I, for one, welcome our new Trimble Overlords

[StrayKatStudio]

I actually this that this is portentious of some really sweet new modeling systems. Trimble has been doing GIS and scanning equipment for so long, and that's exactly what Google Earth 3D modeling needs. The potential here is awesome. Can't wait to see how it works out!
I'm hoping for a LiDAR/SketchUp marriage, personally.

What do you other modelers think? Think Google is putting the helping of modelers with 3D creation into better-equiped hands?

Someone said that they're afraid Google will drop Google Earth, but I think that's nuts. There's no way that would happen. Google gives Places listings higher ranking because it knows that location searches are so valuable, especially for AdWords. And I don't think, with 3D buildings now on smart phones, and with graphics incorporating 3D imaging so much more readily now, that Google is about to, or will ever, drop GE. It looks to me like they are just outsourcing the content-creation more than ever, which sounds like an even more focused investment into GE. But this is all just my guesses. What do you guys think?

I can tell you that Trimble is a solid company. My family and friends have worked with them for years. A friend of mine is in Fort Collins, CO, right now getting training from Trimble.

[kristofer mäger]

What will happen with googel Guides what currently live

[Randy]

I think you're thinking! I find that to be a breath of fresh air!

 

I stated this in another post "...A fresh set of eyes, new ideas (some of which may match many of our past suggestions.) " to be my attempt to stay positive. We don't truly know if there is any alterior motive at play, or how this will transform each of our lives.

 

You might wonder "Where is everyone?" They're most likely to be in another group that is more suitable for this topic.

[CraigD]

We're still here and won't be moving to Trimble with the SketchUp team. We're planning on a close relationship with Trimble and our SketchUp friends, and think this is very positive for the future of SketchUp and modelers. :)

Cheers,

     - CraigD :)

[StrayKatStudio]

Haha, yes, Randy, I was trying to "think", but "this" happened.  That's what trying to type on a tablet does to my communication skills.

It's nice to see someone else be optimistic!

[StrayKatStudio]

Craig, so you'll be sticking with GE and the 3DWH, then?  

It sounds like Google is focusing on hosting and organizing content, and using partnerships for the actual content creation?  Sounds nicely symbiotic to me.  Trimble can do some really cool stuff for GE content creation that would be outside the core focus for Google to develop.  And the SketchUp team people can focus on the tool itself and improving content creation.
So Craig, has it been determined yet where Nicole and Mason will be based?

[SnowTiger]

I have to admit, I really don't know what to think.
I have trusted Google with my "stuff" for so long now, knowing and being comfortable with their TOC with regards to model rights etc.
But after reading THIS document, and specifically with regards to the following quote, I deleted all my non-geo-located models and those not currently in GE, amounting to 30+ models being removed today.

All license rights in non-geolocated models (e.g. 3D models of everyday objects not tied to a location) submitted before the Closing Date will be assigned to Trimble on the Closing Date. By continuing to store non-geolocated models in the 3D Warehouse after the Closing Date you consent to the assignment by Google of its rights and obligations to Trimble.

I don't want to assign rights of my models to anyone, let alone a company I know nothing about. At least not until I have the opportunity to read their TOC that affects these specific models.

I guess I'll wait and see what Trimble has in store for us before deciding whether to re-upload any or all of those models again.

[Gravitar]

After reading that page, I'm not really sure what to say. I am also concerned with the "model rights" that Chris was talking about. I hope that Google can give us more info about what EXACTLY is going to change, and how it affects us. Are the Google Guides going to still be around? Are there going to be anymore Summit Conferences? ( I would really like to go to one within the next couple of years ) How is the community going to be affected by this? There are so many unanswered questions. I hope Google could clear some of these things up. Just my thought. -Gravitar

[matthiasbasler]

Hi all,

I don't want to sound too pessimistic, but I also feel uneasy about
the change especially for one reason: The transfer of our user data/
contact data to Trimble (covered by Google's current Privacy Policy)
without knowing Trimble's Privacy Policy *beforehand*. Who knows how
they treat our data for afterwards?

The opt-out actually sounds like a rather harsh extortion to me
"If you do not agree to Google licensing, assigning and sharing your
Google 3D Warehouse data (including 3D models and user data) as set
out in this notice, you must remove models from the Google 3D
Warehouse prior to the Closing Date."
Does this sound like an option to you?

I kindly ask Google to publish the future 3DWH Terms of Service and
Privacy Policy of the 3DWH before the closing date and tell us when
this will be as soon as it is known.


Matthias Basler

[Julio Signorelli]

To all

Even before this happen, I ask the question about protection of our Models, it was never  answer to my satisfaction, I for one i remove all my information,

[goodtaste]

Hello everyone.

Sketch up are confident that the step to a good direction was acquired by Trimble, advanced.

Google has acquired the sketch up in 2006, if the why.

Thanks to that, now the world famous 3D software standard.

Sketch-up version of the free version and paid about 30 million people is so that you are using.

(PRO) is the free version and paid version you have in Japan.

My view sketch of the free version should be up to the abolition of all the paid version.

Desired price

Free version of the current 99US $

The paid version is (PRO) 499US $.

