Speculation: So, what is Vince B's objective.....
aeffects
a. present NEW case related evidence -or- shed new light on OLD case
evidence culled from existing/never before seen documentation,
interviews? (All of which, one might add further disgraces the 1964 WC
investigation)
-or-
b. a simple rehash of old material (under a new cover)
note: The WC case (NOT to be confused with the case against Oswald) is
based on a single shooter from the rear. With 2 of 3 rounds fired from
the rear, same single shooter inflicted all wounds in the Presidential
LIMO -- according to the WC. With the advent of Tague and other
considerations, the SBT was created, its alleged the Zapruder film
supports that contention.
Vince Bugliosi had/has every right to be fearful in determining which
Z-film frame displays JFK being hit with the miraculous "Single
Bullet" round. If he based his book on what the Z-film frames
displays, he's in trouble already....
Should we expect more (from Vince) concerning the Zapruder film,
muchmore (pardon the pun)? Perhaps....
SHOULD we expect a book regarding Oswald? Probably a better bet...
Actually, I'll put 10 bucks on it.... the entire book is a case to
convict LHO....
The ONLY thing Vince Bugliosi knows is -- Prosecution! So, regarding
that, only one question remains: could a ham-sandwich (not necessarily
VinceB), today, hang a 1st degree murder conviction on LHO based on
old evidence, collected by the Warren Commission? NO.....
I doubt Vince found anything of consequence new, I do expect: well
known, old-line, JFK assassination authors and their contributions
focused on LHO involvment.... heavy involvement from the 6th floor,
taking the form of unparalled access to their materials.... heavy
involvement from NARA, I expect to see the name Josiah Thompson, (?)
Baden, Gary Mack... (I also expect a DVD concerning on-camera
interviews usedin support of Bugliosi's book -- great for PR clips)
Let's speculate....
David Von Pein
The SBT does NOT hinge on Tague. Never did. And the WR even tells us
as much with these "possibilities" (below link). So why not get rid of
that tired argument? .....
http://history-matters.com/archive/jfk/wc/wr/html/WCReport_0071a.htm
>>> "The ONLY thing Vince Bugliosi knows is -- Prosecution!" <<<
Wrong. He's served as a defense lawyer too. .....
>>> "Let's speculate...." <<<
"Bugliosi's irresistible logic, command of the evidence, and ability
to draw startling inferences shed fresh light on this American
nightmare." -- W.W. Norton
http://groups.google.com/group/alt.conspiracy.jfk/msg/cfb02505fe1534df
aeffects
> >>> "With the advent of Tague and other considerations, the SBT was created." <<<
>
> The SBT does NOT hinge on Tague. Never did. And the WR even tells us
> as much with these "possibilities" (below link). So why not get rid of
> that tired argument? .....
you have a difficult time reading, David? to wit: "...Tague and OTHER
considerations" (emphasis all mine)
> http://history-matters.com/archive/jfk/wc/wr/html/WCReport_0071a.htm
>
> >>> "The ONLY thing Vince Bugliosi knows is -- Prosecution!" <<<
>
> Wrong. He's served as a defense lawyer too. .....
book contract, Bugliosi, defender.... doesn't compute, David
> http://www.amazon.com/gp/customer-reviews/discussions/start-thread.ht...
aeffects
.....AND: Vinces ability to draw startling inferences shed fresh
light.... sounds like nothing new, just new theories -- aw, shit, David
RICLAND
Bugliosi hit the trifecta in the early 70s. He won a very big case,
wrote a book about it that became a best seller, sold the rights to
Hollywood which made a hit movie out of it.
Amid all this he began promoting the idea that he was the best lawyer
around. But this was not necessarily so, especially since after the
Charlie Manson case he cherry-picked all his other cases for sure-fire-
impossible-to-lose cream puffs then went on to win each one.
And such is the man's lawyering creds -- a string of wins Joe Pesci's
character from "My Cousin Vinnie" could have won.
These wins were not difficult cases. In fact, with the exception of the
Manson case, they weren't even interesting.
In other words, after the Hollywood bug bit him, Bugliosi never really
returned to serious lawyering. He didn't prove his mettle by becoming a
defense lawyer and taking on really important cases like Gerry Spence's
"Silkwood" case. Instead, Bugliosi rested on his Charlie Manson laurels
for the next 30 years.
His decision to take on the Kennedy case is not surprising. Bitten by
the Hollywood bug at an early age, he couldn't get it out of his blood.
He wanted to be a rock star all over again.
Don't expect his book to be an important one because as you correctly
point out, Mr. Vincent Bugliosi doesn't have the requisite scholarship
tools.
Mr. Bugliosi is a glorified cop, little more.
ricland
--
Who Shot JFK?
http://tinyurl.com/247ybb
David Von Pein
I doubt very much if you'd ever even heard of Vince Bugliosi before
this month.
You're a disgrace.
aeffects
David, no US taxpaying citizen [seeking answers] is the problem...the
US governments case is the DISGRACE, that includes the Warren
Commission Report.
David Von Pein
Why....because you kooks say so?
