VoF Week :: DV :: 02 AUG 12 - 0338 :: small herb on rock at Valley of Flowers

[Dinesh Valke]

2 AUG 12 Valley of Flowers ... about 9900 ft

Dear friends, ID please. Habitat: growing on rock Habit: small herb, about 15 - 40 cm high; flower about 3 - 4 mm across

Regards. Dinesh

[Gurcharan Singh]

Sibbaldia cuneata I hope

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Dr. Gurcharan Singh

Retired  Associate Professor
SGTB Khalsa College, University of Delhi, Delhi-110007
Res: 932 Anand Kunj, Vikas Puri, New Delhi-110018.
Phone: 011-25518297  Mob: 9810359089

http://www.gurcharanfamily.com/ 
http://people.du.ac.in/~singhg45/ 

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[Dinesh Valke]

Thank you very much Gurcharan ji for the probable ID.
Regards.
Dinesh

[Gurcharan Singh]

Now correctly known as Sibbaldia procumbens

-- 

Dr. Gurcharan Singh

Retired  Associate Professor
SGTB Khalsa College, University of Delhi, Delhi-110007
Res: 932 Anand Kunj, Vikas Puri, New Delhi-110018.
Phone: 011-25518297  Mob: 9810359089

http://www.gurcharanfamily.com/ 
http://people.du.ac.in/~singhg45/ 

[Dinesh Valke]

Many thanks Gurcharan ji.
At The Plants List, found these are being treated as separate species: Sibbaldia procumbens L. and Sibbaldia cuneata Hornem. ex Kuntze
Regards.
Dinesh

[Gurcharan Singh]

Dinesh ji

It would be interesting to resolve this mystery. Flora of British India records Potentilla sibbalii Hallier.f  with following synonyms:

1. Potentilla sibbaldii Clairv

2. Potentilla sibbaldia Greiss.

3. Sibbaldia procumbens L.

4. Sibbaldia parviflora Willd.

5. Sibbaldia cuneata Edgew.

6. Sibbaldia cuneata Kunze

As it seems these are now considered under two species

1. Sibbaldia procumbens L.       with synonyms Potentilla sibbaldia Greiss. , Potentilla sibbaldii Hallier.f., 

2. Sibbaldia cuneata Hornem ex Kunze

(Sibbaldia parviflora Willd. unresolved and Sibbaldia cuneata Edgew. not mentioned (in Fl. China or the Plant List) except as synonym of S. procumbens in Flora of Pakistan 

Both species are described in Flora of China and differ as under:

S. procumbens: Petals shorter than sepals; floweringt stems prostrate or ascending, 4-30 cm tall; petiole pilose; flowers 4-6 mm in diam.

S. cuneata: Petals equal or longer than sepals; flowering stems erect or ascending; 5-14 cm tall; petiole appressed pilose; flowers 5–7 mm in diam. 

Perhaps close up of flower can help resolve.

-- 

Dr. Gurcharan Singh

Retired  Associate Professor
SGTB Khalsa College, University of Delhi, Delhi-110007
Res: 932 Anand Kunj, Vikas Puri, New Delhi-110018.
Phone: 011-25518297  Mob: 9810359089

http://www.gurcharanfamily.com/ 
http://people.du.ac.in/~singhg45/ 

[Dinesh Valke]

Thank you very much Gurcharan ji for digging into these Sibbaldia.
Attaching cropped pictures showing out-of-focus area.

My recollection:
Could see 2 plants with flowering stems ascending.
 1) about 15 cm max.
 2) about 30 - 40 cm
The flower about 4 mm; looks lesser than sepals in most of the instances.
I do not know about pilose OR appressed pilose petioles. Not sure if it can be made out in these views.

[Prashant Awale]

Dear Dinesh,
I had also uploaded same plant. The petals are longer than the sepals.
Regards
Prashant

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[Dinesh Valke]

Dear Prashant, I saw your upload at https://groups.google.com/d/msg/indiantreepix/5WZGkGM5IG0/LKL1NxdUy2YJ
To me, when I see them in profile view, most of them have the green sepals higher than the yellow petals.
Top views of the flowers give an illusion that the yellow petals are longer.
Will wait for comment(s).
Regards.
Dinesh

[Dinesh Valke]

Dear Gurcharan ji and Prashant, referencing Keshava Murthy's VoF book, Prashant's ID of Sibbaldia parviflora agrees with my plant.
As you have observed, it could be a synonym of Sibbaldia procumbens as put in Flora of Pakistan.
Many thanks to you both for the ID.
Regards.
Dinesh

[Tabish]

This should be Sibbaldia cuneata  Hornem. ex Kuntze
Sibbaldia parviflora Edgw. is a synonym.

Sibbaldia procumbens L. is not an Indian plant. The representation at Flora of Pakistan probably needs revision.

  - Tabish

[Dinesh Valke]

Thank you very much Tabish for the clarity.
Regards.
Dinesh

  - Tabish

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[Gurcharan Singh]

Who knows we may have both in Himalayas. The two plants uploaded cropped by Dinesh ji look definitely different, first suggestive of Sibbaldia cuneata and second with taller habit and shorter petals S. procumbens

Perhaps we need to keep our eyes open when we go to alpine Himalayas next time, important in light of confusion in literature.

-- 

Dr. Gurcharan Singh

Retired  Associate Professor
SGTB Khalsa College, University of Delhi, Delhi-110007
Res: 932 Anand Kunj, Vikas Puri, New Delhi-110018.
Phone: 011-25518297  Mob: 9810359089

http://www.gurcharanfamily.com/ 
http://people.du.ac.in/~singhg45/ 

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[Dinesh Valke]

Gurcharan ji,
Many thanks for your clarification regarding possibility of both species distributed in the Himalaya.

I may have not properly expressed when I wrote:
...................

Could see 2 plants with flowering stems ascending.
 1) about 15 cm max.
 2) about 30 - 40 cm

...................

Both these plants are seen on the same rock in the last photo, put here for quick look;

[Gurcharan Singh]

No Dinesh ji

You only give me the idea and the proof.

-- 

Dr. Gurcharan Singh

Retired  Associate Professor
SGTB Khalsa College, University of Delhi, Delhi-110007
Res: 932 Anand Kunj, Vikas Puri, New Delhi-110018.
Phone: 011-25518297  Mob: 9810359089

http://www.gurcharanfamily.com/ 
http://people.du.ac.in/~singhg45/ 

[J.M. Garg]

As per another thread:

"Should be better identified as S. parviflora

notice petals shorter than calyx, epicalyx shorter than calyx and spreading hairy flowers especially calyx

Dr. Gurcharan Singh"

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With regards,
J.M.Garg

'Creating awareness of Indian Flora & Fauna'
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Also author of 'A Photoguide to the Birds of Kolkata & Common Birds of India'.

[Dinesh Valke]

Thanks Garg ji; will update my notes at flickr soon.

Regards.

Dinesh

[J.M. Garg]

I am keeping observations from the Valley of Flowers at Sibbaldia cuneata Hornem. ex Kuntze only, for the time being.
Pl. see Rosaceae Fortnight: Sibbaldia cuneata and S. procumbens in our database  

 

---------- Forwarded message ---------
From: Dinesh Valke <dinesh...@gmail.com>
Date: Fri, 31 Aug 2012 at 23:40
Subject: [efloraofindia:127718] VoF Week :: DV :: 02 AUG 12 - 0338 :: small herb on rock at Valley of Flowers
To: efloraofindia <indian...@googlegroups.com>

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With regards,
J.M.Garg