Star Trek Into darkness / notes before viewing

[Will Dockery]

Star Trek Into Darkness / notes before viewing

Thinking of going to Star Trek- need to wait on Dollar Theater but curious 4 a look at it. More I see about the film the better it looks. Much as I wanna I need to wait until Star Trek is affordable.

Khan is the bad guy it is confirmed.

If I can stand to wait that long...

Read two reviews of it last night, both sides, one that hates the film and one that loves it... and they both make me want to go see Star Trek. This is a Star Trek universe that comments on our modern times, juts as Star Trek was always a mirror on our own society.

1960s Star Trek echoed the Cold War and Vietnam, Klingons were Russians and Romulans were kind of mysterious Viet Cong.

1980s Star Trek saw the breakdown of the Klingons as we did with the USSR, and by next Generation we had a pretty peacefull Star Trek with even Klingons as sort of friends... even one of the greatest characters from that time, Worf, was Klingon.
2013 Star Trek echoes our times, and our recent past. And Khan is back... no replacing Ricardo Montalban though.

"Come sit on my fine Corinthian Leather..."

Was kind of relieved earlier when all reports said Khan would NOT be in the movie, had hoped they wouldn't try such a bone heaed move as try to remake Khan.

The critic who loves the film compares the idea of a new Khan with the success of rebooting the Joker. I still see Jack Nicholson as the all-time Joker, and never saw that new Heath Ledger Joker yet. People say he made Joker great, but I have fixed ideas on who and what the Joker should be.

The new actor "reinterpreted" Khan... made him "better". That will be a tough sell, I'll maybe have to just think of him as another character who happens to be named "Khan".

But I will go in with an open mind, to follow Star Trek where it needs to go. It is either remake the series for the new age or put it in the museums.

Jeer if you need to, Trekies, if at all possible I'll be on board and trying to follow these new directions of Star Trek... if they will allow me to.

[Wiseguy]

Will Dockery <will.d...@gmail.com> wrote in
news:98436076-8e3b-4ece...@googlegroups.com:

> Star Trek Into Darkness / notes before viewing
>
> Thinking of going to Star Trek- need to wait on Dollar Theater but
> curious 4 a look at it. More I see about the film the better it looks.
> Much as I wanna I need to wait until Star Trek is affordable.
>
> Khan is the bad guy it is confirmed.
>
> If I can stand to wait that long...
>
> Read two reviews of it last night, both sides, one that hates the film
> and one that loves it... and they both make me want to go see Star
> Trek. This is a Star Trek universe that comments on our modern times,

> just as Star Trek was always a mirror on our own society.

Yes, we're a society of mindless idiots.

[Bast]

If you see "Jack Nicholson as the all-time Joker", and not Cesar
Romero.......
....Go see 2013 star trek.

[Wiseguy]

"Bast" <fake...@nomail.invalid> wrote in news:knhqh5$80s$1@dont-
email.me:

Many actors can play one part...that's why it's called acting.

Been going on since cavemen, through Shakespeare, soap operas, Broadway
and television.

Anyone who says only one actor can play a part is a fool and probably
has a secret crush on the actor.

[SparkoHeaps]

"The only true Catwoman is Julie Newmar, Lee Meriwether, or Eartha Kitt." --Adam West on the Simpsons.

[Will Dockery]

No, that doesn't directly relate, Batman TV to Star Trek, since what was done to the character of Batman many or most fans feel was turn the story into a cheap, campy comedy.

It wasn't until 1989's Tim Burton version that many of the fans of the "real" Batman felt that the films got Batman and his milleu right.

[Wiseguy]

SparkoHeaps <spark...@gmail.com> wrote in
news:065a15a1-8c2d-45c3...@googlegroups.com:

Adam West the character not Adam West the actor.

[MITO MINISTER]

On May 23, 11:54 am, Wiseguy <epw...@yahoo.com> wrote:
> SparkoHeaps <sparkohe...@gmail.com> wrote innews:065a15a1-8c2d-45c3...@googlegroups.com:

Adam West the character on the Simpsons.

BUKOWSKI RULES!

[Wiseguy]

MITO MINISTER <cigarm...@gmail.com> wrote in
news:1c27d588-9252-4497...@fz1g2000pbb.googlegroups.com:

> On May 23, 11:54�am, Wiseguy <epw...@yahoo.com> wrote:
>> SparkoHeaps <sparkohe...@gmail.com> wrote

>> innews:065a15a1-8c2d-45c3-a577-
> 84c9ec...@googlegroups.com:

That wasn't a question. See the absense of a question mark?
I was already stating what you stated.

