Democrats block reading the 13 soldier's names into the congressional record

[Quick]

Why?

[John Pickels]

On 9/2/2021 10:16 AM, Quick wrote:

Why?

I could find no answer to the "Why?".

I looked and looked and could find no record quoting what you reference.

I finally, after several failed attempts, found this site on the bottom of the second page of the google search referenced below.

I am unfamiliar with DJHJ Media but it seems right wing oriented.  I am surprised that Google could not recover any other references.  It appears to be true, but there may be a back story that paints a different picture.  However, I gave up finding it.  [If you google the entire headline, you only get one hit ... the one below.]

Nancy Pelosi Refuses to Allow the Names of 13 Soldiers Killed in Afghanistan from Having Their Names Read into the Congressional Record | DJHJ Media

names of 13 soldiers killed in afghanistan in the congressional record - Google Search

[Claudia Mastroianni]

The end of that article says they wanted to be recognized “to read names and bring up Afghanistan legislation”. Perhaps it was the latter part that the Dems really objected to? Not enough details to tell.

Claudia

On Sep 2, 2021, at 2:04 PM, John Pickels <johnp...@gmail.com> wrote:



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[Lennie Augustine]

I found this quote from Republican Brian Mast:   "We gaveled in, had a prayer, said the Pledge of Allegiance, took a moment of silence with pretty much all Republican veterans, then asked to be recognized to read names and bring up Afghanistan legislation," Mast told the Floridian.  "They did not acknowledge us, and just closed the House down."

Pelosi and the Democrats opened the House to allow the entire House, Democrats and Republicans, to be able to pay their respects to the 13 murdered soldiers in a solemn and dignified moment of bipartisan respect - a moment every American could share in whatever their political stripes.  The words bolded in the quote are the key to answering the question posed -- the Republicans' request to read the names was just a pretense for opening the floor up to introducing and discussing legislation that was undoubtedly planned as a giant whack-a-Biden publicity opportunity.  That would not have been appropriate to the solemnity and bipartisan nature of the occasion, so Pelosi did not permit it.

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[Patti Beadles]

Like John I looked at Quick's message, thought "[citation needed]", and looked for one. I did a quick check of Google News and found nothing, so I assumed it was probably a crackpot site misrepresenting something. Thank you for finding the DJHJ link. Media Bias Fact Check describes them as a questionable source: "Overall, we rate DJHJ Media extreme right biased and Questionable based on the use of poor sources, promotion of propaganda, and conspiracy theories, as well as consistent one-sided sensationalized reporting."

https://mediabiasfactcheck.com/djhj-media/

I would remind everyone on this list that their messages are more credible and more easily understood by everyone else if they include a citation to their source material when they post a message, rather than expecting the readers to do their homework for them.

In that vein, I will include a link to the August 31 Congressional Record: https://www.congress.gov/117/crec/2021/08/31/167/152/CREC-2021-08-31-house.pdf

It includes this:

MOMENT OF SILENCE IN REMEMBRANCE OF SERVICEMEMBERS
KILLED IN AFGHANISTAN ON AUGUST 26, 2021

The SPEAKER pro tempore. The
Chair asks all Members in the Chamber, as well as Members and staff
throughout the Capitol, to rise for a
moment of silence in remembrance of
the 13 servicemembers who were killed
during the terrorist bombing in Kabul,
Afghanistan, on August 26, 2021.

[Bob Gilbert]

Based on my time as a legislative aide on the other side of the Capitol, the session was opened for a single limited purpose and that (if in fact there was a refusal to recognize the Member), the refusal was not motivated by content — since the Speaker would have no idea what words were going to come out of the Member’s mouth.

On Sep 2, 2021, at 3:06 PM, Patti Beadles <pat...@pattib.org> wrote:

Like John I looked at Quick's message, thought "[citation needed]", and looked for one. I did a quick check of Google News and found nothing, so I assumed it was probably a crackpot site misrepresenting something. Thank you for finding the DJHJ link. Media Bias Fact Check describes them as a questionable source: "Overall, we rate DJHJ Media extreme right biased and Questionable based on the use of poor sources, promotion of propaganda, and conspiracy theories, as well as consistent one-sided sensationalized reporting."

