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Re: Google Maps really needs work
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Alan Browne
Oct 5, 2012, 5:53:31 PM10/5/12
to
On 2012.10.05 17:37 , Michelle Steiner wrote:
> It gives some ridiculous results in The Bronx, NY. For instance, plot the
> directions from 380 W. Tremont Avenue to 379 W. Tremont Avenue, or vice
> versa, in the Bronx. There's no way those two addresses are that far apart.
Sticking with iOS 5 for the foreseeable future.
> Then plot the location of 8033 W. Tremont Avenue (an address used in last
> night's episode of Elementary on CBS).
We saw the pilot of Elementary - not sure we'll continue. Anyway now
that I've severed the cable, I'll have to wait 'til it goes "web".
Maybe I'll set up an antenna to catch HDTV...
--
"There were, unfortunately, no great principles on which parties
were divided – politics became a mere struggle for office."
-Sir John A. Macdonald
> It gives some ridiculous results in The Bronx, NY. For instance, plot the
> directions from 380 W. Tremont Avenue to 379 W. Tremont Avenue, or vice
> versa, in the Bronx. There's no way those two addresses are that far apart.
Sticking with iOS 5 for the foreseeable future.
> Then plot the location of 8033 W. Tremont Avenue (an address used in last
> night's episode of Elementary on CBS).
We saw the pilot of Elementary - not sure we'll continue. Anyway now
that I've severed the cable, I'll have to wait 'til it goes "web".
Maybe I'll set up an antenna to catch HDTV...
--
"There were, unfortunately, no great principles on which parties
were divided – politics became a mere struggle for office."
-Sir John A. Macdonald
George Kerby
Oct 6, 2012, 10:58:15 AM10/6/12
to
On 10/5/12 4:37 PM, in article
michelle-464E0C...@news.eternal-september.org, "Michelle
Steiner" <mich...@michelle.org> wrote:
> It gives some ridiculous results in The Bronx, NY. For instance, plot the
> directions from 380 W. Tremont Avenue to 379 W. Tremont Avenue, or vice
> versa, in the Bronx. There's no way those two addresses are that far apart.
>
> It gives some ridiculous results in The Bronx, NY. For instance, plot the
> directions from 380 W. Tremont Avenue to 379 W. Tremont Avenue, or vice
> versa, in the Bronx. There's no way those two addresses are that far apart.
>
> Then plot the location of 8033 W. Tremont Avenue (an address used in last
> night's episode of Elementary on CBS).
Maybe you should see if Apple Maps can find 77 Sunset Strip?
> night's episode of Elementary on CBS).
Matthew Lybanon
Oct 6, 2012, 10:59:54 AM10/6/12
to
In article <michelle-464E0C...@news.eternal-september.org>,
a minimum of two errors in street names (including the street where I
live) in my city. And Google Maps isn't just picking on this city; it's
an equal-opportunity bucket of bugs.
Michelle Steiner <mich...@michelle.org> wrote:
> It gives some ridiculous results in The Bronx, NY. For instance, plot the
> directions from 380 W. Tremont Avenue to 379 W. Tremont Avenue, or vice
> versa, in the Bronx. There's no way those two addresses are that far apart.
>
> Then plot the location of 8033 W. Tremont Avenue (an address used in last
> night's episode of Elementary on CBS).
Aside from some bizarre things like that, it is full of errors. It has
> It gives some ridiculous results in The Bronx, NY. For instance, plot the
> directions from 380 W. Tremont Avenue to 379 W. Tremont Avenue, or vice
> versa, in the Bronx. There's no way those two addresses are that far apart.
>
> Then plot the location of 8033 W. Tremont Avenue (an address used in last
> night's episode of Elementary on CBS).
a minimum of two errors in street names (including the street where I
live) in my city. And Google Maps isn't just picking on this city; it's
an equal-opportunity bucket of bugs.
Alan Browne
Oct 6, 2012, 11:09:04 AM10/6/12
to
On 2012.10.05 17:37 , Michelle Steiner wrote:
> It gives some ridiculous results in The Bronx, NY. For instance, plot the
> directions from 380 W. Tremont Avenue to 379 W. Tremont Avenue, or vice
> versa, in the Bronx. There's no way those two addresses are that far apart.
I haven't gotten a bum steer from GMaps to date. I have gotten routings
> It gives some ridiculous results in The Bronx, NY. For instance, plot the
> directions from 380 W. Tremont Avenue to 379 W. Tremont Avenue, or vice
> versa, in the Bronx. There's no way those two addresses are that far apart.
that were not optimal, but they weren't grossly off.
Sticking to iOS 5 for the foreseeable future.
A friend of mine was over last night all atwitter over the iPhone 5 but
reluctant to give up Street View (He's a technical specialist and calls
on clients all over the region. He likes to check street view so he can
eyeball the place before he drives up. Saves him time in locating
addresses and parking).
His daughter is salivating over the prospect of taking over his iPhone
4. The pressure is on...
Message has been deleted
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Alan Browne
Oct 6, 2012, 12:48:44 PM10/6/12
to
On 2012.10.06 12:13 , Michelle Steiner wrote:
> In article <Dp6dnWkCm9gN1O3N...@giganews.com>,
> Bronx, NY. Apple's new Maps gets it right.
> understand your concern, but the flaws in the database are rapidly being
> fixed, and as I've shown, Google's Maps data are not perfect.
I have other reasons to prefer Google Maps, one being a month worth of
recording tracks of trails in the woods (two locations) and then
painstakingly entering them in Google Map Maker. Google Maps directions
will even plot the best track through the wood trail network when in
"pedestrian" mode... (I don't 'need' that, but it's cool to show people).
BTW: It's all very nice Michelle that you're sifting through the small,
small number of Google Maps errors to diminish the Apple Map fiasco but
it doesn't stick.
It will take Apple likely a year to get it to an error rate comparable
to Google Maps.
> In article <Dp6dnWkCm9gN1O3N...@giganews.com>,
> Alan Browne <alan....@FreelunchVideotron.ca> wrote:
>
>>> It gives some ridiculous results in The Bronx, NY. For instance, plot
>>> the directions from 380 W. Tremont Avenue to 379 W. Tremont Avenue, or
>>> vice versa, in the Bronx. There's no way those two addresses are that
>>> far apart.
>>
>> I haven't gotten a bum steer from GMaps to date. I have gotten routings
>> that were not optimal, but they weren't grossly off.
>
> Well, it's grossly off for some addresses on West Tremont Avenue in The
>
>>> It gives some ridiculous results in The Bronx, NY. For instance, plot
>>> the directions from 380 W. Tremont Avenue to 379 W. Tremont Avenue, or
>>> vice versa, in the Bronx. There's no way those two addresses are that
>>> far apart.
>>
>> I haven't gotten a bum steer from GMaps to date. I have gotten routings
>> that were not optimal, but they weren't grossly off.
>
> Bronx, NY. Apple's new Maps gets it right.
>
>> Sticking to iOS 5 for the foreseeable future.
>
> Whatever. If Maps is the most important part of the OS for you, I can
>> Sticking to iOS 5 for the foreseeable future.
>
> understand your concern, but the flaws in the database are rapidly being
> fixed, and as I've shown, Google's Maps data are not perfect.
I have other reasons to prefer Google Maps, one being a month worth of
recording tracks of trails in the woods (two locations) and then
painstakingly entering them in Google Map Maker. Google Maps directions
will even plot the best track through the wood trail network when in
"pedestrian" mode... (I don't 'need' that, but it's cool to show people).
BTW: It's all very nice Michelle that you're sifting through the small,
small number of Google Maps errors to diminish the Apple Map fiasco but
it doesn't stick.
It will take Apple likely a year to get it to an error rate comparable
to Google Maps.
Jolly Roger
Oct 6, 2012, 1:47:18 PM10/6/12
to
In article <t5qdnReyA-dx_e3N...@giganews.com>,
--
Send responses to the relevant news group rather than email to me.
E-mail sent to this address may be devoured by my very hungry SPAM
filter. Due to Google's refusal to prevent spammers from posting
messages through their servers, I often ignore posts from Google
Groups. Use a real news client if you want me to see your posts.
JR
Alan Browne <alan....@FreelunchVideotron.ca> wrote:
> It will take Apple likely a year to get it to an error rate comparable
> to Google Maps.
Got some data to back up that assertion?
> It will take Apple likely a year to get it to an error rate comparable
> to Google Maps.
--
Send responses to the relevant news group rather than email to me.
E-mail sent to this address may be devoured by my very hungry SPAM
filter. Due to Google's refusal to prevent spammers from posting
messages through their servers, I often ignore posts from Google
Groups. Use a real news client if you want me to see your posts.
JR
Todd Allcock
Oct 6, 2012, 1:56:28 PM10/6/12
to
At 06 Oct 2012 09:27:21 -0700 Michelle Steiner wrote:
> In article <CC95B137.906A7%ghost_...@hotmail.com>,
Manyana,
> NSW, Dagsboro, DE, Jan Juc, VIC, Ocean Grove, BIC, Show Low, AZ, or
> Cloudcroft, NM?
Hollywood, CA isn't listed because 77 isn't a real address on Sunset. The
TV show's supposed location (next to Dean Martin's bar) is actually in
the 8500 block of Sunset, but I assume nobody thought "8518 West Sunset
Blvd." sounded nearly as catchy as a theme song...
> In article <CC95B137.906A7%ghost_...@hotmail.com>,
> George Kerby <ghost_...@hotmail.com> wrote:
>
> > Maybe you should see if Apple Maps can find 77 Sunset Strip?
>
> Which one: Sunrise, FL, Anderson, MO, Nags Head, NC, Elwood, NE,
>
> > Maybe you should see if Apple Maps can find 77 Sunset Strip?
>
Manyana,
> NSW, Dagsboro, DE, Jan Juc, VIC, Ocean Grove, BIC, Show Low, AZ, or
> Cloudcroft, NM?
Hollywood, CA isn't listed because 77 isn't a real address on Sunset. The
TV show's supposed location (next to Dean Martin's bar) is actually in
the 8500 block of Sunset, but I assume nobody thought "8518 West Sunset
Blvd." sounded nearly as catchy as a theme song...
Alan Browne
Oct 6, 2012, 2:01:05 PM10/6/12
to
On 2012.10.06 13:47 , Jolly Roger wrote:
> In article <t5qdnReyA-dx_e3N...@giganews.com>,
> Alan Browne <alan....@FreelunchVideotron.ca> wrote:
>
>> It will take Apple likely a year to get it to an error rate comparable
>> to Google Maps.
>
> Got some data to back up that assertion?
It's my opinion. Believe it or not there is no requirement on usenet to
> In article <t5qdnReyA-dx_e3N...@giganews.com>,
> Alan Browne <alan....@FreelunchVideotron.ca> wrote:
>
>> It will take Apple likely a year to get it to an error rate comparable
>> to Google Maps.
>
> Got some data to back up that assertion?
post only things that can be backed up with data nor to write
disclaimers with every utterance.
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nospam
Oct 6, 2012, 2:42:03 PM10/6/12
to
In article <jollyroger-3AAE5...@news.individual.net>,
apple has been working on maps for a few years.
a year to fix things is very optimistic.
Jolly Roger <jolly...@pobox.com> wrote:
> > It will take Apple likely a year to get it to an error rate comparable
> > to Google Maps.
>
> Got some data to back up that assertion?
google has been working on maps for nearly a decade
> > It will take Apple likely a year to get it to an error rate comparable
> > to Google Maps.
>
> Got some data to back up that assertion?
apple has been working on maps for a few years.
a year to fix things is very optimistic.