In other words, a fictional Adam West made that quote, not the real one.

[SparkoHeaps]

>
>
>
> In other words, a fictional Adam West made that quote, not the real one.

Yes. And the quote applies.

[Wiseguy]

SparkoHeaps <spark...@gmail.com> wrote in news:dbf9029c-10b5-497b-9f4b-
e82ca5...@googlegroups.com:

>>
>>
>>
>> In other words, a fictional Adam West made that quote, not the real one.
>
> Yes. And the quote applies.
>

In your opinion.

[Your Name]

In article <dbf9029c-10b5-497b...@googlegroups.com>,

SparkoHeaps <spark...@gmail.com> wrote:
> >
> > In other words, a fictional Adam West made that quote, not the real one.
>
> Yes. And the quote applies.

Technically that's "no".

The real Adam West voices the animated Adm West, so the quote WAS made by
the real Adam West ... BUT it was probably created for him to say by the
show's writers (there is a possibility that he came up with the idea or
ad-libbed it and they incorporated it into the show).

[SparkoHeaps]

But the quote itself applies to the discussion at hand. If someone is to claim that the performers in the 1960s incarnation of Batman are the only valid ones, then they must contend with the fact that some of the villains were portrayed by more than one actor.

[Will Dockery]

We have to also note that the situations are reversed here, and that the majority of Batman fans see the TV series in a very simliar was so many TOS Star Trek fans see the J.J. Abrams films.

[SparkoHeaps]

>
> > But the quote itself applies to the discussion at hand. If someone is to claim that the performers in the 1960s incarnation of Batman are the only valid ones, then they must contend with the fact that some of the villains were portrayed by more than one actor.
>
>
>
> We have to also note that the situations are reversed here, and that the majority of Batman fans see the TV series in a very simliar was so many TOS Star Trek fans see the J.J. Abrams films.

Possibly. I'm not sure how the majority stand on this issue.

I was responding, however, to a poster who who stated "If you see 'Jack Nicholson as the all-time Joker', and not Cesar

Romero.......
....Go see 2013 star trek. "

The implied analogy as I read it was "Cesar Romero is to Old Star Trek as Jack Nicholson is to New Star Trek."

But if you use Cat Woman or Mr. Freeze in this analogy, you run into trouble.

I prefer the old Star Trek myself, but I have to admit that the characters have become symbols and can be played by more than one actor and that there will not necessarily be a consensus as to which actor is the all-time Kirk. (Even though in my world, Shatner is the ONLY James T. Kirk. That guy in the movie is just James S. Kirk.)

[Will Dockery]

Of course Star Trek neatly (and in hindsight, brilliantly) sidestepped all the "New Kirk" vs. "Old Kirk" stuff Batman ran into in the late 1980s by recasting and reimagining the entire cast from the same mold, with picard et al.

And then in 1991 wisely avoiding it again when Paramount and other ptb wanted to do the "Starfleet Acadamy" film featuring Young Kirk, Spock et al in their youth, bringing us instead the beautiful send off with The Undiscovered Country.

It had to happen eventually, I figure, though, as Star Trek became hopelessly watered down with the series after TNG, time to bring it all back the the original concept, and refit it for the future generations... or retire it and place TOS on permanent display, as Shakespeare might have been if film and DVD technology existed in his time.

Who knows? I sure don't.

[Wiseguy]

SparkoHeaps <spark...@gmail.com> wrote in
news:164949be-2f18-4438...@googlegroups.com:

Aren't you contradicting yourself?

> "I have to admit that the
> characters have become symbols and can be played by more than one
> actor and that there will not necessarily be a consensus as to which
> actor is the all-time Kirk."

> "Even though in my world, Shatner is the
> ONLY James T. Kirk. That guy in the movie is just James S. Kirk."

Anyone who thinks a fictional character can't be played by a different
actor is a silly fanboy.

[MITO MINISTER]

On May 24, 3:01 pm, Wiseguy <epw...@yahoo.com> wrote:
> SparkoHeaps <sparkohe...@gmail.com> wrote innews:164949be-2f18-4438...@googlegroups.com:

Rim Shot!

