BPH + Frequency = infection?
Anonymous
newsgroups.
Would patients and doctors please comment on the veracity of the
following statement by a Filipino doctor:
"Dr. A. N. Feliciano" wrote:
> An uncomplicated BPH ... is not associated with frequency unless
> the urethra around the prostate is also infected.
My understanding was that frequency is a typical symptom of sterile BPH,
and is only rarely associated with infection. See, for instance,
http://www.uro.com/bph.htm (and hundreds of other web pages which
support my belief).
Dr. A. N. Feliciano
> From: Anonymous <nob...@REPLAY.COM>
> To:
> Subject: BPH + Frequency = infection?
> Date: Tuesday, April 20, 1999 3:21 AM
explaining why frequency occurs in uncomplicated BPH.
I base my conclusion on the above statement by logic and the accepted fact
that not all pure BPH will have frequency of urination as part of their
symptoms. Although frequency is frequently associated with BPH by some
doctors, most of their cases would be found to have an accompanying chronic
prostatitis and posterior urethritis relieved by antibiotics.
Untreated constriction of the urinary tract may cause narrowing of the
urinary flow and a longer time to empty the bladder, but not frequency
unless the bladder or posterior urethra is infected.
In advance cases urine is retained in the bladder due to weakening of
bladder muscles as a result of chronic obstruction, which unable the
bladder to empty it's content completely. However frequency is usually not
an accompanying symptom unless considerable amount of urine is retained. In
this instance there will be a constant leak due to overflow of urine. This
is a rare complication and is remedied by TURP and other measures to
improve the contractility or tone of the bladder muscles.
Thank you for allowing me to express my view, Mr. Anonymous. I have said
the same thing in previous postings and asked for doctor's opinion, but
none has responded to refute my statement.
The above question devoid of rude remarks are welcome and will be answered
by me and hopefully by other doctors. I would particularly be interested in
the opinion of urologists posting in this newsgroup since I am not a
urologist but a specialist in genito urinary tract infection and perhaps
learn more. We continually learn more since medicines is really not a exact
science and this can be achieved by exchanges of opinion between doctors.
If I am proven wrong, then Mr. Anonymous should celebrate. If eventually
proven right in my hypothesis, then you sir, Mr. Anonymous would also stand
to benefit and may get rid of your sufferings including prostatodynia.
If I am not mistaken, even Dr. Shoskes admonished you once because of your
rude comment, and answered your question.
Antonio Novak Feliciano, M.D., F.P.C.S.
Visit my website
http://web.idirect.com/~ino
http://www.qinet.net.user/dr.anf/chronic.htm
David L. Casey, MD
Anonymous <nob...@replay.com> wrote:
> This message has been cross-posted to the BPH and prostatitis
> newsgroups.
>
> Would patients and doctors please comment on the veracity of the
> following statement by a Filipino doctor:
>
> "Dr. A. N. Feliciano" wrote:
>
> > An uncomplicated BPH ... is not associated with frequency unless
> > the urethra around the prostate is also infected.
>
> My understanding was that frequency is a typical symptom of sterile BPH,
> and is only rarely associated with infection. See, for instance,
> http://www.uro.com/bph.htm (and hundreds of other web pages which
> support my belief).
>
>
I have an interactive website that is intended to quantify urinary symptoms
which could be due to BPH. There are seven questions in this AUA Symptom
score questionnaire. This is a common tool used to assess BPH
symptomatology. Perhaps the answer can be inferred from this instrument?
http://www.dentonurology.com/quest/auaform.html
Thanks!
David L. Casey, MD
Denton Urology
Denton, Texas USA
http://www.dentonurology.com/
This communication is intended to provide general information, and in no way
is a substitute for face-to-face medical care. No implication of a
doctor-patient relationship should be assumed by the reader.
Sorry, but no questions or requests answered by private email.
-----------== Posted via Deja News, The Discussion Network ==----------
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Daniel Shoskes MD
David L. Casey, MD <dlc...@my-dejanews.com> wrote:
> In article <1999041919...@mail.replay.com>,
> Anonymous <nob...@replay.com> wrote:
> > This message has been cross-posted to the BPH and prostatitis
> > newsgroups.
> >
> > Would patients and doctors please comment on the veracity of the
> > following statement by a Filipino doctor:
> >
> > "Dr. A. N. Feliciano" wrote:
> >
> > > An uncomplicated BPH ... is not associated with frequency unless
> > > the urethra around the prostate is also infected.
