BATTLING A CTer NAMED WALTER (A REPRISE)
David Von Pein
Walt's fantasies (as of this moment anyway) include:
1.) "Staged Attempts" to kill JFK AND Gen. Walker. (LOL!) ... Even
though Marina said that Lee told her "I shot at Walker". I guess she's
to be disbelieved here, but is to be believed when it comes to her
remembering taking one (but only one) of the backyard photos.
Kook-Logic at work...which equates nicely with a hunk of gum becoming
affixed to the bottom of your shoe. No matter how hard you try, you'll
never get all of that shit unstuck.
2.) "Magic Window" theory re. Howard Brennan. ... Which has Walt-Kook
placing an assassin (seen by Brennan) in the WEST-end TSBD
window...even though Brennan never, ever even hints at seeing anyone
in
any other window besides the SE SN window. More KL from a kook named
Walter.
3.) "Multiple Shots Do The SBT's Work" ... Obviously, a kook named
Walt
(and gobs of others like him) must believe in this multi-bullet theory
to replace the SBT.
The big question is, of course (which will never, ever be answered via
a logical, believable CT scenario) -- How many bullets did this damage
that was (per the WC and the HSCA) all caused by only bullet CE399?
And where were all of these shots coming from? Who fired them? And
where did all of these bullets conveniently disappear to? And how in
Holy Hell did this occur without a single person at Parkland noticing
a single non-CE399 bullet?
4.) And (a biggie to which there is no logical, common-sense answer
from any CTer, because none exists) -- Why in hell would ANY plotters
want to pre-arrange a One-Patsy assassination attempt by utilizing
multiple shooters firing from front & rear?
Brain-dead plotters? Or do we have brain-dead post-11/22 researchers,
ya think? The latter seems much more likely.
Care to take a stab at numbers 3 and 4 above, Walt-Kook? (The first
two
items of Walt-Idiocy, well most notably the Brennan thing, we've
already hashed out at length, with Walter's idiocy still holding firm
regarding those items, as he refuses to budge from his Kook position
on
those. So there's no hope for you there. But take a stab at #3 and #4.
I love to hear Kook-Logic. It's always worth a chuckle or two.
Walt
> REVIEWING WALT'S FANTASIES............
>
> Walt's fantasies (as of this moment anyway) include:
>
> 1.) "Staged Attempts" to kill JFK AND Gen. Walker. (LOL!) ... Even
> though Marina said that Lee told her "I shot at Walker".
"I shot at Walker"....as part of a ruse to make it APPEAR that I tried
to kill one of Castro's most bitter and vocal foes.
Lee never confided the ruse to Marins.....He would have been foolish
to have done so. If she had done as he had told her to do in the
event of an emergency I would not have been made the patsy for killing
JFK. Since Marins could not speak english Lee told her that if an
emergency arose where she would have to call the police, or medical
help for herself, or the baby, she should call Ruth Paine, who would
then get the help she needed. She had found the alarming note that
Lee had left for her when he when to fire a bullet through Walker's
window. The note mentioned that he might be killed or taken to jail.
That should have constituted an emergency in which Marina should have
called Ruth Pain, who would then have called the police. The police
would then have had a clue who had "attempted murder" at General
Walker's house and the manhunt would have been on. Marina did nothing
when she found the note.....so the whole plot failed.
Walker was a very high profile and vocal foe of Fidel Castro. He was
part of the ruse that made it look like Oswald had tried to kill him.
The plot involved Oswald being viewed as communist fugitive from
justice for attempted murder who fled to Cuba.
That's why Oswald created the backyard photo ( CE133A) that fairly
screams...."Hey look at me, I'm a revolucionario, who's armed to the
teeth, and a communist whose itching to join the revolucion", and sent
it to the Militant. If Marina had called Ruth Paine, the cops would
have released his name and the photo to the press which Walker and
Geo. De M would trick Castro's agents into allowing Oswald into Cuba,
as a friend of the revolucion seeking political assylum.
A couple of weeks ago I posted a portion of Walker's testimony in
which he revealed that he knew that Oswald had put the bullet hole
through his window on the night of April 10 1963. At the time that
they staged the attempt on Walker, General Walker thought Oswald was
an American secret agent setting up a ruse to infiltrate Castro's
Cuba. A few months later he learned that Oswald had handed out
flyers for the Fair Play for Cuba Committee, had been in a radio
debate in which he voiced support for Castro, and had tipped Bobby
Kennedy off about the location of the illegal training camps for the
Cuban Exiles. Walker was furious when Bobby ordered the ATF to raid
the camps. The ATF seized tons of bomb making material that Walker and
associates had worked hard to procure for the exiles. He vowed to get
Oswald and JFK.
The morning after JFK was murdered Walker was on the phone telling a
German reporter that Oswald was the man who had tried to kill him on
the night of April 10 1963. Walker wanted to be sure that Oswald did
not get off the hook so he wanted the whole world to know that Oswald
was a killer who had tried to kill him.
