A fun tool for demonstrating or teaching python?
WP
some people interested in building a very easy-to-use IDE for teaching Python,
possibly even with Kids.
I am thinking of whipping up something, perhaps with the ability to walk
through the code ('animated' debugger) and to do something visual or
graphical, turtle graphics, or a game, or something like that.
Anybody got any recommendations on where to start? So far I'm leaning
towards wxPython and maybe PythonCard. The system would either be a
hyper-card like tool using Python, or perhaps it would be a Python Logo,
with the code window on the bottom and a graphics window on the top.
The old Smalltalk 'Alice99' system was a pretty cool way to demonstrate Squeak
(smalltalk) but although the new Alice (which uses Python) is cool looking, it
is closed source, so that's no good.
Regards,
Warren
Simon Burton
Yes, i'm in the same boat. Am trying pygame now; already have a working
turtle and have started on an animated execution tracer...
pygame cause i've had trouble with other stuff on the various platforms i
need it for. (haven't tried wx yet...)
Let me know if you get pygame working; i'll send you what i have done.
Simon Burton.
Tim Gahnström /Bladerman
> There was a discussion (I found it using groups.google.com) a while ago
with
> some people interested in building a very easy-to-use IDE for teaching
Python,
> possibly even with Kids.
I am doing exactly this as my CS master thesis right now, I got some
questions answered here last summer or perhaps autum. I have had to let the
project more or less rest for the last couple of months now but will pick it
up again in early april. I havn't done much coding yet (want do do some
changes to the python interpreter but have a hard time figuring the source
code out) but have writen some and made most design desisions (in swedish
unfortunatley)
> I am thinking of whipping up something, perhaps with the ability to walk
> through the code ('animated' debugger) and to do something visual or
I verry much agree with you here, I think that a nice and simple debugger
will help alot in the process of understanding how code works and why it
works in particular ways. I still dont see why debuggers is not more widley
used in programming education.
Would you care to elaborate more on your thougts about the animated
debugger? I havn't comleteley figured out how I want my debugger to look so
it would be most interesting with some input on that part.
> graphical, turtle graphics, or a game, or something like that.
I plan on somewhat introduce the students to oo without there knowledge and
need to think about it. The first step in this process is introducing
grphical objects that work as objects are supposed to do.
I will have one code window on the right and a output window on the left.
some of the first commands they lern will likely be be something like
createRect(x,y,width,height)
createCircle(x,y,radius)
The code snipet above will ofcourse create a rectangle on the outputscreen.
This is really easy but to get them going in the gameprograming (wich
ofcourse is what young people are in it for) the code could be written like
this for further refferensability to the objects
r=createRect(x,y,width,height)
c=createCircle(x,y,radius)
Then r and c could be used like this
r.moveTo(x,y)
c.scale(times)
I think this aproch will introduce both objects and graphics in a nice and
easy way without oversimplyfy it with a turtle kind of way (besides I think
games are hard with turtle and logo)
> Python Logo,
> with the code window on the bottom and a graphics window on the top.
I will, as it looks, use two parts except the code and outputwindow. The
debugger will be simple and always present on the right hand side and at the
botom I will have a logo kind of inputfield where the user could enter
commands one at the time (maybe run one of the functions in their script or
similar)
I don't claim to be an expert on the subject but am more then happy to have
discussion on various design issues and ideas.
Tim
Tim Gahnström /Bladerman
"Simon Burton" <sim...@webone.com.au>
> On Mon, 10 Mar 2003 16:30:27 +0000, WP wrote:
>
> > There was a discussion (I found it using groups.google.com) a while ago
with
> > some people interested in building a very easy-to-use IDE for teaching
Python,
> > possibly even with Kids.
> > Anybody got any recommendations on where to start? So far I'm leaning
> > towards wxPython and maybe PythonCard. The system would either be a
> > hyper-card like tool using Python, or perhaps it would be a Python Logo,
> > with the code window on the bottom and a graphics window on the top.
> pygame cause i've had trouble with other stuff on the various platforms i
> need it for. (haven't tried wx yet...)
I am doing a similar project and have had some thoughts about using pygame
as part of the project to give the students a good ground for building their
games and stuf but my current questions is if it is overkill?
