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" Extensions which are written for Joomla 2.5.27 and don't use deprecated methods will run on Joomla 3 fine."
That's not completely true. From a php perspective maybe. But CSS/JavaScript is a different matter. If you stick to what's in core, you have the issue between whatever vs Bootstrap, Mootools vs jQuery, etc. Especially when it comes to admin-side extensions.
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We need your to help spread the word!
We are currently planning the Joomla 2.5 marketing campaign. Joomla 2.5.28 will be releasing December 10th. As part of our campaign, we are asking extension developers if they would create a blog (of any length) that explains 2.5.28 will be the final release of the 2.5 series. Additionally, it would be helpful that you provide documentation on how to upgrade your extension within your blog post.
Here is documentation by Jennifer Gress, Tom Hutchison, and Connie Lippert to help people plan for upgradinghttp://docs.joomla.org/Why_Migrate. Furthermore, the marketing team is preparing a press pack to assist you with the proper messaging and Q & A about the development life cycle.
In conclusion, our goal for this campaign is to work together to help the community find the resources they need for successful upgrade planning.
If you have suggestions on how else we can assist in this transition, please let us know.Jess
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A. Migration of usersUsers do not migrate to a new release just because the software vendor is telling them to do so. Any migration that is more then a simple upgrade is considered to be 'a risk' and is translated in 'a cost'. For a user to take this step the benefit of migrating needs to outweigh the cost it involves.The numbers Michael en myself posted above confirm this. Users are in no rush to move to 3.x. Today the market tell us that 30% of new installations are still done on Joomla 2.5, with more then 50% of new installations being on 2.5 a year ago.
1. BenefitJoomla 3.x doesn't have any key selling points over Joomla 2.5 that could help users see additional benefit to upgrade. The unique selling point for v3 has been mobile ready and user friendly. From most users their perspective this is not enough of a reason to migrate.
2. CostJoomla 2.5 is not yet 3 years old. Officially released in January 2012. For many users a time period of less then 3 years is too short to warrant an additional migrate cost. (as Charlie has also pointed out from his own experience) A migration for most means hiring a developer to help them migrate, if often brings additional costs to extensions etc.
Hi everyone,
I cannot speak on behalf of other hosting companies, however, the standard protocol is to provide the best possible service to clients, especially on a shared hosting environment.
This is usually to guarantee the server uptime in the highly competitive market.
SERVICE UPTIME GUARANTEE
We offer a Service uptime guarantee of 99.9% (“Service Uptime Guarantee”) of available time per month. If we fail to maintain this Service Uptime Guarantee in a particular month (as solely determined by us), you may contact us and request a credit of 5% of your monthly hosting fee for that month. The credit may be used only for the purchase of further products and services from us, and is exclusive of any applicable taxes. The Service Uptime Guarantee does not apply to service interruptions caused by: (1) periodic scheduled maintenance or repairs we may undertake from time to time; (2) interruptions caused by you from custom scripting, coding or the installation of third-party applications; (3) outages that do not affect the appearance of your website but merely affect access to your website such as FTP and email; (4) causes beyond our control or that are not reasonably foreseeable; and (5) outages related to the reliability of certain programming environments.
That being said, if any site has:
1. Old extensions, component, plugins etc. that can or does cause server performance issues and/or interruptions on the server, the site will automatically get suspended
a. The client will then be notified to correct the problem (similar concept to Google’s webmaster if your site has a virus/spyware)
Typically, we work with clients to upgrade their systems or provide links/resources to Joomla if we cannot do it ourselves.
Obviously, if a client is on a dedicated server, the above would not be an issue. But, who would invest in a dedicated server while still using Joomla 1.5 or 2.5? That wouldn’t make much sense.
Thanks
Omar
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A. Migration of usersUsers do not migrate to a new release just because the software vendor is telling them to do so. Any migration that is more then a simple upgrade is considered to be 'a risk' and is translated in 'a cost'. For a user to take this step the benefit of migrating needs to outweigh the cost it involves.
The numbers Michael en myself posted above confirm this. Users are in no rush to move to 3.x. Today the market tell us that 30% of new installations are still done on Joomla 2.5, with more then 50% of new installations being on 2.5 a year ago.I disagree with Joomla 2.5 being 30% of new installations - there's still enough people who download the full pack in order to do update via FTP. We still have bug reports about things that break as a result of that from time to time. I think my suspicion of this is backed up by joomla 2.5 being the platform for only 23% of installs of your software down from 47% of installs you quoted earlier (lies, damn lies and statistics right :p) And even with your extension there will always be people who are doing new functionality to existing sites - so even that figure might be high.
