Mocap Conversion Problems

[Gerard Wills]

Hey guys,
I have bought some mocap data to use as motion behaviors for my Golaem crowd.
I used 3dsMax to import and convert to .FBX (using your guide on converting Rocketbox characters).
However, I simply exported with the mocap animation applied (this example is a man not in default pose).
I've followed all the tutorials and reference guide inside and out and can't work out what I'm doing wrong.

When I go to process my character, I get a lot of issues with the legs in general (including uneven footsteps).
I've refined the Conversion Factor down to 0.05 to eliminate the red in the Golaem Conversion Quality indicator.
Everything is green except for the two legs.
Error report as follows:

// Error: [GolaemCharacterMaker]: Some joints' animation seems not to be compatible with forward kinematic animation. Make sure there is no local Translate animation for the following frame/joint:

Frame: 82, bone: Walk_2_Bip01FBXASC032Footsteps, position error: 5.45408

Frame: 83, bone: Walk_2_Bip01FBXASC032Footsteps, position error: 5.45013

Frame: 66, bone: Walk_2_Bip01FBXASC032Footsteps, position error: 5.24832

Frame: 67, bone: Walk_2_Bip01FBXASC032Footsteps, position error: 5.24729

Frame: 84, bone: Walk_2_Bip01FBXASC032Footsteps, position error: 5.10187

Frame: 65, bone: Walk_2_Bip01FBXASC032Footsteps, position error: 4.82761

Frame: 98, bone: Walk_2_Bip01FBXASC032Footsteps, position error: 4.73011

Frame: 68, bone: Walk_2_Bip01FBXASC032Footsteps, position error: 4.72633

Frame: 50, bone: Walk_2_Bip01FBXASC032Footsteps, position error: 4.653

Frame: 81, bone: Walk_2_Bip01FBXASC032Footsteps, position error: 4.60853

Frame: 99, bone: Walk_2_Bip01FBXASC032Footsteps, position error: 4.52774

(and 465 more) //

...

// Error: [GolaemCharacterMaker]: Some joints' animation were not correctly converted by Golaem:

Frame: 0, bone: Walk_2_Bip01FBXASC032LFBXASC032Toe0, position error: 2.22583. Tip: If this is the first error, consider adding a spine or limb before the bone Walk_2_Bip01FBXASC032LFBXASC032Toe0 in the skeleton mapping, to make sure that animation before this node will be taken into account. If There was already an error before, then this one may be a consequence of the previous one

(and 580 more) //

Is it not computing right because of the odd pose and shape of skeleton?
Do I need to set a Bind Pose?
Or can I simply apply my mocap data straight onto the default crowd character from the Samples Pack?

Thank you anyone, been stuck on this for days and weeks now!
Much appreciation if anyone can help!

[Alexandre Pillon]

Hi Gerard,

Which .gcha did you load before importing the motion? Are you trying to directly load the motion on the .gcha provided in the samples?

Actually you need to create a .gcha corresponding to your mocap data (http://golaem.com/content/doc/golaem-crowd-documentation/converting-skeleton), then load the motions on this character and save it as .gmo

Finally, when playing these motions on our crowdMan .gcha, you will (maybe, if the automatic mode is not working) need a motion mapping file

Cheers,

Alex

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[Gerard Wills]

Hey Alex,

I'm using the default crowdMan.gcha to apply my mocap data onto.
I don't really need specific models, the included samples could work just fine.

Except, after the following the steps of the link you sent me, I load the motion from the skeleton but that's when the errors appear as listed above.
So I can't even save a .gmo because of these errors and shows a lot of red under Golaem Conversion Quality. Doesn't look good at all and don't understand what I'm doing wrong! 

[Nicolas Chaverou]

Hi Gerard,

Can you share the motion you're speaking about ?

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[Gerard Wills]

Hey Nicolas,
At your request. I'm thinking maybe I need to open crowdMan.fbx in 3ds Max, create biped, skin to crowdMan, export as .fbx (baking animation)?

[Nicolas Chaverou]

Hi there,

Nop. One of the biggest advantage of using Golaem Crowd is that we can do motion retargeting on the fly. Whatever the motion, whatever the character, we can always play the animation.

To make it work, you just need to define properly the motion skeleton in Golaem and it's gonna be enough.

Just send us your mocap data and we'll show you

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On Tue, May 19, 2015 at 6:28 PM, Gerard Wills <amadamdir...@gmail.com> wrote:

Hey Nicolas,
At your request. I'm thinking maybe I need to open crowdMan.fbx in 3ds Max, create biped, skin to crowdMan, export as .fbx (baking animation)?