JF Mezei
Oct 6, 2012, 2:56:22 PM10/6/12
to
On 12-10-06 12:13, Michelle Steiner wrote:
> Whatever. If Maps is the most important part of the OS for you, I can
> understand your concern, but the flaws in the database are rapidly being
> fixed, and as I've shown, Google's Maps data are not perfect.
Michelle, it is not realistic for Apple to fix flaws in a matter of
> Whatever. If Maps is the most important part of the OS for you, I can
> understand your concern, but the flaws in the database are rapidly being
> fixed, and as I've shown, Google's Maps data are not perfect.
weeks. For one thing, they do not have the army of people to fix them,
and even with Google's 7000 mapping employees, we are talking about
years, not weeks.
Alan Browne
Oct 6, 2012, 3:20:07 PM10/6/12
to
On 2012.10.06 14:10 , Michelle Steiner wrote:
> In article <t5qdnReyA-dx_e3N...@giganews.com>,
> address on a TV show. If the address had not been purported to be in the
> area where I grew up, I wouldn't have bothered.
For every stumble you make with Google Maps many more other people are
stumbling over more with Apple Maps. That will take a long time to
wring out.
> In article <t5qdnReyA-dx_e3N...@giganews.com>,
> Alan Browne <alan....@FreelunchVideotron.ca> wrote:
>
>> BTW: It's all very nice Michelle that you're sifting through the small,
>> small number of Google Maps errors to diminish the Apple Map fiasco but
>> it doesn't stick.
>
> I didn't sift through anything; I stumbled across it when checking an
>
>> BTW: It's all very nice Michelle that you're sifting through the small,
>> small number of Google Maps errors to diminish the Apple Map fiasco but
>> it doesn't stick.
>
> address on a TV show. If the address had not been purported to be in the
> area where I grew up, I wouldn't have bothered.
For every stumble you make with Google Maps many more other people are
stumbling over more with Apple Maps. That will take a long time to
wring out.
Message has been deleted
Message has been deleted
nospam
Oct 6, 2012, 3:47:56 PM10/6/12
to
In article <michelle-57A566...@news.eternal-september.org>,
the first two are data. you might consider the third to be an opinion,
but it's the only possibility given the first two items.
Michelle Steiner <mich...@michelle.org> wrote:
> > > > It will take Apple likely a year to get it to an error rate comparable
> > > > to Google Maps.
> > >
> > > Got some data to back up that assertion?
> >
> > google has been working on maps for nearly a decade
> >
> > apple has been working on maps for a few years.
> >
> > a year to fix things is very optimistic.
>
> OK, no data; just an opinion.
> > > > It will take Apple likely a year to get it to an error rate comparable
> > > > to Google Maps.
> > >
> > > Got some data to back up that assertion?
> >
> > google has been working on maps for nearly a decade
> >
> > apple has been working on maps for a few years.
> >
> > a year to fix things is very optimistic.
>
the first two are data. you might consider the third to be an opinion,
but it's the only possibility given the first two items.
Alan Browne
Oct 6, 2012, 3:51:09 PM10/6/12
to
On 2012.10.06 15:41 , Michelle Steiner wrote:
> In article <XZCdnViBWdX6Ge3N...@giganews.com>,
> Google maps needs much less work than Apple maps. All you're doing is
> confirming what I said in the first place.
The title says that now because I changed it.
> In article <XZCdnViBWdX6Ge3N...@giganews.com>,
> Alan Browne <alan....@FreelunchVideotron.ca> wrote:
>
>>>> BTW: It's all very nice Michelle that you're sifting through the
>>>> small, small number of Google Maps errors to diminish the Apple Map
>>>> fiasco but it doesn't stick.
>>>
>>> I didn't sift through anything; I stumbled across it when checking an
>>> address on a TV show. If the address had not been purported to be in
>>> the area where I grew up, I wouldn't have bothered.
>>
>> For every stumble you make with Google Maps many more other people are
>> stumbling over more with Apple Maps. That will take a long time to
>> wring out.
>
> So what is your point? Note that the subject of this thread says that
>
>>>> BTW: It's all very nice Michelle that you're sifting through the
>>>> small, small number of Google Maps errors to diminish the Apple Map
>>>> fiasco but it doesn't stick.
>>>
>>> I didn't sift through anything; I stumbled across it when checking an
>>> address on a TV show. If the address had not been purported to be in
>>> the area where I grew up, I wouldn't have bothered.
>>
>> For every stumble you make with Google Maps many more other people are
>> stumbling over more with Apple Maps. That will take a long time to
>> wring out.
>
> Google maps needs much less work than Apple maps. All you're doing is
> confirming what I said in the first place.
The title says that now because I changed it.
Message has been deleted
Message has been deleted
AaronL
Oct 6, 2012, 4:03:53 PM10/6/12
to
On Sat, 06 Oct 2012 11:09:04 -0400, Alan Browne
<alan....@FreelunchVideotron.ca> wrote:
>A friend of mine was over last night all atwitter over the iPhone 5 but
>reluctant to give up Street View
Your friend is in luck if he doesn't mind using Safari:
<alan....@FreelunchVideotron.ca> wrote:
>A friend of mine was over last night all atwitter over the iPhone 5 but
>reluctant to give up Street View
http://news.cnet.com/8301-1023_3-57524918-93/google-maps-to-insert-street-view-into-mobile-web-app/
Alan Browne
Oct 6, 2012, 4:17:04 PM10/6/12
to
On 2012.10.06 15:56 , Michelle Steiner wrote:
> In article <6-ydnbWdD-EwFu3N...@giganews.com>,
No apology necessary - esp. after I screwed with your subject entry.
> In article <6-ydnbWdD-EwFu3N...@giganews.com>,
> Alan Browne <alan....@FreelunchVideotron.ca> wrote:
>
>>> So what is your point? Note that the subject of this thread says that
>>> Google maps needs much less work than Apple maps. All you're doing is
>>> confirming what I said in the first place.
>>
>> The title says that now because I changed it.
>
> My apologies; I thought that's what I had written in the first place.
>
>>> So what is your point? Note that the subject of this thread says that
>>> Google maps needs much less work than Apple maps. All you're doing is
>>> confirming what I said in the first place.
>>
>> The title says that now because I changed it.
>
No apology necessary - esp. after I screwed with your subject entry.
Alan Browne
Oct 6, 2012, 4:26:25 PM10/6/12
to
view in it. So I think he meant satellite view which the Apple Map has too.
George Kerby
Oct 6, 2012, 5:08:06 PM10/6/12
to
On 10/6/12 11:27 AM, in article
michelle-4F680E...@news.eternal-september.org, "Michelle
> George Kerby <ghost_...@hotmail.com> wrote:
>
>>> It gives some ridiculous results in The Bronx, NY. For instance, plot
>>> the directions from 380 W. Tremont Avenue to 379 W. Tremont Avenue, or
>>> vice versa, in the Bronx. There's no way those two addresses are that
>>> far apart.
>>>
>>> Then plot the location of 8033 W. Tremont Avenue (an address used in
>>> last night's episode of Elementary on CBS).
>>
>> Maybe you should see if Apple Maps can find 77 Sunset Strip?
>
>
>>> It gives some ridiculous results in The Bronx, NY. For instance, plot
>>> the directions from 380 W. Tremont Avenue to 379 W. Tremont Avenue, or
>>> vice versa, in the Bronx. There's no way those two addresses are that
>>> far apart.
>>>
>>> Then plot the location of 8033 W. Tremont Avenue (an address used in
>>> last night's episode of Elementary on CBS).
>>
>> Maybe you should see if Apple Maps can find 77 Sunset Strip?
>
> Which one: Sunrise, FL, Anderson, MO, Nags Head, NC, Elwood, NE, Manyana,
> NSW, Dagsboro, DE, Jan Juc, VIC, Ocean Grove, BIC, Show Low, AZ, or
> Cloudcroft, NM?
Cloudcroft eh? Been there a few times and never saw that. Have a friend that
> NSW, Dagsboro, DE, Jan Juc, VIC, Ocean Grove, BIC, Show Low, AZ, or
> Cloudcroft, NM?
works at The Lodge and loves the area. The most striking thing I remember
was the great decent westward into Alamogordo and the White Sands.
As a matter of fact, I was looking for Efrem Zimbalist Jr.'s office next to
Deno's. We need his firm to find Barack Obama's testicles (we found the
empty chair and suit already).
George Kerby
Oct 6, 2012, 5:12:20 PM10/6/12
to
On 10/6/12 12:56 PM, in article k4prc2$rgu$3...@dont-email.me, "Todd Allcock"
parallel to finding some supposed address for another TV show she mentioned
based in NYC.
George Kerby
Oct 6, 2012, 5:14:36 PM10/6/12
to
On 10/6/12 1:12 PM, in article
michelle-CF24E2...@news.eternal-september.org, "Michelle
Steiner" <mich...@michelle.org> wrote:
> In article <k4prc2$rgu$3...@dont-email.me>,
> Todd Allcock <elecc...@AnoOspamL.com> wrote:
>
>>>> Maybe you should see if Apple Maps can find 77 Sunset Strip?
>>>
>>> Which one: Sunrise, FL, Anderson, MO, Nags Head, NC, Elwood, NE,
>>> Manyana, NSW, Dagsboro, DE, Jan Juc, VIC, Ocean Grove, BIC, Show Low,
>>> AZ, or Cloudcroft, NM?
>>
>> Hollywood, CA isn't listed because 77 isn't a real address on Sunset.
>
> Yes, I know. But you didn't say Hollywood, or even California. So I
>
>>>> Maybe you should see if Apple Maps can find 77 Sunset Strip?
>>>
>>> Which one: Sunrise, FL, Anderson, MO, Nags Head, NC, Elwood, NE,
>>> Manyana, NSW, Dagsboro, DE, Jan Juc, VIC, Ocean Grove, BIC, Show Low,
>>> AZ, or Cloudcroft, NM?
>>
>> Hollywood, CA isn't listed because 77 isn't a real address on Sunset.
>
> jokingly asked which one you meant.
>
> BTW, try 221B Baker Street.
You think HE could find Obama's twins?!?
Király
Oct 6, 2012, 5:21:18 PM10/6/12
to
In comp.sys.mac.system Jolly Roger <jolly...@pobox.com> wrote:
> > It will take Apple likely a year to get it to an error rate comparable
> > to Google Maps.
>
> Got some data to back up that assertion?
LOL!
> > It will take Apple likely a year to get it to an error rate comparable
> > to Google Maps.
>
> Got some data to back up that assertion?
--
K.
Te tetted e tettetett tettet? Te tettetett tettek tettetett tettese, te!
George Kerby
Oct 6, 2012, 5:25:47 PM10/6/12
to
On 10/6/12 2:47 PM, in article 061020121547563575%nos...@nospam.invalid,
iPhone. The main streets are in Yellow and the side streets show up better.
There is a lot to revise besides simply the data in Apple Map App.
AaronL
Oct 6, 2012, 5:26:26 PM10/6/12
to
Alan Browne <alan....@FreelunchVideotron.ca> wrote:
>On 2012.10.06 16:03 , AaronL wrote:
>>> A friend of mine was over last night all atwitter over the iPhone 5 but
>>> reluctant to give up Street View
>On 2012.10.06 16:03 , AaronL wrote:
>>> A friend of mine was over last night all atwitter over the iPhone 5 but
>>> reluctant to give up Street View
>I just realized that he misled me as Google Maps does not have street
>view in it.
But the mobile Google Maps app does have Street View. At least the
>view in it.
ones I use do (non-updated iPad3 and Android phone).
