OT - Wyndham Vacation TImeshare - Waste of Time??

[hrho...@att.net]

I have been contacted by the Wyndham vacation timeshare folks to hear a 2-hour talk and be rewarded as worded below.

"You will receive a "Fly Away Getaway" vacation certificate which is valid for 4 coach-class round-trip airline tickets to your choice of more than 30 destinations in the U.S., Hawaii, Mexico, the Caribbean and Europe, good for 2 years from Issue Date (2 airline tickets per vacation, 2 vacations allowed) and, when you are ready to make your reservation (advance notice is required), you must purchase your hotel stay through the airline-ticketing agency, First Priority Travel, for a minimum number of nights, choosing from the hotels offered. Or, if you don't want to fly, you can use the certificate for a discount of up to $100 per night at select hotels. Your "Fly Away Getaway" certificate includes a 47-page booklet with pictures and descriptions of the destination and hotel choices. Taxes (hotel tax plus airline/airport tax of $28-$98 per domestic airline ticket) and fuel surcharges, if applicable, are not included. Baggage fees, if applicable, and premium seat assignment fees, if applicable, are not included. Incidental expenses are not included.

And

You will receive $200 in dining dollars redeemable at www.diningdough.com. You will have a choice of popular restaurants in your area or various cities thought out the US. Log on, search to find your favorite restaurant, print certificate and use, it's that simple. Please seewww.diningdough.com for details."

I think I can resist any pressure to sign anything during the 2-hour presentation, but I am wondering if the tickets they propose to make available are worth while or not. It is hard to tell if their choices of destinations are places I might want to go, and I probably would not stay at their choices of hotels since I would be going places where I know local residents.

Anyone have any experience with this sort of gimmick???

[Thane]

On Sat, 26 Mar 2016 21:01:31 -0700, hrhofmann wrote:

How do you know it was from Wyndham and not just some main sleaze spammer?

Note - one of my customers gets junk from Fidelity, Costco, and a dozen
other well known companies, none of which comes from the mentioned
customers. It may be a scam to a) confirm your email address, b) sell you
something other than from the company mentioned, b) have you click on a
link taking you to a malware site or d) something else, including loading
your details into a honeypot site so they can sell your address.

Unless you can really analyze the sites and links they give you, your
best course is to delete the emails and especially, *do not* click the
unsubscribe link.



Thane

[Ed Pawlowski]

On 3/27/2016 12:01 AM, hrho...@att.net wrote:
> I have been contacted by the Wyndham vacation timeshare folks to hear a 2-hour talk and be rewarded as worded below.
>

> Anyone have any experience with this sort of gimmick???

No contact with them but I'm a strong believer in the "no free lunch"
Too many restrictions already listed as to who you book with.

[Don Y]

On 3/26/2016 9:01 PM, hrho...@att.net wrote:
> I have been contacted by the Wyndham vacation timeshare folks to hear a
> 2-hour talk and be rewarded as worded below.

Do you *really* think you're going to game THEIR system?

[gfre...@aol.com]

If you can resist the sales pitch, these things are usually what they
say they are. They will be steering you into time shares they own as
the "hotel". I used to get them a lot but I guess I have abused them
so many times I am blacklisted now.
You can usually get kicked out of the sales pitch early by asking
embarrassing questions like how much does this cost total (purchase
price, service fees, club dues etc) and dividing it by the number of
days you stay there. I take a little calculator but my brother in law
showed me how to really do it by running the numbers in his head.
Just be aware they do everything they can to obfuscate the cost while
telling you all of the benefits. You can break their patter if you can
spontaneously come up with the cost questions and calculate the real
price.
I think my record was 8 minutes and out the door with my free room,
Disney tickets and meal chits in hand. That was also when I stopped
getting the solicitations (Marriott world center in Orlando).
We did get a nice Disney trip out of it tho.

[cheezwhiz]

On 03/26/2016 10:01 PM, hrho...@att.net wrote:
> Anyone have any experience with this sort of gimmick???

*There's a sucker born every minute.*

[trader_4]

It says the airline tickets are free, but you must purchase your hotel
stay through the "airline ticketing agency", which is likely Wyndham's
own. How do you know what the
cost of the hotels, what the choices are, etc? If they charge you $100
more a night for a hotel than similar properties, then someone is getting
some $$$ back from you.