[SparkoHeaps]

>
> > I prefer the old Star Trek myself, but I have to admit that the
>
> > characters have become symbols and can be played by more than one
>
> > actor and that there will not necessarily be a consensus as to which
>
> > actor is the all-time Kirk. (Even though in my world, Shatner is the
>
> > ONLY James T. Kirk. That guy in the movie is just James S. Kirk.)
>
> >
>
> >
>
> >
>
>
>
> Aren't you contradicting yourself?
>

Yes. Humans are, if they are honest with themselves, full of self-contradictions. I cognitively recognize that if Star Trek will continue, then it will have to start using new actors. But emotionally, there will only be one Kirk.

[SparkoHeaps]

>
> It had to happen eventually, I figure, though, as Star Trek became hopelessly watered down with the series after TNG, time to bring it all back the the original concept, and refit it for the future generations... or retire it and place TOS on permanent display, as Shakespeare might have been if film and DVD technology existed in his time.
>

Yeah. One way or another, something had to give.

[Wiseguy]

SparkoHeaps <spark...@gmail.com> wrote in
news:f39d1e42-4e39-4532...@googlegroups.com:

Then you're too emotional to see reality.
Most any actor can play any part.
That's why it's called acting.

[SparkoHeaps]

>
> > Anyone who thinks a fictional character can't be played by a different
>
> > actor is a silly fanboy.
>
>
>
> Rim Shot!

Careful there, Dulka. You get so emotionally involved with the characters that you have gone on a 10-year temper tantrum because someone made suggestions about their sexual orientation.

[SparkoHeaps]

>
> Anyone who thinks a fictional character can't be played by a different
>
> actor is a silly fanboy.

1. Yes, we are both silly fanboys.
2. I do think a fictional character can be played by different actors. I never stated otherwise.

[Wiseguy]

SparkoHeaps <spark...@gmail.com> wrote in
news:f39d1e42-4e39-4532...@googlegroups.com:

I wasn't talking about humans in general but about what you posted.

Just because you're in love with William Shatner doesn't mean he's the
only actor who could play Kirk.

[Wiseguy]

SparkoHeaps <spark...@gmail.com> wrote in
news:8736b9a4-dcfd-4c4d...@googlegroups.com:

1. Speak for yourself. I'm not a fanboy, silly or otherwise.
2. You stated that William Shatner is the only Kirk. Not only do you
contradict yourself, you have a serious crush on William Shatner.

[Bast]

Uh,...in the Simpsons, Adam West the character AND the actor, are one in the
same.

I know. You must be shocked that someone can imitate their own voice so
well.

[Bast]

I'm guessing you watch a lot of Soap Operas.


Shatner is the only James T. Kirk, Nimoy the only spock, et al,....END OF
STORY.
Now if you will excuse me, I'll go back to watching my TOS un-remastered
DVD's,.....in my basement.

[Bast]

Wiseguy wrote:
> SparkoHeaps <spark...@gmail.com> wrote in
> news:8736b9a4-dcfd-4c4d...@googlegroups.com:
>
>>
>>>
>>> Anyone who thinks a fictional character can't be played by a
>>> different
>>>
>>> actor is a silly fanboy.
>>
>> 1. Yes, we are both silly fanboys.
>> 2. I do think a fictional character can be played by different actors.
>> I never stated otherwise.
>>
>
> 1. Speak for yourself. I'm not a fanboy, silly or otherwise.

Yes you are.
Or do you agree with TPM on the K/S stuff ?

> 2. You stated that William Shatner is the only Kirk. Not only do you
> contradict yourself, you have a serious crush on William Shatner.

So what if I do,...you got something against heterosexuals ?

[Wiseguy]

"Bast" <fake...@nomail.invalid> wrote in
news:knrlgl$ovs$1...@dont-email.me:

Many actors have played characters named after themselves...from George
Burns to Garry Shandling, from Jack Benny to Drew Carey. It doesn't
mean the characters were anything like the real actors.

Simple common sense. That must shock YOU.

[Wiseguy]

"Bast" <fake...@nomail.invalid> wrote in
news:knrm7v$rhg$1...@dont-email.me:

Soap operas are a part of acting. And adds credence to my explanation.
Thank you for bringing it up.

Also thank you for your comments concerning William Shatner being the
only Capt. Kirk, etc. Now everyone knows what an arrogant idiot you
are.

