Report of the J Wiki meeting of April 18, 2024
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robert therriault
Apr 23, 2024, 1:24:42 AMApr 23
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== Report of Meeting 2024-04-18 ==
Present: Ed Gottsman, Raul Miller, and Bob Therriault
Full transcripts of this meeting are now available on the its wiki page. https://code.jsoftware.com/wiki/Wiki/Report_of_Meeting_2024-04-18
1) A quick discussion about Jan Jacobs mapping of the wiki to SVG. Jan has been very generous in allowing us to use his work as a way to evaluate the categories of the wiki. This is a commercial application that he has developed, but he is interested in how the J Wiki might be used to further develop his application. Ed has looked at dendrograms http://www.sthda.com/english/wiki/beautiful-dendrogram-visualizations-in-r-5-must-known-methods-unsupervised-machine-learning and feels that a circular dendrogram would be a good space effective way to represent the information. Ed is hoping to have something that he can show at the next meeting. Bob clarified that this experiment is not attached to Jan's categorization scheme. Ed feels that the structure of the category trees has never really been shown and it may be interesting to include the number of pages in each category.
2) Bob talked about his work in the week with the template and trying to adapt the generated category tree to the grid display. The generated tree does not give a lot of options for reformulation. Instead the information of the category tree would be generated manually once for the template and then imported to the bottom of the page. A category page would have the page titles in the upper area, while the content pages would have their content in the upper area.
3) Raul posted a link into the chat to overcome the challenges of using Javascript in the development of the the wiki https://code.jsoftware.com/wiki/MediaWiki:Common.js. Raul also pointed out that on the wiki server J can be run against the database and that may be a path for future development. The actual interface for MediaWiki is in PHP. Raul also supplied a link to the layout of the database in Mediawiki https://www.mediawiki.org/wiki/Manual:Database_layout
4) Discussion of a stand-alone J Viewer. Raul reported a bug that he had seen in starting up a second J instance from JQt. The second instance should be independent, but it seems to be dependent on the first instance. Raul has reported this to Bill Lam and we will wait to see if Bill can clear up the bug and allow Ed to continue on with his development of the stand-alone J Wiki Viewer.
5) Bob talked about trying to incorporate the category trees into the template. Bob was considering using SVG in the templates to allow for a more interactive and responsive category tree. (Editor note: MediaWiki will allow SVG, but converts it to non-interactive png files, so this may not be useful for the wiki, but could still be useful for the J viewer.) Ed pointed out that hover based expansion can be very tricky because as the expansion moves things you end up hovering over a new area and creating unpredictably results. Bob wondered whether there was a way to do a fish-eye approach which allows you to remain centred over the area of interest. Ed feels that you would still see some of the same challenges and Bob may explore this. There was a quick discussion of tree-maps versus dendrograms. Bob wondered about ways to accommodate mobile devices and Ed warned against different experiences for different platforms.
6) Category discussion moved into the cloud categories that are not associated with the trees, but float free in the cloud. Ed thought that it is possible that Jan's work may provide a map of those disconnected categories. Bob felt that the quantitative information would enrich the qualitative approach that he had taken with his taxonomy. Bob felt that one of the things that is promising is that you can
build trees that organize existing documentation. Ed pointed out that the J wiki has enough information and organizing it is the challenge.
For access to previous meeting reports https://code.jsoftware.com/wiki/Wiki_Development If you would like to participate in the development of the J wiki please contact us on the J forum and we will get you an invitation to the next J wiki meeting held on Thursdays at 23:00 (UTC) Next meeting is April 25, 2024.
Present: Ed Gottsman, Raul Miller, and Bob Therriault
Full transcripts of this meeting are now available on the its wiki page. https://code.jsoftware.com/wiki/Wiki/Report_of_Meeting_2024-04-18
1) A quick discussion about Jan Jacobs mapping of the wiki to SVG. Jan has been very generous in allowing us to use his work as a way to evaluate the categories of the wiki. This is a commercial application that he has developed, but he is interested in how the J Wiki might be used to further develop his application. Ed has looked at dendrograms http://www.sthda.com/english/wiki/beautiful-dendrogram-visualizations-in-r-5-must-known-methods-unsupervised-machine-learning and feels that a circular dendrogram would be a good space effective way to represent the information. Ed is hoping to have something that he can show at the next meeting. Bob clarified that this experiment is not attached to Jan's categorization scheme. Ed feels that the structure of the category trees has never really been shown and it may be interesting to include the number of pages in each category.
2) Bob talked about his work in the week with the template and trying to adapt the generated category tree to the grid display. The generated tree does not give a lot of options for reformulation. Instead the information of the category tree would be generated manually once for the template and then imported to the bottom of the page. A category page would have the page titles in the upper area, while the content pages would have their content in the upper area.
3) Raul posted a link into the chat to overcome the challenges of using Javascript in the development of the the wiki https://code.jsoftware.com/wiki/MediaWiki:Common.js. Raul also pointed out that on the wiki server J can be run against the database and that may be a path for future development. The actual interface for MediaWiki is in PHP. Raul also supplied a link to the layout of the database in Mediawiki https://www.mediawiki.org/wiki/Manual:Database_layout
4) Discussion of a stand-alone J Viewer. Raul reported a bug that he had seen in starting up a second J instance from JQt. The second instance should be independent, but it seems to be dependent on the first instance. Raul has reported this to Bill Lam and we will wait to see if Bill can clear up the bug and allow Ed to continue on with his development of the stand-alone J Wiki Viewer.
5) Bob talked about trying to incorporate the category trees into the template. Bob was considering using SVG in the templates to allow for a more interactive and responsive category tree. (Editor note: MediaWiki will allow SVG, but converts it to non-interactive png files, so this may not be useful for the wiki, but could still be useful for the J viewer.) Ed pointed out that hover based expansion can be very tricky because as the expansion moves things you end up hovering over a new area and creating unpredictably results. Bob wondered whether there was a way to do a fish-eye approach which allows you to remain centred over the area of interest. Ed feels that you would still see some of the same challenges and Bob may explore this. There was a quick discussion of tree-maps versus dendrograms. Bob wondered about ways to accommodate mobile devices and Ed warned against different experiences for different platforms.
6) Category discussion moved into the cloud categories that are not associated with the trees, but float free in the cloud. Ed thought that it is possible that Jan's work may provide a map of those disconnected categories. Bob felt that the quantitative information would enrich the qualitative approach that he had taken with his taxonomy. Bob felt that one of the things that is promising is that you can
build trees that organize existing documentation. Ed pointed out that the J wiki has enough information and organizing it is the challenge.
For access to previous meeting reports https://code.jsoftware.com/wiki/Wiki_Development If you would like to participate in the development of the J wiki please contact us on the J forum and we will get you an invitation to the next J wiki meeting held on Thursdays at 23:00 (UTC) Next meeting is April 25, 2024.
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