Alan Browne
Oct 6, 2012, 5:41:52 PM10/6/12
to
re-learned (pindrop and left icon). Belay my previous confusion and
conclusions.
Message has been deleted
Message has been deleted
Tom Stiller
Oct 6, 2012, 6:38:47 PM10/6/12
to
In article <michelle-951831...@news.eternal-september.org>,
Michelle Steiner <mich...@michelle.org> wrote:
> In article <CC9607E6.90702%ghost_...@hotmail.com>,
>
> <http://goo.gl/maps/CiXpT>
> wouldn't have let Romney get away with all his lies.
Nah, he was practicing rope-a-dope.
--
PRAY, v. To ask that the laws of the universe be annulled in behalf
of a single petitioner confessedly unworthy. -- Ambrose Bierce
Michelle Steiner <mich...@michelle.org> wrote:
> In article <CC9607E6.90702%ghost_...@hotmail.com>,
> George Kerby <ghost_...@hotmail.com> wrote:
>
> > >> Maybe you should see if Apple Maps can find 77 Sunset Strip?
> > >
> > > Which one: Sunrise, FL, Anderson, MO, Nags Head, NC, Elwood, NE,
> > > Manyana, NSW, Dagsboro, DE, Jan Juc, VIC, Ocean Grove, BIC, Show Low,
> > > AZ, or Cloudcroft, NM?
> >
> > Cloudcroft eh? Been there a few times and never saw that.
>
> Yup; both Apple and Google maps say it exists. Here's Google's map of it:
>
> > >> Maybe you should see if Apple Maps can find 77 Sunset Strip?
> > >
> > > Which one: Sunrise, FL, Anderson, MO, Nags Head, NC, Elwood, NE,
> > > Manyana, NSW, Dagsboro, DE, Jan Juc, VIC, Ocean Grove, BIC, Show Low,
> > > AZ, or Cloudcroft, NM?
> >
> > Cloudcroft eh? Been there a few times and never saw that.
>
>
> <http://goo.gl/maps/CiXpT>
>
> > As a matter of fact, I was looking for Efrem Zimbalist Jr.'s office next
> > to Deno's. We need his firm to find Barack Obama's testicles (we found
> > the empty chair and suit already).
>
> He seems to have misplaced them during the debate; if he had had them, he
> > As a matter of fact, I was looking for Efrem Zimbalist Jr.'s office next
> > to Deno's. We need his firm to find Barack Obama's testicles (we found
> > the empty chair and suit already).
>
> wouldn't have let Romney get away with all his lies.
Nah, he was practicing rope-a-dope.
--
PRAY, v. To ask that the laws of the universe be annulled in behalf
of a single petitioner confessedly unworthy. -- Ambrose Bierce
George Kerby
Oct 6, 2012, 6:39:21 PM10/6/12
to
On 10/6/12 4:56 PM, in article
michelle-951831...@news.eternal-september.org, "Michelle
Steiner" <mich...@michelle.org> wrote:
> In article <CC9607E6.90702%ghost_...@hotmail.com>,
> George Kerby <ghost_...@hotmail.com> wrote:
>
>>>> Maybe you should see if Apple Maps can find 77 Sunset Strip?
>>>
>>> Which one: Sunrise, FL, Anderson, MO, Nags Head, NC, Elwood, NE,
>>> Manyana, NSW, Dagsboro, DE, Jan Juc, VIC, Ocean Grove, BIC, Show Low,
>>> AZ, or Cloudcroft, NM?
>>
>> Cloudcroft eh? Been there a few times and never saw that.
>
>
>>>> Maybe you should see if Apple Maps can find 77 Sunset Strip?
>>>
>>> Which one: Sunrise, FL, Anderson, MO, Nags Head, NC, Elwood, NE,
>>> Manyana, NSW, Dagsboro, DE, Jan Juc, VIC, Ocean Grove, BIC, Show Low,
>>> AZ, or Cloudcroft, NM?
>>
>> Cloudcroft eh? Been there a few times and never saw that.
>
> Yup; both Apple and Google maps say it exists. Here's Google's map of it:
>
> <http://goo.gl/maps/CiXpT>
>
>
> <http://goo.gl/maps/CiXpT>
>
>> As a matter of fact, I was looking for Efrem Zimbalist Jr.'s office next
>> to Deno's. We need his firm to find Barack Obama's testicles (we found
>> the empty chair and suit already).
>
>> to Deno's. We need his firm to find Barack Obama's testicles (we found
>> the empty chair and suit already).
>
> He seems to have misplaced them during the debate; if he had had them, he
> wouldn't have let Romney get away with all his lies.
He was worried about his nose candy and weed. Michelle was all hot and
> wouldn't have let Romney get away with all his lies.
bothered on her anniversary and just didn't understand why this damn 'debate
thingy' was cutting into her romance/vacation time
<http://www.politico.com/news/stories/1012/82103.html>
I mean with two experts like Maher and Ice-T agree, how can one argue?
What a Wonderful Respected Leader to proudly represent the United States in
world affairs. NOT!
Got anymore blank ammo for the Marine guards at the Embassies around the
world next September, Mr. President?
What a LOSER!
Your Name
Oct 6, 2012, 6:47:23 PM10/6/12
to
In comp.sys.mac.system Jolly Roger <jolly...@pobox.com> wrote:
> >
> > It will take Apple likely a year to get it to an error rate comparable
> > to Google Maps.
>
> Got some data to back up that assertion?
I did have, but the person bringing it over was told to drive off a cliff
> >
> > It will take Apple likely a year to get it to an error rate comparable
> > to Google Maps.
>
> Got some data to back up that assertion?
by their SatNav system ... ;-)
ALL mapping systems contain errors, although ye olde paper-based ones are
less of a problem because there's no electronic voice telling you to "turn
left" into a lake, through a store, or the wrong way down a one-way
street.
George Kerby
Oct 6, 2012, 6:48:06 PM10/6/12
to
On 10/6/12 4:51 PM, in article
michelle-F5099F...@news.eternal-september.org, "Michelle
Steiner" <mich...@michelle.org> wrote:
> In article <CC9608E4.90703%ghost_...@hotmail.com>,
> George Kerby <ghost_...@hotmail.com> wrote:
>
>>> Hollywood, CA isn't listed because 77 isn't a real address on Sunset.
>>> The TV show's supposed location (next to Dean Martin's bar) is
>>> actually in the 8500 block of Sunset, but I assume nobody thought
>>> "8518 West Sunset Blvd." sounded nearly as catchy as a theme song...
>>>
>>
>> I guess Michelle isn't old enough to remember that. I thought it was a
>> good parallel to finding some supposed address for another TV show she
>> mentioned based in NYC.
>
> I'm not old enough??? I'll be 70 in a few weeks, dear.
>
>>> Hollywood, CA isn't listed because 77 isn't a real address on Sunset.
>>> The TV show's supposed location (next to Dean Martin's bar) is
>>> actually in the 8500 block of Sunset, but I assume nobody thought
>>> "8518 West Sunset Blvd." sounded nearly as catchy as a theme song...
>>>
>>
>> I guess Michelle isn't old enough to remember that. I thought it was a
>> good parallel to finding some supposed address for another TV show she
>> mentioned based in NYC.
>
;-)
Congrats, dear! You do understand my hyperbole.
>
> I guess you missed the point of my posting; Google had it completely wrong.
> It's not that it couldn't find those addresses, it's that it had them
> completely in the wrong place. It had 280 W. Tremont correctly, but had
> addresses in the 270 block located somewhere in the 100 block. It also had
> the nonexistent 8033 W. Tremont at the same wrong location as the 270
> addresses.
George Kerby
Oct 6, 2012, 6:49:41 PM10/6/12
to
On 10/6/12 5:38 PM, in article
tom_stiller-A88B...@news.individual.net, "Tom Stiller"
<tom_s...@yahoo.com> wrote:
> In article <michelle-951831...@news.eternal-september.org>,
> Michelle Steiner <mich...@michelle.org> wrote:
>
>> In article <CC9607E6.90702%ghost_...@hotmail.com>,
>> George Kerby <ghost_...@hotmail.com> wrote:
>>
>>>>> Maybe you should see if Apple Maps can find 77 Sunset Strip?
>>>>
>>>> Which one: Sunrise, FL, Anderson, MO, Nags Head, NC, Elwood, NE,
>>>> Manyana, NSW, Dagsboro, DE, Jan Juc, VIC, Ocean Grove, BIC, Show Low,
>>>> AZ, or Cloudcroft, NM?
>>>
>>> Cloudcroft eh? Been there a few times and never saw that.
>>
>> Yup; both Apple and Google maps say it exists. Here's Google's map of it:
>>
>> <http://goo.gl/maps/CiXpT>
>>
>>> As a matter of fact, I was looking for Efrem Zimbalist Jr.'s office next
>>> to Deno's. We need his firm to find Barack Obama's testicles (we found
>>> the empty chair and suit already).
>>
>> He seems to have misplaced them during the debate; if he had had them, he
>> wouldn't have let Romney get away with all his lies.
>
> Nah, he was practicing rope-a-dope.
The 'dope' part is absolutely correct.
> In article <michelle-951831...@news.eternal-september.org>,
> Michelle Steiner <mich...@michelle.org> wrote:
>
>> In article <CC9607E6.90702%ghost_...@hotmail.com>,
>> George Kerby <ghost_...@hotmail.com> wrote:
>>
>>>>> Maybe you should see if Apple Maps can find 77 Sunset Strip?
>>>>
>>>> Which one: Sunrise, FL, Anderson, MO, Nags Head, NC, Elwood, NE,
>>>> Manyana, NSW, Dagsboro, DE, Jan Juc, VIC, Ocean Grove, BIC, Show Low,
>>>> AZ, or Cloudcroft, NM?
>>>
>>> Cloudcroft eh? Been there a few times and never saw that.
>>
>> Yup; both Apple and Google maps say it exists. Here's Google's map of it:
>>
>> <http://goo.gl/maps/CiXpT>
>>
>>> As a matter of fact, I was looking for Efrem Zimbalist Jr.'s office next
>>> to Deno's. We need his firm to find Barack Obama's testicles (we found
>>> the empty chair and suit already).
>>
>> He seems to have misplaced them during the debate; if he had had them, he
>> wouldn't have let Romney get away with all his lies.
>
> Nah, he was practicing rope-a-dope.
<spit>
Bingo.
Alan Browne
Oct 6, 2012, 6:50:13 PM10/6/12
to
On 2012.10.06 18:47 , Your Name wrote:
> ALL mapping systems contain errors, although ye olde paper-based ones are
> less of a problem because there's no electronic voice telling you to "turn
> left" into a lake, through a store, or the wrong way down a one-way
> street.
Never driven with my ex-wife, eh?
> ALL mapping systems contain errors, although ye olde paper-based ones are
> less of a problem because there's no electronic voice telling you to "turn
> left" into a lake, through a store, or the wrong way down a one-way
> street.
Message has been deleted
JF Mezei
Oct 6, 2012, 6:54:16 PM10/6/12
to
On 12-10-06 17:51, Michelle Steiner wrote:
> I guess you missed the point of my posting; Google had it completely wrong.
There are 3 types of errors in mapping:
> I guess you missed the point of my posting; Google had it completely wrong.
Actual map errors. Streets missing, roads existing where there is no
road, placing a railway station over water etc..
Search errors. Displaying an inaccurate location when searching for an
exact address or landmark.
Fluff errors. Not displaying the Statue of liberty in 3d, shwoing
melting cars on roads, and bridges with waterfalls etc.