As corporate profits in the free version of software does not go out.

However, in order to disseminate software free version was a good way of No. 1.

Google's organization is divided into two areas.

One is a division should not be without issuing a profit.

One, even without an income, is a division of do whatever you want, such as developments and events.

However, should not be issued and results here will not result in a certain period of time.

Sketch up or it would not be entered in the second step, after six years.

Considered the culmination of last year look at last year's event.

User's beginning to GEO Asia Summit in Singapore in March,

User's Summit of the United States Mountain View in July.

User's Summit in Barcelona, ​​Spain in October.

Town to make online contest in November.

In Japan

Workshop to make the city of disaster Kesennuma 3.11 in June.

Geo, etc. Creators Day in Tokyo in September.

Various events and workshops seems to have been done in the world.

This year's schedule will be in the User's Summit events and still do not have.

Take profits in addition to new staff and new system is a good way.

If you can roll the system will benefit companies, profits will be distributed to the user we also.

A few years later, you will be the result came out again, if it is to acquire Google Trimble.

I expect it, re-communicate, and if good luck so far.

goodtaste .

********************************************************************************************************************************************:::

こんにちは　皆さん。

スケッチアップはトリンブルに買収されて良い方向へ1歩、進んだことを確信しています。

何故ならば、2006年にグーグルがスケッチアップを買収しました。

そのおかげで、世界の有名なスタンダードな３Dソフトになりました。

無料版と有料版のスケッチアップは約3,000万人が使用しているそうです。

日本でも無料版と有料版（ＰＲＯ）が有ります。

私の見解は無料版のスケッチアップは廃止して全てを有料版にすべきです。

希望価格は

現在の無料版　　９９US$

有料版（PRO)　４９９US$です。

企業としては無料版のソフトでは利益が出ません。

しかし、無料版ソフトは普及させるためには1番の良い方法でした。

グーグルの組織は大きく2つに別れます。

１つは利益を出さなくてはいけない部門です。

1つは、利益を出さずとも、開発やイベントなどやりたい放題の部門です。

但し、こちらはある一定の期間で成果や結果を出さないといけません。

スケッチアップは６年が経過して第2のステップに入ったのではないでしょうか。

昨年のイベントを見ると最期の年の集大成と考えられます。

３月のシンガポールのGEOアジアユーザーズサミットに始まり、

７月の米国マウンテンビューのユーザーズサミット。

１０月のスペイン・バルセロナのユーザーズサミット。

１１月のオンラインの街つくりコンテスト。

日本でも

６月の３．１１気仙沼災害の街作りのワークショップ。

９月の東京のGeoクリエーターズデイ等。

世界中で色々なイベントやワークショップ等が行われたそうです。

今年のスケジュールには未だにイベントやユーザーズサミットの予定はありません。

新しい体制と新しいスタッフを加えて利益を出していく、良い方法です。

企業に利益が出れば、我々ユーザーに対しても利益が分配されるシステムとなります。

数年後には、再び、グーグルがトリンブルを買収することに成れば結果が出たことになります。

それを期待して、今まで通リ、頑張ればいいと思います。

goodtaste

2012年5月7日月曜日 0時37分08秒 UTC+9 Julio Signorelli:

[SnowTiger]

I think one of my only real concerns is how all this might affect things between me and my clients.
Again, without seeing Trimble's TOS (not TOC as mentioned in my previous post), it is hard to know how things will be affected if at all.

The fact is, I always did tell my clients (in writing) that I cannot be held responsible for anything Google does that might affect their models and/or model info (or in this case, Business Info) but that I would always maintain their models barring no other things that are out of my control.

But at this moment, I cannot even promote my business because I have no idea how things are going to work and/or be affected.
I was right in the middle of closing 2 small deals (but with VERY prestigious clients) and "sort of" getting close to closing at least 1 Large Deal with a Municipality and it's Business Support Organization.

One of the things that inspires potential clients is the thought that having a model in GE will help increase their "hit rate" in Google Search Engine. I don't know that it does or did, but I'm guessing it certainly won't know.

So while I am initially reserved if not skeptical, I certainly want to be confident that we can all continue on as if "practically" nothing had ever happened. That things will be pretty much the same if not improved (in any areas that might be improved ... of which I cannot personally think of any).

Best of Luck to Everyone AND Keep Your Fingers Crossed !

[matthiasbasler]

Hi Julio, it was stated many times that you can use the privacy
settings to (f.e.) disallow downloading of certain or all of your
models, or you can just upload a KMZ file if you don't want people to
download the SKP file. I really wonder what else "protection" you are
asking for?

Matthias Basler

[Julio Signorelli]

It is Over, i will be gone from all that is google and a few day, goodbye

[Aubrey Skelly]

Ok, I watch and read what is going on on this forum and I try to restrain from commenting, Having being a modeler for 2 years now, seeing over the past few months what has been going on I would like to make a comment (if you are willing to read this)

To K for the post Question what is a "OVERLORD" historically it is a dictator a individual that controls and keeps the people in a subservient place Guess who :).