> >
> > My understanding was that frequency is a typical symptom of sterile BPH,
> > and is only rarely associated with infection. See, for instance,
> > http://www.uro.com/bph.htm (and hundreds of other web pages which
> > support my belief).
> >
> >
>
> I have an interactive website that is intended to quantify urinary symptoms
> which could be due to BPH. There are seven questions in this AUA Symptom
> score questionnaire. This is a common tool used to assess BPH
> symptomatology. Perhaps the answer can be inferred from this instrument?
>
> http://www.dentonurology.com/quest/auaform.html
>
From:
http://x7.dejanews.com/[ST_rn=ps]/getdoc.xp?AN=337727676&CONTEXT=924612385.13
482 72155&hitnum=1 posted about 1 year ago:
Frequency and nocturia are very common symptoms of BPH and are the most
common reasons for seeking medical attention for the problem (few men
really care if their stream is not what it used to be). The cause is
related to neuromuscular changes in the bladder muscle wall in response to
having to work harder against increasing obstruction to flow. There is a
change of sympathetic nerve receptors in the bladder from the beta type to
the alpha type and urodynamics show small uninhibited contractions at low
volumes. This is why after TURP it may take many weeks before the frequency
decreases but the response to an alpha blocking drug such as Hytrin,
Cardura or Flomax is much more rapid. When the frequency is associated with
pain on voiding, a secondary cause such as infection or bladder stone is
much more likely to be the cause.
There are also many other reasons for frequency and nocturia in older men
AND women that have nothing to do with the prostate but are related to
metabolic changes in the kidney that make it more difficult to concentrate
urine, especially at night. It can also be an early sign of adult onset
diabetes.
Daniel Shoskes MD
UCLA
http://www.ben2.ucla.edu/~dshoskes
Institute for Male Urology
http://www.urol.c
Anonymous
>
> In article <1999041919...@mail.replay.com>,
> Anonymous <nob...@replay.com> wrote:
> >
> > Would patients and doctors please comment on the veracity of the
> > following statement by a Filipino doctor:
> >
> > "Dr. A. N. Feliciano" wrote:
> >
> > > An uncomplicated BPH ... is not associated with frequency unless
> > > the urethra around the prostate is also infected.
> >
> > My understanding was that frequency is a typical symptom of sterile BPH,
> > and is only rarely associated with infection. See, for instance,
> > http://www.uro.com/bph.htm (and hundreds of other web pages which
> > support my belief).
> >
> >
>
> I have an interactive website that is intended to quantify urinary symptoms
> which could be due to BPH. There are seven questions in this AUA Symptom
> score questionnaire. This is a common tool used to assess BPH
> symptomatology. Perhaps the answer can be inferred from this instrument?
>
> http://www.dentonurology.com/quest/auaform.html
>
>
> David L. Casey, MD
David, your excellent cgi-script makes it clear that my supposition that
urinary frequency is a normal symptom of BPH is correct.
This reinforces the need to make it clear to readers of the
sci.med.prostate.* newsgroups that they ought to be very wary of medical
advice received from almost all quarters, ESPECIALLY FROM PEOPLE WHO ARE
NOT UROLOGISTS.
Anonymous
>
> > From: Anonymous <nob...@REPLAY.COM>
> > To:
> > Subject: BPH + Frequency = infection?
> > Date: Tuesday, April 20, 1999 3:21 AM
> >
> > newsgroups.
> >
> > following statement by a Filipino doctor:
> >
> > "Dr. A. N. Feliciano" wrote:
> >
> > > An uncomplicated BPH ... is not associated with frequency unless
> > > the urethra around the prostate is also infected.
> >
> > My understanding was that frequency is a typical symptom of sterile BPH,
> > and is only rarely associated with infection. See, for instance,
> > http://www.uro.com/bph.htm (and hundreds of other web pages which
> > support my belief).
> >
> explaining why frequency occurs in uncomplicated BPH.
> I base my conclusion on the above statement by logic and the accepted fact
> that not all pure BPH will have frequency of urination as part of their
> symptoms. Although frequency is frequently associated with BPH by some
> doctors, most of their cases would be found to have an accompanying chronic
> prostatitis and posterior urethritis relieved by antibiotics.
You are wrong. Patients with frequency and BPH DO NOT HAVE INFECTIONS,
as investigation of these patients show. I suggest you read the postings
on this subject by the urologists. And for once, learn something.
