An Oregon Rep 2 First Day Report!

[Ryan Gerrish]

Hi there!

So I received my Rep 2 unexpectedly today, I was thinking it'd come Monday, but Fedex surprised me! I unboxed it and set it up as per the manual. They give you these cute little 3D printed zip-tie standoffs now securing the Rep together.

I aligned the build plate and printed the Shark from the memory card on Medium resolution. Turned out awesome, no issues. I printed directly to the build plate. I put a straight edge to my plate, and it's pretty close to flat, although not perfect out at the corners. I'll get a couple glass ones later for fun. 

I printed the octopus, and 6 of my own objects so far, all in medium resolution at 230 degrees. So far, I've had about a 60% success rate printing items to completion. My only big issue is that sometimes the extruder stops squirting during the print- it gets clogged. My standard process is to remove the filament, then re-insert it into the motor. This clears the blockage, and I usually have a successful print after that. If I dont clear the extruder, it usually fails on the next print. I've tested the 'pulling power' of the motor, and it doesnt slip unless I really grab it. The filament seems to be feeding fine from the spool. No clicking when extruding, when I load new filament it extrudes perfectly. Not sure why it's being finicky, but I'm still new. I'll try tightening the set screw like MB suggests.

The other minor issues: Makerware (latest version) wont recognize the bot. The computer recognizes it, but makerware doesnt see it. I tried "Restarting the Conveyor" but nothing happened. I'm using Windows 8. Could that be the issue?

Also, I cant print anything in High Quality. When I try, it lays down a few lines, then the extruder clogs. I tried more heat (240) and less (220, 195) with no luck. I'll keep experimenting. I reset my build plate occasionally, it doesnt change much.

So far I'm pleased- it's a cool machine and the pieces it has printed are quite nice, even on medium quality. I was expecting some minor issues, and I'm sure I'll figure them out eventually. Here are a couple pics:

Thanks for any suggestions!

Ryan

[Big-E]

I've been having similar issues with high resolution on my rep2, also been having problems with larger prints clogging the nozzle after the midway point. You may want to try turning down your temps a lot more, like around 189°C is a good starting point, according to Rich Thompson. you may want to check this thread, it's informative: link

It seems the nozzle is gumming up because of the high temps, which seem to be great for small prints around medium resolution, but causes issues with longer prints and high resolution. after a while, the top layer melts around the nozzle after a while, and with PLA cooking inside the nozzle, it makes for a clogged extruder, then you get the bot going through the motions with no plastic coming out.

All I can suggest for sure is you Load/Unload the filament a bunch of times, and try to get it extruding cleanly, and while it's still warm, use a little isopropyl alcohol on a clean, lint-free rag to carefully clean the extra plastic from the outside of your nozzle while it's still gooey. I use an extra-pure alcohol used for cleaning electronics and tape heads, but rubbing alcohol should work too. Once you've cleared out any clogs and cleaned the nozzle, try lowering your temps as Rich suggests, and slowly bump up the temperatures until you get the desired extrusion. 

[Big-E]

BTW, for the driver issues, see if you can get it to work under compatibility mode. I've yet to use windows 8 for myself, but you can get some info on it here: http://www.forumswindows8.com/tutorials/windows-8-compatibility-mode-5264.htm

[Dan Newman]

> Also, I cant print anything in High Quality. When I try, it lays down a few lines, then the extruder clogs. I tried more heat (240) and less (220, 195) with no luck. I'll keep experimenting. I reset my build plate occasionally, it doesnt change much.

That's likely a leveling and/or z home offset issue. The smaller the layer height, the closer
to the build platform the first layer is printed. That means that a level surface is more critical
since otherwise there will be spots where the gap between the build surface and the nozzle is too
small and plastic can not exit the extruder nozzle at the necessary rate and thus it jams. If
you are confident that th build surfaces is very level, then it may be uniformly too close to the
nozzle. In that case, you can decrease the Z home offset. (It defaults to 0 mm on the Rep 2.)
If you decrease it in increments of -0.02 mm, you will increase the gap. If you increase it in
increments of 0.02 mm, you will decrease the gap.

Dan

[Dan Newman]

On 9 Dec 2012 , at 8:01 AM, Dan Newman wrote:

>> Also, I cant print anything in High Quality. When I try, it lays down a few lines, then the extruder clogs. I tried more heat (240) and less (220, 195) with no luck. I'll keep experimenting. I reset my build plate occasionally, it doesnt change much.
>
> That's likely a leveling and/or z home offset issue.