Many are concerned and if you read the details put out by "Google" it seems clear to me that they are basically telling every one to F.. off (stick it)

However if one reads a past note in the forum brought up approx 9 months ago if you copy right you model maybe it might be some protection and  remove all details about yourself for the next month or so.

Also I would like to add the fact that what will happen to the People that have tried very hard to keep this forum going that work for Google Maybe its time for those that model all the time to take control as was mentioned on another post?

If Trimble decide to Take the attitude that "We can do it alone" than it would be Economic Suicide" so Give all a Chance and wait see but be prepared not to trust the "Overlord". so maybe its time to find someone who has some "legal knowledge"

Google do as they always do Stick their head in the sand and hopefully it will go away. Please remember "History always repeats IBM, Microsoft, Yahoo, and Google/facebook/twitter and yes even apple today  10 years time who knows YOU or I tomorrow? who knows? but google is not forever :) thank you for reading 

[Doug]

I agree the opt out is horrible.I would prefer an opt in. The new terms need to be spelled out way advance. Gives us a chance to compare the 2 policies and if we don't agree give us a button that we can click that deletes the entire account. Maybe there already is an option like that.

/this opt out is no different from what any other company does. If you credit card company changes their rules, they tell you to either accept or your account will be closed.

My biggest question is will my models still have a [delete] button. And if I click it will it truly delete the model or will the company still have rights to it.

Currently, the uploaded models are just used in GE, which is in my view is open source or a wiki.

For a company to create a commercial product using open source models then I can't see them allowing models to be just removed from the product, whole towns could disappear.

As much as I would love a GPS unit with actual 3D models, I can't see an open source structure working with a commercial product. I also don't think anyone here, especially expert modelers like Julio, want someone making money using our models.

[Julio Signorelli]

I have deleted all my information and models, if thing change, i will model again, some models that they were important for projects, i have give them to somebody to put them back in with the instruction not to mention me, those models belong to the person that i have give them, and we will se what happen in a few months, how did you copyright your model Aubrey?

[Aubrey Skelly]

I dont believe that any modeler wants to see any corporate make money out of their hard work. If trimble do this than Millions of modelling will disappear unless If you read the small print that google transfer all modelers models as from the Date "Unknown" (yea! they Know) and if you dont remove the models by that "Sudden date" than trimble have all of your stuff. That is my reading and understanding

"It is very important that we need legal advice on this"

[Aubrey Skelly]

What's your e-mail and not a Google mail Julio

Laudos

On 7 May 2012 00:51, Julio Signorelli <juliosi...@xplornet.ca> wrote:

I have deleted all my information and models, if thing change, i will model again, some models that they were important for projects, i have give them to somebody to put them back in with the instruction not to mention me, those models belong to the person that i have give them, and we will se what happen in a few months, how did you copyright your model Aubrey?

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[SnowTiger]

I agree with the statement that "It is very important that we need legal advice on this", however having worked with many Laws for many years, I know that it is our individual responsibilities to have the specific Laws and Legal Documents "interpreted" for us.
In other words, We must each seek Our Own Legal Counsel.

Google won't tell us our rights .. they don't have to nor would it be in their best interest (like any business).
I'm completely comfortable with this statement of fact and issue.

But the real issue here is that while we already have Google's TOS ... which many of us already have a reasonable understanding of,
None of us can even consider doing that until we can see Trimble's TOS.

I can only hope we will have Both to compare from BEFORE the Sale Closes, giving us a reasonable amount of time to make an informed decision about our models and/or the direction each individual is going.

[4throck]

For me there's no question that only models I made for customers or part of projects will remain on the warehouse.

All my models will go until I'm sure about what will happen in the future. I hope for the best and I'd be glad to re-upload everything but only when I can see what options for download / display / share I have.
And what happen when I click in Google Earth, what copyright message is displayed, etc (buildings by Trimble?)
My suggestion to all is to do the same just do be safe. Protect your work.

[NESUA]

I do not know what to think after read this.
But I think Google must to send an email to notify to every modeler
that has their stuff in the 3d warehouse before the change happens,
with all the details of the changes and how will affect to us and our
stuff.

I only want to say that if that is true, and all our stuff will be
property of Trimble, I will also delete all my models from 3D
Warehouse. Located and non-located models.

A note in the official blog with poor details isn't sufficient to me.
I mean, there are a lot of modelers that do not read the official
blog, and I think that all the users have to know the changes, and how
that will affect us, and our stuff.
(Take note Googlers!)


Néstor Suárez (NESUA)



On 6 mayo, 03:59, matthiasbasler <matthiasbas...@earthflight.org>
wrote:

[SnowTiger]

I was just thinking about something last night that has me wondering.

What is going to happen to the Google SketchUp "Authorized Training Centers" ?

Will they just continue but under the name of Trimble ?
Who will pay for any New Signs and Promotional Materials that they will need ?
What about products and training materials they already have ?

I know changing business names, locations, contact information, emails, phone numbers and mailing addresses etc, can be an expensive proposition at the best of time.
I can only hope that Google and Trimble have taken these questions/situations into consideration.