In your complaint, it appears to be a search error. It doesn't appear
that the underlying street data is wrong.
In the case of the Apple maps, there are many errors that are of the
first kind, with incorrent/missing underlying map data.
(And this is where Street View is useful since you can go and verify
which building bears the address you are looking for, so as long as the
serach gets you to the right block/vicinity, you can verify accuracy of
data.
Lack of streetview on Apple maps means you can't verify this. You can't
verify there there is really a bridge across the bay etc.
JF Mezei
Oct 6, 2012, 7:00:07 PM10/6/12
to
On 12-10-06 17:56, Michelle Steiner wrote:
> <http://goo.gl/maps/CiXpT>
If I try to search for "77 Sunset Boulevard" on Google Maps (web):
77 Sunset Boulevard, Houston, TC, United States
77 Sunset Boulevard, West Hollywood, CA, United States
77 Sunset Boulevard, Beverley Hills, CA, Unites States
77 Sunset Boulevard, West Columbia, SC, United States
77 Sunset Boulevard, Los Angeles, CA, United States
In a previous serach I did get 77 Sunset Strip, Cloudcroft, NM which
your link points to. I suspectr Google remembers your searches and
suggests it when you do another search. But searching again, I got only
Sunset Boulevard suggestions.
> <http://goo.gl/maps/CiXpT>
If I try to search for "77 Sunset Boulevard" on Google Maps (web):
77 Sunset Boulevard, Houston, TC, United States
77 Sunset Boulevard, West Hollywood, CA, United States
77 Sunset Boulevard, Beverley Hills, CA, Unites States
77 Sunset Boulevard, West Columbia, SC, United States
77 Sunset Boulevard, Los Angeles, CA, United States
In a previous serach I did get 77 Sunset Strip, Cloudcroft, NM which
your link points to. I suspectr Google remembers your searches and
suggests it when you do another search. But searching again, I got only
Sunset Boulevard suggestions.
Todd Allcock
Oct 6, 2012, 6:45:12 PM10/6/12
to
any day. That show walked the fine line between timely and timeless.
"When you chase yourself from one day to the next; when you're both the
Pied Piper and the kid who digs the music- the one who follows those way-
out notes, you go where it leads you. You don't ask questions, you just
go..."
Todd Allcock
Oct 6, 2012, 7:03:26 PM10/6/12
to
At 06 Oct 2012 14:51:54 -0700 Michelle Steiner wrote:
> In article <CC9608E4.90703%ghost_...@hotmail.com>,
addresses (invalid numbers on real streets.) Often it wraps them down
into the wrong spot on the actual street. My cul de sac has nine houses,
numbered 1-9 (go figure!) but Google will place any number up to 99
somewhere on it. Numbers greater than 99 are placed there with no
number, just the street name.
In reality, it's not that big a deal. Generally you use a maps app to
find actual addresses, not fictitious ones. From a look at both Google
and Bing maps, the 380 and 379 W. Tremont addresses you first listed
don't seem to really exist either (they might if there were any homes or
business there, but there aren't any in the "300" block where Tremont
peters out, AFAIK.) You'd probably know better though, so I'll acquiesce
to your first hand knowledge.
It's pretty typical for TV shows and movies to use fake addresses just as
they use invalid phone numbers. (Law and Order's addresses are often
comical to those who live in NYC. Parallel streets will intersect, uptown
and downtown addresses are often flipped, etc.) It keeps the kooks and
weirdos from stalking locations or calling numbers mentioned in favorite
shows. Otherwise god help the poor schmuck who lives in "Spiderman's"
apartment, or whatever.
> In article <CC9608E4.90703%ghost_...@hotmail.com>,
> George Kerby <ghost_...@hotmail.com> wrote:
>
> > > Hollywood, CA isn't listed because 77 isn't a real address on Sunset.
> > > The TV show's supposed location (next to Dean Martin's bar) is
> > > actually in the 8500 block of Sunset, but I assume nobody thought
> > > "8518 West Sunset Blvd." sounded nearly as catchy as a theme song...
> > >
> >
> > I guess Michelle isn't old enough to remember that. I thought it was
a
> > good parallel to finding some supposed address for another TV show
she
> > mentioned based in NYC.
>
>
> > > Hollywood, CA isn't listed because 77 isn't a real address on Sunset.
> > > The TV show's supposed location (next to Dean Martin's bar) is
> > > actually in the 8500 block of Sunset, but I assume nobody thought
> > > "8518 West Sunset Blvd." sounded nearly as catchy as a theme song...
> > >
> >
> > I guess Michelle isn't old enough to remember that. I thought it was
a
> > good parallel to finding some supposed address for another TV show
she
> > mentioned based in NYC.
>
> I'm not old enough??? I'll be 70 in a few weeks, dear.
>
>
> I guess you missed the point of my posting; Google had it completely
wrong.
wrong.
> It's not that it couldn't find those addresses, it's that it had them
> completely in the wrong place. It had 280 W. Tremont correctly, but
had
> addresses in the 270 block located somewhere in the 100 block. It also
had
> the nonexistent 8033 W. Tremont at the same wrong location as the 270
> addresses.
That seems to be pretty consistent with Google's handling of fictitious
> completely in the wrong place. It had 280 W. Tremont correctly, but
had
> addresses in the 270 block located somewhere in the 100 block. It also
had
> the nonexistent 8033 W. Tremont at the same wrong location as the 270
> addresses.
addresses (invalid numbers on real streets.) Often it wraps them down
into the wrong spot on the actual street. My cul de sac has nine houses,
numbered 1-9 (go figure!) but Google will place any number up to 99
somewhere on it. Numbers greater than 99 are placed there with no
number, just the street name.
In reality, it's not that big a deal. Generally you use a maps app to
find actual addresses, not fictitious ones. From a look at both Google
and Bing maps, the 380 and 379 W. Tremont addresses you first listed
don't seem to really exist either (they might if there were any homes or
business there, but there aren't any in the "300" block where Tremont
peters out, AFAIK.) You'd probably know better though, so I'll acquiesce
to your first hand knowledge.
It's pretty typical for TV shows and movies to use fake addresses just as
they use invalid phone numbers. (Law and Order's addresses are often
comical to those who live in NYC. Parallel streets will intersect, uptown
and downtown addresses are often flipped, etc.) It keeps the kooks and
weirdos from stalking locations or calling numbers mentioned in favorite
shows. Otherwise god help the poor schmuck who lives in "Spiderman's"
apartment, or whatever.
Message has been deleted
Message has been deleted
Your Name
Oct 6, 2012, 7:19:07 PM10/6/12
to
In article <ppKdnQkhj-k4KO3N...@giganews.com>, Alan Browne
most people sensibly don't choose to have included. ;-)
<alan....@FreelunchVideotron.ca> wrote:
> On 2012.10.06 18:47 , Your Name wrote:
> >
> > ALL mapping systems contain errors, although ye olde paper-based
> > ones are less of a problem because there's no electronic voice
> > telling you to "turn left" into a lake, through a store, or the
> > wrong way down a one-way street.
>
> Never driven with my ex-wife, eh?
That's not the map's fault ... it's the fault of the optional extra, that
> On 2012.10.06 18:47 , Your Name wrote:
> >
> > ALL mapping systems contain errors, although ye olde paper-based
> > ones are less of a problem because there's no electronic voice
> > telling you to "turn left" into a lake, through a store, or the
> > wrong way down a one-way street.
>
> Never driven with my ex-wife, eh?
most people sensibly don't choose to have included. ;-)
JF Mezei
Oct 6, 2012, 7:20:07 PM10/6/12
to
On 12-10-06 19:13, Michelle Steiner wrote:
> Street view is old data that can be totally wrong. The bridge could have
> been demolished since the pictures were taken. Besides, something as large
> as a bridge would show up in a satellite photo.
But barriers don't. There is a perimeter road around Vancouver airport.
Shown on maps. But with street view, you can see that it becomes off
limits to the public due to barriers past a certain point.
JF Mezei
Oct 6, 2012, 7:22:48 PM10/6/12
to
On 12-10-06 19:14, Michelle Steiner wrote:
> Rmoney may have won the debate, but in doing so, he showed what a dishonest
> person he is. But Republicans consider honesty to be a weakness, right?
I an puzzled why there appears to be consensus that he won. My opinion
is that Obama won on content, but Romney won on delivery.
Obama would have needed a Red Bull before the debate to fire him up a
bit to raise his charisma.
> Rmoney may have won the debate, but in doing so, he showed what a dishonest
> person he is. But Republicans consider honesty to be a weakness, right?
I an puzzled why there appears to be consensus that he won. My opinion
is that Obama won on content, but Romney won on delivery.
Obama would have needed a Red Bull before the debate to fire him up a
bit to raise his charisma.
Message has been deleted
Message has been deleted
Message has been deleted
JF Mezei
Oct 6, 2012, 8:15:34 PM10/6/12
to
On 12-10-06 19:44, Michelle Steiner wrote:
>> But barriers don't. There is a perimeter road around Vancouver airport.
>> Shown on maps. But with street view, you can see that it becomes off
>> limits to the public due to barriers past a certain point.
>
> The satellite view doesn't show the barriers?
>> But barriers don't. There is a perimeter road around Vancouver airport.
>> Shown on maps. But with street view, you can see that it becomes off
>> limits to the public due to barriers past a certain point.
>
Nop. They are just fences/gates across the road that separate landside
from airside.
I believe the road was once open to public to the western edge of
vancouver airort (but not across runways) but not anymore. This may
explain why maps still show the road.
This is why street view is useful. Just bringing the orgne person icon
reveals that street view stops at that gate.
> https://maps.google.ca/maps?q=Vancouver+International,+Grant+McConachie+Way,+Richmond&hl=en&ll=49.179031,-123.17988&spn=0.005618,0.009645&sll=53.796105,-68.44248&sspn=41.983351,79.013672&oq=vancouver+airpor&t=h&hq=Vancouver+International,+Grant+McConachie+Way,+Richmond&z=17
Try to put the street view icon over Inglis Dr. You see coverage ends
before the bend. If you look carefully at the westernmost frame in
street view you can see a gate across the road (not obvious).
But the fact that the google car stopped where it did is an indication
it was the end of public road.
(and I confirmed with locals the road no longer was opened. After the
bend is the coast guard station (you can see a hovercraft parked there
in both satellite and if you look carefully in the street view)
As a cyclist, I tend to push the likits of mapping by wanting to take
unusual roads, often to avoid the usual busy ones.
Similarly, street view gives me road conditions (paved shoulder or not,
how wide the lane is on a bridge, whether the sidewalk is
useable/accessible. Often you need to conbine with satellite imagery,
but they complement each other very well.
Usually, I will spend the time at home to prepare the route on a real
computer. But I still need to know that in case of unplanned detours
etc, I could still do the same on my fancy iPhone.
Message has been deleted
Message has been deleted
Message has been deleted
Message has been deleted
JF Mezei
Oct 6, 2012, 8:53:36 PM10/6/12
to
On 12-10-06 20:38, Lewis wrote:
> Apple is getting data from millions and millions of iOS 6 users.
How can they process millions of reports of errors in their maps ? do
they have enough employees to process each individual error and correct
their maps ?
There are mapping interpretation errors that Apple may be able to fix by
repairing their mapping server software. Stuff like marking train
stations as parks may also be fixable by software once they figure out
how to correctly interpret the raw dat and apply the right texture.
Search engine errors will be gradually be fixed as they fine tune their
search logic.
But missing roads, roads that don't exist etc are part of the core data
and that will take a long time to fix because they really need to either
street view that counry, or wait for individual reports that are precise
enough to act on.