P.S. I'm assuming that by "a few lines" you mean that the clogging occurs very early on while
printing the very first layer. If instead it's happening after the first couple of layers print,
then it's unlikely a leveling issue and more likely to be the more general temperature issue.

Dan

[Steve]

 

Dan:

What temps are you using with the Rep2?

Are you changing the temp for different kinds of prints or just using the same temp all the time?

[Ryan Gerrish]

Thanks for the info so far everyone!

When printing in Medium Resolution, my clogging occurs half way through the print on average. I'm going to tighten the screw in the extruder, and try lower heat.

On Higher Resolution, the print hasnt ever progressed passed the the first couple base lines. I'll mess with the build plate height.

On Sunday, December 9, 2012 8:06:23 AM UTC-8, dnewman wrote:

[Dan Newman]

> Dan:
>
> What temps are you using with the Rep2?
>
> Are you changing the temp for different kinds of prints or just using the
> same temp all the time?

For short prints, I just use 230 C. For long prints (hour +), I've been using
210 C although 190C might be better. This is absolutely a YMMV sort of thing
and depends upon the particular PLA as well. For instance, for the "natural"
PLA (untinted clear), I find I'm better off using 230C always. I believe that
I'm not alone in that assessment, but again YMMV.

Dan

[Steve]

Dan:

I understand that too high a temp over a long print can degrade the filament and cause clogs. Why do You use the higher temp for short prints, why not just stick with 200C area for all prints?

Steve

[Dan Newman]

On 9 Dec 2012 , at 10:28 PM, Steve wrote:

>
>
> Dan:
>
> I understand that too high a temp over a long print can degrade the
> filament and cause clogs. Why do You use the higher temp for short prints,
> why not just stick with 200C area for all prints?

Because I'm lazy and don't bother. Most of my prints are in ABS on other bots.
So, when I'm working on the Rep2, odds are things are set up for 230 or 240C
when I slice for it. Only if it's a long print do I worry about checking the
actual gcode and ensuring the temp is set around 210C or lower.

Dan

[Ryan Gerrish]

Ok, some good news! I tightened the screw in the extruder like the youtube video shows, and I also changed to my orange filament. Since those changes, every print I've done on Medium quality has printed perfectly! 6 prints in a row, no issues. I think the tightening was the big fixer.

I still cant print high res. I"ll be experimenting more....

[Clinton Hoines]

I would put half the blame on the clear PLA, it takes some work to get to print correctly with long prints especially.

 

Clinton

[Ryan Gerrish]

Yes, I'm noticing that the Clear isnt as reliable as the orange, which is unfortunate, considering I ordered 1 spool of orange and 4 more of clear! Perhaps the bigger spools will print better than the included one?

Still fighting with HQ mode, no luck yet. It's knocking medium quality out of the part though! 

[Ryan Gerrish]

Here are a few pics of Medium resolution success. I'll be printing the test cube tonight, trying different settings.

[Clinton Hoines]

Not likely, I also ordered 3 extra rolls of clear (all they had in stock) when I bought my Rep1 none printed nay better than the others.

 

Clinton

[Ryan Gerrish]

Thanks again for the info!

Also, if there are any other Oregon Rep 2 users that would like to chat, let me know!

I'm currently still experimenting with HQ settings...

[Steve]

Ryan:

I am in LO. I have not received my Rep 2 yet, but it should 'ship soon'. After the holidays when I have the machine and have had a chance to get familiar with it I will stop by Tammies and introduce myself.

Did you try different temps on your prints, if so what were the results?

[Z LeHericy]

I'm near Lewis and Clark College, and have an old Cupcake that i've beefed up with Gen4 electronics, but maybe we should all organize an oregon Makerbot Meetup at some point!

-Zeno LeHericy

//((=:Z:=))\\
INVENTIONS
Technologies
zinventions.com

On Thu, Dec 13, 2012 at 3:31 PM, Trevor deVos <devo...@gmail.com> wrote:

Hi Ryan. Where are you located? I'm in Corvallis. I'm holding out until the next version of the Rep 2 is released but reading and learning everything I can until then.

--
 
 

[Ryan Gerrish]

Yes! HERE HERE! I formally establish the Oregon Make Gruppe (OMG!). We'll get together and just hold each other, releasing our pent-up fury generated while trying to print at 100 microns. Or something like that.

I'm in Beaverton, and would seriously love to get some local networking going. Thanks for posting!

I've experimented a little with various settings and temperatures, but my stupid 'job' keeps getting in the way of my tinkering. I'll post up pictures and results soon.