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[Quick]

Outstanding. We are dealing with Google and friends, Let's suppress/remove/ban any coverage and then ask people for cites "or it didn't happen". Then in case someone does manage to circumvent the suppression let's make sure to discredit them and call them crackpots. (oops, did I use my outside voice?)

The tone of your post seems to imply that you think this did actually happened. Is that true or do you think "it didn't happen"?

Then you reference mediabiasfactcheck (as if the name gives it credibility beyond reproach).

Then you admonish people to do their due diligence to prove the above was indeed published by someone like Google that you find to be credible and unbiased.

And finally you you include a cite that makes no mention of the incident at all.

Yes, I know, you got to start somewhere but it's a bit overused here.

So I guess that's a wrap? It never happened. (but of course you wouldn't actually say that right?)

p.s. I saw it on TV. Not your tv, the other one :)

[Patti Beadles]

Quick, you seem to believe everything that every right-wing crackpot site says without ever verifying it. Why do you trust them?

Let met me help you out. Here's a video of the entire August 13 House session. I've watched every second of it and annotated the timeline so you can skip the boring parts if you want.

https://www.c-span.org/video/?514320-1/house-observes-moment-silence-service-members-killed-afghanistan

00:40 Gavel, "The house will be in order". Reading of the appointment of Debbie Dingell as speaker pro tem
01:10 Prayer
02:50 Approval of previous proceedings
03:00 Pledge of Allegiance
03:20 The chair asks that all members in the chamber rise for a moment of silence in rememberance of the 13 servicemembers who were killed in Kabul on August 26
04:11 The House stands adjourned until noon on Friday
04:17 Gavel

There were a couple of shouts just as she gaveled the adjournment. At that point the CSPAN narrator says, "The House in in a district work period and will return on September 20."

I defy you to find anything in that video that supports the argument that Democrats blocked reading the 13 servciemembers' names into the Congressional Record. If you can find it I will admit that I was wrong. If not, I expect you to admit that your sources were lying.

-P

P.S. You could have verified the information yourself. I just googled "CSPAN August 31 2021" and had answers. Verifying your sources before you post things could provide a tremendous boost to your credibility.

[Dave Tall]

> On Sep 2, 2021, at 5:20 PM, Patti Beadles <pat...@pattib.org> wrote:
>
> Quick, you seem to believe everything that every right-wing crackpot site says without ever verifying it. Why do you trust them?

>
> Let met me help you out. Here's a video of the entire August 13 House session. I've watched every second of it and annotated the timeline so you can skip the boring parts if you want.
>
> https://www.c-span.org/video/?514320-1/house-observes-moment-silence-service-members-killed-afghanistan
>
> 00:40 Gavel, "The house will be in order". Reading of the appointment of Debbie Dingell as speaker pro tem
> 01:10 Prayer
> 02:50 Approval of previous proceedings
> 03:00 Pledge of Allegiance
> 03:20 The chair asks that all members in the chamber rise for a moment of silence in rememberance of the 13 servicemembers who were killed in Kabul on August 26
> 04:11 The House stands adjourned until noon on Friday
> 04:17 Gavel
>
> There were a couple of shouts just as she gaveled the adjournment. At that point the CSPAN narrator says, "The House in in a district work period and will return on September 20."
>
> I defy you to find anything in that video that supports the argument that Democrats blocked reading the 13 servciemembers' names into the Congressional Record.

As was pointed out by another poster, the House was brought into session for the sole purpose of having a moment of silence for the servicemembers. No other business was to be conducted.

Nancy Pelosi blocked members from reading Mrs. Fields’ chocolate chip cookie recipe into the record. Why does Pelosi hate bakers?

[Quick]

You're slipping Dave... Patti made 2 replies already before you came in with the backup. I was really looking forward to your backup post on the first one (seeing it was about cites and reference). Very disappointing.

On Thu, Sep 2, 2021, at 5:55 PM, Dave Tall wrote:

> On Sep 2, 2021, at 5:20 PM, Patti Beadles <pat...@pattib.org> wrote:

> 

> 00:40    Gavel, "The house will be in order".  Reading of the appointment of Debbie Dingell as speaker pro tem

As was pointed out by another poster, the House was brought into session for the sole purpose of having a moment of silence for the servicemembers.  No other business was to be conducted. 

You don't have a reputable cite for this session's agenda  do you?  

