meds for the depression. What can I do in the meantime? I'm very raw and unstable- no intents to harm myself or others but effectively non functional.

[–]RichardGrannon[S] 2 points  

Have you read Pete Walkers book on CPTSD? You sound like you are in a pretty intense flasback right now. If you study the book and his method for handling flashbacks that will help.

Reduce the flashbacks and slowly, over time, you will start to reregulate emotionally.

I just did a short manual on this, its on amazon kindle "how to stop emotional flashbacks" if you just want the cliffnotes version for now.

Ultimately you need to study the P Walker book and the subject, its a lot to learn, but it will dramatically change your life for the better.

It certainly did for me!

[–]_Moby_Dick 1 point  

Hello Richard - Do you have any tips on dealing with the Narco smear campaign? Is it possible to ever counteract it effectively? Is it even worth caring about the people who bought into it in the first place?

[–]Amy516 1 point  

I would love to hear more about this, too. We have been isolated from the rest of family due to a narco smear campaign.

[–]Lesser_Child 1 point  

I grew up as the scapegoat in a family that has strong narcissistic tendencies. It has taken me decades to understand that I was not a bad seed among a garden of idols who I admittedly spent my life worshiping, grateful for any scrap they would throw me. Now that I have finally broke through the fog and have developed a sense of understanding about all of this, I am obsessed with the idea of making them understand how hurtful they have been to me and to showing them that I am not a black sheep, but an actual worthy human being. I find it hard to focus because my mind just constantly goes back to this fantasy of proving to them how wrong they were. I feel empty when I try to tell myself that, in reality, they are probably never going see what they have done, or see me as anymore than a stray dog of some sort that they feed on occasion. How do I let go of this attachment to making my family of origin see what they did to me and and recognize that they were wrong about me? What goes in the empty place where your Mom, Dad and siblings, who hold you in high regard, are supposed to be? How do I shift my focus from this depressing default mode of needing my family and wanting their unconditional love above all else? BTW, I am in my late 40's but I still feel like a child around them.

[–]KaliEarth 1 point  

Hello - I'm not Richard, obviously however, I have dealt with the same thing in the last year or so. I started by writing a lot to myself about the abuse I've suffered. Just a daily journal of thoughts, feelings and memories. It made me aware of MY story as opposed to the one told by my family. After that I started writing emails to my dad, sister and mother telling them how I've experienced my childhood and how it felt. I got emails back, but it became clear that they will never really get it or respect me the way I want and need. In the end I cut contact with my dad and sister. I told them I needed to have my own life and that they should respect it. I felt immidiate relief and space to be myself. Also very very frightened and lonely, but I used friends, help lines and Spartan Life Coach courses to get me through. I have stopped contact with my mother as well, as seeing her makes me feel stuck in a role I don't want to be stuck in anymore. I hurts me and saddens me that it have come to this, but I feel that I can finally be the person I want to be. It's also scary as I've always done what was expected of me, but now I feel that life is mine and it's the best thing I've ever done. Do it with help and support from others is my advice. Nobody needs people who put them down, not even if it's family. I don't know if the separation is for good - but it's for now. And my therapist said to give it three years at least. That calms me and helps me to know that I can go back if I need to. Nothing is permanent, but for now I needed the space to grow into the person I want to be. Be strong and seek support - Be who you know you can be:)

[–]Warhound88 1 point  

Hey man, first of all thank you for all of your videos, they've been extremely helpful for me. I was wondering if it's possible or how you would recommend disconnecting "good" memories from an emotionally abusive ex. My ex had BPD and did a lot of the splitting and idealization, and during the idealization phase, got involved with and integrated herself with as many of my interests as possible. I had no idea what was going on at the time, I just thought "Hey, this is just someone who is genuinely interested in and enjoys the same things I enjoy," but the problem now is most of the things that cause emotional flashbacks for me are things that I once enjoyed, and want to be able to enjoy again.

It's frustrating because I know that I enjoyed all those things BEFORE ever knowing her, and I'm pretty sure she only got into them to try to appeal to me. But it's like my brain is a minefield and I haven't been able to think about certain things, watch movies/tv shows etc. that I normally would have liked, without being reminded of her. It's gotten to the point where it's almost like my subsconscious has made a connection between "feeling good" or "being happy" and "pain". I've made a lot of progress in other areas but this is one thing that's been extremely frustrating and I'm not sure how to tackle.

[–]RichardGrannon[S] 3 points  

I was wondering if it's possible or how you would recommend disconnecting "good" memories from an emotionally abusive ex.

Yes. I actually made a 20 minute long hypnosis that was my version of the process they underwent in "eternal sunshine of the spotless mind". Except instead of scrubbing all the memories I focussed on scrubbing the attachment feelings. I think its in the "overcome narcissistic abuse" course.

"It's gotten to the point where it's almost like my subsconscious has made a connection between "feeling good" or "being happy" and "pain". I've made a lot of progress in other areas but this is one thing that's been extremely frustrating and I'm not sure how to tackle."

So here is an interesting thing: during and after a narcissistically abusive relationship you will think and feel precisely what they want you to think and feel.

If you feel this way its because she wants you to have zero joy in your life without her. When they leave they dont just leave they shit on the living room rug and rub it on the walls.

Why? To feel more powerful and significant.

The idea that you would just "get on with your life" is totally unacceptable to a cluster B. You must be punished.

She has poisoned the well. For now.

If you do nothing at all, the feeling will pass no matter what. There is NOTHING she can do to stop that.

If you maybe join a BPD survivors group, talk to other people who had the same experience as you, study the subject and work on reducing your emotional flashbacks, particularly the ones relating to feelings of abandonment, you will heal way, way faster.

