The reaction to Racing The Night
Emmanuel Goldstein
of Crusade the overwhelming response to this episode. What's troubling is
that so many people who had doubts before *now* believe the show simply
has to be saved. I only hope it's not too late. The time to call SciFi
was early on when, even if the show wasn't perfect, it showed potential.
I fail to see how anyone could believe Crusade didn't at least have that,
especially when considering JMS's track record. Now that most of us seem
to at last agree on this point, please call SciFi during the week at
(212) 413-5000 (after hours enter extension 84393 for the viewer line)
or (god forbid) *write* to them at scifi channel, 1230 avenue of the americas,
20th floor, new york, ny 10020. You might also point out how your opinion
changed as soon as you saw the episodes that TNT had *nothing* to do with.
I'm sure they'll like to hear that.
emmanuel
Tammy Smith
Crusade--I've seen worse on other series. But if RtN is really as good
as people say (I won't see it until the Monday showing), then I really,
really hope Crusade is renewed!
Tammy
MarcusCoIe
>changed as soon as you saw the episodes that TNT had *nothing* to do with.
I am not standing up for TNT here, but again I must point out what has been
said in other posts. All 13 episodes that TNT is airing have been stated by JMS
to be *"True Crusade"* as he saw it in his vision.
The show was stopped by TNT after they wanted to interfere. Since JMS did not
agree to the changes, TNT stopped production.
I am not justifying what TNT did, but you can not blame them for the shows
problems so far.
roanna
MarcusCoIe wrote:
> >You might also point out how your opinion
> >changed as soon as you saw the episodes that TNT had *nothing* to do with.
>
> I am not standing up for TNT here, but again I must point out what has been
> said in other posts. All 13 episodes that TNT is airing have been stated by JMS
> to be *"True Crusade"* as he saw it in his vision.
They also had just gone into a hiatus after the first 5, and apparently established
that they wanted things done differently or production would not start up again.
Like Dureena looking less "Alien". Like lots more exposition to explain premises
in an "A B C" fashion instead of the "jigsaw" puzzle exposition evident in RtN.
Like Trace's addition to the cast. Like adding some sex in for spicing things up.
JMS certainly is a producer with a strong vision, and he has indicated in other
posts that he didn't give up anything substantial, to his mind, but there is an
effect to having a sword hanging over your head. TNT is responsible for the notes
and changes
THEY initiated.
>
>
> The show was stopped by TNT after they wanted to interfere. Since JMS did not
> agree to the changes, TNT stopped production.
For the second time.
>
>
> I am not justifying what TNT did, but you can not blame them for the shows
> problems so far.
On your job, if the CEO of the company dropped by your desk, or called you to her
office to offer "helpful" hints how to do the job they hired you as an expert to
do, and you knew that she was ready and able to pull the plug on not just you, but
your entire department, because she's already suspended production once, would you
feel you were in a situation that allowed you and your team to perform to your
peak?
Hiring a subject expert and then micromanaging them is BAD BUSINESS. Not uncommon,
unfortunately, but not productive.
I only hope that it brings these businessmen verrry bad mojo, baaaby...
Roanna
Jms at B5
>said in other posts. All 13 episodes that TNT is airing have been stated by
>JMS
>to be *"True Crusade"* as he saw it in his vision.
>
>agree to the changes, TNT stopped production.
>
Not entirely true. The 20 pages of notes we got that were truly offensive were
turned down by me.
But they kept after us on other stuff on a daily basis. They wanted Dureena's
makeup softened, on the theory that it was a cliche if she actually *looked*
like an alien...they kept making demands of other scripts, including revisions
in such already finished scripts as "Well" that weakened the script...
What I said was that "War Zone" was the only one written at TNT's behest, not
that they didn't have input into the rest of them. It was only with
"Appearances" that I finally hit the wall and simply stopped taking their
notes.
Every day there was a campaign of attrition and the constant threat that if
things weren't done, either the first shut-down would be permanent, or there
would be another shut-down. The show was essentially held hostage.
I think that there's more positive than negative in all the episodes aired, and
I'm proud of what we did under the conditions under which we had to labor; but
understand that their fingerprints are on all of the first 8 to various
degrees. I separated War Zone from the rest because structurally, that's a
story I would never have told if there wasn't a gun to my head.
The only episodes totally free of interference are the first 5 shot.
jms
(jms...@aol.com)
B5 Official Fan Club at:
http://www.thestation.com
Rob Perkins
were
> turned down by me.
interesting insight into what TV executives really think I want to watch.
[...]
> They wanted Dureena's
> makeup softened, on the theory that it was a cliche if she actually
*looked*
> like an alien
I don't understand the TNT people; I always thought the actual cliche was
aliens that always always look like human beings. "...prosthetic foreheads
on their real heads" (*) and so forth. IMO, it was very refreshing to see
aliens like G'Kar, and the Pak'ma'ra, etc. I was tired of "Star Trek" style
aliens when I first saw Bablyon 5.