[Wiseguy]

"Bast" <fake...@nomail.invalid> wrote in news:knrmfu$sj1$1@dont-
email.me:

>
>
> Wiseguy wrote:
>> SparkoHeaps <spark...@gmail.com> wrote in
>> news:8736b9a4-dcfd-4c4d...@googlegroups.com:
>>
>>>
>>>>
>>>> Anyone who thinks a fictional character can't be played by a
>>>> different
>>>>
>>>> actor is a silly fanboy.
>>>
>>> 1. Yes, we are both silly fanboys.
>>> 2. I do think a fictional character can be played by different
actors.
>>> I never stated otherwise.
>>>
>>
>> 1. Speak for yourself. I'm not a fanboy, silly or otherwise.
>
> Yes you are.

Why am I a fanboy? Fanboys are those who disregard common sense and say
things like Star Trek 2009 isn't real Star Trek and only William Shatner
can play Kirk. I've said neither and disagreed with both.

You lose.

> Or do you agree with TPM on the K/S stuff ?
>
>

So, from what you said above, either you're a fanboy OR you believe the
K/S stuff. Not only does that make no sense but just shows how stupid
you are.

You lose. Again.

>> 2. You stated that William Shatner is the only Kirk. Not only do you
>> contradict yourself, you have a serious crush on William Shatner.
>
>
> So what if I do,...you got something against heterosexuals ?
>
>
>

Just stating conclusions based on your comments.

[Bast]

Well DUHHH.
TOS = Shatner
Everything since is crap.

Since I've been saying the same thing for years.
It seems YOU are the one who no hablas the h'inglish.

[Bast]

So your conclusions are STILL wrong.

[Bast]

So when George Burns or Jack Benny had their own shows they weren't playing
themselves ?

Did Gracie call George something else ?
Did Rodchester not say "yow suh, Misstuuh Benny" ?

Uh Gary shandling had a show where he played a patheticly bad, not-funny,
comic.
Drew Carrey used his own name when he was a nobody. But he plays himself now
on the price is right

[Your Name]

In article <knttg9$e7l$1...@dont-email.me>, "Bast" <fake...@nomail.invalid>
wrote:
>
<snip>

>
> Uh Gary shandling had a show where he played a patheticly bad, not-funny,
> comic.

That's called "casting to type" since hs *IS* a patheticly bad, not-funny,
comic. ;-)

> Drew Carrey used his own name when he was a nobody. But he plays himself now
> on the price is right

He's hosting a silly game show, so he still is a nobody. :-)

[Wiseguy]

"Bast" <fake...@nomail.invalid> wrote in news:kntk4t$gpc$1@dont-
email.me:

Your opinion. Not a fact.

> Since I've been saying the same thing for years.
> It seems YOU are the one who no hablas the h'inglish.
>
>
>

Just because you say something doesn't make it real. Obviously,
considering the nonsense you post.

[Wiseguy]

"Bast" <fake...@nomail.invalid> wrote in news:kntk8e$h9u$1@dont-
email.me:

So you're admitting anything based on your comments would be wrong?

[Wiseguy]

"Bast" <fake...@nomail.invalid> wrote in
news:knttg9$e7l$1...@dont-email.me:

I already said it. They played characters (that is, fiction) named
after themselves. Such a simple concept. Why can't you comprehend?
That's right, you're just an arrogant asshole wanting to start an
argument.

> Did Gracie call George something else ?
> Did Rodchester not say "yow suh, Misstuuh Benny" ?
>

Already answered. See previous post and above.

> Uh Gary shandling had a show where he played a patheticly bad,
> not-funny, comic.

He played a fictional character based and named after himself.
And you still can't understand.

> Drew Carrey used his own name when he was a nobody. But he plays
> himself now on the price is right
>

All game show host are themselves not a fictional character. I wasn't
talking about games shows, but fictional characters named after the
actors who played them.

You understand this. But you just want to be a stupid, arrogant,
asshole and act stupid because you have nothing else to do in the
basement. Now go away, stupid. I'm done with you.

[Wiseguy]

Your...@YourISP.com (Your Name) wrote in
news:YourName-270...@203-118-187-197.dsl.dyn.ihug.co.nz:

I bet you wished you made the money he makes doing a silly game show.

[Bast]

Oh ? you are not done with me yet,......so you are wrong again.