Walt
Walt
>
> Walt's fantasies (as of this moment anyway) include:
>
> 1.) "Staged Attempts" to kill JFK AND Gen. Walker. (LOL!) ... Even
> though Marina said that Lee told her "I shot at Walker". I guess she's
> to be disbelieved here, but is to be believed when it comes to her
> remembering taking one (but only one) of the backyard photos.
> Kook-Logic at work...which equates nicely with a hunk of gum becoming
> affixed to the bottom of your shoe. No matter how hard you try, you'll
> never get all of that shit unstuck.
>
> 2.) "Magic Window" theory re. Howard Brennan. ... Which has Walt-Kook
> placing an assassin (seen by Brennan) in the WEST-end TSBD
> window...even though Brennan never, ever even hints at seeing anyone
> in
> any other window besides the SE SN window. More KL from a kook named
> Walter.
Hey Von Pea Brain.....It wasn't just Howard Brennan who saw the white
clothing clad gunman behind the WIDE OPEN window at the WEST end of
the sixth floor, Arnold Rowland saw him there also. I know I have to
remind you that Oswald was dressed in DARK colored clothes. Lee was
wearing a reddish brown shirt and dark gray trousers, while the gunman
who Brennan ans Rowland both saw was wearing LIGHT colored clothes. I
know you won't believe me so here's a portion of Arnold Rowland's
testimony.......
Mr. Rowland.
We were discussing, as I stated, the different security precautions, I
mean it was a very important person who was coming and we were aware
of the policemen around everywhere, and especially in positions where
they would be able to watch crowds. We talked momentarily of the
incidents with Mr. Stevenson, and the one before that with Mr.
Johnson, and this being in mind we were more or less security
conscious. We looked and at that time I noticed on the sixth floor of
the building that there was a man back from the window, not hanging
out the window.
He was standing and holding a rifle, This appeared to me to be a
fairly high-powered rifle because of the scope and the relative
proportion of the scope to the rifle, you can tell about what type of
rifle it is. You can tell it isn't a .22, you know, and we thought
momentarily that maybe we should tell someone but then the thought
came to us that it is a security agent.
We had seen in the movies before where they have security men up in
windows and places like that with rifles to watch the crowds, and we
brushed it aside as that, at that time, and thought nothing else about
it until after the event happened.
Mr. Specter.
Now, by referring to the photograph on this Commission Exhibit No.
356, will you point to the window where you observed this man?
Mr. Rowland.
This was very odd. There were this picture was not taken immediately
after that, I don't think, because there were several windows, there
are pairs of windows, and there were several pairs where both windows
were open fully and in each pair there was one or more persons hanging
out the window.
Yet this was on the west corner of the building, the sixth floor, the
first floor--second floor down from the top, the first was the arched,
the larger windows, not the arch, but the larger windows, and this was
the only pair of windows where both windows were completely open and
no one was hanging out the windows, or next to the window.
It was this pair of windows here at that time.
On the WEST CORNER of the building, the sixth floor
Mr. Specter.
And were you able to observe any characteristics of his hair?
Mr. Rowland.
No; except that it was dark, probably black.
Mr. Specter.
Were you able to observe whether he had a full head of hair or any
characteristic as to quantity of hair?
Mr. Rowland.
It didn't appear as if he had a receding hairline but I know he didn't
have it hanging on his shoulders. Probably a close cut from--you know
it appeared to me it was either well-combed or close cut.
Black hair....No receding hair line......
Mr. Specter.
What, if anything, did you observe as to the clothes he was wearing?
Mr. Rowland.
He had on a light shirt, a very light-colored shirt, white or a light
blue or a color such as that. This was open at the collar. I think it
was unbuttoned about halfway, and then he had a regular T-shirt, a
polo shirt under this, at least this is what it appeared to be.
A very light colored shirt, white or light blue..... Open at the
collar ...and he had a regular T-shirt under his outer shirt.
Mr. Specter.
Which half of the window was open, the bottom half or the top half?
Mr. Rowland.
It was the bottom half.
Mr. Specter.
And how much, if any, of his body was obscured by the window frame
from that point down to the floor?
Mr. Rowland.
>From where I was standing I could see from his head to about 6 inches
below his waist, below his belt.
Mr. Specter.
Could you see as far as his knees?
Mr. Rowland.
No.
Mr. Specter.
And what is your best recollection as to how close to the window he
was standing?
STANDING
Mr. Rowland.
He wasn't next to the window, but he wasn't very far back. I would say
3 to 5 feet back from the window.
Mr. Specter.
How much of the rifle was separated from your line of vision by the
window?
Mr. Rowland.
The entire rifle was in my view.
Mr. Specter.
In the open part of the window?
Mr. Rowland.
Yes.
Mr. Specter.
And how much of his body, if any, was in the open view where there was
no window between your eyes and the object of his body?
Mr. Rowland.
Approximately two-thirds of his body just below his waist.
Mr. Specter.
Up to what point?
Mr. Rowland.
Mid point between the waist and the knees, this is again in my
proportion to his height that I make that judgment.
Mr. Specter.
So from the waist, some point between his knees and his waist, you
started to see hi clear in the window?
Mr. Rowland.
Yes.