Ryan

[Mike Payson]

I am the designer of the MendelMax and I'm based in North Portland. 

There is already a Portland 3d printing users group at https://groups.google.com/forum/?fromgroups#!forum/print3dpdx

There has been some talk about having meet-ups, but so far nothing has happened. I'd love to have one around the first of the year to show off the new (soon to be announced) MendelMax 2.0 if anyone is interested.

Ryan

--
 
 

[Steve]

Ryan:

How are your experiments going? What have you learned that you wish you knew on the first day? Are you still using the standard settings? I am getting close to my Rep 2 shipping.

[Ryan Gerrish]

Joined it! Thanks!

[Ryan Gerrish]

Hi Steve,

I havent played with HQ mode much lately, mainly because I've been printing X-mas presents for my family. :) Medium quality prints great, and I'm having a blast! Tightening the grub screw on the extruder was important for mine. Also watching the roll of filament to be sure it doesnt snag. How to stop a Makerware slice from processing: Stop conveyor, close MW, open MW, Restart conveyor. Check the acrylic plate to see how warped it is...

Here's a pic of the shelf I had to build to hold all the crap I"m printing!

[Trevor deVos]

Great to hear there is a Portland group going. I'll check it out. It would be great to get meetings going! maybe I'll see you guys there.

Trevor

[Ryan Gerrish]

I made my first $9 today with my Rep 2! 

 

:D

[Cymon]

Curious what you're selling. Are you opening a shop?

[Ryan Gerrish]

I printed a part for my friends pinball machine. :) I wont be opening a 'printed items' specific store. I'll mostly be using the printer for my business for prototyping, with occasional items for sale.

[Ryan Gerrish]

Ok, I NEED to get this model to print at at least .15 resolution. When I try, I usually end up with the ends of it bunched up like this:

And with folds of filament coming out of the back or sides. When I try it colder, the extruder has been failing. (Clicking in and out)

Should I start playing with RepG more? Has anyone had reliable .15 prints with Makerware?

[Minestorm]

> Should I start playing with RepG more? Has anyone had reliable .15 prints
> with Makerware?

http://groups.google.com/group/makerbot/browse_thread/thread/8f3f9c659ee92e2d

Those guys are getting some good results with a new RepG profile.

[Justin Leone]

I'm still pretty new to this (just got my Rep2 a couple weeks ago), but one of the first things I learned was to abandon Makerware.  RepG is a little daunting at first, but by cutting out virtually all the options, Makerware seems pretty useless for controlling such a precise and finicky machine.

If I had to guess (and, like I said, I'm new myself so it's just a guess), I'd say you're extruding too much plastic, and the excess is oozing out.  You can try increasing the filament diameter (so the machine thinks it's getting more plastic, and extrudes less).  There's also a setting under "fill" in Skeinforge called infill perimeter overlap, which will determine how close the fill is to the perimeter shells.  If the value is too low, it can leave a gap, but if it's too high, the fill and shell will overlap and the shell can get pushed outwards.  The more springy the plastic you're using, the higher this value should be.  Since PLA is quite rigid and doesn't shrink much, it probably needs a very low value.

[whpthomas]

Did the objects on the SD card print OK?

[Ryan Gerrish]

Oh, I've had zero problems printing anything and everything in .27, default medium resolution settings! It's been great! I made X-mas presents for everyone in my family. Tons of fun!

It's trying to nail down .15 or less that's hard. I'm going to start using RepG more (I've played a little with it) and see what I can do. 

[Ryan Gerrish]

Ok, I tried a little RepG action using Thomas's 100 micron setup. It seemed to want to print, but the extruder would jam (click in and out) every 9% or so. You can see in the picture where ever there are horizontal lines on the object is where I had to pause the build, load the filament, and continue. I didnt have to unload the filament, just push it through with a little force while loading.

You can see the bits that dont have obvious horizontal lines look nice! 

Any ideas on where to start tweeking RepG settings? Thanks!!

[whpthomas]

Get you callipers and check the diameter of your filament.

[Ryan Gerrish]

My Orange filament is in the 1.75 to 1.78 range it seems, as is my clear.

I bought 2 Glass build plates today at my local glass shop- $10.50 each! They are nice:

I'll experiment more with Hi resolution and Rep G tomorrow- but I've got an order for some parts that I have to get through.

[Chris Pittman]

Do you have the measurements you used for the build plate handy?  I need to get a couple of these myself but unfortunately not nearby my Rep2 right now.

