B5 game article
Jms at B5
folks might be interested.
jms
--------
'B5': Back B4 U Know It?
by Andy Patrizio
3:00 a.m. 20.Oct.99.PDT
The dedicated fans of a game based on the Babylon 5 television series are doing
their level best to find a new home -- and life -- for their favorite pastime.
When Sierra announced in September that it was killing off three games --
including "Babylon 5: Into the Fire" -- as part of a massive reorganization
that
included 105 layoffs, angered fans went bonkers.
"A lot of people wanted to take out the Sierra servers and do other things to
try and take Sierra out of the business," said Kevin MacNeil, aka Drazi Guy,
one
of the three coordinators of the FirstOnes.Com, a fan site that had been
following development of the game.
"It took about a week to get everyone under control and to get ourselves
coordinated and decide what direction we were going to
head," he said.
The plan was to spread the news of the game's demise to every gaming site and
Babylon 5 fan out there. It proved to be an effective
tactic.
One editor for a gaming publication said he'd received more than 2,000 emails
on
the issue. Wired News has also been flooded with feedback from upset B5 fans.
Another target was game developers, and that campaign has also paid off.
"There are four companies who have shown interest in purchasing B5. We are now
in discussions with all of them," said Dave Williamson, Sierra's senior vice
president of business development. "Some have reviewed what we've got and some
are in the process of scheduling meetings with us. So, we are actively pursuing
the opportunities."
The B5 team members, who were all laid off together, bonded quickly with the
FirstOnes crew. "They have been a great help for the team as far as morale,
when
it all first happened," lead programmer Dan Foy said.
Foy has been in the games industry for 10 years and has never seen anything
like
the FirstOnes' effort. "The show's popularity is certainly a part of it," he
said.
Another reason for the loyalty is that the developers took an active role in
the
FirstOnes forums to discuss nuances of the game. "People really enjoyed
participating with us and took it more personally when the project was
cancelled," said Foy.
Even though the B5 team has a good severance package from Sierra, the crew is
eager to renew work on the project. Foy said they need a pretty clear picture
on
a possible buyer within a month or they'll start losing members to other jobs.
At that point, a new team will have to be rebuilt, which would delay the game
even further.
He described the game as 65 percent complete. The engine is pretty much done,
but artificial intelligence and some missions still needed work.
The FirstOnes faithful continue their work as well. A Web ring dedicated to
spreading word of the game and trying to find a new publisher has sprung up. So
far it has 16 member sites. Petitions to find a new publisher have almost 600
signatures, and the message board on FirstOnes.com has 700 users posting to it.
How long will they carry the torch? "We're going to hold out until the
development team has moved on to other projects and there's no hope left," said
MacNeil.
jms
(jms...@aol.com)
B5 Official Fan Club at:
http://www.thestation.com
Tammy Smith
columnist about the Crusade campaign, someone who had obviously only
seen the early, TNT influenced episodes, & he said there wasn't much in
the series worth saving.
I hate TNT!
Tammy
MJB
Well, most journalists at the "Major" newspapers hate Science Fiction
(or won't admit they like it so they won't get teased by their peers).
They typically ignore or trash SF movies and shows (B5's finale was
completely ignored by the Wash Post).
They also tend to write about high tech workers (programmers/computer
folks especially) in negative terms. Whenever the Wash Post writes
ANYTHING about high tech workers the words "nerd", and/or "geek"
invariably show up in the article. I don't know why they have this
negative bias, but it's seems to be against anything high tech or
futuristic. So the columnist seems to be the rule rather than the
exception -- another narrow minded journalist (there are exceptions but
they can be hard to find outside the web).
Mac Breck
MJB <be...@erols.com> wrote in message
news:380f1cac...@news.erols.com...
>
> Well, most journalists at the "Major" newspapers hate Science Fiction
> (or won't admit they like it so they won't get teased by their peers).
> They typically ignore or trash SF movies and shows (B5's finale was
> completely ignored by the Wash Post).
>
> They also tend to write about high tech workers (programmers/computer
> folks especially) in negative terms. Whenever the Wash Post writes
> ANYTHING about high tech workers the words "nerd", and/or "geek"
> invariably show up in the article. I don't know why they have this
> negative bias,
A lot of people seem to have the need to deride or make little of those
things that they do not have the smarts to understand. It's their way of
making themselves seem bigger, or above it all. Most bosses I've known are
this way. If they don't understand it, it must not be important, or worth
their time. If *you* understand it, you are therefore beneath them.
You know, I've never actually heard a boss admit that he/she was wrong, even
to just one ot two people?