Ultimately, the reason these questions came to me is because I was pondering the notion of becoming Qualified with the hopes of Opening an "Authorized Training Center" OR working out of the local Technical College. But now I don't know if that will ever be possible.

>>>> With regards to Julio and 4throck and others who have already or are considering deleting ALL their models, I don't know that it is necessary to do that.
Google intends to keep those models in GE which is where we wanted them to be. I am only concerned about the overall affect to "client commissioned models" (as mentioned in my previous post).
As long as "WE" still have control over editing and the model information we uploaded remains the same, I won't care about anything else (that I can think of right now anyway). Furthermore, as long as the models still identify the Modeler .... so that "WE" are still recognized for each of our works, I think I'll be satisfied.

[CraigD]

Please be patient and calm while we work out the details and communicate what this transition will mean. I wouldn't expect major changes, so reacting harshly may just just cause more problems.

Again, please be patient and calm while we work out the details and communicate them on the forums.

Cheers,

     - Craig

[Aubrey Skelly]

Sorry Graig 

But

It seems to me that Google have made a bit of a mess of this and have not considered modelers in this equation, a bit of arrogance if I might say.

I think if you don't get some message out soon particularly from Trimble than This could be a complete mess for both Google and Trimble.

People are starting to Jump, personally I've started to remove models on a graduated basis. 

Regards,

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[CraigD]

We're doing our best. Please be patient and again, try not to react harshly (like removing models) until all the information is published.

Thanks,

     - Craig

On Monday, May 7, 2012 2:21:39 PM UTC-6, Aubrey wrote:

Sorry Graig 

But

It seems to me that Google have made a bit of a mess of this and have not considered modelers in this equation, a bit of arrogance if I might say.

I think if you don't get some message out soon particularly from Trimble than This could be a complete mess for both Google and Trimble.

People are starting to Jump, personally I've started to remove models on a graduated basis. 

Regards,

Please be patient and calm while we work out the details and communicate what this transition will mean. I wouldn't expect major changes, so reacting harshly may just just cause more problems.

Again, please be patient and calm while we work out the details and communicate them on the forums.

Cheers,

     - Craig

On Monday, May 7, 2012 12:09:52 PM UTC-6, SnowTiger wrote:

I was just thinking about something last night that has me wondering.

What is going to happen to the Google SketchUp "Authorized Training Centers" ?

Will they just continue but under the name of Trimble ?
Who will pay for any New Signs and Promotional Materials that they will need ?
What about products and training materials they already have ?

I know changing business names, locations, contact information, emails, phone numbers and mailing addresses etc, can be an expensive proposition at the best of time.
I can only hope that Google and Trimble have taken these questions/situations into consideration.

Ultimately, the reason these questions came to me is because I was pondering the notion of becoming Qualified with the hopes of Opening an "Authorized Training Center" OR working out of the local Technical College. But now I don't know if that will ever be possible.

>>>> With regards to Julio and 4throck and others who have already or are considering deleting ALL their models, I don't know that it is necessary to do that.
Google intends to keep those models in GE which is where we wanted them to be. I am only concerned about the overall affect to "client commissioned models" (as mentioned in my previous post).
As long as "WE" still have control over editing and the model information we uploaded remains the same, I won't care about anything else (that I can think of right now anyway). Furthermore, as long as the models still identify the Modeler .... so that "WE" are still recognized for each of our works, I think I'll be satisfied.

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[4throck]

Segunda-feira, 7 de Maio de 2012 22:40:39 UTC+1, CraigD escreveu:

>>>> With regards to Julio and 4throck and others who have already or are considering deleting ALL their models, I don't know that it is necessary to do that.

I didn't remove all. All models that were made for 3rd party clients continue on 3DWarehouse of course.
But the general portfolio stuff was taken down. I'm better off loading them from a website using the GE API.

There's the precedent of the 3d buildings on the standard android mobile version of GMaps. Those are not textured and have simplified geometry, clearly derived from our detailed models.
OK, no problem with that, but I do have a problem with the fact that those buildings are not selectable (so you never know who did them, how many views etc).

So for the future of GE / 3D Warehouse,  it's important for example to know if the models will be present on the main 3Dbuildings layer or a new "Trimble selected 3d buildings".
Will they still be clicable? Will there be a monetization strategy like adsence / adwords (I'd welcome that) ? What copyright will be displayed ?
Untill I know what I get back, I'm not giving anything.

[Aerilius]

Hi Nesua and all others,
no need to run amok!

Trimble (at least for what is known so far) will get exactly the same rights that we have granted to Google, namely the right to create and display thumbnails, the right to create derivatives (= converted models for Google Earth) etc. Without those rights 3D Warehouse can't operate. If we were not ok with those rights, we wouldn't have given the models to Google in the first place.
I can't say what "property" means in the judiciary sense, but we have all copyright and ownership on our models, with the exception of the "content license from you" as it is written in the ToS §11.

I hope for the best and for more explanation soon when more things are clear (the deal isn't finished yet).

[matthiasbasler]

Hi all,
I am really shaking my head in disbelieve about what's expressed in
some recent posts.