[Patti Beadles]

Quick, rather than picking on Mr. Tall how about just admitting that you trusted and cited a source that was full of shit?

For bonus points, do better in the future.

-P

[Quick]

I do have to agree with you that the majority of house representatives are full of shit -- but the one on TV seemed pretty trustworthy.

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[Patti Beadles]

Quick writes:

> I do have to agree with you that the majority of house representatives are
> full of shit -- but the one on TV seemed pretty trustworthy.

OK, I'm going to be very direct. You posted this earlier:

>> I found this quote from Republican Brian Mast:   "We gaveled in, had a
>> prayer, said the Pledge of Allegiance, took a moment of silence with
>> pretty much all Republican veterans, then asked to be recognized to read
>> names and bring up Afghanistan legislation," Mast told the Floridian. 
>> "They did not acknowledge us, and just closed the House down."

Now that you've watched the CSPAN video do you believe that Mast's statement is an accurate representation of what transpired?

-P

[Quick]

On Thu, Sep 2, 2021, at 10:59 PM, Patti Beadles wrote:

OK, I'm going to be very direct. You posted this earlier:

Really? I'm pretty sure I said my source was a news person interviewing a house representative on TV. 

You think it might have been Lennie who quoted Brian Mast? 

(here it is. I did say my source was a TV news interview ...but I found it still in my drafts folder.  Here is what I said my source was)

Lol, I was watching an interview on TV where they were asking a real live house representative (no, can't remember the name. It was a male (well, appeared from the clothing, haircut, and facial features to be a male but I do not know their actual biological birth gender or how they identify).

That congress person said they opened the session did the prayer and moment of silence and then they (the Rebublicans -- one or more) asked to read the names into the record and were summarily ignored by the speaker who immediately closed the session. Pretty sure the speaker qualifies as Democrats.

So maybe you just watched the wrong video (or maybe it was edited).  And no, a congressman would never lie on TV right?

On Thu, Sep 2, 2021, at 4:20 PM, Patti Beadles wrote:

Quick, you seem to believe everything that every right-wing crackpot site says without ever verifying it.  Why do you trust them?

I defy you to find anything in that video that supports the argument that Democrats blocked reading the 13 servciemembers' names into the Congressional Record.  If you can find it I will admit that I was wrong.  If not, I expect you to admit that your sources were lying.

[Patti Beadles]

Quick writes:

> So maybe you just watched the wrong video (or maybe it was edited).

Well, maybe I watched the wrong video but how can I know since you didn't give any specifics? Where did *YOU* hear that this alleged event happened and what specifics can you provide? If you claim that something happened then the burden is on you to provide evidence. There's a pretty clear chain of evidence that suggested that what you said didn't actually happen. How about you pony up some evidence that it did?

-P

[John Pickels]

I wonder if "the video" is the whole story.  I was not there.  I have continued to look for more information.  I did find this.

Pelosi blasted for 'REFUSING to let names of fallen US Marines be read out' on House floor (the-sun.com)

I am not sure if the Sun is a reliable source, but it does report what Quick said that started this thread. It did not appear on the first page list of my search on Google.  I continued to search "deeper" into Google and found this from the Washington Examiner (I know the Post would be a better source).

Pelosi knelt for George Floyd in Congress but refused to read names of US military killed in Afghanistan | Washington Examiner

I kept going page after page of unrelated "information" and also stumbled on this.

Nancy Pelosi blocked reading names of 13 US troops killed in Kabul says veteran congressmen | American Military News

I admit that just because a member of the House of Representatives says something happened does not mean that it actually happened, but I do think there is some evidence that it did in fact happen and it is not being reported by the MSM.  Some might say that the MSM is the only source that can be believed and others might say that the MSM is not impartial to the "facts" anymore and maybe sometimes both can be correct and all can be wrong.  It seems to me that maybe the names were not read even though some Congresspersons wanted them read and they were not read.  The "reasons" are not clear to me.  It would seem like there should be no reason why the names could not be read ... but I do not know the facts for sure.  It would not surprise me that "politics" play a large role it what happens and what gets reported and why people say the things they say and why people believe what they believe to be the truth, the whole truth and nothing but the truth.

[Rick Charles]

I saw a couple of interviews on the same subject on 2 different sources.  1 was just one Rep (R) speaking to someone on Fox News and the other interview was 2 or 3 including a woman and a (D) House Rep who were part of the group who wanted to have the names read.  I believe, if I'm not mistaken, but I could be, it was the same two that went over to Afghanistan together and one of the Freshman (R) female Reps.  I'll see if I can find the interview on YouTube, but it's not a high priority.  Quick is telling the truth.

RC

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[Patti Beadles]

I followed the three links that Pickels provided. All three of them cited Mast and Giminez as the source for the information. Let's look at this quote again:

“We gaveled in, had a prayer, said the Pledge of Allegiance, took a moment of silence with pretty much all Republican veterans, then asked to be recognized to read names and bring up Afghanistan legislation,” Mast told the outlet. “They did not acknowledge us, and just closed the House down.”

I suspect that what happened is that the muffled speech as the gavel came down was a couple of guys saying something, not actually trying to have something done just trying to utter the words so that they could spin them later. This hypothesis fits all of the evidence that I've seen, and nobody has yet offered any evidence to the contrary. As someone who is a strong believer in truth I will reassess my position if new evidence comes to light.

-P

[Quick]

lol, let's back up just a bit shall we?  You seem to feel and proclaim that providing evidence, verification, and presenting *facts* is very important. Enough so that posters should do some rigorous due diligence before posting, and in the event of a "mistake" post a retraction. I tend to agree with that but I'm not so rigorous in general conservation.

In that context I'm a little bothered you claimed I posted a quote from Brian Mast as my source for my original post. I do not recall doing so. What I just posted recently as my source (a little late, as it was stuck in my drafts folder), was in fact my source.

Here is what you said (since you have recently taken to snipping context and a lot of relevant information that doesn't fit your narrative in your replies -- makes me sad since you used to be straight up).

Patti writes:

OK, I'm going to be very direct. You posted this earlier:

  I found this quote from Republican Brian Mast:   "We gaveled in, had a

  prayer, said the Pledge of Allegiance, took a moment of silence with

  pretty much all Republican veterans, then asked to be recognized to read

  names and bring up Afghanistan legislation," Mast told the Floridian. 

  "They did not acknowledge us, and just closed the House down."

Can you check to see where you snipped that out of? It appears to be a quote within a quote that was in some email posted by someone. You did not include the attributions some reason.

I'm sure I could have screwed up on the mechanics, since I'm not as diligent as you are, but I am positive I never claimed that to be the source of my original post. As before:

Quick posts his source:

Lol, I was watching an interview on TV where they were asking a real live house representative (no, can't remember the name. It was a male (well, appeared from the clothing, haircut, and facial features to be a male but I do not know their actual biological birth gender or how they identify).

I understand if it was just a hurried mistake. even for an email expert extraordinaire, but if it was intentional I find it rather egregious and unworthy.

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[John Pickels]

Patti, your position is what you suspect happened.  Someone has made a statement that something happened ... why do you dismiss what someone said happened with no support for your suspicions?

[John Pickels]

On 9/3/2021 12:01 PM, Rick Charles wrote:

I saw a couple of interviews on the same subject on 2 different sources.  1 was just one Rep (R) speaking to someone on Fox News and the other interview was 2 or 3 including a woman and a (D) House Rep who were part of the group who wanted to have the names read.  I believe, if I'm not mistaken, but I could be, it was the same two that went over to Afghanistan together and one of the Freshman (R) female Reps.  I'll see if I can find the interview on YouTube, but it's not a high priority.  Quick is telling the truth.

RC

Chuck Breuninger a.k.a. Rick Charles

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It does seem possible that requests were made and denied.  Maybe so ... but it is possible that it did not happen at all.  I wonder why it is being denied so vociferously. 

[Patti Beadles]

Mr. Pickels asks:

> Patti, your position is what you suspect happened.  Someone has made a
> statement that something happened ... why do you dismiss what someone said
> happened with no support for your suspicions?

Please refer to Mast's description of the event:

Rep Brian Mast told The Floridian: "We gaveled in, had a prayer, said the Pledge of Allegiance, took a moment of silence with pretty much all Republican veterans, then asked to be recognized to read names and bring up Afghanistan legislation.

"They did not acknowledge us, and just closed the House down."

There are a few reasons that I think this allegation is unlikely to be true:

1. Mast and Gimenez have provided absolutely no evidence to support their assertion that it happened.
2. It was reported only by highly partisan sites, and that reporting was based solely on assertions by the people who claimed it happened. There was no supporting evidence.
3. I've watched an impartial third-party video of the event where they claimed it happened and there was no evidence to back up their assertions.
4. It seems nonsensical to bring up Afghanistan legislation during a district work period when most House members are not present.

Do you believe that it happened? If so what leads you to that belief? How might you go about verifying that it happened?

-P

[Quick]

Do you believe that it happened?  If so what leads you to that belief?  How might you go about verifying that it happened?

Interesting.

John: There are 3 or 4 congress people on record and on public TV saying it happened.

Patti: (doesn't have anyone or anything disputing those statements or saying it never happened.)

So I guess it's on you John to prove that your sources aren't lying.  ...or it never happened.

p.s. just finding more witnesses saying the same thing doesn't change anything.

[Patti Beadles]

Quick, do you believe that the CSPAN video strengthens or weakens their case?

How might YOU go about proving their assertions true or false?

-P

[Claudia Mastroianni]

As a side note, all those additional headlines blame Pelosi... who wasn’t even in the room. It was a speaker pro tempore who gaveled the session closed.

Claudia

On Sep 3, 2021, at 10:07 PM, Quick <qu...@imapmail.org> wrote:



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[John Pickels]

On 9/4/2021 10:11 AM, Claudia Mastroianni wrote:

As a side note, all those additional headlines blame Pelosi... who wasn’t even in the room. It was a speaker pro tempore who gaveled the session closed.

Claudia

Absolutely correct ... bias on the other side.  However, the "democrats" may have indeed blocked the "republicans" from reading the names.  Still not a good thing ... maybe ... if it really happened at all.

I have lost confidence in all our "sources" of reliable information ... sometimes about very important things. 

[Rick Charles]

https://www.washingtonexaminer.com/news/house-republicans-afghanistan-accountability-bill-blocked-pro-forma-session

RC

Chuck Breuninger a.k.a. Rick Charles

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[Rick Charles]

https://twitter.com/dcexaminer/status/1432759568543719430?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw

RC

Chuck Breuninger a.k.a. Rick Charles

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[Patti Beadles]

Rick writes:

> https://www.washingtonexaminer.com/news/house-republicans-afghanistan-accountability-bill-blocked-pro-forma-session

Oh perfect! Thanks Rick for agreeing with me. I'm assuming that's why you shared an article that explained the whole thing so succinctly.

The second word of that article pretty much encapsulates the whole stunt-- "symbolic". Or, we could skip to the second sentence, "attempted to bring the bill for consideration during a pro forma session of the House." This paragraph explains more: "The House is not scheduled to return to floor activity until Sept. 20. During congressional recesses, pro forma sessions consist of gaveling in and out within minutes or seconds in order to fulfill technical requirements and aims."

The people who did this knew full well that they were staging a publicity stunt. They knew it was symbolic. They didn't expect legislation to be considered during a pro forma session because that's not how the House works. All they did was shout some shit as the gavel fell just so that they could express their outrage at having been "ignored"... even though the House was in recess for a district work period. And then a few of them spun their preplanned outrage on social media to rile up their bases.

Congratulations to those who took the bait. Congratulations to Rick for being smart enough to find the explanation.

-P

[Quick]

On Sun, Sep 5, 2021, at 2:25 PM, Patti Beadles wrote:

Thanks Rick for agreeing with me. 

I don't recall Rick saying it never happened. Are you now acknowledging that it happened?

[Dave Tall]

Nancy Pelosi ruthlessly prevented Republicans from reading the results of all Barge Quick Bets into the record. 

On Sep 5, 2021, at 8:09 PM, Quick <qu...@imapmail.org> wrote:



On Sun, Sep 5, 2021, at 2:25 PM, Patti Beadles wrote:

Thanks Rick for agreeing with me. 

I don't recall Rick saying it never happened. Are you now acknowledging that it happened?

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[Quick]

Better Dave. At least you're not asleep at the wheel. Have to say it's not one of your better diversions.

"A" for timeliness and something less for effort (everybody is a winner though and gets a trophy!).

Wait, do they give awards anymore? or is that just further oppression of the those that don't get one.