> but it's seems to be against anything high tech or
> futuristic. So the columnist seems to be the rule rather than the
> exception -- another narrow minded journalist (there are exceptions but
> they can be hard to find outside the web).
Just think, they're *supposed to be* open-minded and objective. Seems like
they bring along a lot of their subjective baggage with them.
Mac
Diane K De
>Well, most journalists at the "Major" newspapers hate Science Fiction
>(or won't admit they like it so they won't get teased by their peers).
>They typically ignore or trash SF movies and shows (B5's finale was
> completely ignored by the Wash Post).
>
>They also tend to write about high tech workers (programmers/computer
>folks especially) in negative terms. Whenever the Wash Post writes
>ANYTHING about high tech workers the words "nerd", and/or "geek"
>invariably show up in the article. I don't know why they have this
>negative bias, but it's seems to be against anything high tech or
>futuristic. So the columnist seems to be the rule rather than the
>exception -- another narrow minded journalist (there are exceptions but
>they can be hard to find outside the web).
>
Here are some of the exceptions--some of the Sci-Fi friendly reviewers around:
Marvin Kitman of LI Newsday. He's quite well known and wrote often about
Babylon 5 during its syndication days. However, Crusade disappointed him and
he wrote a tepid review.
Matt Roush of TV Guide. Before TV Guide, Matt wrote for USA Today and often
said nice things about Babylon 5. I first noticed him when he featured
"Intersections in Real Time" as a recommended highlight for viewers to watch.
Since getting the TV Guide gig, Matt has written many positive reviews of
various Science fiction series. His review of Crusade also indicated that he
watched more than War Zone to make a judgment. Then he just wrote a tepid
review.
{As an aside, I see Matt getting quoted a lot in articles about the Sci-Fi
Channel}
Tom Shales of the Washington Post. He is a tough reviewer, but he has given a
positive review here and there to science fiction series. A short while ago,
he wrote a review for Farscape that was a rave, without much hint of the
condescension to the genre that you cite.
DD
Chris Andersen
check out a new game called "Homeworld". It is a 3-D space
simulation/strategy game that comes the closest, visually, to matching the
look and feel of Babylon 5.
Brian Watson
"Homeworld" was produced by Sierra Online or one of it's subsidiearies.. the
same folks that canned B5: Into the Fire. I'm boycotting Homeworld and every
other Sierra Product. They aren't the same company they were a few years ago,
they dont' stand for the same thing they once stood for. I don't know why
Roberta Williams has allowed what the new folks have done, but I wish she
hadn't stepped down/sold the company/whatever.. Sierra has become the enemy.
Even if you don't buy it because of them canning the game, then don't buy it
because this is the same company that said months before the cancellation they
were excited by the game, moved nearly all of the employees for the game
across the country to a new state, let them work for a month, then fired
them. If a company has so little compassion for it's workers, it doesn't
deserve my dollar.
My suggestion, wait until you see it in a used bookstore, in their CDROM game
section (there is a local one here called McKay's, I don't know if it is only
a local store though) and buy it then. At that point, Sierra gets NOTHING
from the transaction.
Brian Watson
> Well, most journalists at the "Major" newspapers hate Science Fiction
> (or won't admit they like it so they won't get teased by their peers).
> They typically ignore or trash SF movies and shows (B5's finale was
> completely ignored by the Wash Post).
>
> They also tend to write about high tech workers (programmers/computer
> folks especially) in negative terms. Whenever the Wash Post writes
> ANYTHING about high tech workers the words "nerd", and/or "geek"
> invariably show up in the article. I don't know why they have this
> negative bias, but it's seems to be against anything high tech or
> futuristic. So the columnist seems to be the rule rather than the
> exception -- another narrow minded journalist (there are exceptions but
> they can be hard to find outside the web).
Jealously. They covet our great intellect, and we scare them. *grin*
Von Bruno
doing
their level best to find a new home -- and life -- for their favorite
pastime.>>
That is good news and I hope the B5 game finds a new home.
Personally, I think it would be great if the people at Sir-Tech were able to do
a crpg set in the B5 universe.
-Von Bruno-
Mark Alexander Bertenshaw
> folks especially) in negative terms. Whenever the Wash Post writes
> ANYTHING about high tech workers the words "nerd", and/or "geek"
> invariably show up in the article. I don't know why they have this
> negative bias, but it's seems to be against anything high tech or
> futuristic.
And they are usually the same idiots who spend their time scouring the web
to find "news", and don't even bother to check out the facts.