What makes this one better than similar I've seen is that it's for
4 tickets with Hawaii and Europe included. Assuming you really can
get tickets there, it certainly makes it a lot more attractive, at
least to me. I'd ask to see the 30 destinations and hotels.
They can likely change them at any time though.

Almost all of these, I'd walk on. This one might be worth it.

[Colonel Edmund J. Burke]

Any sort of offer, no matter what, that asks you for money is a fucking
gimmick.
Only stoopid dumbshits bite.

BTW, did I mention . . . the IRS called and they are suing me.
LOL

[dadiOH]

Not really a gimmick, they are selling stuff at huge markups; therefore,
even with very generous commissions, they can afford to be generous in the
"free gift department" as long as enough people buy. The trick is not to
buy.

I went to one once in Kissimmee. I was going to be there anyway so I didn't
mind investing a bit of time for the four Outback dinners (your peddlers are
much more generous). They were selling local condos - worth about $150K -
for $30,000/per week. Eventually, after many, "No thanks", on the my part
the price trickled down to $6,000/week, still a healthy markup. However,
some, no idea of what percentage, actually bought at the 30K price. Which
is why they can be generous with the freebies.

Just remember: no one selling anything is your friend. That includes stock
brokers, investment counselors, etc. as well as time share and cars.

[gfre...@aol.com]

On Sun, 27 Mar 2016 11:32:01 -0400, "dadiOH" <dad...@invalid.com>
wrote:

>They were selling local condos - worth about $150K -
>for $30,000/per week. Eventually, after many, "No thanks", on the my part
>the price trickled down to $6,000/week,

The thing about these deals is you also have several hundred a year in
service fees, dues or whatever they call it. That is why you need to
ask as many questions, as early in the pitch as you can. It will not
take long to figure out the amortized cost of the condo for the week
you are buying, the cost of the loan, plus the service fee is more
than you would pay for a nice suite in a hotel, maybe even from the
same company. In these days of AirBNB and the sites that hawk cheap
hotel rooms, I am surprised that business even exists.
The sooner you start pointing that out to them, loud enough to
distract the other salesmen and customers, the faster they will hustle
you out. I am not sure about other states but in Florida, they have to
honor their promise of the gifts, no matter how long you stay as long
as they say you are done.
I suppose they could put you in detention hall for the whole 2 hours
but they really don't want to waste the salesman's time and they don't
want you pissing in the pond screwing up the other pitches. We are
always quietly shown the door, with gifts in hand.

[Don Y]

On 3/27/2016 8:32 AM, dadiOH wrote:

> Not really a gimmick, they are selling stuff at huge markups; therefore,
> even with very generous commissions, they can afford to be generous in the
> "free gift department" as long as enough people buy. The trick is not to
> buy.

A neighbor here goes out for free meals every week -- on someone else's
dime (the more upscale restaurants). He, of course, knows there's a
pitch involved (let us manage your retirement portfolio) but has gone
through the drill so many times that it no longer phases him. He just
thinks of it as "slow food service".

We, OTOH, won't go more than 10 minutes out of our way for "$10 off a $10
purchase". A client offered to fly us back east in exchange for 4 hours
of my time (of course, it would take more than 8 hours of travel time,
round trip, in addition to that 4 hour meeting): no thanks.

Another tried to bring us to Vegas for a 3 day weekend for a similar
exchange. Travel time would have been only half of the east coast
trip! Again, "Sorry, not interested." Let them buy my time and my
standard rates and *I* will "spend" the proceeds as I see fit.

> I went to one once in Kissimmee. I was going to be there anyway so I didn't
> mind investing a bit of time for the four Outback dinners (your peddlers are
> much more generous). They were selling local condos - worth about $150K -
> for $30,000/per week. Eventually, after many, "No thanks", on the my part
> the price trickled down to $6,000/week, still a healthy markup. However,
> some, no idea of what percentage, actually bought at the 30K price. Which
> is why they can be generous with the freebies.
>
> Just remember: no one selling anything is your friend. That includes stock
> brokers, investment counselors, etc. as well as time share and cars.

Whenever you get something for free, *you* are the product being sold!

[thekma...@gmail.com]

And remember: When you buy a time
share, you are not buying bricks &
mortar - you are buying a slice of TIME
during which you are entitled to make
use of specific units in certain hotels,
cabins on ships, etc.

Try selling a piece of time when you're
ready to get out of the deal.

[Mark Lloyd]

I got one of those IRS calls (the only junk call I've gotten in years
that left a message). They never said WHO they were suing.

