Trailer tires

[Ann]

I know this is a well discussed topic to search the archive for, but I'm on this &?'%*| iPad that thinks for me and takes forever to do basics, grrrrrr
Ok, my question: Trailer tires for a 2002, three horse gooseneck with a six ft short wall. I'm about to take a cross country trip and need new tires. Present tires are Goodyear Wrangler HT LT215/85R16 M+S E.
My mechanic recommends Firestone Transforce HT.
Any thoughts from tire aficionados? The Goodyears have been awesome tires, actually original rubber!
Thanks!

Sent from my iPad

[Carla Richardson]

You want trailer tires, not truck tires.  Trailer tires have stronger side walls.

The tires your mechanic is recommending are light truck tires.  No way would I put truck tires on a trailer.  I know a lot of people do.  Buy the best trailer tire you can afford.

I drive and haul a lot, and in 10 years of pulling a trailer across the west ov ed had exactly one flat tire.

Carla Richardson

--
--
You received this message because you are subscribed to ride...@endurance.net

To post to this group, send email to ride...@endurance.net
To unsubscribe from this group, send email to:       ridecamp+u...@endurance.net
For more options, visit this group at
http://groups.google.com/a/endurance.net/group/ridecamp?hl=en

To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to ridecamp+u...@endurance.net.

[Ann]

Hi Carla,

Thanks so much for your reply! Do you mind telling what tire you use? Have called the mechanic to stop the order. 

Sent from my iPad

[Carla Richardson]

Here's just one brand, Cooper tires are excellent.  These are trailer tires, not truck tires.  Trailer tires have the designation "ST" in their name, you can look for that.

http://roadmastertires.com/by-position/trailer.aspx

Carla Richardson

[Carla Richardson]

This is what is on my trailer, I have a 2 horse bumper pull, so much lighter than your trailer, keep that in mind.

The load range is very important.  My tires are Load range D.  Here's a link to the tires I have, mine as re the ones with 65 psi, about 4th down on the chart.  You may need load range E, I don't know.

http://www.herculestire.com/tire-gallery/commercial/specialty/power-str/#loaded

Carla Richardson

[Dr. Marie Feuer / Life Path Healings]

I am a safety net. I have a very lightweight small stock trailer to Horse and I use E Class tires

[Ed & Wendy Hauser]

On 10/5/2015 11:39 AM, Carla Richardson wrote:

  Here's a link to the tires I have, mine as re the ones with 65 psi, about 4th down on the chart.  You may need load range E, I don't know.

One thing to remember:  To get the benefit of higher load range you need to inflate the tires at the maximum on the sidewall.  After a number of problems I just switched to load range G, Goodyear, ST tires.   They allow pressures up to 110 psi, 30 psi above the 80 psi on E tires.  I go with 100 psi because my compressor won't go that high.

Heat buildup from sidewall flexing is what kills tires.  More air pressure and stiffer sidewalls are the cure.

Ed

--
Ed & Wendy Hauser
5729 175th Ave.
Becker, MN 55308

Ed: (406) 381-5527
Wendy: (406) 544-2926

[Carla Richardson]

I always keep my tires inflated to maximum pressure, truck and trailer.  You are correct, Ed.

One problem I have found is that most tire service and auto service places will deliberately under inflate tires.  They say it gives a softer ride.  I do not want a softer ride, I want maximum inflation for better gas mileage, tire life, and better handling.  Under inflation feels soggy.

Check your tires cold, btw.

Carla Richardson

--

[Truman Prevatt]

Here is a good reference to the difference between LT and ST and why the difference. 

http://www.tirerack.com/tires/tiretech/techpage.jsp?techid=219

Here is a good link on load range and inflation.

https://az184419.vo.msecnd.net/schneider-trucks/PDF/maintenance/TireLoadRangeGvsH.pdf 

The one thing to note is the weights listed on the tires require inflation to the max inflation levels, 110 PSI for load range G.  

And I agree with Ed, load rate G is well worth the difference in cost and they are soon paid for after the first blow out on a long trip in the hot summer. 

Truman

__
“What is objectionable, what is dangerous about extremists is not that they are extreme, but that they are intolerant. The evil is not what they say about their cause, but what they say about their opponents.”  Robert F. Kennedy

You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "RidecampRedistributed" group.
To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to ridecampredistri...@googlegroups.com.
For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/d/optout.

[Carla Richardson]

On a big trailer I would definitely go with a Load G but on mine the D level works very well.

Carla Richardson

[Shannon Chastain]

For what it’s worth I agree with Carla! I live near an interstate and have a friend in town with a tow truck says he makes his living off of people that put truck tires on their trailers and pull their trailers with ½ trucks.

