KOS TO OWN NECRO GUILD?!?
Brian
Having been operating in Neriak and Freeport for about 20 levels, I
decided to make my way back to Odus to check up on my fellow Heretics in
the Toxxulia Forest. Being an Erudite necromancer, this took some doing.
I had to evade numerous guards and other hostile enemies along the way.
Through equal parts caution and luck, however, I finally managed to
reach my place of origin: Erudin. The Erudite guards glowered at me just
as dubiously as they ever did and Toxxulia still looked like a forest
that lay beneath a sea of Mountain Dew. Everything was as I remembered.
I was home. Feeling like the "local boy done good" I gave away five or
six Giant Snake Fangs to some of the newbies in the area and watched
over a small group of young necromancers as they hunted spiderlings,
fire beetles and --when feeling especially daring-- skeletons. One young
necromancer that I met was without his first level pet spell. Since it
costs not more than a gold and change, I gave him a couple gold pieces
to make the purchase. He thanked me for the money, but explained to me
that he didn't have the slightest idea where the guild was. "Not a
problem," I say "I will show you."
Before I even had a chance to touch the door to the Heretics hut,
before I was even close enough to even begin thinking of touching it,
out came the entire necromancers guild, each one screaming a battle cry.
Suddenly I was bespelled, punched and fried to a cinder by my fellow
Heretics. I was stunned. "What the hell just happened?" I found myself
thinking. Loading, please wait...
Ladies and gentleman, I have only ever lost faction with the
Heretics ONE TIME. In the Lavastorm mountains there is an Erudite
spellcaster that sits atop this hill with a group of fire goblins. Not
knowing that she was a necromancer, I killed her. Afterward I saw the
faction adjustment, but figured that, since it takes a MILLION kills to
fix your faction, that one kill wouldn't make much of a strike against
me. Well, no. One kill, it seems, has taken me from AMIABLE to
THREATENING with my guildmates. This is just completely ridiculous. Now,
thanks to this problem that I have encountered, I am not likely to be
accepted in Paineel once it is opened. It's going to be run by Heretics.
Needless to say, I petitioned to a GM. She told me that
"Necromancers are SUPPOSED to have problems with faction." I responded
that yes, I realized that, but that the difficulty was not supposed to
extend to one's own kind. She recommended that I find some way to work
up my faction with the Heretics. I explained to her that I could do
that, but not without LOWERING my faction in Erudin by such a degree
that I would become KOS there. Besides, I added, this whole situation
was ridiculous. How could my faction change so drastically from one
extreme to another as a result of one single misdeed? Surely this was
some sort of bug! "No," she said, "It is not a bug." "If it is not a
bug then, then it is at the very least a serious design flaw! The end
result either way is that it must be fixed!" <Yes, I know I am asking
too much of this simple GM.> "You have to ask other necromancers how to
fix your faction." she says. This was just insulting. She was ignoring
the nature of my complaint and implying that I was ignorant in one
single sentence. I was becoming angry. "Verant will not have any
involvement with complaints regarding faction." she adds. "What?!? What
if the faction system is unfair, dysfunctional or completely broken?" I
reply. There came no further reply.
So, now I am KOS to the Heretics in Toxxulia and will be very
unlikely to be able to step foot in Paineel. I've written out a bug
report on the issue and spoken to a GM. What's left for me to do? Well,
there's you people. If you feel as I do please make some noise about
this. Thank you for reading all this.
Armodeus Endbringer
Erudite Necromancer
on "The Rathe"
Dapumkins
thing that seems to happen in patches now is additions for all the whiners
out there. Myself, I just want to turn non pk again :)
Brian <mean...@mindspring.com> wrote in message
news:3779BFEB...@mindspring.com...
Malvolin
hundreds of kills to raise faction normally, but you killed a named NPC,
which always carries with it a MAJOR faction hit, positive or negative.
Seeing that the caster was an Erudite would have made me leave it alone. I
don't go around killing Kizdean Gix.:)
Brian wrote in message <3779BFEB...@mindspring.com>...
Jeff K.
Malvolin wrote in message ...
