Setting up Linux for Mom and Dad
KillDarren
too hard for the average user to use. That's just a bunch of MS
manufactured FUDge and this article is yet another example that proves it.
http://www.newsforge.com/article.pl?sid=02/03/07/1545228
Quote:
"My mom and dad run Linux. No, she is no nuclear physicist. She is a mom
who works as a government employee, a regular job. At her job, she uses
some kind of Windows. She knows it is Windows, but she doesn't know the
version, why should she care? She just uses Word and Excel. She started
using computers at her work about four years ago."
What were you saying about normal users and Linux XF, Warren?
.
> http://www.newsforge.com/article.pl?sid=02/03/07/1545228
Some time ago (like years), I posted about experimenting with my own mother,
who at the time knew nothing about computers at all. I wanted to see if shed
have a much easier time learning linux if she hadnt learned windows first.
I gave her a linuxppc cd for her macintosh (which shed just purchased and not
used) and a printout of instructions all about how to install and configure it.
It took her a few hours to figure out how to install it properly, but shes been
using it ever since and hasnt had a problem yet that she couldnt solve by looking
it up and following directions. She likes linux quite alot now, and relies almost
solely on it for her thriving graphic design business.
Her business would have been impossible to start in the first place while paying
extortionistic license fees at the same time.
-----.
--
Theres a hole in the world like a great black pit and
its filled with people who are filled with shit and the
vermin of the world inhabit it
Johan Lindquist
. <yt...@mutilation.net> suddenly blurted:
> Some time ago (like years), I posted about experimenting with my own
> mother,
Now /that/ is a very scary sentence.
cheers,
/Johan
--
Time flies like an arrow, fruit flies like a banana. Perth ---> *
10:30pm up 5 days, 11:20, 1 user, load average: 1.13, 1.20, 1.17
$ cat /dev/bollocks
optimize one-to-one e-commerce
Ian Pegel
<SNIP>
> She likes
> linux quite alot now, and relies almost solely on it for her thriving
> graphic design business.
>
> Her business would have been impossible to start in the first place
> while paying extortionistic license fees at the same time.
>
What programs does she use most?
--
Ian - looking through a glass onion
widefish
> relies almost solely on it for her thriving graphic design business.
You are a liar. Thriving graphics design business with Linux. This is not
possible. Linux doesn't have subsitutes for PhotoShop (and no GIMP can not
compete with PhotoShop), Freehand, Illistrator and other industry standard
graphic design software. Linux cult members stop your lies.
BTW prove your mothers thriving graphics design business and prove it is
done almost solely in Linux. Otherwise you are a liar.
Tom Cummins
Ouch! Sounds like someone is a little green with envy. Maybe widefish's
graphic design business isn't doing so good. Probably having trouble
just making enough money to recoup all the dough you shelled out for
Photoshop, Illustrator, Freehand, etc. Suuuuckeeer!
Maybe if you switched to Linux, then your business could thrive too,
just like that mother.
Peter Köhlmann
Hi Flatty. Got your latest shipment of pure unadultered shit yet?
Peter
--
Windows defines "userfriendly" by the requirement of a friendly user.
KillDarren
Accusing someone of being a liar when you have yet to establish any
credibility is a bit slanderous.
But let's examine your credibility - You say that '.. GIMP can not
compete with PhotoShop...' BZZZT. Wrong answer according to this article,
http://www.osopinion.com/perl/story/12934.html . This guy is using GIMP in
place of Photoshop every day.
Let's see what else we can do to trash your comments: Macromedia's
Freehand is a vector-based graphics editor which means it produces images
in a variety of formats such as SVG, EPS, or PDF. Now let's see a review
about creating vector graphics with Linux:
http://www.suse.com/us/support/howto/diagrams/
Adobe's Illustrator (can't you WinTrolls learn to spell for once) is just
another vector-based graphics editor, similar in functionality to
Macromedia's Freehand. Refer again to the preceding comment.
What else do you have to say? Something about 'other industry standard
graphic design software' ... mmmmmm ... where have I seen such a claim
like yours before? Oh yes.. Subzero's spanking ...
http://groups.google.com/groups?hl=en&th=4e75bddcdd0dcd93&rnum=7 Ever
heard of a program called VariCAD?? Seems about as close as you're going
to get to an 'industry standard' graphics design program as you can get -
considering there is no single 'standard' design program or even a
'standard' feature set.