You'll notice that his DESCRIPTION does NOT match Oswald and it is
nearly identical to Howard Brennan's description.
They both saw the gunman STANDING behind that WEST END window. Brennan
saw the gunman aiming the rifle out of that WEST end window at the
time of the shooting while Rowland did not see him there at the time
of the shooting because he never looked up there.
Walt
Walt
>
> Walt's fantasies (as of this moment anyway) include:
>
> 1.) "Staged Attempts" to kill JFK AND Gen. Walker. (LOL!) ... Even
> though Marina said that Lee told her "I shot at Walker". I guess she's
> to be disbelieved here, but is to be believed when it comes to her
> remembering taking one (but only one) of the backyard photos.
> Kook-Logic at work...which equates nicely with a hunk of gum becoming
> affixed to the bottom of your shoe. No matter how hard you try, you'll
> never get all of that shit unstuck.
>
> 2.) "Magic Window" theory re. Howard Brennan. ... Which has Walt-Kook
> placing an assassin (seen by Brennan) in the WEST-end TSBD
> window...even though Brennan never, ever even hints at seeing anyone
> in
> any other window besides the SE SN window. More KL from a kook named
> Walter.
>
> 3.) "Multiple Shots Do The SBT's Work" ... Obviously, a kook named
> Walt
> (and gobs of others like him) must believe in this multi-bullet theory
> to replace the SBT.
Doesn't SBT....stand for Simply Bullshit Theory...
>
> The big question is, of course (which will never, ever be answered via
> a logical, believable CT scenario) -- How many bullets did this damage
> that was (per the WC and the HSCA) all caused by only bullet CE399?
> And where were all of these shots coming from? Who fired them? And
> where did all of these bullets conveniently disappear to? And how in
> Holy Hell did this occur without a single person at Parkland noticing
> a single non-CE399 bullet?
Gibberish.......How about putting this question in a coherent form?
>
> 4.) And (a biggie to which there is no logical, common-sense answer
> from any CTer, because none exists) -- Why in hell would ANY plotters
> want to pre-arrange a One-Patsy assassination attempt by utilizing
> multiple shooters firing from front & rear?
The plotters originally planned to make the murder appear to be the
work of a "band of international communists" lead by Lee Harvey
Oswald. They intended to link the band to Castro and use that as an
excuse to bomb Castro off the island. LBJ was ready to give General
Curtis La May the green light to bomb Havana, but cooler and brighter
heads prevailed and told him he's be triggering a nuclear holocaust if
he bombed Havana. The plot was changed to make it appear that It was
just a lone nut who decided to kill JFK for no reason at all.
Originally it was planned to set up the stage prop on the sixth floor,
to make it appear that one of the communist band had fired two shots
from the sixth floor. After the murder when there was evidence of at
least six shots they realized they couldn't possibly account for all
of the bullet strikes with just two shots so they were forced to re-
create some of the evidence photos which showed only TWO spent shells
on the floor and replace them with photos that showed three spent
shells. Even then they had to lie and cover up the fact that a
bullet had struck in the grass near the place where Jean Hill was
standing. They made up far-fetched stories to explain away the bullet
strike on the chrome molding near the rear-view mirror, and the nick
on James Teagues face, and the bullet that hit Connally.
Anybody who has seriously studied the murder and still believes the
Warren Report is a gutless coward who is afraid to face facts, or a
naive idiot who would by seashore property in Nevada, or an immoral
jerk who would do anything for money .
Walt
David Von Pein
CONSPIRACY SO BAD I CAN TASTE IT AND WILL SKEW ALL THE EVIDENCE I CAN"
catfish. Excellent!
3 posts of utter Walt-authored fantasy...back-to-back....to back. You
just can't ask for more than that, my friends.
Walt
Hey Von Pea Brain....This may come as a shock to you...... but I
really wish I could accept the Warren Commissions decree, as laid out
in the Warren Report. I wish that there wasn't so damned much
evidence of witness intimidation, evidence fabrication, falsification
of evidence, and evidence that the authorities were framing Lee
Oswald.
I'd love to believe that President Kennedy was murdered by Oswald, who
was just a nut, who had no reason what-so-ever for killing
him.......but I'm not a fool. The evidence simply doesn't indicate
that to be a plausible idea, and only a gutless fool would accept the
load of bullshit the LBJ's Warren Commission dumped on us.
The three posts were back to back to addess your questions one post at
a time.
Walt
David Von Pein
Yes...you are. Trust me on this one.
Anyone who says crap like this (in the 2 links below, which are loaded
with made-up Walt-authored kookshit) is a "fool", without question.
(Or: Is a person just fooling himself; take your pick.)......
http://groups.google.com/group/alt.conspiracy.jfk/msg/f73d8c2f30ce51c7
http://groups.google.com/group/alt.conspiracy.jfk/msg/f13069981fa2f87e
Walt
Hey Von Pea Brain.... This post is really insipid. Are you having a
hard time getting up off the canvas and controlling yer wobbly legs?