--
Mark Lloyd
http://notstupid.us/

"Selling eternal life is an unbeatable business, with no customers ever
asking for their money back after the goods are not delivered." Victor
J. Stenger

[Oren]

On Sat, 26 Mar 2016 21:01:31 -0700 (PDT), hrho...@att.net wrote:

>I have been contacted by the Wyndham vacation timeshare folks to hear a 2-hour talk and be rewarded as worded below.

My advice is to run away as fast as you can. These are well trained
high pressure salesmen. They will wine and dine you until you sign a
contract. Further, contact a local real estate agent an ask them. If
they are honest, they will tell you the same.

Don't fall for it and regret it later. They are predators. Timeshares
are just plain silly unless you have more money than sense. Buy land,
"they don't make it anymore" :)

[Oren]

On Sun, 27 Mar 2016 11:18:39 -0700 (PDT), thekma...@gmail.com
wrote:

... and in some rare emergency that you can't vacation when arranged,
tuff luck, try next year.

[trader_4]

I actually got suckered into sitting through a brief one in Puerto Vallarta
a long time ago. It was the one and only time I used a travel agency.
They booked me into this beachfront hotel where one of the things included
was a free lunch. No mention that the free lunch was one where they
had a guy sitting with you giving you the sales pitch to buy a timeshare
there. Only good thing was at least it wasn't an agreed to 2 hours,
so we ate fast. That was the last time I used a travel agency.

And I agree that unless what you get as an incentive to sit through
the pitch is really awesome, it's to be avoided. If he really can get
4 tickets to Hawaii or Europe though, plus $200 worth of grub, that
might be worth it. I'll bet if you read the fine print it says that
they can change the destinations, etc at any time. Or when you try
to use them, you could find that the dates they have available for
HI are awful, don't match your vacation date needs, etc.

Here is a review from some folks that sat through one of the Wyndham
pitchs:


https://www.tripadvisor.com/ShowUserReviews-g612500-d287843-r190740216-Wyndham_Vacation_Resorts_Wanaka-Wanaka_Otago_Region_South_Island.html


And finally, if anyone really is interested in buying a timeshare, they
are available on the resale market for a greatly reduced price from
people who want to bail out of them. At the right price, I guess they
could be OK. But I'd sure research it a lot first.

[Oren]

On Sun, 27 Mar 2016 14:06:32 -0700 (PDT), trader_4
<tra...@optonline.net> wrote:

>And finally, if anyone really is interested in buying a timeshare, they
>are available on the resale market for a greatly reduced price from
>people who want to bail out of them. At the right price, I guess they
>could be OK. But I'd sure research it a lot first.

The resale pitch is another hook. Promise the moon and add another
buyer to the money stream.

A friend came to Vegas, sat through the whole thing. He said no and
would not sign a contract. They actually insulted him. "Why did you
come here then" and some few choice words to play the guilt game.
Tyrone said, "for the free two night stay."

He pissed off the sales team :)

[trader_4]

Never mind the sales team, this is what you have when you own the
timeshare company:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Versailles_house

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/David_A._Siegel


There was a documentary called "The Queen of Versailles". That was their
rags to riches to rags again story done back around 2008. Siegel was building
his 90,000 sq ft, $100 mil house, but his timeshare company that was the
source of his wealth, went kaput with the financial panic, they were
defaulting on the house, couldn't afford the Bentleys, etc. I guess
he resurrected it somehow and now
he's completing the house. Heh, he's very successful, has a lot of
money, extremely bad taste too. That $100 mil house looks worse than
Trump's NY apartment. Why, I guess he's qualified to be president, no?
All he has to do is say he's a conservative and a Republican.

[Ed Pawlowski]

On 3/27/2016 6:14 PM, trader_4 wrote:

>
> Never mind the sales team, this is what you have when you own the
> timeshare company:
>
> https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Versailles_house
>
> https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/David_A._Siegel
>
>
> There was a documentary called "The Queen of Versailles". That was their
> rags to riches to rags again story done back around 2008. Siegel was building
> his 90,000 sq ft, $100 mil house, but his timeshare company that was the
> source of his wealth, went kaput with the financial panic, they were
> defaulting on the house, couldn't afford the Bentleys, etc. I guess
> he resurrected it somehow and now
> he's completing the house. Heh, he's very successful, has a lot of
> money, extremely bad taste too. That $100 mil house looks worse than
> Trump's NY apartment. Why, I guess he's qualified to be president, no?
> All he has to do is say he's a conservative and a Republican.
>

Cannot imagine living in a place like that. May be fun for a week or
two, but from a practical matter I don't want that much space.