Before I have started uploading one single building I read the 3DWH
terms of service, and I have read them again from time to time and
made sure I still agreed to them. The TOS state for example:

"11.1:
(a) You retain copyright and any other rights you already hold in
Content which you submit, post or display on or through, the Services.
"
[...]
(c) By publicly posting or displaying the content you give other end
users of the Services a perpetual, sublicensable, irrevocable,
worldwide, royalty-free, and non-exclusive license to reproduce,
adapt, modify, translate, publish, publicly perform, publicly display
and distribute (subject to the restrictions set forth in Sections 11.4
and 20.3 of these Terms) any Content or derivative works thereof which
you publicly post or display on or through the Services. "

You all have agreed to this, so why now complain about "I don't want
some company to use my models commercially." ???
Of course I also prefer if companies wanting to use my models
commercially ask me for permission, but as far as I understand it,
they need not ask ... and some don't ask anyway. And for all those
that fear Trimble could be making money out of your models, have you
ever believed Google provides all those services, hardware, guides,
programmers and tutorials just for fun? Of course they want to earn
money, by advertising or by re-selling data most likely, and there's
nothing wrong with that. This has been part of our agreement for
years.

I pretty much doubt the TOS of Trimble will be much different, so
likely if you agreed to Google's TOS you likely can agree to them as
well. And thus I will stay calm and await the things to come.

But of course this is just my opinion.
Matthias Basler

P.S. There's one thing that I am a bit angry about and this is the
fact that Google *again* updated *only the English* language version
of the 3DWH with this important legal information. Hey Google, doesn't
affect this change the user worldwide?. Do German, French and Chinese
user not have a right to be informed when they open up the 3DWH front
page? They should at least get a link to the English document imho!

P.P.S. And no, Doug, the 3DWH is *not* open source.

[StrayKatStudio]

SnowTiger, I don't understand. You've trusted Google to behave to everyone's benefit for years, and suddenly you're not only getting suspicious, but you're also starting a proverbial "run on the bank" with everyone following you to pull models from the 3dwh? Why? Who does that benefit?
Of course Trimble will run the 3DWH if they own SketchUp. Because the 3DWH hosts SU models that aren't on Google Earth. Why should Google care take all of these non-GE objects that do not have anything to do with Google Earth?
Would you all really rather have Google split up your GE-layer models from your non-GE models into two separate warehouse repositories? It's easier for modelers to keep the SketchUp models in one place under just one owner. But if Trimble is going to host an online SketchUp repository (3dwh), then they Have to inherit Google's Terms, obligations, etc. There might be some slight modifications for technical reasons, but why would the legalities change significantly? The Terms transfer just seems like a technical detail to me, a formality that they have to go through so that each company can focus on their strengths in this relationship.
Some modelers seem to telling themselves an imagined story that Google is selling our models, instead of just transferring the care, convenient online storage, and display of models collectively known as the 3dwh. The sale was for Sketchup. 3DWH is not a commodity, it's a responsibility. There are absolutely no facts to support belief that Google or Trimble is buying or selling our models. I see no reason for conspiratorial suppositions or pulling models. I bet that in a year, modelers will look back at all of these hasty reactions and realize that the fears were baseless.
I think the real issue is that many modelers want some diplomatic recognition from Trimble. But peeps, the Trimble people will largely be made up of the SketchUp Team. Some of us go way back.
Here's a question: Why do we Geo-model? Isn't it to help make Google Earth look fantastic? To represent our local communities? And does it matter how that happens? So What if the geo-modeling process changes? Photo-cameras might be replaced with other tools. SketchUp will likely evolve, as will BuildingMaker. Who cares as long as it works well? The techniques and processes don't matter. Recreating our world matters. Helping tourists not get lost matters.
I make half my yearly income off Google Earth modeling, but I'm not worried about this sale. I'm excited.
Oh, right, and the "Overlords" comment. Sorry Aubrey, it's a really geeky USA pop culture reference (Google it). It was a joke. I need to remember to not use irony, idioms, or cultural references in this international forum, or I'll be likely to miscommunicate.
Let's focus on the poor lost tourists looking for our amazing models on GE and not thwart their travels by needlessly pulling models. We do amazing work. Let's not sulk, let's show it off.
And lastly, why create headaches for our old friends at the SketchUp and GE teams? They already have lots of changes to adapt to as it is. Instead of punishing them or making threats or demands for imagined slights and uncertainty, let's try to work together and help out our GE and SU people by not freaking out for no reason, eh? They haven't done anything wrong. There are no villians here. Just a need for patience. And some good new things coming.

[StrayKatStudio]

Doug, Julio, and Aubrey, I would love to see corporations profit from my work. I want to see every person and business on the planet profit somehow from my work. If Google profits from Ad exposure, or a business owner profits from increased traffic to their door, or a business traveler doesn't get lost for once, their gain doesn't make me lose anything.
Google has always made money off our work, indirectly. And we profit, too (I used Google Maps for about seven hours today, benefiting from others' work to help me find my way in an unfamiliar desert city).

"Make money off of" does not equal "exploit".

I feel sorry for Tromble. Not only does auto-spell screw their name up constantly, but now they have to deal with geo-modeler drama.

