THE GAY PACKET III: FRAMING THE ISSUE OF HOMOSEXUALITY IN SOCIETY

[green...@cobra.uni.edu]

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THE GAY PACKET: Framing the Issue of Homosexuality in Society
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Here is a good example of the desentization that the homosexual community uses
to push their agenda. See if the following is about Civil Rights or behavior.

The Year of the Queer, I was there. By Bob Larson:

"It started with a deafening roar from the women's motorcycle contingent. They
called themselves "Dykes on Bikes." Most of them wore a little more than
leather chaps and tatoos. It was the 24th annual, Lesbian/Gay Freedom Day
Parade. Needless to say, I was shocked and appalled by what I witnessed. It
was the world's largest gay event, 400,000 observers, 240 contingents, and
20,000 participants. It stretched out for 2 miles. The theme
was 'The Year of the Queer.' That was their term, not mine. According to the
San Francisco press, there seemed to be a better mood than the previous ones,
fewer hostile watchers who took offense to gay hand holding, and nipple rings.
That tells me something. In the era of the Clinton crowd, this era is one in
which Americans have become more desensitized than ever to immoral lifestyles.
No wonder the mood was upbeat. The homosexual community has something to be
happy about. They are celebrating the year of the queer, a year that has seen
the election of a pro-gay president. There is even a cover story on lesbians
in NewsWeek. There has been a spirited debate over ending the ban on gays in
the military and openly gay Roberta Actinburg has been appointed by President
Clinton is under secretary of the department of Housing and Urban
Development. Sticking out his chest in full pride for all to see, strutting
down the street in high-heeled shoes, they celebrated the largest tourist
attraction in the city of San Francisco. It was held on the weekend closest
to the anniversary of the protest and riot that followed a 1969 police raid on
the Stonewall Bar in NYC. The Stonewall Riots led by Drag Queens are widely
regarded as the start of the modern gay rights movement. However, out of the
400,000 people who were there, San Francisco mayor Frank Jordan was not there.
Just before the parade began, Jordan abruptly cancelled his plans to ride in it
because several groups threatened to protest his presence, groups like "Act up"
threatened demonstrations protesting Mayor Jordan's proposed budget, which
they were concerned cut deeply into programs for AIDS patients. And GET
THIS, these individuals who wish special rights, who would have us to believe
that they are just like the rest of us, peaceful, loving, patriotic Americans
so concerned the police that they believed Mayor Jordan's life was in danger
if he participated in the parade. And one of the things that upset
them was the fact that Jordan had appointed to the Human Rights Commission a
minister who had said, "The gay lifestyle was an abomination against God." Now
get this folks, a minister in America could not clearly speak his mind without
bringing down such wrath that the mayor feared for his life. The man was the
pastor of Ebeneezer Baptist Church and he stood by his comments. He said,
"It's sad people have AIDS but it says right there in Scripture that the
homosexual lifestyle is an abomination against God and I have to preach that
Homosexuality is a sin." Well, the people representing the gay community came
back and declared that he had no place on a commission that they said,
"was established to ensure that all San Franciscans are accorded full equality,
dignity, and respect." What exactly went on? Well, as I said, the parade was
kicked off by 300 partially-clad dykes on Harleys, Hondas, BMWs and Yamahas.
Men in drag marched the whole parade in 5 inch heals. Talk about blisters,
let alone some sore calves afterward. One drag queen in heels sprinted the
whole parade route. Parade spectators punched their fists in the air
continually yelling out "WORK IT GIRL! WORK IT GIRL!" to the Dykes on Bikes,
"WORK IT GIRL!" I spotted one female spectator on the parade route getting
excited by these dykes on bikes. As they came roaring by, she would pull up
her T-shirt exposing her naked breasts. She even dropped her shorts down
around here ankles and gyrated her body, screaming "WORK IT GIRL!" She
challenged some of the Dykes on Bikes to take it off. Gays dressed in female
cheerleader uniforms ran twittering down the streets waving their pom-poms,
pursing their bubble gum pink lipstick painted lips.
And instead of balloons, paraders threw condoms in the crowd.
One gay male had condoms neatly tucked into his g-string. And as
he walked pass the spectators, he would have gay men standing on the side
lines slowly pull the condoms out of the g-string and whistle while they did
it. One person was wearing a costume constructed of a 6 foot cardboard box that
was painted to look like a movie camera with the title "The Gay Agenda" painted
on it. CHILDREN by the thousands watched the parade. They nonchalantly
blew bubbles. Some marched with other parade revellers. They should have been
terrified, but they weren't. And people dying of AIDS were pushed in
wheelchairs down the parade route. I remember seeing one of them, an AIDS
victim so weak, he was prone in this special wheelchair that was kind of made
itself into a bed. His 80 lb skeletal frame was draped in a flimsy yellow
sunflower dress. That's right! He was dressed in drag, dying, as he feebly
smiled, waved a flag at the crowd. The lesbian who was in charge of lining up
the participants in the parade wore a transparent body stocking. You could see
everything, inducing 100s of bloody welts produced by ripped skin. I am
talking about her rear, her thighs, her buttocks. It even looked like there
were baseball-induced bruises on her lower thighs. Her nipples were pierced.
One of her friends approached her and instead of telling her to go to a doctor
for having been sadomasochistically beaten by another lesbian, she just wished
her a Happy Birthday. Many women wore spike dog collars. That's it! That's
all! Nothing! Nothing else, but a pair of panties, just a spiked dog
collar. Many of the lesbians, had tatoos. Most of them had pierced nipples.
How do I know? Their breasts were exposed. They wore lace, leather, feathers,
body stockings, hats, torn Levis, fish net stockings, spandex, latex, vinyl
reptile skin, you name it. One of the lesbians wore a topless wedding gown.
Sensuality was the name of the game. Many lesbians hugged, kissed, licked each
other, french-kissed, grabbed each other's breasts, buns, and crotches.
One lesbian drug her girlfriend behind her on a leash, like a dog. The
lesbian in submission was topless. She wore a leather harness that bound
her arms behind her back. Both has pierced breasts and noses. A couple of
lesbians wore viper black leather jackets. It said, "Vipers" and they fondled
each others breasts, and imitated sex by rhythmically rubbing each others'
pelvises up and down against each other, moaning, clutching against the other for
better friction.
Then one of them grabbed the other's naked rear and dug her long
blood red finger nails into the flesh. They flicked their tongues at each
other and stuck their tongues down each others' throats. I remember one
particularly disturbing lesbian couple. One of them was topless with pierced
nipples, clad and a sadomasochistic leather outfit. They had brought along
their 10 year old daughter who looked just like an average little girl, except
she WAS IN LESBIAN LEATHER. She rode on the bicycle with her 2 mothers, her
barbie dolls hanging from one of the saddle bags on mom's Harley.
Bullwhips were the accessory of the day.
Lesbians whipped each other with their 20 foot long bullwhips. The
lesbians continually referred to each other as "BITCH! BITCH!
BITCH!" It says something about their interpersonal relationships. One
lesbian grabbed her friend and pulled up her shirt to reveal her lover's pierced
nipples. Then she said, "Just think, Lynne is a pharmacist." The men had on
jewelry, high heels, wigs, stockings, bras, dresses, and full stage makeup.
Who marched in the parade? That was interesting! Main stream America was
represented. There were Homosexual paramedics, the San Francisco Fire
Department was there, the gay and lesbian fire fighters with their dalmatians
led the way and danced sensuously on top of a SF fire truck. One of the
antigades projects, contingents was represented by a float with men dancing in
g-strings and bustieas (sp). There was even a group of nuns who marched with a
sign that said, "NUNS SAY NO TO NUNN," referring to Senator Sam Nunn. One
group was called the "Bay Area Young Positives." There were lesbians and
gays 26 years and younger who danced suggestively on a float. There was a
group of "Straights for gay rights," a group of parents and friends of
lesbian lovers. The families walked along side their gay children, hand in hand
with their gay children who were hand in hand with their lovers. One mother had
a sign that read, "WE LOVE OUR LESBIAN DAUGHTER." There was a group of
homosexual parents. They called themselves "The San Francisco Baby Group."
They wheeled infants in strollers. One carried a sign that read, "HATE IS NOT
A FAMILY VALUE." There were lesbian physicians, homosexual lawyers, gay bar
patrons. One of these groups had a float with a life-sized Jesus on a cross
and the homosexuals on the float danced like Roman revellers.
The San Francisco police department and its gay division was represented.
So were the CALIFORNIA TEACHERS ASSOCIATION
and should we be surprised, the NATIONAL EDUCATION ASSOCIATION,
Latino Lesbians and Bisexuals for Political Action, the Asian-Pacific Lesbian
Alliance, the United Farm Workers Gay and Lesbians, even a contingency of gay
American legionnaires, Gay Lesbian Therapists Association, a Journal
Association, and FLAG (Federal Lesbian and Gay Employees), even gay employees of
AT&T, and as they passed by, they would say, "WE'LL PAY YOU $75 TO SWITCH."
There were the "Sisters of Perpetual Indulgence" as they called themselves, Drag
Queens dressed as nuns, and the Janus Society, who believe sadomasochism
should be the order of the day. The slogans were interesting. I saw signs,
pictures, T-shirts that said, "2, 4, 6, 8, MANY OF US AREN'T STRAIGHT,"
said by CALIFORNIA TEACHERS ASSOC., bragging about HOMOSEXUALITY BEING
TAUGHT IN THE CLASSROOMS IN FRONT OF YOUR CHILDREN. One man carried a sign
that said, "I WANT TO SHOWER WITH A TERRIFIED MARINE." Another carried a sign
showing a man masturbating and they intended to have a pun, tongue-in-cheek, on
the subject of stopping AIDS. It was a "Stop AIDS project." So they showed
the picture of the man masturbating with the sign saying "BEAT IT LONG! BEAT IT
HARD! BEAT IT GOOD! BEAT AIDS!" Get it? "DYKES TAKE OVER THE WORLD!" said
one sign. Another one said "F___ YOUR OWN GENDER." "HATE IS NOT A FAMILY
VALUE." One contingent chanted "2, 4, 6, 8, HOW DO YOU KNOW YOUR GRANDMOTHER
IS STRAIGHT." These were the gay and lesbian seniors. These were the old
folks. The gay therapist chanted "2, 4, 6, 8, DON'T ASSUME YOUR SHRINK IS
STRAIGHT." And there was even a group of gay bankers that chanted "2, 4, 6, 8,
HOW DO YOU KNOW YOUR BANK IS STRAIGHT?" You don't think they want to recruit
and proselytize. One sign said, "GET YOUR WHOLE FAMILY OUT OF THE CLOSET."
Another sign said, "LEGALIZE GAY AND LESBIAN ADOPTIONS." A lesbian-gay parent-
ing group walked hand in hand with small children. T-shirts said, "I'M THE MOM,
SO IS SHE." One gay-parent group carried a sign that said, "WE LOVE OUR GAY
AND LESBIAN CHILDREN AND GOD DOES TOO." Favorite T-shirts were the picture
of Tipper and Hillary having lesbian sex. There were signs that said "EAT (and
it was a reference---a term I won't use---to the vagina), not cows." There was
a contingent of vagitarians, as they called themselves. Not
vegetarians---vagitarians. Think about the sickness of that. One T-shirt
said, "I CAN'T EVEN MARCH STRAIGHT." Another one that I won't even explain to
you because it is too disgusting to me, "Eroticize my fist." I will only tell
you that it is in reference to one of the homosexual practices of inserting
the fist and the arm into the anus of a lover for sexual excitement. One
lesbian had a sign with a meat tenderizer attached to it. It read, "FUTURE PTA
MEMBER." In celebration of gay parenting, they carried plackers showing sperm.
The sign read, "NO SACRED SPERM." Two lesbians, who were cheered wildly,
walked down the street, holding a sign between them that on the front read,
"LONG TERM RELATIONSHIP, 10 YEARS TOGETHER" and on the back it read "STILL
DOING IT AFTER ALL THESE YEARS." Now contemplate that for a moment. Long term
love. Get it? With the gays and lesbians, a long term relationship is ten
years. That is their idea of a long term relationship. And these are the
people who want to force employers to provide death, health, bereavement,
medical benefits to gays who have lovers. And how many times are they planning
on switching lovers, and how many kinds of domesticated relationships would an
employer have to underwrite. Can you imagine the legal and litigious nightmare
that would exist. The rainbow is everywhere. It has become a sign of the gay
community embracing every form of sexuality imaginable. The promise of God,
the Noaic covenant, the rainbow has now been turned into a homosexual symbol.
How sad! What else did I see? Topless lesbians draped with fruit, a
crucified, nude woman depicted on the back of a man's black, leather jacket,
jumbo-sized lesbians with nipple rings, medieval dress on a sadomasochistic
biker gay man, a sign on the back of a dyke on bike that read, "NO GUILT."
Truer to life and Scripture than they could imagine, with some lesbians wearing
signs that read, "DAMNED LESBIAN." There were lesbians carrying children,
lesbians leading their lovers by chain, lesbians fondling other lesbians,
lesbians as vampires. I walked up to one lesbian, topless with nipple rings,
who had her front teeth cosmetically altered to create 2 fangs. They were
permanent. She didn't just have them for the event. "What do you do with
them?" I asked. She said, "What do you think I do to my lover?" She bit her
own arm and drew blood. I saw women biting the necks of other women to draw
blood. Perhaps most disturbing with the gay and lesbian parenting groups,
pushing little children in strollers, they carried a sign which read, "WE
PLEDGE ALLEGIANCE TO THE RAINBOW FLAG OF THE UNITED STATES OF AMERICA AND TO
THE DIVERSITY FOR WHICH IT STANDS, WORKING TOGETHER IN DIGNITY AND LOVE WITH
LIBERTY AND JUSTICE FOR ALL." One car, driven by a gay man, has a liscense
plate that read "PROM QUEEN." One man had a giant dildo, a mock penis, that
extended about 3 feet. There was a contingent of gay witches, that had a
banner with a pentagram on it that said, "Witches heal." Two gay guys marched
down the street in high-heels, constantly kissing one another, carrying a sign
that said, "DON'T ASK. IT'S CLEAR. WE'RE QUEER. DON'T TELL. THANK GOD, WE'RE
GAY." There were gyas who were dressed as monks, a horned-man standing next to
a nude woman, a man dressed as a giant, yellow condom, a gay parent with a sign
that said, "I RAISED MY CHILD WITH LOVE AND PRIDE, AND ON THIS DAY, I'M ON HER
SIDE. WITH HER LOVER WE MARCH TODAY TO TELL THE WORLD I'M PROUD THEY'RE GAY."
Signs said, "LEGALIZE GAY AND LESBIAN ADOPTIONS" "LEGALIZE GAY MARRIAGE"
"GOD LOVES GAYS" "SUPPORT DOMESTIC PARTNERSHIPS" "REPEAL SODOMY LAWS" and
there were the gay and lesbian avengers who carried signs that read (making no
bones about it), "WE RECRUIT!!" There was a man who had a g-string with a
string attached to the end of his penis. Men led other men in dog collars by
chains. There was a naked lesbian on stilts, who had other lesbians walk under
her legs faining her you know what. I saw one man on a float wearing something
which barely covered his genitals. He stuck his finger in his mouth and licked
his anus with it. There were many in wheelchairs, AIDS victims who looked like
they were ready to die. It could only happen in America. There were visitors
from other countries. Their comments were rather interesting. One man was
from England. He said, "THIS WOULD NEVER HAPPEN IN ENGLAND!" A man from
South Africa said, "THIS WOULD NEVER HAPPEN IN SOUTH AFRICA IN A MILLION
YEARS!" A young girl from Spain said, "GAY COUPLES IN SPAIN DON'T HAVE THIS
KIND OF FREEDOM." After what I have just described to you, listen now to who
else was represented. Roberta Actinburg, the woman nominated by Bill Clinton,
the President of the United States, as undersecretary for the Department of
Housing and Urban Development. She received the longest and the loudest cheers
and she has a gay lover, has been pictured with her gay lover, and is the top
official ever appointed to a government post by a president, who has declared
themselves openly gay or lesbian. One of the local reporters said of her
appearence, "IT WAS ALL VERY SWEET AND GOOD NATURED, JUST LIKE EVERYTHING ELSE
ABOUT THE PARADE. JESSE HELMS WOULDN'T SHOW MOMENTS LIKE THESE ON HIS VIDEO
TAPE." This is the woman who tried to stop funding of the Boy Scouts because
they didn't allow homosexuals. Bob Hatoi, assistant to the President,
surrounding by Secret Service men, rode in the back of an open convertible with
his lover. Hatoi is dying of AIDS. He has a gay lover. They openly displayed
their affections before the hundreds of thousands who were gathered there. He
represented the President of the United States, and the sign on the side of the
car said so. Keith Minoll (sp), petty officer, kicked out of the Navy, fought
it in the courts, who came out of the closet on National television rode in a
yellow convertible with a liscense plate that read, "That boy!" The SF
Sheriff was there. Folks, perhaps most disgusting was to see the endorsement
of what took place from a political standpoint. I watched this for 4 solid
hours. I took scores of pictures to document what I had seen. For the most
part were freely taken and the people who were marching would stop in the
middle of the street and pose for me suggestively. At one point, 2 topless,
nipple pierced, leather clad lesbians decided they would put on a public
display of sadomasochism. One of them leaned over, exposed her buttocks,
grabbed her ankles while the other took out a 20 foot bull whip and began to
beat her. I started taking pictures of it. I was attacked. What was
interesting is that about 45 minutes earlier I had turned to my wife who was
with me and said, "WATCH THAT MAN OVER THERE." Do you know how I have
explained to you how some homosexuals become demon possessed because of their
conduct, and how I have dealt with them and learned to spot them, "THAT MAN HAS
A DEMON." Well, I became so preoccupied with taking the photographs and with
taking notes about what I saw going on I had forgotten to keep an eye on this
guy. And the next thing I know, him and his lover were accosting me
physically. They threatened my wife physically. They grabbed and threatened
me physically. They screamed and yelled that I was a hatemonger. And what
angered them was that I was taking a picture of two topless lesbians beating
each other with bullwhips. And he said to me, 'ARE YOU GOING TO SHOW THAT TO
THE REST OF THE COUNTRY?' Now this was being done on Market Street, the
financial center of SF, in front of 400,000 people and he was worried that the
rest of the country was going to see this. He said, "YOU JUST WANT TO SEE THE
NEGATIVE SIDE OF THIS." I said, "EXCUSE ME, WHERE WAS THE POSITIVE SIDE?" If
this went on, why should I not be allowed to show it? I said to him as they
accosted me, "HEY I'M ON A PUBLIC STREET. THIS IS AMERICA. GET YOUR HANDS OFF
ME," at which point they jammed my camera, ripped the film out of it and threw
it into the crowd. "YOU'LL NEVER SHOW THAT FILM TO AMERICA," they bragged.
My wife became frightened. A riot was about to erupt. She frantically looked
about for a police officer. There was none in sight. In fact, we had to walk
over a mile afterwards to find a police officer. Police officers were
stationed at the end and the beginning of the parade, 2 miles apart, and I
walked the entire parade route and never saw another cop. Now imagine, 400,000
people, not one police officer. And imagine would you, if on any other day at
any other time a woman walked topless down the street OR if a man with his
penis in clear view were to march down market street, they would be arrested
for indecent exposure. But this was a moral free zone. Ironically some signs
said, "HATE FREE ZONE." But the hate directed toward me, the violence directed
toward me was vicious, and I knew we were in trouble. I managed to get my
camera back, tried to get them to calm down. They threatened to beat me, I got
free, ran across the street, we jumped a fence, and lost ourselves in the
crowd. By the way, it wasn't the only time I was accosted. At one point and
must have bumped a young lady standing next to me. I don't know that I did but
I must have. I guess my camera must have bumped into her. The next thing I
knew, a 4 foot 10 inch butched dyke screamed four letter words at me and
doubled up her fists and started punching me in the chest. "YOU BUMPED MY
WIFE," she screamed. What do you do in a situation like that? You don't hit a
woman! You can't fight back. And she was encouraging the crowd, as the others
were, to attack me. Naturally I backed off. The gays would have you to
believe that they are kind, loving, peaceful people, only interested in
achieving equality. I'll tell you this. What I saw was an environment of
HATE, hatred toward decency, hatred toward Godliness, hatred toward anything
that represented normalacy. And maybe one of the most ironic signs that they
carried said "LOVE YOUR BODY!" Love your body? Love your body so much that
you are willing to risk killing it from AIDS. It was an incredibly sensual
environment. Stroking, patting, licking, touching, feeling. This parade is
about sex, because the gay community is about sex. That's its obsession. Some
homosexuals were handsome. Some were ugly. Some were sweet. Some were mean.
But I guess if I had to describe the dominant attitude, it had nothing to do
with equality and beauty, it was defiance, it was "IN YOUR FACE." The smell of
pot and half digested booze permeated the air and hung there sickningly. The
smell made you nauseas. I suppose the alcohol gave them some liquid courage to
literally let it all hang out. And you know by the time I had watched this for
4 hours, normal and weird, straight and gay became blurred and even "I" was a
victim of descensitization, because you have seen so much of this for 4 solid
hours and it so sickened you emotionally, spiritually, physically, you just
can't cope with it anymore. It goes into a kind of ammoral haze. After a
while, you literally couldn't tell who was male, who was female. The women who
were lesbians seemed to want to pride themselves in their freedom, in their
femininity, and yet they showed it by beating each other with bullwhips. The
signs and slogans on posters and T-shirts continually extolled love, but what I
saw were cheap sexual thrills and degredation. The word love was there because
the forces of darkness compelling all this wanted to make it all look
acceptible. But it really didn't look like love, and it didn't feel like love.
It wasn't love that caused women to beat other women. It wasn't love that made
men lead other men down the streets in dog collars. It was brutalization and
exploitation. For 4 hours, nothing was private. Nothing sexual was special.
Anything that had to do with the human body or human intimacy was raw, exposed,
and disrespected. Maybe, one of the flyers handed out said it all, "PROTECT
YOUR RIGHTS!" And what were the rights they demanded? Here's what it is all
about folks. I read to you from the flyer. 1)marriage 2)living together
3)children 4)adoption 5)surrogacy 6)Foster parenting 7)guardianship
8)Powers of attourney 9)artificial insemination 10)insurance 11)state
planning 12)renting/buying property 13)child custody. Those are the special
rights they want accorded without the recognition of heterosexual monogamy.
But the Word of God says very plainly in Leviticus 18 "Thou shalt not lie with
man kind like with woman kind. It is an abomination." Jude 6-7 "Even the
cities of Sodom and Gommorah gave them selves to fornication and went after
strange flesh are set forth as an example, having suffered the vengence of
eternal fire." Genesis 1 says, "God created man in his own image male and
female." The year of the queer was an attempt to blur that distinction and
commit the ultimate blasphemy. For just as man's relationship to God is spoken
of in the New Testiment in conjugal terms, Christ is the groom turning for the
church, the bride, so it is that Satan wishes to, in these last days, blur that
line of gender identification distinction because it mocks the heart of the
gospel, the consumative relationship, spiritually speaking, between Christ and
his church, the spiritual intimacy by which we know him is ridiculed by the
suggestion that a man may sexually co-habit with a man and a woman with a
woman. And only those who know the mercy and grace of Jesus Christ will be
able to carry a message to Bill Clinton's homosexual America that they don't
have to belong to the Year of the Queer, that they can be apart of the Kingdom
of God, set free from the bounds of perversion by the mercy and grace and the
victory given to us by his death, burial, and resurrection.