>What you should do, friend, is think before you kill. Yes, it does take
>hundreds of kills to raise faction normally, but you killed a named NPC,
>which always carries with it a MAJOR faction hit, positive or negative.
>Seeing that the caster was an Erudite would have made me leave it alone. I
>don't go around killing Kizdean Gix.:)
But I wonder what sort of thinking could have prevented him from making that
one kill. How was he supposed to know how it would affect his faction until
actually *making* the kill? One single kill should not screw you over with
your own guild or any other group, no matter how important the NPC, unless
it's your guildmaster or some other incredibly obvious Bad Idea. Even using
non-aggressiveness is not always the best indicator. Krag chicks were not
aggressive to my dwarf paladin, but it turns out that killing them made my
guild, and the warrior's guild also, incredibly happy with me. It's even a
quest to kill them in the paladin's guild.
The game should allow some flexibility so players can experiment without the
fear of totally screwing over their characters.
Jeff K.
Nystramo on Cazic-Thule
Malvolin
Erudite? I would think so, if he was within casting range. If I'm an
Erudite, and I see an NPC Erudite, I'm not gonna touch him unless I'm
specifically told to kill him as part of a quest. And in any event, I'm
going to expect a *big* faction hit with someone for it. Had I attacked him,
then the first time I saw him cast a necro spell, I'd have tucked tail and
run.
Just another situation where it's better to ask questions before shooting,
IMO.
Jeff K. wrote in message <7ldccf$dlk$1...@bgtnsc03.worldnet.att.net>...
DG
but a Necromancer.
>> Ladies and gentleman, I have only ever lost faction with the
>>Heretics ONE TIME. In the Lavastorm mountains there is an Erudite
>>spellcaster that sits atop this hill with a group of fire goblins. Not
>>knowing that she was a necromancer, I killed her
Malvolin wrote in message
Brian
Malvolin wrote:
> Ok, point well taken, BUT: Could he see that the NPC in question was an
> Erudite? I would think so, if he was within casting range. If I'm an
> Erudite, and I see an NPC Erudite, I'm not gonna touch him unless I'm
> specifically told to kill him as part of a quest. And in any event, I'm
> going to expect a *big* faction hit with someone for it. Had I attacked him,
> then the first time I saw him cast a necro spell, I'd have tucked tail and
> run.
> Just another situation where it's better to ask questions before shooting,
> IMO.
I had killed many, many Erudite necros in Befallen and they only gave bad
faction with "Befallen Residents." There was no obvious reason that this Erudite
was any different, now was there? No. Now my character is screwed with his guild
as a result of a poor design scheme.
Armodeus
Carlo Mosca
In Erudin there are a couple of quests to kill Heretic Necros (who are
Erudites, obviously), so one time I ran across Shintar Vinlail in Tox, he
conned blue to me so I zapped him. Oops - lost standing with all three magic
guilds and the high council, gained standing with Heretics.
BUT, it doesn't appear to have been a major hit - I'm still paying to same
prices for everything, and everyone cons the same (and I'm still KOS to
Heretics). Also, I managed to give his bones to the head of the Magicians
Guild, which is a quest for Elial Brook's (a Heretic) bones. Wierd.
Him getting such a major faction hit for killing one guy seems really
excessive.
--
Elethiomel, Erudite Wizard, Rodcet Nife
Paedur, Erudite Wizard, Rodcet Nife
Aquillae, Human Cleric, Rodcet Nife
Malvolin <malv...@columbus.rr.com> wrote in message
news:kvre3.9751$BB5....@storm.twcol.com...
> Ok, point well taken, BUT: Could he see that the NPC in question was an
> Erudite? I would think so, if he was within casting range. If I'm an
> Erudite, and I see an NPC Erudite, I'm not gonna touch him unless I'm
> specifically told to kill him as part of a quest. And in any event, I'm
> going to expect a *big* faction hit with someone for it. Had I attacked
him,
> then the first time I saw him cast a necro spell, I'd have tucked tail and
> run.
> Just another situation where it's better to ask questions before shooting,
> IMO.
>
>
Rick Russell
Jeff K. <jk...@worldnet.att.net> wrote:
> one kill. How was he supposed to know how it would affect his faction until
> actually *making* the kill? One single kill should not screw you over with
> your own guild or any other group, no matter how important the NPC, unless
He could have /conned the target and noted that it was friendly to
him. I know for sure my dwarven cleric is never going to _touch_
another dwarf, unless attacked first.