Where did you expect the WC to go with evidence like this?.......
Oswald's guns (x 2 murders).
Oswald's bullet (399) and fragments (567/569).
Oswald's shells (x 2 murders).
Oswald's prints.
Oswald-fingering witnesses (x 2 murders).
Oswald's lies (x 2 murders).
Oswald's lack of a verifiable alibi (x 2 murders).
Given all of the above, should the WC have looked at the possibility
that Marguerite Oswald might have mowed down JFK & Tippit?
Perhaps Julia Postal should have also been a key suspect, too, huh?
She made the call to the cops that ultimately led to LHO's arrest,
after all. That's suspicious to certain kooks.
And Amos Euins is obviously a plotter too.
<Somebody give me a "Geesh" icon here. I can't find one.>
aeffects
> >>> "The U.S. Government's case is the DISGRACE, that includes the Warren Commission Report." <<<
>
> Why....because you kooks say so?
no.... simply put, what the WC FAILED to include as evidence through
incompetence or the father of incompetence the FBI would fill another
26 volumes ---- there in lies the Lone Nutter dilemma.
Bugliosi can't hide that
> Where did you expect the WC to go with evidence like this?.......
>
> Oswald's guns (x 2 murders).
> Oswald's bullet (399) and fragments (567/569).
> Oswald's shells (x 2 murders).
> Oswald's prints.
> Oswald-fingering witnesses (x 2 murders).
> Oswald's lies (x 2 murders).
> Oswald's lack of a verifiable alibi (x 2 murders).
they published it, didn't they?
> Given all of the above, should the WC have looked at the possibility
> that Marguerite Oswald might have mowed down JFK & Tippit?
makes as much sense as some of the material/evidence the commission
amassed?
> Perhaps Julia Postal should have also been a key suspect, too, huh?
> She made the call to the cops that ultimately led to LHO's arrest,
> after all. That's suspicious to certain kooks.
David, there was only ONE suspect in this case -- despite concerns.
> And Amos Euins is obviously a plotter too.
you want to brewup circular arguments concerning interviews with
nonstarters...
> <Somebody give me a "Geesh" icon here. I can't find one.>
can't help you, champ!
David Von Pein
Oh, you mean all the stuff that CTers THINK deserves much larger
amounts of scrutiny...right?
You're right, that kind of stuff would fill 226 more volumes!
E.G.:
Z-Film fakery.
Autopsy photo fakery.
Autopsy X-ray fakery.
Backyard photo fakery.
Documents fakery.
Autopsy report was doctored.
Autopsy doctors are 3 worthless, lying pigs.
The 6.5mm. "thing" on the AP X-ray. ~gasp~
Mary Moorman's shoes and socks look funny.
Witness coercion galore.
Witnesses who lied like cheap $1.88 Wal-Mart rugs.
Badge Man.
Umbrella darts.
Dave Ferrie planned this whole thing (between joints and LSD trips).
J.D. Tippit killed Kennedy.
Marrion Baker was supposed to rub out Oswald.
Ruby planted CE399.
Ruby's dog, Sheba, was really a homosexual bitch.
Sheba bit JFK to death. (That's the "dog" Jean Hill saw in the limo!)
Of course, several of the above items HAVE been looked into since the
WR was published, with absolutely nothing leading to conspiracy even
after these things were investigated (like the "photo fakery" crap).
But does that stop the rumors of fakery? I'll let you answer that one.
>>> "They published it, didn't they?" <<<
But did the WC collect and process all of that evidence in my laundry
list? Did the WC just INVENT all of that stuff that leads right to
LHO? (Duh!)
Are you in one of those "EVERYTHING'S BEEN FAKED" modes today?
aeffects
ah, yeah.... sure several of them.... tee-hee
> But does that stop the rumors of fakery? I'll let you answer that one.
perhaps they exist because you haven't presented a case strong enough
to debunk them...?
> >>> "They published it, didn't they?" <<<
>
> But did the WC collect and process all of that evidence in my laundry
> list? Did the WC just INVENT all of that stuff that leads right to
> LHO? (Duh!)
Here all along I thought ther FBI collected most of the evidence, what
was in that 5 volume report they turned over to the WC right after its
formation?
Too many scenarios, altered testimony, questionable photo/films,
there's too many lingering questions, David... J Edgar Hoover
directives... and on and on and on -- bad scene man!
> Are you in one of those "EVERYTHING'S BEEN FAKED" modes today?
Sheeeeeeet, that's the Lone Nutter's argument. All CTer's need is ONE
for a conspiracy and we already have that re the HSCA (and don't whine
about the old Nutter piss poor argument about the dictabelt, echos,
you know what they based their decesions on) you're ALREADY out the
window, you just don't believe it.
David Von Pein
it, plus the SS.
The DPD collected all of the TSBD evidence and the Tippit evidence.
The SS collected 399, 567, and 569. The FBI collected none of it.
The FBI took control of it at 11:45 PM (approx.) on 11/22, yes. But
that's not the same thing as collecting it at the crime scene.