Perhaps, you're more the animation fan? Try '3D Studio Max' on Linux, you'll
really like it. Did you like the CGI in the 'Final Fantasy' movie? It was
done on Linux. Did you like the graphics in the 'Lord of the Rings' movie?
It was done on Linux.
Linonut
He doesn't need to prove a fucking thing to you.
Linonut
> Hi Flatty. Got your latest shipment of pure unadultered shit yet?
P.U.S.?
widefish
GIMP instead of PhotoShop. He isn't using it for print work or photography.
GIMP has no CYMK, adjustment layers, LAB color and the most important color
mangment. That is calibrating your monitor to match your output device.
GIMP doesn't offer any of that so therefore it is impossible to use for
print work or photography. GIMP is only suitable for on screen display like
web sites but it is piss poor at that compaired to PhotoShop. Has anyone
had their ImageReady today?
widefish
> He doesn't need to prove a fucking thing to you.
So in other words you admit to being a liar.
.
> . She likes linux quite alot now, and
>> relies almost solely on it for her thriving graphic design business.
> You are a liar. Thriving graphics design business with Linux. This is not
> possible. Linux doesn't have subsitutes for PhotoShop (and no GIMP can not
> compete with PhotoShop), Freehand, Illistrator and other industry standard
> graphic design software. Linux cult members stop your lies.
Actually, im not lying at all. I didnt say it was a *huge* graphic design
business, I said it was *thriving*. Its her and one employee, and thats it.
She makes far more than enough money to pay herself an exhorbitant salary, and
keep her employee from stealing stuff.
> BTW prove your mothers thriving graphics design business and prove it is
> done almost solely in Linux. Otherwise you are a liar.
I owe you nothing, you insipid little worm. Especially not now that youve been
a complete asshole whore bitch with exactly zero provocation.
Roy Culley
yt...@mutilation.net (.) writes:
> KillDarren <KillD...@killfile.com> wrote:
>> I am sick and tired of hearing from all the WinTrolls about how Linux is
>> too hard for the average user to use. That's just a bunch of MS
>> manufactured FUDge and this article is yet another example that proves it.
>
>> http://www.newsforge.com/article.pl?sid=02/03/07/1545228
>
>> Quote:
>> "My mom and dad run Linux. No, she is no nuclear physicist. She is a mom
>> who works as a government employee, a regular job. At her job, she uses
>> some kind of Windows. She knows it is Windows, but she doesn't know the
>> version, why should she care? She just uses Word and Excel. She started
>> using computers at her work about four years ago."
>
>> What were you saying about normal users and Linux XF, Warren?
>
> Some time ago (like years), I posted about experimenting with my own mother,
> who at the time knew nothing about computers at all. I wanted to see if shed
> have a much easier time learning linux if she hadnt learned windows first.
I remember you posting that. Thanks for following it up here.
> I gave her a linuxppc cd for her macintosh (which shed just purchased and not
> used) and a printout of instructions all about how to install and configure it.
>
> It took her a few hours to figure out how to install it properly, but shes been
> using it ever since and hasnt had a problem yet that she couldnt solve by looking
> it up and following directions. She likes linux quite alot now, and relies almost
> solely on it for her thriving graphic design business.
As soon as a major OEM offers a preconfigured Linux box they are on to a
winner. Small businesses and freelance people would save a fortune. If
OEM's were forced to show the cost of the SW as a separate item on all
PC's just how many would be willing to pay the MS tax?
> Her business would have been impossible to start in the first place while paying
> extortionistic license fees at the same time.
Linux advocacy at its best.
.
>> He doesn't need to prove a fucking thing to you.
> So in other words you admit to being a liar.
That wasnt me, you incredible retard.
Now then, if you really want to prove your own intelligence (otherwise
I shall consider this thread over), you can look at my headers, take a
couple of educated guesses at what some of my past monikers have been,
do what is bound to be an extensive and painful (sorry youre such an idiot)
google search, and find the name of the business all by yourself.
Ill give you a hint: I first posted about it round about the end of 1998,
and not in this newsgroup.
KillDarren
You're a bit out of date .. the later versions of GIMP do CYMK .. if
using Linux for pre-press is that important for you, try this page:
http://www.linux4prepress.de/linkster.php3 .. you'll even find the link
to GIMP that does CYMK.
.
> On Thu, 07 Mar 2002 17:17:33 -0500, widefish wrote:
>> . She likes linux quite alot now, and
>>> relies almost solely on it for her thriving graphic design business.
>>
>> You are a liar. Thriving graphics design business with Linux. This is
>> not possible. Linux doesn't have subsitutes for PhotoShop (and no GIMP
>> can not compete with PhotoShop), Freehand, Illistrator and other
>> industry standard graphic design software. Linux cult members stop your
>> lies.
>>
>> BTW prove your mothers thriving graphics design business and prove it is
>> done almost solely in Linux. Otherwise you are a liar.
> Accusing someone of being a liar when you have yet to establish any
> credibility is a bit slanderous.
> But let's examine your credibility - You say that '.. GIMP can not
> compete with PhotoShop...' BZZZT. Wrong answer according to this article,
> http://www.osopinion.com/perl/story/12934.html . This guy is using GIMP in
> place of Photoshop every day.
Yep, its quite possible. There are *a few* high-end, obscure things that
photoshop does and GIMP doesnt (things like infinite nested layer undos),
however the final effect is precisely the same. You can make any picture
you can make in photoshop with the GIMP---but the path to it is often a little
different. Its even more highly impressive when you consider that shes doing
it with the same mac she was doing it with almost 4 years ago, with absolutely
no problem whatsoever.
Though I will admit that it was a little weird when I got a phone call asking
me if id had any problems with the latest glibc in reference to a couple of
arcane compiles.
Also, the printer she uses (most things are outsourced) has no problem at all
reading any file shes ever created with the GIMP. And ill tell you this, its
a much greater pleasure watching the GIMP manipulate a hundreds of megs large
.png on a 4 year old mac than it is watching photoshop choke on the same on
a 1.8ghz athlon. But alot of that has to do with the ppc architecture and a
lightly modified (her doing---she wouldnt leave it alone :)) kernel.
Now, I am not advocating the use of linux in any and all business environments.
I understand fully that it is not appropriate for *every* application, however,
if you are starting your own business and have little in the way of revenue and
are not lucky enough to have a bunch of VC retards lining up at your door, linux
(and any other free software you can get your hands on) is an excellent way to
save a few thousand dollars at the very beginning.
Especially if you dont have it.
widefish
graphics program.
KillDarren
>> He doesn't need to prove a fucking thing to you.
>
> So in other words you admit to being a liar.
No.. he has established his credibility to the newsgroup .. you have not
.. We have seen examples of his expertise and experience .. we have seen
nothing from you ..
He doesn't need to prove a damn thing to you ..
PS. Your info on GIMP is out of date .. it *does* CYMK processing ..
Amaze
> . She likes linux quite alot now, and
>> relies almost solely on it for her thriving graphic design business.
>
> You are a liar. Thriving graphics design business with Linux. This is not
> possible. Linux doesn't have subsitutes for PhotoShop (and no GIMP can not
> compete with PhotoShop), Freehand, Illistrator and other industry standard
> graphic design software. Linux cult members stop your lies.
>
Boy does this rant sound familiar. Coming from a Comcast server too.
Now what other wintroll do we know who used cable modem access and ranted
about graphics packages all day?
> BTW prove your mothers thriving graphics design business and prove it is
> done almost solely in Linux. Otherwise you are a liar.
>
If you are who I suspect you are, then that would be the pot calling the
kettle black.
--
The breakfast of champions is opposition
.
> Some Linux Cult member trying to reach the holy heaven of geekdom by using
> GIMP instead of PhotoShop. He isn't using it for print work or photography.
> GIMP has no CYMK,
The current stable version of GIMP does indeed NOT do cymk or halftone processing.
(look it up, moron) However, the current development version has implemented both,
and apparently theyre both coming to a linux machine near you with the release of
2.0.
Have you been watching whats been going on with modern printing technologies? Neither
of these things is as useful as they were 6 years ago.
> adjustment layers,
Yes, it does.
> LAB color
Yes, it does.
> and the most important color
> mangment.
Yes, it does.
> That is calibrating your monitor to match your output device.
Oh, thats what you mean. Sorry, I wasnt hip to your sophomoric and quite
incorrect lingo.
It doesnt need to do that, there are many other linux applications for it.
> GIMP doesn't offer any of that so therefore it is impossible to use for
> print work or photography.
BWWWAAAAAAAAAAHAHAHAHAHAAAHAHAHAAA.
Hey, are you that hick with the shitty hippie pictures from a couple months
ago? I bet you are. Nice to see you back, SHAWN.
> GIMP is only suitable for on screen display like
> web sites but it is piss poor at that compaired to PhotoShop. Has anyone
> had their ImageReady today?
You're still a shitty photographer, SHAWN, and neither photoshop nor GIMP
can ever, ever fix that.
Amaze
You know, you sound a lot like Shawn Grant and idiot who made exactly same
claims in almost the same manner. This arguement was dispelled months ago.
Do a google search and find out. Check out the Hollywood version of GIMP
for those features....http://film.gimp.org/
.
>> She likes
>> linux quite alot now, and relies almost solely on it for her thriving
>> graphic design business.
>>
>> Her business would have been impossible to start in the first place
>> while paying extortionistic license fees at the same time.
>>
> What programs does she use most?
That I dont know, but from the few times ive actually seen her work, she has
a few rxvt's open, the GIMP, gphoto (to suck down files from her keen Nikon
D1 that ive been coveting for some time), gqview, and something along the lines
of killustrator, though I didnt ask her exactly what it was.
And of course your run of the mill web browsers/email clients.
.
> Thu, 07 Mar 2002 at 22:17 GMT, peering quizzically at his shoes,
> . <yt...@mutilation.net> suddenly blurted:
>> Some time ago (like years), I posted about experimenting with my own
>> mother,
> Now /that/ is a very scary sentence.
Im glad somebody noticed. :)
Amaze
> widefish wrote:
>
>> . She likes linux quite alot now, and
>>> relies almost solely on it for her thriving graphic design business.
>>
>> You are a liar. Thriving graphics design business with Linux. This is
>> not possible. Linux doesn't have subsitutes for PhotoShop (and no GIMP
>> can not compete with PhotoShop), Freehand, Illistrator and other
>> industry standard graphic design software. Linux cult members stop your
>> lies.
>>
>> BTW prove your mothers thriving graphics design business and prove it is
>> done almost solely in Linux. Otherwise you are a liar.
>
> Hi Flatty. Got your latest shipment of pure unadultered shit yet?
>
> Peter
It's not flatty but one of his sockpuppets. Doesn't the subject and the
ranting style look familiar? (graphics, Photoshop, graphics, CMYK, graphics)
KillDarren
> What about color managment which is the most important feature of any
> graphics program.
You didn't even check out that link, did you? For colour management
systems, take a look at the links:
http://www.linux4prepress.de/domains/linux4prepress/linkster.php3?CID=4
.
In 1.2.3? (or whatever the latest stable is)...I didnt know that.
Looks like its time for an upgrade...:)
.
The link is appreciated, and ive updated my own knowledge.
Gratitudes,
Terry Porter
in smoke upside down, and at 500 feet with an old crop duster:
Well said Tom!
Imagine shelling out on Photoshop and then finding that the Gimp
*does* compete with Photoshop and costs *nothing*!
Rage and envy ...
--
Kind Regards from Terry
My Desktop is powered by GNU/LinuX. Debian 2.2 kernel 2.2.20
Free Micro burner: http://w3w.arafuraconnect.com.au/~tp/burn.html
** Registration Number: 103931, http://counter.li.org **
KillDarren
> KillDarren <KillD...@killfile.com> wrote:
>> On Thu, 07 Mar 2002 19:16:56 -0500, widefish wrote:
>
>
>>>> He doesn't need to prove a fucking thing to you.
>>>
>>> So in other words you admit to being a liar.
>
>> No.. he has established his credibility to the newsgroup .. you have
>> not .. We have seen examples of his expertise and experience .. we have
>> seen nothing from you ..
>
>> He doesn't need to prove a damn thing to you ..
>
>> PS. Your info on GIMP is out of date .. it *does* CYMK processing ..
>
> In 1.2.3? (or whatever the latest stable is)...I didnt know that.
>
> Looks like its time for an upgrade...:)
>
I don't know about 1.2.3 but the Gimp2 backend is now in production .. and it *does*
handle CYMK according to this bit:
http://dot.kde.org/974744841/974970910/
And this page has a link to a more current version of GIMP with CMYK and
Color Management ..
http://www.linux4prepress.de/domains/linux4prepress/linkster.php3?CID=1
(but you saw this link in another part of the thread)
I can't seem to get to www.gimp.org right now to get the actual links to
the versions with CMYK .. sorry ..
http://www.linux4prepress.de/domains/linux4prepress/linkster.php3?CID=1
Colin Day
>
> widefish wrote:
>
> > . She likes linux quite alot now, and
> >> relies almost solely on it for her thriving graphic design business.
> >
> > You are a liar. Thriving graphics design business with Linux. This is
> > not possible. Linux doesn't have subsitutes for PhotoShop (and no GIMP
> > can not compete with PhotoShop), Freehand, Illistrator and other
> > industry standard graphic design software. Linux cult members stop your
> > lies.
> >
> > BTW prove your mothers thriving graphics design business and prove it is
> > done almost solely in Linux. Otherwise you are a liar.
>
> Hi Flatty. Got your latest shipment of pure unadultered shit yet?
Now, now, don't you know that Microsoft always adulterates its shit?
Colin Day
Terry Porter
in smoke upside down, and at 500 feet with an old crop duster:
>Some Linux Cult member trying to reach the holy heaven of geekdom by using
>GIMP
Here are *some* of Gimps features of an *old* version:-
Features and Capabilities:-
This is only a very quickly thrown together list of GIMP features.
This is only the tip of the iceberg.
* Full suite of painting tools including Brush, Pencil, Airbrush, Clone, etc.
* Tile based memory management so image size is limited only by available
disk space
* Sub-pixel Sampling for all paint tools for high quality anti-aliasing
* Full alpha channel support
* Layers and channels
* A Procedural Database for calling internal GIMP functions from external
programs as in Script-fu
* Advanced scripting capabilities
* Multiple Undo/Redo (limited only by diskspace)
* Transformation tools including rotate, scale, shear and flip
* File formats supported include gif, jpg, png, xpm, tiff, tga, mpeg, ps,
pdf, pcx, bmp, and many others.
* Load, display, convert, save to many file formats.
* Selection tools including rectangle, ellipse, free, fuzzy, bezier and
intelligent
* Plug-ins which allow for the easy addition of new file formats and new
effect filters.
> instead of PhotoShop.
Karin, who is an architect and designer and a former Photoshop user in
both MAC and Windows environment, can only say this:
Compared to Photoshop, Gimp has it all, and even more if you don't buy
third party plug-ins. Most of the features in Gimp are more flexible and
powerful when you get to know them.The great thing is that Gimp supports
psd fileformat and Filter Factory afs files, so you can easily switch
from Photoshop to Gimp. Simply, it's a hack of a program and it's comes
loaded with a sack of plug-ins. So GO AND GET IT!! you will not be
disappointed, and well, it's not wrong that it is
free...
Karin Kylander & Olof S Kylander
> He isn't using it for print work or photography.
>GIMP has no CYMK,
RGB and CMYK
This is a common question when you are talking to color device end users.
As we've discussed before, the answer lies in the fact that a monitor is
based on the RGB color system and a printer is based on the CMYK color
system. Because monitors and printers use different color models it is
impossible to print the monitor data directly to the printer. When
you print your RGB image it will automatically be converted to CMYK.
> adjustment layers, LAB color and the most important color
>mangment. That is calibrating your monitor to match your output device.
>GIMP doesn't offer any of that so therefore it is impossible to use for
>print work or photography.
Printing from Gimp
Compared to Photoshop, Gimp is not as intuitive when it comes to prepress
issues. Gimp is more focused on Web design, and you always see the image
size as the websurfer would. Gimp has no dialogs where you can put given
printing values before your start creating your design. You simply have to
use your good sense, and a few calculations.
Don't worry, it's not very difficult if you just plan ahead a little.
