Re: Upgrade from Win 10 build 1607 to 1909 has shifted image sideways on monitor

[Arlen Holder]

On Fri, 17 Jul 2020 20:16:00 +0100, NY wrote:

> I installed Classic Shell to give me a "proper" Start Menu.

I never understood _why_ people go to this much trouble...
o to obtain the WinXP accordion cascade menu that was always there!

o *Why does anyone bother to install Classic Shell on Windows if all they want is the WinXP accordion-style sliding cascade Start Menu?*
<https://groups.google.com/forum/#!searchin/microsoft.public.windowsxp.general/classic$20start$20menu%7Csort:date/microsoft.public.windowsxp.general/dTHKXIdlqcw/1YpoS4ITAQAJ>

If you understand how Windows works, you'll realize, instantly, the WinXP
accordion style menu exists & never left Windows in the first place.

It's EXACTLY the same (i.e., it's just a folder hierarchy of shortcuts).

In fact, I've copied my XP menu to Windows 10 and it works beautifully.
(Note that I maintain the same hierarchy on all machines, which is why
copying the "menu" folder from any of my machines works for all of them).

It's just a hierarchical folder pinned to the taskbar, containing
shortcuts.
--
People grasp at straws when they never had the problem in the 1st place.

[Arlen Holder]

On Fri, 17 Jul 2020 20:41:21 +0100, NY wrote:

> Sorry, forgot to mention that - yes, I've tried auto-sync. I also tried
> changing a couple of sync settings in the ATI applet, but those also made no
> difference.

Unfortunately, I don't think this will help NY much, if any, but I recently
had a problem when I decided to format a boot drive and then re-install
Windows 10 Pro v2004 (the canonical May 27th version) from DVD while off
the network.

Until I connected the PC to the network, the monitors wouldn't work right,
with multiple problems (e.g., one monitor simply mirrored and when I used
either monitor, it was the wrong max dimensions, etc.).

I didn't worry about it (as I had bigger issues to handle first, which Paul
was helping me on months ago and which I got back to with respect to
solving hardware BSOD issues), but when the PC connected to the network,
the monitor problem disappeared on the next boot.

There was a miserable stage in between where I installed the Nvidia GeForce
210 drivers offline, which caused, more BSODs, so I can't really say what
caused the problems.

But when I eliminated the Nvidia GeForce 210 graphics card, and reformatted
the hard disk anew, and then installed off the network, the monitors "fixed
themselves" this time.

Who knows what strange ways Windows works its miracles.
--
The beauty of Usenet is we learn from the practices & experiences of all.

[NY]

"Arlen Holder" <arlen...@newmachine.com> wrote in message
news:ret1a5$fs8$1...@news.mixmin.net...

I agree that there is a hierarchical folder for third-party applications
that you install on Win 10, but I haven't found any links for Devices &
Printers, Control Panel, etc.

Also, it seems to be hit-and-miss whether you get a start menu (Windows 10
style) or the infamous "mess of tiles" that covers most of the screen with
huge icons that organise themselves at random (eg Word is not always two
columns from the left on the third row).

I tend not to use the Start Menu on a regular basis, expect for Control
Panel and Devices & Printers. or for accessing a rarely-used program. For
commonly-ones, I locate them in the Start Menu and then copy the shortcut to
the desktop - and I screen-print the desktop when it's all set up so I can
restore icons to the places where I've put them (grouped according to
category) if Windows decides to move them - which seems to happen (but only
occasionally) if I've accessed my PC's desktop remotely from my phone or
laptop by Real VNC.



I'm used to Windows 7: I can "drive" it with me eyes closed (almost!) so I
feel lost and wrong-footed if I try to use vanilla Win 10 without Classic
Shell.


It's a shame that Win 10 hasn't merged the Control Panel (traditional UI)
and PC Settings (Modern UI) into a single set. It is tedious to have to
switch between the two because neither on its own can do *everything*.. I
*much* prefer the traditional UI with a proper menu bar (instead of a
cog-wheel or three-lines icon) to access settings. Modern is too pared-down
(and dumbed-down) for my liking. Microsoft made a very serious mistake with
Win 8 in trying to make a tablet-style minimalist UI the default. They
should have made it much easier to switch between the two - "Make Windows 10
look like all previous versions of Windows" versus "Use our new tablet-style
UI", and that change should be one that can be made at any time on a
per-user basis, not one that is system-wide and can only be configured at
installation time.