[Ryan Gerrish]

6 9/16 wide, 11 5/16 long, 3/8 thick. :)

[Ryan Gerrish]

Got Black and Blue PLA from Ultimachine today! Cant wait to test it out. That blue is dead sexy.

[Ryan Gerrish]

I'm having more frequent issues with my extruder clicking. Seems to do it at random- a print could be 10% or 70% through and it'll start clicking. (Jamming, not extruding) I can try to save it by loading the filament, and if I push it into the extruder it usually clears. I have the plunger tightened as much as I can- any more and it stalls the extruder. Perhaps the Delrin bit is worn...

I tried the MK8 upgrade, but I didnt have the perfect bearing, so I'm going to order that and try again. 

I also havent had any luck printing on the glass plates I had made. Prints dont stick well enough. I'll play with blue tape...

[Alex Lau]

I seem to have the same issue...can't print at low resolutions either, or more detailed structures that require supports.

[Justin M]

Where in Oregon?  There is a decent sized group of us replicator users in Bend, OR.  I would be interested in knowing how well a PLA printed cookie cutter survives the dishwasher.

On Saturday, December 8, 2012 10:35:49 PM UTC-8, Ryan Gerrish wrote:

Hi there!

So I received my Rep 2 unexpectedly today, I was thinking it'd come Monday, but Fedex surprised me! I unboxed it and set it up as per the manual. They give you these cute little 3D printed zip-tie standoffs now securing the Rep together.

I aligned the build plate and printed the Shark from the memory card on Medium resolution. Turned out awesome, no issues. I printed directly to the build plate. I put a straight edge to my plate, and it's pretty close to flat, although not perfect out at the corners. I'll get a couple glass ones later for fun. 

I printed the octopus, and 6 of my own objects so far, all in medium resolution at 230 degrees. So far, I've had about a 60% success rate printing items to completion. My only big issue is that sometimes the extruder stops squirting during the print- it gets clogged. My standard process is to remove the filament, then re-insert it into the motor. This clears the blockage, and I usually have a successful print after that. If I dont clear the extruder, it usually fails on the next print. I've tested the 'pulling power' of the motor, and it doesnt slip unless I really grab it. The filament seems to be feeding fine from the spool. No clicking when extruding, when I load new filament it extrudes perfectly. Not sure why it's being finicky, but I'm still new. I'll try tightening the set screw like MB suggests.

The other minor issues: Makerware (latest version) wont recognize the bot. The computer recognizes it, but makerware doesnt see it. I tried "Restarting the Conveyor" but nothing happened. I'm using Windows 8. Could that be the issue?

Also, I cant print anything in High Quality. When I try, it lays down a few lines, then the extruder clogs. I tried more heat (240) and less (220, 195) with no luck. I'll keep experimenting. I reset my build plate occasionally, it doesnt change much.

So far I'm pleased- it's a cool machine and the pieces it has printed are quite nice, even on medium quality. I was expecting some minor issues, and I'm sure I'll figure them out eventually. Here are a couple pics:

Thanks for any suggestions!

Ryan

[Ryan Gerrish]

I'm in Beaverton, and I'm on the print3dpdx google group. 

[Ryan Gerrish]

Ok, updates:

I found the correct bearing for the MK8 Minimal Extruder Upgrade, and installed the latest version of it.

Did a test print in Makerware at medium resolution of the "Surface Calibration Test" item, and it printed nicely.

Did a test print in Makerware at High reolution of the same thing, and it printed nicely, except for an edge lifting off the build plate.

Attempted a build of a larger item, and the extruder couldnt lay down the first layer. Tried again after adjusting the build plate and clearing the filament, and same result.

One thing I'm noticing is that since the MK8 upgrade, the extruder spits out a smaller diameter of hot filament during the 'loading' process. Also, I can easily stop the pull of the filament into the extruder with my fingers, whereas before with the delrin plunger it was pretty difficult. I'm using the same spring and parts that you're supposed to use with the MK8 upgrade. My guess is that there isnt enough pressure on the filament match the speed of the drive wheel.

Can you other MK8 Upgrade users easily stop the filament pull?

Im going to install a second spring inside the first to see if that helps...

[Ryan Gerrish]

Well, I might have fixed my last issue!

I shimmed my bearing on the MK8 Upgrade to line up better with the filament, and I added a smaller diameter spring inside the larger spring to strengthen it. Printed the "SCT" and it worked, and so far it's printing the tool holder, although a couple corners have lifted. (It's a big thing)

[Ryan Gerrish]

Well, It's printing better- small things seem to go ok, but the 2 larger prints I've tried jammed a ways through.