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New Gay Magazine Publishes National Directory of Public Sex Spots: 'Steam' list
may include your favorite park or department store.
Source: The Lambda Report, Sept. 1993/ Steam magazine

"City of [....] Rest Area. On the north bank of the [....] River, just
just off Hwy. [....], at the foot of the [....] bridge, on the parklike
historic Fort [....]. Most gay activity goes on along the river, under
bridge, and around a pond known as 'Crazy Lake.' Look for the
discarded rubbers. Police authorities are aware, but seldom molest
discreet cruisers. Gate is locked at sundown; not recommended after
dark, due to drug activity."

"The above is an excerpt from the current issue of STEAM, a new quarterly
journal dedicated unapologetically to 'gay and bisexual men with an interest in
public and semi-public sex.' One of STEAM's regular features is a national
directory of meeting places to help gays locate partners for anonymous sexual
encounters. The directory in isue number two, entitled 'Outdoor Action: Summer
1993,' lists hundreds of sex spots in outdoor areas like public parks or under
bridges, as well as various 'tearooms' in shopping malls and department stores.
'Tearooms' are public men's rest rooms where homosexuals meet to have anonymous
sex with each other. STEAM's readers are credited for supplying most of the
information in the magazine.

"With the flippant disclaimer, 'It is not our intent to encourage illegal
activity (much as we may enjoy it ourselves),' the magazine's editors offer
tips on where and when partners for anonymous encounters can be located, and
which areas are more risky due to police patrols.

"STEAM lists 'tearooms' allegedly located inside famous department store
chains, including Bloomingdale's Sears, J.C. Penny, and Hecht's, as well as
those in malls and shopping centers across the country.

"The name J.C. Penny appears several times in STEAM's listings, in various
states---a shock for Penny's spokesman Duncan Muir, who told LR he had no idea
why the company was named. 'We certainly do not condone having our company's
name used in this listing.' said Muir.

"'J.C. Penny is aware of this problem in some our stores and has been taking
appropriate action,' he said. 'We will not olerate it and will do everything
in our power to prevent it. We will do what is reasonable in each individual
situation, ranging from randomly monitoring rest rooms to calling in local
police for assistance.'

"For their part, STEAM's editors (Scott O'Hara is publisher and editor) condemn
any notion---even from so called 'assimilationist' gays---that their cause is
wrong. Under the headline 'Gay/Sexual Pride,' an unsigned editorial in the
summer issue outlines STEAM's credo:
We believe sex is natural, beautiful, and generally a good thing,
whether in public or private. We believe 'The Public'...to get over
it---because we've always had sex in public, we always will, and it's
obscene than reading a book...

"Further on, STEAM's editorialist writes that 'Gay Pride' means much more than
attending an annual parade:

It's what you do about your sexuality the other 364 days of the year
that matters in your psyche. And hiding your sex in a darkened
with drawn curtains, doesn't strike me as an indicator of a healthy
mind in a healthy body. 'Flaunting it' on the beach, in a park, in a
tearoom, or on the street, whether with your lover or with a lovable
stranger---now there's my idea of real Gay Pride.

"The directory, if it is to be taken seriously, is a clear indication that
anonymous homosexual acts are literally going on all around us. Yet many gay
activists dismiss the notion that the homosexuals as a group are more
promiscuous than heterosexuals.

"While some of STEAM's listings are identifiable gay bars and bathhouses, the
vast majority are rest areas and public parks---the places many people choose
for family outings. More than half of the areas listed are outdoors, where the
reader is instructed to follow paths through the bushes to a certain site where
other homosexuals are likely to be waiting.

"Tips like 'Look for the discarded rubbers' expose a significant health
risk---e.g. to children who may wander innocently into a sex area and com in
contact with AIDS-infected condoms left behind from a gay orgy the night
before.