But all that is a side issue to the problem with the graphics adaptor on VGA
output. The only reason I use VGA / D-Sub is that my monitor has only one of
each port (VGA, DVI, HDMI) and I like my main Win 7 PC on DVI to give the
sharpest picture, with VGA for any other PC that I may connect temporarily
(Win 10, Ubuntu), and HDMI for devices that *only* have an HDMI port (eg
Raspberry Pi, on the rare occasions when I need to connect to it monitor and
keyboard, because something is stopping me accessing it by Real VNC or
PuTTY). I could get a KVM console switch, I suppose ;-)

[Big Al]

On 7/18/20 6:33 AM, this is what NY wrote:
> Also, it seems to be hit-and-miss whether you get a start menu (Windows 10 style) or the infamous "mess of tiles" that covers most of the
> screen with huge icons that organise themselves at random (eg Word is not always two columns from the left on the third row).

In my years of more win 10 installs than I can count, there never is a difference in the menu. The items on the tiles may change, Microsoft
has changed the ability to resize the rows and columns a bit, but it's still always tiles.

And you do know that you can just right click them all and 'unpin' and you wind up with just a program list, granted only alphabetical.
Still I usually just add back the programs I really really use, less the ones that are on the desktop, and now I have a very manageable
menu. And no future cute system changes Microsoft makes are going to break my 3rd party menu.

Al

[knuttle]

You know there are several ways to resize the start menu itself. The
first is in Settings, Personalization, Start. (Turn off Use full screen).

You can then size the start menu to the size you want by dragging the
sides line any other windows.

My start menu is about a half of the height of the screen and about a
quarter of the width. I have deleted all icons I don't want, and then
resized all of the icon to Small. They are arranged by subject:
Internet programs, Maps and navigation, printers, readers, office
suites. utilities, etc. making it easy to find what every I am looking
for.

For frequently used programs I have pinned them to the toolbar, with the
File Explorer, and use the icon jump list to go where I want.

[Arlen Holder]

On Sat, 18 Jul 2020 11:33:32 +0100, NY wrote:

> I agree that there is a hierarchical folder for third-party applications
> that you install on Win 10,

Hi NY,

To continue, always, to be purposefully helpful to all adults on Usenet...

I realize this is OT, where I was mainly responding to your words, since I
am a fact-based aspy who always tries to figure out the strange reasons why
people do the strange non-factual things they do. :)

Whenever I'm at the gas station, for example, and some Honda Civic pulls up
and the driver puts in Premium, I ask them "why", and what I get back is
utter nonsense (most of it is utter bull, fed to them by gas advertisers).

Same with people who own iPhones: I ask them while I'm waiting in line what
they like about it, and I _always_ get back almost a one-to-one parrot of
what MARKETING fed them to believe (e.g., "no malware", "frequent updates",
"security & safety", etc.), all of which is easily proven MARKETING
bulldunk.

Same with Classic Shell (and it's variants), where every time someone
mentions it, I simply remind them, nicely, that if all they want are WinXP
cascaded accordion-style menus, they never left Windows 10 in the first
place (they never left ANY Windows version, in fact).

I do though, very much so, ORGANIZE my Windows dual monitors, so I
APPRECIATE your needs, given the capriciousness of the dual-monitor setup,
as I, myself, (together with Paul), have ascertained in the past, e.g.,
o Philosophically, how do you "organize" two monitors
(only applicable to those of you with dual monitors)
<https://groups.google.com/forum/#!topic/microsoft.public.windowsxp.general/OVaj9a326Bo>

> but I haven't found any links for Devices &
> Printers, Control Panel, etc.