1. BenefitJoomla 3.x doesn't have any key selling points over Joomla 2.5 that could help users see additional benefit to upgrade. The unique selling point for v3 has been mobile ready and user friendly. From most users their perspective this is not enough of a reason to migrate.For most users this is always the case. For example from 1.5->2.5 you could argue there were no killer features that would ensure users upgrade. If you say smart search I say tags (or whatever) In the majority of cases the reason for us doing this is to ensure a code base update.
To make sure people can run on the latest code base with the improvements that brings - to this extend we induce the requirement for them to upgrade - so extension developers can have an improved API (because at the end of the day the USP for any Joomla is the wide extension base).
However in anticipation of the response extension dev's can choose to upgrade at any time extension dev's can't afford to loose income from not supporting actively maintained Joomla versions and the majority of people would rather use core supported methods than 3rd party libraries (Nooku, FOF etc).
2. CostJoomla 2.5 is not yet 3 years old. Officially released in January 2012. For many users a time period of less then 3 years is too short to warrant an additional migrate cost. (as Charlie has also pointed out from his own experience) A migration for most means hiring a developer to help them migrate, if often brings additional costs to extensions etc.I'd suggest that this is by far the most significant factor over the previous ones being mentioned.
The first release of the 2.x release series was 1.6 and that happened in january 2011, giving 2.x a lifetime of 4 years.
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Joomla 3.3 (LTS) released in April 2014 and supported until September 2016No info about the new release cycle, maybe a tiny external link.
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If you excuse the retrospectively stupid version number jump between 1.7 and 2.5 and count 1.6 through 2.5 as a complete series (most of the "insiders" do), then under the revised strategy, support for that entire branch technically couldn't end before January 24, 2015 as that would be the 4 year mark of the entire branch. If you treat it under the new strategy and consider it a major version bump (which it is if you go solely on version numbers), then yes, by the new strategy support should continue through 2015. At the time we were discussing the revised strategies, we effectively decided that 3.3 would be the first release under the new strategy (since we broke B/C going to it by changing the minimum supported PHP version mid-series) and that 2.5 wouldn't be considered as part of the strategy with regards to the support timeframes. Hopefully that will shed a little light into some of the thinking (as I remember it, I don't always remember last week very well let alone 9 months ago).
As for the roadmap, I agree totally. In some of my final discussions with the PLT before stepping out of the role, I shared some ideas for a more formally organized Release Team assigned to each minor release series based on my own experiences trying to herd cats for each of the releases I took a lead in coordinating. Part of that team's responsibility would be to review the roadmap alongside the PLT to form the goals and visions for each release. IMO, while the roadmap and project goals should definitely drive that process, the team lead should also be taking into consideration user feedback and current development activities; maybe there's a feature being highly requested by users which isn't a roadmap item but logically fits into Joomla. Ultimately, the roadmap would be updated and the release's goals would be published just as the previous series was preparing for its stable release (similar to how we announced goals for 3.4 (http://developer.joomla.org/news/583-announcing-joomla-cms-3-4.html) as 3.3 had entered its beta phase). This would ensure that the roadmap is getting reviewed probably once or twice per year and that clear announcements about development and where we would like contributors to help out are published in a reasonable timeframe.
2. CostJoomla 2.5 is not yet 3 years old. Officially released in January 2012. For many users a time period of less then 3 years is too short to warrant an additional migrate cost. (as Charlie has also pointed out from his own experience) A migration for most means hiring a developer to help them migrate, if often brings additional costs to extensions etc.
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Hannes, this can be the truth form a technical and "insider" point of view, but hardly anybody who is not a "Joomler" will agree the version 1.6 is the first 2.x version...
On 2014-12-07 23:59, Hannes Papenberg wrote:
The first release of the 2.x release series was 1.6 and that happened in january 2011, giving 2.x a lifetime of 4 years.
Am 07.12.2014 23:51 schrieb "Sergio Manzi" <s...@smz.it>:
Good point, Johan!--
Also look here: https://www.snowtechmedia.com/announcement-end-life-announced-joomla-2-5-migration-options/ They already start talking about "Crossgrading" as "The upgrade from Joomla 2.5.x to 3.3.x is a major one. This can be relatively expensive."
Methink we are shooting in our feet...