[Don Y]

On 3/27/2016 3:42 PM, Ed Pawlowski wrote:
> Cannot imagine living in a place like that. May be fun for a week or two, but
> from a practical matter I don't want that much space.

Consider it from the privacy aspect: you surely can't maintain the place
yourself! So, you'd have lots of "strangers" pawing through your "stuff",
under your feet, etc.

I'd be happy with two bedrooms and two BASEMENTS: one to work in and
the other to store stuff.

[John G]

Just run away and don't look back.

[Stormin Mormon]

On 3/27/2016 8:22 PM, John G wrote:
>
>>
>> Anyone have any experience with this sort of gimmick???
>
> Just run away and don't look back.
>

Ultimately, it's going to be YOUR money that gets
spent (plus the expense of the scam and the rental
dining hall). You'd get better value to contact
a travel agent and have a regular vacation.

-
.
Christopher A. Young
learn more about Jesus
. www.lds.org
.
.

[thekma...@gmail.com]

Stormin Mormon wrote:
"
Ultimately, it's going to be YOUR money that gets
spent (plus the expense of the scam and the rental
dining hall). You'd get better value to contact
a travel agent and have a regular vacation. "

^^^ Should be canonized ^^^

Yep! That's the model that has worked
since people started vacationing. Work.
Save up. Go on vacation. Some can afford
one week away per year, others two weeks
or more. Some by car, others by ship or
plane.

The time share hustlers tricked my folks
into thinking they'd "save money" by not
spending on hotels, and having a guaranteed
slot the same time every year in a part of
the world they enjoyed visiting. Guess they
never thought about that mortgage they were
paying for that privilege!

Years later I was stuck with that time share
as part of their estate settlement after they had
both passed. After dozens of sharks offered to
buy it from us, all claiming they had other buyers
"anxious to buy your timeshare!!", and wasted
months down the toilet, I finally agreed to my
attorney drafting a quit-claim deed, essentially
giving the thing back to the bastards who conned
my folks earlier on.

[Stormin Mormon]

Thanks for the rare moment of agreement, on this list.
Sad to hear your parents got stuck with such a money
sink. Maybe others will learn from your wisdom.

--

[hrho...@att.net]

I have absolutely no intention, plans, or anything even remotely related to actually signing anything. Tomorrow,I am going to contact the sales force that called me and then emailed me the letter I put in my original post, to learn more about the mandatory hotel words. That alone is enough to completely turn me off.

[gfre...@aol.com]

On Sun, 27 Mar 2016 21:29:35 -0700 (PDT), hrho...@att.net wrote:

>I have absolutely no intention, plans, or anything even remotely related to actually signing anything. Tomorrow,I am going to contact the sales force that called me and then emailed me the letter I put in my original post, to learn more about the mandatory hotel words. That alone is enough to completely turn me off.

If you are sure you will not fall under the spell, these things can be
fun and usually when the salesman figures out you are not buying, they
kick you loose. Just go in knowing the down sides so you can ask the
embarrassing questions early.

[Mark Lloyd]

I'm like that. I would NOT want servants in my house. It's like it's not
mine. I even felt strange when I got the new central A/C 3 years ago,
where the installers were in the house for about 9 hours (at least the
A/C has been doing OK with the hot & humid summers here).

--
Mark Lloyd
http://notstupid.us/

"In spite of all the yearnings of men, no one can produce a single fact
or reason to support the belief in God and in personal immortality."
[Clarence Darrow, The Sign, May 1938]

[sms]

> Anyone have any experience with this sort of gimmick???

The scam here is "First Priority Travel." "...you must purchase your

hotel stay through the airline-ticketing agency, First Priority Travel,
for a minimum number of nights, choosing from the hotels offered."

The hotel stay you must purchase is marked up an enormous amount to
cover the cost of the airline tickets. See
<https://www.yelp.com/biz/first-priority-travel-orlando>.

Q. What's the difference between a Timeshare and gonorrhea?

A. You can get rid of gonorrhea.

[Don Y]

Hi Mark,

On 3/28/2016 8:39 AM, Mark Lloyd wrote:
> On 03/27/2016 05:54 PM, Don Y wrote:

[privacy]

> I'm like that. I would NOT want servants in my house. It's like it's not mine.