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[Yann Pinczon du Sel]

Hello there,

With a .bip file, the process to follow to create the .gcha file is the same as explained here: http://golaem.com/content/doc/golaem-crowd-documentation/using-rocketbox-characters-motions

Once you get the .gcha corresponding to your animation, the method to produce the .gmo is explained here: http://golaem.com/content/doc/golaem-crowd-documentation/motions-gmo

Cheers,

Yann.

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[Gerard Wills]

Hey guys,

Thank you for the replies.

I'm pretty sure I get how the process works now as managed to successfully apply it to a crowd sim, except, you can see the problems I'm having in the Playblast.
(some entities jitter and the legs seem to blow out to the right, a weird curve affect).

I've attached the original problem (Golaem_Problem).
The second file (Golaem_Revision_0) was what I did just now where I played with the axis IK planes as it helped rule out any red in the Conversion Quality, though I had it set at minimal, and seem to look fine in the viewport.
However the scale of my animation is large, so maybe the scaling of the .gcha's via Entity attribute scale messed up the .gmo I've converted my mocap to?

My suspicion is that the mocap animation is on an odd axis so it's having a problem detecting which way is front when the skeleton is computed'?

Not sure if you needed my .gmo files and .gcha's.
Thanks again guys : )

[Nicolas Chaverou]

Hi there,

We do indeed.

 

Thanks again guys : )

[Gerard Wills]

As requested.

test2 files plug into the Revision file.
test files plug into the Original file.

Thank you!

[Gerard Wills]

AHA! I think I might know what it is.
The joints in the foot are sending the whole skeleton off I think. I think the problem is with the toes and toenubs. If I disable them and realign, I think that could work?
So it doesn't seem like the entities are "walking on stilts" because I noticed the first error came up about the toe joints.
Maybe it's something else? 

[Thomas François]

Hi Gerard,

I have been looking into your scene and it appears that the character have been made upon the animated one. 

In order to create a golem character you should put your character in bind pose to be able to correctly map the motion on it. I have created the Tpose by hand but you would have better results with the original character in Tpose.

http://golaem.com/content/doc/golaem-crowd-documentation/character-prerequisites

Yet the animation created with this character make the crowd man looking upwards... Thus to correct it it's possible to create a motion mapping file

Go into the motion mapping mode in the character maker open the motion you've just exported and double click on the limb you want to correct in this case the head and correct its pose.

Now you just have to assign it to your motion behavior.

Better now!

http://golaem.com/content/doc/golaem-crowd-documentation/character-main-concepts

I hope this helps!

PS: Again, you could have better results working with the original bind posed character!

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[Gerard Wills]

Thanks for your awesome post Thomas. It does help 

I don't know how I can tpose my character when I have the mocap data applied?
Is it something I should do in Max? I don't know how to pose a biped and keep the mocap data so it goes from tpose straight into the animation?

I'm using what comes with the samples pack, no customized crowd.
I've got the .gcha that comes with it, that's fine.
I just don't know how to blend a tpose of my biped with mocap data.
Really doing my head in, trying everything here but just not getting it.

[Thomas François]

Hi Gerard,

I don't know how I can tpose my character when I have the mocap data applied?
Is it something I should do in Max? I don't know how to pose a biped and keep the mocap data so it goes from tpose straight into the animation?

In fact I was assuming that you already had a character in bind pose somewhere.

You don't need to Tpose your character when the mocap is applied.

The correct workflow when you create an animation with a custom character would be to create your .gcha (character) with the character in bind pose then load another character (duplicated) with the mocap on it. Now the character maker go in motion mode and select the root of your animated character and click "Load motion from selection" it will compute a motion file based on the difference between your bind posed one (gcha) and your animated one.Then you will be able to save your gmo to be applied in a motion behavior or locomotion behavior.

Bests,

Thomas

[Nicolas Chaverou]

Hi Gerard,

FYI when we tried to convert the mocap motion you sent previously, we just manually reorient the animated skeleton so it looked like a tpose (similar to this http://golaem.com/content/doc/golaem-crowd-documentation/character-prerequisites)

We used that tpose, to create a gcha which is the representation of your mocap skeleton as a Golaem format.

It'll not be used in the simulation, it'll be used to convert every mocap relying on the same hierarchy to the Golaem Motion format.

Let us know if that still is unclear.

