Re: diybio testing for horsemeat

[Mega]

Hi. And welcome!

 

Of course there is. In the openlab we have primers for cow-meat, pork, horse, the big edible bird that cannot fly (no idea what it is callled in English ;) )

 

You'll just need to get the primers for ~13 dollar (just guessed that number though) and do a PCR (see youtube).

 

 

Just to mention: I don't understand why this is such a big problem fr the people. Why is it ethically better to kill a pig or a cow than a horse. I believe horse meat contains much less fat than pig, so it would be even healthier.

 

They are so in rage about this that you could assume they found human meat in the food!

 

 

Am Dienstag, 5. März 2013 00:19:20 UTC+1 schrieb Dan Mcquillan:

hi 

re: the horsemeat 'scandal' in the uk

is there a diybio way that people could do their own tests?

apologies for what's probably a newbie question - i'm a diybio beginner. 

dan

[Jeswin]

On Tue, Mar 5, 2013 at 4:19 AM, Mega <masters...@gmail.com> wrote:
> horse, the big edible bird that cannot fly (no idea what it is callled in
> English ;) )
>

Made my day. Big edible bird, lol. Maybe a turkey?

>
> Just to mention: I don't understand why this is such a big problem fr the
> people. Why is it ethically better to kill a pig or a cow than a horse. I
> believe horse meat contains much less fat than pig, so it would be even
> healthier.
>

Probably because it's selling of mislabeled products. No different
than the melamine-milk scandal from China. But really, people should
know that the industrial production of meat is not all "sunshine and
love". Maybe everyone should just read some Upton Sinclair.

[David Murphy]

it's not the fact that it's horse. it could be sheep ,pig or hamster and the problem would be the same. A lot of these companies claimed traceability but it wasn't even the right animal.

sales of horse meat actually went up after it hit the news.

If there's meat from an entirely different animal how do we know that the "beef" doesn't contain brain matter. or substances not classed fit for human consumption.

 

--
-- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups DIYbio group. To post to this group, send email to diy...@googlegroups.com. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to diybio+un...@googlegroups.com. For more options, visit this group at https://groups.google.com/d/forum/diybio?hl=en
Learn more at www.diybio.org
---
You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "DIYbio" group.
To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to diybio+un...@googlegroups.com.
To post to this group, send email to diy...@googlegroups.com.
Visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/diybio?hl=en.

For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/groups/opt_out.

[Andreas Sturm]

I looked it up... It's called ostrich ;) 

That's right.. brain/neuronal matter could transmit Bovine spongiform encephalopathy (BSE) or KJ disease  http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Creutzfeldt%E2%80%93Jakob_disease ... And if they don't tell the truth, how can we believe that they don't throw in brain... Never thought of that before... 

[leaking pen]

put some peanut butter on it and see if it flaps around?

On Mon, Mar 4, 2013 at 4:19 PM, Dan Mcquillan <internet...@gmail.com> wrote:

hi 

re: the horsemeat 'scandal' in the uk

is there a diybio way that people could do their own tests?

apologies for what's probably a newbie question - i'm a diybio beginner. 

dan

--

-- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups DIYbio group. To post to this group, send email to diy...@googlegroups.com. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to diybio+un...@googlegroups.com. For more options, visit this group at https://groups.google.com/d/forum/diybio?hl=en
Learn more at www.diybio.org
---
You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "DIYbio" group.
To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to diybio+un...@googlegroups.com.
To post to this group, send email to diy...@googlegroups.com.
Visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/diybio?hl=en.

To view this discussion on the web visit https://groups.google.com/d/msg/diybio/-/PXg6__PpuEYJ.

[Nathan McCorkle]

On Tue, Mar 5, 2013 at 5:56 AM, Jeswin <phill...@gmail.com> wrote:
> Probably because it's selling of mislabeled products. No different
> than the melamine-milk scandal from China. But really, people should
> know that the industrial production of meat is not all "sunshine and
> love". Maybe everyone should just read some Upton Sinclair.

The melamine in milk was different I think, in that it wasn't simply
mislabeled bioproduct, it was substandard bio-product with a
chem-product added, not for nutrition, but to fool a protein
concentration test.

I recently heard the Pacific Northwest U.S. (where I'm living now) had
the lowest level of mislabeled seafood in the U.S., but that even here
is was still happening quite a lot. Main reason it's lower here in the
PNW... a lot of the seafood is produced locally, meaning it doesn't
get imported, where a lot of mislabeling occurs. It mentioned if a
ship catches/imports too much fish, they'll get fined, so instead they
mislabel as a different fish so they're under the import/catch limit
(which is per species).

I only buy wild-caught fish and try to avoid the bio-accumulator
species, and try to buy only cage-free eggs and meat (and
pastured/grass-fed beef).... so mislabeling is not helpful at all.



--
-Nathan

[Jonathan Cline]

On Tuesday, March 5, 2013 1:19:11 AM UTC-8, Mega wrote:

Just to mention: I don't understand why this is such a big problem fr the people.

RTFM (or in this case some recent news articles).
The horse meat is not known to be human-safe, for example as the horses are treated medically (steroids? antibiotics?  growth hormones?) which remain in the meat and pass onto humans.  Go eat a wild horse, maybe fine, depending on what it was eating during it's lifetime.  Go eat one not certified as safe meat and you could be eating medicines or diseases.  

