Fwd: Significant Insurance Increase
FRED DE LANO
From: Glacier View Manager <man...@glacierviewmeadows.com>
Date: Fri, Jul 25, 2025, 9:35 AM
Subject: Re: Significant Insurance Increase
To: w.sch...@schroeder-law.org <w.sch...@schroeder-law.org>, ROBERT LEWIS <rlewis.c...@gmail.com>, Barbour, Dan <dan.b...@hpe.com>
Cc: William Hobbs <bi...@thehobbsfamily.us>, Michael O'Neill <onei...@msn.com>, Karen Murray <kdmcon...@gmail.com>, Joe Herrick <joe...@gmail.com>, Don Herman <Herm...@msn.com>, FRED DE LANO <fred.d...@gmail.com>, angelika...@yahoo.com <angelika...@yahoo.com>
Sent: Tuesday, July 22, 2025 2:55 PM
To: Glacier View Manager <man...@glacierviewmeadows.com>; 'ROBERT LEWIS' <rlewis.c...@gmail.com>; 'Barbour, Dan' <dan.b...@hpe.com>
Cc: 'William Hobbs' <bi...@thehobbsfamily.us>; 'Michael O'Neill' <onei...@msn.com>; 'Karen Murray' <kdmcon...@gmail.com>; 'Joe Herrick' <joe...@gmail.com>; 'Don Herman' <Herm...@msn.com>; 'FRED DE LANO' <fred.d...@gmail.com>; angelika...@yahoo.com <angelika...@yahoo.com>
Subject: RE: Significant Insurance Increase
WOW!! I’m plsd that we are not paying those premiums. Wayne
From: Glacier View Manager <man...@glacierviewmeadows.com>
Sent: Tuesday, July 22, 2025 2:23 PM
To: w.sch...@schroeder-law.org; 'ROBERT LEWIS' <rlewis.c...@gmail.com>; 'Barbour, Dan' <dan.b...@hpe.com>
Cc: 'William Hobbs' <bi...@thehobbsfamily.us>; 'Michael O'Neill' <onei...@msn.com>; 'Karen Murray' <kdmcon...@gmail.com>; 'Joe Herrick' <joe...@gmail.com>; 'Don Herman' <Herm...@msn.com>; 'FRED DE LANO' <fred.d...@gmail.com>; angelika...@yahoo.com
Subject: Re: Significant Insurance Increase
Understood. I'm still waiting on specifics from their managers, but, I dug through the budgets they posted online and assuming their published budgets are accurate, the totals are actually quite a bit MORE than $147,000.
Crystal W&S Insurance = $40,550
Crystal R&R Insurance = $133,018
I also found a list of the individual insurance providers they are using and they are many (but not all) of the same providers we are using.
I also confirmed both of Crystal Lakes entities are using the same broker we are, I can see their Certificate of Liability Insurance.
Below are all the links of where I got this information.
R&R Links:
Budget: (page 4 shows the line of what their budget and actual is for insurance) https://cdn.website-editor.net/s/04ac321caa78449ca3735a84ad2bb02d/files/uploaded/2025.05+Crystal+Lakes+Road+and+Rec+Financials_For+Posting.pdf?Expires=1755270407&Signature=hUsTvAtFyl7mhO5quClskpCbHH-NmOY2HPxTCTc8l0LsLqIW3eIRi-lNXxf1tHXE7gsSm-tab8x1rEwwIWaGEwkmiTYIRRldDOc~I27SFo8xSf~hT906QvIaj2xVJIsit851bYdwhIjbFO~-nk03Rx7TOBKLnvUbEv3rY8cJwRMta~8phsjSCsumHoUIjnQNZl08VEnL5GZD0uDz81s9zYmb~pj7WqWfte9Ey82qmPF1e1kUyp8dg~jpXAXfG4D1q4ccihb6EJyaRAMMXUlQ2VHGaW-vaaqNVD1O1adQgMKUGFPVDBVo9GKg933Y51ywjQdtdQGTXdJAAP7BVHb0lg__&Key-Pair-Id=K2NXBXLF010TJW
W&S Links:
Budget: (Page 1 shows their budget line for insurance) https://drive.google.com/drive/folders/1VYyI7lGT6gcuvhFNEVvB77lj1_he_1qA
(they do not have a list of providers like the R&R side)
Certificate of Liability (That shows the providers) https://drive.google.com/drive/folders/1f7ptnq6DzESK_qLWF3jFS1nKm-lI1ubf
From: w.sch...@schroeder-law.org <w.sch...@schroeder-law.org>