Don't get me wrong: I (as a sites developer/hoster) have already migrated to Joomla 3 all my websites (well, one remaining...) and I think everybody should start migrating ASAP if has not already done.
But again, "Joomla 2" has had a life cycle of just 2 years (we everywhere say that a normal Joomla Major release lifecycle is 4 years...): 2 years is not enough.
My personal opinion (and I know many will disagree) is that we should support (support = provide security patches and fixes for major, blocking, bugs) two major releases.
Sergio
On 2014-12-07 23:22, Johan Janssens wrote:
Hosts are indeed right to do so if the project has abandonned support for a specific release. The more reason in the case of Joomla 2.5 to nor mark it EOL yet.
Johan
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George the data is our own internal data and it shows 'new' installs of our extensions on Joomla sites. It doesn't show Joomla installs. A new install is an installation of our extension on a site that didn't have the extension installed before, if so it would be an 'upgrade'.Johan
As for your question. Users don't care about changes in the web industry, a user has no idea what the web is capable of doing. Users care about their problem and they are looking for fast and easy solutions.Security, performance, mobile ready ... developer improvements are all all great things and needed enchantments. None of them are unique selling points. Users expect these from any system implicitly. Ask any user what makes Joomla stand out and see what he answers you. I bet that none of them will mention any of those. They are implied.
What you need to sell users on ? Listen to your users, they will tell you. What users are telling us today : Joomla 3 administration is too complex. Too many options, and settings. Clunky workflows, an overly complex ACL system ...What users need : Power in simplicity (which once was Mambo's biggest strength).
I would also put it in retrospect that the end of life of Joomla 1.5 was September 2012. Your effectively putting another LTS at end of life only 2 years after the previous one, this doesn't make much sense, 4 years after seems like a much better and easier to explain target. Again this would be 2016.
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How about just saying End of Support or End of Service?
Obviously, it does need an end to an existing system in order to have any advancement.
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Just a headsup that if you want to change from EOL it needs to be done yesterday or joomla will ship with a plugin called EOL
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Hi all,
I remember sending something like this a while back, but it’s a good idea to revisit again:
http://windows.microsoft.com/en-us/windows/lifecycle
Every Windows product has a lifecycle. The lifecycle begins when a product is released and ends when it's no longer supported. Knowing key dates in this lifecycle helps you make informed decisions about when to upgrade or make other changes to your software. Here are the rights and limits of the Windows lifecycle.
End of support
End of support refers to the date when Microsoft no longer provides automatic fixes, updates, or online technical assistance. This is the time to make sure you have the latest available update or service pack installed. Without Microsoft support, you will no longer receive security updates that can help protect your PC from harmful viruses, spyware, and other malicious software that can steal your personal information. For more information go to Microsoft Support Lifecycle .
I hope this helps. I think it addresses most, if not all of the issues of what’s being discussed in terms of EOL and migrations, updates, etc.
Thanks
Omar
From: joomla-...@googlegroups.com [mailto:joomla-...@googlegroups.com] On Behalf Of Michael Babker
Sent: Monday, December 8, 2014 6:59 PM
To: joomla-...@googlegroups.com
Subject: Re: [jcms] Re: Joomla Extension Developers, what resources do you need for the final release of 2.5
The plugin is named "End of Support" notifier (plg_quickicon_eosnotify). That's OK.
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The word legacy might be what you want to use for end of life security support. Debian calls their ‘After end of life’ security support LTS (obviously not the right term for Joomla) , and that support extends 20 months after the ‘end of life’ on Debian Squeeze, through Feb of 16 when end of life was June 1st ‘14.
I’ll have 50 or so hours I could offer to an official support team for V2.5 should I be able to postpone platform-driven migrations next year.
Charlie Heath
Town Websites
From: joomla-...@googlegroups.com [mailto:joomla-...@googlegroups.com] On Behalf Of Beat
Sent: Monday, December 08, 2014 5:23 PM
To: joomla-...@googlegroups.com
Subject: Re: [jcms] Re: Joomla Extension Developers, what resources do you need for the final release of 2.5
I think that Johan has several good points. (even though i hate to support old versions, specially with different html markups in my extensions).
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I’ll have 50 or so hours I could offer to an official support team for V2.5 should I be able to postpone platform-driven migrations next year.
<twighlight zone theme song>
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Johan, I'm available as a volunteer if there will be an official security support phase for V2.5 lasting at least one year. I have experience in software development, QA, project management, and five years work with Joomla. An old resume here: http://townwebsites.org/CharlesHeathResume.html .Charlie