--
Mark Bertenshaw
Daryl Nash
> My suggestion, wait until you see it in a used bookstore, in their CDROM game
> section (there is a local one here called McKay's, I don't know if it is only
> a local store though) and buy it then. At that point, Sierra gets NOTHING
> from the transaction.
McKay's???? That must mean you're either in Knoxville or Chattanooga, as those
are the only two locations I know of. Unless it's another McKay's, of course....
Ah, I loved that bookstore....
Daryl
Juha Kuusela
> On a related note: people who are interested in the B5 game may want to
> check out a new game called "Homeworld". It is a 3-D space
> simulation/strategy game that comes the closest, visually, to matching the
> look and feel of Babylon 5.
No! It's Sierra game. Siarra canned the B5 sim. Don't buy Sierra products.
Death to Sierra...
Well, anyways, even if you think this "boycott Sierra" -thing is a bit silly,
I still don't see why you would want to buy Homeworld for your B5 game fix. I
have better suggestion: Independence War. It's a space compact simulator that
actually uses Newtonian physics engine as opposed to "flying in eather". Also
the lead designer of the game have openly mentioned Babylon 5 as one of main
scources of innovation. As a result the game has very nice and interesting
plot (with some B5 feel).
ps. A subtle hint: the game uses lightwave models and accepts custom scripts.
;-)
--
_-"Never hate your enemy - it affects your judgment." - The Godfather III-_
- Juha Kuusela - juh...@st.jyu.fi - http://www.jyu.fi/~juhkuus -
Mac Breck
made by Sierra. That is the sole reason I didn't buy it.
Mac
Chris Andersen <chris_a...@mail.com> wrote in message
news:cyGP3.980$As1....@typhoon.aracnet.com...
Brian Watson
Knoxville, actually. Yeah, the idea was a great one, I'd be surprised if this is the
only store of it's kind in the country. Why pay full price for CDs and books when
you can get them 2nd hand cheaper?
Shane D. Killian
>
> My suggestion, wait until you see it in a used bookstore, in their CDROM
> game section (there is a local one here called McKay's, I don't know if
> it is only a local store though) and buy it then. At that point, Sierra
> gets NOTHING from the transaction.
>
from there then there's more than one.
--
Shane D. Killian -- sha...@vnet.net -- http://users.vnet.net/shanek
"uuunnn k mmmmmmk hhhhhhhh khbbbbbbbbbbbh
gnhjjjjjjjjjjj rrrrrrrrrddddfc gvb uyyyyyyyhubbbbbbb"
--Sinclair Mitchell Killian, born 1/29/98
WWS
Brian Watson wrote:
>
> Daryl Nash wrote:
>
> > Brian Watson wrote:
> >
> > > My suggestion, wait until you see it in a used bookstore, in their CDROM game
> > > section (there is a local one here called McKay's, I don't know if it is only
> > > a local store though) and buy it then. At that point, Sierra gets NOTHING
> > > from the transaction.
> >
> > McKay's???? That must mean you're either in Knoxville or Chattanooga, as those
> > are the only two locations I know of. Unless it's another McKay's, of course....
> >
> > Ah, I loved that bookstore....
>
> Knoxville, actually. Yeah, the idea was a great one, I'd be surprised if this is the
> only store of it's kind in the country. Why pay full price for CDs and books when
> you can get them 2nd hand cheaper?
Half Price Books in Texas has the same concept, started out as a
small operation run by some ex-hippies near UT in Austin, and has
turned into a major corperation with outlets in every large city
in the state now. Then of course there's Powell's in Portland,
which is still the best used book store I've ever seen.
--
__________________________________________________WWS_____________
Idiocy abhors a vacuum, but it also abhors a room full of
people it isn't currently in, and so crashes the party. - jdn
M.E.Tonkin
>
> Brian Watson wrote:
> >
> > My suggestion, wait until you see it in a used bookstore, in their CDROM
> > game section (there is a local one here called McKay's, I don't know if
> > it is only a local store though) and buy it then. At that point, Sierra
> > gets NOTHING from the transaction.
> >
> from there then there's more than one.
>
>
And there are a couple of Richard McKay used bookstores in the
Washington,
DC area. Apparently the McKay family carries a gene for book selling,
"used" division. <gr>
MET
BRETNTRACI
>this is the
>only store of it's kind in the country. Why pay full price for CDs and books
>when
>you can get them 2nd hand cheaper?
There is Mr. K's in Johnson City -- it is doing very well (same owner I believe
-- I think they trade out inventory with McKay's on occasion I see the same
price labels frequently) -- Used bookstores are popping up more and more (there
are at least two others the area -- Bristol) but they have not goine that extra
step to expand to video, CDs, and CD-Rom. I love the places My wife get
computer game all the time and I have been building my classic science fiction
library.
Occasionally when I read a good book I feel guilty becasue I feel I've bilked
some really good writer out of a residual payment. I rationalize it by thinking
in the long run they are better off because I won';t be able to wait for future
books to make the rounds to the used stores.
Plus it's the only way to find out of print books.
Still searching for Othersyde...
brett
Vesa Juusola
[ Your display is set for the "US-ASCII" character set. ]
[ Some characters may be displayed incorrectly. ]
Jms at B5 <jms...@aol.com> wrote:
> This got sent to me from someone who got it off the Wired.com site
> ...figured folks might be interested.
Death - been there, done that.
[ These quotes work everywhere! ]
We'll keep trying until it's back alive again. Then I'll email Sierra's
execs with another quote by JMS, starting with words "Dedicated to ..."
--
Vesa Juusola
Editor & owner of B5SCS Finland,
a finnish daily updated website dedicated to the game.
Louise Taylor
> You know, I've never actually heard a boss admit that he/she was wrong, even
> to just one ot two people?
My boss made that admission in a group meeting one day. We all just sat
there and stared until I picked up my pencil and marked it on the
calendar. :-)
Louise
Ed Collins
> Chris Andersen <chris_a...@mail.com> wrote:
> Well, anyways, even if you think this "boycott Sierra" -thing is a bit silly,
> I still don't see why you would want to buy Homeworld for your B5 game fix. I
> have better suggestion: Independence War. It's a space compact simulator that
> actually uses Newtonian physics engine as opposed to "flying in eather". Also
> the lead designer of the game have openly mentioned Babylon 5 as one of main
> scources of innovation. As a result the game has very nice and interesting
> plot (with some B5 feel).
If you look at the story close enough you'll realise that it's a
ripoff of BattleStar Galactica. A race chased off their world by
an enemy force after they discover about their true homeworld and they
set out in a convoy heading towards there. Authors have said how
they're BG fans but for obvious copyright reasons couldn't call it
that. :)
Ed.
--
The World Foundry LLC - Amiga Game Developers - Amiga PPC
Explorer 2260 - The Future of 3D Space Exploration Games
Maim & Mangle - Advanced 3D RTS Game
Chris Andersen
news:7uo3rp$sqg$1...@mordred.cc.jyu.fi...
> Chris Andersen <chris_a...@mail.com> wrote:
> > On a related note: people who are interested in the B5 game may want to
> > check out a new game called "Homeworld". It is a 3-D space
> > simulation/strategy game that comes the closest, visually, to matching
the
> > look and feel of Babylon 5.
>
> Death to Sierra...
Interesting. Especially considering how similar some of the ship designs in
Homeworld are to Earth Force battle cruisers.
Brian Watson
Well when I really want a particular book that's coming out, I dont' wait for a
used copy to show up at the used bookstore, case in point the PsiCorp trilogy. The
big problem with the used bookstore is the hit and miss luck of finding a book you
are looking for. But they are good for some more unusual books. I've found a
dozen books by Jonathan Gash, the "Lovejoy" series about a slightly corrupt but
ultimately heart of gold antique dealer with a penchant for the ladies. Then of
course theres tons of Stephen King's books, and much of the other 'popular'
novelists out there.
Mac Breck
Compare
Sierra - Babylon 5 "Into The Fire" - Homeworld
to
Microsoft - Foxpro - Access
Take ideas/parts from one to use in the other.
Mac
Chris Andersen <chris_a...@mail.com> wrote in message
news:IFNP3.1011$As1....@typhoon.aracnet.com...
Jeffrey MacHott
BRETNTRACI wrote in message
<19991023091208...@ng-fe1.aol.com>...
>>Knoxville, actually. Yeah, the idea was a great one, I'd be surprised if
>>this is the
>>only store of it's kind in the country. Why pay full price for CDs and
books
>>when
>>you can get them 2nd hand cheaper?
>
>There is Mr. K's in Johnson City -- it is doing very well (same owner I
believe
>-- I think they trade out inventory with McKay's on occasion I see the same
>price labels frequently) --
There's a place in Lawton, OK called The Book Stall, though they don't sell
any Babylon 5 stuff that I could see, they had plenty of other books there.
>Used bookstores are popping up more and more (there
>are at least two others the area -- Bristol) but they have not goine that
extra
>step to expand to video, CDs, and CD-Rom. I love the places My wife get
>computer game all the time and I have been building my classic science
fiction
>library.