Sent: Tuesday, July 22, 2025 1:26 PM
To: Glacier View Manager <man...@glacierviewmeadows.com>; 'ROBERT LEWIS' <rlewis.c...@gmail.com>; 'Barbour, Dan' <dan.b...@hpe.com>
Cc: 'William Hobbs' <bi...@thehobbsfamily.us>; 'Michael O'Neill' <onei...@msn.com>; 'Karen Murray' <kdmcon...@gmail.com>;
'Joe Herrick' <joe...@gmail.com>; 'Don Herman' <Herm...@msn.com>; 'FRED DE LANO' <fred.d...@gmail.com>;
angelika...@yahoo.com <angelika...@yahoo.com>
Subject: RE: Significant Insurance Increase
I didn’t spend any time inquiring “which” Crystal Lakes entity was being searched. I just did Crystal Lakes in Larimer County and got the insurance cost that I sent to you. It was in Larimer County and it was Crystal Lakes. Or so that’s what my computer said. Wayne
From: Glacier View Manager <man...@glacierviewmeadows.com>
Sent: Tuesday, July 22, 2025 12:59 PM
To: w.sch...@schroeder-law.org; 'ROBERT LEWIS' <rlewis.c...@gmail.com>; 'Barbour, Dan' <dan.b...@hpe.com>
Cc: 'William Hobbs' <bi...@thehobbsfamily.us>; 'Michael O'Neill' <onei...@msn.com>; 'Karen Murray' <kdmcon...@gmail.com>;
'Joe Herrick' <joe...@gmail.com>; 'Don Herman' <Herm...@msn.com>; 'FRED DE LANO' <fred.d...@gmail.com>;
angelika...@yahoo.com
Subject: Re: Significant Insurance Increase
So is the total cost of the insurance coverage accurately listed in the Crystal Lakes website as $147,000? I don't know.
You might possibly inquire whether there is a breakdown of some sort, so that maybe we can compare some apples to some apples, or something like that.
As I said before, I'll pursue more specific details with both entities.
So after they “fully divorced their R&R and W&S,” as you wrote, their insurance cost is $147,000? I don't know. Yes, they completely separated their entities some number of years ago. They even have 2 completely different websites, so I'm not sure which website you pulled this figure off of, nor where on the website it was located. Each entity is tracking its own financials separately. They have 2 different offices at 2 different addresses on 2 different roads. They are completely separate.
Crystal W&S - https://clwater.org/
Crystal R&R - https://www.crystal-lakes.org/
I have a request in to the managers of both entities for a full breakdown of their insurance providers and costs.
Thanks,
Cav
From: w.sch...@schroeder-law.org <w.sch...@schroeder-law.org>
Sent: Tuesday, July 22, 2025 11:01 AM
To: Glacier View Manager <man...@glacierviewmeadows.com>;
'ROBERT LEWIS' <rlewis.c...@gmail.com>; 'Barbour, Dan' <dan.b...@hpe.com>
Cc: 'William Hobbs' <bi...@thehobbsfamily.us>; 'Michael O'Neill' <onei...@msn.com>;
'Karen Murray' <kdmcon...@gmail.com>; 'Joe Herrick' <joe...@gmail.com>;
'Don Herman' <Herm...@msn.com>; 'FRED DE LANO' <fred.d...@gmail.com>;
angelika...@yahoo.com <angelika...@yahoo.com>
Subject: RE: Significant Insurance Increase
Cavender,
So is the total cost of the insurance coverage accurately listed in the Crystal Lakes website as $147,000?
You might possibly inquire whether there is a breakdown of some sort, so that maybe we can compare some apples to some apples, or something like that.
So after they “fully divorced their R&R and W&S,” as you wrote, their insurance cost is $147,000?