Best,

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[Gerard Wills]

Hey guys,
I think I'm nearly there but following your instructions...I had my .gcha loaded, selected the Bip01 root and went to load the motion only to say;
"Failed to load the selected motion!"
In the Script Editor it says, "The number of bones in the skeleton is different than the number of bones in the animation's postures"

Which they ain't because I'm using the exact same Rocketbox character to set up the .gcha as I am using a duplicate with the mocap data applied to translate across.
But keep getting this error.

[Gerard Wills]

Also, how do I create a .cam file? I can't find anything that saves a .cam. 

[Thomas François]

Hi Gerard,

Are you still using the same gcha and animated character you already send?

Watching your screenshoot or looks like the headbone is missing.

Best regards,

Thomas

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[Nicolas Chaverou]

Hey Gerard,

Ok nearly there.

Can you send us the source skeleton file, the gcha file you made and the motion you're converting ?

(I'm not at the office thus I can't access the previous files you've sent)

Cheers,

N

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<Maya 2015_Failed To Load Motion.jpg>

[Nicolas Chaverou]

Hey Gerard,

Were you able to figure out your issue ?

From the screenshot you sent, Character skeleton and Motion skeleton actually look different : as Thomas noticed the head bones are different and it seems to me that your Character Skeleton has a FloorRef bone which does not exist in the Motion skeleton:

Let us know if we can help,

Best,

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[Gerard Wills]

Hey guys! 
Yes I did solve it! THANK YOU!
Can fully convert characters quickly now I've done it that much haha. Makes so much sense now!
The head issue wasn't an issue at all in the end, that's how it's meant to be from the mocap (the motion of looking up and walking to it).

Except I have some problem now trying to get the Previz Rendering Type to work. 
I load my first character as an entity, set to Previz (tried both From Maya Scene and FBX) but get these two errors;
[GolaemVisualization]: Bone count in FBX (43) is inferior than bone count in Golaem skeleton (44)  // 

// Error: [GolaemCrowd]: FBX File not loaded C:/Users/4THDPC/Documents/maya/projects/default/export/Golaem_Townsfolk_Final/Final/FBX/casual01_m.FBX // 

// Error: [GolaemCrowd]: The Fbx File 'casual01_m.FBX' assigned to Entity '0' could not be loaded! Assign a valid Fbx file or create one. /

&

// Error: [GolaemVisualization]: Skeleton root node (Bip01) not found in FBX. FBX not loaded.  // 

// Error: [GolaemCrowd]: FBX File not loaded C:/Users/4THDPC/Documents/maya/projects/default/export/Golaem_Townsfolk_Final/Final/FBX/casual01_m.FBX // 

// Error: [GolaemCrowd]: The Fbx File 'casual01_mm.FBX' assigned to Entity '0' could not be loaded! Assign a valid Fbx file or create one. // 

[Thomas François]

Hey guys! 

Hi Gerard!

 

Yes I did solve it! THANK YOU!
Can fully convert characters quickly now I've done it that much haha. Makes so much sense now!

The head issue wasn't an issue at all in the end, that's how it's meant to be from the mocap (the motion of looking up and walking to it).

Great news!

 

Except I have some problem now trying to get the Previz Rendering Type to work. 
I load my first character as an entity, set to Previz (tried both From Maya Scene and FBX) but get these two errors;
[GolaemVisualization]: Bone count in FBX (43) is inferior than bone count in Golaem skeleton (44)  // 

// Error: [GolaemCrowd]: FBX File not loaded C:/Users/4THDPC/Documents/maya/projects/default/export/Golaem_Townsfolk_Final/Final/FBX/casual01_m.FBX // 

// Error: [GolaemCrowd]: The Fbx File 'casual01_m.FBX' assigned to Entity '0' could not be loaded! Assign a valid Fbx file or create one. /

Mmmm... It looks like there is a difference between your golaem character and the fbx you have exported. One bone is missing. Go back to the scene you used to create your gcha. Unload your fbx.

You will have to export your fbx again. (while selecting all your character geometry and bones)

Here is some documentation explaining the process:

http://www.golaem.com/content/doc/golaem-crowd-documentation/geometry-file-fbx#exportinggeometry

// Error: [GolaemVisualization]: Skeleton root node (Bip01) not found in FBX. FBX not loaded.  // 

// Error: [GolaemCrowd]: FBX File not loaded C:/Users/4THDPC/Documents/maya/projects/default/export/Golaem_Townsfolk_Final/Final/FBX/casual01_m.FBX // 

// Error: [GolaemCrowd]: The Fbx File 'casual01_mm.FBX' assigned to Entity '0' could not be loaded! Assign a valid Fbx file or create one. // 

This error should be fix with the first one.

Tell me it it solves the problem.

Best regards,

Thomas,

 

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