Impact of Torulaspora delbrueckii on fermentation

[Antoine Raby]

Hello everyone,

I read in past threads that some of you have used Torulaspora delbrueckii (viniflora prelude, zymaflore alpha, biodiva or even wlp603) in past years. What were your impressions on the fermentation of non-saccharomyces yeast with cider? Did you later innoculate with saccharomyces to complete the fermentation? Is it possible to get this strain for non-commercial cider maker(less than 500g packages). I am very interested to know your opinion on the subject!

Thanks,

Antoine

[Michael Thierfelder]

Hi Antoine,

I've used BioDiva and my impression is that it definitely adds mouth feel and complexity but beyond that I couldn't articulate the je ne said quoi but I do like it in cider. I added a saccharomyces after to complete fermentation, but I would be curious to see what happens if you don't, if the yeasts are tolerant to alcohol enough to go to say 7 or 8%.

You can order it online in 125g packs, they must be kept in the refrigerator, and they are not cheap. Online I think they were about $37 for the small packs.

Mike

[Antoine Raby]

Hi Mike, 

Thanks for the reply, from what I read, some Torulaspora delbrueckii are capable of reaching an alcool level of 9-10%. It could be interesting to test this variety with an ice cider for example to leave some residual sweetness without any addition or intervention. If this variety stops working at a lower abv it could be even more interesting since it would have the potential to be used for cider with a lower potential alcool level and leave some sweetness even with bottle conditioning (like many other cider maker I am still looking for the holy graal of some residual sugar and carbonation!!). For my part, I guess i will place a pre-order on White Lab 603 and wait for the release, 37$ and 125g for biodiva is a bit too much for my small personal production. 

Antoine 

[luis.ga...@gmail.com]

The problem I see with this aproach to reach a cider that contains some residual sugar is that unless you work in a sterile environment or something, you will likely have some saccharomyces or other yeast that will be able to multiply in your ferment and since you still have a certain amount of yeast nutrient in your cider, they will be able to make it to dryness..... I don't think this is a viable approach to reach such cider. Going with the low nutrient approach is much easier (and safer), although pasteurization (with/without back sweetening) is also an option.

Louis

[Antoine Raby]

Louis, you are right about nutrient and potential sacc. yeast(or brett) getting in, that being said, in a low nutrient environment and the potential killing factor of the yeast i think it could be of interest to test this particular strain without the use of sacc.

Antoine

[michael thierfelder]

If you hit your juice with 50ppm SO2 initially, then wait a few days for it to get bound up and for the free SO2 level to drop to 20 or less (requirement for pitching BioDiva ) I’d think any wild yeast already present in the juice would be significantly stunted but it’s probably true that eventually, and before the torrulaspora brings the cider to complete dryness, something in there would kick off and take over. It would still be an interesting experiment, just to see how far the torrulaspora could take things and what the result would be. The cider might not really be repeatable since it’s arbitrary as to how long that lag phase lasts and how aggressively the native yeast are when they wake up.

> On Feb 20, 2018, at 2:43 PM, Antoine Raby <rabya...@gmail.com> wrote:
>
> Louis, you are right about nutrient and potential sacc. yeast(or brett) getting in, that being said, in a low nutrient environment and the potential killing factor of the yeast i think it could be of interest to test this particular strain without the use of sacc.
>
> Antoine
>

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[si...@theciderfactorie.co.nz]

Hi,

Used biodiva last year, one of the best performing yeasts up against wild and aw350, qa23 and others. Fermented to dryness no problem (6-7 alc). Adds fruitiness and body. Ordering more this year.

Simon.