Long ago I added to the Usenet tribal record, just for this purpose,
_every_ command known to Windows man already (see links below), e.g.,
this brought up my "Devices & Printers" on Win10 Pro v1909 just now:
o Win+R > Run > control printers
o Win+R > Run > ::{26EE0668-A00A-44D7-9371-BEB064C98683}\2\::{A8A91A66-3A7D-4424-8D24-04E180695C7A}

While this opens up the "device discovery", for example:
o Win+R > Run > ms-settings-connectabledevices:devicediscovery

And this brought up the "Start Menu & Taskbar manager", for example:
o Win+R > Run > devmoderunasuserconfig.msc

And, of course, this opens up the control panel:
o Win+R > Run > control

Where you can get into any specific app wizard if you have the list which
I've provided, long ago, to the Usenet permanent archives for this task,
for example...
o Win+R > Run > control admintools
o Win+R > Run > appwiz.cpl
o Win+R > Run > control.exe /name Microsoft.TaskbarandStartMenu
etc. (we documented _hundreds_ of these commands, see link below)

The point is simply that if you can use "Start Run" to get to the "Devices
& Printers", or to the "Control Panel", then you can make a shortcut to
those commands, which you can give a custom icon, and then you can then put
your custom shortcut in your "menu" folder, which is already pinned to the
taskbar, perhaps under:
o taskbar > menu > os > {your custom shortcut to devices_and_printers.lnk}
o taskbar > menu > os > {your custom shortcut to control panel.lnk}
o taskbar > menu > os > {your custom shortcut to admin tools.lnk}
etc.

How to do all this we've added to the permanent Usenet archives just so
that people like you can do what we discussed long ago, in fact.

See these threads for details on how to do what you need to do:
o Over 250 Start > Run commands (please improve this Start Run commands list)
<https://groups.google.com/forum/#!topic/microsoft.public.windowsxp.general/cc1lGn3ty0E>

o Please follow this cut-and-paste tutorial to get batch command shortcuts working perfectly on Windows
<https://groups.google.com/forum/#!topic/microsoft.public.windowsxp.general/1PzeGP4KMTU>

o What Windows 10 default files contain lots of useful icons for shortcuts to be set to?
<https://alt.comp.os.windows-10.narkive.com/jprmtBFx/what-windows-10-default-files-contain-lots-of-useful-icons-for-shortcuts-to-be-set-to>

o Tutorial for creating custom Windows icons from screenshots using only Irfanview freeware
<https://groups.google.com/d/msg/microsoft.public.windowsxp.general/xm6aHzaC-D8/jvyr_JLnBAAJ>

Once we figure out how to add what you want to the cascade menu, we should
likely update this thread of useful shortcuts so that all benefit from
every action of ours on Usenet:
o What useful Windows shortcuts would you like to share with users?
<https://groups.google.com/forum/#!topic/microsoft.public.windowsxp.general/80ZHKKFom0c>

o What Windwos freeware adds powerful "phone Susan" & "vipw" commands?
<https://groups.google.com/forum/#!searchin/microsoft.public.windowsxp.general/arlen$20menu|sort:date/microsoft.public.windowsxp.general/ySVGbayhLSk/ucth1LPoBAAJ>

Where you need to know how batch/shortcut/target shortcut links differ in
the TARGET line syntax (which is an oddity of Windows it seems):
o What syntax combines 2 commands into a single shortcut TARGET line?
<https://groups.google.com/forum/#!topic/alt.msdos.batch/azQbz6D_v0Y>

o Shutdown or Restart Windows without bickering
<https://groups.google.com/forum/#!topic/microsoft.public.windowsxp.general/Ou___EcjwKo>

> Also, it seems to be hit-and-miss whether you get a start menu (Windows 10
> style) or the infamous "mess of tiles" that covers most of the screen with
> huge icons that organise themselves at random (eg Word is not always two
> columns from the left on the third row).

You may not know this, but I've written many tutorials on how to wrest
control over Windows menus, ever since the Win95 days, where I feel, had
Microsoft hired me years ago, the menus would make sense today.

While I always try to gain control over the native menu system, I've
explained in many threads why Microsoft made that simple task difficult,
e.g.,
o Philosophy on a tutorial for setting up Windows in a well organized
KISS philosopy such that search is never needed & reinstall is trivial
<https://groups.google.com/forum/#!topic/microsoft.public.windowsxp.general/1Gf59YRkaI8>

> I tend not to use the Start Menu on a regular basis, expect for Control
> Panel and Devices & Printers. or for accessing a rarely-used program.

To that end, I keep a shortcut to the "Run" command on my taskbar:
taskbar > Run > control

As described in this thread on pinning the Run icon to the taskbar:
o Is it even possible to pin the RUN command icon to the taskbar
WITHOUT surrendering to a Windows Search?
<https://groups.google.com/forum/#!topic/alt.msdos.batch/Ik_ejNXbrrw>

> For commonly-ones, I locate them in the Start Menu and then copy the shortcut to
> the desktop - and I screen-print the desktop when it's all set up so I can
> restore icons to the places where I've put them (grouped according to
> category) if Windows decides to move them - which seems to happen (but only
> occasionally) if I've accessed my PC's desktop remotely from my phone or
> laptop by Real VNC.