> Thank you for allowing me to express my view, Mr. Anonymous. I have said
> the same thing in previous postings and asked for doctor's opinion, but
> none has responded to refute my statement.
This time they have.
> If I am proven wrong, then Mr. Anonymous should celebrate.
The champagne is being poured as we speak ;-)
Inspector Clouseau
>
> In article <1999041919...@mail.replay.com>,
> Anonymous <nob...@replay.com> wrote:
> >
> > following statement by a Filipino doctor:
> >
> > "Dr. A. N. Feliciano" wrote:
> >
> > > An uncomplicated BPH ... is not associated with frequency unless
> > > the urethra around the prostate is also infected.
> >
> > My understanding was that frequency is a typical symptom of sterile BPH,
> > and is only rarely associated with infection. See, for instance,
> > http://www.uro.com/bph.htm (and hundreds of other web pages which
> > support my belief).
> >
> >
>
> which could be due to BPH. There are seven questions in this AUA Symptom
> score questionnaire. This is a common tool used to assess BPH
> symptomatology. Perhaps the answer can be inferred from this instrument?
>
> http://www.dentonurology.com/quest/auaform.html
>
> Thanks!
>
> David L. Casey, MD
David, your excellent cgi-script makes it clear that my supposition that
urinary frequency is a normal symptom of BPH is correct.
This reinforces the need to make it clear to readers of the
sci.med.prostate.* newsgroups that they ought to be very wary of medical
advice received from almost all quarters, ESPECIALLY FROM PEOPLE WHO ARE
NOT UROLOGISTS.
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
This message was posted via one or more anonymous remailing services.
The original sender is unlogged. The address shown in the From header, if any,
is unverified and probably wrong. - Widow Anonymous Remailer -
Dr. A. N. Feliciano
> Date: Wednesday, April 21, 1999 2:31 AM
Anonymous can not help himself and always insinuating. Had I not posted my
view on the cause of frequency, the doctors that responded would not have
given you the information of other causes of frequency.
May I repeat what I have wrote in a recent posting. The basis of my
conclusion that frequency is almost always due to urinary tract infection
is after we have excluded the other causes in or CP patients as mentioned
by Dr. Dimitrakov, which occurs infrequently compare to cases of CP we have
seen.
As mentioned by Dr. Casey, that frequency is included in the questioner
(AUA)
given to CP patients, only implies that this symptom is frequently
associated with CP which maybe due to urinary tract infection.
Due to my posting on the most frequent cause of penile lesions, other
doctors have posted other causes, and patients are more educated. This is
what I meant when I wrote in previous postings that "doctors should
compliment the other".
Dr. A. N. Feliciano
> > > Date: Tuesday, April 20, 1999 3:21 AM
> > >
> > > This message has been cross-posted to the BPH and prostatitis
> > > newsgroups.
> > >
> > > following statement by a Filipino doctor:
> > >
> > > "Dr. A. N. Feliciano" wrote:
> > >
> > > > An uncomplicated BPH ... is not associated with frequency unless
> > > > the urethra around the prostate is also infected.
> > >
> > > My understanding was that frequency is a typical symptom of sterile
BPH,
> > > and is only rarely associated with infection. See, for instance,
> > > http://www.uro.com/bph.htm (and hundreds of other web pages which
> > > support my belief).
> > >
> > explaining why frequency occurs in uncomplicated BPH.
> > I base my conclusion on the above statement by logic and the accepted
fact
> > that not all pure BPH will have frequency of urination as part of their
> > symptoms. Although frequency is frequently associated with BPH by some
> > doctors, most of their cases would be found to have an accompanying
chronic
> > prostatitis and posterior urethritis relieved by antibiotics.
>
> You are wrong. Patients with frequency and BPH DO NOT HAVE INFECTIONS,
> as investigation of these patients show. I suggest you read the postings
> on this subject by the urologists. And for once, learn something.
>
> > Thank you for allowing me to express my view, Mr. Anonymous. I have
said
> > the same thing in previous postings and asked for doctor's opinion, but
> > none has responded to refute my statement.
>
> This time they have.
>
> > If I am proven wrong, then Mr. Anonymous should celebrate.
>
> The champagne is being poured as we speak ;-)
>
> You are wrong. Patients with frequency and BPH DO NOT HAVE INFECTIONS,
And I suppose you are right. Most of previous postings have indicated the
common occurrence of CP with BHP, and some doctors are now associating BPH
as due to a long standing CP.
