Immorality

[BVKS Sanga]

From: "Jay Nityananda Das" 

Sent: 29-03-2021 7.40.14 PM

Subject: Re: Immorality

Dear Siddha Nitai Prabhu ji,

Namo Namah.

Nice to interact with you after a long time! Hope you are well with your family.

"If one fails to offer respect to the common jiva, special respect to the religious jiva, and befitting honour to the brahmana and vaisnava-praya jivas, then one incurs sin (papa). However, to disrespect or dishonour a vaisnava-jiva is actually an aparadha (an offence against divinity)". [An excerpt from the article]

 
JND: Vaisnava-praya jivas are listed with the "less than Vaisnava category", hence, criticizing them only sins occur, not offences as their faith in scriptures is conventional (laukika-sraddha) contrast to "Vaisnavas" who faith in scriptures arises  from deep conviction in the words of the scriptures and is based on the evidence presented therein (sastriya-sraddha).

>>and even if we criticise pure vaishnava with the view to benefit all, then offence will not occur. But who will correct whom? that Adhikar has be considered.
Without Adhikar, we cannot jump into criticising and correcting anyone?

"When one reflects upon the historical accounts of personalities like Valmiki or Jagai and Madhai in light of one or more of these three virtuous motives, then such reflection is never the cause of incurring sin....

With the motive of encouraging one to accept the shelter of the lotus feet of a true Vaisnava by abandoning false, so-called preachers of religion, one neither risks committing blasphemy of saints (sadhu-ninda) nor vaisnava-aparadha (offence to Vaisnavas). In such cases, even criticism directed at a specific person is free from fault." [An excerpt from the article]

JND: There are many such examples from Srimad Bhagavatam (i.e. Lord Brahma, Lord Shiva, Lord Parashurama etc.) who are worthy of our worship, nonetheless their "misconduct" is studied (by devotee speakers and listeners alike, regardless of their "Adhikara") during the regular Bhagavatam classes with the noble attitude of getting lessons from them.   

das,

Jaya Nityananda Dasa

("Nandagrama" Varnasrama Community Project)

From: "Radhananda Dasa. BVKS" 

Sent: 26-03-2021 5.34.11 PM

Subject: Re: Immorality

Dear Vrajanagara Prabhu,

Here is a relevant quote:

nindaya na bade dharma — sabe papa labha

eteke na kare ninda saba mahabhaga

“Blasphemy does not enhance one’s religious principles, it only results in sin. That is why fortunate souls do not engage in blasphemy.”

Purport

“The devotees of the Lord do not blaspheme anyone in this world. One who blasphemes others is known as “sinful” or “irreligious.” To attribute on someone faults that are not present is called blasphemy. Being induced by irrelevant goals, those who are unable to tolerate the glorification of others and with a desire to attack them unfairly attribute faults on them continually meet with inauspiciousness day after day. A person who out of envy attributes faults on an irreproachable Vaisnava must go to the hell known as Kumbhipaka and suffer severe miseries. Those sinful persons who cannot understand that sarva-mahaguna-gana vaisnava-sarire — “all good qualities are present in the body of a Vaisnava,” and who consider that non-Vaisnavas are equal to Vaisnavas can never achieve any benefit. To criticize the behavior of nondevotees is called sad-upadesa, or good instruction. Other than devotional service to Visnu, all activities of the living entities are condemnable. Sinful people often engage in abominable activities on the pretext of devotional service to Visnu. Instructions to give up these activities should not be called ninda, or blasphemy.”

Ref. VedaBase => CB Madhya-khanda 13.312

From: "Vrajanagara das
Sent: 24-03-2021 10.16.00 AM
Subject: Immorality

My dear Guru Maharaj and devotees,
please accept my respectful obeisances.

My question is so. Many years I observe one situation in Russia. Many members of ISKCON in spite of many year involving in practice remains completely immoral persons. For example, Such 'devotees' may rape girls, who are also devotees, may deceive other kind devotees getting their money. They are completely deceitful in many of his acts. Honestly speaking what I observe in Russian ISKCON last year's is increasing immorality, but most concerning is that the leaders neither want to protect weak persons like woman, nor let others do it, because to criticize 'devotees' is aparadha.

It seems like many of them are worse than usual materialists. I often see that in ISKCON the idea that the most important thing is that they are devotees and they chant the Holy Name. But the problem is that in spite of their adherence to rituals they have no qualities of even an honest person.

Is it possible that spirituality can exist without morality and good qualities?

Your servant,
Vrajanagara Das

[BVKS Sanga]

From: "Vrajanagara das"
To: "BVKS Sanga"
Sent: 31-03-2021 12.10.02 PM
Subject: immorality

Hare Krishna dear devotees. Please, accept my obeisances.
I thank you all for replying to my letter and your good quotations. But the problem is that we a little misunderstand one another because we are not acquainted and do not know situation of one another. Therefore I have to make my situation clearer.
My experience is mostly based on what I observe in Russia especially in Ural region, where I live.
The moral situation becomes worse and worse year after year. If in the nineties I was so glad that in ISKCON (at least in which I lived) the situation differed from of Russian Orthodox Church. Nowadays it is almost the same. I observe how ISKCON becomes convenient for sinful persons. And they remain sinful even after many years of their spiritual practice. Maybe you know Pablo Escobar. He was a head of very big mafia cartel in Columbia. He was a devout Catholic and simultaneously a cruel and deceitful man. Now I observe such small Pablo Escobars in our organization. I understand that they have already been (Kirtananada and so on). But previously they went away (at least I saw it in my location) because for them ISKCON was not a convenient place. Now I see how good and pious persons go away, because for them to be among such immoral persons is not acceptable. During discussion about the situation with other the most interesting thing is that opposite parties quote the same verse in support of opposite opinions.
For example let's discuss this point. There is a thesis that "a devotee has all good qualities".
The first party states that if one becomes a devotee it means that according to scriptures he has good qualities. And if one cannot see them in him it means that he is a faultfinder, he is sinful himself (and there are quotations supporting it) and so on. Some leaders and even Shrila Prabhupada's disciple coming to Russia states that all members of ISKCON are pure devotees. Consequently to say that a rapist or a pedophile is bad means to criticize a devotee who simply has "temporary difficulties", which are not "obstacles to flow of his bhakti".
The second party (I am here) states that if a "devotee" has no good qualities, It means that he is not a devotee. And following different rituals may not be a criteria of accepting any one as a devotee.
And how I can see ISKCON divides on this subject. In Russian Orthodox Church there is a "saint" named king Vladimir. He lived in the ninth century. He had 500 concubines and he raped all pretty girls and women in Russia. He was completely an abominable person, but he is considered to be a saint because he made a lot for Orthodox Church. We have the same situation now. Those, who are very helpful to ISKCON and its leaders, are good in spite of their bad qualities. When I asked whether spirituality can exist without morality, I meant what must be a criteria of judgment who is who. Is it usefulness for our organization and its officials or moral qualities of a person?
By the way I think it is not only the situation where I live. I was unpleasantly surprised after hearing that Radhanatha Swami and Gopal Krishna Goswami made a samadhi for Kirtanananda. Do they realy think that Kirtananada was in samadhi?
Vrajanagara das