>Occasionally when I read a good book I feel guilty becasue I feel I've
bilked
>some really good writer out of a residual payment. I rationalize it by
thinking
>in the long run they are better off because I won';t be able to wait for
future
>books to make the rounds to the used stores.
>Plus it's the only way to find out of print books.
>Still searching for Othersyde...
>brett
Ooh, if you see a book called "End Run" see if you can tell me, okay? :*)
--Ragu Leader
"Unfortunately you have reached tech support" --Electronic Arts Tech Support
Jeffrey MacHott
Juha Kuusela wrote in message <7uo3rp$sqg$1...@mordred.cc.jyu.fi>...
>Chris Andersen <chris_a...@mail.com> wrote:
>> On a related note: people who are interested in the B5 game may want to
>> check out a new game called "Homeworld". It is a 3-D space
>> simulation/strategy game that comes the closest, visually, to matching
the
>> look and feel of Babylon 5.
>
>No! It's Sierra game. Siarra canned the B5 sim. Don't buy Sierra products.
>Death to Sierra...
>
silly,
>I still don't see why you would want to buy Homeworld for your B5 game fix.
I
>have better suggestion: Independence War. It's a space compact simulator
that
>actually uses Newtonian physics engine as opposed to "flying in eather".
Also
>the lead designer of the game have openly mentioned Babylon 5 as one of
main
>scources of innovation. As a result the game has very nice and interesting
>plot (with some B5 feel).
>
scripts.
>;-)
>
Hmm... replace the Drednought with the White Star, thrown in a bunch of
other EF ships... I think someone used Lightwave to make a Shadow BattleCrab
for Wing Commander Prophecy... :*)
--Ragu Leader
"Unfortunately you have reached tech support" --Electronic Arts Tech Support
>
Juha Kuusela
> If you look at the story close enough you'll realise that it's a
> ripoff of BattleStar Galactica. A race chased off their world by
> an enemy force after they discover about their true homeworld and they
> set out in a convoy heading towards there. Authors have said how
> they're BG fans but for obvious copyright reasons couldn't call it
> that. :)
Just to clarify: Ed is writing about Homeworld being BG ripoff, not IWar.
In IWar humans do well know where Earth is. :-)
Simo Aaltonen
>No! It's Sierra game. Siarra canned the B5 sim. Don't buy Sierra products.
>Death to Sierra...
I realise you're probably not 100% serious about this (Sierra's demise
would mean hundreds or thousands of people losing their jobs), but...
Boycotting Sierra or sending them angry letters or e-mails won't achieve
anything except give B5 fans a bad name, and make them even less
interested in continuing the project (not that they're going to, but
anyway).
Besides, Gabriel Knight 3 is coming out soon from Sierra! That's one game
I wouldn't miss even if it meant a whole host of B5 games being released
AND Crusade being renewed (errm, yes, I do rather like the GK series)...
-sIMO aaltonen
---
"Don't these sausages look kind of pale to you?"
-GK, GK2
Daryl Nash
> >Knoxville, actually. Yeah, the idea was a great one, I'd be surprised if
> >this is the
> >only store of it's kind in the country. Why pay full price for CDs and books
> >when
> >you can get them 2nd hand cheaper?
>
> There is Mr. K's in Johnson City -- it is doing very well (same owner I believe
> -- I think they trade out inventory with McKay's on occasion I see the same
> price labels frequently) --
The only Mr. K's I know of is in Oak Ridge, but perhaps there is a sister store?
I'm fairly certain that it was bought from McKay's and is under different
management. They still do have McKay's stickers left over from the olden days
tho... (I think it's been about three or four years since they changed names.) I
still visit friends up there occasionally, and most always stop in at either Mr.
K's or McKay's, since they are such wonderful bookstores.
FYI, if you're looking for out of print books, try the 'net. There are lots of
options. The books will cost more than at McKay's, but if they're ones that are
especially hard to find, it might be worth it. Try Barnes and Noble, or
www.bibliofind.com, or www.alibris.com.
Daryl
JBONETATI
Still searching for Othersyde...
brett>>
Brett,
Try www.bibliofind.com I don't see it listed right now but I believe you
can put a search in so that you'll be notified if it's listed. I've heard that
Amazon.com uses this for many of it's out of print searches.
Also, I've seen it on Ebay a few times.
Hope this helps,
Jan
Jon Niehof
Boutique frequently has a bin of pre-owned.
I highly recommend Descent: Freespace (Conflict: Freespace
overseas). Plot's much thicker in Freespace2, but both are
very good.
--Jon, N9RUJ jnie...@calvin.edu www.calvin.edu/~jnieho38
This is Linux country. On a clear night, you can hear Windows reboot.