Please don't pull a Roberto Duran on me and cry,.... No Mas!...No
Mas! I love knocking the snot outta you with the facts. Perhaps
you'll realize that your handler has not prepared you very well, and
has not given you anything to fight the facts with......Lies just
don't cut it Pea Brain.
You're a fool to attempt to make it appear that I skew the
evidence.... anybody reading my posts can see that they consist mainly
of posting the original testimony of the people who actually witnessed
the murder.
Now c'mon.... get yer hands up and quit being a rope-a-dope.
Walt
David Von Pein
You're exhibiting those "fool" traits again I see.
So, you think there's SOLID EVIDENCE (somewhere in the RECORDS of the
case) that Oswald made a "staged attempt" on Gen. Walker on Apr. 10th?
And that Oswald WANTED the cops to find his rifle after that "staged
attempt"? Right?
Is that why Oswald BURIED the rifle...to help the cops find it more
easily?
And your "version" of Brennan's testimony is ALL in the verified
transcripts, too, right? Including the part about positively seeing a
shooter on the WEST end of the TSBD? Right?
That stuff is actually IN THE WC TESTIMONY for all to see, right? But
nobody EXCEPT WALT has interpreted it correctly. Right?
And Belin, et al, were sweatin' bullets I'll bet when they asked
Brennan open-ended questions like: "Is there anything else you'd like
to add?" and "Will you tell us what happened?"
Walt, I know you're smarter than you actually appear on these Forum
(Nuthouse) pages. (How can you not be?) ;)
Therefore, you cannot possibly actually believe that you HAVEN'T
skewed and manipulated the testimony of Howard Brennan to suit your
OWN "west-end TSBD gunman" theory. Can you?
And the "staged" Walker thing is just too silly to believe as well.
With no hard evidence to back up your claims.
And I think you even went so far a while back to purport that the JFK
assassination was meant to be merely a "staged attempt" too. Isn't
that correct? (But they got UNlucky and actually killed him!)????
Walt -- Stop....Breathe....Think....And re-evaluate the two (or more)
hunks of nonsense that you posted via the links I provided above.
Brennan saw no gunman (or anybody at all) in that West-End
window....and you know he didn't.
Walt
> >>> "You're a fool to attempt to make it appear that I skew the evidence. Anybody reading my posts can see that they consist mainly of posting the original testimony of the people who actually witnessed the murder." <<<
>
> You're exhibiting those "fool" traits again I see.
>
> So, you think there's SOLID EVIDENCE (somewhere in the RECORDS of the
> case) that Oswald made a "staged attempt" on Gen. Walker on Apr. 10th?
> And that Oswald WANTED the cops to find his rifle after that "staged
> attempt"? Right?
>
> Is that why Oswald BURIED the rifle...to help the cops find it more
> easily?
We don't know what Oswald meant by the word "buried"...IF.. he used
the word "buried" the rifle.
You may recall that Marina said she didn't sleep much that night after
Lee told her that he had shot at General Walker, and then buried the
rifle. The reason she didn't sleep was because she thought the police
had dogs that would smell the rifle and find it. She expected the
police to knock on the door at any moment.
Lee wouldn't have had a shovel with which to actually dig a hole and
"bury" the rifle. He most likely "buried" it in weeds and leaves
along the railroad track. I believe that Lee thought he'd be on the
run for "attempted murder" at the time he "buried" the rifle. He
probably thought the cops would have dogs that would find the rifle
and then they would trace it back to him.
which would lend credence to the tale that he was the guy who had
tried to kill Walker.... But by time they found the rifle he would be
in Mexico City seeking assylum in Cuba.
>
> And your "version" of Brennan's testimony is ALL in the verified
> transcripts, too, right? Including the part about positively seeing a
> shooter on the WEST end of the TSBD? Right?
Brennan never actually said:.... "I saw the white clothing clad gunman
in the west end window" but he DESCRIBED the window where he saw the
man and he DESCRIBED the wide open WEST END window. We can be sure
the gunman was there in the WEST wnd window because....... Arnold
Rowland saw him there, and SPECIFICALLY said the White clothing clad
gunman was STANDING 3 to 5 feet back from the WIDE OPEN WEST END
window.
That stuff is actually IN THE WC TESTIMONY for all to see, right? But
nobody EXCEPT WALT has interpreted it correctly. Right?
Could be...... Maybe I am the only one who can see through the smoke
screen laid down by the Warren Commission lawyers. It's readily
apparent that you can't ....but I've always attributed that to the
fact that you have your head in your ass.
It would be nice to know that others have read my posts and understand
that Howard Brennan, Arnold Rowland, Robert Edwards, and Ronald Fisher
all saw the WHITE clothing clad man there on the sixth floor, just
minutes before the shooting, and Howard Brennan actually saw him
STANDING UP and aiming the rifle out of that wide open window at the
west end of the sixth floor. Howard Brennan, Ronald Fischer, and Bob
Edwards all saw him at the EAST end window BEFORE the motorcade
arrived.... And Brennan and Rowland saw him behind the wide open WEST
end window.
This guy definitely was NOT Lee Oswld ..... Oswald was dressed in
dark colored clothesat the time.
This FACT absolutely and utterly destroys the Warren Commissions
THEORY that Oswald was the "lone nut killer.
Walt
David Von Pein
Never happened, and even you know it never happened.
Brennan utilized FOUR different WC exhibits and via his own HAND he
drew a rifle angle on one exhibit and circled the ONLY window he saw a
gunman in on two other exhibits.....
http://history-matters.com/archive/jfk/wc/wcvols/wh17/html/WH_Vol17_0113a.htm
http://history-matters.com/archive/jfk/wc/wcvols/wh17/html/WH_Vol17_0113b.htm
http://history-matters.com/archive/jfk/wc/wcvols/wh17/html/WH_Vol17_0112a.htm
>>> "We can be sure the gunman was there in the WEST-end window because Arnold Rowland saw him there..." <<<
Not at 12:30 DURING the shooting. Even assassins have legs for
mobility, you know. Oswald moved from the west side to his SN window
on the east side after Rowland's west-end observation. Why do you
think the gunman HAD to be glued to the west end?
>>> "Maybe I am the only one who can see through the smokescreen laid down by the Warren Commission lawyers. It's readily apparent that you can't...but I've always attributed that to the fact that you have your head in your ass." <<<
That's funny...I've always attributed it to the fact that I'm not a
conspiracy-loving kook.
>>> "...And Brennan and Rowland saw him {the TSBD gunman} behind the wide-open WEST-end window." <<<
Not during the assassination. But keep thinking that your goofy
"lining up" of these witnesses gets Oswald off the hook for murder.
After all, everybody needs their fantasies. I'm still dreaming about
playing first base for the Reds some day. But my height will probably
prohibit that from happening (I'm 5'9", the same as your hero,
Oswald). But, then again, Vic Davalillo played a little first
base...and he was only 5'7". ~wink~
>>> "Oswald was dressed in dark-colored clothes at the time." <<<
And, once again, how would YOU know that? You don't think anybody ever
even saw LHO at the exact time of the shooting, do you? How the hell
do you know how he was dressed? He could have had on a hula-skirt and
a string of beads for all you know.
>>> "This FACT absolutely and utterly destroys the Warren Commission's THEORY that Oswald was the lone nut killer." <<<
What "FACT"? The "fact" that you believe that somebody saw a killer in
the WEST-end window DURING the shooting itself? But nobody testified
to that. That's your own invention. Always was.
Or the "fact" that the clothing descriptions vary? That doesn't get Oz
off the hook. That type of testimony is always going to vary. Always.
Plus: Oz had on TWO shirts when arrested remember...one dark; one
white (t-shirt). The outer one being easily-removable and also easy to
slip on quickly.
And Oswald's LIES re. the rifle would have convicted the bum -- all by
themselves.
Think up another theory--quick. Before Fetzer does!
<all of Walt's stupid Walker-related crap excised>
Walt
> >>> "He {Brennan} DESCRIBED the wide open WEST END window." <<<
>
> Never happened, and even you know it never happened.
Mr. Brennan.
Well, as it appeared to me he was standing up and resting against the
left window sill, with gun shouldered to his right shoulder, holding
the gun with his left hand and taking positive aim and fired his last
shot. As I calculate a couple of seconds. He drew the gun back from
the window as though he was drawing it back to his side and maybe
paused for another second as though to assure hisself that he hit his
mark, and then he disappeared.
And, at the same moment, I was diving off of that firewall and to the
right for bullet protection of this stone wall that is a little higher
on the Houston side.
Mr. Belin.
Do you remember what kind of clothes he was wearing?
Mr. Brennan.
Light colored clothes, more of a khaki color.
What kind of clothes did he have on?
Mr. Edwards.
Light colored shirt, short sleeve and open neck.
What, if anything, did you observe as to the clothes he was wearing?
Mr. Rowland.
He had on a light shirt, a very light-colored shirt, white or a light
blue or a color such as that. This was open at the collar. I think it
was unbuttoned about halfway, and then he had a regular T-shirt, a
polo shirt under this, at least this is what it appeared to be. He had
on dark slacks or blue jeans, I couldn't tell from that I didn't see
but a small portion.
>
> Brennan utilized FOUR different WC exhibits and via his own HAND he
> drew a rifle angle on one exhibit and circled the ONLY window he saw a
> gunman in on two other exhibits.....
>
> http://history-matters.com/archive/jfk/wc/wcvols/wh17/html/WH_Vol17_0...
>
> http://history-matters.com/archive/jfk/wc/wcvols/wh17/html/WH_Vol17_0...
>
> http://history-matters.com/archive/jfk/wc/wcvols/wh17/html/WH_Vol17_0...
David Von Pein
As I've mentioned previously, the following words spoken by Howard
Brennan totally destroy your "Gunman In A West-End Window" theory. (Do
you think there were some OTHER Negroes hanging out of the 5th-Floor
windows on the WEST end of the building too, who looked exactly like
Norman and Jarman, whom Brennan IDed within minutes of the
shooting?).....
Mr. BRENNAN -- "The only thing I said is that they {the 5th-Floor
Negroes} were one window over below the man that fired the gun."
Walt
> How does any of that stuff above put a gunman in a west-end window?
>
> As I've mentioned previously, the following words spoken by Howard
> Brennan totally destroy your "Gunman In A West-End Window" theory. (Do
> you think there were some OTHER Negroes hanging out of the 5th-Floor
> windows on the WEST end of the building too, who looked exactly like
> Norman and Jarman, whom Brennan IDed within minutes of the
> shooting?).....
Yer hallucinating if you think that Brennan said he saw the three
stooges below the window from which the WHITE CLOTHING clad gunman was
FIRING the gun. He said he had seen the gunman there in the window
above Bonnie Ray Williams and Harold Norman BEFORE the motorcade
arrived. He did NOT say the gunman was firing from that window. In
fact he could NOT have DESCRIBED the WHITE clothing clad gunman as
STANDING and bracing against the side of the window, if he had been
firing from that window because Ronald Fischer and Bob Edwards saw the
WHITE clothing clad man "crowed in among the boxes" behind that EAST
window BEFORE the motorcade arrived. They were only about 10 or 15
feet west of Brennan's position and they saw the white clothing clad
man "crowded in among the boxes" and all they could see of him was his
shoulders and head. Brennan could see all of the man from his hips to
the top of his head. Clearly Brennan was DESCRIBING the same window
that Arnold Rowland had seen the WHITE clothing clad gunman in. And
Arnold Rowland SPECIFICALLY said He saw the WHITE clothing clad gunman
in the wide open window on the WEST end of the sixth floor.
Howard Brennan did see the white clothing clad man in that SE corner
window BEFORE the motorcade arrived and so did Ronald Fischer and Bob
Edwards...... But as you point out the guy wasn't stuck in those boxes
behind the SE corner window,eventhough Fischer and Edwards described
him as... "crowded in among the boxes" ( pretty hard to be seen as
STANDING and firing a rifle if he was "crowded in among the boxes" in
fact it would have been difficult, if not impossible, to for the man
to fire a rifle from the position DECRIBED by Fischer and Edwards.
I'll post what Bob Edwards had to say about the man when he was in the
SE corner window BEFORE the motorcade arrived.
>
> Mr. BRENNAN -- "The only thing I said is that they {the 5th-Floor
> Negroes} were one window over below the man that fired the gun."
I can see how a mentally challenged person might have trouble
understanding that Brenan was describing the MAN ( not the window) He
was describing the man as... "the man that fired the gun"
He was NOT saying .....This is the window from which I saw the man
firing the gun.
Brennan DESCRIBED the window from which he SAW the WHITE clothing clad
gunman by saying he could see all of the gunman as he was aiming the
rifle out of the window. He could NOT have seen that if the gunman had
been in the SE corner window. Brennan was saying that he saw the
WHITE CLOTHING clad gunman in the SE corner window BEFORE the
motorcade arrived. That was the window that he saw him depart from,
and return to, a couple of times BEFORE the motorcade arrived.
Mr. Belin.
Now, I hand you what has been marked as Exhibit 480, which appears to
be a picture of the Texas School Book Depository Building, which was
taken shortly after this time.I believe on the fifth floor you can see
on two of the open windows there some people looking out, and Exhibit
481 is a picture of the east windows on the south side of the fifth
and sixth floors, and Exhibit 482 is an enlargement of 481.First of
all, on Exhibits 481 and 482, do you recognize any of these two
persons in the fifth floor window as people you saw there?
Mr. Brennan.
No; I do not recognize them.As positive identification I cannot
recognize them.Now, I see where there is a possibility I did make a
mistake. I believe these two colored boys was in this window, and I
believe I showed on that other exhibit that they were in this window.
Mr. Belin. All right. I am going to hand you now
Mr. Brennan.
The only thing I said is that they were one window over below the man
that fired the gun.
Mr. Belin. Well, I hand you Commission Exhibit 477, where you marked
a "B" at the point there you first said you saw the Negro men. Is this
the one you say now you might have been mistaken?
Mr. Brennan.
Yes; I believe I was mistaken. I believe the two men that I identified
was in this window.
Mr. Belin.
You are pointing to the window to the east of where you have now
marked "B"?
Mr. Brennan.
That I am not positive of. I just remember that they were over one
window from below him, which at that time I might have thought this
was one window over.
Mr. Belin.
All right. Let me ask you this. On Exhibit 481, does the condition of
the opening of the windows in the fifth floor appear to be that which
you saw on the afternoon of November 22?
Mr. Brennan.
Yes. These do.
Mr. Belin.
You are pointing to the fifth-floor windows now?
David Von Pein
I guess I was wrong....it really IS possible for Walt to be as stupid
as he sounds in the above sentence.
Brennan's CIRCLING the SE/SN/6F window (HIMSELF!) on TWO different WC
exhibits still isn't enough to convince Walt The Rabid Kook that
Brennan saw a person in ONLY that one window the entire time on 11/22.
How do you reason with kooks like this? Any ideas anybody?
And how long has Walt been on this fantasy binge about Brennan and the
non-existent "WEST-END SNIPER" anyway? Has it been many years? Anybody
know?
So, Walt, yes or no....do you believe that 3 different Negroes were
occupying the west-end windows of the 5th Floor...in addition to
N,J,&W at the east end, of course?
If you answer "No" to that question (which you'll have to, of course,
in order to stay anywhere near the testimony of N,J,&W, who ran to
that very west-end side of the building almost immediately after the
shooting and saw no other Negroes there), then your west-end theory is
dead via this Brennan quote (again):
Walt
> >>> "He {Brennan} DESCRIBED the wide open WEST END window." <<<
>
> Never happened, and even you know it never happened.
>
> Brennan utilized FOUR different WC exhibits and via his own HAND he
> drew a rifle angle on one exhibit and circled the ONLY window he saw a
> gunman in on two other exhibits.....
>
>
> http://history-matters.com/archive/jfk/wc/wcvols/wh17/html/WH_Vol17_0...
>
> http://history-matters.com/archive/jfk/wc/wcvols/wh17/html/WH_Vol17_0...
>
>
> Not at 12:30 DURING the shooting. Even assassins have legs for
> mobility, you know. Oswald moved from the west side to his SN window
> on the east side after Rowland's west-end observation. Why do you
> think the gunman HAD to be glued to the west end?
You dumb bastard.... I'm the one who pointed out to you that Brennan
said that the WHITE CLOTHING CLAD gunman left the SE corner window a
couple of times and reurned to it a couple of times BEFORE the
motorcade arrived. Your ignorance
is only surpassed by your treachery in covering up for the killers.
>
> >>> "Maybe I am the only one who can see through the smokescreen laid down by the Warren Commission lawyers. It's readily apparent that you can't...but I've always attributed that to the fact that you have your head in your ass." <<<
>
> That's funny...I've always attributed it to the fact that I'm not a
> conspiracy-loving kook.
>
> >>> "...And Brennan and Rowland saw him {the TSBD gunman} behind the wide-open WEST-end window." <<<
>
> Not during the assassination.
I never said Rowland saw him there DURING the shooting....He would
have, if he had looked up. We can be sure he would have seen the WHITE
CLOTHING clad gunman AIMING a rifle out of the WEST end window if he
had looked up because Howaed Brennan saw the man there at thjat time.
He didn't look up there at that WEST end window because nothing drew
his attention to that location. The sounds of gunfire sounded like
it had come from the GK so that's where he looked.
But keep thinking that your goofy
> "lining up" of these witnesses gets Oswald off the hook for murder.
>
> After all, everybody needs their fantasies. I'm still dreaming about
> playing first base for the Reds some day. But my height will probably
> prohibit that from happening (I'm 5'9", the same as your hero,
> Oswald). But, then again, Vic Davalillo played a little first
> base...and he was only 5'7". ~wink~
You'd better learn to play ball..... because you damned sure have no
future in any field that requires critical evaluation of information.
>
> >>> "Oswald was dressed in dark-colored clothes at the time." <<<
>
> And, once again, how would YOU know that? You don't think anybody ever
> even saw LHO at the exact time of the shooting, do you? How the hell
> do you know how he was dressed? He could have had on a hula-skirt and
> a string of beads for all you know.
I know that because there is loads of evidence that confirms Oswald
was wearing DARK colored clothing at the time of the shooting.... Do a
little research and learn that FACT... or just keep asking stupid
questions and expose your ignorance.
>
> >>> "This FACT absolutely and utterly destroys the Warren Commission's THEORY that Oswald was the lone nut killer." <<<
>
> What "FACT"? The "fact" that you believe that somebody saw a killer in
> the WEST-end window DURING the shooting itself? But nobody testified
> to that. That's your own invention. Always was.
>
> Or the "fact" that the clothing descriptions vary? That doesn't get Oz
> off the hook. That type of testimony is always going to vary. Always.
> Plus: Oz had on TWO shirts when arrested remember...one dark; one
> white (t-shirt). The outer one being easily-removable and also easy to
> slip on quickly.
Oswald was wearing DARK GRAY cotton twill trousers .... Brennan said
the gunman was wearing trousers "that were a shade lighter" than his
dingy WHITE shirt.
Bob Edwards described the WHITE CLOTHING clad man he saw "crowded in
among the boxes" as wearing a light colored short sleeve sport shirt
with a T-shirt beneath the sports shirt.
>
> And Oswald's LIES re. the rifle would have convicted the bum -- all by
> themselves.
>
> Think up another theory--quick. Before Fetzer does!
>
> <all of Walt's stupid Walker-related crap excised>
Walt
Walt
> >>> "I can see how a mentally challenged person might have trouble understanding that Brennan was describing the MAN (not the window). He was describing the man as..."the man that fired the gun". He was NOT saying....This is the window from which I saw the man firing the gun." <<<
>
> I guess I was wrong....it really IS possible for Walt to be as stupid
> as he sounds in the above sentence.
>
> Brennan's CIRCLING the SE/SN/6F window (HIMSELF!) on TWO different WC
> exhibits still isn't enough to convince Walt The Rabid Kook that
> Brennan saw a person in ONLY that one window the entire time on 11/22.