If you are in a building at 1 infinite loop, and get some swedish
customer complaint about there being an error in Stockholm bay, how do
you first know what the error is, and how can you verify it ?
I suspect vast majority of error reports are too vague to be acted upon.
(which is why Is suggested errors should be reported on a real computer
with a real web site, instead of from an iPhone.
> Apple is getting data from millions and millions of iOS 6 users.
How can they process millions of reports of errors in their maps ? do
they have enough employees to process each individual error and correct
their maps ?
There are mapping interpretation errors that Apple may be able to fix by
repairing their mapping server software. Stuff like marking train
stations as parks may also be fixable by software once they figure out
how to correctly interpret the raw dat and apply the right texture.
Search engine errors will be gradually be fixed as they fine tune their
search logic.
But missing roads, roads that don't exist etc are part of the core data
and that will take a long time to fix because they really need to either
street view that counry, or wait for individual reports that are precise
enough to act on.
If you are in a building at 1 infinite loop, and get some swedish
customer complaint about there being an error in Stockholm bay, how do
you first know what the error is, and how can you verify it ?
I suspect vast majority of error reports are too vague to be acted upon.
(which is why Is suggested errors should be reported on a real computer
with a real web site, instead of from an iPhone.
Wes Groleau
Oct 6, 2012, 9:17:42 PM10/6/12
to
> Alan Browne<alan....@FreelunchVideotron.ca> wrote:
>> >I have other reasons to prefer Google Maps, one being a month worth of
>> >recording tracks of trails in the woods (two locations) and then
>> >painstakingly entering them in Google Map Maker. Google Maps directions
>> >will even plot the best track through the wood trail network when in
>> >"pedestrian" mode... (I don't 'need' that, but it's cool to show people).
Google Maps is not aware of the existence of anything that's not a
street, road, or trail. If there is a fence along a street, and I stand
next to it, GM will assume I am ON that street and give directions
accordingly.
GM is also pitifully screwed up about hike/bike trails. Even when it
knows they are there, it will often in pedestrian or bike mode plot a
much longer route along streets.
One time I was ON the bike path and GM detected that. But instead of
plotting the route to the destination (also on the path), it asked me to
go a half-mail the opposite direction to get on a street. (I knew the
route, just wanted GM to tell me how far)
--
Wes Groleau
Always listen to experts. They'll tell you
what can't be done and why. Then do it.
— Robert A. Heinlein
Wes Groleau
Oct 6, 2012, 9:19:54 PM10/6/12
to
On 10-06-2012 20:38, Lewis wrote:
> In message <50707ed7$0$1236$c3e8da3$9f40...@news.astraweb.com>
> JF Mezei <jfmezei...@vaxination.ca> wrote:
>> On 12-10-06 12:13, Michelle Steiner wrote:
>
>>> Whatever. If Maps is the most important part of the OS for you, I can
>>> understand your concern, but the flaws in the database are rapidly being
>>> fixed, and as I've shown, Google's Maps data are not perfect.
>
>> Michelle, it is not realistic for Apple to fix flaws in a matter of
>> weeks. For one thing, they do not have the army of people to fix them,
>> and even with Google's 7000 mapping employees, we are talking about
>> years, not weeks.
the app would overnight actually become as useless as folks are claiming
it already is.
And the next day, the spammers would realize what an opportunity they've
got.
--
Wes Groleau
Heroes, Heritage, and History
http://UniGen.us/webtrees
> In message <50707ed7$0$1236$c3e8da3$9f40...@news.astraweb.com>
> JF Mezei <jfmezei...@vaxination.ca> wrote:
>> On 12-10-06 12:13, Michelle Steiner wrote:
>
>>> Whatever. If Maps is the most important part of the OS for you, I can
>>> understand your concern, but the flaws in the database are rapidly being
>>> fixed, and as I've shown, Google's Maps data are not perfect.
>
>> Michelle, it is not realistic for Apple to fix flaws in a matter of
>> weeks. For one thing, they do not have the army of people to fix them,
>> and even with Google's 7000 mapping employees, we are talking about
>> years, not weeks.
>
> Apple is getting data from millions and millions of iOS 6 users.
Irrelevant. If they automatically put in everything the clueless send,
> Apple is getting data from millions and millions of iOS 6 users.
the app would overnight actually become as useless as folks are claiming
it already is.
And the next day, the spammers would realize what an opportunity they've
got.
--
Wes Groleau
Heroes, Heritage, and History
http://UniGen.us/webtrees
Message has been deleted
bi...@mix.com
Oct 6, 2012, 10:06:57 PM10/6/12
to
In comp.sys.mac.system Alan Browne <alan....@freelunchvideotron.ca> wrote:
> It will take Apple likely a year to get it to an error rate comparable
> to Google Maps.
Man, you are one optimistic guy. Heh.
The reality of this situation -
http://blog.telemapics.com/?p=399
| Google Maps announces a 400 year advantage over Apple Maps
This is an extensive analysis, ending with some recommendations.
Some bonus reading -
http://www.theatlantic.com/technology/archive/2012/09/google-maps/261913/
| How Google Builds Its Maps - and What It Means for the Future of Everything
Billy Y..
--
sub #'9+1 ,r0 ; convert ascii byte
add #9.+1 ,r0 ; to an integer
bcc 20$ ; not a number
> It will take Apple likely a year to get it to an error rate comparable
> to Google Maps.
Man, you are one optimistic guy. Heh.
The reality of this situation -
http://blog.telemapics.com/?p=399
| Google Maps announces a 400 year advantage over Apple Maps
This is an extensive analysis, ending with some recommendations.
Some bonus reading -
http://www.theatlantic.com/technology/archive/2012/09/google-maps/261913/
| How Google Builds Its Maps - and What It Means for the Future of Everything
Billy Y..
--
sub #'9+1 ,r0 ; convert ascii byte
add #9.+1 ,r0 ; to an integer
bcc 20$ ; not a number
Message has been deleted
Message has been deleted
nospam
Oct 6, 2012, 10:19:41 PM10/6/12
to
In article <michelle-561264...@news.eternal-september.org>,
it's from a cartographer, and he makes some excellent points about how
far behind apple's maps are.
Michelle Steiner <mich...@michelle.org> wrote:
> > The reality of this situation -
> >
> > http://blog.telemapics.com/?p=399
> >
> > | Google Maps announces a 400 year advantage over Apple Maps
>
> Google announces it, so it must be true.
> > The reality of this situation -
> >
> > http://blog.telemapics.com/?p=399
> >
> > | Google Maps announces a 400 year advantage over Apple Maps
>
it's from a cartographer, and he makes some excellent points about how
far behind apple's maps are.
Wayne Marsh
Oct 6, 2012, 10:20:22 PM10/6/12
to
In article <Dp6dnWkCm9gN1O3N...@giganews.com>,
Alan Browne <alan....@FreelunchVideotron.ca> wrote:
> I haven't gotten a bum steer from GMaps to date. I have gotten routings
> that were not optimal, but they weren't grossly off.
Google maps routed me through a cemetery once. It told me to enter
through a gate that is opened only on Memorial Day, then "proceed on
unnamed street for 0.1 mile, turn right onto unnamed street for 0.1
mile, ..." It wasn't technically wrong, but definitely "not optimal."
--
Wayne Marsh Minneapolis, Minnesota, USA
wayne...@mac.com
Alan Browne <alan....@FreelunchVideotron.ca> wrote:
> I haven't gotten a bum steer from GMaps to date. I have gotten routings
> that were not optimal, but they weren't grossly off.
Google maps routed me through a cemetery once. It told me to enter
through a gate that is opened only on Memorial Day, then "proceed on
unnamed street for 0.1 mile, turn right onto unnamed street for 0.1
mile, ..." It wasn't technically wrong, but definitely "not optimal."
--
Wayne Marsh Minneapolis, Minnesota, USA
wayne...@mac.com
Message has been deleted
Message has been deleted
nospam
Oct 6, 2012, 10:50:19 PM10/6/12
to
In article <michelle-87AF2F...@news.eternal-september.org>,
> Then why is the subject, "Google Maps announces..."?
i don't know, i didn't write it.
here's the guy who wrote it, why don't you email him and ask.
<http://blog.telemapics.com/?page_id=104>
contact info:
<http://www.telemapics.com/Contact%20Us.htm>
i don't know, i didn't write it.
here's the guy who wrote it, why don't you email him and ask.
<http://blog.telemapics.com/?page_id=104>
contact info:
<http://www.telemapics.com/Contact%20Us.htm>
Jolly Roger
Oct 6, 2012, 10:55:54 PM10/6/12
to
In article <zrGdncpT8PN87O3N...@giganews.com>,
Alan Browne <alan....@FreelunchVideotron.ca> wrote:
> On 2012.10.06 13:47 , Jolly Roger wrote:
> > In article <t5qdnReyA-dx_e3N...@giganews.com>,
>
> It's my opinion.
I see. Thanks.
--
Send responses to the relevant news group rather than email to me.
E-mail sent to this address may be devoured by my very hungry SPAM
filter. Due to Google's refusal to prevent spammers from posting
messages through their servers, I often ignore posts from Google
Groups. Use a real news client if you want me to see your posts.
JR
Alan Browne <alan....@FreelunchVideotron.ca> wrote:
> On 2012.10.06 13:47 , Jolly Roger wrote:
> > In article <t5qdnReyA-dx_e3N...@giganews.com>,
> > Alan Browne <alan....@FreelunchVideotron.ca> wrote:
> >
> >> It will take Apple likely a year to get it to an error rate comparable
> >> to Google Maps.
> >
> > Got some data to back up that assertion?
> >
> >> It will take Apple likely a year to get it to an error rate comparable
> >> to Google Maps.
> >
>
> It's my opinion.
I see. Thanks.
--
Send responses to the relevant news group rather than email to me.
E-mail sent to this address may be devoured by my very hungry SPAM
filter. Due to Google's refusal to prevent spammers from posting
messages through their servers, I often ignore posts from Google
Groups. Use a real news client if you want me to see your posts.
JR
Davoud
Oct 6, 2012, 11:06:19 PM10/6/12
to
Alan Browne:
entirely on alleys. Most were paved, a few were two dirt ruts with
grass in the middle. On the far end of town it dumped me onto the paved
road it should have had me on the entire time. Sub-optimal result.
In that same New Jersey it took me on a short-cut that led me down a
dead-end street that ended with a low, neatly-trimmed hedge growing
across it. On the other side of the hedge, perhaps two meters distant,
was the Delaware river and a nice view of the Philadelphia skyline.
Trouble was, I was supposed to be heading to Rutgers and then up 287N
to Suffern, NY. That excursion cost me an hour. Sub-optimal result.
A third time, still in Jersey, the four-lane highway Google maps put me
on narrowed to two lanes and then to 1-1/2 lanes and then it became a
potholed 1-1/2 lanes. I pulled into a bodega where no English was
spoken My Spanish does not extend to detailed instructions. Shortly,
however, an English-speaking deliveryman came in to buy something and I
told him where I wanted to go. He said yes, this is the right road.
Then he dryly asked, "Er, did you want to be there today?" "Yes, I
rather did." In that case go back the way you came and..." Soon enough
I was on an Interstate heading for my destination. Sub-optimal result.
--
I agree with almost everything that you have said and almost everything that
you will say in your entire life.
usenet *at* davidillig dawt cawm
> > I haven't gotten a bum steer from GMaps to date. I have gotten routings
> > that were not optimal, but they weren't grossly off.
Wayne Marsh:
> > that were not optimal, but they weren't grossly off.
