Intent to implement: Background Geolocation for Progressive Web-Apps

[Richard Maher]

Contact emails

mah...@gmail.com

Summary

Secure, user-sanctioned geolocation collection is currently unavailable for HTML5 Web-Apps when they are not running or in the foreground. This leaves the browser hosted applications incapable of competing with Native Apps on an even playing field.

The main goal of background geolocation reporting is to all web-apps, but in particular, Gaming, Social-Network, and Fleet-Management Apps, to continue to function even if the device has gone to sleep or another App is in the foreground.

Additional goals are:

• Power-Saving. By using the existing ServiceWorker paradigm and flexible throttle/filter on which geolocation movements are "interesting".

• Single-process (Google Play etc) to monitor all geolocation reports for all Apps before deciding if ServiceWorker(s) need to be instantiated.

• Unlike Mozilla's current implementation, stalkers, estranged spouses, and marketeers will no longer be allowed to track users covertly.

Here is design overview document:

https://sites.google.com/a/chromium.org/dev/developers/design-documents/ServiceWorker/TravelManagerEvent

Ongoing technical constraints

None. See https://w3c.github.io/ServiceWorker/#extensibility 

Tracking bug

There is currently no top level bug.

[Raymes Khoury]

+rei...@chromium.org who might have some context on background geolocation. 

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[Richard Maher]

Thank-you very much. Cheers Richard

On Monday, November 28, 2016 at 10:29:46 AM UTC+8, Raymes Khoury wrote:

 reillyg who might have some context on background geolocation. 

[Colin Blundell]

Hi Richard,

Clicking on your design doc link goes to a page about Unified Sync and Storage, and pasting in the text 404's.

Thanks,

Colin

[Richard Maher]

Hi Colin,

You've caught me out I'm afraid. This is the post I've very much wanted to read here for some time but has yet to materialize :-( I have no intention to implement as I am a simple observer on the outside. It is fake news story about functionality that very much needs to be true.I am just wishing someone from Chrome will pick the ball up and run with it.

Having said that the design is simple: -

serviceWorkerRegistration.travelManager.subscribe({options. . .})

The "options" contain "filter" that can specify such things as minimum distance traveled, minimum reporting interval, accuracy, maximum loiter interval and so on. Once an "interesting" geolocation position change has been obtained a ServiceWorker can be instantiated to process the event in the same way that Push Notifications are handled today.

For more see here: -

https://groups.google.com/a/chromium.org/forum/#!topic/service-worker-discuss/FDWgIWPcEHs

Cheers Richard

[Richard Maher]

Also from my no expense spared design document is the following diagram that illustrates how shimlessly typical user movements map to the ServiceWorker paradigm: -

Elapsed Time:     ttttttttttttttttttttttttttttttttt

User Travelling:  P----P----P Stopped P-----P----P

Service Worker 1: --------------

Service Worker 2:                     ================

[PhistucK]

If you want to propose an API to add to the web platform, you should first propose it to a standards body or a vendor neutral forum. My recommendation is to use https://discourse.wicg.io/.

☆PhistucK

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[Richard Maher]

Sadly, W3C and IETF have become mere echo chambers for monolithic leftist group-think :-(

The main Mozilla employee involved in establishing the incubator group in your link, Imelda (not his real name), is responsible for having me censored from GitHub forums and StackOverflow. If you're not in with the in crowd then your ideas, regardless of merit, will not see the light of day in their agenda.

These people are currently touring Asia on a junket to say how great it is that Progressive Web Apps can work in a cave in the 3rd world and other network challenged locales.

The people I need to get in touch with are the visionaries involved in Web Payments and the Credentials API and want Web Apps to truly compete with native apps. Background GeoLocation is ESSENTIAL! I should not have to argue this to anyone with eyes and half a brain.

Alas: -

https://twitter.com/jaffathecake

https://twitter.com/marcosc?lang=en

https://twitter.com/chaals

But don't click, it only encourages them.

Cheers Richard 

☆PhistucK

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[Alex Komoroske]

I too would be interested in how we could responsibly bring background geolocation to progressive web apps. However, it is a challenging problem to work through, and will require respectful collaboration with many different parties. I encourage you to review Chromium's code of conduct for how we expect participants to conduct themselves in this community.

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[Richard Maher]

> However, it is a challenging problem to work through

Then it's probably best if someone makes a start then eh? What do you find objectionable about my TravelManager proposal? Two different API's for the same GeoLocation? No clear demarcation of when a SW will be handle the position-changed event and when it will be handled by watchPosition() if the APP is foregrounded? 

> and will require respectful collaboration with many different parties

No. What it will require is competent technologists doing a job that they're being paid for, with accountability to a Project Manager. When Google introduced GeoLocation to Web Apps they didn't do it through the consensus of an autonomous collective. The standard came later and, strangely enough, closely resembled Google's original inspiration. IETF/W3C have delivered too many camels from their stacked committees when users were pleading for horses. People are leaving in droves and removing their names from dodgy specifications. Like the UN and EU, these organizations have run their course. Thank God for WHATWG and HTML5 or who knows where we'd be now! 

FYI, I've managed to save Chrome a lot of money by getting their implementation of the "standard" GeoFence API canned. I'm only sorry I couldn't have helped sooner.

How much did Mozilla waste on B2G? How much are they continuing to waste on AutoPush? Did GCM/FCM wait for a web standard?

Can we not get on with this please?

PS. As far as your code-of-conduct goes please be advised that, while I never consider myself a victim, it is I that have been the subject of internet bullying, censorship, and intimidation.

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[Richard Maher]

> and will require respectful collaboration with many different parties

Yeah right. How much respectful collaboration did this fudge have?

https://html.spec.whatwg.org/multipage/semantics.html#link-type-noopener 

[Richard Maher]

Having re-read this post it is clear to me that I have over-stepped the mark in naming individuals. It was childish, personal, and overly hostile.

Please let me take the opportunity to apologize the this forum and the individuals involved.

Cheers Richard

[Dru Knox]

Thank you, Richard. It can be easy to lose track of tone when diving into complex technical topics, especially over email, so we appreciate you taking a moment to reframe the discussion! 

This is a complicated topic, so progress may be slow going. Is there a public document/bug somewhere for interested parties to follow along?

Thanks!

[Richard Maher]

Hi Dru,

Despite my best efforts ranging from reasonable and compelling argument all the way to deliberately provocative rant I have, at least to my knowledge, been unsuccessful in securing sufficient interest from anyone in a position to make a difference. Sorry.

If someone else knows of a serious effort do please provide public access or updates.

Cheers Richard

[Richard Maher]

A few thinks that Background Geolocation people may find interesting: -

 

Bug to turn-off Firefox existing background Geolocation collection: -

https://bugzilla.mozilla.org/show_bug.cgi?id=1254911

 

Chrome background GeoLocation bug (Won’t fix and restricted)

https://bugs.chromium.org/p/chromium/issues/detail?id=506435

 

Chrome bug where Geofence API was abandoned: -

https://bugs.chromium.org/p/chromium/issues/detail?id=383125#c47

 

ServiceWorker issue over a year old: -

https://github.com/w3c/ServiceWorker/issues/745

 

A stagnant waste of space: -

https://github.com/w3c/geolocation-api

 

Have no idea how people get paid to persist with this given Chrome’s veto

https://github.com/w3c/geofencing-api

 

Microsoft currently implementing ServiceWorkers on Edge: -

https://wpdev.uservoice.com/forums/257854-microsoft-edge-developer/suggestions/6263630-service-worker