"Typical of STEAM's evaluations of local police are the following: 'Police make
regular sweeps, but usually just tell guys to 'move along'' and 'Closes at 11pm
and the police do cruise through after that, and they can get very nasty,'"

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Gay Hate Crimes (and Hateful Speech)
The Lambda Report
September 1993

"Homosexual columnist Dan Savage of the Seattle newspaper The Stranger let
loose another barrage of prank and hate calls after printing Lambda Report's
toll-free number in his column.

"After receiving copies of LR's first two issues, Savage (who earlier maligned
LR's publishers, the Report) wrote that the newsletter is full of 'lies, hate,
distortion, and bullsh__ about queers.' He was particularly upset by LR's
regular column 'Gays can Change,' which he said features the 'stories of
serious[ly] twisted, self hating...ex-gay guys.' Savage said 'sexual
orientation' is 'immutable' and that former homosexuals have merely 'stopped
having sex.'

"The gay writer's column, entitled 'Savage Love,' fell short of its billing.
Savage encouraged his readers to call LR's 800-number with 'hot tips' about
homosexuality. He told non-gays to call and 'let LR know that not all breeders
[heterosexuals] are small-minded, homophobic, rightwing, flat-earth
motherf___ers.' Savage also advised callers to use a pay phone if they didn't
want their number traced, warning that hang-ups and harrassing calls were
illegal.

"The latter advice went unheeded. In the hours and days after Savage's column
hit the streets, the LR was pestered with hang-up calss and those from people
who said they dialed only to make LR pay for the call. Some phoned in
repeatedly for that purpose. The campaign went national after Savage's column
was reprinted by a gay activist over the computer bulletin board 'Internet.'

"A smattering of callers talked civilly with LR personnel, but most were intent
on heckling or worse. Several men made crude references to gay sex acts that
simply cannot be printed here. Below is just a sampling of the Savage-inspired
fare:
->'What you're doing borders on the illegal.'
->'God loves you even though you're a pile of sh__.'
->'We know who you are. We're watching you...'
One caller who volunteered that he makes upward of $70,000 a year scolded LR
for encouraging 'discrimination' against homosexuals. When it was suggested
that he and other gays were excelling in the workplace without special
protections, he became irate.

"A special letter-to-the-editor by an elderly Iowa man earned him the type of
harrassment from gay activists that will make him 'couch his words' the next
time he complains about anything pro-gay. Of course, that is the goal of
homosexual intimidators.

"Harold Smith---a pseudonym for the actual writer, who asked LR not to use his
real name---wrote the Des Moines Register newspaper in March and complained
about an article by reporter Elliot Nusbaum. It ridiculed, among other things,
the concerns of citizens over the showing of a film depicting male homosexual
sex acts to University of Iowa students.

"Smith, a Des Moines resident wrote the Register saying that Nusbaum's article
'could have been authored for the shoddy sheets of the Washington Blade,'
D.C.'s homosexual newspaper, in that it 'extolled the underground virtues of
sexual degeneracy versus the sins of organized religions...'

"After his letter---and address---were published in the Register, Smith
received an angry call from a gay man who protested that he and his boyfriend
attend church every Sunday. Smith said the man started 'haranguing' him told
the homosexual lifestyle is wrong.

"About 15 minutes later, Smith said a pizza delievery truck arrived at his door
asking payment for a pricey pizza he never ordered. A few minutes later,
another delivery truck from a different pizza chain arrived, also carrying an
unrequested pizza.

"Within about 10 minutes of the second bogus delivery, Smith received a phone
call from a woman who blurted out, 'Well, how did you like your pizza?' and
then hung up. He and his wife presumed the call was an angry lesbian. The
elderly couple received a few more harrassing phone calls the Sunday the articl
appeared.

"In the future, Smith said, 'I would still write but I'd certainly have to
couch my words more...I don't relish the thought of receiving any more
harrassment, and who knows what extent it will go.'"

"The phone message on William Devlin's answering machine is a distressing sign
of the times:
'Hello this is Bill Devlin. If this is one of our friends calling, at
the sound of the tone please leave a message. If this is someone calling from
the homsexual community with a death threat or verbal intimidation, I hope you
have the courage of your convictions to leave your name and home phone number
because we'd love to be back in touch with you...'
The verbal abuse that led to Devlin's pre-emptive phone tag stemmed from his
leading role in turning back a 'domestic partner' bill in Philadelphia that
would have granted legal recognition to live-in homosexual couples. Such
legislation has become a priority of gay activists nationwide.

"Devlin is director of the Philedelphia Christian Action Council. The
religious-led, multi-ethnic coalition of which he was a member waged an
effective grassroots campaign that flooded City Hall with petitions and letters
opposing the pro-gay legislation.

"The pro-family coaltion won a come-from-behind victory, leaving homosexual
activists furious and vengeful. On August 14, pink and black posters targeting
Devlin began appearing on Philadelphia utility poles calling on people to
'PHONE ZAP THIS MAN!' The posters included his name, home address, and a
paragraph describing his role in defeating the gay 'partners' bill.

"The next days, activists began phoning Devlin's house to say that he and his
family should be dead. One man called at 1:00 in the morning to say, 'I'm
calling for all the queers in Philadelphia, and you should drop dead.'
Another: 'You and your family deserve to die.'

"Of course, Devlin's cohorts shared in the abuse. In May, Cardinal Anthony
Bevilacqua, Catholic Archbishop of Philadelphia, and his spokesman Jay Devine
were crudely mocked in an editorial cartoon in the Philadelphia Gay News.
Photos of each of their heads were superimposed atop nude male torsos, with the
Cardinal's dialogue insinuating a sexual relationship with Devine."

********************************************************************************
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Newsgroups: talk.religion.misc
Subject: church attacked by homosexuals
Message-ID: <2c8vd8$h...@b8.b8.ingr.com>
From: jsp...@b8.b8.ingr.com (Joey Paul)
Date: 15 Nov 1993 16:21:28 -0600
Organization: Intergraph Corporation, Huntsville, AL
NNTP-Posting-Host: b8.b8.ingr.com
Lines: 356

==================================================================
Press Release from the Hamilton Square Baptist Church, 1212 Geary
Street at Franklin, San Francisco, California, USA 94109,
Ph: 415-673-8586 David C. Innes, Pastor
==================================================================
Copied and distributed with permission as published by the church.
==================================================================

September 23, 1993

Dear Fellowsoldier in Christ;

Last Sunday evening, September 19, at our 6:00 PM service, our
church was stormed by a mob of rioting homosexuals and lesbians.
They came to protest the presence of Reverend Lou Sheldon of the
Traditional Values Coalition. Because of the political
stranglehold that the homosexual community has on this city, they
were allowed to commit numerous criminal violations with impunity.

I am enclosing two items: an official accounting of some of the
events that took place that evening, and an information sheet
listing the names, addresses, and phone numbers of the city
officials responsible for this travesty against our church and our
religious freedoms.

What has happened here will be happening all across America if
God's people do not establish a beachhead, draw the line and take
their stand.

I am pleading for your help. Here's what you can do:

1. Carefully read the enclosed materials and invest some of your
money on long distance phone calls to each of the city officials on
the list. Remember that we are on Pacific time.
2. If you would prefer, write a letter to each of the city
officials on the list. I believe that phone calls would be more
effective.
3. Copy these materials on you copy machine and distribute them to
all of your people, requesting that they also call or write.
4. Send copies of these materials to those on your mailing list.

Please consider carefully that if they can do this to us here in
San Francisco, this kind of tragedy will soon spread across the
country. Brethren, pray that you never see this happen to your
church.

The people of our church have responded to this incident with
courage and grace. It is our prayer that God will save many of
these precious people who are lost and in spiritual darkness, and
make them trophies of His grace. God has not commissioned us to
hate sinners and seek their destruction, but rather to love them
and give them the good news of the gospel as their only hope.

We are rejoicing in the Lord. We shall press on in our service for
Him with joy, courage, and zeal. God is on the throne and we will
always be triumphant in Him. Our goal is the exaltation of Christ
and the glory of God.

Brethren, pray for us.

With warm Christian regards,

David C. Innes

==================================================================
NEWS RELEASE: OFFICIAL STATEMENT BY DR. DAVID C. INNES
==================================================================

The following events took place on Sunday evening, September 19,
1993 revolving around the regularly scheduled 6:00 PM Sunday
Evening Worship Service of the Hamilton Square Baptist Church, 1212
Geary St., San Francisco, California. Reverend Lou Sheldon, of the
Traditional Values Coalition, was invited by the church to be the
guest speaker.

Only the church's membership and regular attenders were notified of
the service, through the church's own Sunday bulletin. No public
notice or invitation was made in addition to this. However, in the
September 16, 1993 edition of the BAY AREA REPORTER, the meeting
was announced in a front page article using intemperate,
inflammatory language. A three-by-five ad on page five of the
September 15, 1993 edition of the SAN FRANCISCO SENTINEL announced
a protest of the Sunday night service. The church has no knowledge
of how, or from whom they obtained the information.

The church received telephone calls during the week prior to the
meeting, demanding that our guest speaker should not come. Two
people came to the church during that week asking to see the pastor
and, speaking to the caretaker, notified him that we could not have
Rev. Sheldon as a guest speaker in our church, and that they
intended to stop him.

The church's pastor, Dr. David C. Innes, made at least four calls
to the Northern (Police) Station prior to the meeting, on Saturday
and Sunday afternoon regarding the demonstration, expressing his
concern for potential problems. He called the Northern Station
immediately before the service, and requested more police backup
because he felt the situation was not under control. He was
informed that no backup would be sent unless requested by police
that were present and further, that they had not requested it. Dr.
Innes was told, "You must understand. This is San Francisco."

Homosexual and lesbian demonstrators began gathering around the
church property as early as 5:00 PM. The police were immediately
notified by telephone of their presence. As people entered the
building, demonstrators handed out flyers purporting to be
published by the church. These were also placed upon automobile
windshields in the immediate area. By 6:00 PM a riot was under
way. The rioters assumed complete control of the exterior property
and grounds of the church. In spite of several requests to have
them removed the officer in charge insisted that everything was
under control and that police procedures and regulations would not
allow him to do so.

At about the time of the beginning of the service, an usher
stationed himself in the courtyard to assist members in gaining
entry to the building. The usher witnessed the destruction of
church property and notified an officer who turned away and ignored
him. The rioters recognized him as a church member, surrounded him
and completely denied him any freedom of movement.

Pastor Charles & Donna Mcllhenny were refused entry by the rioters,
and told they could not enter the building. The doors were
completely blocked by the rioters. Pastor Mcllhenny held on to
Donna as they began to make their way through the mob who were
shouting and screaming in their ears, "You will not enter this
church." The rioters assaulted them, pushing and shoving them,
seeking to keep them from the front door. One of them grabbed
Donna's body, lifting her off the ground, and another put his arms
completely around her, and attempted to pull her back away from the
entry. She stretched her arms out for help from a nearby police
officer who offered no assistance. Her son, seeing she was in
trouble, pleaded with the officers to assist her. The officers
appeared so overwhelmed by the rioters that they were unable to
take control of the situation. Both of her hands were scratched
(the skin was broken).

Finally, the church's caretaker grabbed her outstretched arms and
pulled her through to the door, out of the hands of the rioters.
As they made their way past the three police officers at the door,
they were pelted by rocks, which also struck the window panes of
the entry doors. Several members from Pastor Mcllhenny's church
also were accosted and had to flee to a side entrance. There they
also found the entry blocked and had to remain outside until the
riot police arrived and let them in the building. Pastor
Mcllhenny's son, Ryan, and his friend were not able to enter the
building.

The rioters removed the Christian flag from the flagpole, and
attached the gay flag under the U.S. flag. The church's caretaker
removed both flags, but a rioter grabbed the gay flag and it was
again run up the flag pole and the rope knotted out of reach. When
the caretaker again attempted to remove the gay flag, he was
assaulted and hit with eggs. Being pushed back, he was unable to
reach the flag pole, and returned to the entry of the church. Much
of the newly planted landscaping around the flag pole was damaged.

One cement bench was pushed over into the fountain by rioters.
When police were notified of this they refused to respond. A
second bench was dismantled and the seat thrown over into a light
well and destroyed by rioters. The rioters guilty of this
vandalism described this wanton destruction of church property as
"interior decorating". Paper messages were stuck to the handrails,
walls and windows of the building.

A single parent, who is a church member, and her six year old
daughter were told they could not enter the building. A rioter
grabbed her daughter's arm as she was clinging to her mother, and
began interrogating her. The mother and daughter finally entered
the building by passing through the rioters. The child was crying
and terrified. The mother had also brought an elderly friend who
was refused entry by the rioters. Twenty minutes passed before she
was able to get her friend into the service. Along with these,
many others of the elderly and children were terrorized.

To our knowledge, riot police were never called in by the officers
present. They came only because the guest speaker left the worship
service and called 911. The rioters were then removed from the
courtyard area of the church property by the riot police. They
then proceeded to the emergency exit doors on the west side of the
auditorium where they pounded and kicked the doors seeking to break
them down. This so disturbed the service in process that the
service had to be temporarily discontinued. The officers present
were immediately notified. The pounding was so loud, that an
elderly blind woman was terrified, thinking that the sound was
gunshots. She began crying, feeling helpless and threatened, and
was comforted by nearby members. Due to the forceful nature of the
rioter's attempt to break down the doors, one of the exit doors was
damaged in a major way, the door jam being broken.