Exactly. It's not like you're asking them to pull the weeds in your *lawn*!
They'll be *inside* among all of your belongings, personal spaces, etc.

And, *underfoot*!

[hrho...@att.net]

to SMS,

Thanks, the hotel vs airfare gimmick was exactly how I thought it was, I just wanted someone to agree with my thinking without my mentioning the problem first. So, again,

THANKS!!!!!

[trader_4]

I mentioned that you have to book the hotel through their travel agency
and they could jack up the price in one of the first replies.

[Mo Standards]

On 3/28/2016 11:18 AM, sms wrote:
> The scam here is "First Priority Travel." "...you must purchase your hotel stay through the airline-ticketing agency, First Priority Travel, for a minimum number of nights, choosing from the hotels offered."
>
> The hotel stay you must purchase is marked up an enormous amount to cover the cost of the airline tickets. See <https://www.yelp.com/biz/first-priority-travel-orlando>.
>
> Q. What's the difference between a Timeshare and gonorrhea?
>
> A. You can get rid of gonorrhea.

Orlando is the Telemarketing and Time Share Vacation Scam capitol of the US.

[Oren]

On Mon, 28 Mar 2016 18:33:24 -0400, Mo Standards <m...@standard.com>
wrote:

>> Q. What's the difference between a Timeshare and gonorrhea?
>>
>> A. You can get rid of gonorrhea.
>
>Orlando is the Telemarketing and Time Share Vacation Scam capitol of the US.

As is many locations with mild sunny climates.

[Ed Pawlowski]

My wife watched Downton Abby. They had all sorts of staff. The family
would be having a meal at the table and a butler and footman would be
standing behind, ready to pour the wine or whatever, hearing every
conversation. They were also in the bedroom helping them dress. Seems a
bit creepy, but the wealthy lived like that.

[gfre...@aol.com]

I don't want "body servants" like that but I wouldn't mind having
"people". It would be handy to have someone to run errands, maintain
the pool, maintain the cars/boats and generally help out. If I hit the
lottery I would buy the house down the street and put my person/people
up there. Not right in your business but close enough to help on very
short notice. My wife wants a driver.

[Unquestionably Confused]

Learn from others mistakes and timeshares can be a winner.

1) NEVER, EVER (under penalty of death) buy on the primary market (the
developer or through the sales agent thereof). If you do, you bear ALL
of the marketing expense for the development and then some.

1(a) Go to the presentation if you're iron-willed, scarf up the
incentives offered but just put your hands over your ears, shake your
head, and say "no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no,
no, no, no. . . I can't hear you when they commence the sales pitch.

2) Do your own due diligence and only buy on the secondary market.

3) Always look for weeks that are "full float, 1-52" Simply, this means
that even though you are deeded Week 36 in Shangri-La, you can book,
subject to availability ANY week of the year.

4) Look for a timeshare in an area that has maximum "Red" weeks (the
best) for maximum trading value.

5) Go with an established timeshare organization Sheraton/Starwood,
Marriott, Wyndham, etc. They seem to know what they are doing.

Reference the secondary market. . . Ebay is a great place to buy.
Folks who were suckered in unload here. I just helped a friend get a
place where we own several timeshares buy a 2 bedroom lock-off, all Red
weeks, with full float. His cost was $230 total. The schmuck that
originally bought that timeshare likely paid >$19K - $25K. Yearly
maintenance on the timeshare is $1100. That equates to a large two BR
with two kitchens, 2 baths, 2 living rooms, 2 patios/balconies for ONE
week or he can split them up (two different times of year or half the
unit one week and the other half the following week) in Scottsdale, AZ.
You will not find similar accommodations in the area for less than
$185/night.

Join a timeshare exchange like RCI or II and bank your weeks which
extends the window you can benefit from the ownership. If you play your
cards right it's relatively easy to trade the small one bedroom half of
this timeshare into a two or three bedroom unit elsewhere and still have
trading power left to do another trade. The cost? ~$200 exchange fee
for each stay but I've either upgraded to a 2 or 3 BR unit and possibly
gained a second week's stay in a new area.

I don't sell these things and, frankly, I'm so frugal I squeeze a nickel
until the buffalo's head is coming out of his a**hole. Taking a flyer
on a timeshare on the secondary market was one of the smartest things
I've ever done.