Yes. Indeed. Windows acts in strange ways, just like the proverbial
capricious Gods when it comes to messing up my carefully arranged desktop
also.

I suggest you put NOTHING on your desktop; put those valuable shortcuts in
your data directory (which is the only directory you ever need to back up),
and then you can simply copy that one directory tree to any newly set up
machine, and you're instantly good to go (it's what I do so I know it
works, and I've been doing this since, oh, I guess well into the Win95
days, where that one menu hierarchy works on all machines I've set up).

NOTE: I use a consistent hierarchy organized by FUNCTIONALITY (which almost
never changes over time), such as these samples would indicate:
o Taskbar > menu > archiver > veracrypt.lnk
o Taskbar > menu > browser > firefox.lnk
o Taskbar > menu > cleaner > ccleaner.lnk
etc.

To philosophize, I feel Microsoft screwed up on ORGANIZATION, where it's
trivial to organize a computer, IMHO (see aforementioned threads) if you
think about it ahead of time, since there are very few things you do,
overall, e.g., you "browse" and you "edit" and you "network", etc.,
so my systems (on my phone also) are organized by FUNCTIONALITY:
C:\apps\browsers
C:\apps\editors
C:\apps\networking
etc.

NOTE: I don't use plurals, but I added plurals above for illustrative
reasons, where my names are 8+3 and easily guessed (which is why I don't
use plurals, since it adds zero value & yet has to be typed correctly).

For the _same_ organizational strategy on my phone, see this screenshot:
o <https://i.postimg.cc/hjwRjQWV/homescreen01.jpg>

In short, while both Microsoft & Google (and Apple) would have benefited
greatly had they hired me to define their overall user interface (i.e., the
whole world would have an easier time with what a lot of people have
trouble with), at least I can help you access everything from what we've
been calling the "start menu" (which is really the "taskbar menu").

> I'm used to Windows 7: I can "drive" it with me eyes closed (almost!) so I
> feel lost and wrong-footed if I try to use vanilla Win 10 without Classic
> Shell.

That's my whole point.

Notice even in Android, my entire system ports over _seamlessly_ from any
device, simply because they're all organized by FUNCTIONALITY (which almost
never changes over time!).

So on ANY Windows, from Win95 up, you copy over ONE menu hierarchy, and it
works OUT OF THE BOX (for the most part, depending on how CONSISTENT you
are) on ALL PC's you, yourself, set up.

All you have to do is be consistent with your organizational strategy,
which is a LOT easier than people think, as we all do the same things
(e.g., we browse, we print, we edit, etc.).
<https://i.postimg.cc/rwdW0vrW/apk01.jpg>

> It's a shame that Win 10 hasn't merged the Control Panel (traditional UI)
> and PC Settings (Modern UI) into a single set.

I'm not sure _what_ Microsoft is doing with the control panel lately...
o Microsoft is reputedly beginning to sunset the Control Panel system applet
<https://groups.google.com/forum/#!topic/alt.comp.microsoft.windows/APpB-RBSBCI>

> It is tedious to have to
> switch between the two because neither on its own can do *everything*.. I
> *much* prefer the traditional UI with a proper menu bar (instead of a
> cog-wheel or three-lines icon) to access settings.

Take a look at the aforementioned thread on the 250 things you can do with
the Start > Run menu, and let us know what's missing that you need.

For example, we added a bright red admin prompt command, as one sample:
o Efficient Windows Admin command prompt of any color in any desired location
<https://alt.msdos.batch.narkive.com/0mQlFn8s/efficient-windows-admin-command-prompt-of-any-color-in-any-desired-location>

The whole point of that permanently archived thread is to allow people like
you to do what we researched (which took lots of time & energy) for you.

If you can't do something you need to do, then it's time to update those
threads, where I consider a thread a permanent reference which can be
updated as long as my news server has the article that I can respond to.

> Modern is too pared-down
> (and dumbed-down) for my liking. Microsoft made a very serious mistake with
> Win 8 in trying to make a tablet-style minimalist UI the default.