[StrayKatStudio]

Snow Tiger, just tell your clients that this is the best thing ever for Google Earth and that it will increase the value of their GE presence. Because making models is going to get better, easier, and more prolific.

And just say it like you mean it. After all, if you're going to make up a story in the face of uncertainty, why not make it a good and optimistic one? It's better for everyone.

[StrayKatStudio]

http://knowyourmeme.com/memes/i-for-one-welcome-our-new-x-overlords

For people who don't watch The Simpsons, Jeopardy, or campy old sci-fi.

[matthiasbasler]

On 9 Mai, 09:52, StrayKatStudio <straykatstu...@gmail.com> wrote:
> http://knowyourmeme.com/memes/i-for-one-welcome-our-new-x-overlords

Thanks for sharing, it never occurred to me that this thread title had
any deeper meaning. Nice to know!

Matthias Basler

[CraigD]

For what it's worth, and being a Simpsons fan, I LOL'd when first saw your post! :)

Cheers,

    - Craig

[CraigD]

I believe the Trimble folks understand that there's always discomfort when things change, and I also know that they are committed to the community and excellent work you all do. They are modelers, they love 3D, they love seeing their tools used to build incredible things in this world. Let's have some faith in that passion. They're very excited about SketchUp's future, and I hope you all continue to share that excitement. 

Cheers,

    - Craig

[Richard Pedicini]

After reading this thread, I wonder that people aren't adding to their models little prophets carrying "The End is Nigh!" placards.

I saw the End of the World once, with Adobe Atmosphere. The idea was very similar to Sketchup, though without the geolocation potential or support of Google Earth - I recall using USGS data and two or three different open source programs to conjure terrain.

Atmosphere, to be blunt, did not work. It had some method of displaying surfaces that varied wildly on small data differences - and a file format that rounded data. A spiral staircase would look fine; on being saved and re-opened, one step would stretch fifteen meters away from everything else. There were doubtless other problems I personally didn't encounter or don't remember.

That software took several months to learn in "beta", was finally launched, lasted under a year and was simply discontinued, giving carefully crafted models all the usability of wax recording cylinders or Betamax tapes.

Google has taken software that did work, improved it (I assume, I've seen only version 6 onward), given it a public and an audience, and passed it on to a company with a focus that more closely matches that of the product.

Compare that to what happened with Atmosphere, and the wailing and gnashing of teeth seems a bit over the top.

My own feeling is that the future holds something similar to automatic translation of natural languages.  In a few years that has gone from giving sometimes a vague notion, to generally producing almost reliable translations of simple texts. No doubt in the future it will further improve. But for difficult or critical texts, human translation done with care by a human who knows both languages well, will always be superior. In modeling,  the melted and tilted looking automatic models will lose their tilts and sags. The laser measurement devices that have been used on major monuments will fall in price, and the declining cost of computer cycles will make the conversion of that data into models practical for any building. Whoever is working on the next generation of software, at Google, Trimble, or wherever, is probably using models from the 3d Warehouse as a benchmark of some sort. But that's all the future.

Regarding the copyright concerns, I can write as a computer programmer (I wrote Lehman Brothers' MIS system, and did the calculation for Merril Lynch's first mortgage-backed securities) and as someone who now lives in the Third World. Once upon a time, copper would be mined in Chile and refined in the US, and raw copper was given a low price, and refined copper a high one, such that the profit went to the U.S. Dickens never received royalties for his books in the U.S., at that time it was advantageous to the U.S. not to respect foreign copyrights. The current fervor for "intellectual property", whether in computer software or pharmaceuticals, is just a new way of saying, "send the profits north". From another angle, like the miracle of loaves and fishes, knowledge (and software is merely codified knowledge) can be used by an infinite number of people without in any way being diminished.

I upload all my models. I don't know if anyone has used parts of them or textures, but I am absolutely certain that I have never awoken with less money in my wallet if anyone did so. I also realize that making Sketchup models has some of the characteristics of building a ship in a bottle; the value of the finished product is not necessarily proportionate to the effort that went into making it. I do it because I find it relaxing when I am tired of producing words. 

One should be cautious to embrace the fads of the moment, whether they be an ever-rising real estate market, or the sacrosanct nature of "intellectual property". I have modeled a number of commercial properties (as well as, among other interests, the scenes of old and recent crimes), and have yet to be contacted by the owner of any of them, from which I assume the money-making potential of 3d models has yet to move from potential to reality.

In short, there seems no motive to panic and run for the hills. Even if Trimble's future terms contain something unacceptable, it is likely that a polite letter requesting removal of a model will receive a polite response in the affirmative. Even if not, your wallet will not be any the lighter for it.

Cheers,
Richard 


  

   

[4throck]

"... from which I assume the money-making potential of 3d models has yet to move from potential to reality"

I agree. I hope that the change will bring some monetization strategy. If that materializes I guess it will be only for new uploaded models.
Even if theres no €€ perhaps better authorship exposure /integration with social media or clickable buildings in Maps / API.

So there might be some gain for re-uploading models in the near future.