If you want to adjust/calibrate your scanner, monitor etc. this has to be
done by hand. Does it sound complicated? Maybe, but on the other hand you'll
probably understand a lot more about prepress when you've read this chapter,
and you shouldn't have a hard time setting up your own prepress strategy with
Gimp.
Linonut
>
>> He doesn't need to prove a fucking thing to you.
>
> So in other words you admit to being a liar.
WTF??? Dude, stop taking that ecstacy man! You're brain is
frying!
Chris
--
Living large and loving Linux!
Road Menace
> > He doesn't need to prove a fucking thing to you.
>
> So in other words you admit to being a liar.
According to one of the biggest liars around - Shaun Grant.
Darren
> On Fri, 8 Mar 2002 12:34:03 +1100, tjpo...@gronk.porter.net (Terry
> Porter) wrote:
>
>>>Maybe if you switched to Linux, then your business could thrive too,
>>>just like that mother.
>>
>>Well said Tom!
>>
>>Imagine shelling out on Photoshop and then finding that the Gimp *does*
>>compete with Photoshop and costs *nothing*!
>>
>>Rage and envy ...
>
>
> Walking competes with driving and costs nothing.
>
> Doesn't make a good way to get to work.
>
> Sam
Walking usually does not meet 'timing' requirements .. so it is deficient
to my needs and therefore does not 'compete' with driving.
What the other poster was getting at was that GIMP will meet most users'
(including paid graphics people) requirements *and* costs nothing to
acquire.
Peter Köhlmann
> On Fri, 8 Mar 2002 12:34:03 +1100, tjpo...@gronk.porter.net (Terry
> Porter) wrote:
>
>>>Maybe if you switched to Linux, then your business could thrive too,
>>>just like that mother.
>>
>>Well said Tom!
>>
>>Imagine shelling out on Photoshop and then finding that the Gimp
>>*does* compete with Photoshop and costs *nothing*!
>>
>>Rage and envy ...
>
>
> Walking competes with driving and costs nothing.
>
> Doesn't make a good way to get to work.
>
Here it does. Walking to word means going upstairs and sitting down in
front of one of the computers.
Would be a hell of a drive.
Peter
--
Outlook Express, who do you want to infect today?
Roy Culley
lin...@bone.com (Linonut) writes:
> After takin' a swig o' grog, Peter Köhlmann belched out this bit o' wisdom:
>
>> Hi Flatty. Got your latest shipment of pure unadultered shit yet?
>
:-)
Actually, pus is flatties appetizer. It all boils down to a shit life.
Darren
Puss, Boils, Open Sores ... yech.. what's next? Oozing lesians?
Terry
>Thriving graphics design business with Linux. This is not
> possible. Linux doesn't have subsitutes for PhotoShop >(and no GIMP can
not
> compete with PhotoShop), Freehand, Illistrator and >other industry
standard graphic design software.
You must be completely out of your mind. Gimp is everything anyone could
possibly want for graphics.
The only thing it does not come with is brains for the M$ drones who need
them to know real quality software when they see it.
M$ boys, keep on playing with your toys. Serious computer users know open
source is the only possible option.
.
> <snip>
>>Thriving graphics design business with Linux. This is not
>> possible. Linux doesn't have subsitutes for PhotoShop >(and no GIMP can
> not
>> compete with PhotoShop), Freehand, Illistrator and >other industry
> standard graphic design software.
> You must be completely out of your mind. Gimp is everything anyone could
> possibly want for graphics.
Now youre out of your mind. Gimp cannot produce celluloid resolution in-line
skins to complex animated wireframe models in real time.
But then again, neither can *anything* that runs under windows.
:)
Darren
> Terry <tgab...@bellsouth.net> wrote:
>> <snip>
>
>>>Thriving graphics design business with Linux. This is not
>>> possible. Linux doesn't have subsitutes for PhotoShop >(and no GIMP
>>> can
>> not
>>> compete with PhotoShop), Freehand, Illistrator and >other industry
>> standard graphic design software.
>
>> You must be completely out of your mind. Gimp is everything anyone
>> could possibly want for graphics.
>
> Now youre out of your mind. Gimp cannot produce celluloid resolution
> in-line skins to complex animated wireframe models in real time.
>
> But then again, neither can *anything* that runs under windows.
>
> :)
>
LOL
You mean not even MS-Windows Paintbrush would be able to handle the job?