[Roger Ward]

You might also want to think about the high pressure comments.  They are putting short term gas mileage over the well being of their horses and over the long term wear of the tires.   Over inflating tires above what is needed to support the load weight results in premature wear of the center tread and results it a harsh ride for your horses.  

Personally I want the tire pressure that will distribute the weight of the loaded trailer over the face of the tire.   Lower pressure will wear out the side tread of the tire and higher pressure will wear out the center tread of the tire.  For my rig (3h steel Logan stock side GN), that is about 45 - 50 PSI.  The lower pressure also reduces the shock and vibration on my horses legs.  I can buy another trailer in just a few weeks.  What I can't do is buy another horse.  It has taken me months to years to build up my string of horses to be tough reliable mountain horses that live in the flat central valley.  I am not going to put gas mileage over the well being of my horses.  That is just penny wise and pound foolish.

If its good gas mileage that that is wanted, then switch tire size to the 14.5-9 lowboy tires.  Wind resistance consumes much more gas than rolling resistance from the tires..  The shorter tire allows you to lower the trailer at the goose neck and reduce your frontal area.  Lowering your trailer will save you a lot more gas than over inflating your tires

You are all ready hooked on one of the most expensive sports you can be in.  Don't cheep out now.  Think first of what is best for your horse.

Roger Ward

Acampo, CA

[Carla Richardson]

Roger,

I am definitely thinking of safety for myself and my horse.  Gas mileage is not why I inflate my tires, lol, although it certainly is a nice byproduct.  I do not over inflate; I inflate cold tires to the recommended maximum pressure.  My tires on both truck and trailer wear well, and my truck and trailer roll easily and handle well, no sway.  Under inflated tires overheat, can blow out, cause trailer sway, and reduce your ability to maneuver in an emergency.  It also causes your truck to work harder to pull the load.

I probably drive more than most endurance riders, perhaps barring the professional riders/trainers who relocate  back and forth across the country routinely.  My truck has almost 300,000 miles since 2008, and the majority all of those miles are towing miles.  My tires wear evenly.  The tires on my truck have exceeded their warranty of 55,000 miles. I'm going to replace them in a few weeks, but they're still good for another long trip; my tire shop mechanic just checked them last week.  Cooper tires, really good truck tires.

As far as hurting a horse with bounce and shock, my horse Khid has over 11,000 endurance miles, and I can't even imagine how many highway trailering miles.  His legs are great.  And he was in a little, old, 2h bp trailer.  I would have loved to put him in a big LQ trailer, but I didn't have the truck to pull one, couldn't afford a giant rig.  But what I did do was stop and let him out to walk around, pee, relax every time I'd stop to get gas.  I definitely took care of my horse.

Carla

--

[Ed & Wendy Hauser]

On 10/6/2015 7:33 AM, 'Roger Ward' via ridecamp at Endurance.Net wrote:

ou might also want to think about the high pressure comments.  They are putting short term gas mileage over the well being of their horses and over the long term wear of the tires.   Over inflating tires above what is needed to support the load weight results in premature wear of the center tread and results it a harsh ride for your horses.

That is true, but I suspect that many (most?) trailer manufacturers are not honest when sizing tires for their trailers.  We are talking horse trailers here, often with LQ's.  To specifically recommend tire size and inflation you would have to load the trailer with the maximum number of large horses, hay, and stuff in the LQ, then weigh the whole thing.  I doubt the manufacturers do this.  They do have to put a GVW sticker on the unit.  If you weighed your loaded trailer and found it to be heavier than that they could claim it was your fault for "overloading" the unit.  By putting smaller, lower load range, tires on the unit they save money.

Even if you had weighed the unit and were under or more likely very near the load limit of the tires, you would have no practical recourse to the tire manufacturer.  They would claim that their "scientific" tests showed that the tire was under inflated.  How could you "prove" otherwise?  Read about the final results of the exploding Firestone tires on pickups.

I switched to range G tires after two separate instances of blown tires.  They were both under 5 years old, and inflated cold to the maximum on the sidewall.  I do check pressure every morning before driving.  I would rather have a bit harsher ride for the horses than have another blowout on I 90 in the MT mountains. 