Looking forward to a new Warehouse or at least strong signs of continued support of the present model (not perfect but works).
My fear is that the present warehouse models may be treated as some kind of legacy data that will get outdated and irrelevant with time.

[Aubrey Skelly]

All I can say is "Beware of Greeks Baring Gifts" Be very careful what you ask for as one day it just might come true and unfortunately, just when you least expect it and if you think a "overlord" is welcoming just look at history. 

Arrogance and ignorance is not a good thing. 

Regards,

Aubrey

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[StrayKatStudio]

4thRock - There is already a monetizing strategy for modeling.  I sell SketchUp modeling to building owners and businesses.  Just got about 3 thousand dollars in contracts yesterday.

I doubt you will ever see a day when Google pays all modelers for geo-modeling.  That would be cost-prohibitive for them.  

If you want authorship exposure, promote yourself.  It's no accident that my local state business magazine did an article about local 3D modeling.  I suggested it =).  And as for social media, clicking on the model author can indirectly lead to their Google+ profile, can't it?  As for Facebook, it's probably best to create your own FB page with your model links on it, if you want FB integration (facebook.com/straykatstudio).
I don't think that Google is planning on dumping our models or anything with this change, but with all technology, it's good to keep in mind that everything we develop is ephemeral.  If you design a new mobile phone nowadays, you have about 2 months of popularity before the next, faster, better model comes out.  Technology is going to revolutionize the 3D Geo-visualization platform over and over.  We use photographs now, perhaps we'll use a different hand-held device later.  SketchUp will change.  Our models will all likely be replaced eventually as better processes and software is developed.
But hey, it's all about enjoying our "15 minutes of fame" (cultural reference alert!).  Someday we'll tell all the young 3D-modeling whippersnappers that we were doing this way back in the day before everyone knew about it, using Cameras and 3G networks and they'll be like "whoaaaaa" and think we're cool old tech-heads, like Wozniak. But yeah, our current modeling processes will probably go the way of floppy disks and dinosaurs, at some point.  And that's ok, because we'll get new toys when we throw out our old ones.

Speaking of new toys, I'm going to go buy a smartphone this week that shows our 3D models on Google Earth!

[SnowTiger]

Hello StrayKatStudio

I have and continue to trust Google.
The problem is I know little or nothing about Trimble.

My previous post regarding Training Centers was purely inquisitive and something I figure those that own/run training centers are probably asking themselves.

But the fact that I removed my non-geo-located models is specifically due to the wording of Google's Notice re: Sale of SU to Trimble.
I accept that I might not fully understand the implications of that notice or its wording (i.e. I'm unable to accurately or comfortably interpret it), but when the Notice starts out by stating "If you’re a user or licensee of SketchUp, or a user of the Google 3D Warehouse, this will affect your rights - please read this notice carefully."  ... then I want to know "What Rights of mine will be affect and How will they be affected" ?

Furthermore, said Notice suggests something about the rights and/or ownership of the non-geo-located or non-Google Earth Models. I don't completely understand it but I figured since the Notice suggest that if we aren't comfortable with "whatever it is that happens with them", that we should remove those models.
So I did.
I have no concerns that I won't be able to re-upload them again later and I very likely will. But not until I have a clear (or at least clearer) understanding of the implications of things which NON of us will have until we have the opportunity to see and read Trimble's TOS.

So I don't think I'm doing a Run on the Bank so to speak, but rather CMA (like CYA but different) until I know better, based on the advice provided in the Notice.
Few of us here are Lawyers (although I have interpreted more legal documents and legislation than most people that aren't lawyers ... because I was in an Enforcement position) and so when documents are ambiguous there can be allot of confusion, especially on the part of those that have no idea how to interpret law.

In the end, I reserve my right to pass final judgement until ALL the relevant information is available from which I can make an educated assessment.
In the meantime, I will continue to trust Google with certain things even though I like many, don't particularly care about their handling of our personal information and data... but I realize that is part of what we agree to allow them to do if and when we wish to utilize their products.
But that doesn't mean I have to be happy about it.
Just because I have trust in Google, doesn't mean I should blindly and neglectfully now trust some company I have never even heard of, let alone trust them with my information and or models etc ... not until I get to read there TOS.
If it turns out to be the same as Google's.. great.  If not, I will make my decision then. But I also understand you only have to change one or two words in any document for it to have a completely different meaning and resulting effects.

I do however, realize that Text can often be damning because we don't get to see a person's eyes or hear the Tone of their voice .. and the Tone of Text can easily be misinterpreted.
The bottom line here is that I speak only for myself here and do not, nor have I encouraged anyone to take my words for anything or follow any particular advice about the impending sale of SU to Trimble. And I certainly have not spoken badly about Google. In fact, I have been and will continue to be very supportive.
PS> My curiosity about how this sale might affect Training Centers and their advertising and training materials, still stands.

[Aubrey Skelly]

I could not have put it better, Snowtiger, I think you said it all.

Cheers

[Phil Croft]

" BOTH "  StrayKatStudio & SnowTiger are perfectly right in their comments. -   WELL DONE !  -  will continue to watch this space !!!! 