> Google maps routed me through a cemetery once. It told me to enter
> through a gate that is opened only on Memorial Day, then "proceed on
> unnamed street for 0.1 mile, turn right onto unnamed street for 0.1
> mile, ..." It wasn't technically wrong, but definitely "not optimal."
Google maps succeeded in guiding me through a small town in New Jersey
> through a gate that is opened only on Memorial Day, then "proceed on
> unnamed street for 0.1 mile, turn right onto unnamed street for 0.1
> mile, ..." It wasn't technically wrong, but definitely "not optimal."
entirely on alleys. Most were paved, a few were two dirt ruts with
grass in the middle. On the far end of town it dumped me onto the paved
road it should have had me on the entire time. Sub-optimal result.
In that same New Jersey it took me on a short-cut that led me down a
dead-end street that ended with a low, neatly-trimmed hedge growing
across it. On the other side of the hedge, perhaps two meters distant,
was the Delaware river and a nice view of the Philadelphia skyline.
Trouble was, I was supposed to be heading to Rutgers and then up 287N
to Suffern, NY. That excursion cost me an hour. Sub-optimal result.
A third time, still in Jersey, the four-lane highway Google maps put me
on narrowed to two lanes and then to 1-1/2 lanes and then it became a
potholed 1-1/2 lanes. I pulled into a bodega where no English was
spoken My Spanish does not extend to detailed instructions. Shortly,
however, an English-speaking deliveryman came in to buy something and I
told him where I wanted to go. He said yes, this is the right road.
Then he dryly asked, "Er, did you want to be there today?" "Yes, I
rather did." In that case go back the way you came and..." Soon enough
I was on an Interstate heading for my destination. Sub-optimal result.
--
I agree with almost everything that you have said and almost everything that
you will say in your entire life.
usenet *at* davidillig dawt cawm
JF Mezei
Oct 7, 2012, 1:41:31 AM10/7/12
to
On 12-10-06 21:21, Michelle Steiner wrote:
> Have you bothered to look into the error-reporting mechanism that's built
> into Apple's maps app?
I am prevented from doing so because Apple has not published a web
interface to its maps, and its maps are not available as a separate app
for IOS 5 so we can't test drive it.
> Have you bothered to look into the error-reporting mechanism that's built
> into Apple's maps app?
I am prevented from doing so because Apple has not published a web
interface to its maps, and its maps are not available as a separate app
for IOS 5 so we can't test drive it.
JF Mezei
Oct 7, 2012, 1:56:20 AM10/7/12
to
>> http://blog.telemapics.com/?p=399
There is one aspect with which I disagree in that otherwise very good
description of the situation. Apple knew about the problems. There is no
way they wouldn't have known.
When they bought those mapping firms, they may not have had sufficient
employes to correct mapping mistakes from around the would, but that
staff SHOULD have been able to tell upper management that the project
would take much longer and releasing it now would make it a joke.
We may have to wait for Tim Cook's biography to know how much he knew
about the map problems and whether Jobs had committed Apple beyond point
of no return and they were forced to release the Maps knowing it was not
ready.
If the mapping staff did not have the guts to tell upper management that
their product wasn't ready, then there is a bigger problem at Apple.
JF Mezei
Oct 7, 2012, 1:58:22 AM10/7/12
to
On 12-10-06 22:44, Michelle Steiner wrote:
> fine. (Well, I wouldn't because I have a clean-air license plate that
> allows me to drive in the HOV lane during HOV hours, but Google Maps
> doesn't know that.)
Now they do ! They know you made that post and will add this to your
profile that is used when generating maps for you :-) :-) :-)
The power/dangers of data wharehousing capabilities such as Google are
huge !!!
> fine. (Well, I wouldn't because I have a clean-air license plate that
> allows me to drive in the HOV lane during HOV hours, but Google Maps
> doesn't know that.)
Now they do ! They know you made that post and will add this to your
profile that is used when generating maps for you :-) :-) :-)
The power/dangers of data wharehousing capabilities such as Google are
huge !!!
JF Mezei
Oct 7, 2012, 3:19:26 AM10/7/12
to
On 12-10-06 23:06, Davoud wrote:
> Then he dryly asked, "Er, did you want to be there today?" "Yes, I
> rather did." In that case go back the way you came and..." Soon enough
> I was on an Interstate heading for my destination. Sub-optimal result.
When asking Mr Google for directions, you need to make sure you specify
> Then he dryly asked, "Er, did you want to be there today?" "Yes, I
> rather did." In that case go back the way you came and..." Soon enough
> I was on an Interstate heading for my destination. Sub-optimal result.
the right options. If you ask for pedestrian directions, it will give
you stuff that is not usable by car such as walking on a pedestrian path
across bushes. (it all depends on how much the municipalities furnish
google in terms of bike and pedestrian paths)
There may be some options leftover from a previous search which affect
your current search.
One problem with the web interface and that those options are hidden by
default so it may not be obvious.
Alan Browne
Oct 7, 2012, 9:43:39 AM10/7/12
to
On 2012.10.06 20:29 , Lewis wrote:
> In message <t5qdnReyA-dx_e3N...@giganews.com>
Of course it does as Google Map App is not included with iOS 6 and Apple
Maps definitely do not have those trail networks.
>
>> BTW: It's all very nice Michelle that you're sifting through the small,
>> small number of Google Maps errors to diminish the Apple Map fiasco but
>> it doesn't stick.
>
> It's not a small number though.
Relatively speaking.
--
"There were, unfortunately, no great principles on which parties
were divided – politics became a mere struggle for office."
-Sir John A. Macdonald
> In message <t5qdnReyA-dx_e3N...@giganews.com>
> Alan Browne <alan....@FreelunchVideotron.ca> wrote:
>> I have other reasons to prefer Google Maps, one being a month worth of
>> recording tracks of trails in the woods (two locations) and then
>> painstakingly entering them in Google Map Maker. Google Maps directions
>> will even plot the best track through the wood trail network when in
>> "pedestrian" mode... (I don't 'need' that, but it's cool to show people).
>
> Which has absolutely nothing to do with iOS 5 versus 6, does it?
>> I have other reasons to prefer Google Maps, one being a month worth of
>> recording tracks of trails in the woods (two locations) and then
>> painstakingly entering them in Google Map Maker. Google Maps directions
>> will even plot the best track through the wood trail network when in
>> "pedestrian" mode... (I don't 'need' that, but it's cool to show people).
>
Of course it does as Google Map App is not included with iOS 6 and Apple
Maps definitely do not have those trail networks.
>
>> BTW: It's all very nice Michelle that you're sifting through the small,
>> small number of Google Maps errors to diminish the Apple Map fiasco but
>> it doesn't stick.
>
> It's not a small number though.
Relatively speaking.
--
"There were, unfortunately, no great principles on which parties
were divided – politics became a mere struggle for office."
-Sir John A. Macdonald
Alan Browne
Oct 7, 2012, 9:51:54 AM10/7/12
to
On 2012.10.06 21:17 , Wes Groleau wrote:
>
>> Alan Browne<alan....@FreelunchVideotron.ca> wrote:
>>> >I have other reasons to prefer Google Maps, one being a month worth of
>>> >recording tracks of trails in the woods (two locations) and then
>>> >painstakingly entering them in Google Map Maker. Google Maps
>>> directions
>>> >will even plot the best track through the wood trail network when in
>>> >"pedestrian" mode... (I don't 'need' that, but it's cool to show
>>> people).
>
> Google Maps is not aware of the existence of anything that's not a
> street, road, or trail. If there is a fence along a street, and I stand
> next to it, GM will assume I am ON that street and give directions
> accordingly.
>
> GM is also pitifully screwed up about hike/bike trails. Even when it
> knows they are there, it will often in pedestrian or bike mode plot a
> much longer route along streets.
>
> One time I was ON the bike path and GM detected that. But instead of
> plotting the route to the destination (also on the path), it asked me to
> go a half-mail the opposite direction to get on a street. (I knew the
> route, just wanted GM to tell me how far)
Since Apple Map App has no idea about the existence of the trails I put
>
>> Alan Browne<alan....@FreelunchVideotron.ca> wrote:
>>> >I have other reasons to prefer Google Maps, one being a month worth of
>>> >recording tracks of trails in the woods (two locations) and then
>>> >painstakingly entering them in Google Map Maker. Google Maps
>>> directions
>>> >will even plot the best track through the wood trail network when in
>>> >"pedestrian" mode... (I don't 'need' that, but it's cool to show
>>> people).
>
> Google Maps is not aware of the existence of anything that's not a
> street, road, or trail. If there is a fence along a street, and I stand
> next to it, GM will assume I am ON that street and give directions
> accordingly.
>
> GM is also pitifully screwed up about hike/bike trails. Even when it
> knows they are there, it will often in pedestrian or bike mode plot a
> much longer route along streets.
>
> One time I was ON the bike path and GM detected that. But instead of
> plotting the route to the destination (also on the path), it asked me to
> go a half-mail the opposite direction to get on a street. (I knew the
> route, just wanted GM to tell me how far)
in to Google Maps ( via http://www.google.com/mapmaker ) it can do
nothing about them - not even show them. At the time I did them some
(on another forum) urged me to do them in Open Maps but I chose to do
them in Google Maps. I may yet repeat the exercise for Open Maps if I
find the time and the urge.
As to GM's reluctance to take a path there is definitely one reason and
likely another:
1. Many of the paths, street corrections, features, etc. in Google Maps
are entered by volunteers (such as myself). They are sometimes poorly
terminated or joined to streets and they are often poorly defined as to
type. This can cause the guidance algorithms to not select a path.
2. The algorithms may have hard to tune criteria for choosing a path
over a street. Do all pedestrians necessarily want the path? I suppose
options could be added to force shortest pedestrian routes. Or force
them during daylight hours, but not at night, etc. Or in the winter
when the paths may not be open... etc.
Alan Browne
Oct 7, 2012, 10:04:46 AM10/7/12
to
On 2012.10.06 22:06 , bi...@MIX.COM wrote:
> In comp.sys.mac.system Alan Browne <alan....@freelunchvideotron.ca> wrote:
>
>> It will take Apple likely a year to get it to an error rate comparable
>> to Google Maps.
>
> Man, you are one optimistic guy. Heh.
>
> The reality of this situation -
>
> http://blog.telemapics.com/?p=399
>
> | Google Maps announces a 400 year advantage over Apple Maps
A bold assertion. However one assertion in there matches my own opinion
> In comp.sys.mac.system Alan Browne <alan....@freelunchvideotron.ca> wrote:
>
>> It will take Apple likely a year to get it to an error rate comparable
>> to Google Maps.
>
> Man, you are one optimistic guy. Heh.
>
> The reality of this situation -
>
> http://blog.telemapics.com/?p=399
>
> | Google Maps announces a 400 year advantage over Apple Maps
stated earlier in another thread.
'... overall view of the companies that it (Apple) has assembled to
create its application is that they are, as a whole, rated
“C-grade” suppliers.'
That is exactly as I said earlier. Apple selected weak and waning
TomTom (and others) over the strength of Google.
> http://www.theatlantic.com/technology/archive/2012/09/google-maps/261913/
Very interesting article. I'm sure it's causing some interesting
discussions in Cupertino.
Alan Browne
Oct 7, 2012, 10:05:56 AM10/7/12
to
On 2012.10.06 22:14 , Michelle Steiner wrote:
interesting and revealing reading. You can paper it over with one
condescension but blinders are not helping anyone - least of all Apple.