[Laney Humphrey]

Roger, I drove a 4 wheel drive pickup which meant my LQ always rode
front end high. I even raised the LQ's axles hoping to level it.
That helped a bit. lower tires on the trailer would have made that
problem worse. My horses never seemed to suffer, even on cross
country hauls but I'm sure riding level would have been more
comfortable for them. Laney 12921

[Nathan Hoyt]

Roger is absolutely correct.  Fill tires to the inflation on the capacity plate of the trailer.  This is provides the best tire life for the trailer's capacity.  Higher or lower pressures will just chew up tires and hurt performance.  The give of the tire sidewall at recommended pressure is considered when calculating the torsion axle or spring to carry a given load.

This is a tangent, but here goes anyway.  I only recently learned that trailer tires aren't commonly balanced.  I can't help but suspect that the constant vibration of an out of balance tire would increase the fatigue of a horse after trailering.  I imagine under the best conditions it would be like standing on a vibrating sawdust floor that constantly tilts forward, backward, left and right.  Any extra vibration should increase the effect.  It seems I'd have to tense a lot more core muscles to keep my feet under me and stay centered in my slant.  I can't prove this is, but I need to have my wife tow me in the trailer for a few miles to see how my trailer rides.

Nate

Mostly harmless.

--

[Karen Sullivan]

another thing to check- CLEARANCE between tire and trailer wall.
Often it is not very much and if your tire defalts, it could
rub......happened to me

On 10/6/15, 'Nathan Hoyt' via ridecamp at Endurance.Net

> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups
> "RidecampRedistributed" group.

> To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an

[Ed & Wendy Hauser]

I do not have a reference handy but the old advice that tire wear patterns show under/over inflation goes back to the days, remembered only by us old farts, when tires were bias ply.  In these days of steel belted radial tires the tread wear pattern produces much less information on inflation level.

[Ann]

Lots of information being shared. Thank you! 

I'd like to take a poll:

Which is on your rig right now, truck or trailer tires? Brand and specs? Some have already shared, just wondering about others following this thread. Thanks!

Sent from my iPad

--

[Dolores Arste]

I have a 2002 Jamco 3 horse with a 7' short wall. My trailer came with Goodyear Wrangler HT LT215/85R16. They are/were great tires so when it came time to change I put the same tires on. 

I read what everyone said about trailer tires etc. But, I've had great luck with these. Go figure. 

Warmly,

Dolores

[Julie Hart]

THank you for all this good information.  It made me go out and check my tires.  I noticed the side wall says max weight 2,120 pounds.  What does this mean?  Surely it doesn't mean I can only carry that much weight?  If it does, I need to get tires rated for more weight!

[Ed & Wendy Hauser]

On 10/7/2015 8:25 AM, Julie Hart wrote:

I noticed the side wall says max weight 2,120 pounds

Yes, but per tire.  Assuming that your trailer has 4 tires that is 8480 lbs if tires are inflated to the max (cold) on the sidewall.  If the trailer is a bumper pull ~10% of the weight will be on the truck, not the tires so the total weight will be 9422 lbs.  If the trailer is a goose neck ~50% will be on the tires.

In reality the only way to be really, really sure is to load your truck and trailer up like you were going to a ride, drive to a truck scale, weigh with only the truck on the scale, with only the trailer on the scale, and with it all on the scale.  If done right truck + trailer = truck and trailer weight.  This gives you a check on the individual weights.

Armed with this information you can figure out what load range tires and inflation is the minimum for your rig.  Personally, I wouldn't want to be close to overloaded.

[Julie Hart]

Thanks Ed,  I have a steel 2 horse/dressing room gooseneck and I just added some cabinets, sink, metal tack box, etc. that has increased the weight.  I will take it to scale to get it weighed, great idea!  If I understand you correctly, 4 tires on a gooseneck means the tires are rated for 12,720 pounds (2120 x 4 x 50% = 4240 + 8480) since 50% of the weight is on the truck.

Julie

--

[Teddy Lancaster]

I would not assume that 50% of the weight is on the truck. The length of the trailer, the accessories (such as an LQ) may make a huge difference.
Weigh your trailer (hooked up is OK) with JUST the trailer wheels on the scale. If the result is MORE than the 8420 YOU ARE OVERLOADED!  PERIOD!

For instance: I have a HUGE trailer (50 foot) towed with a Freightliner FL70.  On the Cat Scale I get these readings: Truck front axle: 9,000#, Truck rear axle: $12,000#, Trailer (tri-axle) $20,000#  ALL of my trailer tires are 16" Load range G rated at  3750 each.  (total is then 22500# max trailer capacity.)  My VIN plate reads 21,000 axle load capacity. But I put on 3 8,000# axles, so the trailer load capacity is now $24,000.

This is an interesting formula (see attached). It is the calculation for FET tax rating. Easy to do the calculation (see attached). My Vin Plate says $21,000 but the calculation told me my capacity is 28,000# .   I switched axles to 3 x  8,000# and have 6 tires all load range G (Sailun 637's)  rated 3750# each for a total of 22,500#.