Regards,
Wayne
From: Glacier View Manager <man...@glacierviewmeadows.com>
Sent: Tuesday, July 22, 2025 10:34 AM
To: w.sch...@schroeder-law.org; 'ROBERT LEWIS' <rlewis.c...@gmail.com>;
'Barbour, Dan' <dan.b...@hpe.com>
Cc: 'William Hobbs' <bi...@thehobbsfamily.us>; 'Michael O'Neill' <onei...@msn.com>; 'Karen
Murray' <kdmcon...@gmail.com>; 'Joe Herrick' <joe...@gmail.com>; 'Don Herman' <Herm...@msn.com>;
'FRED DE LANO' <fred.d...@gmail.com>;
angelika...@yahoo.com
Subject: Re: Significant Insurance Increase
Wayne,
Yes, I'd gotten information from the W&S side of Crystal. Now, the key item here is that Crystal went the opposite direction we did, and fully divorced their R&R and W&S. They are now 2 completely different entities with completely different manager's and management structures.
The R&R side of Crystal has a brand new manager, and I spoke with him briefly on the phone, and requested some info, but didn't hear back.
However, the W&S side uses the exact same company as we do for brokerage, TCW Risk Management. When I heard that, i didn't really pursue specifics with them, as I expected a more or less apples-to-apples comparison.
I'll pursue more specific details with both entities up there though.
Thanks,
Cav
From:
w.sch...@schroeder-law.org <w.sch...@schroeder-law.org>
Sent: Tuesday, July 22, 2025 9:40 AM
To: Glacier View Manager <man...@glacierviewmeadows.com>;
'ROBERT LEWIS' <rlewis.c...@gmail.com>;
'Barbour, Dan' <dan.b...@hpe.com>
Cc: 'William Hobbs' <bi...@thehobbsfamily.us>;
'Michael O'Neill' <onei...@msn.com>; 'Karen
Murray' <kdmcon...@gmail.com>; 'Joe
Herrick' <joe...@gmail.com>; 'Don Herman'
<Herm...@msn.com>; 'FRED DE LANO' <fred.d...@gmail.com>;
angelika...@yahoo.com <angelika...@yahoo.com>
Subject: RE: Significant Insurance Increase
FYI, the website for Crystal Lakes shows an insurance cost of $147,000. Maybe we are on the low side of premium costs. Wayne
From: Glacier View Manager <man...@glacierviewmeadows.com>
Sent: Tuesday, July 22, 2025 7:59 AM
To: ROBERT LEWIS <rlewis.c...@gmail.com>; Barbour, Dan <dan.b...@hpe.com>
Cc: William Hobbs <bi...@thehobbsfamily.us>; Michael O'Neill <onei...@msn.com>; Wayne Schroeder
<w.sch...@schroeder-law.org>; Karen Murray <kdmcon...@gmail.com>; Joe Herrick
<joe...@gmail.com>; Don Herman <Herm...@msn.com>; FRED DE LANO <fred.d...@gmail.com>
Subject: Re: Significant Insurance Increase
We didn't pay any of it yet. I just signed the forms and bound it.
From: ROBERT LEWIS <rlewis.c...@gmail.com>
Sent: Monday, July 21, 2025 5:24 PM
To: Barbour, Dan <dan.b...@hpe.com>
Cc: Glacier View Manager <man...@glacierviewmeadows.com>;
William Hobbs <bi...@thehobbsfamily.us>;
Michael O'Neill <onei...@msn.com>; Wayne
Schroeder <w.sch...@schroeder-law.org>;
Karen Murray <kdmcon...@gmail.com>;
Joe Herrick <joe...@gmail.com>; Don Herman
<Herm...@msn.com>; FRED DE LANO <fred.d...@gmail.com>
Subject: Re: Significant Insurance Increase
Hi Cav-
Did you pay the whole premium or just the first payment?
On Mon, Jul 21, 2025 at 4:03 PM Barbour, Dan <dan.b...@hpe.com> wrote:
Thanks- Cav.
Sad to hear another strain on rural mountain community. From a budget perspective, at this point , all we can realistically project is an impact to the contributions to capital in the Admin account (R&R/001) should be we not find other budget savings in 2025-26.