[...]
> Every day there was a campaign of attrition and the constant threat that
if
> things weren't done, either the first shut-down would be permanent, or
there
> would be another shut-down. The show was essentially held hostage.
This is the reason men like George Lucas keep such iron-handed control over
their creations, isn't it?
> The only episodes totally free of interference are the first 5 shot.
Of all the episodes aired to date, I have enjoyed the last two ("Racing the
Night" and "The Memory of War") the most. Now that JMS has said this, I have
a reason why, because it's been hard for me to pinpoint *exactly* what made
me uncomfortable about the other stories. I thought "Racing the Night" was a
much better episode than "War Zone", and made a much much more intelligent
introduction to the series and its premise. I wish more series' would be
this mindful of my ability to follow a plot, and identify a theme.
JMS, the one thing I would like out of this series is to see it continue, so
that you and other storytellers can write and produce the kind of
intelligent television that I, thanks to Babylon 5, have come to consider
the "minimum requirement" for good TV, broadcast, cable, or otherwise. The
truth is, I've stopped watching other episodic television almost completely.
Barring this, I wonder what will you do with the unproduced screenplays for
Crusade? It would be nice to read those stories if I can't see them, either
in script form, or comics, or as novels that are as adroitly written as
_Dark Genesis_ was. I would be willing to pay money and my compliments for
the opportunity to continue experiencing "Crusade" in any form.
Rob
(*) apologies to They Might Be Giants...
Jay Denebeim
Jms at B5 <jms...@aol.com> wrote:
>Not entirely true. The 20 pages of notes we got that were truly
>offensive were turned down by me.
Would you mind making a list for us? I realize this could be painful
or hopefully vindicative, so don't do it if it hurts.
>The only episodes totally free of interference are the first 5 shot.
Well, not quite... Average breast size on Crusade is about 3 times
that of B5 :-)
Jay
--
* Jay Denebeim Moderator rec.arts.sf.tv.babylon5.moderated *
* newsgroup submission address: b5...@deepthot.aurora.co.us *
* moderator contact address: b5mod-...@deepthot.aurora.co.us *
* personal contact address: dene...@deepthot.aurora.co.us *
Brian Watson
> The only episodes totally free of interference are the first 5 shot.
>
> jms
>
> (jms...@aol.com)
> B5 Official Fan Club at:
And the difference of quality /shows/ Just goes to further proof that creativity
by committee does nothing more than fester.
Mena Ryan
>
> Hiring a subject expert and then micromanaging them is BAD BUSINESS. Not uncommon,
> unfortunately, but not productive.
>
> I only hope that it brings these businessmen verrry bad mojo, baaaby...
>
> Roanna
"Welcome to NBC, Mr. Roddenberry."
Mena
(Trying to help you invoke hubris but will settle for the Narns...)
Tom Maddox
>In article <19990810023957...@ng-ck1.aol.com>,
>Jms at B5 <jms...@aol.com> wrote:
>
>>Not entirely true. The 20 pages of notes we got that were truly
>>offensive were turned down by me.
>
>Would you mind making a list for us? I realize this could be painful
>or hopefully vindicative, so don't do it if it hurts.
Hey, Jay's back!
>>The only episodes totally free of interference are the first 5 shot.
>
>Well, not quite... Average breast size on Crusade is about 3 times
>that of B5 :-)
Well, the *size* is not, I think, so much larger, but the emphasis put on them
by clothing certainly is. Look at Dureena's costume in "A Call to Arms," and
then look at it in Crusade, you'll see what I mean.
"Those you cannot teach to fly, teach to fall faster." -- Nietzsche
<mailto:tma...@dnai.com> | I'd use a spam trap, but I have enough.
Pelzo63
ahem....spoiler space....for...sorta spoilers
>Well, the *size* is not, I think, so much larger, but the emphasis put on
>them
>by clothing certainly is. Look at Dureena's costume in "A Call to Arms," >and
>then look at it in Crusade, you'll see what I mean.
i've been resisting commenting on this, but i just couldn't help but notice,
and with 2 posts in a row on this...erm....subject...(one by the mod..whew).
has anyone else noticed that, judging by the actresses, umm...attributes, that
it frequently seems to be "cold" on the B5 set? <g> not that i'm complaining,
it just seems to be "colder" on the B5 set than on most other shows on
tv(Baywatch and other "babewatch" shows excluded, of course).
just an...umm..observation.(examples, Delenn in Comes the inquisitor, and dr
chambers in patterns of the soul come to mind off the top of my head :-)
--Chris AOL/AIM--pelzo63
http://members.aol.com/pelzo63/welcome.html
yet another thing to miss about B5....