Ref: http://www.guardian.co.uk/politics/2013/feb/10/contaminated-horsemeat-harm-health

""Last week it emerged that Findus lasagne contained up to 100% horsemeat. ""

""Paterson agreed there would be a whole new ball game if horsemeat had come from Romania contaminated with equine anaemia, known as "horse Aids" even though it is not harmful to humans.""

It is similar to the melamine scandal since this is not an accidental problem but obvious fraud for financial gain.   Suppliers purposely sold unqualified meat.   Then perhaps ironically the meat found it's way into all kinds of processed foods which maybe the suppliers' own children ate, since there is no traceability.  D'oh!


## Jonathan Cline
## jcl...@ieee.org
## Mobile: +1-805-617-0223
########################

[jarlemag]

I recommend the following articles:

Authentication of species in meat products by genetic techniques:

http://link.springer.com/article/10.1007%2Fs00217-010-1417-1?LI=true#page-1

Identification of Meat Species by Polymerase Chain Reaction (PCR) Technique: http://journals.tubitak.gov.tr/veterinary/issues/vet-07-31-3/vet-31-3-3-0601-30.pdf

Detection of Adulteration and Identification of Cat’s, Dog’s, Donkey’s and Horse’s
Meat Using Species-Specific PCR and PCR-RFLP Techniques: http://www.ajbasweb.com/ajbas/2009/1716-1719.pdf

[Jeswin]

On Wed, Mar 6, 2013 at 8:58 AM, jarlemag <jarle...@gmail.com> wrote:
>
> Detection of Adulteration and Identification of Cat’s, Dog’s, Donkey’s and
> Horse’s
> Meat Using Species-Specific PCR and PCR-RFLP Techniques:
> http://www.ajbasweb.com/ajbas/2009/1716-1719.pdf
>

Link above is broken:
http://journals.tubitak.gov.tr/veterinary/issues/vet-07-31-3/vet-31-3-3-0601-30.pdf

That's a good article. I think that's a doable project for anyone with
a PCR machine and access to reagents/primers.

On Tue, Mar 5, 2013 at 10:04 AM, Ellen Jorgensen
<ejorg...@genspace.org> wrote:
> We are doing this now at Genspace with IKEA meatballs! We will let you know
> what we find :-)
>

Looking forward to your results, Ellen.

[Nathan McCorkle]

On Tue, Mar 5, 2013 at 10:23 PM, Jonathan Cline <jnc...@gmail.com> wrote:
>
>
> On Tuesday, March 5, 2013 1:19:11 AM UTC-8, Mega wrote:
>>
>>
>> Just to mention: I don't understand why this is such a big problem fr the
>> people.
>
>
> RTFM (or in this case some recent news articles).
> The horse meat is not known to be human-safe, for example as the horses are
> treated medically (steroids? antibiotics? growth hormones?) which remain in
> the meat and pass onto humans.

I think most of those molecules will be broken down by cooking, things
of concern would probably be more like dioxins or heavy metals.

> Ref:
> http://www.guardian.co.uk/politics/2013/feb/10/contaminated-horsemeat-harm-health

Stability studies of phenylbutazone and phenylbutazone-antacid oral formulations
F. Matsui*, D. L. Robertson, P. Lafontaine, H. Kolasinski, E. G. Lovering
Journal of Pharmaceutical Sciences
Volume 67, Issue 5, pages 646–650, May 1978

"Measurable chemical degradation occurred only at 60°, with several
formulations showing more than 50% degradation by the time the study
was terminated"

http://onlinelibrary.wiley.com/doi/10.1002/jps.2600670519/abstract



--
-Nathan

[Nathan McCorkle]

On Wed, Mar 6, 2013 at 12:57 PM, Nathan McCorkle <nmz...@gmail.com> wrote:
> I think most of those molecules will be broken down by cooking,

s/most/some/

--
-Nathan

[Andreas Sturm]

Well, talking of BSE, the prions need 200°C for 5 hours IIRC. 

--
-Nathan

--
-- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups DIYbio group. To post to this group, send email to diy...@googlegroups.com. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to diybio+un...@googlegroups.com. For more options, visit this group at https://groups.google.com/d/forum/diybio?hl=en
Learn more at www.diybio.org
---

You received this message because you are subscribed to a topic in the Google Groups "DIYbio" group.
To unsubscribe from this topic, visit https://groups.google.com/d/topic/diybio/cPzfEuiZH58/unsubscribe?hl=en.
To unsubscribe from this group and all its topics, send an email to diybio+un...@googlegroups.com.

To post to this group, send email to diy...@googlegroups.com.
Visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/diybio?hl=en.

[Dan Mcquillan]

hi all

thanks for the links to the useful papers.

what's the openlab? ("In the openlab we have primers..")

fyi there's an event in london on friday which sounds like the kind of thing i was aiming for:

"Deptford Market DNA FoodLab" http://www.artscatalyst.org/experiencelearning/detail/Deptford_DNA_FoodLab/

cheers

dan

[Andreas Sturm]

Hi, 

Openlab is kind of part of our university, where students from (equivalent to high school) perform some standardized experiments. 

E.g. they bring their own meat, and there are primers for many species provided. 

in another workshop they do PCR with primers for 35S-Promoter. So they find out if their cornflakes/ whatever contains GMO plants. Farmers' children often bring pig food. And in 70-80% they do find GMOs. (But in our country import and breeding of GM products is heavily forbidden)

Yet another does just extraction of vegetable DNA / DNA from your mouth skin. 

In another they cut plasmids and let em run on a gel, predicting the bands. 

To view this discussion on the web visit https://groups.google.com/d/msg/diybio/-/w-sIvK4Ix6QJ.