Just don't be stupid. Again, YOU profit from OTHERS mistakes!

[Oren]

On Mon, 28 Mar 2016 19:41:11 -0400, gfre...@aol.com wrote:

>>My wife watched Downton Abby. They had all sorts of staff. The family
>>would be having a meal at the table and a butler and footman would be
>>standing behind, ready to pour the wine or whatever, hearing every
>>conversation. They were also in the bedroom helping them dress. Seems a
>>bit creepy, but the wealthy lived like that.
>
>I don't want "body servants" like that but I wouldn't mind having
>"people". It would be handy to have someone to run errands, maintain
>the pool, maintain the cars/boats and generally help out. If I hit the
>lottery I would buy the house down the street and put my person/people
>up there. Not right in your business but close enough to help on very
>short notice. My wife wants a driver.

I'm at the age I could enjoy watching an attractive nekkid female
model to do house cleaning.

[Pavel314]

On Sunday, March 27, 2016 at 12:01:37 AM UTC-4, hrho...@att.net wrote:
> I have been contacted by the Wyndham vacation timeshare folks to hear a 2-hour talk and be rewarded as worded below.
>

> "You will receive a "Fly Away Getaway" vacation certificate which is valid for 4 coach-class round-trip airline tickets to your choice of more than 30 destinations in the U.S., Hawaii, Mexico, the Caribbean and Europe, good for 2 years from Issue Date (2 airline tickets per vacation, 2 vacations allowed) and, when you are ready to make your reservation (advance notice is required), you must purchase your hotel stay through the airline-ticketing agency, First Priority Travel, for a minimum number of nights, choosing from the hotels offered. Or, if you don't want to fly, you can use the certificate for a discount of up to $100 per night at select hotels. Your "Fly Away Getaway" certificate includes a 47-page booklet with pictures and descriptions of the destination and hotel choices. Taxes (hotel tax plus airline/airport tax of $28-$98 per domestic airline ticket) and fuel surcharges, if applicable, are not included. Baggage fees, if applicable, and premium seat assignment fees, if applicable, are not included. Incidental expenses are not included.

>
> And
>
> You will receive $200 in dining dollars redeemable at www.diningdough.com. You will have a choice of popular restaurants in your area or various cities thought out the US. Log on, search to find your favorite restaurant, print certificate and use, it's that simple. Please seewww.diningdough.com for details."
>
> I think I can resist any pressure to sign anything during the 2-hour presentation, but I am wondering if the tickets they propose to make available are worth while or not. It is hard to tell if their choices of destinations are places I might want to go, and I probably would not stay at their choices of hotels since I would be going places where I know local residents.
>
> Anyone have any experience with this sort of gimmick???

I went to one of these many years ago. I got the free hotel room, ski lift tickets, and a free dinner and breakfast, but it was all in exchange for a very long and boring high-pressure sales pitch. I could tell early on that it wasn't worth what they were charging and they finally let me go. I only regret that I was too polite for too long.

Paul

[Oren]

Good for you. I pass, not interested in jumping through hoops.

[Unquestionably Confused]

On 3/28/2016 7:14 PM, Oren wrote:
> On Mon, 28 Mar 2016 18:54:48 -0500, Unquestionably Confused
> <puzz...@ameritech.net> wrote:

[snip]

>> I don't sell these things and, frankly, I'm so frugal I squeeze a nickel
>> until the buffalo's head is coming out of his a**hole. Taking a flyer
>> on a timeshare on the secondary market was one of the smartest things
>> I've ever done.
>>
>> Just don't be stupid. Again, YOU profit from OTHERS mistakes!
>
> Good for you. I pass, not interested in jumping through hoops.

Agreed. They are not for everyone. Neither is sword swallowing, bronc
riding or bull fighting. All I'm saying is that if you're going to do
it, do it right and know WTF you are doing.

[Stormin Mormon]

First, that's funny. Second, the God of the
Old Testament got rid of Sodom and
Gonorrhea. (ha, ha)

[Don Y]

On 3/28/2016 4:24 PM, Ed Pawlowski wrote:
> My wife watched Downton Abby. They had all sorts of staff. The family would
> be having a meal at the table and a butler and footman would be standing
> behind, ready to pour the wine or whatever, hearing every conversation. They
> were also in the bedroom helping them dress. Seems a bit creepy, but the
> wealthy lived like that.