> In article <k4qo41$dr5$1...@reader1.panix.com>, bi...@MIX.COM wrote:
>
>> The reality of this situation -
>>
>> http://blog.telemapics.com/?p=399
>>
>> | Google Maps announces a 400 year advantage over Apple Maps
>
>
>> The reality of this situation -
>>
>> http://blog.telemapics.com/?p=399
>>
>> | Google Maps announces a 400 year advantage over Apple Maps
>
> Google announces it, so it must be true.
That assertion may be BS - but much of the rest of the two articles is
interesting and revealing reading. You can paper it over with one
condescension but blinders are not helping anyone - least of all Apple.
Alan Browne
Oct 7, 2012, 10:10:47 AM10/7/12
to
On 2012.10.06 20:38 , Lewis wrote:
> In message <50707ed7$0$1236$c3e8da3$9f40...@news.astraweb.com>
> JF Mezei <jfmezei...@vaxination.ca> wrote:
>> On 12-10-06 12:13, Michelle Steiner wrote:
>
>>> Whatever. If Maps is the most important part of the OS for you, I can
>>> understand your concern, but the flaws in the database are rapidly being
>>> fixed, and as I've shown, Google's Maps data are not perfect.
>
>> Michelle, it is not realistic for Apple to fix flaws in a matter of
>> weeks. For one thing, they do not have the army of people to fix them,
>> and even with Google's 7000 mapping employees, we are talking about
>> years, not weeks.
>
> Apple is getting data from millions and millions of iOS 6 users.
Oh my! Is that like the Chinese curse: "May your life be interesting."
> In message <50707ed7$0$1236$c3e8da3$9f40...@news.astraweb.com>
> JF Mezei <jfmezei...@vaxination.ca> wrote:
>> On 12-10-06 12:13, Michelle Steiner wrote:
>
>>> Whatever. If Maps is the most important part of the OS for you, I can
>>> understand your concern, but the flaws in the database are rapidly being
>>> fixed, and as I've shown, Google's Maps data are not perfect.
>
>> Michelle, it is not realistic for Apple to fix flaws in a matter of
>> weeks. For one thing, they do not have the army of people to fix them,
>> and even with Google's 7000 mapping employees, we are talking about
>> years, not weeks.
>
> Apple is getting data from millions and millions of iOS 6 users.
That's an awful lot of data to merge into a database that has problems.
And just "how" do the millions send the data to Apple? Voluntarily?
Automagically? How are the millions of data points vetted? How are
information coincidences weighted, selected, rejected?
Read this article that bi...@MIX.COM posted for an idea of what Apple
seem not to have and what Google have in spades:
http://www.theatlantic.com/technology/archive/2012/09/google-maps/261913/
Alan Browne
Oct 7, 2012, 10:11:34 AM10/7/12
to
On 2012.10.06 21:21 , Michelle Steiner wrote:
> In article <5070d292$0$57777$c3e8da3$c8b7...@news.astraweb.com>,
> In article <5070d292$0$57777$c3e8da3$c8b7...@news.astraweb.com>,
> JF Mezei <jfmezei...@vaxination.ca> wrote:
>
>> If you are in a building at 1 infinite loop, and get some swedish
>> customer complaint about there being an error in Stockholm bay, how do
>> you first know what the error is, and how can you verify it ?
>>
>> I suspect vast majority of error reports are too vague to be acted upon.
>> (which is why Is suggested errors should be reported on a real computer
>> with a real web site, instead of from an iPhone.
>
>
>> If you are in a building at 1 infinite loop, and get some swedish
>> customer complaint about there being an error in Stockholm bay, how do
>> you first know what the error is, and how can you verify it ?
>>
>> I suspect vast majority of error reports are too vague to be acted upon.
>> (which is why Is suggested errors should be reported on a real computer
>> with a real web site, instead of from an iPhone.
>
> Have you bothered to look into the error-reporting mechanism that's built
> into Apple's maps app?
Want to bet that it's a pale nothing compared to:
> into Apple's maps app?
Alan Browne
Oct 7, 2012, 10:14:24 AM10/7/12
to
Alan Browne
Oct 7, 2012, 10:23:28 AM10/7/12
to
On 2012.10.06 20:31 , Lewis wrote:
> The first*one*, Apple bought existing companies, as well as data from
> TomTom that has been around at least as long as Google's been working on
> mapping.
I have a TomTom in my car. It won't accept the name of a major
boulevard in for an address go to. But when I get there it tells me
that I'm on that boulevard.
It guides me off of major highways on to secondaries then back to the
highway further down the road.
And from secondaries to dirt roads ... and back on again.
The other day it wanted to send me via a large town's main streets. The
stops and lights would have cost me 30 minutes had I followed it. By
simply staying on the boul. I was on I shortly was on a highway.
On that same trip, it wanted me to take numerous left turns that were
not allowed (Google maps knows about no-left-turns where TomTom often
fails).
TomTom is shit and its sales have been down over the last 2 years.
Apple surely made a "smart deal" and now are paying the price for it.
(I only keep the TomTom because it is more useful than not and I want to
wring the value out of it before replacing it).
> The first*one*, Apple bought existing companies, as well as data from
> TomTom that has been around at least as long as Google's been working on
> mapping.
I have a TomTom in my car. It won't accept the name of a major
boulevard in for an address go to. But when I get there it tells me
that I'm on that boulevard.
It guides me off of major highways on to secondaries then back to the
highway further down the road.
And from secondaries to dirt roads ... and back on again.
The other day it wanted to send me via a large town's main streets. The
stops and lights would have cost me 30 minutes had I followed it. By
simply staying on the boul. I was on I shortly was on a highway.
On that same trip, it wanted me to take numerous left turns that were
not allowed (Google maps knows about no-left-turns where TomTom often
fails).
TomTom is shit and its sales have been down over the last 2 years.
Apple surely made a "smart deal" and now are paying the price for it.
(I only keep the TomTom because it is more useful than not and I want to
wring the value out of it before replacing it).
News
Oct 7, 2012, 10:33:30 AM10/7/12
to
On 10/7/2012 10:23 AM, Alan Browne wrote:
> On 2012.10.06 20:31 , Lewis wrote:
>> The first*one*, Apple bought existing companies, as well as data from
>> TomTom that has been around at least as long as Google's been working on
>> mapping.
>
> I have a TomTom in my car. It won't accept the name of a major
> boulevard in for an address go to. But when I get there it tells me
> that I'm on that boulevard.
>
> It guides me off of major highways on to secondaries then back to the
> highway further down the road.
>
> And from secondaries to dirt roads ... and back on again.
>
> The other day it wanted to send me via a large town's main streets. The
> stops and lights would have cost me 30 minutes had I followed it. By
> simply staying on the boul. I was on I shortly was on a highway.
>
> On that same trip, it wanted me to take numerous left turns that were
> not allowed (Google maps knows about no-left-turns where TomTom often
> fails).
>
> TomTom is shit and its sales have been down over the last 2 years. Apple
> surely made a "smart deal" and now are paying the price for it.
>
> (I only keep the TomTom because it is more useful than not and I want to
> wring the value out of it before replacing it).
>
TomTom has been useless for a lot longer than two years. The HP iPaq
> On 2012.10.06 20:31 , Lewis wrote:
>> The first*one*, Apple bought existing companies, as well as data from
>> TomTom that has been around at least as long as Google's been working on
>> mapping.
>
> I have a TomTom in my car. It won't accept the name of a major
> boulevard in for an address go to. But when I get there it tells me
> that I'm on that boulevard.
>
> It guides me off of major highways on to secondaries then back to the
> highway further down the road.
>
> And from secondaries to dirt roads ... and back on again.
>
> The other day it wanted to send me via a large town's main streets. The
> stops and lights would have cost me 30 minutes had I followed it. By
> simply staying on the boul. I was on I shortly was on a highway.
>
> On that same trip, it wanted me to take numerous left turns that were
> not allowed (Google maps knows about no-left-turns where TomTom often
> fails).
>
> TomTom is shit and its sales have been down over the last 2 years. Apple
> surely made a "smart deal" and now are paying the price for it.
>
> (I only keep the TomTom because it is more useful than not and I want to
> wring the value out of it before replacing it).
>
hw6500 came with a TomTom offer, which was immediately ditched for
working Mapopolis nav software and maps.
George Kerby
Oct 7, 2012, 10:54:08 AM10/7/12
to
On 10/6/12 5:53 PM, in article
michelle-162B67...@news.eternal-september.org, "Michelle
Steiner" <mich...@michelle.org> wrote:
> In article <CC961D49.90756%ghost_...@hotmail.com>,
> George Kerby <ghost_...@hotmail.com> wrote:
>
>>>> As a matter of fact, I was looking for Efrem Zimbalist Jr.'s office
>>>> next to Deno's. We need his firm to find Barack Obama's testicles (we
>>>> found the empty chair and suit already).
>>>
>>> He seems to have misplaced them during the debate; if he had had them,
>>> he wouldn't have let Romney get away with all his lies.
>>
>> He was worried about his nose candy and weed. Michelle was all hot and
>> bothered on her anniversary and just didn't understand why this damn
>> 'debate thingy' was cutting into her romance/vacation time
>>
>> <http://www.politico.com/news/stories/1012/82103.html>
>>
>> I mean with two experts like Maher and Ice-T agree, how can one argue?
>
> Apparently, you have no sense of humor, and take jokes to be literal facts.
>
>> What a Wonderful Respected Leader to proudly represent the United States in
>> world affairs. NOT!
>
> But you think that a liar and a cheat like Romney is fit to be president.
LOL! HOW do you think Obama GOT his Illinois State Senate seat in the first
place? Just so he could vote "Present" over a 125 times...
bi...@mix.com
Oct 7, 2012, 11:13:06 AM10/7/12
to
In comp.sys.mac.system Alan Browne <alan....@freelunchvideotron.ca>
writes, quoting me:
> > The reality of this situation -
> >
> > http://blog.telemapics.com/?p=399
> >
> > | Google Maps announces a 400 year advantage over Apple Maps
>
> A bold assertion.
mean "massive," "huge," perhaps even "devastating," et cetera.
Billy Y..
--
rol -(sp) ; save carry
.purge #lun.sr ; dump channel open for .cstat
ror (sp)+ ; pop carry
George Kerby
Oct 7, 2012, 11:22:23 AM10/7/12
to
On 10/6/12 6:14 PM, in article
michelle-840FFF...@news.eternal-september.org, "Michelle
Steiner" <mich...@michelle.org> wrote:
> In article <CC961FB5.9076F%ghost_...@hotmail.com>,
> George Kerby <ghost_...@hotmail.com> wrote:
>
>>>> He seems to have misplaced them during the debate; if he had had them, he
>>>> wouldn't have let Romney get away with all his lies.
>>>
>>> Nah, he was practicing rope-a-dope.
>
>>>> He seems to have misplaced them during the debate; if he had had them, he
>>>> wouldn't have let Romney get away with all his lies.
>>>
>>
>> The 'dope' part is absolutely correct.
>
> With Rmoney being the dope.
>
> Rmoney may have won the debate, but in doing so, he showed what a dishonest
> person he is.
<snip snit>
Yeah, bringing a hanky to help with tears of laughter at the dope's poor
performance is truly "cheating".
Try again...
bi...@mix.com
Oct 7, 2012, 11:23:38 AM10/7/12
to
In comp.sys.mac.system JF Mezei <jfmezei...@vaxination.ca> wrote:
> >> http://blog.telemapics.com/?p=399
>
> There is one aspect with which I disagree in that otherwise very good
> description of the situation. Apple knew about the problems. There is no
> way they wouldn't have known.