Rioters continued their demonstration, standing on church property
with their megaphone. The rioters then laid down in the
intersection of Geary and Franklin, blocking all traffic. The
rioters passed out the fraudulent flyers to waiting vehicles and
pounded on the vehicles of those attempting to cross the
intersection. The police took no action to remove them for
approximately ten minutes. A woman demonstrator exposed her
breasts to church members present in the area.

One woman, a regular attender at our services, and her husband were
hindered from entering the building by the rioters who had been
moved to the sidewalk. When she entered the building she was so
terrified that one of our other ladies had to help her calm down.
Another member stood across the street and did not enter because of
fear of physical violence.

As the service was concluded, the people were split into three
groups. All of the children were clinging to the parents,
frightened to leave the building. Two groups exited out emergency
exits. One group waited, and then exited the main entrance. The
people were shouted at and threatened by the rioters as they made
their way to their cars, being called Christian bigots, hypocrites,
fascists, homophobes, and other expletives, some obscene. An eight
year old retarded girl, upon exiting through the front entrance was
so traumatized upon being verbally accosted, that she fell down the
steps.

The guest speaker was escorted by police to the church van, as
debris pelted him from the rioters. Following his departure the
rioters began to depart and the riot police were dismissed. The
rioters shouted at the police, "You won't be here all night, but
the church (building) will be." Only two or three police officers
remained to secure the building. Dr. Innes, Rev. Eugene Lumpkin,
and the church's associate Pastor with his wife and children
remained inside. When this became known to the rioters, they
returned in force to the church and began pounding on the front
doors. The situation was once again out of control and Dr. Innes
called 911 for reinforcements. When the rioters saw children
standing in the lobby, they shouted, "We want your children. Give
us your children." The police asked us to move away from the
entry. Dr. Innes, his associate and family left through another
exit. A nine year old boy was crying in hysterics. "They are
after me, it's me they want." He did not calm down until the
family was several miles from the building.

A rioter broke one of the large address numbers off the face of the
building and attempted to remove others unsuccessfully. A
citizen's arrest was made on this individual. The person making
the citizen's arrest was verbally threatened by other rioters.

Officers told us they were informed by the rioters that our meeting
was an open, public meeting, and they did not intend to prohibit
the entry of the rioters onto our property. The pastor, Dr. Innes,
informed the officers that this was a regularly scheduled church
worship service and was not, as such, an open, public meeting, in
the secular sense. He further informed the officers that no public
notice had been made by the church inviting the public. The police
later insisted that they were bound by the rioters claim that this
was an open, public meeting and not a worship service. We were
informed by the police, that due to the city's police regulations
and policies, the police were not allowed to enforce the law
regarding the disturbance of church worship services and the
presence of rioters on church property. Police estimates of the
number of rioters were approximately 75, although actual counts
indicated a number closer to 100.

In spite of all this malicious disruption, not a single arrest was
made by the police outside of one citizen's arrest. The church's
property was not secured, and the fundamental rights of the
worshippers were not protected because, we were told, "The Board of
Supervisors would never support the measures necessary to do so."

Upon leaving for the final time, several of the rioters said, "We
will be back." Numerous obscene and threatening telephone calls
have been received at the church following the riot.

==================================================================
WHAT YOU CAN DO
==================================================================

After familiarizing yourself with the events as described [above],
we ask that you call each of the city officials listed [below].
Ask to speak to the chief aid of the person you are calling if the
official is not available. Tell them you have called in support of
Dr. Innes and his church. Express your outrage concerning the
homosexual riot and storming of the Hamilton Square Baptist Church.
PLEASE be respectful and kind in your remarks. By all means there
should be no name calling or threatening; these will only be
counterproductive.

Specifically, ask the mayor to have the rioters arrested and to
prosecute them to the full extent allowable under the law.

Urge the Supervisors to pass a resolution:

1. Condemning the violence against the Hamilton Square Baptist
Church.
2. Affirming that the churches of San Francisco have equal human
rights with all other groups and must be given full protection
under the law.
3. Calling for swift justice in arrest and prosecution of all of
the rioters.

IN ADDITION TO THE ABOVE

Fax or mail a copy of the news release to the following San
Francisco newspapers:

San Francisco Chronicle - FAX number 415-512-8196 attention City
Desk.
San Francisco Examiner - FAX number 415-777-2525 attention City
Desk.

Call or write the news editors and protest their failure to cover
this story:

San Francisco Chronicle 415-777-7100
5th and Mission
San Francisco, CA 94105

San Francisco Examiner 415-777-2424
110 Fifth
San Francisco, CA 94103

IF THE PHONE LINES ARE BUSY, PLEASE CONTINUE TO CALL UNTIL YOU GET
THROUGH!

OFFICIALS

San Francisco Mayor's office
415-554-6141
The Honorable Frank Jordan
Room 200, City Hall
400 Van Ness Avenue
San Francisco, CA 94102

San Francisco Board of Supervisors
Supervisor (Name)
Room 235, City Hall
400 Van Ness Avenue
San Francisco, CA 94102

Angela Alioto 415-554-7788
Vocally hostile to the churches on this issue
Sue Bierman 415-554-6661
Very liberal, but not openly hostile
Annemarie Conroy 415-554-7751
Shares our concern somewhat
Terence Hallinan 415-554-7766
Openly hostile to the churches on this issue
Tom Hsieh (pronounced Shay) 415-554-5015
Neutral
Barbara Kaufman 415-554-4880
Neutral
Willie B. Kennedy
She has been a real friend to us - write and thank her
Susan Leal (pronounced Lay-al) 415-554-6644
Hostile to us on this issue
Bill Maher 415-554-5401
Position not known
Carole Migden 415-554-4033
Vocally hostile to the churches on all issues
Kevin F. Shelley 415-554-4005
Position not known

********************************************************************************
There is Hope for the Homosexual: Ex-gay pastors and Christian psychologists
agree that homosexuals can change---but it's not easy.
Source: Focus on the Family Citizen. By Frank York.

"If you were to depend upon the mass media for an understanding of
homosexuality, you'd discover several common themes: Homosexuals are born that
way; their sexual orientation is merely an alternative lifestyle and they
deserve special legal protection because of AIDS."

"But that is an unrealistic view. It is needlessly condemning many homosexual
men and women to a lifestyle that can lead to death."

"The truth is that homosexuality is a sexual identity disorder that has been
sucessfully treated. An issue that should be more prominent today is the
single fact that gays can change."

"Dr. Donald Tweety, for example, spent 14 years as a professor of psychology at
Fuller Theological Seminary in Pasadena, Calif."

"Now retired, he first began treating homosexuals in 1955 and has evaluated
more than 1,000 cases since that time. He has personally counseled nearly 400
homosexual men and women in his career as a clinical psychologist."

"In working with gays for more than 30 years, Tweedy has concluded that
homosexuality is a learned behavior that can be successfully treated."

"'The theoretical genetic, congenital rationale for homoerotic impulses is not
well established,'" said Tweedy."

"During the 1950s, 60s, and early 70s, he noticed a 60 to 75 percent success
rate in terms of changed attitudes and behaviors among his clients."

"But that success rate took a plunge in the mid-1970s and continues to decline.
The reason? Tweedy believes it's because of a cultural shift toward the
acceptance of homosexuality, plus the distribution of what he calls
'pseudo-scientific' literature which says that homosexuality is an inborn
trait, such as left-handedness."

"Tweedy has treated homosexual impulses 'just like any other compulsive
behavior pattern.'"

"Can homosexuals be cured? 'I think that anybody who is very involved in the
development of homoerotic impulses--the desire for sexual contact--probably
will always have that as part of his experience, much like a successful
dieter,' said Tweedy."

"Just as the dieter is not going to lose his appetite for a hot fudge sundae,
the homosexual may not completely lose his desire for same-sex intimacy,
although he can learn to control his attitudes and behavior."

"Counseling Programs Work:
Dr Harold Voth, Chief of Staff at the VA Medical Center in Topeka, Kan. is
author of Families: The Future of America."

"As a psychiatrist and psychoanalyst he has successfully treated dozens of
homosexuals. The last male homosexual he treated, for example, was a typical
case."

"According to Voth, he was 'deeply tied to his mother and never broke away when
he should have. The father was a harsh, rejecting alcoholic with whom he had no
relationship whatsoever. He couldn't enter into relationships with women.'"

"After counseling with this young man by dealing with his unconscious
conflicts, excessive guilt and anxiety, the young man was able to leave the
lifestyle. Currently he's happily married. Voth has also successfully treated
lesbians."

"Voth is critical of psychologists and psychiatrists who accept homosexuality
as an alternative lifestyle. The American Psychiatric Association, for
example, accepts the premise that if homosexuality bothers a gay, it's abnormal
and should be treated. But if the homosexual is not disturbed by his
orientation, the condition does not need treatment."

"According to Voth, that's absurd reasoning. 'I can show you all kinds of
psychiatric conditions that don't bother the person afflicted with them.
They're happy as a lark.'"

"'Homosexuals are emotionally sick people,'" said Voth and they need
compassionate care. 'Our society sorely needs treatment centers for
homosexuals, but until the day arrives when such centers exist, individuals
will have to seek help on their own private resources. Help does exit, not
enough to treat all, but some at least.'"

"Homosexuality Is Curable:
Dr. George Rekers, author of Growing Up Straight---What Every Family Should
Know About Homosexuality, is an expert in childhood sexual identity disorders
and has done extensive research on homosexuality for the National Institute of
Mental Health. Rekers is currently affiliated with the Department of
Neuro-Psychiatry at the University of South Carolina."

"In his clinical counseling practice, Rekers has treated more than 500
homosexuals. He says that homosexuality is a treatable sexual identity
disturbance---as long as certain factors are present during the treatment
process."

"The National Institute of Mental Health has published a list of those factors:
1) The homosexual is young, with only a few sexual encounters. As the
homosexual becomes more deeply involved in sexual experiences, change becomes
more difficult, but not impossible.
2) He has a strong religious motivation or has a strong social support system,
including his family and his church to help him change.
3) He does not have other mental disorders to deal with.
4) He is involved in a subculture of society that has sanctions against
homosexual behavior.
5) He successfully completes the treatment process.
Rekers noted that with those factors in place during the treatment process,
there is a 2/3-90% success rate in leading homosexuals out of their destructive
lifestyle."

"'When they are motivated, have a strong spiritual motivation, are in their
20's, and if they complete therapy, I've had an 85% cure rate,' said Rekers."

"He cautions, however, that drug or alcohol abuse among homosexuals
significantly reduces the success rate."

"Rekers emphasized that a strong religious motivation is a key factor in
delivering homosexuals from bondange to an addictive and harmful lifestyle."

"Ex-Gay Ministries Are Filling a Void:
Andy Comiskey, president of Exodus International, an umbrella organization of
ex-gay ministries is a former homosexual who is now happily married."

"Comiskey says he drifted into a homosexual lifestyle because of his feelings
of inadequacy as a boy and self-doubt about his sexual identity."

"'I didn't think I was a girl or anything, but that was an area of my life
where I felt inadequate and that was reinforced by not being particularly good
at athletics.'" He also experienced rejection and was taunted by other boys as
a 'faggot,' 'sissy,' and 'queer.'"

"He was becoming more aware of his homosexual feelings as a pre-adolescent, but
did not act them out until highschool."

"After his first sexual encounter, he thought, 'I've got to stop kidding myself
and start tracking with the homosexual self. So I did and after high school I
got involved in another homosexual relationship and moved out into the gay
community and began identifying more forcibly with other homosexuals.'"

"He credits the prayers of his friends and two brothers with helping him out of
homosexuality."

"But just accepting the Lord didn't instantly deliever him. 'In a way I am
still in the process. I really took a long time. It took about two years
before I consistently committed to a body of people other than homosexuals. So
the first two years were rough, letting go of the relationships, addictive
behaviors, and, in turn, getting involved in the body of Christ and making a
firm commitment to Jesus. I really wavered in the early days."

"Key Elements to Deliverance:
Bud Searcy is director of New Creation Ministries in Fresno, California. He
lists several essential elements in any successful ministry to gays."

"In his counseling sessions with gays, he attempts to communicate unconditional
love and acceptance. 'First, they need to know that decision they make, it's
not going to change the way that I perceive them. I don't reject them
personally.'"

"Second, they 'need to know that what they're doing is damaging to their lives
and to God's will for them.'"

"Third, homosexuals need to know that 'Our hope is in Jesus for all change. We
let them know that we are a Christ-centered ministry and that it is Jesus
Christ who gives us power to change and transform. We can't do it on our own.
We tell them that change will not come easily, it is a process and we will be
committed to them through that process."

"Fourth, homosexuals who are in counseling are encouraged to break off all
former relationships and that new non-sexually oriented relationships should be
formed."

"Fifth, they are taught to pray, how to study the Bible and to get involved in
a local church. 'We have a list of churches that we know are compassionate to
the homosexual and will be willing to work with them and help them achieve
their goal of being healed from homosexuality,' said Searcy."

"Sixth, homosexuals must be taught to have healthy, same-sex relationships.
According to Searcy, homosexuals confuse sex with intimacy and they eroticize
their relationships with men."

"Part of the healing process is to teach homosexuals to relate with men in a
nonsexual manner. 'There is a real need for healthy, same sex relationships,'
said Searcy. 'We have to show them how to be a good friend. We are almost in a
parenting role, in teaching them things they should have learned as children.'

"There is Hope:
Homosexuality is a problem of behavior, not of genetics or of inborn traits.
it is a compulsive behavior pattern that is destructive to the individual and,
in this age of AIDS, will likely lead to death."

"Homosexuality is not an incurable sexual identity disorder. It has been
successfully treated, using conventional psychological and psychiatric
techniques as well as religious conversion, coupled with a strong support
system."

"Those who want to help out of homosexuality can receive counseling and the
support they need."