BEWARE of manufacturers ratings.  In order to avoid FET the RV (included horse trailers) industary has been "allowed" to put the GVWR UNDER 28,000 fo their customer would not have to pay FET (sure would hurt the recreational trailer industry and you would be required to cross truck scales in many states.  My "hitch" weight (what rests on the truck) is just under 6000#.  So the GVWR on the VIN plate means next to nothing in reality as my  truck & trailer actually weighs over 40,000#! (and yes it is LEGAL!)

To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to ridecamp+u...@endurance.net.

--

Teddy Lancaster
RUNNING BEAR
3404 Carl Allred Rd.
Franklinville, NC 27248
800-533-2327

There is no better example of duping the American public in the history of the country than Obamacare.
As Levin noted on his program, Washington ought to feel fortunate that Americans are as tolerant of corruption as they are.

Learn more: http://www.naturalnews.com/047619_Obamacare_government_transparency_American_voters.html#ixzz3IpFfDnKY

[Teddy Lancaster]

Weigh your trailer loaded.  (Just the trailer, just keep the truck OFF the scale.) There are Cat Scales at many truck stops, or try a gravel yard...

If you have 4 tires: 8420 is the MAX weight you should see. (actually being under is far better)
There should be a Vin plate on the trailer with weight ratings. Most will tell you what the load rating is as well as other important information.
SAMPLE below
See TIRES: the "G" is the load range for the recommended tire size. Tires are rated by weight capacity.


Also see: http://www.worktruckonline.com/article/story/2007/07/how-to-determine-tire-load-ratings.aspx

--

--
You received this message because you are subscribed to ride...@endurance.net
 
To post to this group, send email to ride...@endurance.net
To unsubscribe from this group, send email to: ridecamp+u...@endurance.net
For more options, visit this group at
http://groups.google.com/a/endurance.net/group/ridecamp?hl=en

To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to ridecamp+u...@endurance.net.

[Lisa Salas]

Goodyear G614 RST LT2/ 85R16 load range G on my 29 foot 3/horse with full living quarters. They have served us very well.

[Teddy Lancaster]

I, too used the Goodyear G614 for decades. I found that the Sailon G637 last longer and are about $100 less per tire!

--

[Teddy Lancaster]

Weigh your trailer loaded.  (Just the trailer, just keep the truck OFF the scale.) There are Cat Scales at many truck stops, or try a gravel yard...

If you have 4 tires: 8420 is the MAX weight you should see. (actually being under is far better)
There should be a Vin plate on the trailer with weight ratings. Most will tell you what the load rating is as well as other important information.
SAMPLE below
See TIRES: the "G" is the load range for the recommended tire size. Tires are rated by weight capacity.


Also see: http://www.worktruckonline.com/article/story/2007/07/how-to-determine-tire-load-ratings.aspx

On 10/7/2015 9:25 AM, Julie Hart wrote:

THank you for all this good information.  It made me go out and check my tires.  I noticed the side wall says max weight 2,120 pounds.  What does this mean?  Surely it doesn't mean I can only carry that much weight?  If it does, I need to get tires rated for more weight!

 Monday, October 5, 2015 at 11:42:36 AM UTC-4, tailtothewind wrote:

I know this is a well discussed topic to search the archive for, but I'm on this &?'%*| iPad that thinks for me and takes forever to do basics, grrrrrr

Ok, my question: Trailer tires for a 2002, three horse gooseneck with a six ft short wall. I'm about to take a cross country trip and need new tires. Present tires are Goodyear Wrangler HT LT215/85R16 M+S  E.

My mechanic recommends Firestone Transforce HT.
Any thoughts from tire aficionados? The Goodyears have been awesome tires, actually original rubber!
Thanks!

Sent from my iPad

--

--
You received this message because you are subscribed to ride...@endurance.net

 

To post to this group, send email to ride...@endurance.net
To unsubscribe from this group, send email to: ridecamp+u...@endurance.net
For more options, visit this group at
http://groups.google.com/a/endurance.net/group/ridecamp?hl=en

To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to ridecamp+u...@endurance.net.

[Ed & Wendy Hauser]

On 10/7/2015 10:25 AM, Teddy Lancaster wrote:

I would not assume that 50% of the weight is on the truck.

Teddy is right.  I should have been more clear that both 10% and 50% figures were approximations (thus the ~ sign), and that if there is any doubt use the scales like Teddy and I suggest.

Ed

PS. Be safe out there!