And once healed you cannot unheal. Its a shitty experience, my ex was bpd, npd, hpd so I know how god awful and upside reality can seem at times, but it will pass.

Dont do what I did and run away from the pain. Lean into it, study it, analyse it, get some help, maybe see a professional, do some journalling, connect with your feelings (feel the feels bro https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aHiFnJ2Mx68) and do NOT self isolate. Connect. As you just did. And you asked for help.

So double cyber high fives to you on both counts.

All the best mate.

[–]Warhound88 1 point  

Thanks for this - avoiding isolation is definitely tough, particularly since she also isolated me from a lot of friends while we were in the relationship. Telling people I'd said things about them that I hadn't, if she didn't like someone or got into some argument with them she'd try to demand that I cut them out too, that sort of thing. I've reconnected with some friends and I'm hoping eventually I'll regain the ability to meet new people. It's like I've forgotten how to talk to people, but that I'm assuming will improve with healing too. I'll definitely check out that course - thanks again.

[–]X3nah13 1 point  

Is CPTSD being acknowledged as a "real" diagnosis? My belief is Ive been misdiagnosed (with PTSD/bipolar/borderline) and would be like to reevaluated. I've met with most professionals in my area and they do not enough knowledge about trauma to help. what is your advice on seeking treatment?

[–]RichardGrannon[S] 1 point  

CPTSD is not acknowledged in the mainstream as a real diagnosis, no. It is, in my experience and my humble opinion, all too common to see people misdiagnosed with bipolar and bpd when it is CPTSD. On seeking treatment: you are going to have to make do with a good therapist who at least can talk you through coping with and healing from childhood trauma and... well... if you find a good therapist they will help you even if they are not familiar with CPTSD.

When I was seeking treatment I went through a load of people, picked out my top 10 and then phone interviewed them and chose one that way. I recommend you do the same.

I'm sorry I cant be more helpful, good luck to you!

[–]X3nah13 1 point  

thank you very much. thats what I've been trying and will continue

[–]zyllah 1 point  

Hi,

Do you have any tips or ideas for supporting a friend who is married to shall we say a toxic lady. She has him convinced she would kill herself if he left and he only intermittently admits she is abusive. Thanks

[–]RichardGrannon[S] 1 point  

This is a high risk situation for me to be giving advice on. Imagine he is a member of highly demanding cult for a second. If you say one thing that goes too far against the cult leader, he will cut you out of his life until he wakes up from her zombie spell or possibly never. So no, I cant really advise you 3rd hand because Id hate to think anything I said would make him banish you.

She is in his head now, he will be like one of those little slaves with their brains sucked dry in the "dark crystal".

The "I will kill yourself if you leave me" dance is classic for the aggressively inclined borderline personality disorder. The vulnerable predator.

My friend married one too. I warned him once. Never again. Keep shtum if you want to stay friends.

[–]shw3nn 1 point  

I know you're a fan of Joe Rogan, have you listened to this podcast?

The whole thing is interesting but that moment made me rethink my position on this topic.

[–]GingerHills 1 point  

How does one give a shit? I got out of a horrible relationship, which was actually a great relationship until the completely random end. The relationship included the guy telling me every day how wonderful and smart and cute and fun and blablablaaaaaaaaaaaa I was, but then one day, totally out of the blue, he turned around and dumped me for being “too fat and ugly" for him. Then he'd get drunk and call me and tell me he loved me sooooooo much and how smart and wonderful and blablablaaaaaaaaaaaaaa I was, but that I was still too fat and ugly for him. BTW, he was no Magic Mike. He was quite the pudgy little potato himself.

So, I decided that if I'm going to be too fat and ugly to be lovable, I might as well get my money's worth, so I gained a metric fuckton of weight and replaced most of my wardrobe with sweatpants and cat hair. Why not? Life is terrible, food is yummy. It's going on three years since this happened and I've basically completely isolated myself since. On an average week, I'd say I only make it out of the house twice. Obviously the boyfriend isn't the only factor here, but it's the freshest one. I realize this is all HORRIBLY unhealthy, but I can't seem to give a shit enough to change it. It's not like I don't know I should be exercising and eating better, but who the hell cares?

This is a little dark, but I finally realized that I'm basically committing passive suicide. I couldn't do it outright, but this way I can pretend it's an accident, like I'm a victim of some rare bonkers health malady (a few of which do run in the family) if I, say, have a heart attack and die, and thus wouldn't be "blamed" by my friends and family. The reason I'm committing passive suicide is because I feel like there is nothing to look forward to at all in life. I mean, if THIS is what life is going to be like, I don't want to live that long....and women on both sides of my family live for-fucking-EVER...well into their 90s.

I don't like this game. I don't want to play anymore...and I certainly don't want to play for another 60-70 years! Ergo, I have a hard time giving a shit about anything, least of all my health or forgetting that Doritos and cake is not a food group. So far, my experiences with therapy have NOT been good. It's been a pernicious potpourri of victim blaming, Oprah/Dr. Phil School of Bovine Scatology, and CBT (which stands for Cock Ball Turds as far as I'm concerned).

Oh, and I also have a problem with maladaptive daydreaming. So...that's fun.

Suggestions?

(Sorry for the novel)

[–]Pizzawho 0 points  

Hi Richard. I would like your thoughts on FLEAS. Are they responses to emotional flashbacks, or something else? Also, thank you for doing what you do. Your videos have helped me make sense...of me, really. :)

[–]jeulie 1 point  

While you are here what are identifiers and FLEAS Your videos help me a lot too

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