(#862) Wrong skeleton mapping

[Lamppost VFX]

Submitted on Tuesday, September 27, 2022 - 14:10
Submitted by anonymous user: 212.170.48.86
Submitted values are:

First Name: Ariadna
Last Name: Ollé
Company: Lamppost VFX
Status: Customer
Email: ollea...@gmail.com
Emails to CC:
Golaem Version: 8.1
Maya Version: 2022
Python Version:
OS: Windows
Distribution:
Renderer:
Other DCC:
Subject: Wrong skeleton mapping
Attachment:
https://golaem.com/sites/default/files/webform/Pigeon_Screenshots.zip
Details:
Good morning,
We are experiencing some issues while trying to remap the joint structure we
created for a pigeon into the Golaem Character Maker, we hope you can provide
some solution or suggestion.

Our problem arises the moment we need our character to fold its wings, since
we need to animate the feathers as fingers in order to adapt their postion to
the body. We tried several joint hierarchy options till we decided to rig the
feathers as effectors connected to a limb in order to be more close to a
basic Golaem Mapping. And, despite we can export the Golaem Character
correctly rigged and skinned as an Entity, some parts seem not to be
operating right.

The feathers seem not to be capturing any animation (we attach an image of
our charcater in fold wings position comparing the Maya animated posing with
Golaem Population Entity result). The feathers (effectors) do not seem to be
picking responding to the motion we created to achieve that pose.
As well it looks like the limbs break its curvature in its T-Pose (we attach
as well an image comparing both Spread Wings Character: Maya version vs
Golaem Entity result).
In order to facilitate the understanding of our process we provide, as well,
a capture of the joint hierarchy we created from Maya and the Skeleton
Mapping Structure created from the Golaem Character Maker.

If there is a more eficent skeleton hierarchy for this character, we are open
to ideas. Please keep in mind that we are only testing the wings (we knew
this is the trickiest part), so we haven't create nodes for the neck and head
yet.

Thanks in advance for your help!

Ariadna Ollé and Gerard Casas
Lamppost VFX


The results of this submission may be viewed at:
https://golaem.com/node/250/submission/6483

[Nicolas Chaverou]

Hey Ariadna,

Before going further, could you try rendering those scenerios

As our Entity Geometry Display is GPU based, we can have some limitations on the number of bones we can take into account for skinnin

At rendering time, those limitations do not exist anymore

If you still have the issue, could you send the assets so we can take a look?

Best,

---

 
+33 (0)2 99 27 21 44
http://www.golaem.com

--
Note that crowd...@golaem.com is a public list.
If for any reason (confidential project, sending production files...) you need to post a private message to Golaem Support, please use http://support.golaem.com
---
You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "Golaem List" group.
To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to crowd-list+...@golaem.com.
To view this discussion on the web visit https://groups.google.com/a/golaem.com/d/msgid/crowd-list/20220927121057.AF3BB618A6%40cluster023.hosting.ovh.net.

[Yann Pinczon du Sel]

Hi there,

Adding a few details, but still waiting for more info from your side to get further.

• the posture used by golaem when no animation is played is not the Tpose, but a fully extended limbs pose, so the Tpose problem is not really a problem. If you want to see the Tpose, you have to save an animation of your Tpose and replay it
• from your screenshot, the golaem mapping seems quite fine (and the animation should definitely be saved correctly), but we can't see what bone are really mapped where from a screenshot, so we'll need at least to see the gcha to tell you more about it.

Note that this is a public list, if your assets are sensitive, you can send them on our private support address: sup...@golaem.com.

Keep us posted about this.

Best,

Yann

DIRECT  +33 (0)2 99 27 21 44
MAIN    +33 (0)2 99 27 21 40
 
yann.pin...@golaem.com
http://www.golaem.com

To view this discussion on the web visit https://groups.google.com/a/golaem.com/d/msgid/crowd-list/CAFS5DCbciH%2BP-t8qHaTftr%3D%2B7ho80VCkAe7NmztLmESsx%3D9rpw%40mail.gmail.com.

[Ariadna Olle]

Hi Yann and Nicolas,

Thanks for the interest about our issue and for the tips you did send us. We are sending you a private message with our files attached.

We've solved some of the previous issues, but we are still stacked at one particular point... we seem to have a functional rig that allow us to transfer the character from Maya skeleton to the Golaem Character file, we can also export the animations properly (we attach both .gcha and .gmo files and the current maya Tpose rig). Those files seem to work properly, we can easily connect the Maya Skeleton structure to the Golaem Character, and the rig is properly weighted to avoid undesired geometry collisions.

But apparently when we create an entity with those files (the golaem character + the maya rig + the motion golaem file) the resulting golaem entities are not aperating as the maya animated file. We are not sure if the problems has to do with the skinning, but it seems that the extremities and feathers of the entities do not pick the weights that we defined from the maya rig (we attach as well the maya scene with the fwind folding animation, and two playblasts that show the difference between the original maya animation and the golaem entity motion... as you can see in the resulting Golaem file at some point symmetry is lost, and feathers make strange collisions with the body).

Thanks in advance! We appreciate any suggestion you can provide!

El dia dilluns, 3 d’octubre de 2022 a les 15:52:16 UTC+2, Yann Pinczon du Sel va escriure:

[Nicolas Chaverou]

Hey Ariadna

Posting my previous message :)

Before going further, could you try rendering those scenarios?

As our Entity Geometry Display is GPU based, we can have some limitations on the number of bones we can take into account for skinning in the viewport

At rendering time, those limitations do not exist anymore

If rendering produces the same result, we'll check the files

Best,

Best,

---

 
+33 (0)2 99 27 21 44
http://www.golaem.com

To view this discussion on the web visit https://groups.google.com/a/golaem.com/d/msgid/crowd-list/daa1646f-841a-4bd7-8d98-9210f46ec7e7n%40golaem.com.

[Ariadna Olle]

Hello Nicolas,

Sure! I am attaching you some images and render pases for a better understanding (please consider we are not working with shaders yet; so Golaem instances are the ones in orange and the original pigeon is the one in full texture display).

Thank you!

Ariadna

Missatge de Nicolas Chaverou <nicolas....@golaem.com> del dia dt., 4 d’oct. 2022 a les 19:01:

[Yann Pinczon du Sel]

Hey there,

Well, the long answer is on the private support ticket, but for people on the list that might deal with the same problems, here is the short answer.

The animation contains translation animation on some bones (which was detected and displayed in the character maker interface and maya log):

// Error: [GolaemSDK]: Some joints' animation seems not to be compatible with forward kinematic animation.

The best way to deal with such animation in Golaem Crowd (for now) is to use blind data animations, as explained here: https://golaem.com/content/doc/golaem-crowd-documentation/using-blind-data-store-more-accurate-animations

Best regards,

Yann.

DIRECT  +33 (0)2 99 27 21 44
MAIN    +33 (0)2 99 27 21 40
 
yann.pin...@golaem.com
http://www.golaem.com

[Ariadna Olle]

Hello Yann and Nicolas,

Thank you very much for your feedback, we did read it but we were busy with other projects and we didn't have time to put it to practice yet. As soon as we go back to this, we'll keep you updated.

Again, thanks for the amazing and detailed support.

Gerard and Ariadna

Lamppost VFX

El dia divendres, 7 d’octubre de 2022 a les 10:48:55 UTC+2, Yann Pinczon du Sel va escriure: