RE: [STONE-CAMPBELL] Elton Trueblood

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Rushford, Jerry

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Jan 16, 2014, 1:23:24 AM1/16/14
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 Lloyd,
 
I didn't expect to see the name of the Quaker author, Elton Trueblood, in a post on the SC List, and I wasn't aware that Sam Stone had attended Earlham College.
 
I began reading books by Elton Trueblood during my OCC years (1963-65).  When I went to graduate school at ACC (1965-68), I took a course in Philosophy of Religion taught by Robert Johnson in the Fall of 1966, and the textbook we used was written by Elton Trueblood.  In October we heard that Dr. Trueblood was going to give a series of lectures at Texas Tech University in Lubbock.  There was a student in the class named Lewis Rambo, and he and I began lobbying Dr. Johnson to drive us to Lubbock to meet Elton Trueblood.  Time Magazine had called Trueblood "the most quoted religious author in America" and we were eager to meet him.
 
Dr. Johnson called Dr. Trueblood the night before and asked if he could bring two of his students to Lubbock to meet him.  The reply was positive and the three of us drove to Lubbock (3 hours there and 3 hours back) on October 26, 1966.  Lewis Rambo and I interviewed Trueblood for about an hour (I think this was in the Plainsmen's Hotel) and then he signed our books.  The reason I know the date is that I am holding The Company of the Committed in my hand as I write, and he signed it on October 26, 1966. 
 
The following year I heard Dr. Trueblood speak at Trinity College in Austin, Texas, and then I began corresponding with him.  He told me he was coming out of retirement in the Fall of 1968 to teach a course on "How to Write Books."  He wanted to hand-pick a class of 15 students from 15 different Christian faith traditions, and he asked me if I would come study with him and represent the Restoration Movement.  When I told him I had no money and could not possibly come, he replied that he would pay for all of my travel expenses, and all of my lodging and meals for four months if I would come and study writing with him.  By that time I had returned home to Michigan and was preaching for the Hazel Park Church of Christ north of Detroit.  My elders thought it was a great opportunity and they allowed me four months off without pay.  We had two preachers at Hazel Park, and Perry Milner, my co-worker, agreed to do all of the preaching for those four months.
 
Around September 1st, 1968, I drove down to Richmond, Indiana, and enrolled in the Earlham School of Religion for one semester.  It was a glorious autumn -- made more so by the fact that the Detroit Tigers and St. Louis Cardinals were playing in the World Series -- and I knew I couldn't lose -- those were my two favorite teams.  Mickey Lolich was awesome and the Tigers won in 7 -- their first World Series Championship since 1945.
 
I arranged for Elton Trueblood to come to Pepperdine in the Fall of 1978.  He spoke at Convocation in Firestone Fieldhouse and then gave an evening lecture in Elkins Auditorium.  He came to our home for dinner, and after conversing  with Lori for awhile he turned to me and said "Jerry, I always admire a man who has the courage to marry a woman smarter than himself."  I should probably say here that Elton had a million one-liners like that -- he always kept everyone on their toes.  I traveled with him enough to different conferences and events that I came to know most of his favorite lines.  He liked to tell people that Earlham College wanted to make him Professor Emeritus after his retirement but he refused it because he knew his Latin too well.  Then he would pause and say: "E" means you're out -- and "Meritus" means you deserve to be.
 
When Elton celebrated his 80th birthday on December 12, 1980, I was in the middle of a gospel meeting with the San Rafael Church of Christ north of San Francisco.  The preacher for this church was my old classmate from ACC, Lewis Rambo.  Lewis had completed a doctoral program at Yale and was now on the faculty of San Francisco Theological Seminary.  Like myself, Lewis had kept in touch with Elton Trueblood through the years.  On the afternoon of Dec. 12th we each went to a phone in Lewis's home and called Dr. Trueblood to wish him a happy 80th birthday.  He was delighted to be talking to both of us at the same time and glad to hear we were working together in a gospel meeting.
 
I might add that 4 nights earlier (Dec. 8th) as I was returning to my motel after preaching at San Rafael, I heard the news that John Lennon had been shot and killed in New York.
 
The last time I visited with Elton he was living in a retirement residence near Valley Forge.  I was in Philadelphia to speak at the Northeastern Christian College Lectureship, and I called to ask if I could come over one day.  With his usual insistence on punctuality, he said I could arrive at 10:00 am sharp, but I must leave by 11:00 am sharp.  He knew the limitations of his strength.  And that's exactly what I did.  Toward the close of our final conversation, he said that I could select any book from his library and take it with me as a final gift from my teacher.  I can remember how hard the decision was as I browsed through his wonderful library, but all these years later I can't remember what book I finally chose.
 
He died on December 20, 1994, 8 days after his 94th birthday.
 
 
Jerry Rushford
Oak Park, California
 
 
 

From: lmpe...@gmail.com [lmpe...@gmail.com] On Behalf Of Lloyd Pelfrey [lpel...@cccb.edu]
Sent: Tuesday, January 14, 2014 5:10 AM
To: stone-c...@acu.edu
Subject: Re: [STONE-CAMPBELL] Supreme Court Justices

Thanks, Tom, for offering another perspective on what may be considered the first Restoration congregation in MO!  Stone, Mulkey, and the Haggard brothers (Rice and David) were indeed active early along the KY-TN border, and in all directions from there.  Mulkey was breaking with the Baptist association in c.1809, the year that Thomas Campbell was writing his D&A.  The O'Kelley segment must also be considered. 

My source for the "first" church as being the Salt Creek congregation is the book by George Peters, published in 1937 as a history of the church (Disciples) in MO.  Peters cites this statement about the Salt Creek church:  "To this organizaton belongs the distinction of being the oldest Christian Church west of the Mississippi River" (p. 29).  Those words, "Mississippi River," may be an overstatement. 

It would be great to discover that the task of unity by restoring was already in AR.  Hopefully someone from around Searcy or Memphis has more information. 

Sixty years ago I was preaching in Eaton of Preble Co., OH. That is the town that Stone and Reuben Dooley turned upside down in their preaching tour of 1811.  Stone's wife had died the year before, and he was trying to stay busy. 

David Purviance would later settle at New Paris, in the NW corner of Preble County.  I visited there frequently when my roommate from collegiate days became the preacher.  Later, Sam Stone, a retired editor of the Christian Standard, preached in New Paris for a time.  During those days he attended Earlham College in Richmond, IN, where Elton Trueblood was teaching. 

It's amazing how one thing leads to another, especially when you have many years behind you. 

Y&H,
LMP




On Mon, Jan 13, 2014 at 10:29 PM, Tom Olbricht <tom-ol...@comcast.net> wrote:
Lloyd,
 
I doubt very much that the first restoration church in MO was founded in 1816.  But I don't have the name of a specific congregation to offer instead.  And I don't quarrel that in Little Dixie that was the first congregation.  Little Dixie was the area around the Missouri River and north mostly west of Jefferson City.  These people came from Kentucky and Tennesee following Daniel Boone.  That's why it was called little Dixie.  Perhaps Booneville was the heart of Little Dixie.  The restorationists came from the Stone, Mulkey and O'Kelly movements.
 
What I do know is that restorationists from the Mulkey, Stone, and O'Kelly movement were meeting Randolph County, Arkansas on the Missouri border.  Some later came from the Jones, Smith movement and married into my Grandfather's family.
 
People from the Stone, Mulkey and O'Kelly movements started arriving in Green and Randolph counties Arkansas in some numbers as early as 1806 and they gathered congregations.  The Missouri/Arkansas line was not too well defined in those earlier years and I think there is little question but that some gatherings were formed in what is now Missouri.
 
At a later date persons from the Little Dixie region did some evangelizing and church planting in the regions on the border so that there is influence from the north.  But there was also influence from the south.
 
This is no big problem with me but I think the dating of the first congregation came from people who didn't know much about the southern border of the state and date the first congregation from the standpoint of their region in central Missouri.
 
 
Tom Olbricht
RiverWoods, P113
7 RiverWoods Drive
Exeter, New Hampshire 03833
----- Original Message -----
Sent: Monday, January 13, 2014 9:37 AM
Subject: Re: [STONE-CAMPBELL] Supreme Court Justices

Jerry, and others,

Thomas Allen McBride was a chief justice for the Oregon Supreme Court.  His grandfather founded the first Restoration church in MO in 1816 (plus many others), and then moved to OR.  TAB had a brother who was a US Senator.  I do not know TAB's religious persuasions, but it is difficult to imagine his being anything but a Restorationist.  Jerry, you might know the answer.  

BTW, Thomas Crawford McBride had been influenced by John Mulkey, and B.W. Stone was also a factor.  In 1816, when the first group of Christians only began meetingin MO, A. Campbell was in the Red Stone Baptist Association, and he had given his "Sermon on the Law" on Sept. 1, of that year.  

Y&H,
LMP


On Sun, Jan 12, 2014 at 8:47 PM, Rushford, Jerry <Jerry.R...@pepperdine.edu> wrote:
 
Tom and Phillip,
 
Yes, I was talking about justices on the U.S. Supreme Court.  But it is interesting to know about Jeffrey Boyd -- and before him there was Jack Pope from ACU -- I think he was Chief Justice of the Texas Supreme Court.
 
Tom, you are correct that Jeremiah Sullivan Black was a Disciple.  He was baptized by Alexander Campbell in Buffalo Creek behind the Campbell residence in 1843. 
 
Three weeks from tomorrow (Monday, Feb. 3) -- our fellow-lister, Terry Gardner, will be giving a lecture on Jeremiah Sullivan Black during the "Friends of the Restoration Movement" section of the Freed-Hardeman Bible Lectureship.
 
There is also Janice Rogers Brown who was an Associate Justice on the California Supreme Court from 1996 to 2005.  During those years she and her husband were faithful members at the Rancho Church of Christ in Rancho Cordova, a suburb of Sacramento.  In 2005 she was appointed a Federal Judge and assigned to the high profile U.S. Court of Appeals for the Washington D.C. Circuit.  I am told that she and her husband have continued to be active church members in the Washington D.C. area, but I don't know which congregation they are with.  She has served on the Pepperdine University Board of Regents for many years, and she continues in that role.  She taught classes at the Pepperdine Bible Lectures on at least two occasions during my years as director.
 
Jerry Rushford
Oak Park, California
 
 
 

From: Phillip Morrison [sclaus....@gmail.com]
Sent: Sunday, January 12, 2014 6:12 PM
To: stone-c...@acu.edu
Subject: RE: [STONE-CAMPBELL] Turner Tabernacle

I know Jerry’s question was about justices of the U. S. Supreme Court with a SC connection, but listers may be interested in knowing that Texas Supreme Court Justice Jeffrey S. Boyd graduated from Abilene Christian University with a degree in Biblical Studies, and graduated second in his class from Pepperdine School of Law. He was appointed by Governor Perry in 2012 to fill an unexpired term and will stand for election in 2014. He and his family are active members of the Brentwood Oaks CoC in Austin. His wife Jackie is Children’s Minister at Brentwood Oaks.

 

Thanks!

 

Phillip Morrison

 

From: Tom Olbricht [mailto:tom-ol...@comcast.net]
Sent: Sunday, January 12, 2014 7:34 PM
To: stone-c...@acu.edu
Subject: Re: [STONE-CAMPBELL] Turner Tabernacle

 

Jerry,

 

Jeremiah Black became the chief Justice of the Pennsylvania Supreme Court.

 

Did he become a Disciple?  I know he visited Campbell in Bethany, but and it seems to me he became a Disciple, but I may be mistaken on the later.

 

 

Tom Olbricht
RiverWoods, P113
7 RiverWoods Drive
Exeter, New Hampshire 03833

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RLLay...@aol.com

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Jan 16, 2014, 4:54:10 AM1/16/14
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Jerry,
I want you to know how much I appreciate and enjoy your various posts about your life's experiences and the people you have known. 
Lavelle Layfield
 

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Hugh Fulford

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Jan 16, 2014, 5:26:05 AM1/16/14
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Soon after becoming a member of this list, I recognized its great value as a source for  significant facts about various RM personalities.  I therefore created for my computer a special section of folders labeled "Brotherhood Personalities."  I currently have 126 such folders,  alphabetized according to the first names of the persons--currently running all the way from A. C. Pullias to Yater Tant.  I have just this morning created a folder for Jerry Rushford and added Jerry's most interesting post about his early life and preaching and the post below re his friendship with Elton Trueblood.  I have no idea of what use, if any, these folders may later be to anyone.  I only know they have become a means of saving information about various ones  who have in some way made significant contributions to the RM.  They are my own ready reference/easy reference archives. 
 
Jerry, I read Trueblood's The Company of the Committed well over 50 yrs ago, and somewhere in a sermon I have a fairly lengthy quotation from it.  It would take a while to remember which sermon it is in my category of "Christian Living" sermons or to search through the notebooks containing those outlines and find it, but it is there somewhere!  I may try to look for it a little later.  Thanks for stirring my memory of Trueblood's book, and thanks for your interesting and informative posts.
 
Hugh Fulford

Robert M Randolph

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Jan 16, 2014, 7:26:30 AM1/16/14
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Trueblood had been in Abilene several years earlier for a lecture at a Methodist Church and the lecture was likely tied to time at McMurray College. He was invited to ACU by Johnson for a gathering of students  and faculty in the Roberson Chapel. This would have been in 1963. The meeting was contentious and eventually broke up after several unpleasant exchanges mostly about Acts 2:38 with Trueblood contending that he knew the text well and thought the implications being drawn were nonsense.
The exchange sealed Trueblood's place in the pantheon of thinkers for many of us; others went to his lecture and later met again for conversation at his hotel room. It was a rocky introduction to the Restoration Movement and the beginning of a friendship for many with Trueblood.  The event caused some concern among the leadership at ACU and began Robert Johnsons fall from grace at ACU. He eventually left and finished his teaching career at John Brown University in Arkansas. I last saw Bro. Johnson at Pepperdine where he was being honored by the University and Jerry Rushford. It was a fitting occasion for a man who was both courageous and faithful.


Robert M. Randolph
Chaplain to the Institute
Massachusetts Institute of Technology
W-11  128


Tom Olbricht

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Jan 16, 2014, 7:39:24 AM1/16/14
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Jerry,
 
Great story about your time with Elton Trueblood.   I have heard it, of course, several times.  I know it was very important to you.
 
For the record [I make more mistakes than you] Trinity College is in San Antonio not Austin and Lewis Rambo's doctorate was from the University of Chicago, not Yale.  He took an M.Div. from Yale.  See below.  I think Lewis Rambo took a course from me when I first arrived at ACU.  As you may recall Marian Ruth Rambo Stevens was the wife of John Christopher Stevens [Lavelle will like this detail] and Lewis Rambo was related to her.  As you know too Lewis had a daughter who graduated from Pepperdine and he stopped in several times to talk when he visited her.
 
 

Lewis R. Rambo

San Francisco Theological Seminary
Research Professor of Psychology and Religion
Core Doctoral Faculty Member

At GTU since 1978

Ph.D. University of Chicago Divinity School, 1975
M.A. University of Chicago Divinity School, 1973
M.Div. Yale University Divinity School, 1971
B.A. Abilene Christian University, 1967

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Hugh Fulford

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Jan 16, 2014, 8:03:28 AM1/16/14
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One minor correction to the post below: It was well over 40 yrs ago--not 50--that I read Trueblood's The Company of the Committed.  (One of the dangers of early morning posting is that the brain calculator is not always working efficiently!)  And, of course, reading and profiting from Trueblood does not mean that I agreed with all his views, but that is also true of reading my own brethren.  But then I'm sure we all already knew that.

Ben WIEBE

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Jan 16, 2014, 11:18:08 AM1/16/14
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Jerry,

Appreciate your reflections on E. Trueblood. I took the same course in philosophy under Dr Johnson using the Trueblood text in my senior year at ACU. It opened up some new windows for various ones of us in the class; I remember that he also left some things simply open (to be expected in this kind of class) in a way we had not found in some other classes. I kept reading Trueblood's books in the 70's.

He came to Toronto (as I recall in 72) and we had an evening for "Conversation with Elton Trueblood" at one of the large churches in the city. There was a good crowd and some of the questions were about issues of faith and the secular society (the work of Harvey Cox at Harvard, The Secular City [1965], and that of John A T Robinson was all the fashion then); there were also questions about conflict and war. He spoke about the call to "make peace and the limits of war as an "instrument" for peace, he did not think the Christian could be merely passive in the face of direct aggression (he gave an example of someone being attaked before you and finding a way to intervene withut destroying the aggressor). He was well received. He had a large influence in his time but now his work seems largely left behind.

Ben





From: Jerry.R...@pepperdine.edu
To: stone-c...@acu.edu
Date: Wed, 15 Jan 2014 22:23:24 -0800
Subject: RE: [STONE-CAMPBELL] Elton Trueblood

Phillip Morrison

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Jan 16, 2014, 11:30:55 AM1/16/14
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The Bob Johnson I knew certainly was courageous and faithful. I first met him in 1957 or 1958 when I was the 24 or 25-year-old preacher at the Northwest CoC in Detroit. He and his family came to visit Mary’s mother and step-father, Gilbert Bradshaw, who was one of my elders. I was intimidated by Bob because he was 14 years older than I, much better educated, and had been an interim minister at that same church. But he soon put me at ease and became a strong encourager of my work. It is not surprising that he would see a fellow truth-seeker like Elton Trueblood as a kindred spirit. Bob sought truth wherever it might be found.

 

When we moved to the Ashwood CoC in Nashville in 1986, a woman came up to me at church and introduced herself as the Bradshaw’s granddaughter and the daughter of Bob and Mary Johnson. That church loved her through a difficult marriage and painful divorce. After we became Woodmont Hills, we were privileged to rejoice with Mary through her courtship and marriage to Bob Hemmegar. They remain good friends and faithful members of the WH church.

 

If someone has not already done the study, it would be interesting to see when in our SC history people from outside our heritage began to be used on Bible lectureship programs. I believe the current use of such people is consistent with our search for truth  in both academic and church environments. I also believe people like Bob Johnson at ACU and Harvey Floyd at Lipscomb would be welcome on those campuses in our current environment, and I think that is healthy progress.

 

Thanks!

 

Phillip Morrison

Hugh Fulford

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Jan 16, 2014, 12:02:32 PM1/16/14
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I am determined to continue in my resolve to not be the prickly and combative person I have been perceived to be in the past on this list, but I would like to observe that seeking truth wherever it is found is a two-way street, and that Trueblood perhaps could have shown a little more humility and openness to what he may have learned from the Acts 2:38 text from the ACC professors of 1963, in spite of (as reported by Bob), "contending that he knew the text well and thought the implications being drawn were nonsense."  I don't think we have to fall all over ourselves, feel intimidated, or be ashamed of our views, even in the presence of big name and highly respected theologians from the denominational world.  Humility, respect for others, and learning from others all ought to be two-way streets.  We have a message and a plea and we ought to be ashamed of it.
 
FWIW. 

RLLay...@aol.com

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Jan 16, 2014, 12:45:49 PM1/16/14
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About 50 years ago when Elton Trueblood was being quoted around Abilene, one Bible Professor was preaching on the subject of “situation ethics,’ and he quoted Elton Trueblood on this subject.

Since that professor and I were good friends, often eating together, I said to him that Trueblood had not plowed any new ground on this subject, that since I was just a kid I had heard people in our community say that “situations alters cases.”

I liked Bob Johnson. He also taught a course at ACC on World Religions. I think this is the subject that got him in difficulty.

To Tom:  Ruth Rambo and John C. Stevens were good friends. I visited with John just a short time before his death.

Lavelle Layfield

 

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Jan 16, 2014, 1:12:56 PM1/16/14
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Robert,
I have often wondered what happened to Bob Johnson after he left ACC. Is he still living and do you know where he is now. Thanks,
Lavelle Layfield

Hugh Fulford

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Jan 16, 2014, 1:22:32 PM1/16/14
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The last sentence of my post below omitted a very important "not" -- "We have a message and a plea and we ought NOT to be ashamed of it."
 
The devil maliciously inserted a "not" in his tale to Eve (Gen. 3:4); I inadvertently left out a "not" in my statement.
 
Hugh Fulford

David Sherwood

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Jan 16, 2014, 2:03:52 PM1/16/14
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Two very helpful books for me from Elton Trueblood were his Philosophy of Religion and his General Philosophy texts. One of his principles that I have found helpful over the years is "comparative difficulties." No human construct or formulation is without its weaknesses and inadequacies, including our theological ones, but that doesn't mean they simply have to be discarded--just held lightly and compared with the alternatives.

My only personal memory of Trueblood has to do with a retreat/workshop/conference event that I attended in Pennsylvania sometime probably in the early 1970s when I was teaching at Northeastern Christian Junior College. I can't remember exactly who sponsored it, but it was an essentially Church of Christ group in attendance. Trueblood had spoken more than once and was generally well-received. At the end of his final session there was a question and answer time. At some point one of the good brothers stood up and said something to the effect, "Mr. Trueblood, I can tell from all the things that you have said that you really know your Bible. Why it is that you are not a member of the Lord's church?" Trueblood first said, "Did everyone hear the question?" And then simply said, "I am."

Grace and peace,

David Sherwood, Editor, Social Work & Christianity

Robert M Randolph

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Jan 16, 2014, 2:35:45 PM1/16/14
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 I believe he died shortly after he was honored by Pepperdine.


Dr. Robert M. Randolph
Chaplain to the Institute
MIT    W-11 Rm. 128
40 Massachusetts Avenue
Cambridge, MA. 02139
617-258-5484



On Jan 16, 2014, at 1:12 PM, <RLLay...@aol.com>

Lloyd Pelfrey

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Jan 16, 2014, 2:52:18 PM1/16/14
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Jerry, the mention of Trueblood has generated several comments, so it was good to have mentioned him.  Your inter-actions with him have brought you some great memories. 

When I was in Eaton, OH, I contacted Earlham College and was ready to enroll.  Instead I moved to southeastern TN and preached there before coming to MO.  For several years I received alumni publications, almost as if I had completed the process at Earlham.  

Y&H,
LMP

Tom Olbricht

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Jan 16, 2014, 2:55:35 PM1/16/14
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Let me first say that while I had to read professors of religion of all sorts I never was assigned Trueblood to read either at Iowa or Harvard Divinity School.   I read Trueblood on my own and appreciated many of his insights.
 
Trueblood in the major seminaries of the time was not read that much though he was sometimes invited to lecture at them.  He was never seen to be in the same category as Rheinhold Niebuhr, Richard Niebuhr, Paul Tillich or with Biblical scholars Bultmann, Albright, Wright, etc.
 
These days I doubt if Karl Barth is read much at least in some seminaries.  So it is not surprising that Trueblood is not read.  Trueblood in a sense was more in the category of C. S. Lewis.  Lewis is still much read in some quarters but not in the seminaries.  There are organizations of fans of Lewis.  I know of none for Trueblood.  He is, of course, still remembered among  Quakers.
 
 
Tom Olbricht
RiverWoods, P113
7 RiverWoods Drive
Exeter, New Hampshire 03833
----- Original Message -----
From: Ben WIEBE

Tom Olbricht

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Jan 16, 2014, 3:27:44 PM1/16/14
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Bob,
 
You are correct.  I thought an obituary might be available but I did not find one in a quick search.
 
After Johnson's death some members of his family and others started a fund in the Christian Scholars Conference in his name which helps graduate students attend who are giving papers and who need and apply.
 
 
Tom Olbricht
RiverWoods, P113
7 RiverWoods Drive
Exeter, New Hampshire 03833
----- Original Message -----
Sent: Thursday, January 16, 2014 2:35 PM
Subject: Re: [STONE-CAMPBELL] Elton Trueblood

Phillip Morrison

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Jan 16, 2014, 4:52:15 PM1/16/14
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I don't recall just when Bob Johnson died, but think it was at least four or five years ago. I do recall reminiscing with his daughter about her parents, grandparents, and mutual friends at the Northwest CoC in Detroit. With respect to his ACU course on world religions mentioned by Lavelle, Bob made an extended world tour sometime in the early 1960s to observe various religions, talk with followers, and see first-hand the impact of the religions in their cultural setting. I can't imagine he would have taught anything threatening to Christians. 

Thanks!

Phillip Morrison

Ben WIEBE

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Jan 16, 2014, 5:44:53 PM1/16/14
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Tom,
 
I believe you are accurate in the observation that Trueblood was not perceived in the same category as the Niebuhr brothers, Tillich or with Biblical scholars like Bultmann and Wright.

It is interesting to reflect on why that might be. He was more of a person aiming to communicate with ordinary people than the others. I think he saw himself as doing much of the same kind of thing C. S. Lewis was doing. In philosophical acumen I think he was certainly the equal of the Niebuhr brothers, in Biblical studies he would not have viewed himself as equal to Bultmann or Wright.
Philosophy and Biblical studies have taken other turns in the last few decades that in large part ignore Trueblood's approaches. Perhaps more important, he was not from the "mainline" (in those days that mattered even more).

Ben


From: tom-ol...@comcast.net
To: stone-c...@acu.edu
Subject: Re: [STONE-CAMPBELL] Elton Trueblood
Date: Thu, 16 Jan 2014 14:55:35 -0500

Keith Price

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Jan 16, 2014, 6:18:59 PM1/16/14
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Jerry, I do not recall the occasion but I remember Joseph Jones mentioning the fact that he also met Dr. Trueblood and was blessed by the meeting.

 

Keith Price

 

stevew...@aol.com

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Jan 16, 2014, 7:47:43 PM1/16/14
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After graduating from Florida College, I continued at what is now Indiana Wesleyan University, where I took several theology courses under Charles W. Carter, editor of the Wesleyan Bible Commentary and founding editor of the Wesleyan Theological Journal. Dr. Carter had formed a friendship with Elton Trueblood (Earlham was only about an hour or so away) and Trueblood spoke at an assembly (Fall of 1969 as I recall) and then next year came to nearby Taylor University.  Part of his discourse included (what I suspect was a staple of his speeches) an exposition of the "Cut-flower civilization" concept. 

I had not heard about the confrontation at ACU a few years earlier. Of course he was no doubt somewhat more comfortable with Wesleyan theology, as well as personal friends with Carter. I remember he held the audience's attention very well.

Thanks, Jerry, for your account of Trueblood!

Steve Wolfgang


-----Original Message-----
From: Tom Olbricht <tom-ol...@comcast.net>
To: stone-campbell <stone-c...@acu.edu>
Sent: Thu, Jan 16, 2014 1:55 pm
Subject: Re: [STONE-CAMPBELL] Elton Trueblood

C J Dull

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Jan 16, 2014, 8:17:02 PM1/16/14
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In a lecture Sam once gave about his experience at Earlham, he also mentioned that another student in the same Trueblood class was Keith Miller, the author of the Taste of New Wine.  He suggested that what Miller did  essentially was to expand on the major points given by Trueblood in the course.  


C. J. Dull
3626 E. Hwy 24
Moberly, MO 65270-5514


-----Original Message-----
From: Rushford, Jerry <Jerry.R...@pepperdine.edu>
To: stone-campbell <stone-c...@acu.edu>
Sent: Thu, Jan 16, 2014 12:23 am
Subject: RE: [STONE-CAMPBELL] Elton Trueblood

Tom Olbricht

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Jan 16, 2014, 8:43:49 PM1/16/14
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While I think the Quaker view is counter to the Biblical faith from Genesis to Revelation, Trueblood was true to his Quaker heritage in that he held that what matters is what is in the heart (non-material).  Therefore old line Quakers neither baptize in water or take the ingredients of the Lord's supper.  They may not even sing because baptism, supping with the Lord, and making melody is all in the heart.  At least, so it seems to me the Quakers are more consistent than the Evangelicals who think that conversion is in the heart and has little or nothing to do with water, nevertheless take the ingredients of the Lord's supper and sing aloud.
 
We therefore don't need to agree with Trueblood but it helps if we understand and appreciate where he's coming from.
 
Exterior hard physical reality in the Scripture was created by God.  He saw that it was good.  Items from that hard reality have to do with a God relationship, e. g., water, blood, bread, fruit of the vine.
 
The hard world out there is being redeemed because of the death of Christ.  It is foreign to the Biblical faith to hold that only what is in the heart/mind (spiritual?) makes a difference to God.
 
Romans 8:21-25 (NRSV)
21 that the creation itself will be set free from its bondage to decay and will obtain the freedom of the glory of the children of God.
22 We know that the whole creation has been groaning in labor pains until now;
23 and not only the creation, but we ourselves, who have the first fruits of the Spirit, groan inwardly while we wait for adoption, the redemption of our bodies.
24 For in hope we were saved. Now hope that is seen is not hope. For who hopes for what is seen?
25 But if we hope for what we do not see, we wait for it with patience.

Not only is the Quaker view foreign to the Biblical vision but also the Platonic/Puritan vision that God is only concerned about the spiritual universe and souls.  Matter is foreign to God's salvific (Zounds! There is that word that makes C. J. cringe !) interests so claims Platonized theology.

So before we get too hard on Trueblood (and we should) let's get our act straight Biblically.

 

Tom Olbricht
RiverWoods, P113
7 RiverWoods Drive
Exeter, New Hampshire 03833


C J Dull

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Jan 16, 2014, 9:29:14 PM1/16/14
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Actually, I kind of like "zounds"; it even sounds like what it means.   The canons of criticism I was exposed to (and are not totally foreign to experts in oratory as well) suggest that the best procedure is to use a word that sounds like the type of emphasis one is talking about:  an impressive sounding word for a positive and important concept, the opposite for a negative concept.  I think "soteriological" sounds pompous, but I have a tough time hearing anything impressive in "salvific" (the ancients probably would agree because of the short vowels--maybe a pronunciation like JFK's would help), which seems to hint that salvation is distasteful.   "Saving" is a perfectly good word in my estimation and not obscure. 

Tom's point about (Neo)Platonic influence in arguing only for purely "spiritual" things is something that more preachers need to hear.  Now if scholars would only recall that one important segment of the movement--probably the most productive one--began by rejecting, not ignoring, infant baptism!

C. J. Dull
3626 E. Hwy 24
Moberly, MO 65270-5514


-----Original Message-----
From: Tom Olbricht <tom-ol...@comcast.net>
To: stone-campbell <stone-c...@acu.edu>
Sent: Thu, Jan 16, 2014 7:43 pm
Subject: Re: [STONE-CAMPBELL] Elton Trueblood

Robert Lawrence

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Robert Randolph,
    Thanks for the comments about Robert Johnson.  I was blessed to have had one if not two courses at his feet.  I've been privileged to meet many people of integrity, but if I had only met one, it would have to be Robert Johnson.  His convictions were not for market.  He would be his own man before God.  He would give to others the respect he knew they deserved; he expected the same from them, whether they were his peers or whether they exercised job authority over him.  It was a sad day for me when I learned of his departure from Abilene Christian.  Until your note I had never heard where he went after Abilene.
From this distance, I laud his irenic spirit, his sacred convictions, and his uncompromising character.  If he still lives, I will be indebted to anyone who knows how to pass my remarks on to him.
    All good wishes,
    Bob Lawrence
   
----- Original Message -----
Sent: Thursday, January 16, 2014 6:26 AM
Subject: Re: [STONE-CAMPBELL] Elton Trueblood

Joy, Mark

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Jan 16, 2014, 10:34:07 PM1/16/14
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From: Joy, Mark
Sent: Thursday, January 16, 2014 7:34 AM
To: 'stone-c...@acu.edu'
Subject: RE: [STONE-CAMPBELL] Elton Trueblood

 

I have also read widely in Trueblood’s works and benefitted from it greatly.  This discussion is interesting, especially Dr. Randolph’s comments about a contentious meeting with Trueblood and some students at Abilene.  I just read one of his works and noted that there were places where he seemed to critique some of the special emphases of the restorationist position.   Unfortunately I just read both The Company of the Committed and The Incendiary Fellowship and I can’t remember which of these  books had this material.

 

Mark S. Joy, Ph.D.

Professor and Chair, Department of History and Political Science

University of Jamestown

Jamestown, North Dakota

 

Rushford, Jerry

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Jan 16, 2014, 11:54:49 PM1/16/14
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Tom,
 
Thanks for making these corrections.  Yes, I heard Trueblood at Trinity in San Antonio -- not Austin. 
 
I had completely forgotten that Lewis Rambo completed his doctorate at the University of Chicago.
 
Jerry
 

From: Tom Olbricht [tom-ol...@comcast.net]
Sent: Thursday, January 16, 2014 4:39 AM
To: stone-c...@acu.edu
Subject: Re: [STONE-CAMPBELL] Elton Trueblood

Hugh Fulford

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Jan 17, 2014, 2:27:17 AM1/17/14
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Tom:
 
I believe every word of Paul in Romans 8:18ff, though I may not completely comprehend all of them.  However, I can grasp Paul's statement in I Cor. 15:50: "Now this I say, brethren, that flesh and blood cannot inherit the kingdom of God; nor does corruption inherit incorruption."  John said that in the eternal state we will be like Christ and see Him as He is (I John 3:2).  God is [a] Spirit (John 4:24), but a spirit does not have flesh and bones (Lk. 24:39).  Nevertheless, spirit is real. 
 
Too, I don't have any trouble understanding that Peter said "the (present) earth and the works that are in it will be burned up" (II Pet. 3:10).  "Burned" is the same word used by Jesus to describe what will happen to the tares (Matt. 13:30), and I don't think the tares will simply be scorched, burned over, and renovated for some later use.  Peter also spoke of the present physical heavens passing away (I think I understand what that means), the elements melting with fervent heat (I believe I understand that), and said that "all these thing will be dissolved" (I think I also understand the meaning of dissolved).  "Nevertheless, we according to His promise, look for new heavens and a new earth in which righteousness dwells" (v. 13), which I understand to be the new realm of existence for the redeemed, but totally different from and not the same as the present realm of existence.
 
There is much about the eternal state that I probably don't understand but I leave what I don't understand about it to Him "who does all things well" and trust His promises.  I am open to any enlightenment that you or anyone else may give me.  But I don't think I have to understand everything about the eternal state to understand Acts 2:38 (and other equally plain passages of scripture regarding salvation from sin) or what Jesus said about His Supper.  I am not arguing with you because I think you said as much yourself.  I'm just making some observations of my own for whatever they are worth.
 
Hugh Fulford
 
----- Original Message -----
Sent: Thursday, January 16, 2014 7:43 PM
Subject: Re: [STONE-CAMPBELL] Elton Trueblood

Rushford, Jerry

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Jan 17, 2014, 4:49:02 AM1/17/14
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Hi Steve,
 
It is so good to hear from you again!!  We have missed your stimulating posts.  Thank you for sharing the story about Trueblood at Taylor University.  We need to hear from you more often.
 
Here are a few final thoughts about Elton Trueblood.
 
When Dr. Bob Johnson and Lewis Rambo and I visited with Elton Trueblood on Wednesday afternoon, October 26th, 1966, in his Lubbock hotel, he informed us that he had been welcomed to Lubbock by Bill Banowsky two days earlier and Bill had given him a lengthy tour of the Broadway Church of Christ building.  He went on to say that Bill had not only invited him to attend their mid-week service on Wednesday night, but that he would like for Dr. Trueblood to come up to the microphone and "bring a greeting" to the assembly.  He wanted this "greeting" to be about 7 to 10 minutes in length (or he might have suggested 10 to 12 minutes in length -- I have forgotten the specific time that Bill was suggesting, but it was somewhere between 7 and 12 minutes.)  This was very surprising news.  I doubted that a non-member of the Church of Christ had ever been invited to address the mid-week assembly of the Broadway Church in its 64-year history, but I wasn't sure about that.  Dr. Trueblood asked us what he should speak about that evening.  There was a brief silence, and then I asked him if anything had impressed him during his tour of the Broadway building.  "Yes" he said excitingly, "I loved that sign!!"  I asked what sign he was talking about, and he said "you know, the big sign out front that says 'The Broadway Church of Christ Meets Here.'  The 3 of us couldn't stay for the mid-week service, we had a 3-hour drive ahead of us as we returned to Abilene.  But later we heard that Elton Trueblood delivered a powerful "greeting" congratulating the Broadway Church on realizing the great truth that the church is not a building -- the building is just a place where the church occasionally meets to be renewed in their Christian mission. 
 
In the relaxed Quaker environment of the Earlham School of Religion, we were encouraged to call our professors by their first names.  I found this difficult at first.  My inclination was to say Dr. Trueblood or Professor Trueblood, but after awhile it became natural to call him Elton.  There was a weekly tradition at ESR called "The Common Meal" or something similar where one day in every week the faculty and students ate lunch together -- and everyone was on a first name basis. 
 
Soon after my arrival at ESR, I asked Elton if I could have the privilege of picking up our guest speakers at the Dayton (Ohio) airport and also returning them to the airport.  When Keith Miller arrived in October, I picked him up at Dayton and we drove back to Richmond.  After he had lectured to us for a couple of days, he needed to go on to his next appointment at the Southern Baptist Seminary in Louisville, Kentucky.  I was assigned to drive him.  We drove I-70 to Indianapolis and I-65 down to Louisville.  That was plenty of time to have a substantive conversation.  I had read "The Taste of New Wine" two years earlier, and I was full of questions about his background and training and about the books he still wanted to write.
 
Bill Banowsky also arrived in October.  I picked him up at the Dayton airport and returned him there one week later.  Bill had written a powerful critique of the Playboy Philosophy (was this before or after his debate with Anson Mount? I can't remember).  Bill entitled his book "The Playboy Cult" and it was really aggressive.  Trueblood was impressed with the book and he encouraged Bill to submit it to his own publishers -- Harper & Row.  But the House of Harper thought the book's critique of Hugh Hefner and the Playboy Philosophy was too strong, and they would not publish it unless it was toned down.  Trueblood agreed to devote a week of his time to helping Bill rewrite the book.  I was somewhat involved in the project -- running down footnotes, making suggestions, repairing corrections etc...  and having lunch and dinner with Bill and Elton on a daily basis. The book was resubmitted to Harpers and they turned it down again.  Finally, Bill gave it to the Fleming Revell company and they ruined it -- first by changing the title from "The Playboy Cult" to "It's a Playboy World" -- and second by printing the dust jacket in purple and orange colors (I thought it had a psychedelic feel) -- and third by putting bunny ears on the "Y" in Playboy.  When you picked up the book you thought it was a defense of the Playboy Philosophy instead of a serious and well-argued critique of that hedonistic lifestyle.  The book did not sell many copies.  What a shame.  Bill should not have pursued a secular publishing company -- from the beginning he should have offered it to Baker or Eerdmans or IVP and he should not have compromised on the title of the book.  
 
When I enrolled at ESR, I still had two courses left to complete my M.Div at ACC ( I think it was called the STB degree in those days).  Dean Fred Barton at ACC had permitted me to take my last two courses at ESR.  Fortunately, I had one elective remaining -- and I used that for the course in "How to Write Books."  The other course I needed to take was Homiletics II -- and Elton agreed to guide me through that course as a personal tutorial and independent study.  He assigned me a lot of reading in homiletics, but he did something far more valuable.  We walked over to the Quaker meetinghouse (Stout Meetinghouse) on the Earlham campus one afternoon a week for 18 weeks (I think we almost always went over there on Thursdays).  I would climb up the winding European staircase to the lofty pulpit and preach my heart out to an audience of one.  There was no heat in the drafty old meetinghouse and by the time we got to mid-October it was really getting cold in that room.  I can see Elton in my mind's eye -- dressed in his overcoat with a scarf around his neck and gloves on his hands, and his arms folded across his chest -- staring up at me with furrowed brow.  When I finished my sermon, I would climb down and sit beside him on the uncomfortable bench and he would begin to critique my mannerisms, eye contact, gestures, voice inflections, and, of course, outline, content, and the pacing of the sermon.  I talked too fast in the beginning, but gradually I learned to slow down at key moments in the discourse. He wanted me to take my best 30-minute and 35-minute sermons and pare them down to 22 minutes.  This was almost impossible in the early weeks, but with practice I began to cut away the fluff.  Those Thursday afternoons in Stout Meetinghouse were a very valuable one-on-one experience for me.
 
In 1969 Harper & Row published their latest Elton Trueblood book entitled:  A Place To Stand (A practical guide to Christian faith as a solid point from which to operate in contemporary living).  One day in the late Fall of 1968, I was visiting with Elton in his office and I saw the final revised typed copy of "A Place to Stand" that he had submitted to Harpers for publication.  Now that the book was being prepared for printing, the company had returned the manuscript to the author.  As I thumbed through it, I could see that Elton had taken his fountain pen and made several last minute corrections in the final revision.  I was fascinated to see this original typed copy, and especially the final corrections.  I asked him what he did with his original manuscripts when they were returned to him.  He asked me if I was interested in having it, and when I said yes he picked it up and shoveled it into a beat-up leather case and zipped it up and gave it to me.  It is now in the Churches of Christ Heritage Center at Pepperdine.  Now, if I could just find Alexander Campbell's original manuscript for "The Christian System" and note his final corrections -- that would really be interesting -- perhaps even enlightening.
 
The Pepperdine Bible Lectures celebrated their 50th anniversary in 1993.  That was also the 11th lecture program I had directed, and the Pepperdine administration decided to honor me for those 11 years by presenting me with an album of letters of appreciation from various church leaders and friends.  To this day, I don't know who thought to write Elton Trueblood and ask him if he would like to contribute a letter.  I don't even know how they tracked him down.  He was 92 years old by that time and he was living in a retirement center in Lansdale, Pennsylvania.  But he sent the following hand-written note on his personal stationary:
 
4-2-1993
 
Dear Jerry,
 
When I contemplate eleven years of your Bible Lectures, I am deeply impressed. 
 
You are one of the most successful of my students and I rejoice.
 
My degree from Pepperdine is surely something I owe to you.
 
Our Yokefellow annual conference last week was a big success.
 
Admiringly, Elton Trueblood
 
 
I had forgotten about the honorary doctorate from Pepperdine.  In fact, that is a vague memory and I doubt that I had anything to do with it.  I am guessing that President Howard A. White made that decision in consultation with Norvel Young, Charles Runnels and some members of the Board of Regents.
 
On several occasions, Elton told me that what he had been trying to do with many of his 36 published books was to become an "American C.S. Lewis."  In his autobiography ("While It Is Day" 1974) he talked about the problem of belief and why he wrote "A Place to Stand" and he says:  "I had come to feel acutely the lack of positive belief on the part of millions, including many church members.  I concluded that it is possible to present, in small compass as C.S. Lewis had done earlier, a faith which meets the demands of rational examination.  The Christian, I was convinced, must be able to meet all opposition, and he cannot do so unless he has a firm base from which to operate.  Like Archimedes, he cannot lift anything unless his center is solid."  "A Place To Stand" is a short book -- only 128 pages -- and the 5 chapters are entitled: (1) Rational Christianity, (2) A Center of Certitude, (3) The Living God, (4) The Reality of Prayer, (5) And the Life Everlasting.  Chapter 2, of course, is the chapter on Christ.
 
That's more than enough on Elton Trueblood.  Hopefully, this conversation has highlighted some of the interaction between "the most quoted religious author in America" and the Churches of Christ.  Elton and I had numerous discussions about Christian doctrine -- some of them quite heated.  But we never loved each other less.  He was a father figure in my life, and he treated me very well.  I owe him a lot.  When I met with Robert Michaelsen and asked him to accept me into the doctoral program in American Church History at UCSB, he told me that he didn't need any more students.  I had driven 3,000 miles across America to meet him in person and gain entrance into this outstanding educational institution, and he was turning me away that easily?  In desperation, I pulled out my two-page recommendation from Professor Elton Trueblood.  Michaelsen read it slowly and carefully and then his scowl melted from his face.  "That's quite a letter" he said looking at me intently.  "Yes Sir," I replied. "It really is quite a letter." 
 
Michaelsen decided in that moment to give me a chance.  In less than a year I had become his primary teaching assistant -- occasionally substituting for him in some of his classes -- and grading his exam papers.  Looking through an old photo album today, I saw the picture of me and Michaelsen at my graduation party -- just the two of us.  He is shaking my hand and smiling.  I don't know what I would have done if I had failed to get into that doctoral program, or where I might be living today.  But I do know that I owe that open door to Elton Trueblood.  It wasn't the only door he opened for me, but it may have been the open door that had the most far-reaching impact on my university career of teaching, writing, and research.  
 
 
Jerry Rushford
Oak Park, California 
 
     
 

From: stevew...@aol.com [stevew...@aol.com]
Sent: Thursday, January 16, 2014 4:47 PM
To: stone-c...@acu.edu
Subject: Re: [STONE-CAMPBELL] Elton Trueblood

Phillip Morrison

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Jan 17, 2014, 5:45:38 AM1/17/14
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Jerry,

WOW!!

Thanks!

Phillip Morrison

Hugh Fulford

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Jan 17, 2014, 6:15:19 AM1/17/14
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Banowsky's book It's a Playboy World was published after his debate with Anson Mount.  The book was published in 1969; the debate was late 1967 or early 1968.  We had Banowsky come to Clarksville, TN in April of 1968 to speak on the Playboy philosophy.  This was after the debate  but at least a year before the book was published.  The Madison Street church in Clarksville where I preached was three blocks from Austin Peay State University and we thought it would be good to have Banowsky come and speak.  Mount, by the way, was born and raised in the little town of White Bluff, TN in Dickson County, about 30 miles south of Clarksville.  When Bill came to Clarksville he had already made his decision to leave Broadway and return to Pepperdine in a larger role.
 
Hugh Fulford
----- Original Message -----

stevew...@aol.com

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Jan 17, 2014, 10:42:09 AM1/17/14
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Thanks, Jerry, for your kind comments.  I have been absent from the list partly due to a move from one Chicago suburb to another (Naperville and Bolingbrook) as well as emergency abdominal surgery a few months ago (9 days in Edward Hospital in Naperville, and then a slower-than-expected recovery).  I had to cancel all my trips and speaking appointments for October and November, but am finally back to more-or-less "normal" (for me).  

And thanks for the additional detail about Elton Trueblood.  Just think -- if I had been in Marion a year earlier, or you at Earlham a year later, we might have met well before we did.  Some of the students in Charles Carter's classes discussed with him the possibility at one point of "cutting" some classes (with permission) to go to Earlham for some sort of conference organized by Trueblood, but I don't now recall the details of why we did not make the trip.  Most of us we just married and struggling to make ends meet while in school, I suspect.  

Do you know where Elton Trueblood's papers are located, and are they accessible and organized for research purposes?  You should write a biography!

Thanks again!

Steve


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To: stone-campbell <stone-c...@acu.edu>

Tom Olbricht

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Jan 17, 2014, 10:59:55 AM1/17/14
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Jerry,
 
Thank you very much for this detailed depiction of your times with Trueblood.
 
I will make some remarks on Robert Michaelson.  You and I probably talked about this somewhere along the way.  We both had the same teacher in Michaelson, I at Iowa and you at the University of California, Santa Barbara.
 
Robert Michaelson was a professor at Yale, perhaps one of their 5 year appointments.  I can't find on line any information about him.  He was appointed chair of the Department of Religion at Iowa in I think the fall of 1953.  I think it was the spring of 1954 when he offered his first course at Iowa, a graduate seminar on John Calvin and Jonathan Edwards.  Two people signed up, a man with a B. D. from Princeton who served as a minister, perhaps Presbyterian somewhere near Iowa City who had and I.  We read the two volume, Institutes of Calvin and two or three long essays of Edwards. 
 
When Michaelson and I bumped into each other in later years at AAR national meetings he would recall that I was one of his first two Iowa students.  He was a demanding teacher so I know you had to work hard.
 
 
Tom Olbricht
RiverWoods, P113
7 RiverWoods Drive
Exeter, New Hampshire 03833


ahighers

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Jan 17, 2014, 11:19:08 AM1/17/14
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Tom, I though ALL of Jonathan Edwards' essays were long!


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DLHc...@aol.com

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Jan 17, 2014, 11:24:05 AM1/17/14
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Dear Jerry, Bob, Tom and others,
 
What a blessing the past few weeks have been on the list! I am so thankful for Jerry's posts about Elton Trueblood and Bob Johnson. Amazing stuff. And I have known Bob Randolph since I was a little boy (or it seems that way) and never knew about the FFA. Now the gorgeous flowerbeds around his yard make sense. And I have always reveled in Tom's stories. I almost feel like I grew up in Missouri.
 
And Hugh, what do you think about preachers who presently have chickens? I just picked eggs this morning!
 
I just want to say thank you all for taking the time to share with us. You have enriched our lives and I feel like a kid sitting on the floor asking for one more story please!
 
So please keep it up. Someday an enterprising person will compile these incredible stories that are a part of our great heritage!
 
Blessings and Gratitude,
Doug Hall
 
Steve Wolfgang


Tom Olbricht
RiverWoods, P113
7 RiverWoods Drive
Exeter, New Hampshire 03833
----- Original Message -----
Tom Olbricht
RiverWoods, P113
7 RiverWoods Drive
Exeter, New Hampshire 03833
----- Original Message -----
Tom Olbricht
RiverWoods, P113
7 RiverWoods Drive
Exeter, New Hampshire 03833
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Hugh Fulford

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Jan 17, 2014, 11:38:22 AM1/17/14
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Doug:
 
I think it is wonderful that you have chickens.  There are some city dwellers in Nashville who have chickens in their back yards and some neighbors have created a ruckus about it.  I think there is an ordinance of some kind underway to allow people to keep a few chickens as long as they have a house or coop for them.
 