Yup. Many of the homes in neighborhoods where I grew up had
servants' rooms, upstairs. But, I never knew anyone who had
LIVE-IN help.

Lots of friends with gardener, pool guy, landscaper (different from gardener!),
maid, etc.

It must be tough to be poor! :<

[Oren]

Speaking for myself, I'd rather buy a house at a good price or a plat
of land on really own the dirt. Not pay a price for some week or two
in some sunny location, when I can just go vacation there without
limitations, penalties or extra cost.

As I mentioned earlier, buy land because "they don't make it anymore".
If the house burns down I still own the dirt.

[Ed Pawlowski]

On 3/28/2016 7:57 PM, Oren wrote:

>
> I'm at the age I could enjoy watching an attractive nekkid female
> model to do house cleaning.
>

I've been trying for that since I was 18.

[gfre...@aol.com]

When I married my wife, I was 38, she was 28 and her daughter was 8. I
said we needed an 18 year old maid to make it all right. She said no.

It was worth a shot.

[Stormin Mormon]

Most likely, several services can be found
in your yellow pages.

[Oren]

It's hell getting old now, They call us dirty old men. Depriving us
of our pleasures.

[Oren]

On Mon, 28 Mar 2016 21:36:25 -0400, gfre...@aol.com wrote:

>>> I'm at the age I could enjoy watching an attractive nekkid female
>>> model to do house cleaning.
>>>
>>
>>I've been trying for that since I was 18.
>
>When I married my wife, I was 38, she was 28 and her daughter was 8. I
>said we needed an 18 year old maid to make it all right. She said no.
>
>It was worth a shot.

Some wives just lack a sense of humor.

[joeb...@gmail.com]

On Sunday, March 27, 2016 at 12:01:37 AM UTC-4, hrho...@att.net wrote:
> I have been contacted by the Wyndham vacation timeshare folks to hear a 2-hour talk and be rewarded as worded below.
>
> "You will receive a "Fly Away Getaway" vacation certificate which is valid for 4 coach-class round-trip airline tickets to your choice of more than 30 destinations in the U.S., Hawaii, Mexico, the Caribbean and Europe, good for 2 years from Issue Date (2 airline tickets per vacation, 2 vacations allowed) and, when you are ready to make your reservation (advance notice is required), you must purchase your hotel stay through the airline-ticketing agency, First Priority Travel, for a minimum number of nights, choosing from the hotels offered. Or, if you don't want to fly, you can use the certificate for a discount of up to $100 per night at select hotels. Your "Fly Away Getaway" certificate includes a 47-page booklet with pictures and descriptions of the destination and hotel choices. Taxes (hotel tax plus airline/airport tax of $28-$98 per domestic airline ticket) and fuel surcharges, if applicable, are not included. Baggage fees, if applicable, and premium seat assignment fees, if applicable, are not included. Incidental expenses are not included.
>
> And
>
> You will receive $200 in dining dollars redeemable at www.diningdough.com. You will have a choice of popular restaurants in your area or various cities thought out the US. Log on, search to find your favorite restaurant, print certificate and use, it's that simple. Please seewww.diningdough.com for details."
>
> I think I can resist any pressure to sign anything during the 2-hour presentation, but I am wondering if the tickets they propose to make available are worth while or not. It is hard to tell if their choices of destinations are places I might want to go, and I probably would not stay at their choices of hotels since I would be going places where I know local residents.
>
> Anyone have any experience with this sort of gimmick???

Did you end up going and getting the tickets?

[gfre...@aol.com]

The trick with time share pitches is to bring a calculator and a
writing pad. Start punching in the numbers and calculating the over
all costs, amortized over any reasonable time, understanding there is
no intrinsic value in the property or the contract. In fact you
usually have to pay them to get out if it. Be sure to add in all of
the maintenance fees and usage fees. Then divide that total by the
number of days in the contract per year.
Compare that to $250-300 a night for a suite at the Marriott or some
other fairly nice hotel resort.
You also want to talk loud enough to be heard by the other prospective
buyers. They will want to get you out of there as fast as possible.
Don't go until you get all of your vouchers. If they screw with you
about it just say "OK can you answer a few more questions for me".
My record was about 3 minutes because I open up by asking the above
questions while they were still asking me what I thought a vacation
should cost. The guy just said "I see you are not interested" and
sent me on my way with my vouchers. (2 nights at an Orlando resort and
Disney tickets)
I did get my name on a list and time share people never call me any
more.