Agreed. Paul and I tried to wrest control over the damn tiles, where you
end up in binaries as you dig deeper, so I just gave up on both the Win10
right side (orthogonal) menu and the Win10 left side (alphabetical) menus.

In fact, we've discussed on this ng many related ways to make Win10
efficient and organized, some of which are summarized in this thread:
o Is this the most efficient way to access most-used folders & the entire file system with the LEAST amount of clutter?
<https://alt.comp.os.windows-10.narkive.com/e8etKofB/is-this-the-most-efficient-way-to-access-most-used-folders-the-entire-file-system-with-the-least>

> They
> should have made it much easier to switch between the two - "Make Windows 10
> look like all previous versions of Windows" versus "Use our new tablet-style
> UI", and that change should be one that can be made at any time on a
> per-user basis, not one that is system-wide and can only be configured at
> installation time.

Um... if you use what I suggest above, EVERY Windows version from about
Win95 to the latest Win10 can use the exact same menu folder.

It's what I do, so I know it works as I've been doing it for a decade or
two (I don't count how many years, and I do improve the organization over
time, but it's essentially the same for all Windows versions out there).

> But all that is a side issue to the problem with the graphics adaptor on VGA
> output. The only reason I use VGA / D-Sub is that my monitor has only one of
> each port (VGA, DVI, HDMI) and I like my main Win 7 PC on DVI to give the
> sharpest picture, with VGA for any other PC that I may connect temporarily
> (Win 10, Ubuntu), and HDMI for devices that *only* have an HDMI port (eg
> Raspberry Pi, on the rare occasions when I need to connect to it monitor and
> keyboard, because something is stopping me accessing it by Real VNC or
> PuTTY). I could get a KVM console switch, I suppose ;-)

Yes. I understand. I have graphics issues myself lately, as shown here:
o Windows 10 BSOD indicates a hardware problem - but what hardware is the problem?
<https://alt.comp.os.windows-10.narkive.com/oL7PTNKu/windows-10-bsod-indicates-a-hardware-problem-but-what-hardware-is-the-problem>
--
Those who purposefully help others on Usenet are few and far between.

[John Doe]

Arlen Holder <arlen...@newmachine.com> wrote:

> NY wrote:
>
>> I agree that there is a hierarchical folder for third-party
>> applications that you install on Win 10,
>
> Hi NY,
>
> To continue, always, to be purposefully helpful to all adults on
> Usenet...
>
> I realize this is OT, where I was mainly responding to your words,
> since I am a fact-based aspy who always tries to figure out the
> strange reasons why people do the strange non-factual things they
> do. :)

<yada yada yada>

Me too. I wonder why you and "Good Guy" have such similar headers.
And then there's the fact you both sound weird (not offensive by
itself). Like a Dr. Jekyll and Mr. Hyde thing (with some shared
traits)? Maybe someday you'll drop the Mr. Hyde thing and keep the
non-HTML posting Dr. Jekyll?







--

> Path: eternal-september.org!reader01.eternal-september.org!feeder.eternal-september.org!news.mixmin.net!.POSTED!not-for-mail
> From: Arlen Holder <arlen...@newmachine.com>
> Newsgroups: alt.comp.os.windows-10,alt.comp.microsoft.windows
> Subject: Re: Upgrade from Win 10 build 1607 to 1909 has shifted image sideways on monitor
> Date: Sat, 18 Jul 2020 14:36:33 -0000 (UTC)
> Organization: Mixmin
> Message-ID: <rev1df$t6i$1...@news.mixmin.net>
> References: <restd8$86r$1...@dont-email.me> <ret1a5$fs8$1...@news.mixmin.net> <reuj5g$86b$1...@dont-email.me>
> Injection-Date: Sat, 18 Jul 2020 14:36:33 -0000 (UTC)
> Injection-Info: news.mixmin.net; posting-host="94acd28e614e9dd09d1f33c173eb1c5668702f63"; logging-data="29906"; mail-complaints-to="ab...@mixmin.net"
> Xref: reader01.eternal-september.org alt.comp.os.windows-10:122602 alt.comp.microsoft.windows:822

[John Doe]

There's also the fact, like "Good Guy", "Arlen Holder" overtly
antagonizes Apple. Methinks there is some relationship. Tune in next
time...