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Etznab
Jul 19, 2016, 9:42:01 AM7/19/16
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It would be nice if all the history books contained truthful and factual content vs. personal bias, embellishments, pseudo history and religion.
I read the claim, in so many words, that all religions take from others and then develop the teachings further. Kinpa used such an idea to apologize for actions by Paul Twitchell and Eckankar. Iow, according to him, everybody does it.
What a lame response.
Writing as if "everybody" does it and using words like "nobody" cares and "all" believe a certain way is like stretching the truth to such a great extent in an attempt to desperately get one's view accepted as meaningful. IMHO it is a sign of desperation.
Is Kinpa a control freak? Someone not really interested in discovering what is true vs. what is false, but simply someone who wants to try and control what it is that people think?
Well, first we would need to find evidence for the total disrespect for other people's opinions and points of view and whether Kinpa has expressed such mal content publicly and repeatedly. It is not hard to find this since he has made it a regular habit.
Numerous methods have already been used by Kinpa to manipulate the flow of information and the sharing of other people's views and opinions. Methods that include the intentional making up of pseudo history and religion in order to influence control both subjects.
The real danger about man-made history and religion is that it tries to plant false information into the minds of others by exploiting human imagination and intelligence. And when people refuse to be controlled by the false information then the manipulators get angry and increase their efforts to such an extent it results in the kind of false information Kinpa and J.R. repeatedly use to beat their horses.
I read the claim, in so many words, that all religions take from others and then develop the teachings further. Kinpa used such an idea to apologize for actions by Paul Twitchell and Eckankar. Iow, according to him, everybody does it.
What a lame response.
Writing as if "everybody" does it and using words like "nobody" cares and "all" believe a certain way is like stretching the truth to such a great extent in an attempt to desperately get one's view accepted as meaningful. IMHO it is a sign of desperation.
Is Kinpa a control freak? Someone not really interested in discovering what is true vs. what is false, but simply someone who wants to try and control what it is that people think?
Well, first we would need to find evidence for the total disrespect for other people's opinions and points of view and whether Kinpa has expressed such mal content publicly and repeatedly. It is not hard to find this since he has made it a regular habit.
Numerous methods have already been used by Kinpa to manipulate the flow of information and the sharing of other people's views and opinions. Methods that include the intentional making up of pseudo history and religion in order to influence control both subjects.
The real danger about man-made history and religion is that it tries to plant false information into the minds of others by exploiting human imagination and intelligence. And when people refuse to be controlled by the false information then the manipulators get angry and increase their efforts to such an extent it results in the kind of false information Kinpa and J.R. repeatedly use to beat their horses.
Kinpa
Jul 19, 2016, 5:57:15 PM7/19/16
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On Tuesday, July 19, 2016 at 1:42:01 PM UTC, Etznab wrote:
> It would be nice if all the history books contained truthful and factual content vs. personal bias, embellishments, pseudo history and religion.
>
> I read the claim, in so many words, that all religions take from others and then develop the teachings further. Kinpa used such an idea to apologize for actions by Paul Twitchell and Eckankar. Iow, according to him, everybody does it.
>~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
> It would be nice if all the history books contained truthful and factual content vs. personal bias, embellishments, pseudo history and religion.
>
> I read the claim, in so many words, that all religions take from others and then develop the teachings further. Kinpa used such an idea to apologize for actions by Paul Twitchell and Eckankar. Iow, according to him, everybody does it.
That was a factual "claim" and was in no way an apology for Sri Paul Twitchell or anyone else...why is it that you never use the Sri for either Paul or Harold...not so much of a current ECKist these days??
> What a lame response.
>~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
And opinions are like rear ends aren't they? Everyone has one, and no one cares much about them, they tend to stink...your response is equally as lame...try again...
> Writing as if "everybody" does it and using words like "nobody" cares and "all" believe a certain way is like stretching the truth to such a great extent in an attempt to desperately get one's view accepted as meaningful. IMHO it is a sign of desperation.
More meaningless crap....and your opinions are supposed to be considered meaningful? Why again?? The 1650 people I am speaking for I have been given every right to speak for...if that is a problem for you, you might consider speaking to a professional who is skilled enough to help you not care so much
> Is Kinpa a control freak? Someone not really interested in discovering what is true vs. what is false, but simply someone who wants to try and control what it is that people think?