Well, this is a biggie, but based on innumerable smaller yet
> >> http://blog.telemapics.com/?p=399
>
> There is one aspect with which I disagree in that otherwise very good
> description of the situation. Apple knew about the problems. There is no
> way they wouldn't have known.
still annoying, gratuitous, and obviously inadequately tested
things Apple's foisted upon us, I have my doubts about exactly
how much they knew.
Message has been deleted
Message has been deleted
Message has been deleted
Message has been deleted
Doug Anderson
Oct 7, 2012, 12:07:59 PM10/7/12
to
consisting entirely of cherry-picking) and on the side of pointing out
Google Maps is also imperfect.
But since you are one of the big complainers on the side of one set of
cherry-pickers, I'm unclear on why you find the cherry-picking
objectionable.
My first clue that the Apple Maps priblems seem to be over-stated was
the ubiquity of a single error (the Dublin airport error) in news
reports.
(And to be clear, I'm not asserting that Apple Maps is as good as
Google Maps - I'm merely pointing out the paucity of non-anecdote in
discussions of this issue, both here and elsewhere.)
George Kerby
Oct 7, 2012, 1:09:40 PM10/7/12
to
On 10/7/12 10:43 AM, in article
michelle-C17B96...@news.eternal-september.org, "Michelle
Steiner" <mich...@michelle.org> wrote:
> In article <CC97085F.907E3%ghost_...@hotmail.com>,
> George Kerby <ghost_...@hotmail.com> wrote:
>
>>> Rmoney may have won the debate, but in doing so, he showed what a dishonest
>>> person he is.
>>
>> <snip snit>
>>
>> Yeah, bringing a hanky to help with tears of laughter at the dope's poor
>> performance is truly "cheating".
>
> OK, so you advocate cheating and lying; what other dishonest activities do
>
>>> Rmoney may have won the debate, but in doing so, he showed what a dishonest
>>> person he is.
>>
>> <snip snit>
>>
>> Yeah, bringing a hanky to help with tears of laughter at the dope's poor
>> performance is truly "cheating".
>
> you support? Or do you support them only when Republicans do them?
<whoosh>
Have you stopped beating you dog yet?
George Kerby
Oct 7, 2012, 1:21:52 PM10/7/12
to
On 10/7/12 10:44 AM, in article
michelle-33174B...@news.eternal-september.org, "Michelle
Steiner" <mich...@michelle.org> wrote:
> In article <CC9701C0.907E1%ghost_...@hotmail.com>,
> George Kerby <ghost_...@hotmail.com> wrote:
>
>>> But you think that a liar and a cheat like Romney is fit to be president.
>>
>> LOL! HOW do you think Obama GOT his Illinois State Senate seat in the first
>> place?
>
> Not by lying and cheating?
>
>>> But you think that a liar and a cheat like Romney is fit to be president.
>>
>> LOL! HOW do you think Obama GOT his Illinois State Senate seat in the first
>> place?
>
You really make it SOOOO easy it's almost embarrassing for you...
<http://blog.heritage.org/2012/01/25/fact-check-10-dubious-claims-from-obama
s-state-of-the-union/>
<http://www.fireandreamitchell.com/2012/07/24/barack-hussein-obama-2004-tax-
cheat-did-obama-underreport-his-income-to-irs/>
<http://www.fireandreamitchell.com/2012/10/03/racist-obama-voted-against-sta
fford-act-as-senator-flat-out-misled-audience-in-2007-media-silent/>
<http://www.audacityofhypocrisy.com/fashion-shows/>
And even CNN:
<http://nicedeb.wordpress.com/2008/06/02/not-pretty-how-barack-obama-won-his
-illinois-senate-seat/>
Jolly Roger
Oct 7, 2012, 2:16:00 PM10/7/12
to
In article <michelle-C17B96...@news.eternal-september.org>,
Michelle Steiner <mich...@michelle.org> wrote:
> In article <CC97085F.907E3%ghost_...@hotmail.com>,
knows what else, as long as you're doing it for the right reason, such
as "to take my country back from ________".
--
Send responses to the relevant news group rather than email to me.
E-mail sent to this address may be devoured by my very hungry SPAM
filter. Due to Google's refusal to prevent spammers from posting
messages through their servers, I often ignore posts from Google
Groups. Use a real news client if you want me to see your posts.
JR
Michelle Steiner <mich...@michelle.org> wrote:
> In article <CC97085F.907E3%ghost_...@hotmail.com>,
> George Kerby <ghost_...@hotmail.com> wrote:
>
> > > Rmoney may have won the debate, but in doing so, he showed what a
> > > dishonest
> > > person he is.
> >
> > <snip snit>
> >
> > Yeah, bringing a hanky to help with tears of laughter at the dope's poor
> > performance is truly "cheating".
>
>
> > > Rmoney may have won the debate, but in doing so, he showed what a
> > > dishonest
> > > person he is.
> >
> > <snip snit>
> >
> > Yeah, bringing a hanky to help with tears of laughter at the dope's poor
> > performance is truly "cheating".
>
> OK, so you advocate cheating and lying; what other dishonest activities do
> you support? Or do you support them only when Republicans do them?
In right wing nut job's minds, it's okay to lie, steal, murder, and who
> you support? Or do you support them only when Republicans do them?
knows what else, as long as you're doing it for the right reason, such
as "to take my country back from ________".
--
Send responses to the relevant news group rather than email to me.
E-mail sent to this address may be devoured by my very hungry SPAM
filter. Due to Google's refusal to prevent spammers from posting
messages through their servers, I often ignore posts from Google
Groups. Use a real news client if you want me to see your posts.
JR
Jolly Roger
Oct 7, 2012, 2:16:50 PM10/7/12
to
In article <CC9701C0.907E1%ghost_...@hotmail.com>,
guilty of cheating and lying to the American people.
George Kerby <ghost_...@hotmail.com> wrote:
> On 10/6/12 5:53 PM, in article
> michelle-162B67...@news.eternal-september.org, "Michelle
> Steiner" <mich...@michelle.org> wrote:
>
> > In article <CC961D49.90756%ghost_...@hotmail.com>,
> > George Kerby <ghost_...@hotmail.com> wrote:
> >
> >>>> As a matter of fact, I was looking for Efrem Zimbalist Jr.'s office
> >>>> next to Deno's. We need his firm to find Barack Obama's testicles (we
> >>>> found the empty chair and suit already).
> >>>
> >>> He seems to have misplaced them during the debate; if he had had them,
> >>> he wouldn't have let Romney get away with all his lies.
> >>
> >> He was worried about his nose candy and weed. Michelle was all hot and
> >> bothered on her anniversary and just didn't understand why this damn
> >> 'debate thingy' was cutting into her romance/vacation time
> >>
> >> <http://www.politico.com/news/stories/1012/82103.html>
> >>
> >> I mean with two experts like Maher and Ice-T agree, how can one argue?
> >
> > Apparently, you have no sense of humor, and take jokes to be literal facts.
> >
> >> What a Wonderful Respected Leader to proudly represent the United States in
> >> world affairs. NOT!
> >
> > But you think that a liar and a cheat like Romney is fit to be president.
>
> LOL! HOW do you think Obama GOT his Illinois State Senate seat in the first
> place? Just so he could vote "Present" over a 125 times...
Hate to break it to you, but Democrats and Republicans are just as
> On 10/6/12 5:53 PM, in article
> michelle-162B67...@news.eternal-september.org, "Michelle
> Steiner" <mich...@michelle.org> wrote:
>
> > In article <CC961D49.90756%ghost_...@hotmail.com>,
> > George Kerby <ghost_...@hotmail.com> wrote:
> >
> >>>> As a matter of fact, I was looking for Efrem Zimbalist Jr.'s office
> >>>> next to Deno's. We need his firm to find Barack Obama's testicles (we
> >>>> found the empty chair and suit already).
> >>>
> >>> He seems to have misplaced them during the debate; if he had had them,
> >>> he wouldn't have let Romney get away with all his lies.
> >>
> >> He was worried about his nose candy and weed. Michelle was all hot and
> >> bothered on her anniversary and just didn't understand why this damn
> >> 'debate thingy' was cutting into her romance/vacation time
> >>
> >> <http://www.politico.com/news/stories/1012/82103.html>
> >>
> >> I mean with two experts like Maher and Ice-T agree, how can one argue?
> >
> > Apparently, you have no sense of humor, and take jokes to be literal facts.
> >
> >> What a Wonderful Respected Leader to proudly represent the United States in
> >> world affairs. NOT!
> >
> > But you think that a liar and a cheat like Romney is fit to be president.
>
> LOL! HOW do you think Obama GOT his Illinois State Senate seat in the first
> place? Just so he could vote "Present" over a 125 times...
guilty of cheating and lying to the American people.
Jolly Roger
Oct 7, 2012, 2:17:34 PM10/7/12
to
In article <CC972460.90872%ghost_...@hotmail.com>,
George Kerby <ghost_...@hotmail.com> wrote:
> On 10/7/12 10:44 AM, in article
> michelle-33174B...@news.eternal-september.org, "Michelle
> Steiner" <mich...@michelle.org> wrote:
>
> > In article <CC9701C0.907E1%ghost_...@hotmail.com>,
> > George Kerby <ghost_...@hotmail.com> wrote:
> >
> >>> But you think that a liar and a cheat like Romney is fit to be president.
> >>
> >> LOL! HOW do you think Obama GOT his Illinois State Senate seat in the first
> >> place?
> >
> > Not by lying and cheating?
>
> You really make it SOOOO easy it's almost embarrassing for you...
>
> <http://blog.heritage.org/2012/01/25/fact-check-10-dubious-claims-from-obama
> s-state-of-the-union/>
>
> <http://www.fireandreamitchell.com/2012/07/24/barack-hussein-obama-2004-tax-
> cheat-did-obama-underreport-his-income-to-irs/>
>
> <http://www.fireandreamitchell.com/2012/10/03/racist-obama-voted-against-sta
> fford-act-as-senator-flat-out-misled-audience-in-2007-media-silent/>
>
> <http://www.audacityofhypocrisy.com/fashion-shows/>
>
> And even CNN:
>
> <http://nicedeb.wordpress.com/2008/06/02/not-pretty-how-barack-obama-won-his
> -illinois-senate-seat/>
That's a pretty silly, petty, useless argument you are both having...
> On 10/7/12 10:44 AM, in article
> michelle-33174B...@news.eternal-september.org, "Michelle
> Steiner" <mich...@michelle.org> wrote:
>
> > In article <CC9701C0.907E1%ghost_...@hotmail.com>,
> > George Kerby <ghost_...@hotmail.com> wrote:
> >
> >>> But you think that a liar and a cheat like Romney is fit to be president.
> >>
> >> LOL! HOW do you think Obama GOT his Illinois State Senate seat in the first
> >> place?
> >
> > Not by lying and cheating?
>
> You really make it SOOOO easy it's almost embarrassing for you...
>
> <http://blog.heritage.org/2012/01/25/fact-check-10-dubious-claims-from-obama
> s-state-of-the-union/>
>
> <http://www.fireandreamitchell.com/2012/07/24/barack-hussein-obama-2004-tax-
> cheat-did-obama-underreport-his-income-to-irs/>
>
> <http://www.fireandreamitchell.com/2012/10/03/racist-obama-voted-against-sta
> fford-act-as-senator-flat-out-misled-audience-in-2007-media-silent/>
>
> <http://www.audacityofhypocrisy.com/fashion-shows/>
>
> And even CNN:
>
> <http://nicedeb.wordpress.com/2008/06/02/not-pretty-how-barack-obama-won-his
> -illinois-senate-seat/>
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