I grew up in a small town.  My daddy always planted a big garden of a wide variety of things.  I remember a yr or two when he even had a row or two of peanuts (soil of NW Florida conducive for such).  We had a fig tree in our back yard.  For much of the time we kept a cow in the back lot of our house.  (After we moved to Florence, AL we had a couple of milk goats.)  I had to milk either in the morning or evening and sometimes both.  We had laying hens some of the time.  I have never heard of picking eggs.  Maybe that's a Texas expression.  We picked figs, peaches, apples, blueberries, etc and "gathered" eggs.  To the say the least, I was subjected to a very character building environment as a child and young boy. 
 
Hugh Fulford
 
----- Original Message -----

Tom Olbricht

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Jan 17, 2014, 11:43:22 AM1/17/14
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Richard, George and others, I appreciate the remarks about my agricultural acuity.  I have plowed in more than one field in my long career.  I first taught a college course in public speaking at the University of Iowa in the fall of 1952, 62 years ago.  I have taught most years since.
 
Now I turn back to Bob Johnson.  What Jerry may not know is that Bob Johnson tried his hand at farming, or perhaps better yet, ranching in Oregon Country, Missouri, the county of my nativity and youth.  Bob did not live there since he was still teaching at John Brown in Siloam Springs, AR.  As a  part of his retirement investments he bought a farm west of Alton, Missouri, large enough to graze a fairly large herd of cattle.  That is good ranching country.  He bought the place sometime in the late 1970s or early 1980s. 
 
How do I know all this?  When Bob came occasionally on weekends to see the cattle and how things were going he attended church in Alton.  There he struck up a conversation with an older man who was a former vocational agriculture teacher at Alton High School.  Bob was having a few problems getting up and running so he and the former teacher talked at some length about what he should do.  The teacher himself had farms and raised cattle.  The teacher also occasionally went out to the farm with Bob to look it over.
 
It turns out that the teacher was Cleo S. Taylor, my mother's brother.  I stayed with Uncle Cleo and went to high school and worked on his farms.  It was from him that I took four high school courses in agriculture.
 
Uncle Cleo died in 1994 at 89.  Bob mentioned to me, when he came to Pepperdine for the award, how helpful my Uncle had been.
 
So you younger generation were surrounded by more would be farmers than you realized who disguised themselves as academics.  I'm still involved in ranching as an owner with our daughter of the family homesteaded (Grandfather and father) Nebraska ranch.  We have leased the ranch to one man since 1971.  He is the son of a friend and neighbor of my father.
 
 
Tom Olbricht
RiverWoods, P113
7 RiverWoods Drive
Exeter, New Hampshire 03833


Tom Olbricht

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Jan 17, 2014, 11:47:10 AM1/17/14
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Alan, True.  Some were longer than others.
 
 
Tom Olbricht
RiverWoods, P113
7 RiverWoods Drive
Exeter, New Hampshire 03833
----- Original Message -----
From: ahighers
Sent: Friday, January 17, 2014 11:19 AM
Subject: Re: [STONE-CAMPBELL] Elton Trueblood

ahighers

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Jan 17, 2014, 11:53:28 AM1/17/14
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Phillip Hathcock, a friend of mine, is the preacher at Amory, Mississippi.  His hobby is chickens.  He has a big chicken yard not far from his house.  He has several exotic breeds (I didn't realize there were exotic chickens).  He gave me some eggs the last time I was there.  They were large and small (Banty eggs), and it seems there were some different colors.  I was fascinated.


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stevew...@aol.com

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Jan 17, 2014, 12:05:52 PM1/17/14
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I see that a few are at Iowa (any Tom Olbricht connections with their location at Iowa?)

Our on-list librarians may well enlighten us, hopefully. 

http://collguides.lib.uiowa.edu/?MSC0710

George Cooper

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Jan 17, 2014, 12:12:08 PM1/17/14
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Listers,

Richard Hofstadter opened one of his books with the marvelous line: "America was born in the country and moved to the city." With all the farming posts recently, it might be a helpful to reframe our efforts and consider the farming and agricultural roots and branches of the SCM. It what ways were the SCM and its people shaped and influenced by agriculture--economic, ecclesiastical, theological, liturgical, social, educational.

Blessings!

Tom Olbricht

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Jan 17, 2014, 12:51:59 PM1/17/14
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George,

Enough of our preachers supported themselves by farming, perhaps first and
foremost:

Alexander Campbell
Barton W. Stone
Walter Scott (not always with greatest success)
Raccoon John Smith
Tolbert Fanning (Published agriculture journals)
David Lipscomb
J. D. Tant
Joe Blue
J. W. and R. L. Roberts

Not long ago our daughter complained that in the prayers at church lots of
problems of individuals were mentioned but nothing about magistrates and
world problems. I'm not saying this is typical in Churches of Christ, but
somewhat.

I compared us to the Anglicans. The main weight in the Anglican churches
through the centuries has been royalty and the upper class. It is for these
reasons that they always have prayers about the international scene.

I said our people have mostly come up from the farm and are not too involved
in the plights of nations.

Her response was that our people need to lift their sights.


In the thirties several preaches moved to jewelry

e. g. V. E. Howard, Arthur Taylor, Herbert D. Hooker, Irl Stallcup


Tom Olbricht
RiverWoods, P113
7 RiverWoods Drive
Exeter, New Hampshire 03833
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ahighers

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Jan 17, 2014, 1:32:42 PM1/17/14
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Tom

Someone described the Episcopal (Anglican) Church as "the Republican Party at prayer."



Sent from my iPad

Tom Olbricht

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Jan 17, 2014, 1:58:04 PM1/17/14
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Steve,
 
Thanks for this.  No connection of which I am aware.
 
 
Tom Olbricht
RiverWoods, P113
7 RiverWoods Drive
Exeter, New Hampshire 03833
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Wilson, John

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Jan 17, 2014, 2:28:16 PM1/17/14
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An elder at the University Church here in Malibu, who did not grow up in the Churches of Christ, likes to refer to what he calls the “Church of Christ Twilight Zone”—that mysterious realm which people in the Churches of Christ, no matter how differently they grew up, or where they are from, tend to always be able to point to some connection with each other.  I have known and associated with Tom Olbricht and Jerry Rushford for many, many years—but only now do I realize that we shared a teacher.  I, too, was a student of Robert Michaelson, and remember his class on Religion and Culture in America at the University of Iowa as a formative experience.   –John Wilson

 

From: Tom Olbricht [mailto:tom-ol...@comcast.net]

Sent: Friday, January 17, 2014 8:00 AM
To: stone-c...@acu.edu

Subject: Re: [STONE-CAMPBELL] Elton Trueblood

 

Jerry

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Robert Lawrence

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Jan 17, 2014, 4:43:33 PM1/17/14
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Tom,
    Anybody who has read both volumes of Calvin's Institutes deserves, well, I don't know what, but something good for sure.
    Bob Lawrence
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Sent: Friday, January 17, 2014 9:59 AM
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Robert Lawrence

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Jan 17, 2014, 4:54:52 PM1/17/14
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Tom,
    Only a few years ago Ruth and I drove on a Saturday to Fort Robinson, NE, as we had long wanted to see the "fort".  Much to my chagrin, I found few if any marks of a "fort" in my long-held notion of what a fort should look like: no sharp piked post walls, to top the list, e.g.  Had we known how close we were to your acreage we would surely have looked it up.
    Learning of my friends bucolic backgrounds only elevates them in my view.
    Bob Lawrence
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Sent: Friday, January 17, 2014 10:43 AM
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Tom Olbricht

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