"According to Dr. Rekers, 'The person with a problem with homosexual lust or
homosexual behavior problems needs divine forgiveness; Christian sympathy and
prayer; supportive encouragement for solving the problem from the parents and
friends; and proper counseling or psychotherapy, or help from an effective
Christian minstry to homosexuals."

********************************************************************************
Helping Gays 'Come out' of Homosexuality
Source: The Lambda Report/ Regeneration News

"To hear gay activists tell it, chage for homosexuals is impossible. One's
'sexual orientaion' is fixed---'immutable,' or so the new dogma goes.

"But like all intellectual rigidities, this latest gay myth requires a certain
suppression of truth. That truth, represented by Alan Medinger, is that gays
not only can change but that thousands already have.

"Medinger is founder and director of Regeneration, a Baltimore-based Christian
outreach to men & women who no longer want to be homosexuals. A former 'gay'
who is now happily married with 3 kids, Medinger launched Regeneration in
Baltimore in 1979 as a counselling program. Since then, the group has expanded
to Virginia and become home to the world's largest 'ex-gay' book ministry.

"Since many in the liberal academic and psychological establishments have
embraced pro-gay thinking on the supposed normalcy of Homosexuality, religious
groups and psychiatrists have risen to the forefront of efforts to help gays
change. There are now hundreds of Christian books in print---ranging from
evangelical to Catholic---on the subject.

"These works have joined the already extensive secular scholarship of
specialists such as psychoanalyst Dr. Charles Socarides. Together they testify
ever more boldly to the reality that homosexual ideologues steadfastly deny:
that gay men and women need not remain locked into some predestined
'orientation.'

"Regeneration's book distribution program, launched by Medinger in 1989, now
distributes over $75,000 worth of books a year advancing a 'biblical healing
for homosexuals. The books are sent to cost to churches and other outreach
organizations.

"Medinger himself is a skilled writer whose essays are filled with keen
insights into the 'gay' predicament. A recent article in Regeneration News
dealt with a subject close to his heart--the rise of prohomosexual counselling
programs in the schools. As one who spent 17 years in the destructive 'gay'
lifestyle, Medinger is saddened by the current push to make homosexuality an
acceptible if and even 'hip' option for youth.

"Commenting on a recent study showing that the percentage of youth who identify
themselves as homosexual decreases with age, Medinger wrote:
In schools all over the country, children...are being labelled 'sexual
minority' students and are being led to counselors drawn from the gay
community. How often are the deeply rooted needs and biases of these
'counselors' going to lead them to counsel the 'unsure' that they are
gay? 'Unsure' in their minds often means that the youngster is simply
afraid of coming to terms with his or her homosexuality...
From every medical and health aspect---up to and including the
probability of becoming infected with AIDS---it is tragic, even
criminal to lead a child into homosexuality because he or she showed
some degree of sexual orientation confusion in adolescence.

"Medinger rejects the notion that homosexuality is a condition from birth,
calling studies designed to prove that proposition---such as the recent one by
geneticist Dean Hamer---'flimsy.' He laments that when the inevitable
criticisms surface calling these studies' conclusions into question, the media
rarely get around to reporting them. So all the public is left with all the
initial, exaggerated claims.

"According to Medinger, the decisive factors that lead men to fall into
homosexuality occurs early in life---and often involve absent or abusive
fathers. However, he stresses, it is too simplistic to look for a negligent
father behind every gay man; the range of factors that affect human
self-perception are extremely complex.

"Nevertheless, Medinger said the following scenario is revealed by 75%-80% of
the men who have gone through the Regeneration ministry: Boys, he said, 'come
into the world with real need for manly (non-sexual) love.' For some reason or
another---the father was alcoholic, he deserted the family at an early age,
etc.---that need was not met.

"'But more often than not, we hear that the father is there physically but not
emotionally,' Medinger said. 'He can't emotionally relate. Maybe he wasn't
fathered himself...but the little boy receives this as rejection.' The son
reacts to the pain of rejection by pulling way from his father emotionally.

"'He fails to bond...It tends to ease his feeling of rejection...but his need
for love and affirmation don't go away,' Medinger said. The child arrives at
puberty and his unfulfilled emotional needs 'get all mixed up with sexual
desire.' But by distancing himself from his father, the boy 'has cut himself
off from the person from whom he should have taken his male identity'---his
intended role model.

"'Little boys come out of their mother's body and they have to break from that
mother and develop that male identityu somewhere and daddy's the one,' he said.

"Medinger readily admits that in the past, methods of 'forcing change' on
homosexuals, such as encouraging them to get married, were bound to fail and
usually did. These strategies are frequently the object for gay jokes today.
Medinger fears most gays are ignorant of today's more effective counseling
programs, which he said het to the root of the problem---the unmet emotional
needs carried by the person through his or her life.

"We find for a man coming out of homosexuality, the things inside of him that
drove him in the first place...are healed and dealt with,' Medinger said.
'What lingers is pretty much this programmed [sexual] response, a habit kind of
thing. The power is all gone out of it.'

"For many men, he said, sexual tempatation persist, but they diminish over time
to the point where they are a 'nuisance,' as men grow emotionally and
spiritually.

"Medinger added that among the former homosexuals who have passed through
Regeneration and gotten married, every marriage but one has worked---sexually
and otherwise.

"In spite of the obvious good that Regeneration has done in the lives of
thousands of gay men and women, the ministry has come under attack by
homosexual activists who accuse it and similar groups of spreading 'self hate.'
But Medinger says his ministry is non confrontational and wouldn't think of
forcing change on anybody.

"'We really don't want to battle the gay community,' he said. 'We want to help
those seeking change to get healed.'"

********************************************************************************
Homosexuality and the Truth
Compiled by Sy Rogers and Alan Medinger

Sources:
1---John W. Money, "Sexual Dimorphism and Homosexual Gender Indentity," in
Perpectives in Human Sexuality, ed. Nathaniel W. Wagner (New York: Behavioral
Publications, 1974), p. 67.
2---Charles W. Socarides, "Homosexuality: Basic Concepts and Psychodynamics,"
in the International Journal of Psychiatry, 1972.
3---William H. Masters, Virginia E. Brown, and Robert C. Kolodny, Human
Sexuality (Boston: Little, Brown, and Company, 1984), pp. 319-320.
4---Dr. Edmund Bergler, Homosexuality: Disease or Way of Life? (Colier Books,
1962), pp. 277.
5---Charles Socarides, "Homosexuality," American Handbook of Psychiatry, 2nd
Ed., Vol. 3 (Basic Books, 1974).
6---Dr. Irving Bieber, Homosexuality: A Psychoanalytic Study, (Basic Books,
1962), pp. 318-319.
7---Drs. Irving and Toby Bieber, "Male Homosexuality," Canadian Journal of
Psychiatry, Vol. 24, No. 5 (1979), p. 416.
8---Bell and Weinberg, Homosexualities, table 21.12
9---Robert J. Kus, "Alcoholics Anonymous and Gay American Men," Journal of
homosexuality, Vol 14, No. 2 (1987), p. 254.
10--Bell and Weinberg, Homosexualities, p. 308.
11--Ibid., pp. 308-309.

"For many years the politically-active segment of the gay community has
effectively used propaganda through media as a means to change society's
attitudes about homosexuality. In some ways, this has been helpful in curbing
mistreatment of homosexuals.

"However, for the purpose of social "legitimization" of homosexuality (attained
through political and religious systems), the gay community has also
disseminated much questionable information about homosexuality. They have
attempted to convince society that homosexuality is innate, unchangeable and a
normal variable in the spectrum of human sexuality. If this is true, then
homosexuals would be deserving of minority status, entitled to the rights and
protection of other legitimate minority groups.

"Rather than speculate on what that could mean, let's instead ask if the
pro-homosexual propaganda is based on truth. Are their claims legitimate? The
following is a compilation of responses to the most common pro-gay arguments.
___________
1) "Some people are meant to be gay---they're born gay."
Nothing has been published and gained wide acceptance in the scientific and
medical communitiess to indicate that homosexuality is primarily genetic or
otherwise prenatally determined.

One of the most widely recognized authorities on the subject is John W. Money,
Pd.D., a professor at the Johns Hopkins School of Medicine, and Director of the
Psychohormonal Research Institute. In an article in 'Perspectives in Human
Sexuality,' he states:
Whatever may be the possible unlearned assistance from constitutional
sources, the child's psychosexual identity is not written, unlearned,
in the genetic code, the hormonal system or the nervous system at
birth.---1

A psychiatrist who has written and spoken widely on the subject of
homosexuality, Dr. Chareles W. Socarides, of the Albert Einstein College of
Medicine in New York, has stated:
Homosexuality, the choice of a partner of the same sex for orgastic
satisfaction, is not innate. There is no connection between sexual
instinct and the choice of sexual object. Such an object choice is
learned, acquired behavior; there is no inevitable genetically inborn
propensity toward the choice of a partner of either the same or the
opposite sex.---2

Finally we have the opinions of Masters and Johnson, the most widely known
authorities in the field of human sexual behavior. In one of their books, they
have written:
The genetic theory of homosexuality has been generally discarded today.
Despite the interest of possible hormone mechanisms in the origin of
homosexuality, no serious scientist today suggests that a simple cause-
effect relationship applies.---3

2)"Homosexuals can't change and to suggest they try is unrealistic, even
harmful."
Again, some of the most prominant specialists in this field disagree.

Dr. John Money, from his 1988 book, 'Gay, Straight, and In Between,' states:
Some poeple do change their sexual orientation. There is absolutely no
harm in trying.

Dr. Reuben Fine, director for the New York Center for Psychoanalytic Training,
states in his 1987 publication, Psychoanalytic Theory, Male and Female
Homosexuality: Psychological Approaches:
I have recently had occasion to review the result of psychotherapy with
homosexuals, and been surprised by the findings. It is paradoxical
that even though politically active homosexual groups deny the
possibility of change, all studies from Schrenk-Notzing on have found
positive effects, virtually regardless of the kind of treatment used...
a considerable percentage of overt homosexuals became heterosexual...

If the patients were motivated, whatever procedure is adopted, a large
percentage will give up their homosexuality. In this connection,
public information is of the greatest importance. The misinformation
spread by certain circles that 'homosexuality is untreatable by psycho-
therapy' does incalcuable harm to thousands of men and women.
(pp. 84-86)

Dr. Robert Kronemeyer, in his 1980 book, "Overcoming Homosexuality":
For those homosexuals who are unhappy with their life and find
effective therapy, it is 'curable.'

Dr. Edmund Bergler in his book, "Homosexuality: Disease or Way of Life?:
The homosexual's real enemy is...his ignorance of the possibility that
he can be helped.---4

Dr. Charles Socardies, in his test, "Homosexuality," in the American handbook
of Psychiatry writes:
The major challenge in treating homosexuality from the point of view of
the patient's resistance has, of course, been the misconception that
the disorder is innate or inborn.---5

Dr. Irving Bieber and his colleagues concluded:
The therapeutic results of our study provide reason for an optimistic
outlook. Many homosexuals became exclusively heterosexual in
psychoanalytic treatment. Although this change may be more easily
accomplished by some than others, in our judgment, a heterosexual shift
is a possibility for all homosexuals who are stronly motivated to
change.---6

Bieber states 17 years later:
We have followed some patients for as long as 10 years who have
exclusively heterosexual.---7

Dr. Lawrence J. Hatterer states in "Changing Homosexuality in the Male":
I've heard of hundreds of other men who went from a homosexual to a
heterosexual adjustment on their own. (p. 138)

Even Masters and Johnson report in their 1979 book, "Homosexuality in
Perspective," that the success rate in 81 gays desiring reorientation (after a
sex-year followup), is 71.6% (p. 402).
No longer should the qualified psychotherapist avoid the responsibility
of either accepting the homosexual client treatment or referring him or
her to an acceptable treatment source. (p. 251).

3) "Homosexuality is no longer considered a mental disorder."
The gay community claimed a great victory when they prevailed upon the American
Psychiatric Association to remove homosexuality from the DSM-II, its listing of
psychological disorders.

This highly controversial action seems to fly in the face of the evidence of
any common-sense definition of psychological well-being. Consider the
following:
a) Homosexual men are 6x more likely to have attempted suicide than
heterosexual men.---8
b) Studies indicate that between 25 and 33% of homosexual men and
women are alcoholics.---9
c) Statistics give evidence of widespread sexual compulsion among
homosexual men.
One Kinsey institute study revealed that 43% of the homosexual men
surveyed estimated that they had had sex with 500 or more partners;
28% with 1,000 or more partners.--10
d) The same kinsey study revealed that homosexual men have to be great
extent separated sexuality from relationship. The survey showed 79%
of the respondents saying that over 1/2 of their sexual partners were
strangers. 75% said that over 1/2 of their sexual partners were people
with whom they had sex with once.--11 Surely this is an indication of
either deep dissatisfaction, or else terribly destructive hedonism.

We do not need to address the statement that the difficulties suffered by
homosexuals are all a result of society's prejudice and unwillingness to
support stable gay relationships. We can address this on several points:
a) In areas where there is the greatest acceptance of homosexuality
(San Francisco, West Hollywood, New York City), the detrimental effects
don't decrease; they increase.
b) Over the past 20 years, there has been a great increase in the
acceptance of homosexuality, but during the same period, there has been
a huge increase in homosexual suffering due to disease and other
factors.
c) For many years society did not condone heterosexual sexual
involvement outside of marriage. As far as we know, this did not force
the people so inclined into greater sexual promiscuity, higher rates
of alcoholism, suicide and disease.