I would sympathize with the affected player if he was attacked first,
since you can't realistically expect people to let themselves be
killed just to save faction.
Rick R.
doov
> Ladies and gentleman, I have only ever lost faction with the
>Heretics ONE TIME. In the Lavastorm mountains there is an Erudite
>spellcaster that sits atop this hill with a group of fire goblins.
I agree that to lose that much faction from one kill is pretty
extreme, but since you are yourself a Erudite spellcaster, it would
probably be prudent to avoid killing Erudite spellcasters.
Malvolin
a design issue it might very well be. I'm just throwing out some ways it
could have been averted, and could be avoided in the future. Killing
*named*same race NPC's is usually bad, and if they end up being of YOUR
faction, then it's very bad. The Erudites in Befallen(to my knowledge) are
not named. If it /cons amiably to me, forget it. For me, that would include
Kizdean Gix, Dorn B'Dynn, and Ambassador D'Vinn.
Brian wrote in message <377A4CB3...@mindspring.com>...
>
>
>Malvolin wrote:
>
>> Ok, point well taken, BUT: Could he see that the NPC in question was an
>> Erudite? I would think so, if he was within casting range. If I'm an
>> Erudite, and I see an NPC Erudite, I'm not gonna touch him unless I'm
>> specifically told to kill him as part of a quest. And in any event, I'm
>> going to expect a *big* faction hit with someone for it. Had I attacked
him,
>> then the first time I saw him cast a necro spell, I'd have tucked tail
and
>> run.
>> Just another situation where it's better to ask questions before
shooting,
>> IMO.
>
A.G. Turner
to not have any single faction adjustment that would make you KOS with your
guild in case you make the mistake of assisting someone (heal, etc.) who is
fighting that NPC.
On the other hand, I think we are all very aware that faction is important
and that there are dire consequences to killing certain NPC's. You may
become KOS to Freeport Militia for killing one of them for instance.
From a roleplaying standpoint it really doesn't make any sense to kill your
own kind unless specifically called upon to do so. Even then for
roleplaying purposes I have refused to kill what quests called for. Dwarves
are supposed to kill Krags because their guild tells them too, right? Why
does their guild tell them to? Because some Krags had the audacity to perch
on some statutes. Is that really a reason to make enemies of an entire
race? Especially when that race is passive toward you at the beginning? I
don't think so, so my dwarf doesn't kill Krags. My Erudite doesn't kill the
Cat People and my Ranger doesn't kill Pixies. Why? I am aware of faction
and I don't really need to kill those things to gain experience or obtain
anything I really need. I prefer to have fewer KOS enemies rather than
more. And the reasons for killing them don't make sense to me.
I see people killing NPC's on a regular basis "cause I want the xp" or "to
see what kind of loot they have". So they take a huge faction hit. So they
become KOS to a group. So that group happens to be their guild. Well, they
found out what they wanted to find out, and got the experience they wanted
to get. They took a chance and it bit them in the hiney. I find it hard to
drum up sympathy in such a situation. Indiscriminate killing leads to some
very unsavory results. For some reason that seems like a good thing to me.
Just my 2 coppers worth.
Jeff K. <jk...@worldnet.att.net> wrote in message
news:7ldccf$dlk$1...@bgtnsc03.worldnet.att.net...
>
> Malvolin wrote in message ...
> >What you should do, friend, is think before you kill. Yes, it does take
> >hundreds of kills to raise faction normally, but you killed a named NPC,
> >which always carries with it a MAJOR faction hit, positive or negative.
> >Seeing that the caster was an Erudite would have made me leave it alone.
I
> >don't go around killing Kizdean Gix.:)
>
>
> But I wonder what sort of thinking could have prevented him from making
that
> one kill. How was he supposed to know how it would affect his faction
until
> actually *making* the kill? One single kill should not screw you over with
> your own guild or any other group, no matter how important the NPC, unless
DG
regime.
doov <do...@hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:377a6406...@news.cis.ohio-state.edu...