So now you're trying to make the absurd point that Howard ....Quote
DVP..." Brennan saw a person in ONLY that one window the entire time
on 11/22"....unquote
Here's what you wrote earlier in this thread.... Quote DVP...."Even
assassins have legs for mobility, you know. Oswald moved from the west
side to his SN window on the east side after Rowland's west-end
observation"....unquote
"Oswald moved from the WEST side to his SN window "
You may be right the WHITE CLOTHING CLAD gunman may have "moved from
the west side to the SN ( smokers nook) window, and back to the WEST
end window again. Brenan said he saw the guy leave and return to the
SE corner window a couple of times BEFORE the motorcade arrived. It's
entirely logical that the WHITE CLOTHING clad gunman did move back and
forth between the east end window and the west end window, where he
was when Howard Brennan saw him STANDING and aiming a rifle out of
that WIDE OPEN window.
Why do you
think the gunman HAD to be glued to the west end?
Walt
David Von Pein
saw Oswald on the WEST end. Only Rowland saw Oz on the west end. And I
never said Brennan saw ANYONE on the west end....because he obviously
never did. Never. He would have said so if he had, you goofball-slash-
kook!
And Brennan certainly wouldn't have circled ONLY the southeast window
on TWO separate WC exhibits if he had actually seen Oswald SHOOTING
from a different (west) window, you stupid freakin' goofball!*
* = It's getting late, so I'm letting out my frustration on your
mindless, retarded position re. Brennan's testimony. Sorry, but you
deserve it, and you know you do. You should really be embarrassed to
post here with such obvious distortions of the facts. I'm kinda
embarrassed just talking to a retard like you, in fact.
You actually want to believe that Brennan just obediently circled the
SN window on 2 exhibits, but he only saw Oz before the shooting in the
circled window?
But when it comes to the BIG, MAIN-EVENT evidence of Brennan SEEING
THE GUN BEING FIRED, Brennan never says a word about his circled
window on 2 exhibits (plus the "rifle-angle" drawing on yet another
exhibit) being the WRONG window??
Is this your retarded position as she exists as of 3/30/2007 AD, you
mindless retard?!
Walt
> Yes, Walt, that quote of mine is 100% accurate....but BRENNAN never
> saw Oswald on the WEST end.
That's right....Because Brennan never saw a man dressed in a DARK
reddish Brown shirt and DARK gray trousers anywgere on the sixth floor
around 12:30 that day.....He DID see a 30 to 35 yr old, 165 to 175
pound man, who was dressed in a white shirt anf trousers moving about
from window to window at that time....and since Oswald was dressed in
a DARK reddish Brown shirt, and DARK gray trousers,the man he saw WAS
not the 24 year old 140 pound Lee Oswald.
Only Rowland saw Oz on the west end.
Here's a description that Rowland gave of the man he saw with a 30.06
rifle with a scope STANDING in the wide open WEST end Window.
Mr. Specter.
What, if anything, did you observe as to the clothes he was wearing?
Mr. Rowland.
He had on a light shirt, a very light-colored shirt, white or a light
blue or a color such as that. This was open at the collar. I think it
was unbuttoned about halfway, and then he had a regular T-shirt, a
polo shirt under this, at least this is what it appeared to be.
A very light colored shirt, white or light blue..... Open at the
collar ...and he had a regular T-shirt under his outer shirt.
Why would you lie and say the man Rowland saw was Oswald?
You're obviously smart enough to know the difference between Dark
colored clothes and WHITE clothes, so you're not simply
confused....You are a liar. The question is WHY do you lie? Are
you being paid to perpetrate the hoax?
And I
> never said Brennan saw ANYONE on the west end....because he obviously
> never did. Never. He would have said so if he had, you goofball-slash-
> kook!
Here's what you wrote earlier in this thread.... Quote DVP...."Even
assassins have legs for mobility, you know. Oswald moved from the
west
side to his SN window on the east side after Rowland's west-end
observation"....unquote
You acknowledge that there was a WHITE CLOTHING clad man with a rifle
in the WEST end window. ( because that's what Rowland reported.) and
yet you attempt to make the utterly stupid point that the White
clothing clad gunman could only have been Oswald. Yer revealing that
not only are you not the brighest bulb on the tree....you may well be
the dimmest.
>
> And Brennan certainly wouldn't have circled ONLY the southeast window
> on TWO separate WC exhibits if he had actually seen Oswald SHOOTING
> from a different (west) window, you stupid freakin' goofball!*
He circled that window to designate the place where he'd seen the
white clothing clad gunman BEFORE the shooting.
>
> * = It's getting late, so I'm letting out my frustration on your
> mindless, retarded position re. Brennan's testimony. Sorry, but you
> deserve it, and you know you do. You should really be embarrassed to
> post here with such obvious distortions of the facts. I'm kinda
> embarrassed just talking to a retard like you, in fact.
One of us should be embarrassed ..........
Walt
aeffects
This will make it into one of VB's talking point scripts --- Good job,
Walt!