I have never tried to control what you think.....and a good thing too, you certainly have no intention of changing any of your opinions....so why do you so often complain about mine as you are doing here?? Trying to ridicule me and force me to change my own views?? It is an unfortunate thing to attempt...no one has ever tried to stop you from speaking your opinions, a thing you have done ad nauseum for over a decade...so why is it problematic that I don't agree with you? Think anything you want to...no one cares that much...and I still see that no one is joining your ranks other than the other emails that you and sean use to attempt to make your numbers look greater, while I still have no problem telling you what I think of your opinions all by myself...
> Well, first we would need to find evidence for the total disrespect for other people's opinions and points of view and whether Kinpa has expressed such mal content publicly and repeatedly. It is not hard to find this since he has made it a regular habit.
Seriously? There are still only 4 people here complaining about me...get over yourselves already, you will never be able to control the thoughts and opinions of others by your constant framing of things...sean has already failed at that outright, and the entire world can see his attempt at misleading everyone as to the definitions of Munchausen's Syndrome, but I notice you have no problem with his doing that, despite the fact that I proved him wrong...
> Numerous methods have already been used by Kinpa to manipulate the flow of information and the sharing of other people's views and opinions. Methods that include the intentional making up of pseudo history and religion in order to influence control both subjects.
More opinions, if not outright lies....too bad, I simply do not agree with your opinions...what of it? Can't stand that fact? Why not? No thicker skin? Why not? The rest of the world has no problem developing a thicker skin, why are you so unable to do so???
> The real danger about man-made history and religion is that it tries to plant false information into the minds of others by exploiting human imagination and intelligence. And when people refuse to be controlled by the false information then the manipulators get angry and increase their efforts to such an extent it results in the kind of false information Kinpa and J.R. repeatedly use to beat their horses.
Yet you get to continue demanding that everyone see your proof of plagiarisms and agree with YOU about what they mean? You silly boy! The world has never worked that way! You are here trying to control my opinion...too afraid to agree to disagree?? My horse is by no means dead....but I have to treat it as if it is because you demand that I do? This is ridiculous...cry me a river....or grow the hell up and give the respect that you demand of others, otherwise, too bad...no one has ever forced you to respond to anything here, you have always been free to walk away and say nothing, and yet you choose not to, and then try to blame me for that? LOL
Whatever floats your boat pal, but I'm quite happy to not be on it....
Henosis Sage
Jul 19, 2016, 7:45:44 PM7/19/16
to
RE: "all religions take from others and then develop the teachings further."
I think it's clear that is what has happened many times before. In the 20th
century going back millennia. as per syncretism https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Syncretism
eg Christianity surely did evolve from Judaism ala Jesus and St Paul; and then
many other Christian faiths spun off from that.
For Paul to combine various prior teachings and ideas together into a new whole
of his own - there's nothing wrong in that. many others have done the same
thing. eg Theosophy drew upon many sources incl Vedanta Hinduism and new
thought as well.
What the majority do do such as these examples is that they acknowledge and
honour those prior teachings and point out exactly where they vary from prior
practices and beliefs.
Twitchell's practice of using verbatim copying of prior texts into his texts and
doctrines, some relatively new like Goldsmith and Kirpal Singhs teachings, and
then covering up those sources as if they never existed and putting those
"words" into the mouths of his new, never before seen Eck masters is where
Twitchell significantly diverges from the norm.
It is this that has created havoc and unsettled many Eckists over the decades.
Worse still most have stated that it is Klemp's cover ups and being less that
open and totally truthful about what Twitchell did ... iow intervening in other
people's freedom and their right to know this, that have been the hardest to
accept as OK.
No one likes being used, manipulated or spun a yarn in order to influence them,
and even less can accept others then spending decades to continue to downplay
it, minimize it and continue to cover that up.
The Truth would sort out most of the problems overnight. Eckankar members have
a basic right to the historical truth about plagiarism, what it means, and the
rest of the story.
Twitchell's compiling by talking verbatim plagiarisms form others in the
mid-20th century is completely different from other prior examples of
"religions take from others and then develop the teachings further"
this without having to be told it is.
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