Additionally, many therapists disagree with the 1973 APA ruling. Why?
a) Over 75 years of psychoanalytic knowledge underscoring homosexuality
as a disorder was disregarded. Experts who viewed homosexuality as a
a disorder were pointedly left off the National Institute of Mental
Health task force studying this mental issue. Others were silenced or
disregarded.
b) Militant homosexual groups threatening terrorism, employing hate
campaigns and disrupting numerous scientific programs and conferences,
also very heavily lobbied the APA and its meetings during the early- to
mid-1970s. Gay political groups especially targeted and disrupted
national and local meetings in which the psychopathology and treatment
of homosexuality were going to be discussed. For full discussion of
these events, including documentation and sources, read "Hope for
Homosexuality," published by the Free Congress Foundation, 1988
(especially pp. 46-55; see "Resources").
c) 243 practitioners and members of the APA petitioned for a
referendem to vote on a reversal of the ruling. That vote occured in
April 1974 in which 40% of the voters disagreed with the ruling,
asserting that there were no legitimate scientific reasons for the
APA's change in fundamental psychiatric theory. (Ibid., p. 53) In late
1977, 68% of American Medical Association psychiatrists responding to a
poll still viewed homosexuality as a pathological adaption as opposed
to a normal variation. (Ibid., p. 53, footnotes). Dr Joseph Nicolosi,
in the February 1989 issue of "The California Psychologist," said:
Many members of our profession still privately express the
opinion that homosexual development is not normal. The 1973
APA ruling did not resolve the issue--it simply silenced 80 yrs
pychoanalytic observation.
Elizabeth Moberly of Cambridge, England, author of 2 clinical books
regarding origins and treatment or homosexuality, believes that it is
important to see homosexuality as symptomatic, in part, of an
exaggerated, deviated but nevertheless compensatory drive to satisfy a
childhood deficit in and for legitimate same-sex indentification and
relationships. Understanding this, homosexuality can be resolved and
same-sex attraction can be "neutralized in part through correctly
satisfying this deficit through healthy, non-sexual, non-erotic, non-
romantic same sex relationships.

Conclusion:
Homosexuals should not be held responsible for becoming homosexually oriented.
However, homosexuality can be effectively treated. It is important that the
homosexually-inclined person understands that in spite of why homosexual
attraction developed, he or she can employ 'choice' today and become
responsible not only for the behavior, but also for the resolution of the
homosexual attraction/orientation.[]

_____________
An Observation by Aaron Greenway:
Homosexuality and the Truth states:
>One Kinsey institute study revealed that 43% of the homosexual men
> surveyed estimated that they had had sex with 500 or more partners;
> 28% with 1,000 or more partners.--10

The Conservative Chronicle states:
>"According to every study of sexual BEHAVIOR, homosexuals are
>notoriously promiscuous. In one 1978 study, 43% of male homosexuals admitted
>to having sex with 500 partners, 28% to having sex with over 1,000.

Another observation:
Homosexuality and the Truth states:
>The survey showed 79%
> of the respondents saying that over 1/2 of their sexual partners were
> strangers. 75% said that over 1/2 of their sexual partners were people
> with whom they had sex with once.--11 Surely this is an indication of
> either deep dissatisfaction, or else terribly destructive hedonism.

The Conservative Chronicle states:
Most of
>their "partners" were anonymous, or men with whom they had sex once. (A 1981
>study found only 2% to be "near monogamous," i.e. with 10 or fewer partners in a
>lifetime.)"

Yet another observation:
The Gay Agenda in Public Education states:
>"Joe Dallas states, 'In '73, the general meeting of the APA was swarmed with gay
>activists, who threatened to disrupt the proceedings, and who were abetted by
>progay psychologists and who joined forces to assentially FORCE a decision on
>the APA's part to reconsider the diagnostic status of Homosexuality. The
>voting board of the APA did decide at that time to remove Homosexuality from
>the list of diagnoses. This was by no means a universally accepted decision.
>Some 6 years later, a polling was done of psychologists, asking them if they
>felt homosexuality was normal or whether or not it represented a pathological
>adeptation. Nearly 70% of the psychologists that were polled 6 years later
>still felt that Homosexuality represented pathological adeptation. And to this
>day, there are hundreds of psychoanalyists, psychiatrists, medical doctors,
>marriage, family, and child counselors and psychologists who continue to
>believe that Homosexuality is not immutible, that it is not normal that it is
>changeable, and that people coming for therapy, seeking change have good reason
>to be optimistic for their chances of success.'"

Homosexuality and the Truth states:
>Additionally, many therapists disagree with the 1973 APA ruling. Why?
> a) Over 75 years of psychoanalytic knowledge underscoring homosexuality
> as a disorder was disregarded. Experts who viewed homosexuality as a
> a disorder were pointedly left off the National Institute of Mental
> Health task force studying this mental issue. Others were silenced or
> disregarded.
> b) Militant homosexual groups threatening terrorism, employing hate
> campaigns and disrupting numerous scientific programs and conferences,
> also very heavily lobbied the APA and its meetings during the early- to
> mid-1970s. Gay political groups especially targeted and disrupted
> national and local meetings in which the psychopathology and treatment
> of homosexuality were going to be discussed.

And yet another observation:
Homosexuality and the Truth states:
>a) Homosexual men are 6x more likely to have attempted suicide than
> heterosexual men.---8
> b) Studies indicate that between 25 and 33% of homosexual men and
> women are alcoholics.---9

The Conservative Chronicle states:
>"Among Homosexuals, the ration of men murdered (1 in 200 deaths)
>was 50x that of the general population; for suicide, 60x; for death in auto
>accidents, 45x. (As the total number of victims of murder, suicide and accidents was
>small, ratios may very widely; still, the disparity is glaring and ominous)."

and

>"Gay men are 3x as likely to have alcohol or drug
>abuse problems,

********************************************************************************
Ministries to Homosexuals:

Exodus International
P.O. Box 2121
San Rafael, California 94912
(415)-454-1017

New Creation Ministries
1020 E. McKinley
Fresno, California 93728
(209)-264-6125

Love in Action
P.O. Box 2655
San Rafael, California 94912
(415)-454-0960
Fax: (415)-454-7826

Regeneration
P.O. Box 9830
Baltimore, MD 21284-9830
(410)-661-0284

Eleutheros
1298 Minnesota Avenue, Suite "D"
Winter Park, Florida 32789
(407)-629-5770

Nikon
P.O. Box 19631
Birmingham, AL 35219
(205)-942-0769

Kerusso Ministries
P.O. Box 210909
Anchorage, Alaska 99521
(907)-333-4673

Agapao
501 Cambridge St.
San Francisco, CA 94134
(415)-586-9495

Cornerstone
200 Cirby Way
Roseville, CA 95678
(916)-722-0206

The David Project
42 Broadmoor Plaza #3
Santa Barbara, CA 93105
(805)-569-2486

Desert Stream Ministries
12488 Venice Blvd.
Los Angeles, CA 90066-3804
(310)-572-0140

Genesis Counseling
2745 E. Chapman #202
Orange California 92669
(714)-744-3326

HIS Ministry
c/o Sunrise Baptist Church
8321 Greenback Ln.,
Fair Oaks, CA 95628-2699 (Sacramento area)
(916)-969-3929

Liberty
P.O. Box 2652
Lompoc, CA 93438
(805)-735-8143

South Bay Christian Counseling Services [formerly called Hope Straight Ahead]
4030 Spencer St. #105
Torance, CA 90503
(310)-798-8284
Please ask for Andria Sigler.

Thomas Aquinas Psychological Clinic
16542 Ventura Bld, Suite 416
Encino, CA 91436
(818)-789-4440

Word of Life
1605 Ashbury Dr.
Concord, CA 94521
(510)-825-7138 or (510)-685-4343

Yours for Life Ministries
Box 27023
Santa Ana, CA 92799-7023
(714)-545-5227

Where Grace Abounds
P.O. Box 18871
Denver, CO 80218
(303)-322-2027

Hope Ministries
Box 604
Hamden, CT 06517
(203)-248-5274

Shoreline Christian Ministries
17 Water Street
Guilford, CT 06437
(203)-453-2390

Straight Ahead
Box 16889
Tampa, Florida 33687
(813)-988-3557

Worthy Creations
3601 Davie Blvd
Ft. Lauderdale, FL 33312
(305)-680-3538

Katapauo
Box 13962
Atlanta, GA 30324
(404)-636-5924

Pneumatikos
Box 6808
Macon, GA 31208
(912)-825-1158

Nehemiah Ministries
Box 773
Urbana, IL 61801
(217)-344-4636

New Dawn West
444 W. Grand
Springfield, MO 65807
(417)-866-2361

Christ's Place
1111 Old Cheny
Lincoln, NE 68510
(402)-421-1111

ReCreation Ministries
Box 551
Manchester, NH 03105-0551
(603)-625-9132

New Dawn Ministries East
Box 3689
Wayne, NJ O7474-3689
(201)-694-2938

Free Indeed Ministries
c/o God's People of Praise
2417 Wyoming NE
Albuquerque, NM 87112
(505)-275-9623

All in His Name Minsitries
c/o New Life Assembly Church
14 North Street
Buffalo, NY 14202
(716)-881-3227

Whosoever Will Ministry
Box 227
Middletown, NY 10940
(914)-374-8128

Breaking Free
Box 225 DTS
Boone, NC 28607
(704)-963-7772 or (919)-877-5649

Crossroads
Box 10388
Charlotte, NC 28212
(704)-536-6705

Olive Branch Ministries
Box 20042
Raleigh, NC 27619-0042
(919)-829-1489

Refuge Ministries
c/o Marantha Church
4433 Rehobeth Church Rd.
Greensboro, NC 27406-9245
(919)-852-6134
Please ask for Jan or Mike with Refuge

Stepping Stones
1524 E. Morehead St
Charlotte, NC 29207
(704)-331-1720
Please ask for Sister Frances

Healing Touch Ministry
Box 395
Dayton, OH 45459
(513)-433-0332

Freedom Ministries
Box 12189
Des Moines, IA 50312
(515)-244-8073

Freedom at Last
Box 13314
Wichita, KS 67213
(316)-267-8779

Second Chance Ministries
Box 12265
Overland Park, KS 66282-2265 (Kansas City area)
(913)-541-1044

CrossOver Ministries
Box 23744
Lexington, KY 40523
(606)-277-4941

Amazing Grace Ministries
Box 8234
Porland, ME 04104
(207)-879-2554

Crown of Life Ministry
Box 11404
Portland, ME 04104
(207)-828-1025

Transformation Ministries of Boston
Box 1313
Back Bay Annex, Boston, MA 02117
(617)-445-1787

White Stone Ministries
c/o Ruggles Baptist Church
874 Beacon St
Boston, MA 02115
(617)-266-3633

Hyperniken Counseling Services
2020 Raybrook SE #206
Grand Rapids, MI 49546
(616)-942-2063

Reconciliation Ministries
Box 10237
Detroit, MI 48210
(313)-730-8111

Eagle's Wings
c/o North Heights Lutheran Church
1700 Hwy. 96
Arden Hills, MN 55112
(612)-522-2782

Outpost
Box 7067
Minneapolis, MN 55407
(612)-827-1419

Prodigal Ministries
Box 19949
Cincinnati, OH 45219-0949
(513)-861-0011

The First Stone
Box 20822
Oklahoma City, OK 73156
(405)-525-FREE

Restoration Outreach
Box 55236
Tulsa, OK 74155
(918)-254-1175

The Portland Fellowhip
Box 9205
Portland, OR 97207
(503)-235-6364

Day Seven Ministry
Box 265
Elizabethtown, PA 17022
(717)-361-8414

Dunamis Ministries
1111 Wood St
Pittsburgh, PA 15221
(412)-731-3828

Free!
321 Gettysburg Pike
Mechanicsburg, PA 17055
(717)-766-7904

Harvest
Box 53486
Philadelphia, PA 19105
(215)-985-4031

Promise
c/o Christian Counseling Services
Box 60383
Nashville, TN 37206
(615)-254-8324

Living Hope
Box 3352
Knoxville, TN 37927
(615)-673-6550

Christian Coalition for Reconciliation
Box 420437
Houston, TX 77242-0437
(713)-465-7045

Living Hope Ministries
c/o Grace Vineyard
Box 121012
Arlington, TX 76012
(817)-640-4044 (Metro.)

Set Free
Box 14835
Richmond, VA 23221
(804)-358-8150

Sought Out
168 Business Park Dr. #103
Virginia Beach, VA 23462
(804)-490-5777

Metanoia Ministries
Box 33039
Seattle, WA 98133-0039
(206)-783-3500

Transformation Ministries
Box 55805
Seattle, WA 98155
(206)-364-2306

Transformation Ex-Gay Ministry
1017 12th Street NW
Washington DC 20005
(202)-371-0800

Broken Yoke Ministries
25050 W. Bluemound Rd.
Pewaukee, WI 53072
(414)-896-0841

Canada:
Another Chance
c/o Burnaby Christian Fellowship
7325 MacPherson Ave
Burnaby, BC V5J 4N8
(604)-430-4154

New Direction for Life Ministries
Box 1493
Winnipeg, MB R3C2Z4
(204)-783-6754

New Direction for Life Ministries
Box 1078
Stn. F. Toronto, ON M4Y 2T7
(416)-921-6557

International Connections:
Exodus Europe: True Freedom Trust
P.O. Box 592
London SE4 1EF, England
(081)-314-5735 From USA/Canada: 011-44-81-314-5735

Exodus South Pacific: Liberty
P.O. Box 308
Fortitude Valley
Queensland 4006, Australia
(07)-371-4705 From USA/Canada: 011-61-7-371-4705

Exodus Missionaries:
Sy and Karen Rogers: Choices, Church of Our Savior
130 Margaret Drive
Singapore 0314.
Phone from USA/Canada: 011-65-474-7222
Fax from USA/Canada: 011-65-472-0309

Frank and Anita Worthen
Bagong Pag-asa
P.O. Box 9139
MCS Mailing Center
1200 Makati, MN, PHILIPPINES
Phone/Fax from the USA/Canada: 011-632-846-3097

********************************************************************************
Videos on Homosexuality:

For adults: Understanding Homosexuality and the Reality of Change. Interviews
with 2 men and 2 women on roots of homosexual orientation and the change
process; interviews with therapists Joe Dallas and Joseph Nicolosi; 60 minutes.
Impact Resources Corp., P.O. Box 1169, Murrieta, CA 92564-1169. 1-800-333-6475.

