451 Tires

[Andrew P. Black]

John Thurston:

On the strength of your recommendation, I just ordered a pair of Tioga FASTR-X S-SPEC 451 tires from Modern Bike. I was going to try the MAXXIS DTH, but prefer a folding tire if its available, and the Maxxis DTH seem to be wire bead only in 451.

The back story is that I’m on a quest for wider, more supple tires for my Air Friday. I used Schwalbe Stelvios for years, then Duranos when Stelvios went away, but 28mm seems really narrow nowadays, and I’m getting older (funny how that happens …) and they are both pretty stiff, especially the wire-bead versions. More recently I switched to Primo Comets, nominally 37mm, but actually 32mm, so they fit with my Ultegra brakes. Not a high quality tire, but the improvement in ride is quite significant. I’m hoping that the FASTR-X S-SPEC will be the same actual width, but higher quality.

I’ll report beck when I have them!

Andrew

[John Thurston]

I have found the upper-spec Tioga tires to have an excellent price:performance ratio.

As I have mentioned here before, the Schwalbe Shredda is (IMHO) the 406mm tire to beat. It rides smoothly, is easy to pedal, and has good traction. The difficulty being it is no longer made, and the trike-riders of the world have snapped up most of the remaining stock. If you see any out there in a width which will fit in your frame, you can afford the cost, and have an interest in high quality rubber, you really should grab ‘em and give ‘em a try.

But in the absence of Shreddas, the Tiogas are easy to find and deliver 90% of the Shredda at 50% of the cost.

The Tiogas have the advantage that several models can be found in 451mm and 559mm BSD.

John Thurston
Juneau, Alaska

[andrew.]

Shreddas are available for 12 euros at XXcycle in France, in both 406 and 451.  But if you had 406 rims as an option, i don't see why you'd fit Shreddas which are merely medium quality tyres from Schwalbe's "Performance" range when you can get the same nominal 406-40 size in G-One Speed tyres (actual measured 36mm on my Silk), which are from their top Evolution range and are truly supple fast tyres with a reasonably high load rating.  A bit more expensive, yes, but good tyres are the cheapest easily changed and noticeable performance variable we have.

[John Thurston]

The Shreddas I see at XXCycle

https://www.xxcycle.com/schwalbe-shredda-20-performance-line-hs434-50-406,,en.php

are on a 60tpi casing, with a wire bead.

The Shreddas I lust after are on a 120tpi casing with a folding bead.

https://www.bunneysbikes.com/wheel_tyers/35513-schwalbe-shredda-tyer-wire-20-x-1-3-8-4026495761604.html

Like Tioga, Schwable markets the “same” tire with several different constructions. I would not pay shipping from France for the 60tpi/wire Shredda when I could get 120tpi/folding PowerBlocks locally. But if I ever saw the 120tpi/folding Shredda for 12 euros, I would certainly consider shipping them from France!

Regarding the choice of Shredda/G-One:

If the current Schwalbe web site can be trusted, the G-One maxes out at a nominal 40mm width. The Shreddas (when they were available) came as wide as 50mm (maybe wider, I don’t recall exactly). I have found the 44mm to be a comfortable width. I found 40mm to be too narrow for my taste.

But the discussion is academic, as the nice Shreddas are gone, this is a thread about 451mm tires (not 406mm), and none of the G-One tires are made with 451mm BSD.

John Thurston

Juneau, Alaska

[Hugh Larkin]

The widest tire size for a 451 wheel on a PR or PRPro is the 1-3/8" due to the fork crown design using straight blades, even when running disc brakes. You can only use the Tioga Powerblock 1.6" (Tioga used a decimal size for this 451 tire) if you have a llama-style fork with its U-shaped crown and have the underside of the steerer tube removed in order to have tread clearance. Our 2 Rocket Llamas are probably the only BFs that can run the 1.6" 451 Powerblocks as they were "project bikes" when I worked there.

Hugh Larkin
Eugene

Verstuurd vanaf mijn iPhone, but never when I'm pedaling!

[Squire Black]

I received one of my Tioga Fastr-X tires yesterday.  The other is backordered.

It fits my Air Friday!   The critical dimension is the height under the brake bridge.  My bike has Ultegra brakes, and there is about 3mm of clearance with the tires inflated to around 40 psi.  Inflated to around 70 psi, clearance is reduced to something closer to 1.5mm.   My brake bridges are set so that the brakes must be adjusted to close to their maximum reach; your bike frame dimensions may be different.

Here is a comparison with some other tires, when mounted on Velocity A23 rims, which have an internal rim width of 18mm.

Tioga Fastr-X:  Folding, nominal 34-451, actual width 34mm, weight 258g

Primo Comet:  Wire-bead, nominal 37-451, actual width 32mm, weight 277g

Schwalbe Durano: Wire-bead, nominal 28-451, actual width 28mm, weight 271g

Schwalbe Stelvio: Folding, nominal 28-451, weight 181g.  (This is the tire that I carry as a spare!)

If you were to use a wider rim, I assume that the same tires would end up being wider but less tall.  Since height, not width, is the most restrictive dimension, this might let you run a wider tire.  I don't have any wider rims with which to try this.

I haven't actually ridden on the Tioga yet, but it seems to be light and flexible, which is promising.