Prostatitis is frequently associated with benign hyperplasia of the
prostate. It has been suggested that the non-predictable course of
obstructive symptoms in elderly men with benign prostatic enlargement may
be partly ascribable to inflammatory changes in the gland elicited by
aseptic necrosis of adenomatous foci. (Colleen & Mardh).
In 100 consecutive autopsies on men who had died suddenly in automobile
accidents and from other causes Bostrom found that the prevalence of
histological signs of prostatitis increased with age and was greatest when
there was benign enlargement of the gland. Signs of prostatitis were
present in 22 percent of men younger than 40 years and in 60 percent of
those above that age (Bostrom).
Insufficient knowledge may be misleading Mr. Anonymous!!
Anonymous
>
> >
> > >
> > > I have an interactive website that is intended to quantify urinary
> > > symptoms which could be due to BPH. There are seven questions in
> > > this AUA Symptom score questionnaire. This is a common tool used
> > > to assess BPH symptomatology. Perhaps the answer can be inferred
> > > from this instrument?
> > >
> > > http://www.dentonurology.com/quest/auaform.html
> > >
> > > Thanks!
> > >
> > > David L. Casey, MD
> >
> > David, your excellent cgi-script makes it clear that my supposition that
> > urinary frequency is a normal symptom of BPH is correct.
> >
> > This reinforces the need to make it clear to readers of the
> > sci.med.prostate.* newsgroups that they ought to be very wary of medical
> > advice received from almost all quarters, ESPECIALLY FROM PEOPLE WHO ARE
> > NOT UROLOGISTS.
>
> Anonymous can not help himself and always insinuating. Had I not posted my
> view on the cause of frequency, the doctors that responded would not have
> given you the information of other causes of frequency.
You stated *categorically* that frequency in BPH = infection. They
corrected you. You were wrong. Don't try to squirm out of it now!
> May I repeat what I have wrote in a recent posting. The basis of my
> conclusion that frequency is almost always due to urinary tract infection
> is after we have excluded the other causes in or CP patients as mentioned
> by Dr. Dimitrakov, which occurs infrequently compare to cases of CP we have
> seen.
This is what is called revisionism (rewriting history).
> As mentioned by Dr. Casey, that frequency is included in the questioner
> (AUA) given to CP patients, only implies that this symptom is frequently
> associated with CP which maybe due to urinary tract infection.
ABSOLUTELY WRONG! The questionnaire is given to **BPH** patients, not CP
patients, as he states repeatedly above. Reread his words at the top of
this message.
You are making such a fool of yourself in this forum. Almost every post
contains mistakes in medicine and in reading and comprehension. I'd be
terrified to have you treat me for any condition at all.
> Due to my posting on the most frequent cause of penile lesions, other
> doctors have posted other causes, and patients are more educated. This is
> what I meant when I wrote in previous postings that "doctors should
> compliment the other".
They seem to spend most of their time correcting your errors. You have
become a barrier to progress on this group. Instead of being humiliated
by your fluffs and boobs, you just take it in your stride and carry on
regardless. You are incredibly thick-skinned.
Anonymous
>
> common occurrence of CP with BHP, and some doctors are now associating BPH
> as due to a long standing CP.
See my postings today on the subject, and admit you are mistaken.
> Prostatitis is frequently associated with benign hyperplasia of the
> prostate. It has been suggested that the non-predictable course of
> obstructive symptoms in elderly men with benign prostatic enlargement may
> be partly ascribable to inflammatory changes in the gland elicited by
> aseptic necrosis of adenomatous foci. (Colleen & Mardh).
Exactly: "aseptic necrosis of adenomatous foci." This is not an
infective process.
> In 100 consecutive autopsies on men who had died suddenly in automobile
> accidents and from other causes Bostrom found that the prevalence of
> histological signs of prostatitis increased with age and was greatest when
> there was benign enlargement of the gland. Signs of prostatitis were
> present in 22 percent of men younger than 40 years and in 60 percent of
> those above that age (Bostrom).
>
> Insufficient knowledge may be misleading Mr. Anonymous!!
I'm glad you realize that, since the person with insufficient knowledge
is clearly you. You have failed to notice that at no point do the
reseachers and authors you quote suggest a microbial etiology for BPH.
Ooops! When they say "prostatitis" they are referring to
histologically-observable inflammation, not infection. See my other
posts today with "BPH" in the subject lines for further information.