 

On Tuesday, 1 May 2012 04:35:26 UTC+1, StrayKatStudio wrote:

I actually this that this is portentious of some really sweet new modeling systems. Trimble has been doing GIS and scanning equipment for so long, and that's exactly what Google Earth 3D modeling needs. The potential here is awesome. Can't wait to see how it works out!
I'm hoping for a LiDAR/SketchUp marriage, personally.

What do you other modelers think? Think Google is putting the helping of modelers with 3D creation into better-equiped hands?

Someone said that they're afraid Google will drop Google Earth, but I think that's nuts. There's no way that would happen. Google gives Places listings higher ranking because it knows that location searches are so valuable, especially for AdWords. And I don't think, with 3D buildings now on smart phones, and with graphics incorporating 3D imaging so much more readily now, that Google is about to, or will ever, drop GE. It looks to me like they are just outsourcing the content-creation more than ever, which sounds like an even more focused investment into GE. But this is all just my guesses. What do you guys think?

I can tell you that Trimble is a solid company. My family and friends have worked with them for years. A friend of mine is in Fort Collins, CO, right now getting training from Trimble.

[4throck]

StrayKatStudio -Interesting discussion!

I agree that geo-referenced models do have a business model. All of my professional geo-referenced models were payed and of course they are all in 3Dwarehouse!
And I'm working on another right now. So I'm not for "let's remove all the models".

But I still think that modelers should be protective of their personal and portfolio models, for example historical models that are non-geolocated. That is an individual call, and I'm for removal until things are clearer. But I firmly expect to re-upload ASAP. As pointed out, that would be an opportunity for exposure :-)


It is impossible to predict the future. I personally don't see much benefit for the end customer of an auto-generated model. We have building maker that does something like that.

My personal experience is that people don't want 100% acurrate models. They want pristine walls, completly imaculate fences, nice signs, etc, when in reality their buildings are in need of repairs! So they need a model to replace actual photos of their (decaying) property!
Of course every market is different, but in my country that how it works.
So even if we can "model" a building in the near future using hundreds of cell phone photographs, the amount of work to clean them and provide the client with a satisfying results would be the same as hand building the model.

[isidro del pino]

esto es demasiado,tanto trabajar ,muchas horas dedicadas a esto y no sirve de nada,lo peor es que gente con tanto talento y dedicacion a borrado sus modelos y cuentas,y como es muy normal en cualquier sociedad los que hacemos grande un sector nos dan con la puerta en las narices,no es justo,yo antes metia en google earth de 15 a 20 modelos por semana,todo lo que mando se lo dan a otro solo por que el modelo es mas reciente que el anterior,a rey muerto rey puesto,es el lema,julio recientemente habia hecho el numero 3000 de sus modelos y total no parece importarle su trabajo,por que google no mantiene nuestro perfil y solo subimos el modelo a la galeria de timble,solo el modelo,y asi timble seguira con la adquisision de sketchup y nosotros nos proteja nuestros datos personales google,a ver pienso que es una buena idea,google protege nuestros datos personales y solo timble obtiene los modelos y la galeria sin datos personales,que opinais

[Eneka Mujika]

Hola Isidro

Opino que el uso del  "punto" es una virtud del lenguaje que facilita el entendimiento.

Me gustaría preguntarte de donde sacas esta información:

" por que google no mantiene nuestro perfil y solo subimos el modelo a la galeria de timble,solo el modelo "

No he leído nada al respecto.

salu2

nk

[isidro del pino]

lo del punto,¿que es?,no entiendo

[Eneka Mujika]

Punto y aparte.Punto y mayúsculas.

no que los escribas todo de un tirón, a mi se me hace más difícil de leerte cuando escribes así, por que es parecido a que no puedes coger aire cuando estas leyendo y no tienes un punto donde parar, se me hace un poco difícil, y además el traductor se me vuelve loco, buenas noches Isidro

Uf, pues eso.

salu2

nk

[isidro del pino]

bueno,esto no es un foro literario,hay personas que escriben en su idioma,y la traduccion te la tienes que inventar,

[Auquicu]

Hola Isidro. No me molesta lo de los puntos, pero creo que el traductor funciona mejor si usas puntos. Lo digo por quienes no hablan español y deben usar el traductor.

Cambiando a lo otro, creo que hay mucho ruido del paso a Trimble, pero parece que va a ser lo mejor para Sketchup y la comunidad. Julio se dejó llevar por este ruido en lugar de tener un poco de paciencia. Cuando venga de regreso, y espero así suceda, le va a costar mucho trabajo y tiempo volver a subir todos sus modelos.

 

Saludos,

[isidro del pino]

estoy de acuerdo contigo,a ver si en la forma en que se llevan las revisiones,son mas justas,y es de mi opinion que se revisen los modelos y que estos,brillen por su calidad,y no por otro motivo,
por lo de julio estoy muy disgustado,por el,ya que me parece un tio fantastico,haciendo tantos modelos,mas de 3000 y todos a mano,sin usar el modelador,que en mi humilde opinion hace unos modelos pesimos,un saludo y espero vernos mas por este hilo.