Which is why the massive all-encompassing plot of the multitudes in
this case is even harder to swallow and all the more
idiotic....because it would certainly have to involve all 3 of those
agencies just mentioned...DPD, FBI, and SS. (Plus the Dallas County
Sheriff's Dept. as well.)
An IN-TANDEM "LET'S ALL FRAME OSWALD" plot right from the get-go.
Amazing, huh? And ultra-silly-sounding.
Gil Jesus
Anthony Marsh
> The FBI collected NONE of the evidence initially. The DPD collected
> it, plus the SS.
>
Did the DPD collect the President's clothing? Did the DPD collect the
limousine evidence? Did the DPD collect the Magic Bullet?
> The DPD collected all of the TSBD evidence and the Tippit evidence.
> The SS collected 399, 567, and 569. The FBI collected none of it.
>
The FBI collected the limousine evidence which the SS had overlooked.
> The FBI took control of it at 11:45 PM (approx.) on 11/22, yes. But
> that's not the same thing as collecting it at the crime scene.
>
No earlier than 11:45 PM?
The limousine was a crime scene.
> Which is why the massive all-encompassing plot of the multitudes in
> this case is even harder to swallow and all the more
> idiotic....because it would certainly have to involve all 3 of those
> agencies just mentioned...DPD, FBI, and SS. (Plus the Dallas County
> Sheriff's Dept. as well.)
>
> An IN-TANDEM "LET'S ALL FRAME OSWALD" plot right from the get-go.
>
Some else has the FBI crime scene team as the masterminds.
> Amazing, huh? And ultra-silly-sounding.
>
David Von Pein
overlooked."
I suppose you might actually know what you're talking about here...but
I'm nearly certain that the SS collected the large 567 & 569 fragments
linked to Oz's MC.
But if the FBI (initially) collected, say, the small fragments under
Nellie's seat and, say, the lead smear off the windshield...which is
possible, indeed...that scenario only positively INCREASES the
absurdity of the kind of widespread plot that so many CTers believe...
Because via that scenario, we'd have ALL THREE previously-mentioned
agencies POSITIVELY initially handling/collecting major hunks of
evidence favoring Oswald's likely involvement/guilt -- the DPD and SS
for absolute certain...and, if the FBI did collect initially some
other things in the car...then we've got the FBI being the third
agency to initially handle some major hunks of evidence.
What an across-the-board plot it was.
It'd take an Army to conceal it forever.
And it would also take something else -- It'd take a conspiracy-lovin'
kook of the First Order to believe that such a plot/cover-up actually
was orchestrated perfectly AND was pulled off to perfection as well,
without an agent having cracked to date.
RICLAND
>>>> "The U.S. Government's case is the DISGRACE, that includes the Warren Commission Report." <<<
>
> Why....because you kooks say so?
>
> Where did you expect the WC to go with evidence like this?.......
>
The WC is a disgrace because 45 years after it we're still asking "Who
killed JFK?"
What other proof do you need, David?
DUH ...
David Von Pein
I'm not asking that question. I know who killed President Kennedy.
It's obvious.
You kooks might be asking that question....but that's because,
well...you know...
And learn to count. It's hasn't been 45 years.
aeffects
after all that time and money, if we have to ask that "Who killed JFK"
question, 1 minute after the WC reitred, the commission failed,
miserably. Now I know what the Warren Commission's *probable* excuse
was.
Lone Nutter's on the other hand have NO excuse as to why they support
such a failed, disgraceful report....
Anthony Marsh
> "The FBI collected the limousine evidence which the SS had
> overlooked."
>
> I suppose you might actually know what you're talking about here...but
> I'm nearly certain that the SS collected the large 567 & 569 fragments
> linked to Oz's MC.
>
The SS overlooked the three very tiny lead fragments because they were
UNDER Nellie's jump seat.
> But if the FBI (initially) collected, say, the small fragments under
> Nellie's seat and, say, the lead smear off the windshield...which is
> possible, indeed...that scenario only positively INCREASES the
> absurdity of the kind of widespread plot that so many CTers believe...
>
The SS saw the crack on the windshield, but they did not remove it and
they did not collect the lead fragments.
> Because via that scenario, we'd have ALL THREE previously-mentioned
> agencies POSITIVELY initially handling/collecting major hunks of
> evidence favoring Oswald's likely involvement/guilt -- the DPD and SS
> for absolute certain...and, if the FBI did collect initially some
> other things in the car...then we've got the FBI being the third
> agency to initially handle some major hunks of evidence.
>
> What an across-the-board plot it was.
>
> It'd take an Army to conceal it forever.
>
> And it would also take something else -- It'd take a conspiracy-lovin'
> kook of the First Order to believe that such a plot/cover-up actually
> was orchestrated perfectly AND was pulled off to perfection as well,
> without an agent having cracked to date.
>
No one said it was perfect. Ever hear of Fox?
David Von Pein
conclusion.
Gotta love them kooks for mangling everything in sight. Wonder how you
guys can even manage to dress yourself every morning? (Or can you? If
I see a guy walking around with his boxers on his head, I'll think of
you.)
aeffects
*reasonable doubt* can make you crosseyed, eh?