[Tekkie®]

gfre...@aol.com posted for all of us...

>
> The trick with time share pitches is to bring a calculator and a
> writing pad. Start punching in the numbers and calculating the over
> all costs, amortized over any reasonable time, understanding there is
> no intrinsic value in the property or the contract. In fact you
> usually have to pay them to get out if it. Be sure to add in all of
> the maintenance fees and usage fees. Then divide that total by the
> number of days in the contract per year.
> Compare that to $250-300 a night for a suite at the Marriott or some
> other fairly nice hotel resort.
> You also want to talk loud enough to be heard by the other prospective
> buyers. They will want to get you out of there as fast as possible.
> Don't go until you get all of your vouchers. If they screw with you
> about it just say "OK can you answer a few more questions for me".
> My record was about 3 minutes because I open up by asking the above
> questions while they were still asking me what I thought a vacation
> should cost. The guy just said "I see you are not interested" and
> sent me on my way with my vouchers. (2 nights at an Orlando resort and
> Disney tickets)
> I did get my name on a list and time share people never call me any
> more.
>
>

I have noticed a flurry of ads on services that will get you out of your
timeshare.

--
Tekkie

[gfre...@aol.com]

On Tue, 18 Jun 2019 17:00:26 -0400, Tekkie® <Tek...@comcast.net>
wrote:

It isn't cheap tho and I bet these things get recycled into another
boiler room looking for new suckers. These people may just be brokers
who charge the owners to get out, hold off the time share operator
with a promise of a new sucker and get a commission on the new sale.
The chance of the owner himself actually selling one of these things
is nil.

[Ed Pawlowski]

Some of those are worse scammers than the timeshares from what I've read.

[Marius Josipovic]

True! The scammers know that if someone was duped into buying a timeshare, they can be easily duped again.

[trader_4]

Only problem with that is that the maintenance fee is almost always
whatever they want to make it, at any time. If it's a new place they
are selling, they set if low, then later it starts to ramp up and
nothing you can do.

But I think the real question there was not about whether they are a good
idea or not, it was whether it's worth taking the free trip offer to see
the place and sit through a high pressure sales pitch. I got suckered
into one once, decades ago. It was the first and last time I used a
travel agency. They steered me to Puerta Villarta, Mexico. Included was
a free lunch, but the trip I paid for and there was no mention of any
timeshare pitch. At check-in, they also didn't say anything about a
timeshare pitch. Turns out the lunch was a timeshare pitch. It wasn't
the worst thing ever, but no way I'd go to lunch if I knew it was a sales
pitch. A trip somewhere has to be worse, I'd suspect that they find
ways to continue to hound you, that it won't just be a one or two hour
thing.

There was an interesting story on shysters on TV last week. It's the
the shysters that advertise they will get you out of a timeshare.
I hear one on the radio, advertising on right wing radio. IDK if that
one is honest or not, but the story was about a bunch of them, mostly
based in Missouri, that scam people. They had a couple that had a timeshare
at the NJ shore, wanted to get out of it, paid one of those companies
$16,000 and they did NOTHING. When I hear those ads, first thing I think
is what is that company going to do that I can't do myself? If that
couple had negotiated with their timeshare company, I'd bet they could
have gotten out of it for $16K by paying them, instead of the shysters.

[gfre...@aol.com]

I haven't been dumb enough to buy a time share but I thought the
people who offer to get you out were reselling them. I wouldn't give
anyone a dime until it was clear they were actually buying my unit or
somehow brokering the sale.

BTW in Florida you can refuse to go to the sales pitch if you want and
they still have to give you the "gift". Remind them of that if you
are here. In the early 70s we passed laws about that regarding all
sorts of baited sales tactics, not just time shares. In the 60s it was
lots in communities that did not really start growing until the 2000s
house bubble. We stayed in a hotel on St Pete Beach in 1971 and they
were chasing us the whole time trying to get us to ride all the way to
Lehigh (Ft Myers) to look at a building lot. We just skipped the free
lunch and didn't spend a lot of time in the room during the day. Once
they finally caught up to us, when we were checking out, I reminded
them of the new law, they paid our bill and stomped off grumbling.
I am not sure how much lots were going for in Lehigh then but
throughout the 80s and 90s, they were going over for the 3 year tax
bill all the time. (typically a few hundred bucks) if anyone bid at
all.