For teens: Homosexuality. Part of the "Power Surge Hot Topics for Teens"
series. A 16-minute condensation of Understanding Homosexuality and the
Reality of Change, geared for teenagers. Includes a leader's/study guide.
Media International, 313 E. Broadway, Suite 202, Glendale, CA 91209.
1-800-477-7575

Edge TV: Edition 2, Sexual Choices. Addresses homosexuality some in the
18-minute segment on sexual choices. Includes a leader's guide. Edge TV, The
Navigators, P.O. Box 6000, Colorado Springs, CO 80934. 1-800-366-7788.

I can give you more information on this later. There is simply too much to
post.

****************************************************************************************************************************************************************
A last note:

I just want to say that regardless of what people might think about this post,
it was not meant to attack anyone. It was to give the truth about the
homosexual lie and then give a way out of the lifestyle.

If you are gay and need help, you can call anyone one of the organizations
above. They will help you to get to the bottom for your feelings and help you
to be the person God meant you to be.

I want you to know that I love you and I care about you. If I didn't I
wouldn't be spending this kind of time doing this kind of post.

There was much more that I could write, but time will not permit me to type all
the material I have. Perhaps I will post another 3000 lines in a few months.

Here's the last part of my post for the Gay Packet.

********************************************************************************
Homosexuality and the Christian: Questions Gays Ask Most...
by Sy Rogers and Bob Davies

Q-As a homosexual, I believe that my sexual feelings are natural and normal for
me. Why is this against God's will?

A-Homosexuality is against God's Will because it was never part of God's
original design for human sexual behavior. Seeing Adam's need for physical and
emotional companionship, God did not create another man for him, but rather,
God created woman for man (see Genesis 2:18-25 and I Corinthians 11:9). This
was God's original plan, His design which is obvious in the natural and
complimentary function of the male and female sex organs and the male and
female temperments. Prior to the fall of mankind, there was only one
male-female relationship. Like all life on earth, human heterosexual
(male-female) pairing was affected and distorted by the fall of mankind. This
led to cases of polygamy (having more than one wife...Genesis 4:19), adultery
(Genesis 12:17, 26:10), Incest (Genesis 19:33), prostitution (Genesis 38:15)
and rape (Genesis 43:2). Homosexual pairing also resulted from the fall.
Though a person may 'feel' that their sexual orientation or inner
drives are natural and normal for themselves, remember, feelings can mislead us
(see Jeremiah 17:9). What we may 'feel' is right does NOT make it morally
right. The bottom line here, is that we live according to the principles of
God's Word, not according to our feelings.

Q- I've been told that nowhere does the Bible 'flat-out' condemn homosexuality.
I've even heard that the word 'homosexual' doesn't appear in the original
Scriputure. What's the scoop?

A- The scoop is...you must first decide whether or not you will accept the
Bible as the Word of God, and as our true, absolute authority of faith and
conduct. You must also believe that the writings of the Bible are relevant and
applicable today. I believe as II Peter 1:21 says, "That men, moved by the Holy
Spirit, spoke from God." I believe that the Bible is the inspired Word of God,
is without error and that His Word is very much for us today (Isaiah 40:8 and
Psalm 119:160). II Timothy 3:16 says it best: "All Scripture is given by
inspiration of God, and it is profitable for teaching, for reproof, for
correction and for instruction in righteousness."
To answer this question, the Bible does 'flat out' condemn all
homosexual behavior in both the Old and New Testaments (see Leviticus 18:22,
20:13, Romans 1:24-32 and I Corinthians 6:9-10). Since the word "Homsexual" is
a relatively new word, it doesn't appear in the Bible's original writings. But
God needed no modern label to describe homosexual practices. Besides the word
"Homosexual" is a general term which covers a variety of same-sex sexual
behavior. God, however, is much more specific in His Word. There are several
words in Hebrew and Greek (the languages the original Scriptures were written
in), which pinpoint the kinds of sexual behavior God declares to be sin.
Sinful sexual behavior includes: sex outside of marriage or sex without
intending to get married, adultery, sex with family members, sex with animals,
male and female prostitution and all passive and aggressive sex acts with the
same sex. (Note: All references to homosexuality in Scripture refer to
male-to-male sex, except in Romans 1:26-27, which is the only record of God's
condemnation of lesbianism)

Q- Since we live under "grace" and not the "law" why should we be concerned
with outdated Old Testament standards and Levitical laws dealing with ceremony,
food and sex?

A-Many people believe that we can ignore the Old Testament "Holiness Code" God
gave to Moses while the Israelites traveled through the desert. In that code
was God's standard for our sexuality, including God's condemnation of
homosexuality. The natural argument is, "If we are under grace and not the
law, then we can do away with God's condemnation of homosexual acts found in
Leviticus 18:22 and 20:13." Some argue that these laws no longer apply to us,
or that God only gave these laws to encourage the population growth of the
Israelits to ensure their survival. In reality, God forbade adultery and
incest, He led the Israelites into war several times, and God said to kill
those who disobeyed his moral laws...all of which helped to reduce the
population. So it wasn't quantity God was concerned with, it was, and still
is, quality!
Additionally, God's holiness code for Isreal had two categories: the
"ceremonial or symbolic" laws and the "moral" laws. The ceremonial laws dealt
with religious worship, dietary laws, clothing and various cultural aspects of
the jews, representing a people set apart for God. These ceremonial laws also
symbolized the future coming of the Messiah, Jesus and these laws are temporary
(Acts 10:15). However, the moral laws were God's principles for humanity, and
were not limited to the Jewish culture, but were universal. These moral laws
are permanent (Psalms 119:160) and apply to every culture including our modern
society. Obviously, the commands concerning sexuality and homosexuality are
apart of God's moral laws. Jesus was the fulfillment of the ceremonial or
symbolic law (Ephesians 2:15) and He did not come to do away with the moral law
(see Matthew 5:17-19). Jesus said of the Old Testament moral commandments:
"Whosever keeps and teaches them sahll be called great in the Kingdom of
Heaven." --Mattehew 5:19 (Also read Romans chapter 6).

Q- Did Jesus ever say anything about homosexuality?

A- Directly, no. HOWEVER- are many things Jesus said that the Bible doesn't
record (see John 21:25). He could have mentioned it, although He probably had
no occasion to - the Jews of His day were strictly against such practices.
There are many subjects Jesus did not mention such as incest, rape and
beastiality. Just because Jesus didn't mention these practices doesn't mean
they are therefore OK to do so.
Jesus always upheld the Old Testament law (Matthew 5:17-19), which
strictly condemned homosexuality. Jesus only spoke of sexualitin a
heterosexual sense. The only alternative marriage Jesus spoke of was celibacy
- no sex of any kind (Matthew 19:12), Additionally, there is absolutely no
support to any accusation of homosexuality among Jesus's disciples. Christ's
ememies would have gladly exposed it, as homosexuality was a crime punishable
by death in the Jewish culture.

Q- In spite of the drawbacks, I'm satisfied with the gay lifestyle and I have
no desire to become heterosexual. I don't think it is fair that God expects me
to give up what I have now and attempt to live as a heterosexual. What am I
suppose to do?

A- God isn't asking you to become heterosexual. Heterosexuality isn't your
goal, being in right standing with God is! God doesn't want you to stop having
gay sex just to start having "straight" sex. Heterosexuals don't have Heaven's
blessing just because they aren't gay. Remember, God does NOT have a personal
hatred of homosexuals. He doesn't consider it the ultimate sin. However, God
DOES have a personal hatred of sin, and He hates heterosexual sin (such as
incest, adultry), just as much as He hates homosexuality, stealing, murder,
lying, gossip. God hates sin because He knows that it will lead to corruption,
destruction and eternal punishment. God hates sin, including homosexual sin,
because He sees what it does to those He created and loves. Yes, God is Love,
but His love NEVER justifies our sinful behavior. He does desire to forgive us
and change us so we can be pleasing to Him, but it's up to us to be willing to
be changed. Where God requires change, He makes change possible (Mark 10:27
and Philippians 4:13).
The only sexual relationship God blesses is between a man and a woman
who have a lifetime commitment to each other (marriage....see Hebrews 13:4).
Every other form of sex is sin, whether it's gay or straight. As mentioned
earlier, the only alternative to heterosexual marriage is celibacy. This may
sound extreme, especially in our easy-sex society, but God's attitude toward
sex is NOT casual. No argument or philosophy of man will ever change God or
what he has said about sin, including homosexuality (Malachi 3:6). God will
never compromise His standards to satisfy our human desires. His ways many not
seem fair to us, but God IS GOD. It is not up to us to debate His
standards--just obey them.
Though you may enjoy being gay for now (even the Bible says that sin is
pleasurable for a while...Hebrews 11:25), only isa real and vital relationship
with God will bring lasting happiness and purpose in life. God has created us
with a need for Him which nothing else can fulfill. When we don't have a right
relationship with God, we tend to look everywhere and try everything to fill up
that need for Him. But philosophies, lifestyles, money, fame, sex - even
relgion, can't be a satisfying substitute for God in the long run.

Q- If God is a God of love, how can He condemn anyone?

A- Yes, God IS love (I John 4:8), although God's version of love is not always
like our human version of love. God is also truth (John 14:6-7), and God's
love will not compromise His truth. In fact, God's judgment is based on truth
(Romans 2:2). Jesus came to earth to show us God's love - and He proved His
love for mankind by dying for us (John 3:16-17). Jesus loved people enough to
be honest with them. He was even willing to confront and offend people with
the truth in order that they might turn away from sin and be saved. Jesus
sharply reprimanded His disciple Peter for a wrong attitude (Mark 8:33). Jesus
blasted the religious hypocrites in Matthew chapter 23, and Jesus threatened a
sinner with punishment if he did not stop sinning (John 5:14). Jesus never
condemned people - but He did condemn their wrong actions and wrong attitudes
[BEHAVIOR AND LIFESTYLE] (Matthew 23:27-28, Mark 7:20-23). He warned them that
unless they turned away from sin and turned to God (to repent), they would
suffer eternal torment in Hell after death (Luke 13:1-5 and Acts 17:30-31).
People end up going to Hell not because of the sins they committed, but
because they never turned from their sins and got reconciled or "made right"
with God. Because of mankind's fall (read Genesis 3), all of the creation,
including every human being, has been contaminated with sin. It doesn't matter
whether a person is an axe murderer, a prostitute, a homosexual or the world's
sweetest grandmother, everybody has been affected by the terminal plague of
sin. Sin separates us from God here on earth, and will result in our eternal
separation from God after death (Isaiah 59:1-2)
BUT...the "Good News" is this: Now it is possible to get right with
God and be pleasing to Him by having our sins removed or washed away, through
faith in Jesus, who has made the way for us to return to God!! Through faith
in Jesus, our sins won't separate us from God (see Ephesians 2:8, Luke 7:50 and
Galatians 3:26). Because it cost Jesus His life to make this way back to God
for us, God will severely judge those who reject Jesus (disobey him) and His
teachings. Those who directly or indirectly reject Christ have not been
cleansed from the contamination of sin, and God will not allow sin and it's
corruption to exist in Heaven. The Bible says that none of us is good enough
to quality for Heaven without being cleansed by faith in Jesus (read Romans 3).
Though God's judgment is just and terrible, no one need to go to hell. That's
why Jesus has made a way of escape for us! All those who come to Christ of His
forgiveness and cleansing will not be turned away! (John 6:37).

Q- Although I am a practicing homosexual, I believe in God and Jesus and
consider myself to be a Christian. Recently, I've been told that you can't be
gay and be a Christian too. What do you say?

A- First we need to determine what a Christian is. In brief, a Christian is a
person who lives in obedience to the teachings of Jesus Christ, regardless of
the personal sacrifice, recognizing Christ's teachings to be ultimate truth
(John 14:6, 18:37). Such obedience is required by God to qualify for Heaven,
and as proof of our love for God and our fellow man (John 14:15, John 14:23-24,
Hebrews 5:9, and I Peter 1:22).
This obedience is possible only after a supernatural experience Jesus
called being "Born Again" (John 3:3). Being Born Again of the Spirit of God
is a result of faith in Jesus: who He said He is, and what He has done for us.
But saving faith is much more than just believing (James 2:19). Faith that
saves is faith that trusts God and believes what Jesus has said to the degree
that a life-time commitment requires abandoning all things which God declares
to be sin. The Bible says that if a person is Born Again, he will live to
please God through obedience to His Word (John 8:31). Additionally, the Bible
states as proof of a Born Again experience, the person will no longer live in a
state or situation of continual sin (I John 3:9-10). The Born Again person
will no longer be a slave to sin and its passions (see Romans chapter 6 and
Hebrews 10:26-27).
Though a person will struggle with sin and temptation after being Born
Again (read Romans chapter 7, I Corinthians 10:13, and James 1:12), they will
no longer continue to live in a lifestyle that disobeys God's Word (John
14:23-24). The Word of God is clear that homosexuality is sin. The Word of
God is also very clear that those who continue to practice and live in sexual
sin will NOT enter Heaven, but will be judged and punished eternally (I
Corinthians 6:9-10, Galatians 5:19-21 and Revelation 21:7-8). Regardless of a
person's claim to be a Christian, God's Word tells us that our actions reveal
the truth more than our words (Galatians 5:19-25 and Matthew 15:7-8). As Titus
1:16 says, "They claim to know God, but by their actions deny Him." Therefore,
based on what the Bible says (not my opinion), you cannot be a Christian and
remain a practicing homosexual - it is a direct contradiction to God's Word.
Remember however, where God requires change, He gives us the power to become
his children...John 1:12-13.