My Thoughts.
Dan
Budget Chair
From: Glacier View Manager <man...@glacierviewmeadows.com>
Sent: Monday, July 21, 2025 4:32 PM
To: William Hobbs <bi...@thehobbsfamily.us>; Michael O'Neill <onei...@msn.com>; Robert Lewis <rlewis.c...@gmail.com>; Wayne Schroeder <w.sch...@schroeder-law.org>; Karen Murray <kdmcon...@gmail.com>; Joe Herrick <joe...@gmail.com>; Don Herman <Herm...@msn.com>
Cc: Barbour, Dan <dan.b...@hpe.com>; FRED DE LANO <fred.d...@gmail.com>
Subject: Significant Insurance Increase
Group,
So, I'm going to try to keep this brief, but this has been a long and painful road to get here.
Our previous insurance provider is "getting out the business" of providing comprehensive insurance to organizations like ours. So, they dropped us.
For the record, this was all of our insurance. From the D&O coverage of the board, to automobiles, to the water infrastructure, to the lakes and dams, all of it.
So, for the last few months I have been working with our broker to find new insurance. Dozens of applications. She went to market with 14 different companies that specialize in insurance for municipalities, district's, HOA's, etc. I went to a company Fred Delano suggested, and then to other private companies I found on google and otherwise.
We could not find comprehensive coverage from one provider for our entire organization. Everyone denied our applications.
So we switched to trying to find separate companies to write different policies for different parts of our operations, and we did eventually succeed, but the cost has gone up significantly. We've had to go to companies that write high risk policies. We are also out of time. Our current coverage expires right now, literally today. Unfortunately we ran this right down the wire. I have to bind this coverage, or we will lapse.
I'm sorry I didn't blast this to everyone's attention sooner, but I didn't really have any facts to present. I just found out about this astronomical increase today, on the last day. Our merger actually made getting insurance more difficult. There's a chance we could've gotten 2 different policies for 2 different entities and not been in as high of a risk category, but as it stands, getting 2 policies for one entity made it incredibly difficult.
So, this is also a last minute bomb-shell for the budget committee, and I apologize. I wish there had been better information to give, sooner.
Last year our total insurance cost was about $30,000
This year it's going to be $45,000
Obviously a significant increase. I'm now kicking myself I didn't at least warn everybody at the most recent board meeting, I just didn't have any facts and didn't want to cause a ruckus when I didn't have any solid data. I can only apologize at this point.
I've gone ahead and singed the forms and bound the coverage, as we are out of time.
Thanks,
Cav
Cavender Andrews
General Manager, Glacier View Meadows Associations
Phone: 970-493-6812
Email: man...@glacierviewmeadows.com
Website: GlacierViewMeadows.com
FRED DE LANO
Good morning Fred,Thank you for sharing the email string between the GVM HOA GM and various neighbors that describes the difficult and financially costly insurance situation facing your community. I also reviewed the attached documents regarding the HOA's budgets and the Certificate of Liability Insurance for the CL water and sewer association. The cost of living in mountain communities continues to rise and is not sustainable, especially for folks living on fixed incomes. How are these insurance costs shared among the GVM HOA members? Besides looking at CL property and liability insurance costs and their approach of creating R&R and W&S Associations, have you looked at other comparable mountain community HOAs that may provide some other ideas? Would you like me to share this information with Congressman Neguse's staff so he is aware and better understands the challenges? I do not think there is much that I can do to help this situation, but I am open to suggestions. In the meantime, here is a link to the Colorado Division of Insurance within the Department of Regulatory Agencies (DORA) that has good information and resources for homeowners and HOAs regarding insurance matters, https://doi.colorado.gov/. Michael Conway, https://doi.colorado.gov/colorado-insurance-commissioner, is the Insurance Commissioner, and I could ask him to attend our next RFL Community Conversation in September. Thoughts? There is also the Rocky Mountain Insurance Information Association, http://www.rmiia.org/index.asp, and they may be able to assist.
John Kefalas (he/him)
County Commissioner, District 1
Commissioners' Office
PO Box 1190, Fort Collins, CO 80522-1190
Cell: (720) 254-7598