Are al the features of pygame more confusing then helping to a beginner? Is
that maybe later on for more advanced students? It is an interesting
question that I havn' t yet answered. "Wat features are begginer looking for
(or able to grasp) in the graphics departement". The answer might ofcourse
depend on their age but my curren opinion is geared towards that they really
don't ask fore more then the basics, thats what I wanted when I started I
think.
Tim
Lee Harr
> There was a discussion (I found it using groups.google.com) a while ago with
> some people interested in building a very easy-to-use IDE for teaching Python,
> possibly even with Kids.
>
> I am thinking of whipping up something, perhaps with the ability to walk
> through the code ('animated' debugger) and to do something visual or
> graphical, turtle graphics, or a game, or something like that.
>
I am working on a project with a similar idea:
http://www.nongnu.org/pygsear/
http://savannah.nongnu.org/projects/pygsear/
I have a turtle module... though it just uses the terminal for input right now.
Arthur
>with some people interested in building a very easy-to-use IDE for
>teaching Python, possibly even with Kids.
IMO, VPython would work great for this kind of thing. www.vpython.org.
Simple 3d graphics. Among the beauties of it, is tthe fact that it works
from the command line.
>>from visual import *
>>ball=sphere(color=color.blue)
creates a window with a nice OpenGL lit and shaded sphere.
>>sphere.color=color.red
and the sphere changes color.
And so on.
I am finalizing VPython .properties and .api files for ScITE. Which will
hopefully provide a simple IDE for VPython. I was not involved with
developing VPython. Noentheless, I am quite enthusiastic about it as a tool
for introductory programming - especially for younger folk.
I did a windows executable (py2exe) of a nice Tower of Hanoi implementat
done in < 75 lines of Python as one of the VPython demos (by Ruth Chabay, a
physics instructor), - available at
http://www.dstoys.com/content/education/index_html/Visual%20Arts/Interactive
if you might want to get a quick look at what it can do. Button 1 down and
drag to move rings.
What I don't have is the immediate inpetus to undertake creating a
formalized curriculum for using the VPython environment to teach
programming. Maybe I'll get there eventually. But others would probably be
more capable.
Art
Simon Burton
>
>
> I am doing a similar project and have had some thoughts about using pygame
> as part of the project to give the students a good ground for building their
> games and stuf but my current questions is if it is overkill?
>
> Are al the features of pygame more confusing then helping to a beginner? Is
> that maybe later on for more advanced students? It is an interesting
> question that I havn' t yet answered. "Wat features are begginer looking for
> (or able to grasp) in the graphics departement". The answer might ofcourse
> depend on their age but my curren opinion is geared towards that they really
> don't ask fore more then the basics, thats what I wanted when I started I
> think.
>
> Tim
yes, i agree.
Not using pygame directly; but interfacing to classes (eg. Turtle) that
do.
But, to learn basics one needs examples, etc, and i want to steer clear of
math/algorithm examples, and use sound/animation/multi-m as soon as
possible. eg. x+y concatenating sound objects x and y.
Simon.
Greg Ewing (using news.cis.dfn.de)
>>I am thinking of whipping up something, perhaps with the ability to walk
>>through the code ('animated' debugger) and to do something visual or
Something you might like to consider in this area is displaying
a graphical representation of Python data structures. If you
can get people visualising how objects and references work
correctly from the start, it would help clear up a lot of
confusions that beginners often have due to mutating shared
objects.
--
Greg Ewing, Computer Science Dept,
University of Canterbury,
Christchurch, New Zealand
http://www.cosc.canterbury.ac.nz/~greg
Michele Simionato
> There was a discussion (I found it using groups.google.com) a while ago with
> some people interested in building a very easy-to-use IDE for teaching Python,
> possibly even with Kids.
I am not sure if this has been pointed out ...
Ingo Linkweiler
http://www.ingo-linkweiler.de/diplom/index_en.htm
Ingo
Ingo Linkweiler
> http://www.ingo-linkweiler.de/diplom/index_en.htm
"Of pens and mice" is german only, perhaps I will translate it in future.
PyNassi 1.2 ist english and german.
Andy Bulka
http://www.atug.com/andypatterns/egg.htm
which might provide some ideas on how visual python debuggers
and/or development environments might work.
-Andy Bulka
http://www.atug.com/andypatterns