Q- I've been reading about gays being "Born Again" and delievered or "set free"
from homosexuality. Is there any Biblical record of homosexuals being changed
by God.

A- Yes! The Bible DOES mention that there is hope and freedom for the
homosexual! In I Corinthians 6:9-10, we are told that neither the sexually
immoral, nor idolators, nor male prostitutes nor homosexual offenders...will
inherit the Kingdom of God. BUT...following verse 11 we are told: "And that is
what some of you 'were.' But you were washed (made clean), you were sanctified
(set apart), you were justified (declared righteous before God) in the name of
the Lord Jesus Christ adn by the Spirit of God."
Regardless of the sin, regardless of the situation or problem, God is
willing to forgive us and change us so we can be pleasing to Him. Some of the
most famous people in the Bible were murderers (Moses, King David, the Apostle
Paul) and prostitutes (Rahab and Mary Magdalene). Why would God use them? To
prove that no sin was too big for God to forgive. These people trusted God's
love for them and allowed Him to change their lives.
Yes the thought of change can be scary - but remember, God knows you
best and loves you the most. He understands your fears. He knows all about
your hurts and He knows your need for love. God would never ask you to do
anything that wasn't possible - and with God all things are possible (including
freedom from Homosexuality). Will you resist God and His love for you at your
own expense? Is the moment of passing pleasure worth the price you'll be
paying, both in this life and in eternity? Consider the alternatives. Nothing
has greater worth than God's love. Trust Him and discover His love for you!

Closing Coments:
In spite of the popular myth that "homosexuals can't change," we've seen
Biblical proof that says homosexuals can change! The excuses "Once gay always
gay," and "I can't help it, I was born this way", are no longer true in the
light of the Scriptures. Additionally, there are now many Christians in
America and around the world who have been set free from homosexuality by the
power of God - and their numbers are growing! Several former homosexuals have
even married and have families, not a "proof" of their freedom from
homosexuality, but evidence of their new lives as followers of Christ.
Sure it won't be easy for any of them to give up the life they had
known. Each of them faced struggles, rejection and temptation, but they never
gave up on God's ability to change them. They were determined and committed to
continue their relationship with God, knowing He would help them face a new
future. "Therefore if any man be in Christ, he is a *new creation*; old things
have passed away, all things become new"---II Corinthians 5:17.
Finally, our purpose in writing this was not to condemn you. We LOVE
you! We cared - dared enough to share what we know to be true - so you might
come to experience God's tremendous love for you! The Bible says that if we
know the truth, then the truth can set us free. Jesus is the truth, and He
would love for you to share your life with Him!

[K=A*T]

I just finished paging through 2300+ lines of GAYPACK
part III. I might be wrong, but there is but a few
lines (less than 50) which are Aaron's own.

I am more sad than angry. I am sad because Aaron has
spent all this time to type up stories and reports that
already exist. I am sad that Aaron didn't take a tenth
of that time to reflect on the posts that people have
addressed to him and try to think about them logically.

I am really sad.

I guess I will not have sex on a regular basis for a
week or so and people can think I am moron, if they
want to.

--KAT

[green...@cobra.uni.edu]

In article <POLITICS%9311230...@UCF1VM.CC.UCF.EDU>, K=A*T <MEC...@UKCC.UKY.EDU> writes:
> I just finished paging through 2300+ lines of GAYPACK
> part III. I might be wrong, but there is but a few
> lines (less than 50) which are Aaron's own.

KAT, the whole point of the Gay Packet was to back up (with sources) from what
I have already said.

>
> I am more sad than angry. I am sad because Aaron has
> spent all this time to type up stories and reports that
> already exist. I am sad that Aaron didn't take a tenth
> of that time to reflect on the posts that people have
> addressed to him and try to think about them logically.
>

There are very few logical posts that have been posted on homosexuality. I
mean if you want to connect homosexuals with mercinery soldiers, then theirs
something wrong with your head. You are one of the most illogical people on
this list and you persist (Michael Morse is good at this too) at taking low cut
cheap shots rather than dealing with the issue and the context in which the
Gay Pack is in. It is really easy to not know how to answer the packet and
then get on here and say:

> I am really sad.
>
> I guess I will not have sex on a regular basis for a
> week or so and people can think I am moron, if they
> want to.
>

KAT, It might do you some good to practice the S word: Self Control and the M
word: Morality and the D word: Decency and the C word: Conviction and lastly,
the T word: Thinking.

> --KAT
Aaron

[Song Weaver]

> KAT, It might do you some good to practice the S word: Self Control and the M
> word: Morality and the D word: Decency and the C word: Conviction and lastly,
> the T word: Thinking.

I would consider this a major compliment coming from aaron.

:-)

--Julie

------------------------------------------------------------------------
Julie Waters "Power is a Drug. Put Corporate
ju...@drycas.club.cc.cmu.edu America in Detox."

[Song Weaver]

[..stuff Aaron's already posted once deleted...]

[...Other stuff that's first and foremost editorial opinion deleted...]

[...Theoretically "scientific" stuff deleted...]

>An Observation by Aaron Greenway:
>Homosexuality and the Truth states:
>>One Kinsey institute study revealed that 43% of the homosexual men
>> surveyed estimated that they had had sex with 500 or more partners;
>> 28% with 1,000 or more partners.--10

It fascinates me that you'll claim that Kinsey has been entirely
"discredited" and then pretend that you don't believe this and
quote something (something relatively spurious at best) that is
supposedly from Kinsey's work to support yourself.

>The Conservative Chronicle states:
>>"According to every study of sexual BEHAVIOR, homosexuals are
>>notoriously promiscuous. In one 1978 study, 43% of male homosexuals admitted
>>to having sex with 500 partners, 28% to having sex with over 1,000.

No good. Tell me _who_ was studied and the details of the "study"
(or studies) involved.

>A last note:
>
>I just want to say that regardless of what people might think about
>this post, it was not meant to attack anyone. It was to give the truth
>about the homosexual lie and then give a way out of the lifestyle.

If you hadn't behaved with such utter hositility and crassness to people
who disagreed with you I'd find this statement easier to believe.

[...Remaining 250+ lines of attempts at prostelytization deleted...]

Final note on this subject (unless I think of something else to say, of
course ;-)):

I think Aaron's established quite clearly that his primary objection to
"homosexuality" is primarily religious in nature. His data with respect
to all other of his objections is consistently either erronious, out of
date, and in some cases appears simply fabricated (not necessarily by
Aaron, but by his "sources."

As both myself and KerryS have pointed out, propoganda is generally
unreliable as a viable source for accurate information. Furthermore, a
good deal of the discreding that has been done to Aaron's quoted
material has not only been properly adressed by Aaron, but in some cases
been used as an excuse for Aaron to personally attack the person
responding.

Given that Aaron has demonstrated a complete unwillingness to adress any
of the critiques directed towards his "gaypack" (critiques which he
himself invited) it seems clear that further discussion is most likely
to be uneventful at best.

--Julie

[Michael Morse]

Well, we have it on reliable authority that I persist in "taking low cut
cheap shots and ignoring the context in which the Gay Pack is in."
Let me, if I may, take a breather for a moment from these deeply nefarious
doings, and ask one question, and make one correction:
a. the question is this: in which context is the Gay Pack is in?;
b. the correction is: I have documentary evidence that 99.9% of my shirts
are not "low cut," indeed do not even fall away from the shoulder, but
maintain a prim but extremely fashion-conscious neckline. When *I* want
to start talk, sweetheart, I'll do it with a philosophical statement, not
a fashion statement.
Oh, and one more question. Since I confine my sex life to reality and
not online pornographic fantasies, I'm afraid your Ed/Fred scenario
rather lost me. Who licks whom where, exactly? And, by the by, precisely
how did you happen to introduce this particular fantasy into the discussion?
Was it to demonstrate your moral outrage against gay sexual behaviour by
documenting as vividly as your moral code exactly what gay sex must feel
like? To project it as precisely in your imagination as possible? See, I've
got be careful here not to run afoul of the local grammarnazis; even though
you have, not for the first time, explicitly spelled out an imaginary gay
sex scenario, no one, least of all me, is authorized to connect this gesture
to your own desire, since that's not precisely what you said in so many
words. So, rather than risk crossing these exalted hermeneuticians (our
very own Estee Lauders of interpretation), I'll let YOU tell us instead:
if homosexuality is so abhorrent to you, what the bloody hell are you
doing littering your postings with gay sex fantasies?
Thanks ever so much.
MWM

[Geoffrey Simmons]

I just skimmed the account of the "Year of the Queer" parade in Gaypack III,
the event that Aaron has been hemming and hawing about for months now, as
clear evidence of how disgusting homosexuals are. I thought it was hysterical;
some of the slogans quoted were really funny. It's also fun to read Bob
Larson's "oh my"-gasp at what he saw.

Thanks, Aaron, for having worked so hard on a posting that brought a smile
into my day, and for heightening our awareness of the creative wit within
the homosexual community.

Geoff
--
Geoffrey Simmons | sim...@informatik.uni-hamburg.de | "Insert wise
University of Hamburg | Phone: (++49 40) 4123-6151 | and witty
Bodenstedtstr. 16 | Fax: (++49 40) 4123-6159 | quotation
D-22765 Hamburg, Germany | | here."

[green...@cobra.uni.edu]

In article <2ddo5o$j...@pith.uoregon.edu>, drei...@oregon.uoregon.edu (daniel r. reitman, attorney to be) writes:
> In article <1993Nov29.1...@cobra.uni.edu>,
> green...@cobra.uni.edu writes:
>>In article <93328.214...@YORKVM1.BITNET>,
>> Michael Morse <MMO...@YORKVM1.BITNET> writes:
>
>>> Was it to demonstrate your moral outrage against gay sexual *behaviour*
>>TYPO ALERT! TYPO ALERT! MICHAEL MISSPELLED A WORD!!!!!! . . .
>
> Ahem. He didn't misspell it. He used the Canadian spelling. Quite
> logically.
This isn't Canada.
>
> Dan, ad nauseum
>
> "It is sometimes said that error 'crept' into the trial of a lawsuit. Not so
> in the case at bar. It marched in like an army with banners, and trumpets. It
> was escorted, and emphasized, and aggravated by the attorney for the state."
> State v. Tolson, 248 Iowa 733, 734, 82 N.W.2d 105, 106 (1957).

[daniel r. reitman, attorney to be]

In article <1993Nov30.1...@cobra.uni.edu>,

green...@cobra.uni.edu writes:
>In article <2ddo5o$j...@pith.uoregon.edu>,
> drei...@oregon.uoregon.edu (daniel r. reitman, attorney to be) writes:
>> In article <1993Nov29.1...@cobra.uni.edu>,
>> green...@cobra.uni.edu writes:
>>>In article <93328.214...@YORKVM1.BITNET>,
>>> Michael Morse <MMO...@YORKVM1.BITNET> writes:

>>>> Was it to demonstrate your moral outrage against gay sexual *behaviour*

>>>TYPO ALERT! TYPO ALERT! MICHAEL MISSPELLED A WORD!!!!!! . . .

>> Ahem. He didn't misspell it. He used the Canadian spelling. Quite
>> logically.

>This isn't Canada.

It is inferable from Mr. Morse's E-mail address that he is in Toronto.

[Michael Morse]

Sorry, Aaaron, you've got me a tad confused: *what* "isn't Canada"?
Thanx,
MWM

[green...@cobra.uni.edu]

We were talking about (can't remember at the moment) making a typo. And
someone said that the word behavior (which was the word that was misspelled)
was spelled behaviour in Canada. And I said, "This isn't Canada."

Speaking of spelling errors:

> Sorry, Aaaron, you've got me a tad confused: *what* "isn't Canada"?

> Thanx, ^^^^^^
> MWM

[Benetna'asch]

green...@cobra.uni.edu wrote:

When you're on the net, Aaron, you've got to remember that it reaches
outside of the United States.
------------------------------------------------------------------------------
In as much as the pursuit of the stars | Brian D. Kane (Benetna'asch)
is our destiny, this pursuit will lead | kane@{buast7,astro,buast1}.bu.edu
to a radical redefinition of the basic | Astronomy Dept, Boston University,
thing we call "family". Change awaits. | Boston, MA 02215.|_|^|_|^|_|^|_|^|_|
T8(7v)C3L1wvhb+(hcl)d--a+w-cye++gfk+s-m1+m2+q--

[Geoffrey Simmons]

green...@cobra.uni.edu writes:

> Michael Morse writes:
>> Sorry, Aaaron, you've got me a tad confused: *what* "isn't Canada"?

>We were talking about (can't remember at the moment) making a typo. And

>someone said that the word behavior (which was the word that was misspelled)
>was spelled behaviour in Canada. And I said, "This isn't Canada."

Incredible, Aaron, you just *cannot* answer a straight question. *What* isn't
Canada? This posting? Iowa? The list? The sentence "This isn't Canada"? To
be sure, all of these things are not Canada, but none of them is the United
States, either. Offhand, I can think of list participants from Canada,
Ireland, England, Australia and *ahem* Germany. Is it OK by you if we are
on the list?

I thought you had final exams...

Mit freundlichen Gruessen,